Here's why I can't call Ralph cheap

[Yasgur's Farm]

The following is based on what I speculate to be true. Some of the numbers have not been entirely researched but I believe are representative.

1) TV contracts generate the most dollars and are distributed in a fair manor among the 32 teams.

2) Teams share in the gate dollars. I believe a percentage of each gate is pooled and that money is distributed among the 32 teams as well. While the percentage that's kept by each team is the same, the teams generating higher gates (greater than Buffalo's $45 average) are producing greater revenue. Buffalo has the potential gate of $27M ($45 X 75,000 X 8) per season while a team like Washington has a potential gate of $52M ($100 X 65,000 X 8). If each team contributes 20% of gate, that leaves Washington with $22.5M more revenue per season than Buffalo.

3) NFL (owners agreement) dictates a yearly cap for players combined salaries. The teams with the greatest resources want the higher cap.

4) NFL does not dictate a cap for coaches, administrators and staff salaries. Once again, the more well-to-do teams have greater resources to employ the top people.

5) Teams in depressed markets (not necessarily smaller markets) such as Buffalo find it hard to compete because their gate revenue is far less than teams like Dallas, New England, Washington, etc.

[X-Era]

The following is based on my what I speculate to be true. Some of the numbers have not been entirely researched but I believe are representative.

1) TV contracts generate the most dollars and are distributed in a fair manor among the 32 teams.

2) Teams share in the gate dollars. I believe a percentage of each gate is pooled and that money is distributed among the 32 teams as well. While the percentage that's kept by each team is the same, the teams generating higher gates (greater than Buffalo's $45 average) are producing greater revenue. Buffalo has the potential gate of $27M ($45 X 75,000 X 8) per season while a team like Washington has a potential gate of $52M ($100 X 65,000 X 8). If each team contributes 20% of gate, that leaves Washington with $22.5M more profit per season than Buffalo.

3) NFL (owners agreement) dictates a yearly cap for players combined salaries. The teams with the greatest resources want the higher cap.

4) NFL does not dictate a cap for coaches, administrators and staff salaries. Once again, the more well-to-do teams have greater resources to employ the top people.

5) Teams in depressed markets (not necessarily smaller markets) such as Buffalo find it hard to compete because their gate revenue is far less than teams like Dallas, New England, Washington, etc.

And your point is what?

If Ralph doesnt have the money, he needs to sell the team to someone that will use the cap for its purpose, to keep teams on an even playing field.

If Ralph wont do it, hes screwing you and me by making us the Montreal Expos of the NFL.

Sorry, but hes either cheap or has crappy accountants, either way you spend to stay competitive or you admit defeat

[Coach Sal]

Luxury box revenue is not split or pooled whatsoever.

Teams get to keep 100% of their luxury box/suite money. THAT'S where the biggest difference comes in.

Teams in some markets can charge double or triple what the Bills do and still sell out every box they have.

[Yasgur's Farm]

And your point is what?

If Ralph doesnt have the money, he needs to sell the team to someone that will use the cap for its purpose, to keep teams on an even playing field.

If Ralph wont do it, hes screwing you and me by making us the Montreal Expos of the NFL.

Sorry, but hes either cheap or has crappy accountants, either way you spend to stay competitive or you admit defeatIf Buffalo doesn't generate the revenue (which it's not), Ralph doesn't have the resources.

It's like your 16 year old daughter calling you cheap when you can't afford to buy her a brand new BMW for her birthday.

[X-Era]

Luxury box revenue is not split or pooled whatsoever.

Teams get to keep 100% of their luxury box/suite money. THAT'S where the biggest difference comes in.

Teams in some markets can charge double or triple what the Bills do and still sell out every box they have.

Amazing thing is teams like Pitt, Arizona, GB arent *****ing. Why?

[Yasgur's Farm]

Amazing thing is teams like Pitt, Arizona, GB arent *****ing. Why?Have you looked at their average gate?

[X-Era]

If Buffalo he doesn't generate the revenue (which it's not), Ralph doesn't have the resources.

It's like your 16 year old daughter calling you cheap when you can't afford to buy her a brand new BMW for her birthday.

And if it was REQUIRED to have a BMW, I should let her be adopted by someone with the money to do it!

If true, and Im not sure I buy that Ralph doesnt have the money, it still means he cant be competitive in the NFL anymore. OK, then sell the team.

I have no doubts that Golisano has the cash to make the team a winner. Everyone hopefully remembers that the Sabres operated in the red for at least the first year, but now, SINCE THEY ARE WINNING, they have 3 of the top 10 most wanted player jerseys, and no problems selling out.

Look at Pitt, GB, Sea, STL. All have had recent success or big name players that put fannys in the seats. And NONE are *****ing.

You want money, put great players on the roster, have success, and the money will be there. If your not willing to do it, you agree to fail and might as well sell the team.

[Yasgur's Farm]

So you're suggesting that an owner (Wilson, Galisano) should be "REQUIRED" to take a loss year after year just to keep a team in Buffalo. Boy... Now there's a selling point to a potential new owner!

[Yasgur's Farm]

Look at Pitt, GB, Sea, STL. All have had recent success or big name players that put fannys in the seats.Who?

[X-Era]

Have you looked at their average gate?

Heres an article:

http://www.usatoday.com/sports/football/nfl/2006-09-06-ticket-prices_x.htm

Pitts are 59.00
Wash is the highest in the league (interesting you used them)

Notice that all the playoff teams raised their ticket prices the most. DUHHH. Thats my point.

[X-Era]

So you're suggesting that an owner (Wilson, Galisano) should be "REQUIRED" to take a loss year after year just to keep a team in Buffalo. Boy... Now there's a selling point to a potential new owner!

Ralph is taking a loss because he hasnt made the correct GM choices until now. He also hasnt forced us to add the types of players that people want to see enough to pay the leagues lowest tciket prices. Then the product stunk for a decade and now he has no money, (supposedly), go figure.

A owner who wants to be competitive will spend the money necessary and have the savvy to get the right guys, new stadium, to build success.

I work for a large corporation and yes, sometimes we take a loss to launch a new product, because we know that if we build it right it will have long term sustained success that will cover our short term loss and then some.

Thats what Golisano did and that worked, but Ralph cant, wont?

[X-Era]

Who?

Seriously? GB is owned by the cities residents which cannot be done again in the NFL due to some law. However, the have a guy named Favre that puts fannys in the seats.

Pitt won the SB last year, Sea played in the SB last year as you know and has a guy named Alexander, STL has a nice run a few years back and still has guys like Holt, Pace, et al.

[gr8slayer]

Ralph, cheap? Never.

[Yasgur's Farm]

That's my point JP... The Buffalo market can't bare the expense necessary to keep an NFL franchise. The owners with the highest revenue are pushing Buffalo out. Something has to change if we wanna keep this team... The way I see it is these 2 best case scenario's...

1) Build a 65,000 seat stadium near Darien lake. Boost the average ticket price to $65. This is closer to the center of the Bills fan base.

2) Toronto gets the Bills NFL franchise and builds a stadium on the Buffalo side of Toronto. Buffalo gets the Argo's CFL franchise.

These are desperate times for Bills fans!!

[gr8slayer]

2) Toronto gets the Bills NFL franchise and builds a stadium on the Buffalo side of Toronto. Buffalo gets the Argo's CFL franchise.

These are desperate times for Bills fans!!
That's some of the dumbest **** I have ever heard.

The Bill stay. Period.

[X-Era]

Ralph, cheap? Never.

Well, lets watch and see shall we. Anyone here believe ANY of the following?:

1) We compete with the rest pof the league and resign Nate
2) We spend even close to our salary cap, last year we went into the season something like 11 or 15 mill under

Yes, thats cheap. I dont believe Marv is the one who would say, Nates going price is X, but I wont pay it or even approach Ralph to pay it.

I think its Ralph who would say, Im not paying that big of a contract.

[gr8slayer]

Well, lets watch and see shall we. Anyone here believe ANY of the following?:

1) We compete with the rest pof the league and resign Nate
2) We spend even close to our salary cap, last year we went into the season something like 11 or 15 mill under

Yes, thats cheap. I dont believe Marv is the one who would say, Nates going price is X, but I wont pay it or even approach Ralph to pay it.

I think its Ralph who would say, Im not paying that big of a contract.
It was pure sarcasm my man.

[Yasgur's Farm]

Packers - Favre - $6.75M cap hit. Cheap for a franchise QB.
Seahawks - Alexander - $7.75M cap hit. For the NFL's premiere RB.
Rams - Can't find info initially
Bills - Clements - projected $10M cap hit.
HMMMM

[X-Era]

That's my point JP... The Buffalo market can't bare the expense necessary to keep an NFL franchise. The owners with the highest revenue are pushing Buffalo out. Something has to change if we wanna keep this team... The way I see it is these 2 best case scenario's...

1) Build a 65,000 seat stadium near Darien lake. Boost the average ticket price to $65. This is closer to the center of the Bills fan base.

2) Toronto gets the Bills NFL franchise and builds a stadium on the Buffalo side of Toronto. Buffalo gets the Argo's CFL franchise.

These are desperate times for Bills fans!!

I dont know the true situation here.

Im sorry but I refuse to accept that we cant have a franchise. I know in my heart that if we come out of the gate next year like we finished this year, each and every game will be sold out EVEN IF THE BILLS RAISE THE TICKET PRICE.

If they go from 42 or 45 or whatever to 55 or even 60, people wont pay the extra 30 bucks for a pair of tickets??? Hell ya they will, you can EASILY drop that on one trip to McDonalds.

Im just not going to think that the situation is that dire yet. The politicians would be doing MUCH MUCH more complaining.

[X-Era]

Packers - Favre - $6.75M cap hit. Cheap for a franchise QB.
Seahawks - Alexander - $7.75M cap hit. For the NFL's premiere RB.
Rams - Can't find info initially
Bills - Clements - projected $10M cap hit.
HMMMM

Those moneys were all PRE- CBA. The game has changed.

Not only that but Nates contract can be done so as to cost us less than 10 mill in cap hit this next year (although if we have the cap why not front load it).

[SABURZFAN]

before the NFL became a cash cow,the Old Fart was using the Bills as a writeoff.

[Yasgur's Farm]

Those moneys were all PRE- CBA. The game has changed.Exactly... That $16.5M ($85.5M to $102M salary cap adder from 2005 to 2006 pretty much did Ralph in. How much profit do you think a team like the Bills makes anyway? Prior to this new CBA, the Bills were capped out year after year.

Not only that but Nates contract can be done so as to cost us less than 10 mill in cap hit this next year (although if we have the cap why not front load it).Sooner or later, you gotta pay the fiddler if you wanna listen to the music. An average is an average. If it's $10M per year average, and the 1st year counts as $8M, the subsequent years will average more than $10M.

We have 14 free agents of our own... That's 14 salaries that are not yet counted against the cap. 6 of those will be draft picks = $4M rookie pool. The other 8 spots will cost around $14M to $20M for comparable talent (Not to mention wanting to improve). That cap room starts to dwindle fast.