A new WR in Free Agency?

[kernowboy]

"It turns out the Falcons' trade for Ashley Lelie will be a one-year deal. FOXSports.com has learned that Lelie voided his contract on Friday and is now scheduled to become an unrestricted free agent. He had play-time incentives that allowed him to void the final year remaining on his contract. That makes him the top free agent wide out on the open market."

Now for me this is extremely interesting news. He fell out with Shanahan in Denver but I believe that was because he wanted to be a starter. Well we need a starter at No2 and lets be frank these are interesting stats

Esperience: 50 out of 79 games started
Height: 6ft3
Weight: 200lbs+
Career Avg per catch: 18 yds
Age: 26
Character issues: He got very angry when Denver were linked with TO and then traded for Walker meaning he had little chance of starting. So what, so would I considering the peformance below

In his last starting season he averaged 18.3yds for 770yds off 42 catches. The year before he was 54 catches at 1084yds avg 20yds per catch

Pick up this guy and WR becomes a non issue in the draft.

[RedEyE]

Lelie would be a damn good pickup and a huge boost in talent over Price. I just don't think the Bills would be remotely interested.

[Forward_Lateral]

He's a head case, and a locker room cancer. No thanks.

[kernowboy]

Funny enough, that can be said of a lot of players it seems

[Philagape]

Um, no.

What he did in his best season doesn't mean much when his best season was in 2004. I'm not impressed at what someone did when he WAS a starter, because at that means at some point he was no longer a starter, and that's what gets my attention.

This season in Atlanta he did less than Michael Jenkins and Roddy White. :ill:

He'd be another Andre Davis. Or at best, Peerless Price. We don't need yet another No. 3 WR.

[ParanoidAndroid]

Pass.

[Don't Panic]

No thanks... we need a difference maker, not a proven pain in the *ss.

[kernowboy]

What are people's problems with Lelie.

Firstly he did less than White and Jenkins in Atlanta. He came in at the last moment compared to vets who already knew the play book. Here's some information:

White 50 catches 506 yds 16.9yds average 0 TDs
Jenkins 39 catches 436 yds 11.2yds average 7 TDs
Lelie 28 catches 430yds 15.4yds average 1 TDs

I can see how he was massively poorer than Jenkins and White (sarcasm)

"A proven pain in the ass, a cancer, a head case ... evidence please!?!?"

I have done a google search and there is no hint of legal problems. He had a fit of pique where after finally becoming a starter beating out McCaffery and having two decent seasons, he gets demoted back to 3rd receiver after the Broncos sniff around Owens and trade for Walker.

He is not the first player to fall out with a coach/team and demand a trade or refuse to resign. Names that spring to mind .. well at the top of list might be Terrell Pwens, John Elway, Takeo Spikes etc. I am sure there are many more.

However should be waste a R1 choice on a similar sized WR like Jarrett who is much slower and has never played a single pro game when we have other pressing needs?

We seem happy to advocate the signing of players who are spouse beaters, accused of sexual assault, and a whole multitude of other sins and not sign a player who has a 1000yds season, a great average per catch and whose principle crime was to get very pissed when he was demoted after having had a decent season. Pass on players like Lelie who fill a need and are clearly capable of doing so and we deserve not to get to the playoffs or beyond

[THATHURMANATOR]

I wouldn't mind him being brought in at all!

[clumping platelets]

No thanks....................how about Jerry Porter?

[kernowboy]

Yes, lets not bring in a player who got over angry because he lost his starting place maybe unjustly - lets stick to players who seem to not to care about playing and just want to grab their pay cheque.

[Ron Burgundy]

Lelie didn't start because he drops passes and he's a one-trick pony.

He can run really fast down the field and snag a deep one every once in awhile. But he's a poor route-runner and a bit of a slacker, and has been riding the fact that he's got wheels since he got into the league from Hawaii. And while it's obvious that he dislikes going over the middle, there've been rumors that he actually refuses to do it.

He got pissed 'cause Denver told him how it was, then left for Atlanta, and now they've found out what type of receiver Lelie is. But he's tall and fast as ****, so some other team will be stupid enough to take a shot at him.

Let's just hope it's not Buffalo.

[kernowboy]

Lelie didn't start because he drops passes and he's a one-trick pony.

He can run really fast down the field and snag a deep one every once in awhile. But he's a poor route-runner and a bit of a slacker, and has been riding the fact that he's got wheels since he got into the league from Hawaii. And while it's obvious that he dislikes going over the middle, there've been rumors that he actually refuses to do it.

He got pissed 'cause Denver told him how it was, then left for Atlanta, and now they've found out what type of receiver Lelie is. But he's tall and fast as ****, so some other team will be stupid enough to take a shot at him.

Let's just hope it's not Buffalo.

The Sporting News say

"Possesses excellent ball skills and sure hands. Makes a lot of plays and runs crisp routes. Has a long stride and can really fly when he gets going. Scrappy blocker."

To drop the ball, you've had to have been in the area to catch it. In Atlanta he had 6yds less than Jenkins on 11 fewer catches, and 76yds less than White on 22 fewer catches.

Obviously a complete waste of space !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Ron Burgundy]

The Sporting News say

"Possesses excellent ball skills and sure hands. Makes a lot of plays and runs crisp routes. Has a long stride and can really fly when he gets going. Scrappy blocker."


Can I get a link on that? It sounds like his draft profile or a let's-pimp-fantasy-football report.


To drop the ball, you've had to have been in the area to catch it. In Atlanta he had 6yds less than Jenkins on 11 fewer catches, and 76yds less than White on 22 fewer catches.

Wow, he's about as good as Michael Jenkins and Roddy White!

Comparing **** to **** to ****? It just means you're gonna end up with ****.


Obviously a complete waste of space !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

He's not a complete waste of space. He can run real fast and catch a deep pass.

But there's a reason a 6'3", sub-4.4 guy is about to go on his third team in three years. He's not a complete player. He's yet another slot option and we have too many of those already.

[Philagape]

Firstly he did less than White and Jenkins in Atlanta. He came in at the last moment compared to vets who already knew the play book. Here's some information:

White 50 catches 506 yds 16.9yds average 0 TDs
Jenkins 39 catches 436 yds 11.2yds average 7 TDs
Lelie 28 catches 430yds 15.4yds average 1 TDs

I can see how he was massively poorer than Jenkins and White (sarcasm)


Did I say massively? Does it have to be massively when we're talking about Michael Jenkins and Roddy White? :ill:

And your excuse for catching 28 passes in 15 games is he didn't learn the playbook? :ill:

What I don't understand about pleas to sign players who lost starting jobs ... does it ever occur to people to wonder why they lost their starting jobs? If Lelie is so great, why did Denver trade for a WR? Maybe it's because he's a one-dimensional track star? Maybe because of all his drops? Maybe because he's a one-season wonder, like so many others? Guess who else once had a 1,000-yard season? Peerless Price!

[kernowboy]

Can I get a link on that? It sounds like his draft profile or a let's-pimp-fantasy-football report.



Wow, he's about as good as Michael Jenkins and Roddy White!

Comparing **** to **** to ****? It just means you're gonna end up with ****.



He's not a complete waste of space. He can run real fast and catch a deep pass.

But there's a reason a 6'3", sub-4.4 guy is about to go on his third team in three years. He's not a complete player. He's yet another slot option and we have too many of those already.

http://www.tsn.ca/nfl/teams/players/bio/?id=4478&hubname=nfl-falcons

I seem to recall a certain Travis Henry being called a cancer because he demanded a trade ... I wonder now if it was the wrong player was traded.

Often when a player is traded, they accept the trade because they simply want out. The team will only trade to someone who will provide compensation so the only thing the player can do is make sure that with the new team he has certain terms written into his contract to make sure he doesn't get shackled with a 2nd team who he only accepted to get away from the first place. He can quickly become a free agent and move on. It is merely a sign of the times, and we shouldn't be foolish to pass up players who have been traded and have made sure they don't get stuck in a second undesirable location.

He and his agent have been intelligent. He are critising him for being intelligent?

And are Lelie, White and Jenkins look poor because they play with a crappy passing QB. I imagine their figures would be significantly better with Schuab behind scrimmage

[chernobylwraiths]

The Sporting News say

"Possesses excellent ball skills and sure hands. Makes a lot of plays and runs crisp routes. Has a long stride and can really fly when he gets going. Scrappy blocker."

That sounds a lot like Josh Reed's profile, except for the fly part. :snicker:

[ParanoidAndroid]

You mean Mikey Schwab from South Buffalo, or Matt Schaub of the Atlanta Falcons? :D

[Ingtar33]

I won money betting on how long it would take Lelee to sprain something in his legs, causing him to miss a full game or more, when he came out of college.

I bet it would take less then 10 games.

I think it took 2 (hammy)

Lelee is a sprinter, not a football player, and his durability will always be an issue. He's neither dependable, nor can he work off press coverage well.

i think of one word when i think of Lelee... "soft"

[kernowboy]

Did I say massively? Does it have to be massively when we're talking about Michael Jenkins and Roddy White? :ill:

And your excuse for catching 28 passes in 15 games is he didn't learn the playbook? :ill:

What I don't understand about pleas to sign players who lost starting jobs ... does it ever occur to people to wonder why they lost their starting jobs? If Lelie is so great, why did Denver trade for a WR? Maybe it's because he's a one-dimensional track star? Maybe because of all his drops? Maybe because he's a one-season wonder, like so many others? Guess who else once had a 1,000-yard season? Peerless Price!

Maybe you should have said that he did less than White and Jenkins but that 'less' amounted to 76yds and 6 yds respectively despite catching a total of 33 fewer throws.

And with the larger cap space for most teams, we are unlikely to sign starters so we may have to look at former starters. Starters loose their starting positions for a whole number of reasons ... not all of them are performance related, and it could be that Walker would only accept the Broncos trade with a guaranteed starting spot. If they like Walker more because he is a better blocker then Lelie is the odd man out.

Just because someone loses the starting job elsewhere does not automatically mean they can't be a great starter here. And a big target who can flat out fly (bigger than anything we currently have) added to Evans deep speed and JPs howtizer arm could cause opposing coordinators sleepless nights.

He's an upgrade which doesn't cost a pick. He's the size of Jarrett, the speed of Ginn. Surely he must warrant a serious look?

[Ron Burgundy]

http://www.tsn.ca/nfl/teams/players/bio/?id=4478&hubname=nfl-falcons

I seem to recall a certain Travis Henry being called a cancer because he demanded a trade ... I wonder now if it was the wrong player was traded.

Often when a player is traded, they accept the trade because they simply want out. The team will only trade to someone who will provide compensation so the only thing the player can do is make sure that with the new team he has certain terms written into his contract to make sure he doesn't get shackled with a 2nd team who he only accepted to get away from the first place. He can quickly become a free agent and move on. It is merely a sign of the times, and we shouldn't be foolish to pass up players who have been traded and have made sure they don't get stuck in a second undesirable location.

He and his agent have been intelligent. He are critising him for being intelligent?

And are Lelie, White and Jenkins look poor because they play with a crappy passing QB. I imagine their figures would be significantly better with Schwab behind scrimmage

Yeah, that's what I thought...a scouting report.

Travis Henry never had a problem with effort or production. Sure, he had some fumbling issues, and he liked to tag underaged girls at gas stations, but he was a good player and a hard worker who had a player drafted at his position directly after he had a career year in Buffalo. Not the same situation at all.

I'm not criticizing this player or his agent over their intelligence, I'm criticizing Ashlie Lelie for his skillset, and explaining why the Bills would not want to spend money or waste time on such a limited player.

For the record, I don't mind White, he's got potential. But Jenkins and Lelie are just non-hackers.

[RedEyE]

All of Atlanta receivers were having issues holding onto the ball this year. Lelie shows great promise and might be the big receiver the Bills need pushing across the middle as well as a lure for Evans on break aways.

Heres the thing, however. Lelie wants an opportunity to become THE receiver where ever he lands. Now, that opportunity never presented itself in Denver, and Atlanta just does not posses the passing game for that to come into fruition. And Buffalo isn't any more tempting then Atlanta or Denver. Yes the Bills have a QB that can sling the ball downfield, but Lee Evans is the "go to" guy for the Bills. That's not going to change and that's not what Lelie and his agent are after.

The Bills have more pressing issues at hand then over filling the receiving squad again this year. And I don't like players that try prying their way into winning situations, which it precisely appears what Lelie has been attempting to do with his career. He and his agent have positioned himself to sign a high dollar deal with a team desperate for his services. That's not Buffalo, the two are not a match in the very least. I can see him signing with the Pats, or Eagles though.

[Philagape]

Maybe you should have said that he did less than White and Jenkins but that 'less' amounted to 76yds and 6 yds respectively despite catching a total of 33 fewer throws.

You're totally missing the point ... If Lelie is the savior you're making him out to be, shouldn't he do way better than mediocre scrubs?


Starters loose their starting positions for a whole number of reasons ...

The most common reason is deserving it. Prove he lost his otherwise.


and it could be that Walker would only accept the Broncos trade with a guaranteed starting spot. If they like Walker more because he is a better blocker then Lelie is the odd man out.

And he's a WAY better receiver. Why did Denver want to trade for a WR in the first place?


Just because someone loses the starting job elsewhere does not automatically mean they can't be a great starter here. And a big target who can flat out fly (bigger than anything we currently have) added to Evans deep speed and JPs howtizer arm could cause opposing coordinators sleepless nights.

"Does not automatically mean he can't be." Wow, that's convincing.


He's an upgrade which doesn't cost a pick. He's the size of Jarrett, the speed of Ginn. Surely he must warrant a serious look?

Then why in his career has he averaged 39 catches, 687 yards and 2.6 TDs? That's not an upgrade. I'm tired of hearing hype about physical attributes. All that matters is production, and Lelie's been a disappointment for most of his career. All I'm doing is, instead of dreaming about what he could do, presenting the reality of what he has done. Whatever his strengths are, he's been defined by his weaknesses. He's a journeyman, like the two we signed last year.

[kernowboy]

I'm not saying he's a saviour

I am saying he's an upgrade.

He's offering both size and speed.

Everyone's getting excited about Dwayne Jarrett at No12, but with Lelie in FA, he is a truly wasted pick especilly with his 4.6 time

How many camps did Rod Smith go through before he was given a proper chance?

[The last buffalo fan]

My big buddy from Denver, once told me when we were playing the Broncos, "Why do you like Ashlie somuch, he is a tool". He is a big time Bronco fan.

[Ron Burgundy]

My big buddy from Denver, once told me when we were playing the Broncos, "Why do you like Ashlie somuch, he is a tool". He is a big time Bronco fan.

Word, I've got a friend who likes the Broncos who *****ed about him all the time, too.

Somewhere, on other message boards, people are having discussions just like this about Chris Kelsay.

[Luisito23]

I didn't even know Lellie played anymore.....





GO BILLS!!!!!!!!

[TigerJ]

I might put out a feeler or two.

[camelcowboy]

I'm not saying he's a saviour

I am saying he's an upgrade.

He's offering both size and speed.

Everyone's getting excited about Dwayne Jarrett at No12, but with Lelie in FA, he is a truly wasted pick especilly with his 4.6 time

How many camps did Rod Smith go through before he was given a proper chance?

Im glad someone in the world likes Lelie, tell me the truth you his mom aren't you?

[Throne Logic]

Regardless of what he did or didn't do, I am concerned about one simple fact. He's gone through two teams in the past two years. What exactly is this guy's problem?

[LifetimeBillsFan]

....Just because someone loses the starting job elsewhere does not automatically mean they can't be a great starter here. And a big target who can flat out fly (bigger than anything we currently have) added to Evans deep speed and JPs howtizer arm could cause opposing coordinators sleepless nights.

He's an upgrade which doesn't cost a pick. He's the size of Jarrett, the speed of Ginn. Surely he must warrant a serious look?

Yet, despite that, he has yet to make an impact in the NFL, even though he has played on two different teams with different offensive systems. There has to be a reason why, even though he has all of that size and speed, he has never been able to establish himself as anything more than a so-so 2nd WR at best. So, how can you say that he would necessarily be an upgrade when Price's career number and some of his seasonal numbers are better than Lelie's? No thanks!

I'd rather see the money that it would take to sign Lelie spent elsewhere. If the Bills want to try to upgrade their # 2 WR spot, I would rather they use their # 3 or # 4 pick on a receiver like Paul Williams, Dallas Baker or Johnny Lee Higgins, etc. or a later pick on someone like Jacoby Jones or David Ball, etc.

[Bert102176]

he stinks and can't catch for his life

[PECKERWOOD]

He would be an upgrade over Peerless Price that's for sure. With that said, it would be foolish not to atleast bring him in and try to understand his intentions. If Ashley Lelie understands that we already have our man in Lee Evans and that he isn't going anywhere, then I would have absolutely no problem with bringing him in. Hell, in the end Lelie could probably learn a couple of things from Peerless in the sense that he should not go out and try to perform as a #1 WR when he is clearly a gifted #2, that's a good way to destroy your career! Even with all this bullcrap I just typed up, if we don't get a #2 in draft or via FA, I don't care. I feel like Peerless Price is really going to turn up the heat this upcoming season, if given the chance to.

[kernowboy]

Regardless of what he did or didn't do, I am concerned about one simple fact. He's gone through two teams in the past two years. What exactly is this guy's problem?

As I mentioned earlier, he so wanted out of Denver he accepted a trade anywhere. However like a lot of intelligent traded players, he made sure that he was in a position where come the end of the season to go to a team of his choice not the one Denver chose because they'd get compensation.

Its the same with TJ Duckett and Pat Ramsay. You accept a trade because you want out, but you accept the deal if its in your interests as well as your former team, i.e. getting released at the first off season to scout around for a team that will be in your best interests.

I'm shocked people are making such a big deal of it. For me it strikes as intelligent agent work and common sense

And lets not forget, football players can be intelligent and as they grow older often they mature, so once where they had heightened expectations, they now accept a decent role on a team willing to give them an opportunity and is moving forward.

[Night Train]

Peerless Price lite. No thanks.

We need a disciplned route runner with size and good hands. One who will go over the middle and find open space when his QB is scrambling.

[kernowboy]

So who then?

A slow unproven in the pro game rookie ... Dwayne Jarrett who will cost a high pick when we have other needs. For every Marvin Harrison there is a Travis Taylor - actually he could be worth a look?

A guy who lacks the physical intangibles but has done well in one system and will cost a hell of a lot .. Drew Bennett

Looking at the Free Agency class, there is not a lot out there.

We get a guy with the physical intangibles in and see if we can gain an improvement .. IT IS CALLED COACHING .. its what we pay coordinators to do.

If we fail, so what, there are big receivers coming out in 2008 - Bowman and Floyd etc who have size but also something Jarrett doesn't have .. speed.

[Kerr]

It's no big deal. They could bring lelie in to prove his worth in training camp and if doesn't perform, he gets cut. There's no harm in that. It's been done before. Nice suggestion kern. The guy could be good if he wanted to.

[dolphan117]

Boy does this make the Falcons front office look stupid. They gave up a second round pick and gave him a contract that made it possible for him to leave after just one year?!?!? Doh!

[ParanoidAndroid]

I wouldn't waste my time or money on Lelie when there are more pressing needs to fill in FA.
I'd rather take my chances on a rookie, even if he has that "lack of elite speed" knock on him. There are quite a few not so fast receivers out there doing very well because they know how to run routes, get open, and have great hands.
I'm gonna put a tag on Jason Hill as this year's "you're too slow" wide receiver who someone steals in the 3rd or 4th round.

[DraftBoy]

Id put out a feeler but only if he will go over the middle. Thats the biggest thing we need. We have a deep threat (2 if you consider Roscoe as one) we need reliable big target over the middle that can take the pounding. Im not sure Lelie is that.

[Talk0fNewYork]

Id put out a feeler but only if he will go over the middle. Thats the biggest thing we need. We have a deep threat (2 if you consider Roscoe as one) we need reliable big target over the middle that can take the pounding. Im not sure Lelie is that.
That's Reed,(besides the big target) and Lelie is just what we need. A big target for jump balls and some one that can go deep when lee is 2x covered.

[DraftBoy]

That's Reed,(besides the big target) and Lelie is just what we need. A big target for jump balls and some one that can go deep when lee is 2x covered.


I disagree, Lee was 2x covered this year and with no real #2 look what he did. We do not need to stretch the field we need an over the middle target Jp will trust and Dick will use (which is what Reed isnt). A Dwayne Jarrett/Marques Colston type of WR would be the ideal. I dont care if he runs 4.65 speed if he can run good routes, make tough catches, get up for the ball (which Lee is good at), and break arm tackles.

For anybody who had to suffer through watching the Falcons this year (raises hand) you know Ashley Lelie was nowhere near the price Atlanta payed for him.