Why is everyone already counting out JP?

[Mr. Miyagi]

Everyone in the media is already calling JP a bust, that we'll be draft Brady Quinn next year, that JP will never amount to anything, blah blah blah. These are the same people who say Philip Rivers will not be a big drop off from Drew Brees, that Rivers is no JP.

Why all the hate? It's not like JP has had 2 seasons to prove that he sucks. He's had 8 games, not consecutive ones either. Everyone can already tell how bad he is from those 8 games? Really?

Why aren't these same people calling David Carr a bust then? Carr's career has been as mediocre and has had much longer to prove that. What about Rex Grossman?? Pennington?? Michael ****** Vick????

Is it an anti-Buffalo bias??

[Patti120]

If JP doesn't start this year, then JP = Bust. If he does start and improves as the season goes on then I don't think he can be called a bust, as long as he keeps improving. We will have to wait and see what happens though.

[Mr. Miyagi]

I agree with the wait and see approach, but the point is the media is already saying he's a bust. Why is that??

[madness]

I agree with the wait and see approach, but the point is the media is already saying he's a bust. Why is that??

Because they don't know their ass from a hole in the ground...oh and they are realists. They only predict the current trend.

[Patti120]

The media are a bunch of idiots, they always write people off who are struggling, especially if youg and drafted in the 1st round. Maybe if the new coaching change is embraced by the team then it will be what JP needs to be a successful starter. hopefully his actions change their minds and finally give us some comfort with the QB situation. At that point we'd probably start hearing those melodramatic stories about how he was all but written off by the team, the fans, even the water boy and that he overcame these insurmountable obstacles to prove himself

Otherwise its NALL BALL BABY!!

[Mr. Miyagi]

Nall is one ugly mofo.

[Mr. Miyagi]

I can't wait until Philip Rivers falls on his ass this season, leading the Chargers to a 2-8 start. I bet the media will still suck his ass like they do now. They just hate to be wrong.

[gil]

The media go for the convenient narrative - remember, 90% of them do no actual reporting, they rely on the "conventional wisdom" - which is cherished above all else, especially among members of the sport punditocracy.

The conventional wisdom about Buffalo is that they have struggled because JP Losman was a 'bust' - few in the media actually know the ins and outs of how this franchise has been handled in recent years, so they go with the easiest answer - the conventional wisdom has become - "oh, Buffalo? JP Losman has been a bust, that's why they've struggled"

[Mr. Pink]

Because the NFL has largely turned into a "win-now" league. You're not given the luxury of allowing your "franchise saviour" to sit on the bench for a few years, take some lumps over a few years and wait 5 years for him to become good.

That's just the nature of the way the league has become, Losman looked outright terrible in 6 of his 8 starters...Miami and Hou being the exceptions. So go figure the media is going to portray him as a bust at this time.

Does this mean he can't turn it around? Definitely not, but this isn't the NFL of 1986 where you could afford to sit there for 3-4 years hoping a guy can figure it out. If JP puts up a mirror image season of last year, this year, his career will be labelled as a bust and he'll pretty much be done.

[Mr. Miyagi]

So why isn't anyone on David Carr's sad ass case?

[TacklingDummy]

So why isn't anyone on David Carr's sad ass case?

Because Carr was drafted by a expansion team? Expansion teams generally are not counted on to do much their first 5 years or so.

[TacklingDummy]

Everyone in the media is already calling JP a bust, that we'll be draft Brady Quinn next year, that JP will never amount to anything, blah blah blah.

I think its because people who know football realize that the Bills were a QB away from being a more competitive team last year. Many of their losses could have been wins last year with a decent QB. Kelly Holcomb and JP Losman don't actually put fear in a imposing defenses eyes. The Bills would of played much better games last year against Tampa, New Orleans, Atlanta, NE, Carolina, Jets, Miami, KC, Houston with more production out of the QB position.

The Bills 4 biggest weakness last year were...1) Stopping the run 2) Pass Rush, 3) QB, 4) A offense that went 3 and out a majority of the time. Making 1 and 2much worse.

[Philagape]

They simply don't know what they're talking about. All they see is last year (irrelevant) and don't know anything else.

[Amare]

Because he had a whoping 8 WHOLE GAMES! Those *******s!

[bigbub2352]

Plus most people across this great nation only know what they see on NFL primetime, Nfl Total access, and Sportscenter, they dont actually watch the games, the just know who is good in fantasy football, Fact being if u are a young QB thrown into an NFL profit freindly city you will be given all the chances in the world to suceed so they can sell those ever popular NFL merchandise, David Carr (HOUston) Kyle Bollar(Baltimore), Chris Simms (TB), Drew Brees (SD) Chad Pennington (NYC) and now you have Vince Young (Tenn), Leinhart (AZ), Cutler (Denver), u dont think the NFL promotes bigtime in those cities of millions, Vick in (ATL) one of the most overatted QB's i have ever seen, Everyone of these QB's were promoted heavely comig out and all struggled, and continue to strugglebut they are always talked about and promotede as futures of the nfl and franchises, Fact is nobody cares about the Bills and there population of 600,00 and going down that is why all the critics and experts all say the same things, we here are not NFL freindly,

U mean to tell me if Willis got drafted by the Raiders he would not be twice as popular about his knee and how he overcame adversity, or if TKO signed with Dallas how much more press he would get, this **** is obvious just look at it this way and u will see for your self!!

[patmoran2006]

Right now in JP.. I see all the physical attributes in a great QB, but I dont see any of the intangibles, inlcuding the most important; intelligence.

[Mr. Cynical]

People who count out a QB on his 9 games behind a putrid oline, a putrid HC and a putrid OC are in a word, morons.

[Jan Reimers]

For some reason, the media assumes JP has had a lot more playing time than his 8 starts and assorted mop up roles. I always seem to read references about his being a disappointment so far in his career, blah, blah, blah.

Career? He's had 8 friggin' starts for a coach who was unable to make a commitment to him, and damaged the hell out of his confidence.

But with the media, let him have 2 or 3 nice games, and they'll all be saying that they told us the kid would be good, he's the next Elway, etc., etc. I despise a good share of these "experts."

[Mr. Miyagi]

Right now in JP.. I see all the physical attributes in a great QB, but I dont see any of the intangibles, inlcuding the most important; intelligence.
When was the last time you had a conversation with JP?

[Mr. Miyagi]

Plus most people across this great nation only know what they see on NFL primetime, Nfl Total access, and Sportscenter, they dont actually watch the games, the just know who is good in fantasy football, Fact being if u are a young QB thrown into an NFL profit freindly city you will be given all the chances in the world to suceed so they can sell those ever popular NFL merchandise, David Carr (HOUston) Kyle Bollar(Baltimore), Chris Simms (TB), Drew Brees (SD) Chad Pennington (NYC) and now you have Vince Young (Tenn), Leinhart (AZ), Cutler (Denver), u dont think the NFL promotes bigtime in those cities of millions, Vick in (ATL) one of the most overatted QB's i have ever seen, Everyone of these QB's were promoted heavely comig out and all struggled, and continue to strugglebut they are always talked about and promotede as futures of the nfl and franchises, Fact is nobody cares about the Bills and there population of 600,00 and going down that is why all the critics and experts all say the same things, we here are not NFL freindly,

U mean to tell me if Willis got drafted by the Raiders he would not be twice as popular about his knee and how he overcame adversity, or if TKO signed with Dallas how much more press he would get, this **** is obvious just look at it this way and u will see for your self!!
Very probable theory. :bf1:

[bigbub2352]

I think so Mr M, i mean all u got to do is see who is on the covers of all the magazines, and EA sports games, if he is in a marketable city they promote the hell out of him, even if he was tried for murder and the top RB was in jail trying to sell drugs, but they got cool black and purple uniforms and ray lewis is out spoken so the Ravens are the ****, they one that super bowl and haven;t done anything since then so why is kyle boller even talked about, oh yeah Steve Mcnair is there now so they gotta be a contender

[The_Philster]

When was the last time you had a conversation with JP?
probably never. I'll admit my conversation with him wasn't that involved..basically just shooting the ****...but he didn't seem stupid by any means

[Mr. Miyagi]

probably never. I'll admit my conversation with him wasn't that involved..basically just shooting the ****...but he didn't seem stupid by any means
That's my point. Patmoran made that "intelligence" statement out of his ass. :rolleyes:

"Realists" are no better than glorified Guessers and fair-weather fans. :shakeno:

[patmoran2006]

probably never. I'll admit my conversation with him wasn't that involved..basically just shooting the ****...but he didn't seem stupid by any means

Captain Homer: You should "probably" know what your talking about.. #1 I have had more than one conversation with JP Losman, neither about football nor drunken jibberish at a bar. I've talked to him about Mortgage as he was and IS a client of ours..

And I never said JP Losman was a "stupid" person. From what little I have heard him speak live in person and of course on television he comes across as intelligent. I am speaking of what I have seen so far on the FOOTBALL field, and that is extremely UNINTELLIGENT play.

If you want to try and slant it out for me to be a JP hater, go head.. I dont hate on JP.. But I at least in my feeble mind see somethings that you homers dont see: I see a physical marvel who's biggest obstacle to over-come (in MY opinion-thats what message boards are fow) is his pee brain decisions.

[Mr. Miyagi]

I am speaking of what I have seen so far on the FOOTBALL field, and that is extremely UNINTELLIGENT play.
Don't confuse "unintelligent" with "inexperience"! Be fair!

[patmoran2006]

That's my point. Patmoran made that "intelligence" statement out of his ass. :rolleyes:

"Realists" are no better than glorified Guessers and fair-weather fans. :shakeno:
Realists are Fair-Weather fans because we dont EXPECT the Bills to be good this year??

Yep, that's the ticket.

And I absolutely LOVE how on this board when a Homer talks "out his ass" and says the Bills are going to be good this year, its a "great Bills fans opinion".. but when someone thinks otherwise, they're a "know it all" and their opinions dont mean ****, blahblahblah...

[The_Philster]

1...I said probably
2...When I talked to him it was a short conversation with him and Coy Wire at Jills tryouts...not at a bar
3..get your panties unbunched...like I said, I said probably. For the short conversation I had with him, he didn't seem unintelligent.

[Mr. Miyagi]

Realists are Fair-Weather fans because we dont EXPECT the Bills to be good this year??

Yep, that's the ticket.

And I absolutely LOVE how on this board when a Homer talks "out his ass" and says the Bills are going to be good this year, its a "great Bills fans opinion".. but when someone thinks otherwise, they're a "know it all" and their opinions dont mean ****, blahblahblah...
How can you seriously call yourself a fan and trash the team day and night?

[patmoran2006]

How can you seriously call yourself a fan and trash the team day and night?

I trash the team day and night?

I am trashing the team HOW? I dont want generalizations I want examples.. I have NOT trashed the team at all. I don't like JP Losman, that means I'm trashing the team?

[Mr. Miyagi]

Are you sure you're not Wys??? God I'm sure you sound exactly the same!

[patmoran2006]

Am I allowed to give a Stone Cold stunner to a mod?

[Mr. Miyagi]

Am I allowed to give a Stone Cold stunner to a mod?
You're allowed to do whatever that's within the ToS, to a mod or otherwise.

Like this :moon:

[The last buffalo fan]

You're allowed to do whatever that's within the ToS, to a mod or otherwise.

Like this :moon:

:up: .

[djjimkelly]

im not counting out JP im counting on him hes our only hope for success that is soon

[LifetimeBillsFan]

Plus most people across this great nation only know what they see on NFL primetime, Nfl Total access, and Sportscenter, they dont actually watch the games, the just know who is good in fantasy football, Fact being if u are a young QB thrown into an NFL profit freindly city you will be given all the chances in the world to suceed so they can sell those ever popular NFL merchandise, David Carr (HOUston) Kyle Bollar(Baltimore), Chris Simms (TB), Drew Brees (SD) Chad Pennington (NYC) and now you have Vince Young (Tenn), Leinhart (AZ), Cutler (Denver), u dont think the NFL promotes bigtime in those cities of millions, Vick in (ATL) one of the most overatted QB's i have ever seen, Everyone of these QB's were promoted heavely comig out and all struggled, and continue to strugglebut they are always talked about and promotede as futures of the nfl and franchises, Fact is nobody cares about the Bills and there population of 600,00 and going down that is why all the critics and experts all say the same things, we here are not NFL freindly,

U mean to tell me if Willis got drafted by the Raiders he would not be twice as popular about his knee and how he overcame adversity, or if TKO signed with Dallas how much more press he would get, this **** is obvious just look at it this way and u will see for your self!!

I agree and think that plays a big part in it.

I also think that the fact that some of the Bills' players bad-mouthed JP in the media and that the Bills' organization did not stand by him--by showing confidence in him with statement to the media that they felt that, despite his struggles he was still their QB of the future, etc.--gave people in the media the impression that the organization had lost faith in Losman last season. I think that this was further reinforced by the fact that M.Levy and D.Jauron seemed to be so unenthusiastic about Losman when they took over the Bills.

Because the Bills were so bad last season and are seen as being in a complete rebuilding mode this season, I don't think that most reporters or analysts in the national media are paying that close attention to the Bills this year because they do not see them being a playoff contender. As a result, they are working off of the impressions that they got about Losman from last season and from when Levy and Jauron were hired. Because the Bills have been so non-committal about their QB situation thus far in the off-season, the national media sees no reason to change its perceptions of Losman. Their focus is on the teams that they see as being playoff contenders and on the players that they know. In their view and as far as they know, Losman is a disappointment--a bust who was not liked by his veteran teammates, criticized by his star receiver and who lost the confidence and was benched by his former HC and who the organization has shown no committment to as their QB of the future. And, he will remain that way in their perceptions until he does something to change their view of him during the regular season.

Let's face it, Losman was a name that the national media was talking about going into last season because the Bills were perceived as a possible playoff team and the organization was supporting him publicly. None of that is the case now. If the Bills were going to the national media and telling them that JP is their guy and that they believe that his struggles last year were part of his development and that they expect him to be much better this season, at least a portion of the national media would have a different impression of Losman. But, the Bills are not doing that. They are playing their cards very close to the vest with Losman and their whole QB situation. Marv Levy was never one to play to the media when he was a HC, so I don't expect the Bills to be feeding a lot of information to the media with Levy as GM the way that they did before. But, I also think that the Bills have some other reasons that they are not touting Losman in the press at this point as well--reasons that have more to do with the way that they believe is the proper way to develop a young QB.

The national media today relies a lot on the information that the teams feed it. Additionally, as Patti, gilbert and FunTimesYay pointed out, the national media is all about immediate answers and immediate results. But, based on everything that the Bills have done since M.Levy took over, that's not how I see the current regime at OBD operating: they are taking a patient, low-key, "Old School" approach to building a football team without regard for how it looks or making a media splash (if anything I see them trying to be secretive, stay out of the media glare and "fly under the radar" as much as possible). For that reason, I would not pay that much attention to what the voices in the national media have to say about the Bills until the season starts and they actually have a chance to see the team play.

[bigbub2352]

I agree LTBF, also the fact that we didnt foloow the so called experts in the draft so the whole season is a wash, Marv is over the hill and ralph is to old, but god forbid if we win a few games and play hard and get production out of those guys, then the media will praise the **** out of Marv and say he is so smart and his football knowledge is unquestionable

[Mr. Miyagi]

Marv couldn't care less what the media says about him. :up:

[LtBillsFan66]

The media have one or two talking points about each player and repeat them adnausium. The points can even be off.

[Earthquake Enyart]

Are you sure you're not Wys??? God I'm sure you sound exactly the same!
His posts are too short.

My problem with JP is that in his 8 games he has not even showed a flash that he can lead a team to win a game.

[jamze132]

I think its because people who know football realize that the Bills were a QB away from being a more competitive team last year. Many of their losses could have been wins last year with a decent QB. Kelly Holcomb and JP Losman don't actually put fear in a imposing defenses eyes. The Bills would of played much better games last year against Tampa, New Orleans, Atlanta, NE, Carolina, Jets, Miami, KC, Houston with more production out of the QB position.

The Bills 4 biggest weakness last year were...1) Stopping the run 2) Pass Rush, 3) QB, 4) A offense that went 3 and out a majority of the time. Making 1 and 2much worse.
I think you can go ahead can chalk up last year's debacle to the FO. I'm sorry, but when you name a guy the starting QB before the preseason, release your current starting QB, and then bench the new guy after a couple of games, what do you expect from your team? Division within the ranks! And that is exactly what happened. Leadership starts at the top and has a funny little way of filtering on down to the lowest level. I won't blame any one player or position for last year's performance. Donahoe and Mularkay screwed the team!

[jamze132]

Am I allowed to give a Stone Cold stunner to a mod?
Wow, a fake wrestling move threat on a message board. Maybe if I were a realist I would also try a Rock Bottom.

[jamze132]

Captain Homer: You should "probably" know what your talking about.. #1 I have had more than one conversation with JP Losman, neither about football nor drunken jibberish at a bar. I've talked to him about Mortgage as he was and IS a client of ours..

And I never said JP Losman was a "stupid" person. From what little I have heard him speak live in person and of course on television he comes across as intelligent. I am speaking of what I have seen so far on the FOOTBALL field, and that is extremely UNINTELLIGENT play.

If you want to try and slant it out for me to be a JP hater, go head.. I dont hate on JP.. But I at least in my feeble mind see somethings that you homers dont see: I see a physical marvel who's biggest obstacle to over-come (in MY opinion-thats what message boards are fow) is his pee brain decisions.
Since JP is a client, the next time you guys are sitting in the office talking numbers, you should invite him to BillsZone and let him read some of the crap you write about him as a football player. See what he thinks of you. Let him decide whether or not you are an UNINTELLIGENT poster.

[TigerJ]

If JP doesn't start this year, then JP = Bust. If he does start and improves as the season goes on then I don't think he can be called a bust, as long as he keeps improving. We will have to wait and see what happens though.

I agree that while JP may have ample talent regardless what happens this season, he is a bust as far as the Bills are concerned if he doesn't win the starting job this season. That is, if he doesn't start, he will be traded, cut in the off season, and if he isn't he will probably demand a trade.

[Night Train]

Losman should benefit from Fairchild coming on board with an actual offensive gameplan. The last regime didn't do Losman any favors.

TD hung JP out to dry when he cut Bledsoe and basically forced Losman into the starting lineup. The Vets didn't like it and the situation grew worse when Losman came out rushing his throws and misfiring. Holcomb stadied the ship for a few weeks but his sorry lack of athleticism and arm strength hit the wall at home against KC. Once he left the game after a hard sack, Losman came in and threw 2 TD's to win the game.

From that point on, Losman never should have left the starting lineup. Unfortunately, the spineless Mularkey listened to some inmates *****ing and we still wound up 5-11. Meanwhile, we wasted precious developmental time with our young QB.

Jauron is right to make everyone compete for their position. Losman, barring injury, will probably start and the Vets will accept the fact he won the job fair and square this year, instead to being handed the job.

I still grade Losman an I for incomplete, since I never saw an organization handle a young QB so terribly in his first 2 years. Leave him alone and let him grow with experience.

What the media and some barking dogs here have to say means nothing to me.