Being a fan

[Mr. Miyagi]

Anyone can jump on the bandwagon of a team who is a proven winner. They have wins and trophies as cold hard facts and results that they're good. So it's easy to root for them. It's easy to "believe" when it's already right in front of you.

Those kinds of people aren't fans. They're followers.

The true measure of diehard fan is when the team is down and losing, you can still root for them, believe that it will come around, look on the bright side, and instill positive energy. It's about believing that the best is yet to come, even when there's no factual reason to believe. It's about having faith without seeing proof.

And guess what? I have faith. I billieve. Maybe not this season, maybe not the next, but one day I KNOW my faith will be rewarded.

Who's with me?

[THATHURMANATOR]

Anyone can jump on the bandwagon of a team who is a proven winner. They have wins and trophies as cold hard facts and results that they're good. So it's easy to root for them. It's easy to "believe" when it's already right in front of you.

Those kinds of people aren't fans. They're followers.

The true measure of diehard fan is when the team is down and losing, you can still root for them, believe that it will come around, look on the bright side, and instill positive energy. It's about believing that the best is yet to come, even when there's no factual reason to believe. It's about having faith without seeing proof.

And guess what? I have faith. I billieve. Maybe not this season, maybe not the next, but one day I KNOW my faith will be rewarded.

Who's with me?
I am in. I have gone through so much why not stick with them right!

[Mr. Miyagi]

Welcome Thurm!

There's a time and place to be a critic. I didn't become a Bills fan because I wanted to critize every move they make and analyze every play. I'll leave that up for the reporters and beat writers. I do that with the projects at work, because I'm paid to be a analysis not a fan of work.

But I choose to be a fan of the Bills. Nothing more.

[Mr. Miyagi]

We need to start a FAN group and a CRITIC group! Much like "homers" and "haters" only less offensive!

[justasportsfan]

Anyone can jump on the bandwagon of a team who is a proven winner. They have wins and trophies as cold hard facts and results that they're good. So it's easy to root for them. It's easy to "believe" when it's already right in front of you.

Those kinds of people aren't fans. They're followers.

The true measure of diehard fan is when the team is down and losing, you can still root for them, believe that it will come around, look on the bright side, and instill positive energy. It's about believing that the best is yet to come, even when there's no factual reason to believe. It's about having faith without seeing proof.

And guess what? I have faith. I billieve. Maybe not this season, maybe not the next, but one day I KNOW my faith will be rewarded.

Who's with me?
:10:

[PECKERWOOD]

Miyagi, I wouldnt have it any other way. I couldnt just hop on a good teams bandwagon, it wouldnt feel right. When Buffalo wins the superbowl, Im gonna be so happy, it will make it that much better for me. All the losing seasons we have been through, and through all the rain n' the pain, it feels so much better coming up from the bottom to the top. God bless, Bill's fans. We lost 4 superbowls yet were all still here, one of these days our broken hearts will be mended! Go Bills!

[kernowboy]

Great post

[mybills]

You can count me in, Miyagi..otherwise, my username wouldn't make any sense.

[Mr. Miyagi]

You can count me in, Miyagi..otherwise, my username wouldn't make any sense.
It'd make sense to me.

I have water bill, cable bill, cell phone bill.......

[Mr. Miyagi]

Miyagi, I wouldnt have it any other way. I couldnt just hop on a good teams bandwagon, it wouldnt feel right. When Buffalo wins the superbowl, Im gonna be so happy, it will make it that much better for me. All the losing seasons we have been through, and through all the rain n' the pain, it feels so much better coming up from the bottom to the top. God bless, Bill's fans. We lost 4 superbowls yet were all still here, one of these days our broken hearts will be mended! Go Bills!
I'm tearing up a bit just thinking about it.

I swear to God when the Bills finally win the big one, I will literally cry.

[mybills]

It'd make sense to me.

I have water bill, cable bill, cell phone bill.......
yeah, but that would be my bills. See the little space in between? :;

[TacklingDummy]

We need to start a FAN group and a CRITIC group! Much like "homers" and "haters" only less offensive!

I thought it was "homers" and "realists"? Since when did the "realists" turn into "haters"?

[Mr. Miyagi]

I thought it was "homers" and "realists"? Since when did the "realists" turn into "haters"?
:rofl: My bad. Same thing though. :snicker:

[GFLuNEEDit]

Anyone can jump on the bandwagon of a team who is a proven winner. They have wins and trophies as cold hard facts and results that they're good. So it's easy to root for them. It's easy to "believe" when it's already right in front of you.

Those kinds of people aren't fans. They're followers.

The true measure of diehard fan is when the team is down and losing, you can still root for them, believe that it will come around, look on the bright side, and instill positive energy. It's about believing that the best is yet to come, even when there's no factual reason to believe. It's about having faith without seeing proof.

And guess what? I have faith. I billieve. Maybe not this season, maybe not the next, but one day I KNOW my faith will be rewarded.

Who's with me?

Not me

What you are describing is someone that will route for anything or anybody as long as they wear a Bills uniform.


And guess what? I have faith


That sick statement hits the nail right on the head.
Football is not religion.
I have faith in only one God. I have no faith in any football player.
Its a game not a religion.

Dont you feel just a little uncomfortable insinsuating that you have 'faith' in someone like for example Willis McGahee ?%$@!

Do you actually feel comfortable saying that you have faith in a sub 80 IQ dimwit
and the tattoo on his neck just because he wears a Bills uniform and runs with a football?

Understand this...there is nothing whatsoever immoral or anti-social about having a straight forward opinion on the ability or inability of any football team or player.

Blindly cheering for any group of people the Bills decide to stick into a uniform is in no way a barometer of character or any other positive attribute.

That is the true social sickness of brand loyalty.

That is no different than hearing two drunks get into a heated arguement about which brand of beer or wiskey is the best. Then having one claim they the other should have 'faith' in the local brewmaster.

There is nothing redeeming in your unwavering loyalty to a football team regardless of how thoroughly you have convinced yourself that there is.

Half these football players have a rap sheet longer than your arm.

So wake up and get your head out of your a**, because someone has sold you a Bill of goods. ( thats a pun )


<!-- / message -->

[Forward_Lateral]

If the Bills ever win a superbowl, I will likely have a heart attack from excitement. It will be worth it. :up:

[Gunzlingr]

I am with you MM!

[The_Philster]

We need to start a FAN group and a CRITIC group! Much like "homers" and "haters" only less offensive!
I think you can criticize and still be a fan...but some people get way too carried away with criticism to excess...even going so far as to make up stuff to criticize...great thread, MM :bf1:

[gil]

Understand this...there is nothing whatsoever immoral or anti-social about having a straight forward opinion on the ability or inability of any football team or player.

Blindly cheering for any group of people the Bills decide to stick into a uniform is in no way a barometer of character or any other positive attribute.

That is the true social sickness of brand loyalty.

thanks for the insightful social commentary!!!

<!-- / message -->
Half these football players have a rap sheet longer than your arm.

oh really, I'd love to see your list of "half" the bills or "half" of the NFL with rapsheets.

Great post Miyagi, btw

[GFLuNEEDit]

I think you can criticize and still be a fan...but some people get way too carried away with criticism to excess...even going so far as to make up stuff to criticize...great thread, MM Would it suprise you to know that some see it as people getting too carried away with being agog with athletes.

I myself cannot imagine getting pissed off at someone who says one player or another sucks .

Even if I thought the player was a reasonably good player it would never come close to registering a bad reaction from me.

I'll discuss sports with people but I cannot comprehend the thought of latching onto a team or player to the point where I would take offense to someone elses opinion.

[The_Philster]

Would it suprise you to know that some see it as people getting too carried away with being agog with athletes.

I myself cannot imagine getting pissed off at someone who says one player or another sucks .

Even if I thought the player was a reasonably good player it would never come close to registering a bad reaction from me.

I'll discuss sports with people but I cannot comprehend the thought of latching onto a team or player to the point where I would take offense to someone elses opinion.
it's not the opinion people get upset with...it's the way the opinion is relayed...either with name-calling (nut huggers?), lies, or just overly repetitive. Once you've been here a little longer, you may see what I mean. Some of us can agree to disagree most of the time.

[GFLuNEEDit]

thanks for the insightful social commentary!!!
You are welcome , hopefully it serves its purpose and leads some of these zombies out of a mental fog.

[GFLuNEEDit]

it's not the opinion people get upset with...it's the way the opinion is relayed...either with name-calling (nut huggers?), lies, or just overly repetitive. Once you've been here a little longer, you may see what I mean. Some of us can agree to disagree most of the time.
Oh I agree.

And the one thing that become obvious is that 90% of the obsenity and name calling gets started by the diehard fans.

Balanced individuals just are not attached enough to any team or player enough to take it to that extent.

They come at me all the time on that level and I respond in kind, but you'll never see me instigate any of that.

Why ? Because I'm not emotionally married to football players like they seem to be.

The truth for any objective person is that the vast majority of this is coming from these fanatics.

<!-- / message -->

[BidsJr]

Not me

What you are describing is someone that will route for anything or anybody as long as they wear a Bills uniform.



That sick statement hits the nail right on the head.
Football is not religion.
I have faith in only one God. I have no faith in any football player.
Its a game not a religion.

Dont you feel just a little uncomfortable insinsuating that you have 'faith' in someone like for example Willis McGahee ?%$@!

Do you actually feel comfortable saying that you have faith in a sub 80 IQ dimwit
and the tattoo on his neck just because he wears a Bills uniform and runs with a football?

Understand this...there is nothing whatsoever immoral or anti-social about having a straight forward opinion on the ability or inability of any football team or player.

Blindly cheering for any group of people the Bills decide to stick into a uniform is in no way a barometer of character or any other positive attribute.

That is the true social sickness of brand loyalty.

That is no different than hearing two drunks get into a heated arguement about which brand of beer or wiskey is the best. Then having one claim they the other should have 'faith' in the local brewmaster.

There is nothing redeeming in your unwavering loyalty to a football team regardless of how thoroughly you have convinced yourself that there is.

Half these football players have a rap sheet longer than your arm.

So wake up and get your head out of your a**, because someone has sold you a Bill of goods. ( thats a pun )


<!-- / message -->

Most religious people put their faith in men just as much as they put their faith in God. Odds are you have no idea what you are talking about. Only few "really" believe in what you claim to believe. Most who think they believe it truely do not.

[The_Philster]

Oh I agree.

And the one thing that become obvious is that 90% of the obsenity and name calling gets started by the diehard fans.

Balanced individuals just are not attached enough to any team or player enough to take it to that extent.

They come at me all the time on that level and I respond in kind, but you'll never see me instigate any of that.

Why ? Because I'm not emotionally married to football players like they seem to be.

The truth for any objective person is that the vast majority of this is coming from these fanatics.

<!-- / message -->
I think your 90% number is a bit high ;)

[Billscusey]

Anyone can jump on the bandwagon of a team who is a proven winner. They have wins and trophies as cold hard facts and results that they're good. So it's easy to root for them. It's easy to "believe" when it's already right in front of you.

Those kinds of people aren't fans. They're followers.

The true measure of diehard fan is when the team is down and losing, you can still root for them, believe that it will come around, look on the bright side, and instill positive energy. It's about believing that the best is yet to come, even when there's no factual reason to believe. It's about having faith without seeing proof.

And guess what? I have faith. I billieve. Maybe not this season, maybe not the next, but one day I KNOW my faith will be rewarded.

Who's with me?

I'm with ya!!! ...... but it would still be nice to win now! :(

[Mr. Miyagi]

Balanced individuals just are not attached enough to any team or player enough to take it to that extent.

Why ? Because I'm not emotionally married to football players like they seem to be.
I am not emotionally attached to the players. I'm emotionally attached to the team.

And if you do not have enough emotional attachments to the team for you to be passionate, then you're just a casual observer of the team, not a fan.

There's nothing wrong with that, but to insinuate that we who have blind faith are not balanced individuals would be condescending and arrogant. If you're complacent to be standing on the sidelines and cheer casually when the team wins and turn your back when the team loses, then it's your poragative. But don't discredit the ones who REALLY care.

[GFLuNEEDit]

I think your 90% number is a bit high ;)

Oh yeah ?
Here is an example .
Look what this psychopath breaks out with.

Then I need to respond at that level. I mean WTF is it with these crackpots.


Re: BuffaloFever
<!-- BEGIN TEMPLATE: bbcode_quote -->
Quote:
<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=3 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD class=alt2 style="BORDER-RIGHT: 1px inset; BORDER-TOP: 1px inset; BORDER-LEFT: 1px inset; BORDER-BOTTOM: 1px inset">So if your not a fan of any team, and you think its 'extra weird' to express whether or not you want a player or not, why are you even here? This a football forum, if you wanna talk to 13 year old girls, try getting AOL or something </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
<!-- END TEMPLATE: bbcode_quote -->I don't need to have a crush on a player like you do to discuss football.
Where did you get the idea that a football forum is only for people infatuated with players?
Are you under the impression that all people that watch football have posters of players in thier bedrooms like you?

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and you think its 'extra weird' to express whether or not you want a player or not



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<!-- END TEMPLATE: bbcode_quote -->Yeah because I dont want a football player like you do

<!-- BEGIN TEMPLATE: bbcode_quote -->
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<!-- END TEMPLATE: bbcode_quote -->If either of us were to be interested in 13 year olds it would be you. Only your interest would be in 13 year old boys.<!-- / message --><!-- / message --><!-- edit note -->

[PECKERWOOD]

Oh yeah ?
Here is an example .
Look what this psychopath breaks out with.

Then I need to respond at that level. I mean WTF is it with these crackpots.


Re: BuffaloFever
<!-- BEGIN TEMPLATE: bbcode_quote -->
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<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=3 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD class=alt2 style="BORDER-RIGHT: 1px inset; BORDER-TOP: 1px inset; BORDER-LEFT: 1px inset; BORDER-BOTTOM: 1px inset">So if your not a fan of any team, and you think its 'extra weird' to express whether or not you want a player or not, why are you even here? This a football forum, if you wanna talk to 13 year old girls, try getting AOL or something </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
<!-- END TEMPLATE: bbcode_quote -->I don't need to have a crush on a player like you do to discuss football.
Where did you get the idea that a football forum is only for people infatuated with players?
Are you under the impression that all people that watch football have posters of players in thier bedrooms like you?

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and you think its 'extra weird' to express whether or not you want a player or not



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<!-- END TEMPLATE: bbcode_quote -->Yeah because I dont want a football player like you do

<!-- BEGIN TEMPLATE: bbcode_quote -->
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<!-- END TEMPLATE: bbcode_quote -->If either of us were to be interested in 13 year olds it would be you. Only your interest would be in 13 year old boys.<!-- / message --><!-- / message --><!-- edit note -->

Your trying to put words in my mouth dick head, it aint happenin. I never said this place is for fanatics. Simply, for people who want to express their opinions. And you dont have to have a man crush to talk football, but Id rather talk it with fans. You however have no ties to any team, thus, why the **** are you here?

lol, thats a middle school response right there. Either your 13 years old, or you are a gay repressed 30 year old. For your sake, lets hope its not the latter.

Cool, another 'gay' comment. Tell me, why is the subject of being 'gay' even on your mind? Are you hiding something? They have therapists for problems like that.

Im not going to waste anymore time on you, because the way you are going, you will probably be banned soon enough! Just remember though, stay away from drugs, and stay in school. :up:

[G. Host]

Those kinds of people aren't fans. They're followers.
I agree but some fans become so critical, become so blue in the face becoming a fan of one player that they have loss their focus. It is the extreme part of fandom which is so easily to slip into.

[GFLuNEEDit]

If you're complacent to be a standing on the sidelines and cheer casually when the team wins and turn your back when the team loses, then it's your poragative. But don't discredit the ones who REALLY care.

What convinces you that I'm any different when the Bills win or lose ?

You assume that I stand on the perimiter and when the Buffalo Bills begin to win I slide into the 'in crowd' to crash the party. Or as you put it jump on the bandwagon.

You believing that bull***** is where the arrogance is.

I am no different whether that team or any other team wins or loses unless I have a wager going.






But don't discredit the ones who REALLY care.

Read your post in it's you that discredited those who feel no obligation to the Bills to the extent that as you put it they "REALLY care". (REALLY in caps...omg)

It's you . You are the one that went off with discrediting good people.

I feel no remorse and neither should any other sane person about not 'really caring'.

To me it's just football.

[GFLuNEEDit]

See what I mean Philster ...

You will never see a balanced person going off like this BuffaloFever crackpot.

And what group do you think he is part of , the diehard fanatics or the posters that dont really feel an irrational loyalty ?

Read his posts and you will easily see that he is one of these off the wall wackos that would sell his mother for a Superbowl.



He actually believes that you need to have "ties to a team" to talk football.


You however have no ties to any team, thus, why the **** are you here?



But he also said this


I never said this place is for fanatics. Simply, for people who want to express their opinions.

Now how insane is that ?

[PECKERWOOD]

See what I mean Philster ...

You will never see a balanced person going off like this BuffaloFever crackpot.

And what group do you think he is part of , the diehard fanatics or posters that dont really feel an irrational loyalty ?

Read his posts and you will easily see that he is one of these off the wall wackos that would sell his mother for a Superbowl.

He actually believes that you need to have "ties to a team" to talk football.


But he also said this
Now how insane is that ?

The point is, your not talking football. You keep attacking posters, you havent said anything about the Buffalo Bills since you have been here. Also, having 'ties', to a team makes you a fanatic...? I guess so, I love the Bills, call me a fanatic if you want, thats just how it is.

[GFLuNEEDit]

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The point is, your not talking football. You keep attacking posters, you havent said anything about the Buffalo Bills since you have been here. Also, having 'ties', to a team makes you a fanatic...? I guess so, I love the Bills, call me a fanatic if you want, thats just how it is.


I said plenty about football and what I have said about Losman is what caused you to go off like I was criticizing your boyfriend.
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[PECKERWOOD]

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I said plenty about football and what I have said about Losman is what caused you to go off like I was criticizing your boyfriend.
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lolllll, you got me, JP is my boyfriend. SUPPPPERRR! Say thareee.

I really sound like an idiot for even responding to you, but I cant help myself. Just because I disagree with you, JP suddenly becomes my b/f? What kind of ****ed up logic is that? Have you even been around sports fans before? Thats all talking football is about, disagreement. Just look at the boards, nobody here ever agrees on anything.

[GFLuNEEDit]

agree but some fans become so critical, become so blue in the face becoming a fan of one player that they have loss their focus. It is the extreme part of fandom which is so easily to slip into.
Exactly !

And trying to understand the psychology of someone that would lose enough self respect to "slip into that" as you put it would be like opening a pandoras box.

[GFLuNEEDit]

lolllll, you got me, JP is my boyfriend. SUPPPPERRR! Say thareee.

I really sound like an idiot for even responding to you, but I cant help myself. Just because I disagree with you, JP suddenly becomes my b/f? What kind of ****ed up logic is that? Have you even been around sports fans before? Thats all talking football is about, disagreement. Just look at the boards, nobody here ever agrees on anything.

Edited for TOS violations. Personal attacks will not be tolerated.<!-- / message -->

[GFLuNEEDit]

Most religious people put their faith in men just as much as they put their faith in God. Odds are you have no idea what you are talking about. Only few "really" believe in what you claim to believe. Most who think they believe it truely do not.

Odds are you are overabsorbed in this and therefore on that basis resent my comments.<!-- / message -->

[shelby]

Play nicely or leave the sandbox GFL.
There is a smack forum if you are so inclined.

Double M, count me in.
:gobills:

[The_Philster]

All of you drop the personal attacks and name-calling...or else you may be forced to find somewhere else to post. When you registered, you agreed to follow the TOS...maybe some of you should read it..cause if you can't follow it, you aren't welcome here
http://www.billszone.com/fanzone/showthread.php?t=12

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your boyfriend.
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comments like that don't exactly prove your point

[GFLuNEEDit]

Your an ignorant bigot. You can not support any of your arguments and you got owned. So you resorted to name calling and slander.

You have short term memory problems .
It is you that initiated all of this .

Now you pawn yourself off as someone who is offended by the name callers and the obsenities.

You need to make this comment :

Your an ignorant bigot. You can not support any of your arguments and you got owned. So you resorted to name calling and slander.
to give yourself credibility when you email the moderator.


When all along it is you that instigated all of it.

To the moderator...This is the comment by this poster that set all these insults off

This a football forum, if you wanna talk to 13 year old girls, try getting AOL or something

Made by the very same person who is calling on you to intervene.

All because in his mind I should be the fan of a particular football team.
Can anyone see that as reasonable?


<!-- / message -->

[PECKERWOOD]

All apologies, my bad.

[The_Philster]

All apologies, my bad.
If someone pisses you off so much that you're tempted to start making personal attacks, it's best to either step back or stick them on ignore :peace:

[GFLuNEEDit]

That type of stuff is what they do all the time, so it didnt piss me off.

That's just the response he deserves, that's why I followed up.

[The_Philster]

It didnt piss me off.
That's just the response he deserves.
no one deserves personal attacks. There's rules we are all obligated to follow here

[shelby]

Don't make me move a perfectly good thread.
Feve apologized, drop it, play nicely, and move on.

:gobills:

[GFLuNEEDit]

I'm going to drop all of this for now.

And just to demonstrate my magnanomous nature I'm going to post some free picks for tonights hockey games on the sabres forum.

[shelby]

Thank you kind sir, and good day to you.

[X-Era]

Anyone can jump on the bandwagon of a team who is a proven winner. They have wins and trophies as cold hard facts and results that they're good. So it's easy to root for them. It's easy to "believe" when it's already right in front of you.

Those kinds of people aren't fans. They're followers.

The true measure of diehard fan is when the team is down and losing, you can still root for them, believe that it will come around, look on the bright side, and instill positive energy. It's about believing that the best is yet to come, even when there's no factual reason to believe. It's about having faith without seeing proof.

And guess what? I have faith. I billieve. Maybe not this season, maybe not the next, but one day I KNOW my faith will be rewarded.

Who's with me?

Thank you!

My post was a bit more negative but thats the point.

Is hating, rooting? I think not.

[GFLuNEEDit]

Is hating, rooting? I think not.

Is facing reality hating , I thing not.

Is rooting redeeming , hardly.

[Typ0]

Anyone can jump on the bandwagon of a team who is a proven winner. They have wins and trophies as cold hard facts and results that they're good. So it's easy to root for them. It's easy to "believe" when it's already right in front of you.

Those kinds of people aren't fans. They're followers.

The true measure of diehard fan is when the team is down and losing, you can still root for them, believe that it will come around, look on the bright side, and instill positive energy. It's about believing that the best is yet to come, even when there's no factual reason to believe. It's about having faith without seeing proof.

And guess what? I have faith. I billieve. Maybe not this season, maybe not the next, but one day I KNOW my faith will be rewarded.

Who's with me?

another blind faith makes "real fans" assertion. you can believe you are a better fan that someone who recognizes this organization is a joke that's your perogie. Last week I was watching the game with my brother in law. He said we should win. I told him it was a toss up and I kinda doubted we'd win because our run defense is horrid. I think it was two plays into the game they broke one for 20 yards or so. Then I laughed and said we were going to lose. Guess what, next week I'll be watching again hoping we can win but realistically doubting it. I guess you are a better fan that me.

[Typ0]

In short, I don't think we are going to win this week. I'm not going to look like some stupid sucker and go around saying we are going to win when I'm smart enough to know there is only a 5% chance we can pull off a victory. I'm still going to be rooting for us to win on sunday.

[X-Era]

It facing reality hating , I thing not.

Is rooting redeeming , hardly.

Reality is all a matter of perception, haters are always "the glass is half empty"

[GFLuNEEDit]

another blind faith makes "real fans" assertion. you can believe you are a better fan that someone who recognizes this organization is a joke that's your perogie. Last week I was watching the game with my brother in law. He said we should win. I told him it was a toss up and I kinda doubted we'd win because our run defense is horrid. I think it was two plays into the game they broke one for 20 yards or so. Then I laughed and said we were going to lose. Guess what, next week I'll be watching again hoping we can win but realistically doubting it. I guess you are a better fan that me.

No kidding we have someone who isn't a brainwashed zombie.

I'll be damned.

[The_Philster]

Then I laughed and said we were going to lose.:cynic:

[The_Philster]

No kidding we have someone who isn't a brainwashed zombie.

I'll be damned.
laughing about the Bills loss is proof that you're not a brainwashed zombie now, is it?

Better to be a brainwashed zombie who actually hates losing than the alternative

[BillsPride12]

Good post. The Bills are terrible right now and I don't think 95% of the players on the team give a damn but I still wear my Bills hat everyday! I'll never stop rooting for this team, some of these players on the other hand...

[Mr. Miyagi]

I think the so-called "realists" or "haters" are either non-Bills fans, or more likely once passionate real fans who are tired of investing their emotions and being disappointed time and time again. So their natural defensive mechanism is to retreat and assume the worst all the time, and satisfy themselves with all the "I told you so"s not because they're happy the team loses, but because at least their predictions are right so it makes them feel a little better about themselves.

Human nature for the ones who are naturally less optimistic.

Let's hope that in our lifetimes the Bills will actually perform and deliver, leading the team to the Promised Land. When that happens whether you're a homer or a realist you will drop all your guards down and high five together.

May all the yay and nay sayers unite with a championship!

GOOOOOOOOOOOO BILLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[GFLuNEEDit]

Look dont tell me what to do.

Its very hypocritical of you.
Do you refrain from retaliating when someone attacks you personally ?

I doubt you do.

Not once have you attempted to admonish the individual responsible for instigating the whole feud.

Who are you to decide that once he initiates this nonsense you will then step in to correct me when I response.

I think I have it all figured out though ...it's not a really a matter of the fact that he is to blame. You choose to use it as an opportunity to preach to me because you dont like my opinions on football, Losman specifically.

Because if you were unbiased you would state the obvious, which would be..Billsfever if you didnt open your big mouth with these vulgar attacks on GFL none of this would have been neccessary.

But you dont want truth you want this as a chance to attack someone who my not agree with you. That is childish especially knowing that you would also have retaliated.

Hypocrits.

[GFLuNEEDit]

I think the so-called "realists" or "haters" are either non-Bills fans, or more likely once passionate real fans who are tired of investing their emotions and being disappointed time and time again. So their natural defensive mechanism is to retreat and assume the worst all the time, and satisfy themselves with all the "I told you so"s not because they're happy the team loses, but because at least their predictions are right so it makes them feel a little better about themselves

I hate to keep disagreeing with you because I'm convince that you sincerely believe what you are saying.

Try to trust me when I say that not all people think this way.

I honestly don't have much disappointment when the Bills lose unless I have money riding on it.

I honestly dont view the Bills as some sort of focal point for the local community to rally around. Not that there is anything wrong with that. I just don't relate to this notion that its something that people should do. If they do thats ok and if they dont its equally ok.

I like watching the games and having an opinion on the team. But when someone suggests that I'm not as entitled to an opinion on the QB, coach ect because I don't have the 'true fan' mindset, I question the persons sanity.

There is one individual that keeps asking me....if your are not a true fan what are you doing posting on the forum ? That question makes no sense to me.

I have 3 brothers when we get together its not unusual for the Bills to be a topic. But I don't think any of them would want to say they fit that 'true fan' mold. None of us put a lot of emotional energy into it.

So you assume that if someone doesn't love a football team they are a 'hater'. You couldn't be more wrong.

So here is what it is...when it comes to the Bills some people are more pragmatic and don't have this 'we should back the Bills thing' blown out of proportion.

[kernowboy]

Over on your side of the pond, you don't even suffer the dread 'relegation' where upon if you your play is so poor, they don't even let you play in the top league.

True fans are those supporters who support their team through thick and thin.

You guys at the Bills should feel lucky. How long has it been since the Bills made it to the post season? 5-6 years.

When it becomes 10-15 years then so of the bile might be warranted. How long did the Bucs, Bengals and Browns have to wait? Hell, the Browns even lost their team at one point.

A lot of this constant stream of bile and negativity is mentally creating a situation suggesting that it is worse than it probably is.

Is beating up on yourselves an American trait?

[GFLuNEEDit]

The Bills are terrible right now and I don't think 95% of the players on the team give a damn
No more that 2 or 3 weeks ago after a recent loss Losman stated in his press conference after the game that....he and the rest of the players on the team don't give a damn about what the fans think or what the press writes they care about themselves.

I don't believe that the devouted fans want to except that as truth. Because I believe they like to see this as us and Losman and the rest of the team taking on the rest of the league. But there really is no connection like that.

To me the ticket buyer is the Bills customer and Losman is the Bills employee.
So I can't see how the front office can be very happy with him telling thier customers "I dont care what you think and niether does anyone else". But his words like them or not were honest...he doesn't care what you think. He said he and his teammates want to win for each other. In so many words...not for you.

He is here to succeed for the sole purpose of making money. Nothing more.
OK ?

This is only one of serveral reasons why I can't for the life of me understand why 'true fans' go into these psycho dramas everytime someone voices a negative opinion on the coach, QB or anyone else.

[The_Philster]

He is here to succeed for the sole purpose of making money. Nothing more.
They make more money the further they make it into the playoffs

[kernowboy]

I think like will all employees eventually total 100% criticism gets to you.

Unfortunately the most vocal tend to be the most negative.

I almost agree with JPs statement in that if you cannot even recognise some achievements .... and there have been some then why should the team listen to people who are simple going to get down on them.

It is hard to have confidence in yourself if even if you do well you won't receive the compliments. If JP throws for 250yds, 2TDs and no INT, if Evans gets a 100yds as does McGahee, I think the players have reached the stage where they will just think they will hear how the Pats lost it rather than the Bills won it.

The problem with all of the 'haters' is that any criticism of any person at any time in any situation has to be tempered with a recognition and positive acceptance of what they have done well.

[GFLuNEEDit]

A lot of this constant stream of bile and negativity is mentally creating a situation suggesting that it is worse than it probably is.

Is beating up on yourselves an American trait?

Well I for one am not beating up on myself.
I dont beat up on myself over any football team.

Nothing is worse because there is no tragedy even if they go 0-16.




I think the players have reached the stage where they will just think they will hear how the Pats lost it rather than the Bills won it.
Even if this strange theory was true...so what. Does anyone really worry about that ?

[kernowboy]

How can you say that?

Football is no a matter of life or death ... its more important than that!!

P.s. Only joking

[GFLuNEEDit]

Quote:
<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=3 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD class=alt2 style="BORDER-RIGHT: 1px inset; BORDER-TOP: 1px inset; BORDER-LEFT: 1px inset; BORDER-BOTTOM: 1px inset">He is here to succeed for the sole purpose of making money. Nothing more.

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<!-- END TEMPLATE: bbcode_quote -->
They make more money the further they make it into the playoffs And they won't be giving a dime of it to you so stop worrying about it.

[GFLuNEEDit]

The problem with all of the 'haters' is that any criticism of any person at any time in any situation has to be tempered with a recognition and positive acceptance of what they have done well.

Why ? Why do you feel an obligation like that to some football player you dont know from Adam.

I tell you what when i'm talking football and pointing out some boneheaded plays by a Qb or bad decision by a coach , I have never once in my life said to myself ....hey I better temper this with some positive reenforcement.

Hell if I had that type of stuff swimming around in my mind then I would be the person making millions of dollars writing the Barney songs.<!-- / message -->

[GFLuNEEDit]

I almost agree with JPs statement in that if you cannot even recognise some achievements .... and there have been some then why should the team listen to people who are simple going to get down on them.
Because this is sports and those are the type of questions every player gets after loses.
What do you want reporters to do hold hands with the players and have a moment of silence ?

The problem isnt with the questions asked by the reporter the problem is with the player's ego. The player believes he is a celebrity and deserves to be lauded.

[CuseJetsFan83]

you know i agree and disagree........ it is a game that professionals play........ some could be overpaid, but then again, if anyone could be a pro football player, well..... why aren't ya already.

football isn't a religion, unless ur in texas......... to me its not a religion, but its more than a game........ im not gonna say its got a stranglehold on my life, there is more to it than that, but it defintely has top billing.

nothing wrong with having faith, or believing in a lil divine intervention.
conversely, if you share beliefs against a higher power....... well do you consider it to be luck/skill/unknown answer?

the comment about the team not caring, and all that...... you know damn well that they do, but they have to act calm cool and collected, or else, they will be soft........... you know what though, im sure they dont care about people who razz them, they dont need to prove anything for them...... only for the loyal fans/coaches who have let them play

bandwagon fans grind my gears because just like with fashion, and anything else in society....... if its good, its in........... where were the widespread patriots fans during the 1-15 years........... exactly..... winning = fans, which dont get me wrong, i like being supported by others, but i really hope they actually are fans, rather than something that is the in thing...... (ie. liking the yanks because derek jeter is so damn cute)

but in the long run, just like the players, who cares what who thinks...... if you think of yourself as a fan, you dont have anything to prove......... hell, i go to the ralph wearing enemy colors...... and all i could do was smile, im not gonna try and start fights, im not gonna backdown...... sure as hell am not gonna spill beer on opponents fans. thats blasphemy in its own right!

if i wasnt a jets fan, i'd probably be a bills fan.... so trust me, i do have similar feelings as you guys........... but don't worry, brighter days are ahead...... and it begins this weekend......... this weekend is a gauge of the future......... knock the patsies off......... and your one step closer to helping us unseat the patriots!

[CuseJetsFan83]

Over on your side of the pond, you don't even suffer the dread 'relegation' where upon if you your play is so poor, they don't even let you play in the top league.

True fans are those supporters who support their team through thick and thin.

You guys at the Bills should feel lucky. How long has it been since the Bills made it to the post season? 5-6 years.

When it becomes 10-15 years then so of the bile might be warranted. How long did the Bucs, Bengals and Browns have to wait? Hell, the Browns even lost their team at one point.

A lot of this constant stream of bile and negativity is mentally creating a situation suggesting that it is worse than it probably is.

Is beating up on yourselves an American trait?

you know whats sad, is if the NFL could get a legitimate system going.... i would love to see relegations........ if your team sucks that bad..... go down a division and prove urself.......... if that doesn't light a fire to the proverbial ass, i dunno what does.........

i was looking at standings recently....... there was a team i used to see play man utd on tv named nottingham forest...... last i checked they are in english league 1.... which is like 2 divisions below....... think of NFL....... and then being forced to play in the AFL or CFL depending on what you consider to be lower of the two

[The_Philster]

Quote:
<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=3 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD class=alt2 style="BORDER-RIGHT: 1px inset; BORDER-TOP: 1px inset; BORDER-LEFT: 1px inset; BORDER-BOTTOM: 1px inset">He is here to succeed for the sole purpose of making money. Nothing more.


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<!-- END TEMPLATE: bbcode_quote -->And they won't be giving a dime of it to you so stop worrying about it.
All Bills fans worry about the Bills winning and going deep into the playoffs :rolleyes:

[kernowboy]

I think all teams eventually have to have rebuilds.

Unfortunately I think after we got rid of Phillips, which was a poor call from Ralph, our rebuild just went down the wrong road. It has set us back 5 years.

Can't do anything about that so I want to look forward and I am tired of all these negative threads.

Very few posters seem to have a reasoned argument when demanding change and some of the suggestions are laughable.

We need to consider the cap, the cost of resigning players and judging whether its worth it and if they still fit .... Fletcher-Baker for one.

We have to think which Players may want to play in Buffalo. I have always had doubts about sun belt FAs

We need to do what the Pats do. Decide on a system and sign players that fit that system. Do not do a Donahue and sign a marque fan appeasing name because they are a name rather than fit our system. How many Denver OL would be successful elsewhere? But if Denver they are excellent.

We need to consider if we are having a mock draft what our needs might be, what the best player is in each position and most importantly, what is the drop off to the next ranked player. I would be happy with the 3rd ranked at his position if he is quite close to the 1st ranked. I do not want this to happen if he is 3 rounds below.

[The_Philster]

Unfortunately I think after we got rid of Phillips, Blame Wade for that...unless you think insubordination is acceptable

[kernowboy]

Wasn't he standing up for his ST guy after the Titans game? I'm not sure the owner should demand the sacking of a coordinator, that should be the call of the Head Coach

[The_Philster]

Wasn't he standing up for his ST guy after the Titans game? I'm not sure the owner should demand the sacking of a coordinator, that should be the call of the Head Coach
No...DeHaven was already gone. Wade was fired a year later, for refusing to fire the worst special teams coach in history...Ronnie Jones. And as President of the team, Ralph had every right to demand the termination of an incompetent employee

[jmb1099]

This thread started out well enough...
I am a fan. I have no problem being realistic or critical, but I am a fan nonetheless. I can't help but love the Bills. I used to sit with my father and watch him cheer, piss and moan, and have a good and or bad time during the games. Its in my blood and to support another team is unthinkable to me. That doesn't mean I don't see problems or short commings because I do and it irritates me because someday I want to go to work like a total nerd wearing my Bills Superbowl winner t-shirt, hat, socks, even boxer shorts. So I am irritated when we lose and am irritated when we make poor management decisions.
I also get irritated when some tunnel visioned fans (and I believe them to be fans) look to try to find a narrow viewed solution to a larger problem. In fact one poster came right out and said that he refused to believe the oline was as bad as some percieved it. But it isn't just Bills fans that are saying the lines are terrible, many in the media are saying this also. But some here are so impatient (and not without reason) that they want to believe the problem is just the qb, nothing could be further from the truth.
As many in the media have pointed out, our line not only pass blocks poorly, but also run blocks poorly. Some of you guys have said well Losman should grab Gandy's face mask and threaten to blah blah blah. Look, Gandy is what he is. He's not trying to play poorly he has a family to feed too. He's playing the way he is because that's the way he plays. He is in possibly the most single key position on the offense and he's playing poorly and in turn messes up the entire offensive flow. It effects everything. Its easier to blame Losman because he's the guy holding the ball, he's the one the camera is aimed at, but the problem is the line.
Now I know there are going to be posts that disagree with these statements and that is fine. It doesn't make anyone less a fan than me. So be a fan, be critical, but be objective, and if you're claiming to be a realist than for the love of everything holy be realistic, putting the blame for everything on Losman's shoulders is not.
Go Bills