Time Before Being Sacked...

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  • Yasgur's Farm
    Moderator
    • Feb 2005
    • 7091

    Time Before Being Sacked...

    To back up my claims of stopwatch times of 2, 2, 3, 3, 4 on the 5 sacks...

    Here's what Tiger Hoods had to say at bb.com

    http://boards.buffalobills.com/forums/1/1361917/ShowThread.aspx

    First off, I want to thank the guy that uploaded the game at the website. http://timekills.org/WordPress/

    A lot of people claimed to be taking a stopwatch to the game, to which I'll say that it's a bunch of utter nonsense. Realistically, when you're watching your favorite team play in a must win game at home, the last thing that you're going to do is pull out a stopwatch amidst the whole game, especially when one can't predict when there's going to be a run and when there's going to be a pass. And let's be honest, no one is interested in J.P. Losman's development ot the point where their whole focal point of watching a football game is to monitor his time in the pocket.

    Nor do I believe that anyone Tivo'd the game to count his time in the pocket. Yet, everyone seems to be an expert as to how much time he had in the pocket. Some say he had litle time, others say he had plenty of time. We all can go based on what we saw and what we believe to be the time allowed in the pocket. But the only way to know for sure is to really run the clock.

    So, I did.

    Now, let me explain how I did it. I started the clock the moment the ball was snapped and ran it on several occasions. I stopped the clock the moment he was hit. I think many people stop the count when he's on the floor, but it's pointless if he's wrapped up already. I also marked whether it was shotgun and if it was from the shotgun, I started the clock when the ball arrived in his hands. Bear in mind, it takes a whole second to get from 0 to 1, but I also think people just count 1 upon the snap. Regardless, if you want to refute the point, that's fine. But I may be off by .1 or .2. My point is though, that a time of 2.5 and 2.7 isn't that ample a difference.

    Here's what I found

    1st Quarter
    2-9-BUF46(4:51) J.Losman sacked at BUF 35 for -11 yards (A.Kampman) 2.59 seconds (Sack 1)

    3-4-BUF47(1:08) (Shotgun) J.Losman sacked at BUF 39 for -8 yards (C.Williams) 3.07 seconds (Sack 2) It’s in this part where the commentator says, “That is the weakness of this Buffalo Bills team. The Offensive Line.”

    2nd Quarter
    3-6-GB45(9:26) (Shotgun) J.Losman scrambles up the middle to GB 41 for 4 yards (A.Hawk) Pocket collapsed at 2.67 seconds, so he scrambles, play ends at 4.55

    3-4-BUF17(3:17) (Shotgun) J.Losman pass incomplete deep left to L.Evans (A.Harris). Receiver and coverage along sideline at BUF 47. 2.51 seconds, was hit which caused the erratic throw.

    3rd Quarter

    1-10-BUF20(4:09) J.Losman sacked at BUF 10 for -10 yards (C.Jenkins, K.Gbaja-Biamila). Full sack credited to C.Jenkins, assist to K.Gbaja-Biamila. 3.14 seconds. (Sack 3) This was a 5 man blitz. Looked like a 6 man but one dropped back. I don't know if he can audible or not.

    3-25-BUF5(3:26) J.Losman sacked at BUF 3 for -2 yards (C.Williams). 4.09 seconds. (Sack 4) This is the one where the O-Line stood there looking around. This is also the same one where this is credited as a coverage sack. The coverage left no options so he had to eat it.

    At this point in the game, he has been Sacked 4 times, Hit 1, Hurried 5, and Blitzed 2 times. It's uncanny that all this is the result of a four man rush.

    No one can be expected to perform under these conditions, especially when they are under the proverbial training wheels and probably can't check off the coverage or when there's no one open.
  • Pride
    Registered User
    • Jul 2002
    • 10191

    #2
    Re: Time Before Being Sacked...

    Damn impressive work!

    Comment

    • Saratoga Slim
      Registered User
      • Jul 2005
      • 4154

      #3
      Re: Time Before Being Sacked...

      Oh please, if a QB can't read a defense, find an open receiver, and get an accurate pass off in 2.59 seconds, he doesn't deserve to be in the NFL. In 2.59 seconds Tom Brady could complete THREE passes and still have time to write a love note to Deion Branch. Stop blaming everything on the OL, JP is clearly the only weak link on offense.

      /sarcasm
      Last edited by Saratoga Slim; 11-07-2006, 02:37 PM.
      Wake up, brush your teeth, and get ready for a day of hating the Dolphins. Or the Pats? How to choose?

      Comment

      • xXSpIkes5IXx
        Registered User
        • Mar 2006
        • 247

        #4
        Re: Time Before Being Sacked...

        Nice Work! Now to make a comparison you should do one with Tom Brady or Peyton Manning!

        Comment

        • Elminster
          #1 Kelsay Fan
          • Oct 2006
          • 928

          #5
          Re: Time Before Being Sacked...

          Originally posted by Saratoga Slim
          Oh please, if a QB can't read a defense, find an open receiver, and get an accurate pass off in 2.59 seconds, he doesn't deserve to be in the NFL. In 2.59 seconds Tom Brady could complete THREE passes and still have time to write a love note to Deion Branch. Stop blaming everything on the OL, JP is clearly the only weak link on offense.
          A receiver actually has to get open before you can hit an open receiver...
          Good riddance Fairchild. Of course, the knowledge of your departure will only make TE more hateable than the typical Bills QB. Good luck, hope we don't mess you up like JP.

          Comment

          • Saratoga Slim
            Registered User
            • Jul 2005
            • 4154

            #6
            Re: Time Before Being Sacked...

            Originally posted by Elminster
            A receiver actually has to get open before you can hit an open receiver...
            Well yes, I agree. I was BEING SARCASTIC.
            Wake up, brush your teeth, and get ready for a day of hating the Dolphins. Or the Pats? How to choose?

            Comment

            • Inetpub
              i'm a tool
              • Aug 2006
              • 489

              #7
              Re: Time Before Being Sacked...

              Originally posted by Elminster
              A receiver actually has to get open before you can hit an open receiver...
              yes and when the receivers run the 40 in 4.4 seconds, 2.59 seconds he'll be down field 20 yards plus airtime on the ball, thats a 30 yard gain.

              By that time, ANY receiver should be open.
              That proves NOTHING about Losman

              Comment

              • Elminster
                #1 Kelsay Fan
                • Oct 2006
                • 928

                #8
                Re: Time Before Being Sacked...

                Originally posted by Saratoga Slim
                Well yes, I agree. I was BEING SARCASTIC.
                Sarcasm doesn't carry well over the internet when there're so many people who'd say that and mean it...
                Good riddance Fairchild. Of course, the knowledge of your departure will only make TE more hateable than the typical Bills QB. Good luck, hope we don't mess you up like JP.

                Comment

                • Mr. Miyagi
                  Lecter's Little *****

                  • Sep 2002
                  • 53616

                  #9
                  Re: Time Before Being Sacked...

                  Originally posted by Saratoga Slim
                  Oh please, if a QB can't read a defense, find an open receiver, and get an accurate pass off in 2.59 seconds, he doesn't deserve to be in the NFL. In 2.59 seconds Tom Brady could complete THREE passes and still have time to write a love note to Deion Branch. Stop blaming everything on the OL, JP is clearly the only weak link on offense.

                  /sarcasm
                  You're lucky for the /sarcasm line. I was just gonna neg you to hell.

                  Comment

                  • The_Philster
                    Registered User
                    • Jul 2002
                    • 52180

                    #10
                    Re: Time Before Being Sacked...

                    Excellent work
                    The Buffalo Pro Cheer Blog...Positive coverage of Buffalo's Pro Cheerleaders since 2001!

                    Comment

                    • Mudflap1
                      Next Question!
                      • Nov 2004
                      • 3281

                      #11
                      Re: Time Before Being Sacked...

                      The only thing I don't agree with is I think the stopwatch should start with a shotgun play at the snap, not when the ball is in Losman's hands. The point of the shotgun is to give the quarterback an extra advantage of seeing the defense standing back there with the ball being snapped to him.

                      That being said, I don't think anyone is suggesting that the offensive line is good or even average. The same thing some are saying for Losman ("you can't expect him to make a play in 2.59 seconds") can be said for the receivers, you can't expect them to get open in that short of a time either.

                      Watching the game Sunday without a stopwatch, I definitely thought that a lot of the pressure J.P. was under was not his fault (for holding onto the ball too long). However, he did have time on some pass plays, did make some bad throws, did not show leadership abilities, threw late at times, etc. The Bills did win though, and J.P., while it was underthrown, made a play in the 4th quarter and got the job done.

                      While there is merit with this thread and argument, Losman is still a far cry from being a difference-making asset, or even just an asset, on this team.

                      But he did get it done on Sunday. Never said it had to be pretty. I'll take it.

                      Jon

                      Comment

                      • Typ0
                        honey pie
                        • Jul 2002
                        • 32593

                        #12
                        Re: Time Before Being Sacked...

                        I do not have the game Tivod and even if I did I wouldnt spend the time to verify these statistics...but I also would not be surprised if they werent weighted towards the arguement hes trying to make. I was at a party and distinctly remember counting him holding the ball and getting to five. It takes a second to start and stop a timer almost.

                        But the end result is going to be the same anyway. Defenses have no respect for JP Losman. They just rush at him and dont worry about crap at the LOS because hes clueless. JP is going to have to take some initiative and make some things happen that are going to garner him some respect in the passing game or this is the way its going to be.

                        Comment

                        • Typ0
                          honey pie
                          • Jul 2002
                          • 32593

                          #13
                          Re: Time Before Being Sacked...

                          Im not saying the OLine is good either. Im saying JP stinks right now because JP stinks right now. Sure, he could get some help and that would work to cover up the fact that he stinks. But he still stinks.

                          Comment

                          • Michael82
                            Registered User
                            • Jul 2002
                            • 82328

                            #14
                            Re: Time Before Being Sacked...

                            Good work! It's about time someone states the facts with the amount of time he actually gets.

                            Comment

                            • Jan Reimers
                              Thank You, Terry and Kim, for Saving the Bills. Now, Work on the Sabres.
                              • May 2003
                              • 17353

                              #15
                              Re: Time Before Being Sacked...

                              Originally posted by xXSpIkes5IXx
                              Nice Work! Now to make a comparison you should do one with Tom Brady or Peyton Manning!
                              I think that such a comparison would demonstrate that Brady and Manning hardly ever have the D in their face in 2.5 seconds - and when they do, it ain't so pretty, either.

                              I saw only one occasion Sunday when JP held the ball too long on a sack, and that may have been because his receivers were covered. In that case, however, he should have thrown it away.

                              I'm frustrated with JP, too, but I know that part of his problem is the O line's poor pass protection, part is a less than stellar receiving corps, and part is playcalling which doesn't really take advantage of his skills.

                              I just don't know how much each of those parts contribute, and how much is JP himself.
                              Should have known, way back in 1960 when we drafted Richie Lucas Number 1, that this would be a long, hard ride. But who could have known it would be THIS bad?

                              Comment

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