2007 Free Agents

[Lee-83]

QB- Schaub, Sims
O-Line- Starks, Davis
WR- Bennett, Curtis, Wilford
TE- Graham, Stevens, Brady
LB- Briggs, June, Morris, Thomas
D-Line- Freeney, Allen
DB- Samuel, Harper, Lewis, Hamlin

who would you like to see in a bills uni?

my picks would be samuel, harper, briggs, starks, and if theres any way freeney!

[HHURRICANE]

QB- Schaub, Sims
O-Line- Starks, Davis
WR- Bennett, Curtis, Wilford
TE- Graham, Stevens, Brady
LB- Briggs, June, Morris, Thomas
D-Line- Freeney, Allen
DB- Samuel, Harper, Lewis, Hamlin

who would you like to see in a bills uni?

my picks would be samuel, harper, briggs, starks, and if theres any way freeney!


If there is any way to get Schaub, which I highly doubt, we have to sign him. Living in Atlanta and having the chance to watch him play I guarantee wherever he goes he will be a winner. I would bet money on it. I'd bet my house on it!! If he really is available, and JP struggles down the stretch, the Bills have to sign him!!!!!!!!!!!

[don137]

If Losman does not improve they need to make a run at Schaub. Freeney is a beast but he has been injury prone the last couple years.

[bigbub2352]

i wanted to draft Schaub, if Losman busts the rest of the season, Man would i like to see him in a Bills uniform, also Briggs and Davis for the Oline, but Davis is gettin up there and we will see how our T shift works, then pay for a good TE, like Graham

[Kerr]

I like drew bennet as a #2 or curtis who was under fairchild last year might make a good #2.

[Inetpub]

Schaub is underated. Only because the guy in front of him in line is Vick. Otherwise he would be a good decent starter.

[THATHURMANATOR]

Schaub would be a RFA mind you.

[Saratoga Slim]

Curtis would give us more of what we have at WR. small and fast.

with the way that Vick has been playing, I imagine that the talk of schaub replacing him in atlanta will die down a little. thus maybe even if Schaub is a RFA Atlanta will be less inclined to spend a lot of $$ on resigning him. Remember how much they're already shelling out to Vick at the QB position.

I'm not giving up on JP yet, but if it looks like we need to do so at the end of the season, Schaub would sure be an attractive option. That would be a lot more enticing than drafting a rookie and waiting 2-3 years for him to develop.

[THATHURMANATOR]

Curtis would give us more of what we have at WR. small and fast.

with the way that Vick has been playing, I imagine that the talk of schaub replacing him in atlanta will die down a little. thus maybe even if Schaub is a RFA Atlanta will be less inclined to spend a lot of $$ on resigning him. Remember how much they're already shelling out to Vick at the QB position.

I'm not giving up on JP yet, but if it looks like we need to do so at the end of the season, Schaub would sure be an attractive option. That would be a lot more enticing than drafting a rookie and waiting 2-3 years for him to develop.
If JP can't cut it then Schaub would be my #1 alternative to replace him.

[PcA125]

If JP can't cut it then Schaub would be my #1 alternative to replace him.

I feel the same way

[kernowboy]

You've missed some players .... Eric Steinbach at LG

My choices:

At QB, Schaub is unproven and is restricted so will cost draft picks. I would go for Ramsey. He's got a passer rating of 75.0, has played behind a porous O Line, takes his hits and gets up and will be an UFA. He hangs onto the ball too much and takes too many sacks, but has started a number of games. Been unlucky at injuries ... at Redskins he beat out Brunell then got injured in his first game suffering a neck injury. He'd push Losman far more than Nall and Holcomb and we get better as a result.

Davis is massively over-rated, Starks is too immobile and doesn't really upgrade us. Steinbach will cost but will be a huge upgrade in the interior. We'll probably use the draft here.

At WR, Wilford. He's restricted but may get released as the Jags have big WRs and need more speed. He won't be happy being 4th. He's 6ft4, 223lbs, catches and blocks okay.

We so need a good TE. Gonzalez is unlikely, Stevens unreliable. Making a run for Graham would have considerable merit.

Briggs will be hugely expensive to sign and you wonder how good he looks by playing with Urlacher, June has off field problems and I think Morris at 31 has a few more miles in the tank and could be interesting.

Freeney and Allen are ends. Freeney will be hugely expensive if he's not franchised. I think the money will more likely be spent if a DT becomes available.

Samuel will likely be franchised if he doesn't sign. I doubt we'd sign a starting S but Terrence Holt is a FS who could easily back up Simpson. Again I don't think the corners are that good. However I think, Mike Rumph, and Andre Woolfork are becoming available and are still young enough to turn their careers around. If Will Peterson does ok with the Eagles, he'll be free as well.

Considering free agents currently available including Mike Pearson (LT), Ahmed Plummer (CB) and Jeff Mitchell (C), I'd go for

Patrick Ramsay QB
Ernest Wilford WR
Rob Morris MLB
Terence Holt FS
Dan Graham TE
Mike Rumph CB or Andre Woolfork CB

but would also check out Pearson, Mitchell and Plummer, all still potential decent starters.

[HHURRICANE]

At QB, Schaub is unproven and is restricted so will cost draft picks. I would go for Ramsey. He's got a passer rating of 75.0, has played behind a porous O Line, takes his hits and gets up and will be an UFA. He hangs onto the ball too much and takes too many sacks, but has started a number of games. Been unlucky at injuries ... at Redskins he beat out Brunell then got injured in his first game suffering a neck injury. He'd push Losman far more than Nall and Holcomb and we get better as a result.

Are you kidding? Just what we need a proven loser. I'll stick with JP if that's the alternative. Schaub would be an instant starter and quite frankly is already looking way better than JP. Sorry.

[kernowboy]

Are you kidding? Just what we need a proven loser. I'll stick with JP if that's the alternative. Schaub would be an instant starter and quite frankly is already looking way better than JP. Sorry.

Schaub has played so little, I am not sure how we can see he'll be an upgrade let alone an instant starter.

Again, I am not prepared to quit on a player simply because he played for a useless team. I find it amazing we disregard options based on other teams ability to utilise these players.

In Ramsey's first season, the Redskins made FIVE qb changes. When he finally had a run he won 50% of the end of season games and got them close in the another one. As a rookie

In his second season, he won 4 of 11 games he started. He was knocked out in the 11th game. In 4 others, the margin was a touchdown or less.

It was well known that Ramsey had an OL as bad as ours, no running game as Davis was injured most of the time, and no receivers of the calibre of Evans. Also he had a college Head Coach trying to be a Pro Head Coach.

Under Gibbs in 2004, Ramsey outperformed Brunell, yet was yanked in and out of the line up. Gibbs went with his QB, Brunell, initially. Eventually he turned to Ramsey who won 3 of the 7 games he started and got the Redskins within a touchdown in 3 others

Yet despite a good performance, Gibbs then drafts Campbell. Ramsey beats out both Brunell and Campbell to start, but get injured in his first game. The Skins went on to have a 10-6 season as the rest of the team came good and as Campbell was regarded as a QB of the future, because Ramsey was picked by the old regime, he was moved on.

He as a TD-Int ratio of 34-29

His passer rating is 75.0. He is sacked about 3 times every game he starts and fumbles once, though he does recover about 50% of these.

He has actually started 24 games. In these games the Redskins have won 10, and lost 8 by less than a touchdown, with 6 others being heavier.

He has however gotten better the longer he has been in the team

Having been messed around at the Redskins where even Peyton Manning would have struggled to have been a success, exactly how is he a proven loser? Our loss will be someone elses gain.

What has Schaub achieved so far?

[Mr. Cynical]

We need an entirely new OL. However we can make that happen, has to happen.

[X-Era]

QB- Schaub, Sims
O-Line- Starks, Davis
WR- Bennett, Curtis, Wilford
TE- Graham, Stevens, Brady
LB- Briggs, June, Morris, Thomas
D-Line- Freeney, Allen
DB- Samuel, Harper, Lewis, Hamlin

who would you like to see in a bills uni?

my picks would be samuel, harper, briggs, starks, and if theres any way freeney!

Steinbach, Freeney, Corey Simon, Holliday, Graham, Eric Johnson

Choose 3. 4 would be stellar.

[X-Era]

You've missed some players .... Eric Steinbach at LG

My choices:

At QB, Schaub is unproven and is restricted so will cost draft picks. I would go for Ramsey. He's got a passer rating of 75.0, has played behind a porous O Line, takes his hits and gets up and will be an UFA. He hangs onto the ball too much and takes too many sacks, but has started a number of games. Been unlucky at injuries ... at Redskins he beat out Brunell then got injured in his first game suffering a neck injury. He'd push Losman far more than Nall and Holcomb and we get better as a result.

Davis is massively over-rated, Starks is too immobile and doesn't really upgrade us. Steinbach will cost but will be a huge upgrade in the interior. We'll probably use the draft here.

At WR, Wilford. He's restricted but may get released as the Jags have big WRs and need more speed. He won't be happy being 4th. He's 6ft4, 223lbs, catches and blocks okay.

We so need a good TE. Gonzalez is unlikely, Stevens unreliable. Making a run for Graham would have considerable merit.

Briggs will be hugely expensive to sign and you wonder how good he looks by playing with Urlacher, June has off field problems and I think Morris at 31 has a few more miles in the tank and could be interesting.

Freeney and Allen are ends. Freeney will be hugely expensive if he's not franchised. I think the money will more likely be spent if a DT becomes available.

Samuel will likely be franchised if he doesn't sign. I doubt we'd sign a starting S but Terrence Holt is a FS who could easily back up Simpson. Again I don't think the corners are that good. However I think, Mike Rumph, and Andre Woolfork are becoming available and are still young enough to turn their careers around. If Will Peterson does ok with the Eagles, he'll be free as well.

Considering free agents currently available including Mike Pearson (LT), Ahmed Plummer (CB) and Jeff Mitchell (C), I'd go for

Patrick Ramsay QB
Ernest Wilford WR
Rob Morris MLB
Terence Holt FS
Dan Graham TE
Mike Rumph CB or Andre Woolfork CB

but would also check out Pearson, Mitchell and Plummer, all still potential decent starters.

To be honest, your list would be another very questionable offseason. That list WONT make us better, we will be the same.

Graham is the only guy at the list at the bottom thats an upgrade IMO. Cheapo route = more torture.

[kernowboy]

Steinbach, Freeney, Corey Simon, Holliday, Graham, Eric Johnson

Choose 3. 4 would be stellar.

Corey Simon is a medical with arthritis
Holliday ... end of career
Johnson .. can't stay fit
Graham > good signing
Steinbach > v.good signing but v.expensive and likely tagged
Freeney > as above but also plays in one of our positions of strength, RE

[PECKERWOOD]

I have a honest question for you guys that want Schaub. Why? What makes you guys think he would make a good franchise type QB?

[raphael120]

I have a honest question for you guys that want Schaub. Why? What makes you guys think he would make a good franchise type QB?

I think the only good reason would be that it's a little bit better than an unproven drafted rookie in the NFL. If JP continues to blow ace, next year we are going to either draft an unproven FA, do something to get a proven vet (not happening), or draft a 1rst round QB. Now personally, if we have a really bad record, the only other bad teams we will have to compete with rookie QB's is Detroit and Oakland. If we somehow suck worse than them (hope not) i dont know about drafting another 4th left on the list QB like JP was. If we dont have one of the top 10 picks again, if we dont have one of the top 2 QB's fall in our laps in the draft, picking Schaub would be good. On the other hand, what makes Nall worse than Schaub, really?

[PECKERWOOD]

Yah, my thoughts on that is, if JP continues to blow, we will definately be picking atleast around 5'ish. I think we have a legitimate shot at getting Quinn, and I would rather have him over Schaub in all honesty. With that said, there is some speculation that Troy Smith may last into the second round, if that is the case the Bills should pounce on it.

[BidsJr]

He as a TD-Int ratio of 34-29

His passer rating is 75.0. He is sacked about 3 times every game he starts and fumbles once, though he does recover about 50% of these.

He has actually started 24 games. In these games the Redskins have won 10, and lost 8 by less than a touchdown, with 6 others being heavier.

He has however gotten better the longer he has been in the team

Having been messed around at the Redskins where even Peyton Manning would have struggled to have been a success, exactly how is he a proven loser? Our loss will be someone elses gain.

What has Schaub achieved so far?

SO Ramsey is a poor man's Blew Dreadsoe?

Sorry no more Frankendrew for me thanks.

[ScottLawrence]

YEY, Lets blow up the team because JP sucks.

We need a Quarterback, Guard, Nose Tackle, Speed Rushing end, and most likely cornerback.

People saying "we need an entirely new O-Line" don't watch the ****ing games.

Peters, and Fowler have been very good, with Villarrial being solid.

[PECKERWOOD]

We're going to be $20m under the cap next offseason. We better resign Nate.

[Albany,n.y.]

What has Schaub done any better than Doug Johnson when he was Vick's backup?

[Mahdi]

YEY, Lets blow up the team because JP sucks.

We need a Quarterback, Guard, Nose Tackle, Speed Rushing end, and most likely cornerback.

People saying "we need an entirely new O-Line" don't watch the ****ing games.

Peters, and Fowler have been very good, with Villarrial being solid.
Villarial solid??? Villarial hasnt even been good in run blocking which was his strength. I never seem him maul anyone, and he NEVER gets to the second level with any urgency. He's done, and I hope Reyes or Merz take over for him.

[Marvelous]

Schaub---

Didn't Rob Johnson look awesome when he came in for Brunell in Jacksonville.:bandwagon

We need so many different things.

[Bling]

I remember 2006 Free Agency... The Bills had big plans. Wasn't Royals the highlight of the offseason? What makes you think you're even considering decent talent?

[jaycorp51]

The Bills should NOT draft Brady Quinn. I think this year has proven that he is slightly overrated. His biggest bonus is that he is coached by Charlie Weiss. I'm just really sick of seeing the JP bashing. Granted, he hasn't played great or even good over the last three games....but how much of the team has? He has faced two of the best defenses in the league. They have made much better qb's than JP look ridiculous. My biggest concern is the O-Line. If Steinbach is out there....get him. Instant upgrade. Draft a top tier tackle (depending on how Peters works out at LT) or guard. That would make for a good start to an improved line for years. Next we need a DT and a LB. I would look to the draft for a LB like Paul Poluszny or Patrick Willis. DT...not to sure who may be available, but if Corey Simon can prove he is healthy I would take a crack at him. CB's....well if Asante Samuel isn't franchised or doesn't command a ton of money (likely to) I wouldn't mind him. I'm still waiting to see the prospect of Youboty out there. Hopefully he gets a crack in Nickel and Dime situations this year sometime.

[Goobylal]

Schaub's career completion percentage is 49.3% and his QB rating is 68.8. He's not worth it even as an UFA. Although I'd take Crumpler in a heartbeat.

And unless Steinbach can play center, I wouldn't spend all that cash on him. I think that a great center is what the Bills have lacked since the SB years, and that THIS is the reason why the O-line is never any good (along with LT, but hopefully that's been solved).

[patmoran2006]

While I like the spirit of this thread.. I doubt we will put up the money for any of the big-name FA's (Steinbach, Freeney, Briggs, etc)

[X-Era]

While I like the spirit of this thread.. I doubt we will put up the money for any of the big-name FA's (Steinbach, Freeney, Briggs, etc)

Good (in your mind), because the Bills will always suck then regardless of whos the QB!

[ParanoidAndroid]

I remember 2006 Free Agency... The Bills had big plans. Wasn't Royals the highlight of the offseason? What makes you think you're even considering decent talent?

How's that big Culpepper signing working out for you? I'd shut my trap if I were you.

[Goobylal]

How's that big Culpepper signing working out for you? I'd shut my trap if I were you.
LOL! Not to mention LJ Shelton.

[Goobylal]

While I like the spirit of this thread.. I doubt we will put up the money for any of the big-name FA's (Steinbach, Freeney, Briggs, etc)
Yep, because the Bills have NEVER spent money on big-name FA's. :rolleyes:

[Marvelous]

It's crystal clear that we struggle to get the high profile FA's.. Spikes was a rareity.

Sucks for us because the Phins can usualy piss away their draft. We need the draft..

Pats right though, odds are we'll not break the bank based strictly on our recent history.. One can hope though. Briggs would be excellent. O-line! we need two on day 1 no matter what. And a guard would be nice in FA. Not the Bennie anderso,/Reves type either.

[ParanoidAndroid]

Steinbach. This O-line needs a mauler.
2007 is the "on" year for QB's, so I say draft one if JP doesn't improve. It might be worth looking at taking a run at Schaub and drafting someone like Drew Stanton late on day 1 (who, by the way, broke Reich's record for biggest NCAA comeback). Schaub appears to be a very capable QB but he really hasn't played enough to say for sure. It would be a gamble, but a fairly favorable one.
Graham would be a very nice signing, but a difficult one to make.
Freeney is untouchable for us, I believe. Indy would be foolish not to franchise him or re-sign him. There are good DE's in this draft. I say round 1 go DE.
There are many good athletes in this draft at LB. P-Willie tops the list, but he will go in round 1 as well. It might be worth taking a chance on Anthony Waters on day 2 but this would be in addition to a day one selection. Waters tore his ACL but his prognosis is good. He is one of those emotional Darryl Talley types who just never quit. Quincy Black would be a great fit at OLB in the Tampa-2.

[patmoran2006]

Good (in your mind), because the Bills will always suck then regardless of whos the QB!

That's not true.

I dont think the Bills suck.. I think the Bills are on their way up.

Their just not on their way up with that ****ing joke Losman is my ONLY beef with the Bills, and I DO MEAN only beef.

And as for Schaub, and his ****ty stats and "what has he ever done" blahblahblah.. He must be PRETTY GOOD for ATlanta to say NO straight-up for a Pro Bowl DE in John ABraham.

That being said, I dont want Schaub anyway..It will cost too much to get him.. I will give Losman til week 12 (which shutup, I know he'll get the year- I'd go with Nall last four).. But if we have to get rid of Losman, that means record sucked, and I'll take Smith or Quinn in the draft.

[BADTHINGSMAN]

Shaub,Starks and Graham would be nice..

Freeney will go back to Indy..

[Goobylal]

And as for Schaub, and his ****ty stats and "what has he ever done" blahblahblah.. He must be PRETTY GOOD for ATlanta to say NO straight-up for a Pro Bowl DE in John ABraham.
Yeah, good thing they made the right choice and traded a 1st rounder away for a guy who has played in just 2 of their 7 games so far.

That being said, I dont want Schaub anyway..It will cost too much to get him.. I will give Losman til week 12 (which shutup, I know he'll get the year- I'd go with Nall last four).. But if we have to get rid of Losman, that means record sucked, and I'll take Smith or Quinn in the draft.
I think JP gets until game 12 and if he doesn't improve, gets yanked for Nall. If that happens, the Bills will end up picking in the top-5 next year anyway.

[Mahdi]

Steinbach. This O-line needs a mauler.
2007 is the "on" year for QB's, so I say draft one if JP doesn't improve. It might be worth looking at taking a run at Schaub and drafting someone like Drew Stanton late on day 1 (who, by the way, broke Reich's record for biggest NCAA comeback). Schaub appears to be a very capable QB but he really hasn't played enough to say for sure. It would be a gamble, but a fairly favorable one.
Graham would be a very nice signing, but a difficult one to make.
Freeney is untouchable for us, I believe. Indy would be foolish not to franchise him or re-sign him. There are good DE's in this draft. I say round 1 go DE.
There are many good athletes in this draft at LB. P-Willie tops the list, but he will go in round 1 as well. It might be worth taking a chance on Anthony Waters on day 2 but this would be in addition to a day one selection. Waters tore his ACL but his prognosis is good. He is one of those emotional Darryl Talley types who just never quit. Quincy Black would be a great fit at OLB in the Tampa-2.
Will Indy even have enough cap room to sign Freeney? They already pay a lot of money to the rest of their D-line. I think we could go after Robert Mathis as well, he is restricted but if they sign Freeney they wont be able to match an offer made by another team. This is why we need to let Clements walk, so we can actually afford to go after FAs aggressively.

[kernowboy]

We're going to be $20m under the cap next offseason. We better resign Nate.

to continue to offer his substandard level of play?

[kernowboy]

My problem with Schaub is he will NOT be free unless the Falcons release him. Considering that Marv hasn't lost his talent in the draft, the minimum 3rd round pick we give up could be costly. I would only consider a Day2 pick for an RFA and only for one who has shown some production like Ernest Wilford WR who could fit our need for a big No2WR and has often stepped ahead of Matt Jones and Reggie Williams. I do however think we need a QB in FA to push Losman harder. Nall is only ever a backup who after 5 seasons has shown no starting ability. For his money Patrick Ramsey is available, who has started, has a bigger arm, has a decent passer pct in real game time, not garbage time at the end of the year. We could go Losman, Ramsey and a 3rd stringer we can develop and see what he does.

Samuel or Graham will be franchised by the Patriots and considering their depth at TE, I think Dan Graham will be made available. He will definitely be an upgrade, and as Shelton is increasingly becoming a waste of space on the field we could go with a 2 TE set.

Freeney cost will be huge and the Colts will make sure he will cost at least 2 No1s. Steinbach might be easier to sign. If he is given the transition I think we need to give up a R2, and considering the quality of OGs in the draft might be an option though again, I think we need to keep all our Day1 picks.

Starks is a big immobile lump who can only play RT. I would rather see how Pennington and Butler do there first and would even prefer to move Peters back and draft an LT before wasting money on Starks.

Overall this season, the draft picks have put in respectable and promising performance. I would like to see us manoever to get more picks as Levy still has an eye for college talent.

The problem with Free Agency is for every success there seems to be a colossal bust. I am not interested in the team signing one season wonders and would rather the team try to use the extra cap space to completely tie up our players who want to stay like Evans. Whether Clements and McGahee fall in this catergory is doubtful.

We should save the money to go after maybe a decent DT with a proven starting track record, maybe a really nasty LE, and any possible talent that might emerge at LB if they become available. Just because we are well under the cap doesn't mean we spend it all this offseason, as it may then restrict our abilities to sign a real blue chip player in the 2008 offseason.

[Tinboy]

Steinbach from the Bengals would be perfect next to Peter on the left side. But won't Bengals keep him you say? Considering both Jones and Anderson got good money for contract extensions and that Bengals drafted Andrew Whitworth I think not.

If we get him we are going to have a very good leftside on the o-line.

As for a WR we need a BIG recevier how can make those red zone catches when we are 3rd and goal at the 10-5 yard line.

[Lee-83]

i'll take curtis over davis and aiken

[PECKERWOOD]

I remember 2006 Free Agency... The Bills had big plans. Wasn't Royals the highlight of the offseason? What makes you think you're even considering decent talent?
I thought the same thing when Miami hired Mularkey.

[PECKERWOOD]

to continue to offer his substandard level of play?
Kernowboy, you know just as well as me sir, they barely throw Clements way. They dont throw his way for a reason! If anything McGee has been the one getting exploited. Clements is a stud, and we need to sign him long term. If we dont resign Clements, we are going to have to sign a CB who isnt as good, or we will have to draft a CB. And I am not very satisfied with either options to be frank.

[alohabillsfan]

Kernowboy, you know just as well as me sir, they barely throw Clements way. They dont throw his way for a reason! If anything McGee has been the one getting exploited. Clements is a stud, and we need to sign him long term. If we dont resign Clements, we are going to have to sign a CB who isnt as good, or we will have to draft a CB. And I am not very satisfied with either options to be frank.


I have to agree, Re-sign Clements (5% chance of happening)
Sign Briggs
Sign Stienbach
Sign June
Sign D. Bennett

RD1 DT M. Thomas UF
RD2 OT M. Otto Purdue
RD3 CB J. Wade Tenn
RD4 RB L. Booker FSU The next Thurman Thomas
RD6 DE J Moss UF If he comes out RS JR
RD7 TE J. Carter Texas College

[Bling]

How's that big Culpepper signing working out for you? I'd shut my trap if I were you.

Signing? Someone that follows football knows it was a trade.. they also know the Bills are a ****ty franchise. We actually make efforts to improve our franchise. Miami, no matter how bad, is only 1 win behind the Bills. :snicker: When was the last time you made the playoffs? :snicker: When was the last time you had a winning season? I'm pretty sure the Dolphins was last year... you were 2 years ago?

[PECKERWOOD]

Signing? Someone that follows football knows it was a trade.. they also know the Bills are a ****ty franchise. We actually make efforts to improve our franchise. Miami, no matter how bad, is only 1 win behind the Bills. :snicker: When was the last time you made the playoffs? :snicker: When was the last time you had a winning season? I'm pretty sure the Dolphins was last year... you were 2 years ago?

Kelly vs. Marino, thats all I have to say. Shut it.

[Mr. Cynical]

Signing? Someone that follows football knows it was a trade.. they also know the Bills are a ****ty franchise. We actually make efforts to improve our franchise. Miami, no matter how bad, is only 1 win behind the Bills. :snicker: When was the last time you made the playoffs? :snicker: When was the last time you had a winning season? I'm pretty sure the Dolphins was last year... you were 2 years ago?

When was the last time you went to the Super Bowl? Oh that's right....

22 YEARS AGO.

[Mr. Cynical]

And before you shoot back about the last time the Bills won a SB, let me remind you when the Fish won their last Super Bowl.

33 YEARS AGO.

[ParanoidAndroid]

Steinbach from the Bengals would be perfect next to Peter on the left side. But won't Bengals keep him you say? Considering both Jones and Anderson got good money for contract extensions and that Bengals drafted Andrew Whitworth I think not.

If we get him we are going to have a very good leftside on the o-line.

As for a WR we need a BIG recevier how can make those red zone catches when we are 3rd and goal at the 10-5 yard line.

Wilford?

[YardRat]

Steinbach's going to command big bucks and I don't see Buffalo shelling out for a guard.

Any FA's will follow the precedent of '06...mid-level guys that may contribute or may not. Younger guys that have more 'potential' than 'name-value'. Any studs we acquire, we're going to get through the draft.

[Goobylal]

Signing? Someone that follows football knows it was a trade.. they also know the Bills are a ****ty franchise. We actually make efforts to improve our franchise. Miami, no matter how bad, is only 1 win behind the Bills. :snicker: When was the last time you made the playoffs? :snicker: When was the last time you had a winning season? I'm pretty sure the Dolphins was last year... you were 2 years ago?
So trading a 2nd rounder for Culpepper and signing Harrington are "efforts to improve [y]our franchise?" Good one. Funny how a team coming off a 9-7 season can become THE worst team in the NFL over an off-season, with that expensive HC and all. And the Bills who were 5-11 last year and have a new GM and HC, are 1 win better.

[PECKERWOOD]

Pile on Bling!

[X-Era]

I have to agree, Re-sign Clements (5% chance of happening)
Sign Briggs
Sign Stienbach
Sign June
Sign D. Bennett

RD1 DT M. Thomas UF
RD2 OT M. Otto Purdue
RD3 CB J. Wade Tenn
RD4 RB L. Booker FSU The next Thurman Thomas
RD6 DE J Moss UF If he comes out RS JR
RD7 TE J. Carter Texas College

Thats ugly dude, sorry.

Briggs and June are OLB's and thats NOT the weakness on this team, ILB isnt either except that Fletch is likely gone. Unfortunately there isnt a good ILB in FA. But I think a guy like Buster Davis would be the next Fletch or even better in the Tampa 2 scheme. Ill pass on both those moves.

Steinbach? Absoultely, better get in line and bring a big check book. Hopefully we FINALLY step up and pay for the top guys.

Drew Bennet? I like him, but I think our high 1st rounder can do us even better and cost us less overall. I like guys like Calvin Johnson, we'd need to lose the rest of our games, Dwayne Jarrett, or Ted Ginn Jr. All have better potential than Bennett.

Round 2, Doug Free may drop to the top of the 2nd, or go after a pass rusher or CB if Clements is gone.

That draft doesnt excite me much to be honest.

[X-Era]

Steinbach's going to command big bucks and I don't see Buffalo shelling out for a guard.

Any FA's will follow the precedent of '06...mid-level guys that may contribute or may not. Younger guys that have more 'potential' than 'name-value'. Any studs we acquire, we're going to get through the draft.

Hmmm, great so you have Pat's overall opinion that we are screwed. Well thats up lifting considering you can usually land one maybe 2 decent starters out of the draft, at least early in their career.

Im holding out for us finally spending big money and getting the good guys. If not, it will show me that we arent committed to winning.

[Mr. Cynical]

Im holding out for us finally spending big money and getting the good guys. If not, it will show me that we arent committed to winning.

Just curious - why do you think next year will finally be any different that this or any past year?

[X-Era]

Just curious - why do you think next year will finally be any different that this or any past year?

I dont. But I also wont concede to having another second tier FA either.

We need MUCH MUCH more, and if we dont go out and get it, its proof that we dont have the balls to do what it takes to win.

[Mr. Cynical]

I dont. But I also wont concede to having another second tier FA either.

We need MUCH MUCH more, and if we dont go out and get it, its proof that we dont have the balls to do what it takes to win.

Thing is, I don't know if it's about "balls". All kidding/jabbing/etc aside for a moment...seriously...I think it is more about Ralph just not knowing what it takes to build a good FO in this day and age.

I really feel like he's not able to move into the new era. He had a great vision when he helped build the AFC and build up the team over the years. But now I think the game has passed him by.

As such I don't think it's about balls. I think it's about a new perspective that's needed at the top. JMO.

[Gunzlingr]

I can't believe anybody would want Ramsey. He has been a back up on 2 teams now, and what is he 3rd QB in NY? Not thanks.

[bflojohn]

Another thought on the weighty QB issue.... IF J.P. struggles in the second half, why not bring Brohm or Quinn in to push him in a very meaningful way? This actually worked in San Diego, where Drew Brees was percieved as a QB who couldn't get it done, and they opted to select Eli Manning to "dangle as trade bait" for Phillip Rivers. The only thing I'd do differently than the Bolts is trade away the odds-on #2 QB in this derby when the time is right! The Packers made a living out of trading QB's they developed in the 90's, such as Brunell, Brooks, and Hasselback. they even had Kurt Warner in camp one year!! Ron Wolf worked this to perfection and it isn't a bad philosophy!!

[kernowboy]

I have to agree, Re-sign Clements (5% chance of happening)
Sign Briggs
Sign Stienbach
Sign June
Sign D. Bennett

RD1 DT M. Thomas UF
RD2 OT M. Otto Purdue
RD3 CB J. Wade Tenn
RD4 RB L. Booker FSU The next Thurman Thomas
RD6 DE J Moss UF If he comes out RS JR
RD7 TE J. Carter Texas College

I'm a little concerned that Briggs is a product of playing next to Urlacher, plus it is very likely that he will get locked up.

I do think Steinbach will be available but I also think that he will be hugely pursued and I think people will end up paying hin $6m a season. I don't think we'll go that high.

June has off field problems and I am not certain that he offers more than Kevin Ellison - both of similar size, both 6th rounders.

Bennett would be a good signing but I'd prefer Wilford as he is faster.

I would try to sign Daniel Graham as I think the Patriots will try to franchise Samuel and this means we need to make a big go for Graham. With Shelton past it moving to the 2xTE set would be useful.

Regarding the draft we can trade down for Thomas, plus he's not that big. Otto's a good choice but I think we'd get him in the 3rd.

I would go.

R1. Trade down for Posluzny Penn St MLB/OLB - a leader
R2. Doug Free LT, Northern Illinois
R2. (extra pick) Drew Stanton QB, Michigan State - plays hurt and a leader
R3. Justin Harrrell DT, Tennessee - bigger and plays hurt
R4. Eric Weddle CB/S, Utah - provides depth in the DB, shut down Johnson
R6. Clark Harris TE, Rutgers - not fast but big
R7. Clifton Dawson RB, Harvard - could be the next TT.

Regarding Clements he will demand something around the $8m per year mark. I'm sorry but his lack of performance over the last 2 seasons does not justify that. I'm not saying he cannot still be a good player but I am concerned that we might have seen the best of him. His play this year has not been stellar.

[Hamilton Billsfan]

Starks is a big immobile lump who can only play RT. I would rather see how Pennington and Butler do there first and would even prefer to move Peters back and draft an LT before wasting money on Starks.:nod:

[Dantheman1280]

Kernowboy, you know just as well as me sir, they barely throw Clements way. They dont throw his way for a reason! If anything McGee has been the one getting exploited. Clements is a stud, and we need to sign him long term. If we dont resign Clements, we are going to have to sign a CB who isnt as good, or we will have to draft a CB. And I am not very satisfied with either options to be frank.

News Flash: Clements who at one point was my favorite player on the team is highly overrated!! He plays 10 yards off the line consistantly and is a below average tackler at best. He is not worth big money, let someone else pay for his unwarented big name.