The sad part is...

[Mr. Cynical]

...our hopes are riding on a 3rd year unproven youngster beating out a talentless 11 year career backup. Because if KH wins out, we're going nowhere again this year and we will need to start all over again at QB next year.

Not a particularly inspiring situation.

[Pinkerton Security]

...our hopes are riding on a 3rd year unproven youngster beating out a talentless 11 year career backup. Because if KH wins out, we're going nowhere again this year and we will need to start all over again at QB next year.

Not a particularly inspiring situation.


as has been said before, if all else fails, brady quinn here we come :hang:

[YardRat]

...our hopes are riding on a 3rd year unproven youngster beating out a talentless 11 year career backup. Because if KH wins out, we're going nowhere again this year and we will need to start all over again at QB next year.

Not a particularly inspiring situation.

What makes you think starting JP will produce any different results?

[patmoran2006]

I'm in the minority on this; but I'm not throwing in the towel with Holcomb as the starter..

I'm so SICK of hearing about JP's young and a first rounder and blahblahblah.. If he CAN'T beat out Holcomb at camp he doesnt DESERVE to start.

[Drive 4 Five]

I'm in the minority on this; but I'm not throwing in the towel with Holcomb as the starter..

I'm so SICK of hearing about JP's young and a first rounder and blahblahblah.. If he CAN'T beat out Holcomb at camp he doesnt DESERVE to start.

I agree. I am not a fan of Holcomb at all but I like how you put that.

[Iehoshua]

Gawd would the "beat out in camp" argument please die? Rob Johnson was the best 'camp' performer QB lots of scouts ever saw, but if it doesn't translate to the field, it's useless!

If camp means everything, why didn't Tom Brady beat out Bledsoe for the starting gig?

There is no guarantee with JP, but he has one thing Holcomb is proven to NOT have; U-P-S-I-D-E. Might as well see if it can be taken advantage of or not, or if the Bills need to look elsewhere. Holcomb is no part of that equation.

[Dozerdog]

...our hopes are riding on a 3rd year unproven youngster beating out a talentless 11 year career backup. Because if KH wins out, we're going nowhere again this year and we will need to start all over again at QB next year.

Not a particularly inspiring situation.

http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b29/ab0079/girl-with-gun-in-mouth.jpg

[patmoran2006]

Ha ha ha.

[YardRat]

Gawd would the "beat out in camp" argument please die? Rob Johnson was the best 'camp' performer QB lots of scouts ever saw, but if it doesn't translate to the field, it's useless!

If camp means everything, why didn't Tom Brady beat out Bledsoe for the starting gig?

There is no guarantee with JP, but he has one thing Holcomb is proven to NOT have; U-P-S-I-D-E. Might as well see if it can be taken advantage of or not, or if the Bills need to look elsewhere. Holcomb is no part of that equation.

I wish the 'we need to start JP because he has 'potential'' argument would go away. Put the best players on the field, period.

Youboty and Simpson have 'potential', also. So does Nance. They all have U-P-S-I-D-E, let's insert them into the starting line-up too.

Put potential in one hand, and **** in the other, and see which one fills up first.

[Pinkerton Security]

I wish the 'we need to start JP because he has 'potential'' argument would go away. Put the best players on the field, period.

Youboty and Simpson have 'potential', also. So does Nance. They all have U-P-S-I-D-E, let's insert them into the starting line-up too.

Put potential in one hand, and **** in the other, and see which one fills up first.

The only thing that keeps me from agreeing with you is the fact that no matter what anyone says, IMO JP has....POTENTIAL....to be a better player than Holcomb. Its obvious they are close since there is no obvious choice, at least for the coaches. JP has more of the tools needed, i think, but he just doesnt know how to use them yet. Its up to the coaches and JP himself to learn to use them, or I will also end up rooting for Kelly to start.

[The_Philster]

I wish the 'we need to start JP because he has 'potential'' argument would go away. Put the best players on the field, period.

Youboty and Simpson have 'potential', also. So does Nance. They all have U-P-S-I-D-E, let's insert them into the starting line-up too.

Put potential in one hand, and **** in the other, and see which one fills up first.
apples and oranges....those guys can see playing time even if they aren't starting. How do you expect to play 2 QBs at once?

[SpillerThrills]

IMO JP has....POTENTIAL....to be a better player than Holcomb.

I have more tallent than Holcomb!!!! and I was a lineman when I played!!!

[YardRat]

apples and oranges....those guys can see playing time even if they aren't starting. How do you expect to play 2 QBs at once?

Why can't a back-up QB see playing time, depending on the game situation?

[The_Philster]

Why can't a back-up QB see playing time, depending on the game situation?
Sure...if you plan on being blown out early in every game. Switching up QBs in the middle of the game for a series or two would hurt our ability to win games now...which is the argument that the Holcomb supporters are using...they wanna win a few more games now ...never mind that it could slow our progress in the future

[Mr. Cynical]

I'm in the minority on this; but I'm not throwing in the towel with Holcomb as the starter..

If you think KH can lead this team to a winning season I don't know what games you've been watching over the last 11 years.


I'm so SICK of hearing about JP's young and a first rounder and blahblahblah.. If he CAN'T beat out Holcomb at camp he doesnt DESERVE to start.

I agree - and that's my point. If JP can't beat out a talentless 11 year career backup then he doesn't deserve to start. But that also means we are going into the season with a talentless 11 year backup, and that means a sub 500 season and another rebuild at QB next year.

So that's why I said our hopes ride on JP, because if he busts, we are back to square 1. KH is not, nor will he ever be, a successful full time starter.

[Mr. Pink]

If you think KH can lead this team to a winning season I don't know what games you've been watching over the last 11 years.



I agree - and that's my point. If JP can't beat out a talentless 11 year career backup then he doesn't deserve to start. But that also means we are going into the season with a talentless 11 year backup, and that means a sub 500 season and another rebuild at QB next year.

So that's why I said our hopes ride on JP, because if he busts, we are back to square 1. KH is not, nor will he ever be, a successful full time starter.


Out of curiousity...when has KH been given the opportunity to show if he can or cannot lead a team to a .500 record? He sure as hell didn't get that opportunity in Indy watching Peyton and Cleveland flipped between Couch and Holcomb.

You can unequivocally say that KH can't do that, but there's nothing to base it on, much like JP, neither have had been a full-time starter in this league. And to imply otherwise is false.

[Mr. Cynical]

Out of curiousity...when has KH been given the opportunity to show if he can or cannot lead a team to a .500 record? He sure as hell didn't get that opportunity in Indy watching Peyton and Cleveland flipped between Couch and Holcomb.

You can unequivocally say that KH can't do that, but there's nothing to base it on, much like JP, neither have had been a full-time starter in this league. And to imply otherwise is false.

He played for two years behind Harbaugh before Manning was drafted. He could not take the job from him during that time.

He played for three years behind Couch and could not take the job from him. When Couch was out football in '04, they brought in Garcia so they obviiously didn't feel secure with KH at the helm. And again, KH could not win the starting job.

So, KH couldn't beat out Harbaugh, Couch and Garcia for a starting job in the NFL. Not to mention he hasn't done anything here even when he had the time and chances to throw and make plays.

I've seen all I need to see from an 11 year career backup QB. He has not been nor will he ever be a full time starter for a very good reason. He does not have the ability to do so.

Comparing his experience with JP is not apples and oranges, its apples and lawn chairs.

[Turf]

I really think everyone's underplaying the coaching. It all comes down to an inept coaching staff last year being able to bring anyone along.
If the coaches are better this year we'll see a vast improvement across the board. The coaching staffs of the last 5 years, and the last two especially were horrendous.

[BillsFever21]

I get sick of hearing people say Holcomb never had a chance to there isn't anything to base it on.

He's been in the NFL for 11 years. For starters if any other team who has been looking for QB's all these years thought he was any good then they would've brought him in.

For seconds, if the teams he was on thought he was any good they would've let him be the starter and wouldn't have needed to draft #1 overall QB's to play in front of him. He wasn't good enough for his teams to believe he could be a starter so they had to draft a young QB.

And worse of all, he wasn't even thought of enough to start in Cleveland when they brought in a washed up Jeff Garcia instead. And even when Garcia was there he wasn't good enough to Garcia off the field when he was healthy.

And then even when they get rid of Garcia they still could've given Holcomb the job but they decided on Trent Dilfer instead.

Just face reality that Holcomb sucks. You're not in the league for 11 years without being the main guy for a reason.

Even if the situation didn't fit for the certain team you are on, all these other teams scout the players in the league and they needed QB's. If they would've thought anything of him they would've brought him in and let him be the starter.

[Jan Reimers]

I don't even understand the debate. We need to start Losman all 16 games to see if he has what it takes to play QB in the NFL. Holcomb has proven himself over and over again to be nothing but a decent backup.

To sit Losman in favor of Holcomb is absurb, no matter how you look at it.

[SABURZFAN]

we're better off bringing kelly out of mothballs. :(

[pats-were-right]

If camp means everything, why didn't Tom Brady beat out Bledsoe for the starting gig?

.

Actually he performed better in the 2001 preseason but Bledsoe basically got the job based on past accomplishment - he was, to some degree "proven". However, the hook was near.

Holcomb's mediocre - Losman's unproven. When you have mediocre versus unproven and you have enough talent around you to not resign yourself to a rebuilding year, you definitely have a camp competition.