Has Tampa Bay went Crazy?

[patmoran2006]

Buccaneers | Team officials to meet with Grant
Fri, 16 Mar 2007 11:56:31 -0700
<A href="http://www.kffl.com/link/17">Len Pasquarelli, of ESPN.com (http://www.kffl.com/link/9), reports team officials of the Tampa Bay Buccaneers (http://www.kffl.com/team/35/nfl) will meet Friday, March 16, with New Orleans Saints (http://www.kffl.com/team/25/nfl) DE Charles Grant (http://www.kffl.com/player/1215/nfl), who was scheduled to become an unrestricted free agent this offseason but was given the team's franchise tag instead. Players designated with the franchise tag can still negotiate with other teams, but the original team reserves the right to match any offer the player receives or get two first-round picks as compensation for losing the player. Since the Buccaneers (http://www.kffl.com/team/35/nfl) have the No. 4 overall pick in the 2007 NFL Draft (http://www.kffl.com/link/159), the compensation for acquiring Grant would be very costly for the team.


what are they ****ing insane? They're going to give up a crack at Calvin Johnson, JOe Thomas or Gaines Adams PLUS another number one pick to sign charles grant?

THat's gotta be some kind of joke.

[camelcowboy]

That broke yesterday they would probally try to work out a trade, but i can't see the saints letting him go without receiving a number 1 pick at least.

[patmoran2006]

If Grant would be worth the 4th pick in a trade I'd hate to see what Chicago would want for Lance Briggs.

[Jan Reimers]

No, but it appears that they have GONE crazy.

Just a little correction from the grammar police.

[gr8slayer]

Already posted.

[patmoran2006]

LOL.. is this English class?

I'm on my fourth glass of Jamieson (if that's spelled correctly)

[gr8slayer]

http://www.billszone.com/fanzone/showthread.php?t=122398

[MDFINFAN]

I can't see this trade even being thought of..TB must have some other plan in mind..

[gr8slayer]

You always ask for more than you think your product is worth. NO must be looking for a second this year and a third or forth next or something.

[THATHURMANATOR]

If Grant would be worth the 4th pick in a trade I'd hate to see what Chicago would want for Lance Briggs.
good point

[THATHURMANATOR]

The funny thing is that Kelsey and Grant had pretty much the same season and Kelsey is younger, but Marv WAYYY Overpaid..... :ill:

[justasportsfan]

The funny thing is that Kelsey and Grant had pretty much the same season and Kelsey is younger, but Marv WAYYY Overpaid..... :ill:

good point.

[THATHURMANATOR]

good point.
I am sure Pat will see it in a different light...

[patmoran2006]

Anybody who is stupid enough to compare Kelsay to Grant favorably, isnt worth a response too.

Homerism reigns supreme.

[The last buffalo fan]

Anybody who is stupid enough to compare Kelsay to Grant favorably, isnt worth a response too.

Homerism reigns supreme.

Comments like this, makes a guy look smart or stupid.

[casdhf]

A mexican will never be Admin here.

[THATHURMANATOR]

Anybody who is stupid enough to compare Kelsay to Grant favorably, isnt worth a response too.

Homerism reigns supreme.
Well if we are comparing Stats they are are pretty much exact. What else should we compare? I usually like to compare their accomplishments on the field. Maybe you want to compare Grant and Kelseys Chess games. I heard Grant is out of this world and uses the rook like no other.... Why don't you stop licking Grant's nutsack.

I think we all would agree that we would rather have Grant over Kelsey.

I think it is also fair to say that Grant is getting paid A LOT more than Kelsey is this year.

I think it is also fair to say that the two players had almost identical stats last season.

I think it is also fair to say Kelsey is younger.

I think it is also fair to say that Grant was on a better overall defense and had more help overall.

Again Grant is the better player of course but don't question my mental capacity because I compared identical stat lines.

[X-Era]

Buccaneers | Team officials to meet with Grant
Fri, 16 Mar 2007 11:56:31 -0700
Len Pasquarelli, of (http://www.kffl.com/link/17)ESPN.com (http://www.kffl.com/link/9), reports team officials of the Tampa Bay Buccaneers (http://www.kffl.com/team/35/nfl) will meet Friday, March 16, with New Orleans Saints (http://www.kffl.com/team/25/nfl) DE Charles Grant (http://www.kffl.com/player/1215/nfl), who was scheduled to become an unrestricted free agent this offseason but was given the team's franchise tag instead. Players designated with the franchise tag can still negotiate with other teams, but the original team reserves the right to match any offer the player receives or get two first-round picks as compensation for losing the player. Since the Buccaneers (http://www.kffl.com/team/35/nfl) have the No. 4 overall pick in the 2007 NFL Draft (http://www.kffl.com/link/159), the compensation for acquiring Grant would be very costly for the team.


what are they ****ing insane? They're going to give up a crack at Calvin Johnson, JOe Thomas or Gaines Adams PLUS another number one pick to sign charles grant?

THat's gotta be some kind of joke.

The franchise tag just gives the owning team negotiating rights. Teams can trade for anything they want.

NO will fess Grant for a HELLUVA lot less than the 4th pick, maybe more like a 3rd rounder. Grant is a very solid, good player. But hes not a household name.

[patmoran2006]

When I see Kelsay getting compared favorably to Grant, that's when it goes from homerism and just gets plain ******ed.

Find me a Gm, a scout or coach in this league who will even use Kelsay and Grant in the same sentence. Grant is a franchise worthy DE. Kelsay is an average DE who cant stop the run to save his life.

Please.. next topic

[X-Era]

A mexican will never be Admin here.

??????????

Wow, just wow.

I hope this is a joke.

[patmoran2006]

Well if we are comparing Stats they are are pretty much exact. What else should we compare? I usually like to compare their accomplishments on the field. Maybe you want to compare Grant and Kelseys Chess games. I heard Grant is out of this world and uses the rook like no other.... Why don't you stop licking Grant's nutsack.

I think we all would agree that we would rather have Grant over Kelsey.

I think it is also fair to say that Grant is getting paid A LOT more than Kelsey is this year.

I think it is also fair to say that the two players had almost identical stats last season.

I think it is also fair to say Kelsey is younger.

I think it is also fair to say that Grant was on a better overall defense and had more help overall.

Again Grant is the better player of course but don't question my mental capacity because I compared identical stat lines.
actualy, i was referring more to Justa than you.. and I wasnt implying that YOU'RE a ******.. But it's ******ed to compare Grant and Kelsay based on stats.

If you want to use stats, was Willis McGahee the BEST RB in the NFL at the bye last year? Well, he was the leading rusher, so does that make him the best?

Kelsay is only arguably the second best DE on his own team, a team with a poor defense to begin with.

[THATHURMANATOR]

When I see Kelsay getting compared favorably to Grant, that's when it goes from homerism and just gets plain ******ed.

Find me a Gm, a scout or coach in this league who will even use Kelsay and Grant in the same sentence. Grant is a franchise worthy DE. Kelsay is an average DE who cant stop the run to save his life.

Please.. next topic
You are the king of not reading posts correctly and then veering of topic into some kind of dreamworld. I mentioned they had the same stat line which there is 0 argument against since they did.

Yes lets change topics to one of you whiny ***** threads about how the Bills have no chance this year.

[THATHURMANATOR]

actualy, i was referring more to Justa than you.. and I wasnt implying that YOU'RE a ******.. But it's ******ed to compare Grant and Kelsay based on stats.

If you want to use stats, was Willis McGahee the BEST RB in the NFL at the bye last year? Well, he was the leading rusher, so does that make him the best?

Kelsay is only arguably the second best DE on his own team, a team with a poor defense to begin with.
No it certainly doesn't make him the best but it shows that he has some kind of ability and in a market where salaries where skyrocketing Kelsey's contract wasn't insane. I am not even a huge Kelsey fan but it needs to be pointed out.

[patmoran2006]

Kelsay is a turd compared to Grant, and they shouldnt even be mentioned in the same sentence.

[X-Era]

No it certainly doesn't make him the best but it shows that he has some kind of ability and in a market where salaries where skyrocketing Kelsey's contract wasn't insane. I am not even a huge Kelsey fan but it needs to be pointed out.

I like the resigning and predicted it from day one. Hes a good player with upside. Is his contract too much? I dont know. Id rather pay for what you can do for me in the future than what you've done in the past. See Bruce Smith's contract with the Redskins.

[justasportsfan]

Well if we are comparing Stats they are are pretty much exact. What else should we compare? I usually like to compare their accomplishments on the field. Maybe you want to compare Grant and Kelseys Chess games. I heard Grant is out of this world and uses the rook like no other.... Why don't you stop licking Grant's nutsack.

I think we all would agree that we would rather have Grant over Kelsey.

I think it is also fair to say that Grant is getting paid A LOT more than Kelsey is this year.

I think it is also fair to say that the two players had almost identical stats last season.

I think it is also fair to say Kelsey is younger.

I think it is also fair to say that Grant was on a better overall defense and had more help overall.

Again Grant is the better player of course but don't question my mental capacity because I compared identical stat lines.


good point

[justasportsfan]

You are the king of not reading posts correctly and then veering of topic into some kind of dreamworld. I mentioned they had the same stat line which there is 0 argument against since they did.

Yes lets change topics to one of you whiny ***** threads about how the Bills have no chance this year.
good point.

[patmoran2006]

I like the resigning and predicted it from day one. Hes a good player with upside. Is his contract too much? I dont know. Id rather pay for what you can do for me in the future than what you've done in the past. See Bruce Smith's contract with the Redskins.
how many years does a player play in the NFL before the word "upside" goes away?

Rookies, 2nd year, even third year players I could see.. But your saying that a guy going into what, year five still has upside. He's been starting for three years now.. When is this "upside" going to kick in so he can be something more than an average, dime a dozen DE?

[X-Era]

how many years does a player play in the NFL before the word "upside" goes away?

Rookies, 2nd year, even third year players I could see.. But your saying that a guy going into what, year five still has upside. He's been starting for three years now.. When is this "upside" going to kick in so he can be something more than an average, dime a dozen DE?

Clearly you never had a Phil Hansen jersey. But Id bet Bruce wouldnt have traded him for the world.

[patmoran2006]

That is funny you say that, I DO have a Phil Hansen jersey, and I wear it all the time actually..

Kelsay is no Phil Hansen, I can tell you that.

[X-Era]

That is funny you say that, I DO have a Phil Hansen jersey, and I wear it all the time actually..

Kelsay is no Phil Hansen, I can tell you that.

What exactly seperates the two? Neither was an all-star, both were high motor guys only. Disruptive forces rather than pur pass rushers. I think the similarities are huge to be honest.

<table border="0" cellpadding="0" width="100%"><tbody><tr><td width="50%">Phil Hansen

Phillip Allen Hansen
Position: DE
Height: 6' 5'' Weight: 275
Born: 5/20/1968 (http://www.databasefootball.com/players/playerbdays.htm?mth=5&dy=20), in Ellendale, ND, USA
High School: Oakes (ND)
College: North Dakota State (http://www.databasefootball.com/players/bycollege.htm?sch=North+Dakota+State) </td> <td align="right" valign="top" width="50%"> <!--promotion--> <!-- <table width="350" border=1 cellspacing=0> <tr bgcolor="dddddd"> <td>Visit RotoWire.com (http://www.rotowire.com/football/index.htm) for
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<table class="pt8" border="0" cellpadding="2" cellspacing="0"><tbody><tr><td colspan="5"> </td><td colspan="2" class="title">DEF</td><td class="nul"> </td><td colspan="4" class="title">INTS</td><td class="nul"> </td><td colspan="5" class="title">FUMBLES</td></tr><tr class="statHead"><td class="cen">Year</td><td class="cen">AGE</td><td>Team</td><td class="cen">LG</td><td class="cen">GP</td><td class="cen">SK</td><td class="cen">SFY</td><td class="nul"> </td><td class="cen">INT</td><td class="cen">YDS</td><td class="cen">LNG</td><td class="cen">TD</td><td class="nul"> </td><td class="cen">TOT</td><td class="cen">OWR</td><td class="cen">OPR</td><td class="cen">YDS</td><td class="cen">TD</td></tr><tr class="cl2"><td class="cen">1991</td><td class="cen">23</td><td>BUF (http://www.databasefootball.com/teams/teamyear.htm?tm=BUF&yr=1991&lg=nfl)</td><td class="cen">NFL (http://www.databasefootball.com/leagues/leagueyear.htm?yr=1991&lg=nfl)</td><td class="rht">14</td><td class="rht">2.0</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="nul"> </td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="nul"> </td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">1</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">0</td></tr><tr class="cl1"><td class="cen">1992</td><td class="cen">24</td><td>BUF (http://www.databasefootball.com/teams/teamyear.htm?tm=BUF&yr=1992&lg=nfl)</td><td class="cen">NFL (http://www.databasefootball.com/leagues/leagueyear.htm?yr=1992&lg=nfl)</td><td class="rht">16</td><td class="rht">8.0</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="nul"> </td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="nul"> </td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">0</td></tr><tr class="cl2"><td class="cen">1993</td><td class="cen">25</td><td>BUF (http://www.databasefootball.com/teams/teamyear.htm?tm=BUF&yr=1993&lg=nfl)</td><td class="cen">NFL (http://www.databasefootball.com/leagues/leagueyear.htm?yr=1993&lg=nfl)</td><td class="rht">11</td><td class="rht">3.5</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="nul"> </td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="nul"> </td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">0</td></tr><tr class="cl1"><td class="cen">1994</td><td class="cen">26</td><td>BUF (http://www.databasefootball.com/teams/teamyear.htm?tm=BUF&yr=1994&lg=nfl)</td><td class="cen">NFL (http://www.databasefootball.com/leagues/leagueyear.htm?yr=1994&lg=nfl)</td><td class="rht">16</td><td class="rht">5.5</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="nul"> </td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="nul"> </td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">0</td></tr><tr class="cl2"><td class="cen">1995</td><td class="cen">27</td><td>BUF (http://www.databasefootball.com/teams/teamyear.htm?tm=BUF&yr=1995&lg=nfl)</td><td class="cen">NFL (http://www.databasefootball.com/leagues/leagueyear.htm?yr=1995&lg=nfl)</td><td class="rht">16</td><td class="rht">10.0</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="nul"> </td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="nul"> </td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">1</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">0</td></tr><tr class="cl1"><td class="cen">1996</td><td class="cen">28</td><td>BUF (http://www.databasefootball.com/teams/teamyear.htm?tm=BUF&yr=1996&lg=nfl)</td><td class="cen">NFL (http://www.databasefootball.com/leagues/leagueyear.htm?yr=1996&lg=nfl)</td><td class="rht">16</td><td class="rht">8.0</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="nul"> </td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="nul"> </td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">2</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">0</td></tr><tr class="cl2"><td class="cen">1997</td><td class="cen">29</td><td>BUF (http://www.databasefootball.com/teams/teamyear.htm?tm=BUF&yr=1997&lg=nfl)</td><td class="cen">NFL (http://www.databasefootball.com/leagues/leagueyear.htm?yr=1997&lg=nfl)</td><td class="rht">16</td><td class="rht">6.0</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="nul"> </td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="nul"> </td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">0</td></tr><tr class="cl1"><td class="cen">1998</td><td class="cen">30</td><td>BUF (http://www.databasefootball.com/teams/teamyear.htm?tm=BUF&yr=1998&lg=nfl)</td><td class="cen">NFL (http://www.databasefootball.com/leagues/leagueyear.htm?yr=1998&lg=nfl)</td><td class="rht">15</td><td class="rht">7.5</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="nul"> </td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="nul"> </td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">3</td><td class="rht">13</td><td class="rht">1</td></tr><tr class="cl2"><td class="cen">1999</td><td class="cen">31</td><td>BUF (http://www.databasefootball.com/teams/teamyear.htm?tm=BUF&yr=1999&lg=nfl)</td><td class="cen">NFL (http://www.databasefootball.com/leagues/leagueyear.htm?yr=1999&lg=nfl)</td><td class="rht">14</td><td class="rht">6.0</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="nul"> </td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="nul"> </td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">2</td><td class="rht">24</td><td class="rht">0</td></tr><tr class="cl1"><td class="cen">2000</td><td class="cen">32</td><td>BUF (http://www.databasefootball.com/teams/teamyear.htm?tm=BUF&yr=2000&lg=nfl)</td><td class="cen">NFL (http://www.databasefootball.com/leagues/leagueyear.htm?yr=2000&lg=nfl)</td><td class="rht">10</td><td class="rht">2.0</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="nul"> </td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="nul"> </td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">1</td><td class="rht">29</td><td class="rht">0</td></tr><tr class="cl2"><td class="cen">2001</td><td class="cen">33</td><td>BUF (http://www.databasefootball.com/teams/teamyear.htm?tm=BUF&yr=2001&lg=nfl)</td><td class="cen">NFL (http://www.databasefootball.com/leagues/leagueyear.htm?yr=2001&lg=nfl)</td><td class="rht">12</td><td class="rht">3.0</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="nul"> </td><td class="rht">1</td><td class="rht">17</td><td class="rht">17 </td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="nul"> </td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">0</td></tr><tr><td colspan="3">11 NFL Season Totals</td><td> </td><td class="rht">156</td><td class="rht">61.5</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="nul"> </td><td class="rht">1</td><td class="rht">17</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="nul"> </td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">0</td><td class="rht">10</td><td class="rht">66</td><td class="rht">1</td></tr></tbody></table>
Heres Kelsays:

<table border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" width="100%"><tbody><tr><td colspan="2" class="player"># 90 Chris Kelsay</td> <td rowspan="2" align="right" width="134">http://images.nfl.com/images/helmets/134x121/BUF.gif (http://www.nfl.com/teams/news/BUF)</td> </tr> <tr valign="top"> <td width="70">http://images.nfl.com/images/players/60x80/396007.jpg</td> <td class="playerbio"> Position: DE
Height: 6-4
Weight: 275
Born: 10/31/1979
College: Nebraska
NFL Experience: 5 </td></tr> <tr><td colspan="3" align="right" height="16">http://images.nfl.com/images/teams/275x16/BUF.gif (http://www.nfl.com/teams/news/BUF)</td></tr> </tbody></table> <table border="0" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="0" width="100%"> <tbody><tr class="teamsbg"> <td> <table border="0" cellpadding="2" cellspacing="0"> <tbody><tr> <td class="playerNavOn" height="20"> Career Stats (http://www.nfl.com/players/playerpage/396007) </td><td class="playerNav">|</td><td class="playerNav" height="20"> Game Logs: </td><td class="playerNav" height="20"> 01 (http://www.nfl.com/players/playerpage/396007/gamelogs/2001) </td><td class="playerNav" height="20"> 02 (http://www.nfl.com/players/playerpage/396007/gamelogs/2002) </td><td class="playerNav" height="20"> 03 (http://www.nfl.com/players/playerpage/396007/gamelogs/2003) </td><td class="playerNav" height="20"> 04 (http://www.nfl.com/players/playerpage/396007/gamelogs/2004) </td><td class="playerNav" height="20"> 05 (http://www.nfl.com/players/playerpage/396007/gamelogs/2005) </td><td class="playerNav" height="20"> 06 (http://www.nfl.com/players/playerpage/396007/gamelogs/2006) </td><td class="playerNav">|</td><td class="playerNav" height="20"> Situational Stats (http://www.nfl.com/players/playerpage/396007/splits/2006) </td><td class="playerNav">|</td><td class="playerNav" height="20"> Team Roster (http://www.nfl.com/teams/rosters/BUF) </td></tr> </tbody></table> </td> </tr> </tbody></table>
<table border="0" cellpadding="1" cellspacing="1" width="100%"><tbody><tr class="bg0" align="left"><td class="bg0" colspan="13">Defensive Stats</td></tr> <tr class="bg1" align="center"><td>Year</td><td>Team</td><td>G</td><td>Total</td><td>Tkl</td><td>Ast</td><td>Sacks</td><td>Int</td><td>Yds</td><td>Avg</td><td>Lg</td><td>TD</td><td>Pass Def</td></tr><tr class="bg3" align="right" height="15" valign="middle"><td align="left">2003</td><td align="left">Buffalo Bills</td><td>16</td><td>19</td><td>12.0</td><td>7</td><td>0</td><td>0</td><td>0</td><td>0.0</td><td>0</td><td>0</td><td>0</td></tr><tr class="bg2" align="right" height="15" valign="middle"><td align="left">2004</td><td align="left">Buffalo Bills</td><td>16</td><td>37</td><td>22.0</td><td>15</td><td>4.5</td><td>1</td><td>3</td><td>3.0</td><td>3</td><td>0</td><td>1</td></tr><tr class="bg3" align="right" height="15" valign="middle"><td align="left">2005</td><td align="left">Buffalo Bills</td><td>16</td><td>44</td><td>25.0</td><td>19</td><td>2.5</td><td>1</td><td>17</td><td>17.0</td><td>17</td><td>0</td><td>3</td></tr><tr class="bg2" align="right" height="15" valign="middle"><td align="left">2006</td><td align="left">Buffalo Bills</td><td>16</td><td>61</td><td>41.0</td><td>20</td><td>5.5</td><td>0</td><td>0</td><td>0.0</td><td>0</td><td>0</td><td>4</td></tr><tr id="total_CAREER_DEFENSE" class="bg3" align="right" height="15" valign="middle"><td class="bg4" align="left">TOTAL</td><td class="bg4" align="left"> </td><td class="bg4">64</td><td class="bg4">161</td><td class="bg4">100.0</td><td class="bg4">61</td><td class="bg4">12.5</td><td class="bg4">2</td><td class="bg4">20</td><td class="bg4">10.0</td><td class="bg4">17</td><td class="bg4">0</td><td class="bg4">8</td></tr></tbody></table>
I cant find Phils tackles stats.

I think they are very very similar

[justasportsfan]

What exactly seperates the two? Neither was an all-star, both were high motor guys only. Disruptive forces rather than pur pass rushers. I think the similarities are huge to be honest.



You could make an argument that Hansen = Schobel. But cmon, Kelsay? I'm hoping eventually but not right now. Not even close.

I realize Hansen had Bruuuuuce opposite him but still.

[gr8slayer]

When I see Kelsay getting compared favorably to Grant, that's when it goes from homerism and just gets plain ******ed.

Find me a Gm, a scout or coach in this league who will even use Kelsay and Grant in the same sentence. Grant is a franchise worthy DE. Kelsay is an average DE who cant stop the run to save his life.

Please.. next topic
Schobel is just as bad against the run.

[HAMMER]

Oh god, this guy is such a douche.

[THATHURMANATOR]

Since when did Charles Grant become such a great player? He is solid but doesn't blow me away.

[DraftBoy]

Since when did Charles Grant become such a great player? He is solid but doesn't blow me away.


Watch his game films then, and the argument is about so much more than his stats. Teams gameplan to run away from this guy, he is a completel disruptive force. To go on stats alone is a bad argument to make. This guy is not only a great pass rusher but he consistently alters the route in which the RB takes, he also commands consistent double teams and doenst play alternate a pro bowl DE. Please stop with the weak comparisons of these two if you havent see the film on Grant, once you see that it becomes painfully obvious how bad we need a good all-around DE, and not just good pass rushers.

[THATHURMANATOR]

Watch his game films then, and the argument is about so much more than his stats. Teams gameplan to run away from this guy, he is a completel disruptive force. To go on stats alone is a bad argument to make. This guy is not only a great pass rusher but he consistently alters the route in which the RB takes, he also commands consistent double teams and doenst play alternate a pro bowl DE. Please stop with the weak comparisons of these two if you havent see the film on Grant, once you see that it becomes painfully obvious how bad we need a good all-around DE, and not just good pass rushers.

1) I have said all along that Grant is the better player.

2) Kelsey is making less money

3) How much "game film" have you analyzed?

4) Please tell me you don't actually analyze game film... especially of other teams other than your favorite :ill:

[Philagape]

Looks like this was all about 2008 ....

Buccaneers | Team will make at C. Grant in 2008
Sat, 17 Mar 2007 10:13:19 -0700

Roy Cummings, of The Tampa Tribune, reports the Tampa Bay Buccaneers talked with free-agent DE Charles Grant (Saints), who was franchise tagged by the New Orleans Saints this offseason. The Buccaneers visit with Grant was an attempt to let him know they will make a run at him in 2008 if he is a free agent again. General manager Bruce Allen said, "We never intended to discuss a contract with him. We talked about his dreams and discussed his options. We obviously have a leg up on our competition."

[DraftBoy]

1) I have said all along that Grant is the better player.

2) Kelsey is making less money

3) How much "game film" have you analyzed?

4) Please tell me you don't actually analyze game film... especially of other teams other than your favorite :ill:


1) :rofl: yea, but thats not what your getting at now is it?

2) :bf1: that takes alot of deductive reasoning

3) I live in NFC South Country, and I see the saints every week on TV, plus I enjoy watching them play and if you watched any of their playoff games last year it was clearly evident. So lets see 16 weeks, but I probably missed 3 or 4, so 12 plus 2 playoff games, equals 14 games from last season alone I saw. I usually watch them later in the week not just Sundays. Some of us enjoying watching games other than just the Bills game, and some of us dont get the Bills game on TV every week so we make do.

4) Sorry I actually enjoy football and want to have knowledge behind the points I make. Hence the reason I can sit here and tell you again that we will suck v. run bc our ends still arent to where they need to be to force the play inside and funnel it to our MLB. We have the DT's to penetrate but we have no containment to the outside. If you look at Tampa in its Cover 2 prime they had good all around ends not ours. Watching games of other teams does nothing short of provide you with an actual realistic view of what we need to do, not just some bias one sided view from only our team's prospective. You see the problem here is that you only see things as it relates to Buffalo, you have really no idea what happens with other teams, or how they scheme differently, or how opponents play them. Your only concern is with Buffalo, which is fine, but I am a fan of the Bills 1st, and the NFL 2nd. I watch as much as I can, and keep up with other teams as much as I can. I like to watch as many games as I can (I only get 4 per sunday, if Im lucky). So please forgive me for trying to enjoy my favorite sport, Im sorry that you dont feel the same way I do, but there is much more to football than just Buffalo, I suggest one Sunday you try that.

[THATHURMANATOR]

1) :rofl: yea, but thats not what your getting at now is it?

2) :bf1: that takes alot of deductive reasoning

3) I live in NFC South Country, and I see the saints every week on TV, plus I enjoy watching them play and if you watched any of their playoff games last year it was clearly evident. So lets see 16 weeks, but I probably missed 3 or 4, so 12 plus 2 playoff games, equals 14 games from last season alone I saw. I usually watch them later in the week not just Sundays. Some of us enjoying watching games other than just the Bills game, and some of us dont get the Bills game on TV every week so we make do.

4) Sorry I actually enjoy football and want to have knowledge behind the points I make. Hence the reason I can sit here and tell you again that we will suck v. run bc our ends still arent to where they need to be to force the play inside and funnel it to our MLB. We have the DT's to penetrate but we have no containment to the outside. If you look at Tampa in its Cover 2 prime they had good all around ends not ours. Watching games of other teams does nothing short of provide you with an actual realistic view of what we need to do, not just some bias one sided view from only our team's prospective. You see the problem here is that you only see things as it relates to Buffalo, you have really no idea what happens with other teams, or how they scheme differently, or how opponents play them. Your only concern is with Buffalo, which is fine, but I am a fan of the Bills 1st, and the NFL 2nd. I watch as much as I can, and keep up with other teams as much as I can. I like to watch as many games as I can (I only get 4 per sunday, if Im lucky). So please forgive me for trying to enjoy my favorite sport, Im sorry that you dont feel the same way I do, but there is much more to football than just Buffalo, I suggest one Sunday you try that.

Sure watching them on TV but where do you get this "Game Film" and the equipment to sit there and break it down? No game on tv gives any of us insight as to teams game planning away from guys. Hell you would almost have to be a coach on the team to know for sure. No need to ask forgiveness for watching football games on tv since we all do that every sunday all day. I was commenting on the fact that you were acting like you were sitting in a darkroom with a projector and film and "breaking" it down, which would seem ridiculous to me.

Not sure why this has to even come to this. Maybe it is because some act like they know so much more about things than the rest of us. My original point was just saying that Kelsey's stats matched Grants last season. Nothing else. Lets just leave it at that.

[DraftBoy]

Sure watching them on TV but where do you get this "Game Film" and the equipment to sit there and break it down? No game on tv gives any of us insight as to teams game planning away from guys. Hell you would almost have to be a coach on the team to know for sure. No need to ask forgiveness for watching football games on tv since we all do that every sunday all day. I was commenting on the fact that you were acting like you were sitting in a darkroom with a projector and film and "breaking" it down, which would seem ridiculous to me.

Not sure why this has to even come to this. Maybe it is because some act like they know so much more about things than the rest of us. My original point was just saying that Kelsey's stats matched Grants last season. Nothing else. Lets just leave it at that.


First off, any time you have a game recorded, you can call it whatever you want, I put almost every game I watch on my DVR and Ill rewind and watch parts of it, im no coach nor do I have the knowledge to be one, but I do know what Im talking about atleast in this regard. And what equipment do you need? A VCR with a rewind function, pencil and a paper? I didnt know that was hot commodities these days. Also I do "break down" game film, mainly just college film though on guys I like. I dont have a darkroom, but I do look at paticular plays of the games I have of theirs to get a feel for their ability and intangibles.

And why has it come to this? Because people in general are ******ed, they continually choose to forget the fact that we are all Bills fans, and nobody is less of or more of one than the other. They also choose to sit here and degrade each other in some of the most juvenille ways possible. So what if somebody wants to ***** about the moves? Can we not argue with maturity? Must we really stoop to the low pitiful level that the BZ has now become? And who cares is somebody is a Homer? Does that mean they know less about football? This who ****ing argument is stupid (and I dont just mean the Grant-Kelsay discussion) and its getting to the point that we are losing good posters over it, so I hope you are all proud of yourselves, for driving away people who come here to have a good time and talk Bills, instead they find a constant pissing match between 4-5 people whose heads are shoved so far up their asses they dont which way is which. And Thurm I am not talking about you, so dont take this as a personal thing, this is bigger than our discussion. For christ sakes in recent weeks we've seen people ask for some fans to stop being Bills fans!!! Are you ****ing serious? What kind of ******ed ass attitude is that to have? Are we too good for some people? Last time I checked this team is this close to moving away and we cant sell out our own stadium any more, yet we have the luxury to pick and choose our own fans? Gimme a ****ing break. This is why people hate elite teams like the Yankees, BoSox, Braves, Lakers, Knicks (previously), Patriots, and Cowboys. Because their fans have this air about them since their team wins they are better fans, and until recently that was never an issue on this board, even though we had been to 4 straight SB, but now we have the same issue, and to be honest its a shame to see, this teams fan base has fallen so much (and I know this is only a small representation of the entire fan base) but the fact remains that we should all take a step or two or three in some cases back and maybe rethink the way we treat our fellow Bills fans.

/rant

[Al13]

LOL.. is this English class?

I'm on my fourth glass of Jamieson (if that's spelled correctly)

no its not....:couch:

[gr8slayer]

1) I have said all along that Grant is the better player.

2) Kelsey is making less money

3) How much "game film" have you analyzed?

4) Please tell me you don't actually analyze game film... especially of other teams other than your favorite :ill:
All I do in the off-season is break down film of teams Bills or not :couch:

[THATHURMANATOR]

First off, any time you have a game recorded, you can call it whatever you want, I put almost every game I watch on my DVR and Ill rewind and watch parts of it, im no coach nor do I have the knowledge to be one, but I do know what Im talking about atleast in this regard. And what equipment do you need? A VCR with a rewind function, pencil and a paper? I didnt know that was hot commodities these days. Also I do "break down" game film, mainly just college film though on guys I like. I dont have a darkroom, but I do look at paticular plays of the games I have of theirs to get a feel for their ability and intangibles.

And why has it come to this? Because people in general are ******ed, they continually choose to forget the fact that we are all Bills fans, and nobody is less of or more of one than the other. They also choose to sit here and degrade each other in some of the most juvenille ways possible. So what if somebody wants to ***** about the moves? Can we not argue with maturity? Must we really stoop to the low pitiful level that the BZ has now become? And who cares is somebody is a Homer? Does that mean they know less about football? This who ****ing argument is stupid (and I dont just mean the Grant-Kelsay discussion) and its getting to the point that we are losing good posters over it, so I hope you are all proud of yourselves, for driving away people who come here to have a good time and talk Bills, instead they find a constant pissing match between 4-5 people whose heads are shoved so far up their asses they dont which way is which. And Thurm I am not talking about you, so dont take this as a personal thing, this is bigger than our discussion. For christ sakes in recent weeks we've seen people ask for some fans to stop being Bills fans!!! Are you ****ing serious? What kind of ******ed ass attitude is that to have? Are we too good for some people? Last time I checked this team is this close to moving away and we cant sell out our own stadium any more, yet we have the luxury to pick and choose our own fans? Gimme a ****ing break. This is why people hate elite teams like the Yankees, BoSox, Braves, Lakers, Knicks (previously), Patriots, and Cowboys. Because their fans have this air about them since their team wins they are better fans, and until recently that was never an issue on this board, even though we had been to 4 straight SB, but now we have the same issue, and to be honest its a shame to see, this teams fan base has fallen so much (and I know this is only a small representation of the entire fan base) but the fact remains that we should all take a step or two or three in some cases back and maybe rethink the way we treat our fellow Bills fans.

/rant
I was just saying they had similar stats... :(