View Full Version : More proof that Mularkey slowed jp's development
During the game Steve Buerlien said that when he spoke to jp that it really messed up his confidence when he got benched by his head coach last season and he took it really tough. He thought he failed at what he does best. He said that losman said that when jauron and fairchild came in they gave him a vote of confidence, it was a big boost for him and made him work harder to improve, hence the current results.
The best thing Mike Mularkey did for the buffalo bills was quit. Who knows how far along jp would have gotten had Mularkey stayed on as head coach.
Philagape
12-17-2006, 04:38 PM
Moolarkey got his today. Going to Miami was the best thing he ever did for the Bills.
Moolarkey got his today. Going to Miami was the best thing he ever did for the Bills.
Yep, for sure.
what it proves is JP has been acting like a mental midget. If he got benched too bad. He should have responded by working harder and being more focused not crying and pouting. Call that a blast on JP if you want and lambaste me but the guy is a professional football player not some shy schoolgirl.
Philagape
12-17-2006, 04:49 PM
One more sour-grapes hater on my ignore list
what it proves is JP has been acting like a mental midget. If he got benched too bad. He should have responded by working harder and being more focused not crying and pouting. Call that a blast on JP if you want and lambaste me but the guy is a professional football player not some shy schoolgirl.
You could say that, but I think he proved that he wasn't just a mental midget by showing up for the new coaching staff.
One more sour-grapes hater on my ignore list
you don't have any idea about how I feel or my opinions....you just want to run around and piss on people because it's gives you some sense of accomplishment.
You could say that, but I think he proved that he wasn't just a mental midget by showing up for the new coaching staff.
it looks like he's coming around. I'm happy for that the kid has a great skill set and if he keeps improving may turn into something really special. as I said weeks ago, maybe his problem is he's younger than most...but at the level these people are playing there are no excuses. you either go out there on sunday and get it done or you don't.
HAMMER
12-17-2006, 05:00 PM
you don't have any idea about how I feel or my opinions....you just want to run around and piss on people because it's gives you some sense of accomplishment.
No, he is just calling a douche a douche!
No, he is just calling a douche a douche!
oh I see you are around here again...why don't you crawl back under your pile of ****.
Philagape
12-17-2006, 05:04 PM
Trashing our QB all year way more than he deserves, with incredibly ******ed posts like he's sucked "every chance" he got, now can't say one good thing without throwing in a backhanded dig, and then this ... gee yeah I haven't a clue. :rolleyes:
Trashing our QB all year way more than he deserves, with incredibly ******ed posts like he's sucked "every chance" he got, now can't say one good thing without throwing in a backhanded dig, and then this ... gee yeah I haven't a clue. :rolleyes:
he was god awefull quite a lot. There were games he made a few good promising plays but mostly he stunk up the joint every start he made up until a few weeks ago. be the eternal optimist if you want but I was going by what I was seeing on the field not some notion of hope. And there aren't any backhanded digs either...just rational and analysis supported by sound observations.
I'm done arguing with you clowns about this though. See ya!
Billzz
12-17-2006, 05:08 PM
what it proves is JP has been acting like a mental midget. If he got benched too bad. He should have responded by working harder and being more focused not crying and pouting. Call that a blast on JP if you want and lambaste me but the guy is a professional football player not some shy schoolgirl.
I think your off base on this one. In theroy you are correct, but still if you are in a situation where no one has confidence in your ablities it will bother you and affect your perfomance.
He is performing in a new enviroment, new coaching staff and new GM. Some people do not operate well in crappy situations and that is exactly what he was in.
I think your off base on this one. In theroy you are correct, but still if you are in a situation where no one has confidence in your ablities it will bother you and affect your perfomance.
He is performing in a new enviroment, new coaching staff and new GM. Some people do not operate well in crappy situations and that is exactly what he was in.
it was clear he was falling into an emotional turmoil and his performance was suffering that's for sure. I still say it's his responsibility to deal with it not the coaches but you are entitled to your opinion.
I think your off base on this one. In theroy you are correct, but still if you are in a situation where no one has confidence in your ablities it will bother you and affect your perfomance.
He is performing in a new enviroment, new coaching staff and new GM. Some people do not operate well in crappy situations and that is exactly what he was in.
here's another way to approach it. Who is the one that really is empowered to turn this situation around a coach or JP? Therein lies your answer about who is responsible to get it turned around.
Billzz
12-17-2006, 05:19 PM
here's another way to approach it. Who is the one that really is empowered to turn this situation around a coach or JP? Therein lies your answer about who is responsible to get it turned around.
Technically he was a rookie who did need some support from the coaching staff, which he did not get. Yes you can try as you might to turn lemons into lemonade, but if you are not allowed to that is not your fault.
Yes he did need some time to develop emotionally which we have seen this year but he still was in a crappy quarterback carosell.
Bufftp
12-17-2006, 05:53 PM
it was clear he was falling into an emotional turmoil and his performance was suffering that's for sure. I still say it's his responsibility to deal with it not the coaches but you are entitled to your opinion.
Good coaches handle players well and grow them.
Bad coaches ruin them.
Good coaches put players in positions to succeed, bad coaches don't.
Coaches are responsible for their actions also.
Please refer to Mularkys consisent success in Miami.
Philagape
12-17-2006, 06:00 PM
Who cares what happened last year? Irrelevant, dead and buried.
justasportsfan
12-17-2006, 06:39 PM
what it proves is JP has been acting like a mental midget. If he got benched too bad. He should have responded by working harder and being more focused not crying and pouting. Call that a blast on JP if you want and lambaste me but the guy is a professional football player not some shy schoolgirl.
Did you watch the game? He did exactly what you just said he should do. :huh:
HHURRICANE
12-17-2006, 06:47 PM
Moolarkey got his today. Going to Miami was the best thing he ever did for the Bills.
I called it. Check all of my post before the season started!!
Philagape
12-17-2006, 06:52 PM
I called it. Check all of my post before the season started!!
:clap:
Mitchy moo
12-17-2006, 06:54 PM
Moolarkey got his today. Going to Miami was the best thing he ever did for the Bills.
Amen.
ArcticWildMan
12-17-2006, 08:45 PM
Who cares what happened last year? Irrelevant, dead and buried.
Unfortunately, a lot of folks think what happened last year was a reflection on his ability to lead the team. How you can expect a player to succeed under that kind of coaching is beyond me.
The kid has been on fire the last 6-7 games and still people are second guessing him. Young QB's take time and patience to develop. I'm sure if this team was still being run by Mularkey, we'd be seeing Holcomb in there and JP's chance to learn the game would be wasted for another year.
There is no doubt that the Mularkey fiasco set the kid back in his development. Once we got a coaching staff in here that knew how to groom a young QB, things turned around. The proof is in plain sight.
Philagape
12-17-2006, 09:43 PM
A QB's first year starting should NEVER be held against him. Don't make me get out the Elway/Young stats! :D
ublinkwescore
12-17-2006, 09:49 PM
it was clear he was falling into an emotional turmoil and his performance was suffering that's for sure. I still say it's his responsibility to deal with it not the coaches but you are entitled to your opinion.
Well, I think he's beyond that.
Michael82
12-17-2006, 09:51 PM
What sucks the most is that I have no doubt if he kept playing all year, his rust would have worn off slowly and he wouldn't have started out like he did this year. :mad:
Why oh why did we have to have that piece of ****, Mularkey? Thank you, Nick Saban for taking him and please promote him to assistant head coach or something. :snicker:
Michael82
12-17-2006, 09:53 PM
And thanks to Mike Mularkey for quitting on us. :bf1:
Thanks to the Buffalo school teachers and kids for harassing his kids and chasing Mularkey out. :snicker:
ublinkwescore
12-17-2006, 09:55 PM
look on the bright side mikey - next year, we should have an even better line protecting him, hopefully either a real TE or a #2 reciever, and at least one big DT that can engulf running backs or Olinemen blocking for them to free up our LBs or other linemen to stop them for gains of say 2 yards instead of 7 a carry.
Michael82
12-17-2006, 09:57 PM
look on the bright side mikey - next year, we should have an even better line protecting him, hopefully either a real TE or a #2 reciever, and at least one big DT that can engulf running backs or Olinemen blocking for them to free up our LBs or other linemen to stop them for gains of say 2 yards instead of 7 a carry.
:drool:
I could easily see JP putting up 300 yards a game occasionally. :up:
Historian
12-18-2006, 04:37 AM
I have to agree with the majority here. I think AWM hit the nail on the head. QBs take time to develop, as the game is so much more complicated than it once was.
All kidding aside, didn't we warn fish fans about Mularkey? I mean really?
I remember posting in one of Papas threads that he would rue the day that Saban brought him in, as his playcalling resembles a *****zophrenic on meth.
You saw it again yesterday, with the reverses, etc...
kernowboy
12-18-2006, 04:48 AM
here's another way to approach it. Who is the one that really is empowered to turn this situation around a coach or JP? Therein lies your answer about who is responsible to get it turned around.
THE COACH.
He is the one who coaches the techniques required of a QB to transfer their natural skills from college to the NFL.
He is the one who 'should' support a young QB who may be struggling and being put down by some loud mouth malcontent senior players who should know better.
He is the one who made the call about handing the job to an unprepared/untested rookie
He is the one who determines who steps onto the field with the starting unit.
He is the one who may sling an under prepared QB into the deep end and watch him drown through his own lack of support and concern for his own position.
He is the one who provides a QB coach and determines how the QB, especially a rookie will be coached.
So the answer is ..... THE COACH
YardRat
12-18-2006, 05:18 AM
I think some are missing a point or two on this issue, especially regarding Typo's posts (which I tend to lean toward his point of view...I'm not a fan of laying all the blame on every other person in the organization for JP's play in the past)...
1. If you're going to blame JP's lack of development last year on the coach, shouldn't the credit for what he's done since the break go to Jauron, not JP?
2. Since the bye week, the o-line has played better, the #2 receivers have stepped up, Royal (TE) has contributed, the defense has played better, the play-calling has been better, etc, etc. Shouldn't they get the credit and not JP?
I (and others) have preferred to lay the responsibility for his play on JP's shoulders mostly (where it belongs, IMO), and consequentially perceive JP's progress as an individual player as a credit to him, not necessarily the rest of the team.
Losman's played well over the last seven games, and I give full props to him for appearing to come around and reaching the point where he looks and plays like he belongs in this league, regardless of the line, the #2, the TE, the coaching, and on and on.
ICE74129
12-18-2006, 06:14 AM
what it proves is JP has been acting like a mental midget. If he got benched too bad. He should have responded by working harder and being more focused not crying and pouting. Call that a blast on JP if you want and lambaste me but the guy is a professional football player not some shy schoolgirl.
Again proof you dont' know anything at all about Developing QB's.
jamze132
12-18-2006, 07:28 AM
I don't think there is much merrit in the "mental midget" theory.
Considering what he had to go through last year, I think it ended up being a blessing in disguise. He basically had his head ****ed with all last season by Mularkey's dumbass. What JP experiened throughout Mularkey's reign of terror was all JP knew of the NFL. That's all he had to go on. But what did he do? He worked harder and harder and look where he is now.
When a soldier comes out of Basic training, he is considered a "proffesional soldier" much like a QB is considered an NFL QB. But I can tell you that most new soldiers aren't mentally ready to handle what's coming their way. And a lot of times, they stumble, but the the good ones get back up and try again. It's part of being human.
The "mental midget" arguement would have held a lot more water if JP was still devastated from last year. He seems to be ok.
justasportsfan
12-18-2006, 07:37 AM
During the game Steve Buerlien said that when he spoke to jp that it really messed up his confidence when he got benched by his head coach last season and he took it really tough. He thought he failed at what he does best. He said that losman said that when jauron and fairchild came in they gave him a vote of confidence, it was a big boost for him and made him work harder to improve, hence the current results.
The best thing Mike Mularkey did for the buffalo bills was quit. Who knows how far along jp would have gotten had Mularkey stayed on as head coach.
I don't know what the hell JP was talking about. JP has regressed since Boolarkey left.
Proof:
He torched the fins for 3 TD's in 1 qtr. Yeaterday it took him 4 qts. That's regression.
PS- I hope Boolarkey took notes on how not to blow a 21 pt lead :roflmao:
Good coaches handle players well and grow them.
Bad coaches ruin them.
Good coaches put players in positions to succeed, bad coaches don't.
Coaches are responsible for their actions also.
Please refer to Mularkys consisent success in Miami.
if you said good coaching makes the team and players better I would agree with you...in fact it's a necessity because the players are doing the work and bad coaching will clearly shoot them in the foot. But a good player is going to be a good player despite how their coaches handle them.
Maybe we can think of it this way. You go to work (this is hypothetical). You are working for a bad manager. You aren't happy in your situation. What do you do?
a. work hard to be successful in spite of the situation and find ways to have as many little victories as possible.
b. pout in the corner, make a ton of excuses and fail miserably at your job.
You pick and then tell me who is responsible for what. The right choice should be choice a. Your going to work, perhaps even harder, to overcome obstacles created by bad management.
THE COACH.
He is the one who coaches the techniques required of a QB to transfer their natural skills from college to the NFL.
He is the one who 'should' support a young QB who may be struggling and being put down by some loud mouth malcontent senior players who should know better.
He is the one who made the call about handing the job to an unprepared/untested rookie
He is the one who determines who steps onto the field with the starting unit.
He is the one who may sling an under prepared QB into the deep end and watch him drown through his own lack of support and concern for his own position.
He is the one who provides a QB coach and determines how the QB, especially a rookie will be coached.
So the answer is ..... THE COACH
this is a typical it's someone else's responsibility excuse. The truth is JP Losman is the only one that is empowered to have any true control over what JP Losman does. If you believe differently, then you also believe that a rapist or axe murder should never go to prison because it's someone else's fault they do these things because people aren't responsible for themselves.
Did you watch the game? He did exactly what you just said he should do. :huh:
yes! it's definately looking like he's turned the corner not only in his play but his attitude. But three months ago he had yet to demonstrate even peeking around the corner. That's all I have been saying. He either does it or he doesn't. Anything else is just a bunch of excuses predicated around the hope that we have the QB position solved because it's so important.
Unfortunately, a lot of folks think what happened last year was a reflection on his ability to lead the team. How you can expect a player to succeed under that kind of coaching is beyond me.
The kid has been on fire the last 6-7 games and still people are second guessing him. Young QB's take time and patience to develop. I'm sure if this team was still being run by Mularkey, we'd be seeing Holcomb in there and JP's chance to learn the game would be wasted for another year.
There is no doubt that the Mularkey fiasco set the kid back in his development. Once we got a coaching staff in here that knew how to groom a young QB, things turned around. The proof is in plain sight.
learning is a process and it always takes time. But the fact that it takes time does not equate to if you give it time the person will always learn. I am a teacher. Sometimes the light bulbs never go on and you can't force them to go on. Everyone keeps throwing insults around that "it takes time" attitude...and the truth is for just about everyone..in almost every single case it takes time. But like I said...that's a lot different than saying if you give it time that person will always learn.
Well, I think he's beyond that.
yes, it does...and I hope the trend continues.
What sucks the most is that I have no doubt if he kept playing all year, his rust would have worn off slowly and he wouldn't have started out like he did this year. :mad:
Why oh why did we have to have that piece of ****, Mularkey? Thank you, Nick Saban for taking him and please promote him to assistant head coach or something. :snicker:
I think people underestimate the impact of the composting time and the work in the off-season...and in the last two seasons have played down their expectations for JP Losman way too much because he didn't get "the maximum amount of starts".
The_Philster
12-18-2006, 05:26 PM
if you said good coaching makes the team and players better I would agree with you...in fact it's a necessity because the players are doing the work and bad coaching will clearly shoot them in the foot. But a good player is going to be a good player despite how their coaches handle them.
Maybe we can think of it this way. You go to work (this is hypothetical). You are working for a bad manager. You aren't happy in your situation. What do you do?
a. work hard to be successful in spite of the situation and find ways to have as many little victories as possible.
b. pout in the corner, make a ton of excuses and fail miserably at your job.
You pick and then tell me who is responsible for what. The right choice should be choice a. Your going to work, perhaps even harder, to overcome obstacles created by bad management.
NewsFlash!
A player won't produce if he isn't allowed to. Mularkey wouldn't allow JP to produce...first by benching him after 4 games...then by benching him when he had shown he was clearly better than the alternative
I'm just curious...how was JP going to be successful when Mularkey wouldn't let him even try to be? :popcorn:
I have to agree with the majority here. I think AWM hit the nail on the head. QBs take time to develop, as the game is so much more complicated than it once was.
All kidding aside, didn't we warn fish fans about Mularkey? I mean really?
I remember posting in one of Papas threads that he would rue the day that Saban brought him in, as his playcalling resembles a *****zophrenic on meth.
You saw it again yesterday, with the reverses, etc...
yes they take time to develop, but time is no guarantee they will develop. For every QB that is successful in the league I bet I can think of five that never made it despite having time to develop. So you can sit around and bark about "time" or you can go on what you observe. I never said JP shouldn't be playing. Last year I said that he should have been benched because he was regressing. If the coaching is so poor and he's out there getting killed...I'm sure it's productive to have him in there. That just doesn't make any sense. He wasn't getting it done...and things were getting worse on a consistent basis.
He was better this year all along...but earlier in the season he was making far too many boneheaded decisions. They weren't just rookie "i'm trying to make a play" mistakes. He was lost out there for almost entire games at times. That being lost comes from preparation and learning off the field not what he's doing on the field. So, based on observation, he deserved criticism for his play like it or not.
I think some are missing a point or two on this issue, especially regarding Typo's posts (which I tend to lean toward his point of view...I'm not a fan of laying all the blame on every other person in the organization for JP's play in the past)...
1. If you're going to blame JP's lack of development last year on the coach, shouldn't the credit for what he's done since the break go to Jauron, not JP?
2. Since the bye week, the o-line has played better, the #2 receivers have stepped up, Royal (TE) has contributed, the defense has played better, the play-calling has been better, etc, etc. Shouldn't they get the credit and not JP?
I (and others) have preferred to lay the responsibility for his play on JP's shoulders mostly (where it belongs, IMO), and consequentially perceive JP's progress as an individual player as a credit to him, not necessarily the rest of the team.
Losman's played well over the last seven games, and I give full props to him for appearing to come around and reaching the point where he looks and plays like he belongs in this league, regardless of the line, the #2, the TE, the coaching, and on and on.
thank you, and i agree with you. some people just can't handle the thought of healthy scrutiny. They let their passion get in the way of being rational.
NewsFlash!
A player won't produce if he isn't allowed to. Mularkey wouldn't allow JP to produce...first by benching him after 4 games...then by benching him when he had shown he was clearly better than the alternative
I'm just curious...how was JP going to be successful when Mularkey wouldn't let him even try to be? :popcorn:
like I said Phil, from what I was seeing JP was dormant on the field last year when he had opportunities. just leaving him in there to be clueless and get eaten up by defenses would have done nothing but hurt his confidence and IMO he's emotionally a little more needy than we would like. So, the coaching response to that neediness was to take him out so he didn't fall further into the crapper. It's a no win situation for the coaching staff. They leave him in, and he gets hammered on the field and in the media (and that results to a cultural lambasting). They leave him in and his collegues have less and less confidence in him week to week. They take him out, and they hurt him another way. They made a choice.
The_Philster
12-18-2006, 05:37 PM
like I said Phil, from what I was seeing JP was dormant on the field last year when he had opportunities. just leaving him in there to be clueless and get eaten up by defenses would have done nothing but hurt his confidence and IMO he's emotionally a little more needy than we would like. So, the coaching response to that neediness was to take him out so he didn't fall further into the crapper. It's a no win situation for the coaching staff. They leave him in, and he gets hammered on the field and in the media (and that results to a cultural lambasting). They leave him in and his collegues have less and less confidence in him week to week. They take him out, and they hurt him another way. They made a choice.
Point is...benching him the first time around may have been warranted. Mularkey was nothing short of stupid for benching him the second time around. He was starting to come around...and he was already making smarter decisions with the football than Holcomb was
Again proof you dont' know anything at all about Developing QB's.
Oh yeah, I keep forgetting. It takes time to develop a QB so as long as you give it time that QB will develop into a viable starter. I keep forgetting about that. Thanks for the lesson. I wish we had given Todd Collins and Rob Johnson more time we wouldn't even be having this discussion about JP Losman. I guess the same can be said about Mike Williams too...we should have given him more time and he would have become a stud LT.
SABURZFAN
12-18-2006, 05:39 PM
why are these ladies harping about last year? :shakeno:
The_Philster
12-18-2006, 05:41 PM
RJ was given a lot more time than JP's gotten...and as for Collins, it's not like he was dumped off after the 97 season...he was with us in '98 training camp but he couldn't beat out anyone
Point is...benching him the first time around may have been warranted. Mularkey was nothing short of stupid for benching him the second time around. He was starting to come around...and he was already making smarter decisions with the football than Holcomb was
well...I'm entitled to my opinion too. The team sucked, he wasn't getting it done and he was getting thrashed. Since he's a bit fragile and very young, the coaching staff last season did him and the organization a favor for sitting him down.
Did you ever stop to consider that like it or not, the events last season have contributed to where he is at today? Maybe it's that he's coming around quicker because of what he went through last season instead of it being so cut and dry "if he'd played four more games last season he would have come around four games earlier this season".
I wish the world was so black and white the way many seem to believe it is...but the reality is just about everything hovers in the gray area.
The_Philster
12-18-2006, 05:45 PM
I just don't get how they did anyone any favors by playing the worse QB of the 2 at the end of the season :idunno:
I just don't get how they did anyone any favors by playing the worse QB of the 2 at the end of the season :idunno:
Because KH was/is more mature. He's already been through the ringer with another organization and had more time in the league. That and fact that the bills organization has WAY more invested in JP Losman it's a no brainer to make the choices you think best protect that investment. And I'm not just talking $$$ on the board what about the opportunity cost of the moves we made to get JP here? That is not something you want to risk going into the toilet when you can avoid that risk.
Bling
12-18-2006, 06:01 PM
:drool:
I could easily see JP putting up 300 yards a game occasionally. :up:
He's only done it once in his career, so obviously there's still work to be done.
Michael82
12-18-2006, 09:06 PM
Point is...benching him the first time around may have been warranted. Mularkey was nothing short of stupid for benching him the second time around. He was starting to come around...and he was already making smarter decisions with the football than Holcomb was
it's the second time around that pissed most of us off. Mularkey did that just to save his job and it didn't work. JP never should have been benched that second time once he started coming around and looking a little better. That was total bull****. There's no way in hell that Holcomb should have started against the Bengals or Jets. :mad:
YardRat
12-18-2006, 09:17 PM
Point is...benching him the first time around may have been warranted. Mularkey was nothing short of stupid for benching him the second time around. He was starting to come around...and he was already making smarter decisions with the football than Holcomb was
I disagree. Losman wasn't coming around enough, and Holcomb was still the better QB when he was re-inserted into the line-up.
He definitely wasn't making smarter decisions, and please don't throw that "throwing a three yard pass on third and eight" at me. Go back and review the game tapes since the break and see how many times JP's done that. Several. Sometimes it's the smart play, or the only play.
BillsFever21
12-18-2006, 09:38 PM
learning is a process and it always takes time. But the fact that it takes time does not equate to if you give it time the person will always learn. I am a teacher. Sometimes the light bulbs never go on and you can't force them to go on. Everyone keeps throwing insults around that "it takes time" attitude...and the truth is for just about everyone..in almost every single case it takes time. But like I said...that's a lot different than saying if you give it time that person will always learn.
Somebody can't learn without giving them the proper opportunity to succeed.
If you had your way he wouldn't have had the extra time to learn after last season and the success he's having now would've never happened in Buffalo.
When a kid joins school if they're not Einstein after the first 2 months of school do you give up on them? That's what you did with JP. I hope you don't look at your students that way.
JP has turned the corner and has been on par with the top QB's in the league in the last 7 games. The only thing you can continue to whine about is what he did last year.
That is the past. That would like somebody still *****ing about how bad Carson Palmer or Peyton Manning was his first 8 games starting in the league.
That's done and over with. Now the hard work is paying off. He has an almost 2-1 TD-INT ratio and has 11 TD's and 4 INT's since the bye week. In the last 4 weeks he has 9 TD's and 2 INT's.
There isn't many QB's with the production that JP has given us over the last 2 months and you still continue to cry about last year. Get over it.
BillsFever21
12-18-2006, 09:49 PM
Oh yeah, I keep forgetting. It takes time to develop a QB so as long as you give it time that QB will develop into a viable starter. I keep forgetting about that. Thanks for the lesson. I wish we had given Todd Collins and Rob Johnson more time we wouldn't even be having this discussion about JP Losman. I guess the same can be said about Mike Williams too...we should have given him more time and he would have become a stud LT.
You really are clueless or just don't have any common sense.
Nobody is saying if you give every QB time to develop that they will turn out to be a good QB. Some people will just never get it or will never good enough.
But for the QB's who do get it and develop into a successful QB it took time for them QB's to become that QB. With your logic they would've never been given the extra time to develop after they initially struggled their first time around. After 8-11 games they would've been benched for good and replaced had they not been lighting up the league. The NFL would be full of nothing but journeymen veterans who gave their teams a slightly better shot to win at that moment. There would be no stars. Just a bunch of QB's like Kelly Holcomb or Craig Nall.
And I remember people like you using Ben Roethlisberger as an excuse as to why JP should've been playing great last year. The truth is Big Ben was put in the best situation ANY QB could ask for let along a young QB that's learning. He wasn't asked to to anything or win games. He had a great running game, OL and defense to do that. He threw about 15 times a game(sometimes less) and was asked to not lose them and wasn't put in the position to lose them.
JP didn't have them tools around him or the coaching staff to lead the team to that last year. Now this part of the year rolls around and Losman is playing much better then Big Ben is.
Point is that some QB's will never become good no matter how much time you give them. The ones that do become good would've never been a great QB had they not been given the proper time to develop even through the bad times. They would've been benched and replaced long before they turned that corner with your theory on developing QB's.
And what is your ***** now? Losman has came around and is playing some good football. You continue to ***** though without any reason. I guess you just can't swallow your pride.
Philagape
12-18-2006, 10:01 PM
One sure sign that JP is improving is that the things haters come up with to bash him just keep getting dumber and dumber.
Someone is actually crying because he took time to develop. Wow.
SABURZFAN
12-18-2006, 10:04 PM
One sure sign that JP is improving is that the things haters come up with to bash him just keep getting dumber and dumber
it could be worse.you could be a fan of his and call for him to be benched.oh wait....you and ICE already did that.
Fever,
what I have been saying is when he shows up and plays well then he will get credit and people will rally around him. When he is not showing up, no matter how inexperienced he is, there is no reason to give him any credit and rally around him. He has played quite poorly at times yet you all knowing people keep suggesting he should get some sort of pass on that play because he "needs time" or "is a rookie". Well this is his third season in the league it's high time he started playing like an NFL QB no matter how much benching was going on.
SABURZFAN
12-18-2006, 10:36 PM
Fever,
what I have been saying is when he shows up and plays well then he will get credit and people will rally around him. When he is not showing up, no matter how inexperienced he is, there is no reason to give him any credit and rally around him. He has played quite poorly at times yet you all knowing people keep suggesting he should get some sort of pass on that play because he "needs time" or "is a rookie". Well this is his third season in the league it's high time he started playing like an NFL QB no matter how much benching was going on.
they'll continue to try to cram losman down your throat regardless.when the Bills win,it's JP this and JP that....when the Bills lose,it's the TEAM. :rolleyes:
BillsFever21
12-18-2006, 10:38 PM
Fever,
what I have been saying is when he shows up and plays well then he will get credit and people will rally around him. When he is not showing up, no matter how inexperienced he is, there is no reason to give him any credit and rally around him. He has played quite poorly at times yet you all knowing people keep suggesting he should get some sort of pass on that play because he "needs time" or "is a rookie". Well this is his third season in the league it's high time he started playing like an NFL QB no matter how much benching was going on.
And no young QB trying to develop has had bad games?
Not even young QB's. Every QB will have bad games in the NFL. Does that mean every bad game he has all you will talk about is what happened in the past.
Tom Brady got rocked last week. Should he get dissed and pissed on all week? Not comparing him to Brady but just using that as an example.
He hasn't bad a bad game in two months. He now has 17 TD's and 10 INT's. Very respectable. He has more good games then bad games this year.
So that means every bad game he has for the next two years you will have to bring up what happened last season in his first year starting even if he's having a great year? That makes no sense at all.
The best QB's in the league will still have awful games. They will also have many great games like JP has recently. Whenever they have a bad game nobody brings up their first year starting and how bad he is.
This makes no sense at all. He has been great the last two months. The two months prior to that he had some bad games and had some decent games too. It's not like he had 2 TD's and 10 INT's.
Some people just can't get over the past and swallow their pride. You act like the good games he's had over the past two months was his first one of the season each time.
And no young QB trying to develop has had bad games?
Not even young QB's. Every QB will have bad games in the NFL. Does that mean every bad game he has all you will talk about is what happened in the past.
Tom Brady got rocked last week. Should he get dissed and pissed on all week? Not comparing him to Brady but just using that as an example.
He hasn't bad a bad game in two months. He now has 17 TD's and 10 INT's. Very respectable. He has more good games then bad games this year.
So that means every bad game he has for the next two years you will have to bring up what happened last season in his first year starting even if he's having a great year? That makes no sense at all.
The best QB's in the league will still have awful games. They will also have many great games like JP has recently. Whenever they have a bad game nobody brings up their first year starting and how bad he is.
This makes no sense at all. He has been great the last two months. The two months prior to that he had some bad games and had some decent games too. It's not like he had 2 TD's and 10 INT's.
Some people just can't get over the past and swallow their pride. You act like the good games he's had over the past two months was his first one of the season each time.
I don't recall at any time bashing JP this week...you guys are making that up.
SABURZFAN
12-18-2006, 10:42 PM
He has been great the last two months.
nothing about TEAM..... :rolleyes:
SABURZFAN
12-18-2006, 10:43 PM
I don't recall at any time bashing JP this week...you guys are making that up.
it's because you're not on the losman jockstrap.
BillsFever21
12-18-2006, 10:45 PM
they'll continue to try to cram losman down your throat regardless.when the Bills win,it's JP this and JP that....when the Bills lose,it's the TEAM. :rolleyes:
Yep. And when Losman plays great it's no reason because of him even with 5 TD's and no INT's the last two weeks. It was everyone else in spite of him according to the few people left with that opinion like yourself.
But when we lose even if Losman didn't have a terrible game and we give up 200 yards rushing and can't stop anybody or run the ball on offense it's only because of Losman according to the few of you.
Some people like you can't swallow their pride when they are wrong and give any credit where it's due. Maybe it's because they are used to being wrong and being ridiculed over their life they are used to it by now.
Some people can see that there is more to a football team then just the QB. People like you can't.
You guys are an endangered species that will soon be extinct. When JP AND this team are enjoying success don't bother coming around and trying to jump on the bandwagon.
Dr. Lecter
12-18-2006, 10:46 PM
they'll continue to try to cram losman down your throat regardless.when the Bills win,it's JP this and JP that....when the Bills lose,it's the TEAM. :rolleyes:
Ah.
The inverse-SAB syndrome. :D
BillsFever21
12-18-2006, 10:49 PM
nothing about TEAM..... :rolleyes:
Nothing in this thread has been about the team. This is an individual subject about a player. I wouldn't expect you to be able to understand the difference though.
Anyway, when things are going bad the few people like you isn't bringing up how bad the team played. It was only JP. You people are the ones who can't talk about the team unless it's when we're winning and then it's everyone but JP who is responsible for it.
SABURZFAN
12-18-2006, 10:58 PM
Yep. And when Losman plays great it's no reason because of him even with 5 TD's and no INT's the last two weeks. It was everyone else in spite of him according to the few people left with that opinion like yourself.
But when we lose even if Losman didn't have a terrible game and we give up 200 yards rushing and can't stop anybody or run the ball on offense it's only because of Losman according to the few of you.
Some people like you can't swallow their pride when they are wrong and give any credit where it's due. Maybe it's because they are used to being wrong and being ridiculed over their life they are used to it by now.
Some people can see that there is more to a football team then just the QB. People like you can't.
You guys are an endangered species that will soon be extinct. When JP AND this team are enjoying success don't bother coming around and trying to jump on the bandwagon.
:laughter:
it's friggin hilarious that it eats you like that.don't worry,you're not alone.it's friggin hilarious that you jump to the conclusion that you're right and we're wrong.don't worry,you're not alone.it's friggin hilarious that you make it sound as if the Bills fans who are not on the JP jockstrap are not Bills fans.don't worry,you're not alone.
SABURZFAN
12-18-2006, 10:59 PM
Ah.
The inverse-SAB syndrome. :D
from where i stand,it's the inverse-Licker syndrome.
SABURZFAN
12-18-2006, 11:01 PM
Nothing in this thread has been about the team. This is an individual subject about a player. I wouldn't expect you to be able to understand the difference though.
Anyway, when things are going bad the few people like you isn't bringing up how bad the team played. It was only JP. You people are the ones who can't talk about the team unless it's when we're winning and then it's everyone but JP who is responsible for it.
:wail: <----- :BillsFever21:
The_Philster
12-19-2006, 04:41 AM
I disagree. Losman wasn't coming around enough, and Holcomb was still the better QB when he was re-inserted into the line-up.
He definitely wasn't making smarter decisions, and please don't throw that "throwing a three yard pass on third and eight" at me. Go back and review the game tapes since the break and see how many times JP's done that. Several. Sometimes it's the smart play, or the only play.It was 4th and 7 and it was a must to get that 1st down because otherwise, the opponent gets to run out the clock. He should've tried to get something deeper. Getting picked off because he was trying to help win the game would've been better than giving up. I don't want quitters on my team :down:
YardRat
12-19-2006, 05:36 AM
It was 4th and 7 and it was a must to get that 1st down because otherwise, the opponent gets to run out the clock. He should've tried to get something deeper. Getting picked off because he was trying to help win the game would've been better than giving up. I don't want quitters on my team :down:
I think it's unfair to label an individual a 'quitter' based on one play.
My point was, and remains, I think it's a mis-perception at best, gross exaggeration at worst, to indicate that JP was 'out-playing' Holcomb at this point last year. Simply not true.
Regardless of any difference in opinion, right now it's a moot point and water under the bridge...last year was last year, and the remaining two games are all that's important.
kernowboy
12-19-2006, 07:12 AM
Over the past five games, Losman has averaged 27 attempts. He is 91 of 37 for 1,050 yards, 10 touchdowns and four interceptions in that stretch. Since the first week of November, only New Orleans' Drew Brees (http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/player/70657) (14), Cincinnati's Carson Palmer (http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/player/140403) (13) and Dallas' Tony Romo (http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/player/142729) (12) have tossed more touchdown passes than Losman's 11 and his quarterback rating of 88.5 is ninth best in the league.
This season, he is at 63.4 percent with 17 touchdowns and 10 interceptions overall.
On the season, Losman is an electrifying 18 of 27 for 122 yards, eight touchdowns and no interceptions when passing inside the opponent's 19-yard line.
Enough said!!
justasportsfan
12-19-2006, 07:49 AM
yes! it's definately looking like he's turned the corner not only in his play but his attitude. But three months ago he had yet to demonstrate even peeking around the corner. That's all I have been saying. He either does it or he doesn't. Anything else is just a bunch of excuses predicated around the hope that we have the QB position solved because it's so important.
three months ago they were all adjusting to each other. But he wasn't crying. he was working his butt off. Kept his composure, etc.
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