How much would Joe Thomas add to this team???

[X-Era]

Lets say that the team remains the same, we finish up at 4 and 12 or something, and we stick with JP for another year.

Yes, thats alot of ifs but play along for a second.

Joe Thomas is a top 5 pick. So at 4 we take Joe Thomas.

Lets say he starts day one, how much better would our O be and why.

[BILLSROCK1212]

bust its either him or Levi Brown i choose him as a bust cas he got injured last year but he is most talented of all players in the draft including Peterson and Wolfe the guy played almost every O-Line position and started at every position too and started on DL in i think his sophmore year....correct me if I'm wrong

[TigerJ]

"correct me if I'm wrong"

OK Billsrock. Your post was almost unreadable because of a lack of punctuation, and asside from proper names - capitilization. There is a place for "stream of consciousness" writing style, but believe me, a Bills message board is not it.

Hey, you asked me to coreect you.

As far as Joe Thomas is concerned, Gandy gave one of the worst performances I've ever seen from a left tackle. I don't usually watch the lineman that much, but Gandy not only wasn't athletic enough, hes technique was terrible. The TV guys commented on one play where he lunged at James Hall, wiffed and left Hall with an open path to the QB. "You can't lunge at the guy, the color man said (I don't know who it was)." You have to move with him and hold your ground. If last Sunday is an example of what we're going to get from Gandy, than drafting a top notch tackle is going to be the surest was possible to get an immediate improvement in the play of the line.<!-- / message -->

[kernowboy]

A great deal especially if he is completely over his injury.

However we have lots of gaps in our team and with so many quality OL coming out in next years draft, possibly the best ever, we could trade down, get a great lineman like Doug Free LT and get an additional high pick. Heck there will be linemen in R2 who in normal years would be in R1 and it would not because they dropped themselves but other teams with other priorities over bid on other players especially with DT.

I can see us taking a TE like Greg Olsen in R1 if we don't get Dan Graham or Jeremy Stevens in FA, and STILL be able to draft the LT of the future in R2.
Or in the first take Paul Posluzny to replace TKO or Fletcher or Alan Branch if he comes out on the DL. And the guy taken as the LT in the 2nd would easily be on a par with the likes of Khaliff Barnes and Matt Light.

I recall the 2004 draft when after Rob Gallery at no2 the next LT went at no52 with Jakob Rogers - this sure ain't happening in 2007. Below are the limemen who would be substantial adds for us. all could upgrade and all could easily go in the first 2 rounds.

Joe Thomas
Sam Baker*
Jake Long*
Levi Brown
Doug Free
Joe Staley
Ryan Harris
Mike Otto
Arron Sears
Justin Blalock

admittedly Long and Blalock are likely to be RTs meaning we shift Peters to the left but all of the above should go in the first 2 rounds. We get any lower and they'd be a steal.

[jamze132]

"correct me if I'm wrong"

OK Billsrock. Your post was almost unreadable because of a lack of punctuation, and asside from proper names - capitilization. There is a place for "stream of consciousness" writing style, but believe me, a Bills message board is not it.

Hey, you asked me to coreect you.

As far as Joe Thomas is concerned, Gandy gave one of the worst performances I've ever seen from a left tackle. I don't usually watch the lineman that much, but Gandy not only wasn't athletic enough, hes technique was terrible. The TV guys commented on one play where he lunged at James Hall, wiffed and left Hall with an open path to the QB. "You can't lunge at the guy, the color man said (I don't know who it was)." You have to move with him and hold your ground. If last Sunday is an example of what we're going to get from Gandy, than drafting a top notch tackle is going to be the surest was possible to get an immediate improvement in the play of the line.<!-- / message -->
Well since we are pointing grammatical errors, let me point out a few...

"Hey, you asked me to coreect you." Spelling

"I don't usually watch the lineman that much, but Gandy not only wasn't athletic enough, hes technique was terrible." This sentence is a negative preposition. Spelling

"The TV guys commented on one play where he lunged at James Hall, wiffed and left Hall with an open path to the QB." Spelling

"If last Sunday is an example of what we're going to get from Gandy, than drafting a top notch tackle is going to be the surest was possible to get an immediate improvement in the play of the line." Huh?

I know you didn't ask me to correct you but I figured you wouldn't mind. If so, then I am sorry. :beers:

[TigerJ]

Well since we are pointing grammatical errors, let me point out a few...

"Hey, you asked me to coreect you." Spelling

"I don't usually watch the lineman that much, but Gandy not only wasn't athletic enough, hes technique was terrible." This sentence is a negative preposition. Spelling

"The TV guys commented on one play where he lunged at James Hall, wiffed and left Hall with an open path to the QB." Spelling

"If last Sunday is an example of what we're going to get from Gandy, than drafting a top notch tackle is going to be the surest was possible to get an immediate improvement in the play of the line." Huh?

I know you didn't ask me to correct you but I figured you wouldn't mind. If so, then I am sorry. :beers:

I knew I should have been a little more careful. LOL You got me!

[DraftBoy]

A great deal especially if he is completely over his injury.

However we have lots of gaps in our team and with so many quality OL coming out in next years draft, possibly the best ever, we could trade down, get a great lineman like Doug Free LT and get an additional high pick. Heck there will be linemen in R2 who in normal years would be in R1 and it would not because they dropped themselves but other teams with other priorities over bid on other players especially with DT.

I can see us taking a TE like Greg Olsen in R1 if we don't get Dan Graham or Jeremy Stevens in FA, and STILL be able to draft the LT of the future in R2.
Or in the first take Paul Posluzny to replace TKO or Fletcher or Alan Branch if he comes out on the DL. And the guy taken as the LT in the 2nd would easily be on a par with the likes of Khaliff Barnes and Matt Light.

I recall the 2004 draft when after Rob Gallery at no2 the next LT went at no52 with Jakob Rogers - this sure ain't happening in 2007. Below are the limemen who would be substantial adds for us. all could upgrade and all could easily go in the first 2 rounds.

Joe Thomas
Sam Baker*
Jake Long*
Levi Brown
Doug Free
Joe Staley
Ryan Harris
Mike Otto
Arron Sears
Justin Blalock

admittedly Long and Blalock are likely to be RTs meaning we shift Peters to the left but all of the above should go in the first 2 rounds. We get any lower and they'd be a steal.

Great Post! However; Staley, Harris, Otto, and Sears are all possibly going to move into early round 3 territory. And your forgetting the OT from Maryland who may declare early too.

[TacklingDummy]

If we waste a Top 5 pick on a O-linemen we deserve to be the new Bungals. Online can be built with later round choices. See Colts/Broncos for examples.

[kernowboy]

Actually the Broncos have a 20 pick (round 1) in Foster and the Colts most important player is Glenn who went at 19 (Round 1)

We currently have 4 dodgy FAs who were drafted in Rounds 5 (Villarial) 3 (Fowler) 5 (Reyes), 3 (Gandy, picked as a guard) and Peters a OFA.

Whilst I agree the top 5 is too high we need to spend a high pick no later than the end of Round 2 on a top tackle. Due to the depth of next years OT draft, there are 10 players who can go in the top 2 rounds and anyone one of them will be excellent and a step up from the current lot. The Bills have done really well with low picks like Ballard and Parker but they played on the right. We potentially have Butler and Pennigton here already if we move Peters (hopefully to LG) but we need a college LT, someone like Doug Free, Mike Otto, or Joe Staley and none of these guys will go lower than Round2.

What disappoints me about last years draft is despite McNallys reputation, none of our low rounders on the OL have been given any real game time yet

[TacklingDummy]

Since 1994 here are the 0-linemen picked in the top 10

1994: None

1995: 2 Jacksonville Tony Boselli T Southern California

1996: 4 Baltimore Jonathan Ogden T UCLA ,10 Cincinnati Willie Anderson T Auburn

1997: 1 St. Louis Orlando Pace T Ohio State , 6 Seattle Walter Jones T Florida State , 10 New Orleans Chris Naeole G Colorado

1998: 7 New Orleans Kyle Turley T San Diego State

1999: None

2000: 3 Washington Chris Samuels T Alabama

2001: 2 Arizona Leonard Davis T Texas

2002: 4 Buffalo Mike Williams T Texas, 7 Minnesota Bryant McKinnie T Miami ,10 Cincinnati Levi Jones T Arizona State

2003: 8 Carolina Jordan Gross T Utah

2004: 2 Oakland Robert Gallery T Iowa

2005: None

14 O-linemen drafted in the Top ten in 12 years. Ogden and Pace the only ones with Super Bowl rings.

Again, 0-Line can be built in the later rounds.

[spacecowboy]

I know some won't agree with me but I think you should almost always draft the best available player not necessarily what you need.

[TacklingDummy]

Actually the Broncos have a 20 pick (round 1) in Foster and the Colts most important player is Glenn who went at 19 (Round 1)



I know that and have posted it a couple of days ago. Besides those 2 the Colts and Denvers O-lines are made up of 4th rounders and undrafted Free Agents. 20th and 19th are not top 5. IMO, if the Bills have a top 5 pick then they shouldnt draft 0-Linemen. Trade down if they are thinking o-line.

[kernowboy]

but both the lines you quoted the Colts and the Broncos have at least a first round choise.

the Broncos have George Foster
the Colts have Tarik Glenn

we have no-one taken before the third. In fact our line consists of no-one we have actually drafted

even our best line of recent times has had at least 1 first round choice like Ruben Brown

Would not a Bryant McKimmie, Levi Jones, Walter Jones, Orlando Pace make our line better.

Last seasons Super Bowl line ups include Hutchinson and Jones for the Seahawks who were drafted in the first round and with the winners Marvel Smith taken in the 2nd round, Alan Faneca in the 1st, Kendall Simmons in the 1st and Jeff Hartings a FA originally drafted in the first by the Lions

So the Steelers victorious offensive line had 3 1st round picks and a number 2

I am not saying we draft in the top 5 of the first round.

I am saying we must draft on Day 1 as a minimum and we need to take advantage of the fact that this year, there will be quality OL players in Round 2 who in any other year would be in Round 1

[TacklingDummy]

but both the lines you quoted the Colts and the Broncos have at least a first round choise.

even our best line of recent times has had at least 1 first round choice like Ruben Brown


I am saying we must draft on Day 1 as a minimum and we need to take advantage of the fact that this year, there will be quality OL players in Round 2 who in any other year would be in Round 1

The Bills tried to put a high draft pick on their line, see Mike Williams.

Yes, the Colts/Den. have a 1st rounder on their line. If the Bills end up with a pick out of the top 10 then I wouldn't care if they drafted a o-linemen with it.

It's just my opinion that top 10 picks are not for O-linemen to be picked and if the Bills waste a top 10 on a O-linemen then they deserve to continue to suck. I rather have a DE, DT, WR, QB with that top 10 pick.

[Ron Burgundy]

The Bills tried to put a high draft pick on their line, see Mike Williams.

Yes, the Colts/Den. have a 1st rounded on their line. If the Bills end up with a pick out of the top 10 then I wouldn't care if they drafted a o-linemen with it.

It's just my opinion that top 10 picks are not for O-linemen to be picked and if the Bills waste a top 10 on a O-linemen then they deserve to continue to suck. I rather have a DE, DT, WR, QB with that top 10 pick.

Unless you've got a no-brainer Ogden type, I can agree with that.

[kernowboy]

I agree

I think we have so many holes we need to trade down. I think we also need to worry that Fletcher will ask for a massive contract now he's with Rosenhaus and TKO will never be the same again.

I reckon we should there do this

R1 trade down get an extra 3rd and pick ... Posluzny, best player available and can cover the loss of Fletcher (a free agent) and TKO
R2 Doug Free LT
R3 get Dan Bazuin at LE even giving up a Day2 pick to move up
R3 (extra trade pick) Justin Harrell big enough to play the nose
R3 hope to get a compensation pick and get the best player available, hoping a CB will slip

In FA sign Dan Graham or Jeramy Stevens as an absolute must