Jauron see's Losmans Development.

[justasportsfan]

http://www.buffalobills.com/news/news.jsp?news_id=4285

[The_Philster]

Nice read...and it's nice to see Jauron is backing him....something a developing QB has to have in order to succeed

[GFLuNEEDit]

Dont put too much stock in it.

What else would he say ?
He'll keep trying to encourage him until he has it reaches a point where he has to yank him.

[Inetpub]

He's not the quarterback he wants to be, he's not the quarterback we need him to be. But he's building on it and I like this guy. And our players buy into him too because he's a real guy, a tough guy. Sums it up right there. Atleast the guys are starting to buy into him. Im not sold yet though. Only thing is Nice guys dont finish first in the NFL if they cant win. I like the part where Dickie says hes not the QB we need him to be. For all you nuthuggers out there, we atleast Dick will acknowledge JP sucks at the moment. But he also recognizes that hes got ALOT of learning to do.

"That doesn't mean I think he's played all good games. I don't. I know he thinks he hasn't played all good games. But I do think the bad things that have happened to him he's learning from and he's going to get better. He's getting better. And it matters to him and means a lot to him. I think he's going to be a good quarterback. It's just going to take a little time. I don't know how much time. Hopefully it happens this weekend." Also a good quote but THIS WEEKEND? I didnt know it was just a lightswitch that would turn on in JP's head. This weekend is abit of a streeeetch. Otherwise I would have turned on his lightswitch 3 years ago when he came into the NFL.
Overall, Good Post!

[ICE74129]

Sums it up right there. Atleast the guys are starting to buy into him. Im not sold yet though. Only thing is Nice guys dont finish first in the NFL if they cant win. I like the part where Dickie says hes not the QB we need him to be. For all you nuthuggers out there, we atleast Dick will acknowledge JP sucks at the moment. But he also recognizes that hes got ALOT of learning to do.
Also a good quote but THIS WEEKEND? I didnt know it was just a lightswitch that would turn on in JP's head. This weekend is abit of a streeeetch. Otherwise I would have turned on his lightswitch 3 years ago when he came into the NFL.
Overall, Good Post!

Find me ONE post where ANYONE has said JP is where he needs to be.

[ICE74129]

"Most of my answers for J.P. will be in time he's going to get a better feel for it," Jauron said. "And there aren't any other answers I don't think. Sometimes he messes it up and he'll tell you. He'll say, 'I missed the read,' or 'I was in the wrong spot and that's why I held it,' or 'I just blew it.' That doesn't happen often. Obviously some of the sacks he can't do anything about, some of them he can. The more time he plays the more he's going to feel it."

Time. Bottom line, thats what JP needs and DJ is apperantly going to give it to him. Look for JP to start next year as well. I guess the JP haters will have to find a new team.

[Inetpub]

Obviously this post is about Dick putting confidence in JP. Tom Donohoe and Ralph obviously felt he was ready. Otherwise they wouldnt just hand him a veteran lad team only to drown in his inexperience. How well did that work?

[The_Philster]

For all you nuthuggers out there, we atleast Dick will acknowledge JP sucks at the moment. But he also recognizes that hes got ALOT of learning to do.
<!-- BEGIN TEMPLATE: bbcode_quote -->putting words on the mouths of others is a form of dishonesty, you know...no one here that I've seen has said that JP doesn't need to improve still

[ICE74129]

putting words on the mouths of others is a form of dishonesty, you know...no one here that I've seen has said that JP doesn't need to improve still That seems to happen a lot with the JP hate crew. They have to twist stats or flat lie to try and back their beliefs.

[Inetpub]

putting words on the mouths of others is a form of dishonesty, you know...no one here that I've seen has said that JP doesn't need to improve still
Fair. Everyone HERE says he needs to improve. Some are more tolerant than others and will wait for the lightbulb to turn on. Some want his head now. Eitherway, he needs to improve.

Funny though, I dont see him saying the OL or the D needs improving. Isnt that odd he would only say JP? Also I like his inclusion of errors JP made and he put the blame where blame belonged. Not like some on here who will say his 15 yard sack was the OL's fault.

[Inetpub]

That seems to happen a lot with the JP hate crew. They have to twist stats or flat lie to try and back their beliefs. Same can be said for all you nuthuggers who compare him to Farve, Young, GOD. If that isnt a lie what is.

[The_Philster]

Fair. Everyone HERE says he needs to improve. Some are more tolerant than others and will wait for the lightbulb to turn on. Some want his head now. Eitherway, he needs to improve.

Funny though, I dont see him saying the OL or the D needs improving. Isnt that odd he would only say JP? Also I like his inclusion of errors JP made and he put the blame where blame belonged. Not like some on here who will say his 15 yard sack was the OL's fault.
the article was about JP...not the O-line...don't be a conspiracy theorist

[Risin]

"Most of my answers for J.P. will be in time he's going to get a better feel for it," Jauron said. "And there aren't any other answers I don't think. Sometimes he messes it up and he'll tell you. He'll say, 'I missed the read,' or 'I was in the wrong spot and that's why I held it,' or 'I just blew it.' That doesn't happen often. Obviously some of the sacks he can't do anything about, some of them he can. The more time he plays the more he's going to feel it."

Time. Bottom line, thats what JP needs and DJ is apperantly going to give it to him. Look for JP to start next year as well. I guess the JP haters will have to find a new team.


What most JP bashers don't realize, he was very raw coming out of college. Matt Leinart, Philip Rivers, Big Ben and Eli Manning all were/are more polished.

Raw QB's take more time to develop, with no guarentees they will ever pan out. Players more "NFL ready" aren't as raw, but in many cases their potential ceiling is lowers than a guy like JP's.

Another example of a raw QB is Vince Young. Right now Matt Leinart looks like the real deal, while Young looks lost at times. The flip side of that coin is that in 3 years, VY might be twice the QB Leinart is. On the other hand, he might not ever reach Matt's level.

Raw QB's are a gamble. Some have worked out in the past (John Elway, Brett Favre) others have never turned into much (Cade McNown, Akili Smith, Ryan Leaf).

I love JP's athletic ability, he has the physical potential to be an absolute stud. Question is, will he pan out like Favre and Elway, or never be anything except physical talent like Rob Johnson, Todd Blackledge, Akili Smith etc.

The way he has progressed, in less then ideal conditions, from last season through this season tells me something. He has shown mad progress, enough to give me hope that he is our answer for the next 10 years.

I will give him every opportunity to succeed here, I hope other Bills fans will back this kid, just like his coach is doing. Jauron wasn't making things up here, he was critical of JP, yet acknowledged some of the good things he's done.

Great job Dick.

[Risin]

Same can be said for all you nuthuggers who compare him to Farve, Young, GOD. If that isnt a lie what is.


He is like Favre.

He is very raw, and is a gunslinger.

To the Bills credit, they have pulled the reigns in on JP, so he isn't quite as careless as Brett was.

The comparison is in physical attributes and mentality only.

If you don't see it, you need to watch more football.

[The_Philster]

Good points, Risin..I think the expectations should be set higher for a QB out of a place like USC...because they've a history of turning out excellent pros. Their college experiences, while not quite on par with the NFL, help them acclimate to the NFL quicker than someone out of a college like Tulane. Does this mean that a Tulane grad can't turn into something special? Hell no...but I think it's understandable that it may take longer.
So what's our answer?
We either show patience...or give up and only draft a QB from a QB factory...ignoring the possibility that we could have a QB being molded into something great already in our hands.
Course...a QB factory is no guarantee either. The U has a history of producing some excellent TEs...and Everett has yet to show us much of anything.

[patmoran2006]

Originally Posted by ICE74129

Time. Bottom line, thats what JP needs and DJ is apperantly going to give it to him. Look for JP to start next year as well. I guess the JP haters will have to find a new team.
======================================================
LMAO, weren't you ready to do that after your 30-day WHINING TIRADE after the Bills drafted Whitner and McCargo in the first round?!?!?

Puh-leaseeeeeeee

[patmoran2006]

Same can be said for all you nuthuggers who compare him to Farve, Young, GOD. If that isnt a lie what is.
hahhahh.. he said "nuthuggers"

[ParanoidAndroid]

Watching the press conference (especielly the end) will give you less of a "warm fuzzy" feeling than reading this article.

[Typ0]

I hope DJ is right and JP gets his head together and reaches for his potential.

[ScottLawrence]

"Most of my answers for J.P. will be in time he's going to get a better feel for it," Jauron said. "And there aren't any other answers I don't think. Sometimes he messes it up and he'll tell you. He'll say, 'I missed the read,' or 'I was in the wrong spot and that's why I held it,' or 'I just blew it.' That doesn't happen often. Obviously some of the sacks he can't do anything about, some of them he can. The more time he plays the more he's going to feel it."

Time. Bottom line, thats what JP needs and DJ is apperantly going to give it to him. Look for JP to start next year as well. I guess the JP haters will have to find a new team.
HAAA.

Based on what?

Jauron backing his starting quarterback?

What the hell do you expect him to say....."Losman sucks, I'm getting tired of it"


Jaurons always been known as a coach who supports his players, no matter how bad they are playing.

Plus Chris Brown wrote the article, the biggest JP Losman sucker out there next to ICE.

[PECKERWOOD]

JP is the perfect present for Dick Jauron. New coaches usually want to 'win now', so they can keep their job and look good. JP isnt quite where he needs to be, but he is past the worst of his growing pains, which is a plus no matter which way you view it.

[PECKERWOOD]

HAAA.

Based on what?

Jauron backing his starting quarterback?

What the hell do you expect him to say....."Losman sucks, I'm getting tired of it"


Jaurons always been known as a coach who supports his players, no matter how bad they are playing.

Plus Chris Brown wrote the article, the biggest JP Losman sucker out there next to ICE.
I can only think of a handful of coaches that has thrown their players under the bus, Gruden and Parcells first came to my head. However, almost every coach will hint that their not satisfied with a players performance that day or whatever, Jauron being one of them.

[ScottLawrence]

I can only think of a handful of coaches that has thrown their players under the bus, Gruden and Parcells first came to my head. However, almost every coach will hint that their not satisfied with a players performance that day or whatever, Jauron being one of them.

Ask any Bears fan, they'll tell you Jauron never throws players under the bus when talking to the media.

He respects his players to much.

[PECKERWOOD]

Ask any Bears fan, they'll tell you Jauron never throws players under the bus when talking to the media.

He respects his players to much.
Like I said in my opening sentence, he doesnt throw players under the bus. But he will make suggestions and hints towards a players bad game play. He calls people out, but not in a offensive way.

[Richard Gozinya]

The Nathan Thurm act from JP's supporters has worn thin. This kid has had his grace period, and it's time to start winning games. No more excuses. Just do it or find somebody else that can.

God knows McGahee hasn't been babied like this, although he labors behind the same garbage offensive line.

[kernowboy]

I did like Risin first post.

We have a young and still inexperienced QB. Starting over again, now, or in the next draft probably won't help as I think the coaches now realise there are other foundations that need working on.

Bringing in somebody elses back up carries hugh risks.

Signing an injury prone vet like Green or Pennington if they become available is a huge and potentially very expensive risk.

What I think people have missed is that the JP Losman of today is a substantially better player than the one left us by the Donahoe/Mularky regime. I would like to think that that is not only down to the player wanting to improve but also to him get better coaching and stronger support from the coaches and management.

And this gives me hope that if JP doesn't make it to the stage of being more than an average starter, whoever we draft in maybe 2008, will be brought up in the professional game in the proper manner. I personally think Kyle Wright will be that man.

[Typ0]

I did like Risin first post.

We have a young and still inexperienced QB. Starting over again, now, or in the next draft probably won't help as I think the coaches now realise there are other foundations that need working on.

Bringing in somebody elses back up carries hugh risks.

Signing an injury prone vet like Green or Pennington if they become available is a huge and potentially very expensive risk.

What I think people have missed is that the JP Losman of today is a substantially better player than the one left us by the Donahoe/Mularky regime. I would like to think that that is not only down to the player wanting to improve but also to him get better coaching and stronger support from the coaches and management.

And this gives me hope that if JP doesn't make it to the stage of being more than an average starter, whoever we draft in maybe 2008, will be brought up in the professional game in the proper manner. I personally think Kyle Wright will be that man.


yeah that's great...a winning season in 2011 or bust.

[kernowboy]

The Pittsburgh Steelers drafted a QB and went to win the SuperBowl in his second season. So that would mean no latter than 2009 for us then

How did they accomplish this? By taking care of basics.

They have a great line on both sides. How? by good drafting and clever free agency work. We are arguably one lineman away on both sides, NT and LT from achieving this.

They have a quality TE in Miller. By acquiring either Stevens or Graham next offseason we can achieve this. Our receivers and RBs are on a par with theirs.

At LB we are not too far away but the concern is we may need to replace TKO and Fletcher-Baker together.

Our DBs and STs are the equal of the Steelers.

With the way JP is improving, astute drafting and use of FA will get us into the playoffs in 2007. And by the time 2008 comes around, yes either an improved JP or top rookie QB could take us all the way. Didn't Marino drafted at the bottom end of the first round in 1983 take the fins to the bowl in his first year? Marv will have been stung in his first go at FA, we won't get caught out again.

[CuseJetsFan83]

y'know just like people have stated in other posts about the state of each team.... in the salary cap era, its all on luck and crunching numbers.

if we had this, that, etc..... anyone could be champs

but would you like a peyton clone who cant win the big one........... or a trent dilfer qb'ed team who wins the big one mostly on defense?

either way you will bash one side and praise the other..... should the teams have problems

situation a = defense fault
situation b - offense fault

as an "outsider" i would have to say since JP has been starting for almost a year and a half, that if he doesnt accomplish anything this year....... and for up to the half way point of next year, it is time to move on........ whether it be holcomb, nall, or draft/FA QB

i just hope the bills staff has some urgency, and try to push JP along while letting him get his licks. but at some point, they have to realize whether to throw in the white towel or not.

[CuseJetsFan83]

The Pittsburgh Steelers drafted a QB and went to win the SuperBowl in his second season. So that would mean no latter than 2009 for us then

How did they accomplish this? By taking care of basics.

They have a great line on both sides. How? by good drafting and clever free agency work. We are arguably one lineman away on both sides, NT and LT from achieving this.

They have a quality TE in Miller. By acquiring either Stevens or Graham next offseason we can achieve this. Our receivers and RBs are on a par with theirs.

At LB we are not too far away but the concern is we may need to replace TKO and Fletcher-Baker together.

Our DBs and STs are the equal of the Steelers.

With the way JP is improving, astute drafting and use of FA will get us into the playoffs in 2007. And by the time 2008 comes around, yes either an improved JP or top rookie QB could take us all the way. Didn't Marino drafted at the bottom end of the first round in 1983 take the fins to the bowl in his first year? Marv will have been stung in his first go at FA, we won't get caught out again.

yeah but with BIG BEN, he's showing that he may not be that good of a qb, just got lucky at the right time... kinda like tom brady...... just happened to be right place at the right time..... and it really kills me to say it but in brady's case (and with some jobs from the refs) he can back it up......... big ben, time will tell wtih him and the same with JP. can expectations beat hype?

pennington had to wait 4 years before he finally took over..... yes he may be an injury risk, but he is much smarter than many qb's in the league, and sometimes brain does beat brawn. (ie - bill romanowski.... look at steroids and what it does to you). for the things he has gone thru, this year is just an astonishing look at how determined chad is...... yes he hasnt had the greatest of games, but he has poise..... patience, and smarts...... something jp will learn eventually

but with jp, i can tell you he can be a great qb, but it all depends on how much faith the staff puts into him, and if he remains here for alot of time..... who knows maybe a spread offense somewhere else might suit him better, or maybe he just needs another offensive weapon in good ole buffalo.

i'd love to say the bills will get the lombardi trophy in 20...... but in teh cap age....... all it takes is one lucky thing to happen and your destined............. take care of NE, and your very much in the hunt........... fail..... and well....... better start tryin out for next year

[kernowboy]

I think the problem with JP was the shoddy way he was treated last year which actually made him regress compounding the fact he didn't come from a pro-style college offense.

In many ways I would happily consider this to be his first real season and because both the offense and our defence are both huge works in progress I have been impressed by the step forward he has taken.

Whilst he is not good, other parts of the team are equally bad if not worse and from a purely pragmatic perspective, we need to address those issues first. QB is a problem but I argue that LT, NT, TE, the impending LB problem and the need to replace Clements are bigger ones

[CuseJetsFan83]

I think the problem with JP was the shoddy way he was treated last year which actually made him regress compounding the fact he didn't come from a pro-style college offense.

In many ways I would happily consider this to be his first real season and because both the offense and our defence are both huge works in progress I have been impressed by the step forward he has taken.

Whilst he is not good, other parts of the team are equally bad if not worse and from a purely pragmatic perspective, we need to address those issues first. QB is a problem but I argue that LT, NT, TE, the impending LB problem and the need to replace Clements are bigger ones

agreed... i'd have to say the game against the jets, is a good indicator that he can make it in the NFL, but then again, the jets d is just god awful this year...... if he can light up say indy........ jacksonville, then maybe he can turn some heads

but, JP should be on a short leash though, and he should be playing like he is fighting for his job, because in reality, thats what he is doing.

[kernowboy]

Oh I do agree

I like what the Jets have done, got their QB of the future on the bench but also substantially undating their line. When Clemens does start he will have protection which regretably JP doesn't have. Its very hard not to slip into the old bad habits when running for your life. Gandhi must make us the laughing stock of the league.

A concern is we will draft another QB next year without giving him adequate line protection again. As someone said on another post we need to take care of the foundations. We can pick up a TE and big no2 WR in FA next year, draft a LT in R2 and also look at DE/NT/LB in the draft.

And who knows JP could do a Dilfer for us

[CuseJetsFan83]

Oh I do agree

I like what the Jets have done, got their QB of the future on the bench but also substantially undating their line. When Clemens does start he will have protection which regretably JP doesn't have. Its very hard not to slip into the old bad habits when running for your life. Gandhi must make us the laughing stock of the league.

A concern is we will draft another QB next year without giving him adequate line protection again. As someone said on another post we need to take care of the foundations. We can pick up a TE and big no2 WR in FA next year, draft a LT in R2 and also look at DE/NT/LB in the draft.

And who knows JP could do a Dilfer for us

very true, which members on the line are indespensable, and which ones are able to just be let go?

plus would you feel safer drafting OL/DL or would you be more akin to Free agency?

too many people think short term, instead of the picture down the road........ kellan clemons will be a great qb, if he can put the knowledge pennington gives him, and as long as they can keep the OL together and healthy.

but does that equal success........ depends on what you term success.........

this year i expected the jets to go somewheres between 3-13 and 6-10....... and so far, im pleasantly surprised, would i be disappointed if we get 5 wins..... yes, but am i gonna call a lynch mob, probably not..... basically because i know we are trying to organize for the future...... and whether you want to call it reloading, rebuilding, or just creation, its a never-ending process.

[mybills]

Personally, I'd rather see JP develop with good games and bad, than to have a QB that does ok up untill the playoffs then rips my heart out with a dive-bomb into the ground.. a.k.a. Bledsoe. Who's to say Matt Leinart won't do that, too? You don't know, I don't know, so we all just have to wait and see after a FULL SEASON, just what JP becomes.

[kernowboy]

For the Bills I think we need to go for best player available of the defence in R1. I have a suspicion that it will be Paul Posluzny which is not so bad as we might be needing to replace Fletcher-Baker if he gets too greedy.

the OT depth in the forthcoming draft is extraordinary. Maybe twice as good as last year and we can definitely pick up a good LT who can start from day one in R2. With some reorganisation and a bit of luck (Butler might be a player) we will have a servicable line. Villarial won't be resigned and will be replaced by Preston or maybe even Merz, Reyes could go or be first reserve off the bench and I'd like to see Peters quick feet and pulling ability at LG. Gandy will get cut so the vacancy is at LT.

On the DL, Denney has been solid but will never be more than that. Kelsay has under achieved and if Bazuin slips into the 3rd we take him immediately. The biggest problem is the NT. Anderson will go as he's not done enough and is a Donahoe pick. Kyle Williams has lots of grit and is very much looking like our Kelly Gregg but lacks size. In the draft, there a very few big DTs unless Branch or Oram come out and because it is weak in this position teams will over reach. We may be lucky and see Justin Harrell slide to the third. He could be a difference maker. Otherwise we have two options only.
1) Hope a good player gets cut because of cap reasons especially with a team who have a lot of depth there. I could see a move for Jimmy Kennedy if the Rams cut him loose
2) Use McGahee as trade bait for a top NT and see if we could pick up a RB replacement, like maybe TJ Duckett or Chris Brown
3) Get seriously lucky and rehab a bust

[ICE74129]

Same can be said for all you nuthuggers who compare him to Farve, Young, GOD. If that isnt a lie what is.

Nuthugger? Last time I checked I am a Bills fan with a clue. One that understands the process and TIME it takes to develop a QB. As a BILLS fan I see how this former BILLS staff jerked JP around and am more than willing to give this new staff time to see what JP can do. Thats at least this year and next.

Now if supporting the QB of my TEAM is being a nuthugger...so be it.

[justasportsfan]

HAAA.

Based on what?

Jauron backing his starting quarterback?

What the hell do you expect him to say....."Losman sucks, I'm getting tired of it"


Jaurons always been known as a coach who supports his players, no matter how bad they are playing.

Plus Chris Brown wrote the article, the biggest JP Losman sucker out there next to ICE.Bitter again because Jauron isn't telling anyone that Holcomb needs time . He's had his time and is still a back up qb. :snicker: One things for sure, after all this time KH isn't where he's supposed to be when it comes to being a starter in this league. He is however where he is supposed to be, holding the clipboard.

I hate blasting a qb that plays for this team, but it sure feels a lot better when someone is hating on the starter of this team because he is a fan of a career back up qb.

[PECKERWOOD]

Why does nobody mention the horrible coaches that Losman has had? Wyche was a good QB coach in his day, but they pretty much hired him out of a waffle house. Inspector Gadget was worst than any other coach Losman had, he started and benched Losman a couple times, I'm surprised he didnt break Losman. This new regime will be better for Losman, even if things dont work out. They realize this kid is our only hope at QB, if Losman fails the Bills will indefinately fail. We have some key coaches behind Losman that I really like. Fairchild spends alot of time with Losman, and puts ALOT of pressure on Losman. Its funny how people are saying we are babying Losman, its the exact opposite, Fairchild has been making him throw, throw, throw and throw some more. Schonert seems to be a decent coach, and he had previous history as a player himself, so he knows how it feels from a players perspective. I think Van Pelt can help Losman out alot too. Van Pelt didnt get to the nfl by his athleticism, he got there because he was mentally tough. I'm hoping he can help make things more tangible for Losman. With that said, were on the right track! Go Bills!

[Risin]

God knows McGahee hasn't been babied like this, although he labors behind the same garbage offensive line.


Are you effing kidding me?!!!!?????????!!!!!!!!!

Willis is considered a god, and superstar by some, even though the dude can barely average 4 yards per carry.

He has been the definition of average so far, yet some think he is all world.

Like JP, I love Willis cuz he is a Buffalo Bill. Like JP, I'd love to see him behind an adequate offensive line.

The only double standard here is that Willis gets a free pass for being average to below, and JP gets hammered.

Funny thing is, running backs don't need to develop. For every rookie QB that "gets it", there are 75 rookie running backs that light it up in between. QB is the toughest position to develop, while RB's are one of the easiest.

I'm not disappointed with Willis, I think with a good surrounding cast he can be lights out. Same can be said about JP, only difference is fans will accept average from a 4th year running back (2 1/2 year starter), but won't from a 3rd year QB (roughly a season worth of starts.)

What gives? Ignorant haters are my guess.

[PECKERWOOD]

Willis looks average behind a poor OL, imagine how he would look behind an average OL.

[Risin]

Willis looks average behind a poor OL, imagine how he would look behind an average OL.


He'd look awesome.

Imagine if JP had a pocket to step up into, or could complete a 5-step drop without getting blindsided, or dodging 2 defensive linemen once he gets there.

That was my point. You gonna hammer JP, hammer the guy sharing the backfield with him.

[ICE74129]

Again both JP and willis are suffering from being on a bad TEAM. This OL sucks and Its a shame Marv has his head in the sand about it.

[PECKERWOOD]

He'd look awesome.

Imagine if JP had a pocket to step up into, or could complete a 5-step drop without getting blindsided, or dodging 2 defensive linemen once he gets there.

That was my point. You gonna hammer JP, hammer the guy sharing the backfield with him.
I feel the same way, our OL's poor play has been pretty blatant. I'm struggling to understand why some people are just blaming JP for our offenses struggles.

[Inetpub]

I feel the same way, our OL's poor play has been pretty blatant. I'm struggling to understand why some people are just blaming JP for our offenses struggles.
We struggle how you cant blame a guy with a history of mishaps and errors. How its always the fault of the guys in front of him but not him. Its easier to blame 1 guy for not doing his job than 4 and at the end of the day, its JP's job to get us into the endzone. Otherwise whats JP here for?

[PECKERWOOD]

We struggle how you cant blame a guy with a history of mishaps and errors. How its always the fault of the guys in front of him but not him. Its easier to blame 1 guy for not doing his job than 4 and at the end of the day, its JP's job to get us into the endzone. Otherwise whats JP here for?
You realize our OL is dirt cheap, right? None of these guys have ever been known for bein paramount linemen. You constantly point out JP's mishaps, but you fail to realize why these mishaps to happen. Its very easy to blame one man versus four men, but does that mean your making the right choice? Sometimes the minority is the one that is right, and the right stand is the unpopular one. I know alot of JP supporters here, and almost all of us realize JP makes bad decisions at times, we dont pardon him.

[Inetpub]

You realize our OL is dirt cheap, right? None of these guys have ever been known for bein paramount linemen. You constantly point out JP's mishaps, but you fail to realize why these mishaps to happen. Its very easy to blame one man versus four men, but does that mean your making the right choice? Sometimes the minority is the one that is right, and the right stand is the unpopular one. I know alot of JP supporters here, and almost all of his realize JP makes bad decisions at times, we dont pardon him.
True our OL isnt the best. I never said it wasnt. You dont need to spend millions to always have the best. Good example are the Detroit Tigers. Cheap team in the World series. Go figure.
You are right. I do constantly point out JP's mishaps. Thats because thats what they are. JP's mishaps. I know why they happen but if a QB has to concentrate and think to just keep 2 hands on the ball to protect it then WTF. Thats basics of football! Im not saying JP wont ever be in the NFL. I definately think hes NFL Calibre. So is Rob Johnson. Both will retire with NFL retirement packages for life. But are they good enough to take a team by the reigns and lead them to the playoffs or even a Superbowl? That is something I have to say I havent seen in JP as of yet. I havent seen him tell his coach to get him an OL so he can do something. If hes playing behind them he has to trust them. One day he might prove me wrong and take the Bills to the playoffs and I hope he does. But till he does, I'll be criticizing his every throw or fumble till he gets it right.

[patmoran2006]

You realize our OL is dirt cheap, right? None of these guys have ever been known for bein paramount linemen. You constantly point out JP's mishaps, but you fail to realize why these mishaps to happen. Its very easy to blame one man versus four men, but does that mean your making the right choice? Sometimes the minority is the one that is right, and the right stand is the unpopular one. I know alot of JP supporters here, and almost all of his realize JP makes bad decisions at times, we dont pardon him.
There are at LEAST a half dozen OL's in the NFL worse than BUffalo's

[PECKERWOOD]

True our OL isnt the best. I never said it wasnt. You dont need to spend millions to always have the best. Good example are the Detroit Tigers. Cheap team in the World series. Go figure.
You are right. I do constantly point out JP's mishaps. Thats because thats what they are. JP's mishaps. I know why they happen but if a QB has to concentrate and think to just keep 2 hands on the ball to protect it then WTF. Thats basics of football! Im not saying JP wont ever be in the NFL. I definately think hes NFL Calibre. So is Rob Johnson. Both will retire with NFL retirement packages for life. But are they good enough to take a team by the reigns and lead them to the playoffs or even a Superbowl? That is something I have to say I havent seen in JP as of yet. I havent seen him tell his coach to get him an OL so he can do something. If hes playing behind them he has to trust them. One day he might prove me wrong and take the Bills to the playoffs and I hope he does. But till he does, I'll be criticizing his every throw or fumble till he gets it right.

The thing is, JP isnt the only QB who makes mistakes like these and has mishaps. Last I checked, every NFL QB has them at one time or another.

And your comparison to the tigers is irrelevant, the difference between us and Detroit is their putting their money in the right place, were not. Football is all about the trenches, everybody knows it starts at the line. We have no all-stars on either side of the line. That isnt good, no matter which way you see it.

Is JP good enough to lead us to the superbowl? Yes, he eventually will be. If Trent Dilfer and Brad Johnson can lead their teams to the superbowl and win it, why couldnt JP do the same for us? All JP needs is the right supporting cast and he could win us football games. By no means am I saying he is the next Montana, Aikman, Brady and Bradshaw. Im simply saying I think he could get us a ring in a one night stand.

[PECKERWOOD]

There are at LEAST a half dozen OL's in the NFL worse than BUffalo's
Half a dozen = 6. Their are 32 teams in the NFL, we are not in good company. That just proves further that, were in the bottom quartile.

[North_Coast]

He is like Favre.

He is very raw, and is a gunslinger.

To the Bills credit, they have pulled the reigns in on JP, so he isn't quite as careless as Brett was.

The comparison is in physical attributes and mentality only.

If you don't see it, you need to watch more football.

You need to amend that last sentence: "if you don't see it, you need to watch more football while sober."

[Risin]

You need to amend that last sentence: "if you don't see it, you need to watch more football while sober."

hahaha.

Now that I rethink it, I'm not sure some of these guys I argue with are old enough to remember a young Favre.

[Inetpub]

If Trent Dilfer and Brad Johnson can lead their teams to the superbowl and win it, why couldnt JP do the same for us?
Because JP isnt a winner.
Brad johnson wins 2/3rds of his games played. JP wins 1/5ths of the games he has played.

[patmoran2006]

People dont understand how much quarterbacking goes far beyond how many yards, touchdowns and completion percentage stats you have..

It's about playing to what your team's strengths are, NOT turning the ball over at bad times, not taking stupid sacks and having the other 52 people on your team believe in you and that you're going to do the right thing when the football is in your hands.

Thats why Brad Johnson and Trent Dilfer won Super Bowls.

[ICE74129]

Because JP isnt a winner.
Brad johnson wins 2/3rds of his games played. JP wins 1/5ths of the games he has played. Because JP doesn't have the TEAM around him those guys did. Both of those Defenses carried that team. They both had more functional OL's than us and ran the ball better.

[SquishDaFish]

Pat that will come with JP playing and getting experience.

[PECKERWOOD]

Because JP isnt a winner.
Brad johnson wins 2/3rds of his games played. JP wins 1/5ths of the games he has played.
Jp is still new, once he plays more games his win percentage will obviously go up.

[PECKERWOOD]

People dont understand how much quarterbacking goes far beyond how many yards, touchdowns and completion percentage stats you have..

It's about playing to what your team's strengths are, NOT turning the ball over at bad times, not taking stupid sacks and having the other 52 people on your team believe in you and that you're going to do the right thing when the football is in your hands.

Thats why Brad Johnson and Trent Dilfer won Super Bowls.
I agree turnovers are an important reason to a teams success. However, JP has more TD's than INT's, so I believe he is on the right track.

As far as the team believing in JP. It sure seems like the coaches believe in him. JP fairly beat Holcomb out of a starting job, and his team mates saw that, and they respect that. He may not be the best QB in the game, but how many of the players on our roster are truly one of the best at their respective positions? It's hard to look down on someone, when you arent much better at your given position.

[The_Philster]

As far as the team believing in JP. It sure seems like the coaches believe in him. JP fairly beat Holcomb out of a starting job, and his team mates saw that, and they respect that.That's a big thing in his favor right there. He doesn't have teammates stabbing him in the back calling for his benching when he struggles. A mark of a good teammate is backing whoever's playing. If the coaches feel a change at a position is necessary...let them do it...lobbying to get another player benched is classless and cowardly...as well as a detriment to team unity

[Inetpub]

Because JP doesn't have the TEAM around him those guys did. Both of those Defenses carried that team. They both had more functional OL's than us and ran the ball better.
Its like a broken record here. I think Ive heard that line 5 million times. If it is our OL then dont you think Dick Jauron would say something or get new people? I dont care how cheap the Ralph can be but last time I checked, The Bills are a football team and no coach would bring a lamb to the slaughterhouse. Even if it is our OL. If it was that bad, they would address it. I dont see them addressing it so Im going to say its not that bad. Yet I do see him addressing the QB's faults in a press conference. Go figure.

Broken records should be turned off.

[feelthepain]

What most JP bashers don't realize, he was very raw coming out of college. Matt Leinart, Philip Rivers, Big Ben and Eli Manning all were/are more polished.

Raw QB's take more time to develop, with no guarentees they will ever pan out. Players more "NFL ready" aren't as raw, but in many cases their potential ceiling is lowers than a guy like JP's.

Another example of a raw QB is Vince Young.


Then why was JP a first round pick??? If he's so raw he should have been drafted much later. You usually draft high because you expect the player to contribute, especially QB's. Vince young isn't raw, he's was the best player on the field during National Championship game. The number one team in the nation couldn't stop him, he had well over 300 yards all by himself in the biggest game of his life on the biggest stage on the planet, that's not raw or even close. JP has never ever done anything even close to that. JP never had an apperance or win in any bowl game and did nothing exceptional at Tulane or UCLA infact he couldn't even outplay Patrick Ramsey, JP had to wait for Ramsey to leave for the NFL before he was given a chance JP played just two seasons of college ball as a starter.

[The_Philster]

Its like a broken record here. I think Ive heard that line 5 million times. If it is our OL then dont you think Dick Jauron would say something or get new people? I dont care how cheap the Ralph can be but last time I checked, The Bills are a football team and no coach would bring a lamb to the slaughterhouse. Even if it is our OL. If it was that bad, they would address it. I dont see them addressing it so Im going to say its not that bad. Yet I do see him addressing the QB's faults in a press conference. Go figure.

Broken records should be turned off.
they couldn't make all the necessary improvements to this team in one offseason

[PECKERWOOD]

Its like a broken record here. I think Ive heard that line 5 million times. If it is our OL then dont you think Dick Jauron would say something or get new people? I dont care how cheap the Ralph can be but last time I checked, The Bills are a football team and no coach would bring a lamb to the slaughterhouse. Even if it is our OL. If it was that bad, they would address it. I dont see them addressing it so Im going to say its not that bad. Yet I do see him addressing the QB's faults in a press conference. Go figure.

Broken records should be turned off.
They have been trying to address it, do you watch the same club as me? Why do you think Reyes and Fowler were picked up? We have had a different set up at OL each year, its pretty hard to build continuity like that.

Oh, btw. Your right, it is like a broken record because its the truth. QB's that win the superbowl obviously have good players around them, are you really stupid enough to debate that?

[Risin]

Then why was JP a first round pick??? If he's so raw he should have been drafted much later. You usually draft high because you expect the player to contribute, especially QB's. Vince young isn't raw, he's was the best player on the field during National Championship game. The number one team in the nation couldn't stop him, he had well over 300 yards all by himself in the biggest game of his life on the biggest stage on the planet, that's not raw or even close. JP has never ever done anything even close to that. JP never had an apperance or win in any bowl game and did nothing exceptional at Tulane or UCLA infact he couldn't even outplay Patrick Ramsey, JP had to wait for Ramsey to leave for the NFL before he was given a chance JP played just two seasons of college ball as a starter.


First off, worry about your own QB situation, before judging ours. :oops:

JP was a first round pick, because he had first round physical talent. Same reason Ron Wolfe gave up a first round pick to trade for Brett Favre, even though he was drafted in the second round and hadn't done crap his rookie season.

The history of the league is littered with QB's taken in the first round, on physical talent alone. Some make it, many do not. (we'll see with JP)

You telling me Vince Young isn't raw because he won a College game is silly. Michael Vick was a terror in college, but raw as hell when he came into the league, as an NFL QB. It's like comparing apples and oranges.

As far as the Ramsey comparison, Tulane's coach once said when comparing the two:

I'd want Patrick to marry my daughter, I'd want JP to QB my football team. (along them lines)

I shouldn't even respond to you, I made you eat your words when you said Daunte was 10 times the QB JP was.

Daunte: 81 of 134 929 yds. 60.4% 2 td's 3 int's. 77.0 rating.

JP: 106 of 172 1121 yds. 61.6% 6 td's 5 int's 80.1 rating.

5 years difference, in terms of experience.

You make me laugh.

[feelthepain]

First off, worry about your own QB situation, before judging ours.


Why there's nothing wrong with our QB's. They have both done more in the NFL then JP will ever do.


JP was a first round pick, because he had first round physical talent. Same reason Ron Wolfe gave up a first round pick to trade for Brett Favre, even though he was drafted in the second round and hadn't done crap his rookie season.


JP is no Favre, not smart enough.


You telling me Vince Young isn't raw because he won a College game is silly. Michael Vick was a terror in college, but raw as hell when he came into the league, as an NFL QB. It's like comparing apples and oranges.

Vince Young has been successful at the highset level of his young career. Thats not raw, that's being able to handle pressure and win when the odds are against you. Learn what it means to be raw, Vince Young is accurate and mobil and smart. I'd say of those three, Vick is one, mobil.




As far as the Ramsey comparison, Tulane's coach once said when comparing the two:

I'd want Patrick to marry my daughter, I'd want JP to QB my football team. (along them lines)

I shouldn't even respond to you, I made you eat your words when you said Daunte was 10 times the QB JP was.


Uh huh, that's why JP was a bench warmer till Ramsey left, after two years!!
The coach was obviously full of crap, you play to win. So if JP was better he would have been on the field. He wasn't, theres your facts. I didn't know JP has done a damn thing in the NFL, so whatever stupidity you're talking about with JP and Daunte you're full of crap. JP is completely healthy and still can't win games, Daunte's coming off triple ligament knee surgery, and you're on drugs.


Daunte: 81 of 134 929 yds. 60.4% 2 td's 3 int's. 77.0 rating.

JP: 106 of 172 1121 yds. 61.6% 6 td's 5 int's 80.1 rating.

5 years difference, in terms of experience.

You make me laugh.

Since you're going out of your way to be an idiot, let me help you,


Daunte Culpepper:

<TABLE cellSpacing=1 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR class=bg3 id=total_CAREER_qb_passing vAlign=center align=right height=15><TD class=bg4 align=left>TOTAL</TD><TD class=bg4 align=left> </TD><TD class=bg4>85</TD><TD class=bg4>84</TD><TD class=bg4>2741</TD><TD class=bg4>1759</TD><TD class=bg4>64.2</TD><TD class=bg4>21091</TD><TD class=bg4>7.69</TD><TD class=bg4>82</TD><TD class=bg4>137</TD><TD class=bg4>89</TD><TD class=bg4>249/1364</TD><TD class=bg4>269</TD><TD class=bg4>58</TD><TD class=bg4>90.8</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

JP Losman:

<TABLE cellSpacing=1 cellPadding=1 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR class=bg2 id=total_CAREER_qb_passing vAlign=center align=right height=15><TD class=bg4 align=left>TOTAL</TD><TD class=bg4 align=left> </TD><TD class=bg4>19</TD><TD class=bg4>14</TD><TD class=bg4>405</TD><TD class=bg4>222</TD><TD class=bg4>54.8</TD><TD class=bg4>2493</TD><TD class=bg4>6.16</TD><TD class=bg4>58</TD><TD class=bg4>14</TD><TD class=bg4>14</TD><TD class=bg4>46/358</TD><TD class=bg4>28</TD><TD class=bg4>8</TD><TD class=bg4>70.5</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

Yep, JP will be the man...if he plays for 30 years.

[The_Philster]

Why there's nothing wrong with our QB's. They have both done more in the NFL then JP will ever do..
so how much was that you won in the lotto? :scratch:



:rolleyes:

[Risin]

Poor feelthepain.

Living in the past.

Daunte did well in Minnesota, but you said he is 10x the QB JP is.

That is phrased in the present, but now you bring career stats into it to backup a ******ed claim.

Now you blame injury, LMAO!

Drew Brees had a much worse injury for a QB to recover from, especially when his arm strength was already questioned. How's he looking?

Funny you say JP isn't smart like Favre, you're the one making idiotic claims. Favre is no Mensa Member, and makes tons of stupid decisions, even now in the twilight of his career.

Don't bring this weak crap.

[Typ0]

Developmentally, yes Vince Young is far behind Max Leinart..but why then did he "look like a veteran" in his own coaches words playing last week? When has JP Losman ever "looked like a veteran"? JP has done nothing to indicate he even has football sense other than make some good throws. You made the analogy not me.

[feelthepain]

Poor feelthepain.

Living in the past.

Daunte did well in Minnesota, but you said he is 10x the QB JP is.

That is phrased in the present, but now you bring career stats into it to backup a ******ed claim.

Now you blame injury, LMAO!

Drew Brees had a much worse injury for a QB to recover from, especially when his arm strength was already questioned. How's he looking?

Funny you say JP isn't smart like Favre, you're the one making idiotic claims. Favre is no Mensa Member, and makes tons of stupid decisions, even now in the twilight of his career.

Don't bring this weak crap.


Weak crap?? Look who's trying to justify JP Losman. He still has done nothing in this league!!!! End of story. Even to this very second,nothing!!! no living in the past, that's as present as it get's.

[Philagape]

When has JP Losman ever "looked like a veteran"?

Against Miami, NE and Minnesota and at times against the Jets and Detroit.