#12 is Simply a Bad Spot for us.. This year

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  • patmoran2006
    Ole' Ralphie SCROOGE
    • Dec 2005
    • 19840

    #12 is Simply a Bad Spot for us.. This year

    Unless Patrick Willis is on the board when the Bills are on the clock; or Adrian Peterson magically becomes the guy this year to fall out of the Top Ten; this is a really bad spot for Buffalo to be in this year when it comes to the draft.

    Think about it; pretty much all of the other players that are ranked/graded by pretty much everyone as Top 12 prospects that COULD conceivably fall to #12 come at spots that Buffalo is either strong at, heavily invested at or do not need.

    For Example:

    Okoye/Branch: One is likely to be there at 12. But Buffalo is already HEAVILY invested at DT. We gave Tripplett $18 million, traded UP to draft McCargo one year ago, drafted Kyle Williams and traded for Darwin Walker last month. So a DT in this spot makes no sense.

    Carriker/Jamal Anderson: Definitely Top 12 talent and 80%+ chance one is on the board at 12. But with the Pro Bowler Schoebel, and Kelsay (who by the way if we just gave him $24 million, more than half of that GUARENTEED) this organization BETTER not even be thinking about a DE with the first pick. To boot, as a backup Denney had more sacks than Kelsay; and Hargrove is very intriguing. So again, DE can't really be an option here.

    Leon Hall: Absolutely absurd in a cover two defense to employ a Top 12 pick on a cornerback. We also used a first day pick on a CB last year (Youboty) adn resigned Kiwi Thomas. DRafting Hall would make either last year's draft pick a waste or Thomas' resigning garbage as one of them would only be the FOURTH cornerback. I dont think happens, but if it did that's horrible offseason planning and management.

    Levi Brown: Very likely to be gone by #12 anyway. But let's say on the 20% chance he's not and on the board at Buffalo. We still couldn't take him. We gave Langston Walker $25 million; and you dont pay a second guard $5 million per year. On top of that, we have a capable backup in Pennington. For those reasons, Brown is not a viable pick either, therefore not a need.

    We don't need a QB-- CJ, Joe Thomas, Gaines Adams, Laron Landry are SURE to be gone--

    So at the end of the day; Either Peterson or Willis fall to us, or we're going to get poor value with the 12th pick. (See demonstration on others above)
    =========================================================

    Every year we have discussions about the team moving down-- but this is one year where they absolutely should.

    If you move down in the draft (for last time, should AP and Willis be gone) IMO two things happen
    1) You get extra pick(s) on a team with a lot to fill.
    2) You get far better value with the pick.

    Once you move down; you have better options and much better value.

    LB- Beason, Pos or even Brandon Siler could bring great value and much needed help to the LB corp.

    WR- You're now in the territory where it could be more sensible to take a Robert Meacham/Dwayne Bowe or even a Dwayne Jarrett. IF we don't do something to give Evans/JP help; I think we're going to find out the hard way how much teams are going to key on Evans. Im all for having an Indy/Arizona type offense where you cannot key on one guy cause others will kill you.

    Olsen: Wouldn't be the most popular pick (and I'd take a WR before him) but if nothing else he's a legit weapon for the offense that can help the unit immediately by him being on the field.

    Lynch: Ive heard enough about him recently that he may not be the pick no matter where we are on the board. Personally, if Marv decided RB should be first; and AP was gone, I'd rather move down, pick up another pick and then trade that first for Turner over Lynch; IFFFFFFFFFFF Marv decided RB is first.

    CB: Much better value in late-mid/late 1st round. Then a guy like Reevis or Chris Houston becomes a stronger value pick. I still disagree about CB at all early; but taking one lower in the first with another pick to boot makes more sense.
    =========================================================
    A hypothetical to demonstrate this...

    Let's say the Giants really want a "shutdown" corner and target Leon Hall. They pick 20th and want to move up. We move down to 20. The Giants get Hall. By the draft value chart, essentially we'd get NY's first and second, and they'd get our first and 4th (111th).

    We'd now have four first day picks, including a pair of second rounders. At #20 we could still easily get one of guys listed in part two (Pos, Beason, Bowe, Meacham) and have two second rounders (as well as 2 thirds). At that point I think a 2nd and 3rd would get Turner (who IMO is far better than level 2 RB's Pittman or Irons). Even if we didnt trade for Turner, we could still get Pittman/Irons in round two AND either a WR/LB (depending on what Marv took in Round 1). and we'd have a pair of thirds.

    In closing; this is most definitely the year to trade down, provided Willis and AP are gone. If one of them are still on the board; scratch this post as both are franchise-quality players that a team like that cannot do without.


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  • patmoran2006
    Ole' Ralphie SCROOGE
    • Dec 2005
    • 19840

    #2
    Re: #12 is Simply a Bad Spot for us.. This year

    Forgot Ted Ginn Jr as a possible "Trade down Pick"

    He could also be an explosive returner for us.


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    • John Doe
      Florida Man
      • Jul 2002
      • 2514

      #3
      Re: #12 is Simply a Bad Spot for us.. This year

      I think that you are really on to something here. We really need to trake up for Willis. Maybe give up next year's first to move up a couple spots.

      One thing is for sure and you can take it to the bank: Willis will be the greatest football player of all time. A guy that will revolutionize the sport. He will be inducted into the hall of fame after only a handfull of seasons. They will change the regualtions of the game because he is so dominant at his position that it gives the team he is on an unfair advantage ("the Patrick Wills rule').

      We absolutely have to have this guy or all is lost. Its totally impossible that another player could come close to making an impact on the Bills.

      I think that everyone is on board with this. You can stop making new threads about it now.

      Comment

      • patmoran2006
        Ole' Ralphie SCROOGE
        • Dec 2005
        • 19840

        #4
        Re: #12 is Simply a Bad Spot for us.. This year

        Originally posted by John Doe
        I think that you are really on to something here. We really need to trake up for Willis. Maybe give up next year's first to move up a couple spots.

        One thing is for sure and you can take it to the bank: Willis will be the greatest football player of all time. A guy that will revolutionize the sport. He will be inducted into the hall of fame after only a handfull of seasons. They will change the regualtions of the game because he is so dominant at his position that it gives the team he is on an unfair advantage ("the Patrick Wills rule').

        We absolutely have to have this guy or all is lost. Its totally impossible that another player could come close to making an impact on the Bills.

        I think that everyone is on board with this. You can stop making new threads about it now.
        Although I can appreciate the sharp-witted sarcasm as much as anybody, this was actually a lot more about value and trading down than it is about Patrick Willis. Willis represented a tiny portion while it's concentrated far more on other players.


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        Comment

        • Jan Reimers
          Thank You, Terry and Kim, for Saving the Bills. Now, Work on the Sabres.
          • May 2003
          • 17353

          #5
          Re: #12 is Simply a Bad Spot for us.. This year

          Pat, the horse is dead, the flesh has disintegrated, and the bones have turned to powder and blown away.
          Should have known, way back in 1960 when we drafted Richie Lucas Number 1, that this would be a long, hard ride. But who could have known it would be THIS bad?

          Comment

          • patmoran2006
            Ole' Ralphie SCROOGE
            • Dec 2005
            • 19840

            #6
            Re: #12 is Simply a Bad Spot for us.. This year

            Again.. selective reading.

            Where is there a thread anywhere about moving down and what those possibilities are? Find me the link, I'd love to read it.


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            • mikemac2001
              is the creepy cross dresser staring at you in the corner
              • Mar 2003
              • 4574

              #7
              Re: #12 is Simply a Bad Spot for us.. This year

              Originally posted by patmoran2006
              Again.. selective reading.

              Where is there a thread anywhere about moving down and what those possibilities are? Find me the link, I'd love to read it.

              its almost impossible to read your post pat

              MUCK
              FIAMI

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              • patmoran2006
                Ole' Ralphie SCROOGE
                • Dec 2005
                • 19840

                #8
                Re: #12 is Simply a Bad Spot for us.. This year

                Ya I know, cause nothing I said many any sense.

                The single problem with this board is that if you dont like poster; you dis the post as garbage and unreadable because you dont like that person.

                I dont care very much for Tatonka, Devin, Lecter and a couple of others. But I"m not biased to the point where I will say nothing they write makes any sense and their points of veiw are always wrong.. . Despite me often disagreeing with them, I think they are some of the best posters on this entire board; and like I said I personally dont care for either of them. Id rather read other points of view than just my own. In fact, I look MORE forward to reading what they have to say than the people I usually agree with.

                This post wasn't a dis towards the Bills; it talked about moving down and who would be there when moving down and who could be a good value pick. And not all, but some dismiss anything because they don't like the posters.

                To the people who actually READ from all points of view whether they agree or not; and have something related to offer; feedback is always cool and much appreciated-- even if harsh.

                To the select few *******s that circlejerk to Marv Levy photos; you can seriously blow me.. Im tired of those clowns who take someone's opinions or feelings at the time about a Bills topic and troll it into nothing more than personal attacks. Either put me on ignore if my views are "dead horses' or bother you that much.. or simply grow up, and shut the **** up.


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                • Dicknoze69
                  Just because my name is dicknoze,it doesn't mean I have balls in my mouth
                  • Jul 2002
                  • 1224

                  #9
                  Re: #12 is Simply a Bad Spot for us.. This year

                  I have to agree with Pat here. If Willis/Peterson are gone at 12, we should probably trade down for added value. However, I could absolutely see us drafting Beason at 12, if we can't find a partner to drop down with.

                  The best possible scenario if Willis/Peterson aren't there, value-wise, is to drop down a few slots, pick up an additional pick, and draft a linebacker.

                  I rarely post here, but I read everything. Pat sometimes gets the shaft because a few people don't read his posts objectively. At the same time, Pat sometimes doesn't post objectively. It's not a black-and-white issue.
                  __________________

                  God give me style and give me grace
                  God put a smile upon my face

                  Comment

                  • THATHURMANATOR
                    Registered User
                    • Jul 2002
                    • 69112

                    #10
                    Re: #12 is Simply a Bad Spot for us.. This year

                    Wow the 5000thd thread on the same topic...

                    The draft can't get here fast enough.

                    Comment

                    • patmoran2006
                      Ole' Ralphie SCROOGE
                      • Dec 2005
                      • 19840

                      #11
                      Re: #12 is Simply a Bad Spot for us.. This year

                      Originally posted by Dicknoze69
                      I have to agree with Pat here. If Willis/Peterson are gone at 12, we should probably trade down for added value. However, I could absolutely see us drafting Beason at 12, if we can't find a partner to drop down with.

                      The best possible scenario if Willis/Peterson aren't there, value-wise, is to drop down a few slots, pick up an additional pick, and draft a linebacker.

                      I rarely post here, but I read everything. Pat sometimes gets the shaft because a few people don't read his posts objectively. At the same time, Pat sometimes doesn't post objectively. It's not a black-and-white issue.
                      Good points.. on both ends.

                      Of all the players I discussed about trade down possibilities, Beason is the one I'd tend to lean to first as well, at least on the defensive side of the ball for sure.


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                      • patmoran2006
                        Ole' Ralphie SCROOGE
                        • Dec 2005
                        • 19840

                        #12
                        Re: #12 is Simply a Bad Spot for us.. This year

                        Originally posted by THATHURMANATOR
                        Wow the 5000thd thread on the same topic...

                        The draft can't get here fast enough.
                        If you think pre-draft time is bad, just wait until the week following the draft..

                        If Willis is on the board at #12 and drafted, I'm sure it will be united in here about being a good move.. Whether you are a "homer" or an "anti homer"-- To say Willis isnt a perfect fit here, that means your INTENTIONALLY trying to start fights with people. AP Im sure the consensus would be great.

                        If Buffalo moves down, gets an extra pick and takes someone else; I'm pretty sure it will be for the most part excepted as a smart move.

                        But if Buffalo doesnt move down, and someone like POS or Leon Hall is drafted.. It's going to get ugly. And people have the right to say what they want.


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                        • THATHURMANATOR
                          Registered User
                          • Jul 2002
                          • 69112

                          #13
                          Re: #12 is Simply a Bad Spot for us.. This year

                          Originally posted by patmoran2006
                          If you think pre-draft time is bad, just wait until the week following the draft..

                          If Willis is on the board at #12 and drafted, I'm sure it will be united in here about being a good move.. Whether you are a "homer" or an "anti homer"-- To say Willis isnt a perfect fit here, that means your INTENTIONALLY trying to start fights with people. AP Im sure the consensus would be great.

                          If Buffalo moves down, gets an extra pick and takes someone else; I'm pretty sure it will be for the most part excepted as a smart move.

                          But if Buffalo doesnt move down, and someone like POS or Leon Hall is drafted.. It's going to get ugly. And people have the right to say what they want.
                          Whatever.

                          Comment

                          • billsburgh
                            Registered User
                            • Jul 2003
                            • 3560

                            #14
                            Re: #12 is Simply a Bad Spot for us.. This year

                            excellent post Pat. I agree with everything you said. That's why I'm that Willis or Peterson is there at 12.

                            Comment

                            • THATHURMANATOR
                              Registered User
                              • Jul 2002
                              • 69112

                              #15
                              Re: #12 is Simply a Bad Spot for us.. This year

                              Originally posted by John Doe
                              I think that you are really on to something here. We really need to trake up for Willis. Maybe give up next year's first to move up a couple spots.

                              One thing is for sure and you can take it to the bank: Willis will be the greatest football player of all time. A guy that will revolutionize the sport. He will be inducted into the hall of fame after only a handfull of seasons. They will change the regualtions of the game because he is so dominant at his position that it gives the team he is on an unfair advantage ("the Patrick Wills rule').

                              We absolutely have to have this guy or all is lost. Its totally impossible that another player could come close to making an impact on the Bills.

                              I think that everyone is on board with this. You can stop making new threads about it now.
                              LOL
                              I thought you were serious after the first couple sentances and I was like what is this guy talking about.

                              Comment

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