For those who think it's losman and not McGahee!

[HHURRICANE]

For those who think Losman is the issue and not McGahee:

Out of the top 11 QB's only 3 didn't make the playoffs: Palmer, Bulgar and Losman.

Out of the top 11 QB's only 2 didn't have a running back to rush for over 1,000 yards: Pennington and Losman. Sidenote : Brady had 2 RB's that ran for about 800 yards each so I didn't count him.

Pennington was 11th and had the worst rushing attack. Losman was 10th and had the 2nd worst rushing attack.

Blame the OL all you want but McGahee is a true under performer. After looking at these stats I really believe RB is more important to this team than CB.

[gr8slayer]

If you can't run and stop the run you will not win.

[ParanoidAndroid]

If you can't run and stop the run you will not win.

Yep. Can't say it enough. :nod:

[Mudflap1]

I think we're officially beating a dead horse with McGahee...

He's not the sharpest knife in the drawer. Marv and company are fairly intelligent human beings. If they think the guy isn't good enough, they're going to get rid of him! To carry on and rant and rage every day about what this guy says, well, he's just not that smart of a guy! Short of putting a burning cross on his lawn, urinating on his car, and spitting on him in public, what else should we do to the guy? He's not going to be reading this post, heck, the guy probably can't read at all. Let's just let the guys in charge make the decisions and let it go! He probably won't be here, but if he is, I guess OBD think he's worth something.

Same goes with J.P. Obviously the coaches and Marv seem to be pleased with his progress and think he's worth keeping around. So let it go about him not living up to expectations or sucking or whatever. The so-called experts on the Billszone have a right to share their opinion, but the constant ridicule is not supportable. He's obviously doing something right.

Jon

[HHURRICANE]

I think we're officially beating a dead horse with McGahee...

He's not the sharpest knife in the drawer. Marv and company are fairly intelligent human beings. If they think the guy isn't good enough, they're going to get rid of him! To carry on and rant and rage every day about what this guy says, well, he's just not that smart of a guy! Short of putting a burning cross on his lawn, urinating on his car, and spitting on him in public, what else should we do to the guy? He's not going to be reading this post, heck, the guy probably can't read at all. Let's just let the guys in charge make the decisions and let it go! He probably won't be here, but if he is, I guess OBD think he's worth something.

Same goes with J.P. Obviously the coaches and Marv seem to be pleased with his progress and think he's worth keeping around. So let it go about him not living up to expectations or sucking or whatever. The so-called experts on the Billszone have a right to share their opinion, but the constant ridicule is not supportable. He's obviously doing something right.

Jon

Although I agree with most of your post it is important to understand that it wasn't our inept passing game that led to our weak running game which some would like to believe. It was our weak running game that probably cost us a couple of games and should be addressed in the offseason.

[Mudflap1]

Although I agree with most of your post it is important to understand that it wasn't our inept passing game that led to our weak running game which some would like to believe. It was our weak running game that probably cost us a couple of games and should be addressed in the offseason.

So be it! I agree! So does Western New York! Everyone thinks is a Willis a bum, we get it! If Marv and Dick agree, he'll be gone. If he stays, then I guess they see some sort of value in him/think the running game is more of a scheme/line issue. I just thinking we're killing this guy 20 different ways since the season ended, that's all.

Jon

[TacklingDummy]

:yawn:

[TacklingDummy]

Although I agree with most of your post it is important to understand that it wasn't our inept passing game that led to our weak running game which some would like to believe. It was our weak running game that probably cost us a couple of games and should be addressed in the offseason.

Defense's keying on the run opens up the passing game for big plays. Notice all the big passing plays out of Lee Evans this year?

That won't happen next year.

[HHURRICANE]

Defense's keying on the run opens up the passing game for big plays. Notice all the big passing plays out of Lee Evans this year?

That won't happen next year.

I appreciate your opinion. However, I don't see any evidence that this was the case, especially late in the season when McGahee was downright terrible.

[TacklingDummy]

I appreciate your opinion. However, I don't see any evidence that this was the case, especially late in the season when McGahee was downright terrible.

He was terrible because teams were playing their safties up trying to stop the run and to force the Bills to beat them by the pass.

I can't recall how many times Evans juked a CB out of his underwear with the CB getting no help from the safties.

[YardRat]

You'd have to analyze all the game films to make an accurate assessment by determining how opposing defenses actually played against the Bills, but it's my perception that the book on the Bills pretty much all year was stop the run and make JP beat you with his arm.

[HHURRICANE]

You'd have to analyze all the game films to make an accurate assessment by determining how opposing defenses actually played against the Bills, but it's my perception that the book on the Bills pretty much all year was stop the run and make JP beat you with his arm.

Well my guess is that the Dick Jauron and his staff have seen enough game film to figure out that Willis is not that good. I haven't heard anything to positive coming out of OBD. And when the owner is calling you a "disappointment" it's safe to say that he's heard a little from the front office.

[HHURRICANE]

He was terrible because teams were playing their safties up trying to stop the run and to force the Bills to beat them by the pass.

I can't recall how many times Evans juked a CB out of his underwear with the CB getting no help from the safties.

Hey, we both agree that he was "terrible".

[YardRat]

Well my guess is that the Dick Jauron and his staff have seen enough game film to figure out that Willis is not that good. I haven't heard anything to positive coming out of OBD. And when the owner is calling you a "disappointment" it's safe to say that he's heard a little from the front office.

I'm thinking both will do better next year.

[HHURRICANE]

I'm thinking both will do better next year.

I actually agree with you here. JP will have free reign of the offense next year. Our OL will be better and if Willis is still here he will the benefactor of both situations.

I still think McGahee underperformed and I like addressing it now while we can still get something for him. Just my opinion.

[OpIv37]

why does it have to be Losman or McGahee? At times, Losman was the problem. McGahee consistently underperformed. But we also lacked performance at TE, at WR (behind Evans), on the OL and especially on the DL. This team still has quite a few holes and I think it's oversimplifying to try to pin the offense's on just McGahee and/or Losman.

[jmb1099]

Defense's keying on the run opens up the passing game for big plays. Notice all the big passing plays out of Lee Evans this year?

That won't happen next year.
Especially since everyone knows WM is underachieving. Thanks for clearing that up :)

[jmb1099]

why does it have to be Losman or McGahee? At times, Losman was the problem. McGahee consistently underperformed. But we also lacked performance at TE, at WR (behind Evans), on the OL and especially on the DL. This team still has quite a few holes and I think it's oversimplifying to try to pin the offense's on just McGahee and/or Losman.
Agreed.
It truly was a growing pains year with new systems etc. Between anticipated oline improvements, experience, and contract years, the offense should be decent this year.

[jamze132]

I hope that either McGahee runs like he did at The "U" or we get someone in here who can.

[RockStar36]

For those who think Losman is the issue and not McGahee:

Out of the top 11 QB's only 3 didn't make the playoffs: Palmer, Bulgar and Losman.

Out of the top 11 QB's only 2 didn't have a running back to rush for over 1,000 yards: Pennington and Losman. Sidenote : Brady had 2 RB's that ran for about 800 yards each so I didn't count him.

Pennington was 11th and had the worst rushing attack. Losman was 10th and had the 2nd worst rushing attack.

Blame the OL all you want but McGahee is a true under performer. After looking at these stats I really believe RB is more important to this team than CB.

I'm going to try and state this in the most simple terms as I can because I'm getting tired of discussing Willis.

He missed two games with an injury.

He finished the season with 990 yards.

Those 10 yards were not the difference in the Bills making/missing the playoffs.

If you would like further proof, here it is. He finished the previous two seasons with 1247 and 1128. They didn't make the playoffs those two years either.

Next.

[OpIv37]

I'm going to try and state this in the most simple terms as I can because I'm getting tired of discussing Willis.

He missed two games with an injury.

He finished the season with 990 yards.

Those 10 yards were not the difference in the Bills making/missing the playoffs.

If you would like further proof, here it is. He finished the previous two seasons with 1247 and 1128. They didn't make the playoffs those two years either.

Next.
1000/14= 71 and change. To get 1000 yards, all McGahee would have had to do was average 72 yards a game. Hell, he had 275 yards just against the Jets- that means he'd only have to average 61 yards a game against teams that AREN'T the NYJ to get 1000.

And he couldn't even do that.

Now, like I already said, this team had a lot of problems this year and Losman and McGahee alone cannot fully explain why we didn't make the playoffs. But McGahee's performance was nothing short of horrendous in 2006. There's no way around it.

[mayotm]

Losman was the sole reason the Bills didn't make the playoffs this year. They won't make the playoffs as long as Losman is the QB. Losman is the worst QB in NFL history. Losman sucks!

Signed,

TacklingDummy and Saburzfan

[RockStar36]

1000/14= 71 and change. To get 1000 yards, all McGahee would have had to do was average 72 yards a game. Hell, he had 275 yards just against the Jets- that means he'd only have to average 61 yards a game against teams that AREN'T the NYJ to get 1000.

And he couldn't even do that.

Now, like I already said, this team had a lot of problems this year and Losman and McGahee alone cannot fully explain why we didn't make the playoffs. But McGahee's performance was nothing short of horrendous in 2006. There's no way around it.

I agree. He sucked this year. But he isn't the sole reason they didn't make the playoffs. I'm getting tired of the threads that are basically saying "McGahee needs to go, he is the reason they lost all those games" over and over again.

[kernowboy]

I agree with the guys who are fed up discussing the Willis issue but I think it comes down to two issues

1) JP actually performed more effectively than most people expected, including myself, and progressed as the season went along, showing the ability and intangibles that had only previously been hinted at

Willis however, regressed. Added to the fact of his incessant boasting that his performances have not merited, he gives the perception of a dislike of Buffalo, and he was just downright awful in some games.

2) there is a concern that he will still try to hold out in the offseason due to his attitude and the record of his agent, which cannot be anything but disruptive on a young team who have actually given fans hope that the Bills can finally return to the exalted heights by a sustained building of a good team, not expensive flash signings and poor quality bandaids elsewhere.

I would like us to retain McGahee for the 2007 season. Whilst not the sharpest tool in the box, even he will get the idea that he needs a big season to get any sort of big contract in 2008 and beyond. We do not re-do his contract but agree not to tag him at the end of the 2007 season. If we trade him now, I doubt we'd get more than a R3. Even if we let him go at the end of next season, the next season has a number of riches at RB, and we could easily draft his replacement to start as a rookie with no problem at all.

Why create a need when we don't have to?

[TacklingDummy]

Losman was the sole reason the Bills didn't make the playoffs this year. They won't make the playoffs as long as Losman is the QB. Losman is the worst QB in NFL history. Losman sucks!

Signed,

TacklingDummy and Saburzfan


He wasn't the "sole" reason. He was just the "main" reason.

[kernowboy]

He wasn't the "sole" reason. He was just the "main" reason.

Losman has progressed as the season has gone on, McGahee has regressed - I would rather have players working hard and creeping forward than those who shoot off their mouths while sliding backwards

[SABURZFAN]

For those who think Losman is the issue and not McGahee:

Out of the top 11 QB's only 3 didn't make the playoffs: Palmer, Bulgar and Losman.

Out of the top 11 QB's only 2 didn't have a running back to rush for over 1,000 yards: Pennington and Losman. Sidenote : Brady had 2 RB's that ran for about 800 yards each so I didn't count him.

Pennington was 11th and had the worst rushing attack. Losman was 10th and had the 2nd worst rushing attack.

Blame the OL all you want but McGahee is a true under performer. After looking at these stats I really believe RB is more important to this team than CB.



LOSMAN SUCKS!!!!!!!!!!!!PERIOD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[SABURZFAN]

Losman was the sole reason the Bills didn't make the playoffs this year. They won't make the playoffs as long as Losman is the QB. Losman is the worst QB in NFL history. Losman sucks!

Signed,

TacklingDummy and Saburzfan



OK DEVIN!!!!!!!!you want to play big shot moderator.here's your chance. :rolleyes:

[HHURRICANE]

LOSMAN SUCKS!!!!!!!!!!!!PERIOD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I would like to know the stats that Losman would have to obtain in 2007 not to suck in your mind?

[kernowboy]

I would like to know the stats that Losman would have to obtain in 2007 not to suck in your mind?

don't hold your breath for a coherent answer

[Philagape]

11th in passing YPA.

27th in rushing YPA.

That cannot be explained away with excuses.

[TacklingDummy]

11th in passing YPA.

27th in rushing YPA.

That cannot be explained away with excuses.

It all ready has. :deadhorse:

[Bling]

11th in passing YPA.

27th in rushing YPA.

That cannot be explained away with excuses.

YPA is such a useless stat when it comes to QB's. The best way to measure a QB is how often the coach puts the ball in his hands.

[B-DON]

what a terrible thread

[Throne Logic]

If he stays, then I guess they see some sort of value in him . . .
Jon

Either that or they decide that of all the available options, keeping Willis makes the most sense. I don't see them just cutting Willis for nothing in return. Even a 4th round pick would be something. But even that may not be offered.

[wbat27]

Rock star i don't get your point, we need a playmaker at rb