The New Depth Chart on BB.com

[ParanoidAndroid]

Sam Aiken is ahead of Roscoe Parrish. The only significance there is that Aiken has secured his future and for those of us who predicted his departure.....oops.

Ryan Neufeld is ahaed of Everett. Given Neufeld's mediocrity, this is alarming in regards to our TE depth. We had better get into the TE market next offseason, especially if our new offense is "TE friendly."

Gates is now our backup RB and Williams dropped to 4th string which is no surprise, but more of a relief. All the hopes I had for him to come along are coming to fruition.

Future cuts at WR?
Denney is a sure thing. Davis and Smith will duel for the 6th spot. Wilson, Nance and possibly Smith (not sure about his eligibility) will be fighting for a Practice squad position. Two of those last four will be cut.

The early buzz about Ceislak is now a cricket chirping.

At RB, it looks as though Burns is toast, no butter and unless they somehow decide to go with 4 RB's, Williams is going to be playing somewhere else.

No surprises on defense and nothing exciting as far as competition and possible cuts. The only thing is that Coy Wire may be on his way out.

http://www.buffalobills.com/depth_chart/index.html

[patmoran2006]

Sam Aiken is ahead of Roscoe Parrish. The only significance there is that Aiken has secured his future and for those of us who predicted his departure.....oops.

Ryan Neufeld is ahaed of Everett. Given Neufeld's mediocrity, this is alarming in regards to our TE depth. We had better get into the TE market next offseason, especially if our new offense is "TE friendly."

Gates is now our backup RB and Williams dropped to 4th string which is no surprise, but more of a relief. All the hopes I had for him to come along are coming to fruition.

Future cuts at WR?
Denney is a sure thing. Davis and Smith will duel for the 6th spot. Wilson, Nance and possibly Smith (not sure about his eligibility) will be fighting for a Practice squad position. Two of those last four will be cut.

The early buzz about Ceislak is now a cricket chirping.

At RB, it looks as though Burns is toast, no butter and unless they somehow decide to go with 4 RB's, Williams is going to be playing somewhere else.

No surprises on defense and nothing exciting as far as competition and possible cuts. The only thing is that Coy Wire may be on his way out.

http://www.buffalobills.com/depth_chart/index.html

I knew Aiken wasnt going anywhere.. He's a great ST and not much worse at WR than any other 4-5 guy.. I'm glad he's staying.

[OpIv37]

Smith has an edge over Davis cuz of his ST ability.

[L.A. Playa]

at least it appears that these coaches are determining the squad based on perfomance

[BAM]

I seem to remember a BZ controversy that included a bet or something? regarding Sam Aiken. I can't remember the two guys that always argued about it though.

[L.A. Playa]

based on chemistry with JP if JP is the starter they should start Aiken over Reed

[ParanoidAndroid]

I seem to remember a BZ controversy that included a bet or something? regarding Sam Aiken. I can't remember the two guys that always argued about it though.

It wasn't you and me, was it?
:couch:

I thought he was gone because he just wasn't making plays in the receiving game, but he's starting to show up there.

I was wrong.

[L.A. Playa]

It wasn't you and me, was it?
:couch:

I thought he was gone because he just wasn't making plays in the receiving game, but he's starting to show up there.

I was wrong.

takes a big man to admit he was wrong

[Jan Reimers]

I believe Smith has too many games on the active roster to be eligible for the PS. Not sure about Wilson.

[L.A. Playa]

Im sure a couple of players will get a hangnail soon and be placed on season ending IR

[BAM]

It wasn't you and me, was it?
:couch:

I thought he was gone because he just wasn't making plays in the receiving game, but he's starting to show up there.

I was wrong.
LOL no. If I remember correctly it was Ebenezer and someone else.

You're one of the few persons that I've seen admit they were wrong for once though. Props. :up: :beers:

Although he still hasn't made the team yet though, so you may be early on this one!

[L.A. Playa]

Eb and Tatonka

[ParanoidAndroid]

I believe Smith has too many games on the active roster to be eligible for the PS. Not sure about Wilson.

That was my thinking. Wilson is good to go.

[ParanoidAndroid]

LOL no. If I remember correctly it was Ebenezer and someone else.

You're one of the few persons that I've seen admit they were wrong for once though. Props. :up: :beers:

Although he still hasn't made the team yet though, so you may be early on this one!

True. We still have 3 pre-season games left. Having to fight a little harder to keep his job may be turning him into a better player.

[socalfan]

..........At RB, it looks as though Burns is toast, no butter and unless they somehow decide to go with 4 RB's, Williams is going to be playing somewhere else.


You don't think that they'll get rid of Shelton and keep Burns?

[ParanoidAndroid]

You don't think that they'll get rid of Shelton and keep Burns?

It's not an impossibility, but I think it's unlikely. Shelton is still a very good blocking FB and Burns isn't really that much greater of a rushing threat. Burns has not been working at FB, apparently.

Ricard may eventually top the chart, but Shelton is our best option as a backup in that case. I'm not sold on Goldsberry.

[Jan Reimers]

You don't think that they'll get rid of Shelton and keep Burns?
That's possible, with Ricard being younger and quicker than Shelton, and Burns being so valuable on special teams.

[John Doe]

That's possible, with Ricard being younger and quicker than Shelton, and Burns being so valuable on special teams.

I agree that it is possible. The past few years Burns has made the team because of versatility. He can fill in at fullback, running back, and he is a good special teams guy. Shelton has no value as a backup. He either starts or he does not contribute to the team.

[socalfan]

I agree that it is possible. The past few years Burns has made the team because of versatility. He can fill in at fullback, running back, and he is a good special teams guy. Shelton has no value as a backup. He either starts or he does not contribute to the team.

Ricard made a couple of blocking errors in the game, but he caught the ball well and ran well. He was brought in for competition....he may win that job.

[Michael82]

I've been banging the Sam Aiken drum for the last couple years. It nice to see that he's finally stepping up. :clap:

[justasportsfan]

based on chemistry with JP if JP is the starter they should start Aiken over Reedactually Reed was JP's favorite target last year and he's been hitting Reed as well at camp. Right now Jp is doing well distributing the ball well although it just happened Aiken played well in the first preseason game.

[L.A. Playa]

well then start Reed

[justasportsfan]

well then start ReedFor now. I'm waiting for the bigger recievers to step up .

[Dr. Lecter]

Burns might beat out Thomas if Gates beats Thomas out for #2. That would be due to his ST ability.

[Tatonka]

Eb and Tatonka
what did i do??

[Tatonka]

as far as the receivers.. there is still 3/4ths of the preseason to be played.. davis can play special teams i think he has a good chance at making it.. i also think they keep 7 wrs. but who knows at this point.. let the best man win.

[Kerr]

Smith has an edge over Davis cuz of his ST ability.


You mean as a returner?? Davis returned ko's with the browns.

[TigerJ]

It's not an impossibility, but I think it's unlikely. Shelton is still a very good blocking FB and Burns isn't really that much greater of a rushing threat. Burns has not been working at FB, apparently.

Ricard may eventually top the chart, but Shelton is our best option as a backup in that case. I'm not sold on Goldsberry.

No way can Burns make this squad as a running back, if FB is out. As much as Levy likes his special teams, I can't see Burns making the team solely for his special team ability. There have to be other guys who can play well on ST and can actually contribute on offense or defense.

[ParanoidAndroid]

No way can Burns make this squad as a running back, if FB is out. As much as Levy likes his special teams, I can't see Burns making the team solely for his special team ability. There have to be other guys who can play well on ST and can actually contribute on offense or defense.

Yes. That is the other side of the coin and I really do think we have plenty of special tems players that can contribute to offense or defense more than Burns will.

Cutting a veteran like A-Train just to make room for a 4th string RB and a 4th string FB who happens to play well on special teams doesn't make sense to me. I think the back up safetys and LB's that we have on the roster are all capable of replacing Burns on special tems.

[L.A. Playa]

what did i do??

youand EB where debating whether Aiken makes the roster

[LifetimeBillsFan]

With Leonard filling in at SS behind Whitner with Bowen and Wire out, I can see Wire being a goner. Leonard is a guy that they can keep on the PS another year I believe. I seriously doubt that they cut Vincent, so that would allow them to keep three backup safeties on the active roster and one on the PS. What do you guys think?

With McFarland again being sidelined by tendonitis in his knee, do you think that increases the chances of Gibson (currently # 3 at RG) making the roster?

[YardRat]

When are the first cuts?

[CuseJetsFan83]

some players are getting cut/signed periodically, the first mass cuts should be after the next preseason game for almost all the teams, and then the same cycle keeps going

[ParanoidAndroid]

Just wanted to say thank you to everyone in this thread for making it a pleasant one.
Excellent discussion and no bickering. Kudos everyone! :up:

[bigbub2352]

I think Shelton needs to go, i think denney and Nance are both candidates for the PS, unless Nance makes a push soon, i think Davis makes the team over Smith Davis can return kicks not punts, but we have Roscoe, nate, for that Smith is too inconsistent catching the ball, davis brings that speed to the table something that has kept Jonathan Smith back

[djjimkelly]

I seem to remember a BZ controversy that included a bet or something? regarding Sam Aiken. I can't remember the two guys that always argued about it though.


i remember every one saying this nance kid was lock and he cant sniff the field

[djjimkelly]

With McFarland again being sidelined by tendonitis in his knee, do you think that increases the chances of Gibson (currently # 3 at RG) making the roster?

im hoping somehow some way gibson passes villarial so we can cut his ass same time we cut holcomb

[BAM]

Nothing wrong with a little speculation of course. I just don't like the ones that think they're right most of the time, go "out on a limb" predict something to happen, then pull the old "I told ya so" card the rest of their lives. It's dumb.

I hope Aiken makes the team. If that's the case, he will have beaten out a better than average group of receivers IMO.

[ParanoidAndroid]

i remember every one saying this nance kid was lock and he cant sniff the field

He still has a good shot at making the PS.

[Michael82]

I know people may think I'm high or something, but I wouldn't be shocked if Sam Aiken sees a lot of time opposite Lee Evans, due to his size. :up:

[more cowbell]

my depth chart

QB - Losman, Holcomb, Nall
RB - McGahee, Thomas, Gates
FB - Ricard
WR - Evans, Price, Reed, Parrish, Davis, Aiken
TE - Royal, Everett, Neufeld
LT- Gandy, Butler, Pennington
LG - Reyes, Gibson
C - Fowler, Geisinger
RG - Preston, Gibson
RT - Peters, German, Pennington

LE - Denney, Kelsay
RE - Schobel, Powell
DT - Tripplett, Williams, McCargo, Anderson
LOLB - Spikes, Haggan
MLB - Fletcher, Watson
ROLB - Crowell, Stamer
CB - Clements, McGee, Greer, Youboty, King
SS - Whitner, Bowen
FS - Vincent, Baker, Simpson

suprise cuts - Villarrial, shelton, wire

practice squad- C Merz, ROLB Ellison, WR Nance, S Leonhard, CB Bassey and to be honest i have no idea who else

[Dr. Lecter]

I don't see Pennington being on the roster. He is a prime PS candidate. I would insert Burns in his spot.

Other than that, all looks good (if the numbers are right)

[LifetimeBillsFan]

Good job! Although I disagree on the offensive linemen and don't think Shelton or Villarial will be cuts:

Here's how I see the offensive line:

RT: Peters, Gibson, (Butler)
RG: Villarial, Preston, Gibson
C: Fowler, Preston, (Geissinger)
LG: Reyes, Preston
LT: Gandy, Peters, (Butler)

PS: Definitely Pennington and Merz and possibly Geissinger or Butler

The reason that I see them keeping C.Villarial is the same as the reason for keeping T.Vincent: he may be an aging vet, but this is still a young, inexperienced group and they will want to keep his experience and ability to teach around for one more season. The only way I see him getting cut--this year--is if he gets injured or decides that his heart isn't into it and he wants to retire. Also, Preston hasn't shown that he is ready to start yet and Gibson is still a question-mark learning a new position.

With Morgan possibly having a degenerative hip and McFarland a bad knee, I don't think either can be counted on, which leaves the Bills very thin at OT, especially on the left side. Without Morgan, if Gandy were to go down, the only guys who really could play LT would be Peters, who has no experience there, and Butler, who played a little LT at Virginia behind D.Ferguson. It would come down to a choice of whether to 1.) slide Peters to LT, with Gibson moving to RT or Butler stepping into RT; or 2.) keeping Peters at RT and moving Butler to LT. The first choice is probably the better one, but, then, it would come down to whether they think Butler would be better than Gibson at RT. If so, there would be no need to keep Geissinger, who has had some problems with bad snaps in TC. If not, then, they need to keep an extra interior lineman rather than Butler, who can go on the PS, and that would probably be Geissinger because keeping him would allow Preston to just back up at the guard positions. Jerman would be a possibility over Geissinger and Butler, but he has not shown the ability to get the job done at OT or OG and would just be a body filling a position, whereas Geissinger and Butler have shown at least some potential at their positions.

If the Bills go with just 8 offensive linemen on the active roster and one inactive, instead of 10 on the active roster, they get to keep two FBs or an extra WR or RB. I believe that one of the reasons that the coaching staff has been so big on having their offensive linemen show versatility and the ability to play more than one position is because they would prefer to have enough flexibility to be able to go with just 8 offensive linemen on the active roster.

If the Bills go this route--which is what a lot of NFL teams do--IMHO Butler vs Geissinger is really a close call. Butler has shown some ability, but I think both are helped by the injuries to Morgan and McFarland.

Why not keep Pennington on the active or inactive 53 man roster? Because, for all of his potential, IMHO he is still so raw and needs to learn so much that he is not yet ready to play. He is a classic developmental project who needs to spend time on the PS to develop his game to the point where he can use his physical talent effectively.

From everything I have read, it seems like McNally and the other coaches really like Merz. I think he makes the PS on that and on the possibility that, if he continues to do whatever he's doing that they like, he could push Geissinger--at least as a center. Geissinger may get a roster spot because he offers flexibility, but IMHO he's really going to have to show that he belongs on an NFL roster this season.

Because of the pounding that FBs take, I can't see the Bills going with just one FB on the roster. Burns may be a top ST guy, but he's really not much as a RB or a FB. I don't think that they would have brought Ricard in if they were happy with Goldsbury or Burns as a second FB. Nor do I think that, in Shelton's case, the Chicago-connection can be entirely ignored. Like Villarial, Shelton will be one of "Jauron's guys" in the lockerroom--a guy Jauron can count on as a supporter and someone that he can lean on to get the pulse of the team as the season progresses. And, he's not a bad blocker. For those reasons, I think that they will try to keep him.

But, of course, I could be entirely wrong and way off-base on this....

[RedEyE]

The Aiken thing has been haunting me for years. This guy consitantly has great camps and works well through practice...then regular season comes and he seems to disappear.

[John Doe]

Good job! Although I disagree on the offensive linemen and don't think Shelton or Villarial will be cuts:

Here's how I see the offensive line:

RT: Peters, Gibson, (Butler)
RG: Villarial, Preston, Gibson
C: Fowler, Preston, (Geissinger)
LG: Reyes, Preston
LT: Gandy, Peters, (Butler)

PS: Definitely Pennington and Merz and possibly Geissinger or Butler

The reason that I see them keeping C.Villarial is the same as the reason for keeping T.Vincent: he may be an aging vet, but this is still a young, inexperienced group and they will want to keep his experience and ability to teach around for one more season. The only way I see him getting cut--this year--is if he gets injured or decides that his heart isn't into it and he wants to retire. Also, Preston hasn't shown that he is ready to start yet and Gibson is still a question-mark learning a new position.

With Morgan possibly having a degenerative hip and McFarland a bad knee, I don't think either can be counted on, which leaves the Bills very thin at OT, especially on the left side. Without Morgan, if Gandy were to go down, the only guys who really could play LT would be Peters, who has no experience there, and Butler, who played a little LT at Virginia behind D.Ferguson. It would come down to a choice of whether to 1.) slide Peters to LT, with Gibson moving to RT or Butler stepping into RT; or 2.) keeping Peters at RT and moving Butler to LT. The first choice is probably the better one, but, then, it would come down to whether they think Butler would be better than Gibson at RT. If so, there would be no need to keep Geissinger, who has had some problems with bad snaps in TC. If not, then, they need to keep an extra interior lineman rather than Butler, who can go on the PS, and that would probably be Geissinger because keeping him would allow Preston to just back up at the guard positions. Jerman would be a possibility over Geissinger and Butler, but he has not shown the ability to get the job done at OT or OG and would just be a body filling a position, whereas Geissinger and Butler have shown at least some potential at their positions.

If the Bills go with just 8 offensive linemen on the active roster and one inactive, instead of 10 on the active roster, they get to keep two FBs or an extra WR or RB. I believe that one of the reasons that the coaching staff has been so big on having their offensive linemen show versatility and the ability to play more than one position is because they would prefer to have enough flexibility to be able to go with just 8 offensive linemen on the active roster.

If the Bills go this route--which is what a lot of NFL teams do--IMHO Butler vs Geissinger is really a close call. Butler has shown some ability, but I think both are helped by the injuries to Morgan and McFarland.

Why not keep Pennington on the active or inactive 53 man roster? Because, for all of his potential, IMHO he is still so raw and needs to learn so much that he is not yet ready to play. He is a classic developmental project who needs to spend time on the PS to develop his game to the point where he can use his physical talent effectively.

From everything I have read, it seems like McNally and the other coaches really like Merz. I think he makes the PS on that and on the possibility that, if he continues to do whatever he's doing that they like, he could push Geissinger--at least as a center. Geissinger may get a roster spot because he offers flexibility, but IMHO he's really going to have to show that he belongs on an NFL roster this season.

Because of the pounding that FBs take, I can't see the Bills going with just one FB on the roster. Burns may be a top ST guy, but he's really not much as a RB or a FB. I don't think that they would have brought Ricard in if they were happy with Goldsbury or Burns as a second FB. Nor do I think that, in Shelton's case, the Chicago-connection can be entirely ignored. Like Villarial, Shelton will be one of "Jauron's guys" in the lockerroom--a guy Jauron can count on as a supporter and someone that he can lean on to get the pulse of the team as the season progresses. And, he's not a bad blocker. For those reasons, I think that they will try to keep him.

But, of course, I could be entirely wrong and way off-base on this....

Nice analysis LBF. One question: Has Peters taken any practice snaps at left tackle. I have not heard anything to indicate that he has, and if their plan is to flip him there in the event that Gandy goes down, they should give him some reps there.

I don't know if there is enough versatility on the o-line to go with only 8 linemen plus a long snapper.

[Devin]

Future cuts at WR?
Denney is a sure thing. Davis and Smith will duel for the 6th spot. Wilson, Nance and possibly Smith (not sure about his eligibility) will be fighting for a Practice squad position. Two of those last four will be cut.


Nance will be signed away from us.

[HAMMER]

takes a big man to admit he was wrong

It takes a normal man to admit he is wrong, it's the know it alls that give the normal guys a bad name.

[LifetimeBillsFan]

Nice analysis LBF. One question: Has Peters taken any practice snaps at left tackle. I have not heard anything to indicate that he has, and if their plan is to flip him there in the event that Gandy goes down, they should give him some reps there.

I don't know if there is enough versatility on the o-line to go with only 8 linemen plus a long snapper.

That's a good question JD. I really don't know.

And, you're right about them not having a lot of versatility...or depth for that matter.

The only things I've really ever read anywhere about Peters playing on the left side are quotes from McNally saying that he thinks Peters could play there and that the Bills didn't want to switch Peters to the left side because they wanted to maintain some consistency on the right side of the line with Peters and Villiarial being familiar with one another. So, I really don't know if Peters has ever even worked out on the left side, like in walk-throughs, etc.

If Morgan's injury is serious--and anytime they start talking about a degenerative hip, it really could be--the Bills really don't have anyone other than Gandy who has much experience playing LT, certainly not on the pro level. As I recall, Jerman has played primarily RT and OG in the pros and done neither very well. McFarland played LT in college on the D-1AA level, but I don't think he has gotten any snaps there as a pro, where he has played some games at RT and this past NFLE season as an OG. I think I read that Peters played some LT in college before being moved to TE so that he could team with S.Andrews, but I don't know how much time Peters got at LT before the move. And, again, I believe that one of the profiles of Butler that I read when he was drafted stated that he played a couple of games at LT in place of D.Ferguson at UVa, but I don't recall how many and doubt that it was many. Pennington is a legit left tackle prospect who, like McFarland, played the position in college, but he's really raw and it showed against Carolina's backups.

So, other than Morgan, the Bills really don't have anyone on their roster with much experience on the pro level at LT and only a couple of guys who might even be candidates to fill that spot if the need should arise. If Morgan's injury is bad enough to keep him from playing this season, the Bills don't have a lot of options at present in terms of who they could use behind Gandy or even to give Gandy a couple of snaps off during the course of a game. And, that could potentially be a problem for them.

McNally was quoted recently as saying that his biggest concern is that the Bills don't have a lot of depth. While they have some interesting developmental projects in Butler, Pennington and Merz, IMHO one look at their roster confirms this. No experienced depth and not a lot of experience overall.

If Morgan's injury really is serious enough to keep him from playing, it really would not surprise me to see the Bills try to bring in someone with some LT experience after the roster cuts begin next week. I would expect that they have already been scouring other team's rosters trying to anticipate which offensive linemen might end up getting cut to see if there are any, especially LTs, that they would want to bring in at least for a tryout.

Maybe someone who has been to their recent practices could let us know who has been getting LT reps with the second and third teamers lately. Please post if you have been there and know who has been getting those reps. Also, Morgan is not expected to play against Cincy, so it will be interesting to see who gets to play LT once the Bills' starting O-line comes out of the game.

[Ebenezer]

youand EB where debating whether Aiken makes the roster
...and I never thought I would hear myself say that Aiken is the #3 WR on this team...he might even be #2 right now...the question is: Is that a reflection of Aiken or how bad the WR corp is? We won't know the answer to that for awhile.