Walker wants new contract

[Philagape]

Wow, two Walker stories on the same day ....

Bills DT Walker seeks new contract
By JOHN WAWROW
AP Sports Writer
BUFFALO, N.Y. (AP) - Newly acquired defensive tackle Darwin Walker won't be reporting to the Buffalo Bills until he receives a contract extension.
Acquired in a trade in March that sent linebacker Takeo Spikes to Philadelphia, Walker on Thursday said he hasn't visited Buffalo yet and won't be reporting until a new deal is completed. Walker has two years left on his existing contract, but was attempting to negotiate a new deal with the Eagles.
Walker's agent, Albert Irby, said the Bills were aware of his client's contract status when they made the trade.
"Yes, he's under contract, and that contract was traded to Buffalo. But it was traded to Buffalo with the understanding that we wanted a new deal," Irby told The Associated Press. "They made the trade knowing that this had to happen."
Irby said he's had discussions with the Bills, and hopes an agreement can be reached prior to the start of training camp in late July.

[patmoran2006]

LOL.

Oh dear.. Here comes the Walker heel-turn..
This front office just stumbles into one thing after another..

[DynaPaul]

Get your ass in here Walker!

[gr8slayer]

Here we go :rolleyes:

He'll be in camp.

[camelcowboy]

I'd normaly say screw you walker your under contract, but this guy unlike most NFL players actually owns a succesful buisness, he can afford to sit out. Get him under contract get him to camp.

[patmoran2006]

Ya know.

Im TRULY, truly starting to become convinced that unless the money is overpowering (Dockery, Walker) that veterans simply do not want to come play for Buffalo.

That's one point, and here is another.. If what Irby (agent) is saying is true, why on God's green earth would Levy make this trade with no extension in place? And if he didn't know this would happen; he should. He's a National Football League general manager. Not a fan board message poster.

[gr8slayer]

Ya know.

Im TRULY, truly starting to become convinced that unless the money is overpowering (Dockery, Walker) that veterans simply do not want to come play for Buffalo.

That's one point, and here is another.. If what Irby (agent) is saying is true, why on God's green earth would Levy make this trade with no extension in place? And if he didn't know this would happen; he should. He's a National Football League general manager. Not a fan board message poster.
Veterans would prefer not to play for a losing team? No way.

[acehole]

I would not want to be the team to give this guy his golden parachute. Let him prove it for a year...give him a one year raise and then he can walk..... or resign.


Wow, two Walker stories on the same day ....

Bills DT Walker seeks new contract
By JOHN WAWROW
AP Sports Writer
BUFFALO, N.Y. (AP) - Newly acquired defensive tackle Darwin Walker won't be reporting to the Buffalo Bills until he receives a contract extension.
Acquired in a trade in March that sent linebacker Takeo Spikes to Philadelphia, Walker on Thursday said he hasn't visited Buffalo yet and won't be reporting until a new deal is completed. Walker has two years left on his existing contract, but was attempting to negotiate a new deal with the Eagles.
Walker's agent, Albert Irby, said the Bills were aware of his client's contract status when they made the trade.
"Yes, he's under contract, and that contract was traded to Buffalo. But it was traded to Buffalo with the understanding that we wanted a new deal," Irby told The Associated Press. "They made the trade knowing that this had to happen."
Irby said he's had discussions with the Bills, and hopes an agreement can be reached prior to the start of training camp in late July.

[patmoran2006]

So let me get this straight.

We traded Takeo Spikes for a guy who's going to be the third or even fourth DT in our rotation; and he won't come to camp without an extension?

Good trade, Marv... This guy better be REAL GOOD.

BTW, I wonder what Schobel is thinking about these contract negotiations and new deals getting done and stuff? Yanno, the one guy on the line that actually DOES PRODUCE Consistently..

[patmoran2006]

Veterans would prefer not to play for a losing team? No way.
That's the best you can come up with?

Lots of teams, in fact, most teams lose.. The majority are still able to attact quality players.

The few teams that consistently are mediocre are usually because the front office of run poor and as a result they have a horrible time trying to attract players that will make a difference.

You're statement is just another EXCUSE. Just like the Donahoe theories two years later, the small market, CBA, revenue sharing, young quarterback, blahblahblah.

[bigbub2352]

I can see were Darwin is coming from, but it is typical of the spoiled athletes today, give him a 2 yr EXT and dont make it a problem goin into camp we needs these youngs in here to develop with no Veteran side drama, gotta luv the NFL

[OpIv37]

If Walker doesn't sign, our DL is EXACTLY the same as last year....

[HAMMER]

That's the best you can come up with?

Lots of teams, in fact, most teams lose.. The majority are still able to attact quality players.

The few teams that consistently are mediocre are usually because the front office of run poor and as a result they have a horrible time trying to attract players that will make a difference.

You're statement is just another EXCUSE. Just like the Donahoe theories two years later, the small market, CBA, revenue sharing, young quarterback, blahblahblah.

Two things;
* Let's wait and see what happens before we get our panties in a bunch.
* Please reread (edit) your posts before hitting submit. They are painful enough to read w/o all the grammatical errors.

[Philagape]

Cleveland and San Francisco have done OK attracting free agents ... what's their combined record this century?

[BILLSROCK1212]

Cleveland and San Francisco have done OK attracting free agents ... what's their combined record this century?San Francisco has made the playoffs a couple of times this century if I am not mistaken.

[gr8slayer]

If Walker doesn't sign, our DL is EXACTLY the same as last year....
No it's not. McCargo will be healthy. Should give a hell of a boost.

[camelcowboy]

So let me get this straight.

We traded Takeo Spikes for a guy who's going to be the third or even fourth DT in our rotation; and he won't come to camp without an extension?

Good trade, Marv... This guy better be REAL GOOD.

BTW, I wonder what Schobel is thinking about these contract negotiations and new deals getting done and stuff? Yanno, the one guy on the line that actually DOES PRODUCE Consistently.. Walker's a smart man. He's not going to get 6 sacks in this defense with it's secondary. He knows that he needs to strike when the irons hot.

[Philagape]

San Francisco has made the playoffs a couple of times this century if I am not mistaken.

I'll answer the question for you ... 48-64. There are only a handful of teams that haven't made the playoffs in that time, so that's irrelevant

[patmoran2006]

Getting back on subject.

I think it's a joke that we traded a starting LB already under contract at a paper thin position; to a team for a player who's not even a starter, is another Larry Tripplett duplicate (rotational player) and wont even report to camp without a new contract extension.

If that is not poor front office management, then someone explain to me what your definition of it is?

[Bling]

So what number are we on?

[SquishDaFish]

WAHHHHHH!! WAAHHHH!!!Wheres my BOBO! Give it a damn break. Big Freaking DEAL.

[patmoran2006]

WAHHHHHH!! WAAHHHH!!!Wheres my BOBO! Give it a damn break. Big Freaking DEAL.
Good insight, as usual.

[OpIv37]

WAHHHHHH!! WAAHHHH!!!Wheres my BOBO! Give it a damn break. Big Freaking DEAL.

having the exact same DL as last year when we were 28th against the run, and trading a player at a position where we have no depth for NOTHING?

it's a big deal whether you want to admit it or not.

[Bling]

having the exact same DL as last year when we were 28th against the run, and trading a player at a position where we have no depth for NOTHING?

it's a big deal whether you want to admit it or not.

:clap:

[patmoran2006]

It's not even the point.

We trade for a guy who already says he wont report without a new deal done. makes for great team chemistry.

I hope Spikes makes the Pro Bowl this year. I refuse to root against him soley because our front office thinks he's washed up.

[BILLSROCK1212]

obviously Levy thought he could get a deal done because he knew of this situation before the trade....sometimes you wonder though, what the hell is Marv thinking but most of the time to us Bills fans he seems like a genious, hopefully he will get a deal done

[OpIv37]

obviously Levy thought he could get a deal done because he knew of this situation before the trade....sometimes you wonder though, what the hell is Marv thinking but most of the time to us Bills fans he seems like a genious, hopefully he will get a deal done

I just have to wonder why the deal hasn't been done yet. That trade was over a month ago and we have plenty of cap space, so what's the hold up?

[BILLSROCK1212]

I just have to wonder why the deal hasn't been done yet. That trade was over a month ago and we have plenty of cap space, so what's the hold up?
i really wonder why we haven't attempted to sing contract extension with our key players this offseason (or so it seems)....that part of the offseason has really puzzled me

[Philagape]

I just have to wonder why the deal hasn't been done yet. That trade was over a month ago and we have plenty of cap space, so what's the hold up?

How much cap space is left under cash-to-crap?

[BILLSROCK1212]

How much cap space is left under cash-to-crap?
i can't answer that but i do know that we are a little under $20,000,000 under the salary cap

[OpIv37]

How much cap space is left under cash-to-crap?

that's a really good question- where's Clump when you need him?

But if that's the case, one would hope Marv wouldn't make the trade knowing there's no possibility of a contract, so I would have to assume there is enough left to get something done.

[mikemac2001]

So let me get this straight.

We traded Takeo Spikes for a guy who's going to be the third or even fourth DT in our rotation; and he won't come to camp without an extension?

Good trade, Marv... This guy better be REAL GOOD.

BTW, I wonder what Schobel is thinking about these contract negotiations and new deals getting done and stuff? Yanno, the one guy on the line that actually DOES PRODUCE Consistently..


Dude STFU hate coming here because all it is is your NEG spam, i dont mind neg comments but your way over the top

Maybe marv didnt know maybe marv is pissed about this but i dont think marv will budge and the guy will be in camp

[Mitchy moo]

Let him sit and hold out.

[Captain Obvious]

BTW, I wonder what Schobel is thinking about these contract negotiations and new deals getting done and stuff? Yanno, the one guy on the line that actually DOES PRODUCE Consistently..

Yes Pat..The Bills are the only team in the NFL who has at least one probowler on the team who is underpaid since the new CBA came into affect

[Night Train]

sometimes you wonder though, what the hell is Marv thinking but most of the time to us Bills fans he seems like a genious

It's spelled genius and I bet Marv doesn't have to think about it.

Walker will be signed.

[acehole]

Walker's a smart man. He's not going to get 6 sacks in this defense with it's secondary. He knows that he needs to strike when the irons hot.

Sorry Camel it usually is the other way around. The better the d-line the better the secondary is not the other way around. It is the same with the offensive line..the better they are the better the running back/game...not the other way around. the Bills should not pay him large. Double his salary next year on a one year I say.

[TacklingDummy]

LOL.

Oh dear.. Here comes the Walker heel-turn..
This front office just stumbles into one thing after another..

Rumor has it Walker wants Kelsay money.

[gr8slayer]

Rumor has it Walker wants Kelsay money.
Haven't seen enough of Walker to know if he deserves it.

[TacklingDummy]

Haven't seen enough of Walker to know if he deserves it.

Im not sure if Kelsay deserved it.

[casdhf]

Haven't seen enough of Kelsay to see if Kelsay deserves Kelsay money

[gr8slayer]

Im not sure if Kelsay deserved it.
Any year before this year he wouldn't have gotten it. He just got lucky that his contract happened to be up the year the cap went up.

[casdhf]

He's got 2 years left on the deal, it isn't like he has alot of power in this situation.

[gr8slayer]

He will be in camp or he won't get paid, we hold all the cards. It's not that difficult to comprehend.

[TacklingDummy]

He's got 2 years left on the deal, it isn't like he has alot of power in this situation.

The Bills can't give into Walkers demands. If they redo his contract with 2 years left on it what does that say to Lee Evans who has 2 years left on his?

Marv may not want to open up that box.

[gr8slayer]

The Bills can't fall into Walkers demands. If they redo his contract with 2 years left on it what does that say to Lee Evans who has 2 years left on his?

Marv may not want to open up that box.
They can cut Walker for all I care if it means keeping Evans.

He needs to be our main priority followed by:

Schobel, Peters (need to lock him up for good) and Losman (assuming he continues to get better.)

I would rather hold off on Losman until the end of next season, we need to be sure.

[camelcowboy]

Sorry Camel it usually is the other way around. The better the d-line the better the secondary is not the other way around. It is the same with the offensive line..the better they are the better the running back/game...not the other way around. the Bills should not pay him large. Double his salary next year on a one year I say. if you watch schobel, kelsay, most of their sacks were coverage sacks. No ones open qb runs out of time he takes the sacks remember bledsoe. Normally a good dl can pressure a qb. I just believe the bills d-line is below average. It won't pressure qbs before their wideouts become open in our inexpirenced secondary. Good coverage=sacks, good passrush=turnovers. I believe the bills are hoping a solid D-line will improve our linebackers and secondary, i just dont see it happening with this cast of characters. Alot is riding on McCargo.

[Romes]

This isn't a problem yet so there is no need to call the spikes trade a bad one now but if he starts holding out then its a problem and I'd start to question the spikes deal.

[HHURRICANE]

Getting back on subject.

I think it's a joke that we traded a starting LB already under contract at a paper thin position; to a team for a player who's not even a starter, is another Larry Tripplett duplicate (rotational player) and wont even report to camp without a new contract extension.

If that is not poor front office management, then someone explain to me what your definition of it is?

Uhhh, Pat is....correct on this one. Gotta call them the way I see them.

1) Agreeing not to franchise Nate. Not to many homers blasting Marv for this one.

2) How big would have one additional second rounder been for McGahhe this year instead of the two thirds.

3) Trading up for McCargo was a reach. He'd better play well.

4) Walker better show up or I'll be Pat Jr. on this board.

[HHURRICANE]

if you watch schobel, kelsay, most of their sacks were coverage sacks. No ones open qb runs out of time he takes the sacks remember bledsoe. Normally a good dl can pressure a qb. I just believe the bills d-line is below average. It won't pressure qbs before their wideouts become open in our inexpirenced secondary. Good coverage=sacks, good passrush=turnovers. I believe the bills are hoping a solid D-line will improve our linebackers and secondary, i just dont see it happening with this cast of characters. Alot is riding on McCargo.

Bills 34
Pats 37

[Devin]

To my knowledge Peters is signed through like 2011 or something. We dont have to worry about him....just yet anyway.

[Mad Bomber]

Wow. I already dislike Walker.

[happyspermwhale]

Wow, two Walker stories on the same day ....

Bills DT Walker seeks new contract
By JOHN WAWROW
AP Sports Writer
BUFFALO, N.Y. (AP) - Newly acquired defensive tackle Darwin Walker won't be reporting to the Buffalo Bills until he receives a contract extension.
Acquired in a trade in March that sent linebacker Takeo Spikes to Philadelphia, Walker on Thursday said he hasn't visited Buffalo yet and won't be reporting until a new deal is completed. Walker has two years left on his existing contract, but was attempting to negotiate a new deal with the Eagles.
Walker's agent, Albert Irby, said the Bills were aware of his client's contract status when they made the trade.
"Yes, he's under contract, and that contract was traded to Buffalo. But it was traded to Buffalo with the understanding that we wanted a new deal," Irby told The Associated Press. "They made the trade knowing that this had to happen."
Irby said he's had discussions with the Bills, and hopes an agreement can be reached prior to the start of training camp in late July.

Good for him, he deserves a pay raise for leaving a perenial playoff team and coming to a struggling franchise that will be lucky to finish 3rd in their division.

[KMA]

If Walker doesn't sign, our DL is EXACTLY the same as last year....

And if he does, what does he add?

[OpIv37]

And if he does, what does he add?

Is it all that hard to be better than Anderson and Jefferson? he's not the run stuffer we need but he should help with the pass rush.

[KMA]

Is it all that hard to be better than Anderson and Jefferson? he's not the run stuffer we need but he should help with the pass rush.
And are we planning on having five DTs on the field at once then?

I mean with big plans for McCargo, Tripplett, and Williams, how many plays do you expect a guy just like them that backs them up to get?

[BillsFever21]

Good job again, Marv. We trade Spikes when we already have junk at LB to try and save some money and the guy we trade him for wants a new contract when he's not even that great.

If he gets a new contract and guys like Evans and Losman are still waiting for theirs then Marv needs to be shot. We have already proved we're not going to spend as much as money as the other 31 clubs so that means every dollar counts. If they waste that on Walker then that just truly shows how ignorant they are. We have 20 million. Give that to Evans.

[OpIv37]

And are we planning on having five DTs on the field at once then?

I mean with big plans for McCargo, Tripplett, and Williams, how many plays do you expect a guy just like them that backs them up to get?

the idea is a rotation- keep the big guys off the field so they don't get tired. Right now, it looks like McCargo and Williams will rotate in at one DT spot and Tripplett and Walker (if he shows up in camp) will rotate in at the other spot. Think of it more like hockey- with line changes- than as starters and back ups in a football game.

[HHURRICANE]

Our D is looking dangerous with Anderson, Wire and Stamer all looking likely to be playing. I'm sorry but we need Walker on the field. We better hope for some Gems coming here at the June 1st cuts.

[KMA]

the idea is a rotation- keep the big guys off the field so they don't get tired. Right now, it looks like McCargo and Williams will rotate in at one DT spot and Tripplett and Walker (if he shows up in camp) will rotate in at the other spot. Think of it more like hockey- with line changes- than as starters and back ups in a football game.
Yeah, it worked just great for us last year didn't it.

I'd rather just have two tackles that start and take most of the snaps like most other teams. Henderson and Stroud are a good example.

[TigerJ]

Walker was seeking to renegotiate with Philly before the trade happened. It's noting against Buffalo. Buffalo knew he wanted a new deal when the trade was done. I have no idea what kind of deal he wants, but I presume Buffalo had heard a ballpark figure when the trade was made and thought they would be able to do a deal. If they didn't, they should have their collective head examined, but I'm not just going to assume the Bills are complete idiots, until they actually run into some kind of impasse in negotiations.

[KMA]

Well I don't know what the guy wants but he's scheduled to make 1.3 million this year which is good for a backup DT.

[HAMMER]

It's not even the point.

We trade for a guy who already says he wont report without a new deal done. makes for great team chemistry.

I hope Spikes makes the Pro Bowl this year. I refuse to root against him soley because our front office thinks he's washed up.

This post#& is a big douche as usual.

[OpIv37]

Yeah, it worked just great for us last year didn't it.

I'd rather just have two tackles that start and take most of the snaps like most other teams. Henderson and Stroud are a good example.

no arguments here- I'm no fan of the rotational/small tackle system or any other defensive system that doesn't stop the run. I miss having 700 lbs of fat-ass clogging up the middle.

But unfortunately, the coaching staff is hell-bent on doing it this way- and as long as that's what they're gonna do, we're better off with Walker than without him.

[HAMMER]

Some of you are such flippin drama queens, settle down and act like men. Marv will handle it.

[OpIv37]

Some of you are such flippin drama queens, settle down and act like men. Marv will handle it.

yeah, you're right- the fact that he's had a month to get the contract done but it hasn't happened and the fact that we're one guy away from having the exact same crap-tacular DL as last year are nothing to worry about :rolleyes:

[Michael82]

:ill:

[Devin]

:yawn:

[jdbillsfan]

yeah, you're right- the fact that he's had a month to get the contract done but it hasn't happened and the fact that we're one guy away from having the exact same crap-tacular DL as last year are nothing to worry about :rolleyes:

McCargo willl be an X-Factor and Kyle Williams should be better with another year under his belt.

It's not the same DL.

Spikes didn't want to be here as soon as Fletcher left. He had one foot out the door and didn't want to be here. He is an aging LB with a bad injury as far as LB's go.

I do like Spikes, but he just wasn't going to be happy this year. I think he still has the heart and talks like he is ready, but I am not sure he'll be the same. Time to move on. I actually thought he was just going to be cut.

The Darwin Walker issue will be interesting to see what Marv does. I'll hold off judgement.

[Philagape]

I'm not worried. It's only May

[Ickybaluky]

Am I the only one thinking that Walker has absolutely no leverage? About the only thing he can do is hold out, which will lead to missed pay and a lot of fine money. Heck, the Bills might even be able to go for part of his original signing bonus.

Seriously, the guy projects to be a backup DT. This would be like if Raheem Brock held out on the Colts. I bet the Bills laugh in his face.

[Devin]

Keep logic and good sense out of this argument.

[billsburgh]

I just have to wonder why the deal hasn't been done yet. That trade was over a month ago and we have plenty of cap space, so what's the hold up?
concentrating on draft prepartion? :idunno:


Im not sure if Kelsay deserved it.
not really.

what would happen if he actually refuses to report while under contract? would the trade be voidable? maybe some fine print in there that would allow that?

[Tatonka]

Am I the only one thinking that Walker has absolutely no leverage? About the only thing he can do is hold out, which will lead to missed pay and a lot of fine money. Heck, the Bills might even be able to go for part of his original signing bonus.

Seriously, the guy projects to be a backup DT. This would be like if Raheem Brock held out on the Colts. I bet the Bills laugh in his face.

that is what i would do.. and if he wanted to hold out, i would welcome it.. he would be vilified in buffalo, and lose the final 2 years of his career.. if he wants to hold out.. he mine as well retire.

F all the bastards that threaten to hold out.. i love it when teams call the bluff.

like briggs in chicago.

[don137]

I agree with Tatonka and NE39. Let him hold out. Its his career that he is hurting. If he sits out then he does not get paid, gets fined and suspend him so he does not play 6 games resulting in the not using up a year on the contract thus calling his bluff...He will lose more in the deal. He has done nothing for Buffalo. Don't come in here and demand a new contract. Get your head out of the clouds and get a dose of reality.

[Dr. Lecter]

yeah, you're right- the fact that he's had a month to get the contract done but it hasn't happened and the fact that we're one guy away from having the exact same crap-tacular DL as last year are nothing to worry about :rolleyes:

It is not the same. Last year there were two rookies... They won't be rookies this year. I know you think players do not improve with experience, but most others (including nearly every single NFL coach) think they do.

[Dr. Lecter]

Ya know.

Im TRULY, truly starting to become convinced that unless the money is overpowering (Dockery, Walker) that veterans simply do not want to come play for Buffalo.

That's one point, and here is another.. If what Irby (agent) is saying is true, why on God's green earth would Levy make this trade with no extension in place? And if he didn't know this would happen; he should. He's a National Football League general manager. Not a fan board message poster.

So now your theory is no other teams have players threatening hold outs?

[alohabillsfan]

Here is the deal, Marv can't win with the experts on this board...

1) Marv signs Walker to an extension and will be flamed for over-paying for a rotational DT.

2) Marv does not sign him and get's flamed for making a bad trade (which really was not because (a) Spikes did not want to be here and struggled lately to remain healthy and (b) Kelly freaking Holcomb)!

P.S. For you experts that say vets don't want to play for Buffalo because they suck, well, Walker wanted an extension in Philly!

[patmoran2006]

So now your theory is no other teams have players threatening hold outs?
Not my point.. Yes, teams do have players threatening holdouts.

And NE39 is 100% right as well. We do hold the leverage when it comes to Walker.

My point is. Why did we trade for him in the first place? Apparently, he hasn't even visited Buffalo yet? (that's what his agent said right)

Why trade for a guy, and give up a starting LB in return, without knowing his feelings about his contract or anything else? It makes no sense to me.

I'm sorry- I love Marv Levy to death and don't ever question his competence, but in comparison to his GM peers, I think he's continuing to get schooled.

[Dr. Lecter]

When a guy has two years left on his deal, there is not much reason to talk contract with him.

If Marv did sign him to an extension, you would ***** about him overpaying him and re-signing before he needed to.

[Mad Bomber]

I agree with Tatonka and NE39. Let him hold out. Its his career that he is hurting. If he sits out then he does not get paid, gets fined and suspend him so he does not play 6 games resulting in the not using up a year on the contract thus calling his bluff...He will lose more in the deal. He has done nothing for Buffalo. Don't come in here and demand a new contract. Get your head out of the clouds and get a dose of reality.
:bf1:

[patmoran2006]

Your right. I'd ***** anyway.. .Because I never would've traded away Takeo Spikes, even AFTER drafting POZ.

If Spikes worked out, Ellison is great depth. If he doesnt, Ellison starts and Spikes' saves cap room. Id feel good about our LB's with Spikes/Crowell and POZ there, and Ellison. Walker doesnt do anything for me in terms of making the DL better. Just pretend Tripplett is there every play, it's the same thing.

Forget the money, Walker isnt worth trading Takeo Spikes for, period.

[gr8slayer]

Not my point.. Yes, teams do have players threatening holdouts.

And NE39 is 100% right as well. We do hold the leverage when it comes to Walker.

My point is. Why did we trade for him in the first place? Apparently, he hasn't even visited Buffalo yet? (that's what his agent said right)

Why trade for a guy, and give up a starting LB in return, without knowing his feelings about his contract or anything else? It makes no sense to me.

I'm sorry- I love Marv Levy to death and don't ever question his competence, but in comparison to his GM peers, I think he's continuing to get schooled.
Yeah because our record was worse last year than the year before :rolleyes:

You need to go back to being Negative Nancy, the name fits you better.

[OpIv37]

It is not the same. Last year there were two rookies... They won't be rookies this year. I know you think players do not improve with experience, but most others (including nearly every single NFL coach) think they do.

once again, player improvement alone over the course of ONE YEAR is not enough to fix 28th against the run, especially with shaky LB's behind the DL. And also, one of those rookies that you're counting on improving didn't play for most of the season- you don't get better by not playing. So, player improvement may be enough to get us from 28th against the run to 24th or 25th. Forgive me for being less than encouraged.

[gr8slayer]

once again, player improvement alone over the course of ONE YEAR is not enough to fix 28th against the run, especially with shaky LB's behind the DL. And also, one of those rookies that you're counting on improving didn't play for most of the season- you don't get better by not playing. So, player improvement may be enough to get us from 28th against the run to 24th or 25th. Forgive me for being less than encouraged.
And one off-season isn't going to fix that problem either. We aren't a team (on paper) that is ready to make the jump yet. It takes time.

[OpIv37]

And one off-season isn't going to fix that problem either. We aren't a team (on paper) that is ready to make the jump yet. It takes time.

It's been 7 years- how much time does it take?

It didn't take the Jets time. It didn't take the Saints time. Every year, some team goes from a top 10 draft pick to the playoffs, meanwhile we improve by a game or two only to regress again the following season.

[Dr. Lecter]

It's been 7 years- how much time does it take?

It didn't take the Jets time. It didn't take the Saints time. Every year, some team goes from a top 10 draft pick to the playoffs, meanwhile we improve by a game or two only to regress again the following season.

7 years???????

Marv has been in charge for 7 years????

[Dr. Lecter]

Your right. I'd ***** anyway.. .Because I never would've traded away Takeo Spikes, even AFTER drafting POZ.

If Spikes worked out, Ellison is great depth. If he doesnt, Ellison starts and Spikes' saves cap room. Id feel good about our LB's with Spikes/Crowell and POZ there, and Ellison. Walker doesnt do anything for me in terms of making the DL better. Just pretend Tripplett is there every play, it's the same thing.

Forget the money, Walker isnt worth trading Takeo Spikes for, period.

Since that happened already, and you have approximately 1,483 posts *****ing about it, can we move and talk about what should happen now that the trade is done?

The trade is done. It is not being undone. *****ing about any action taken now is stupid and proves that you are happier when *****ing.

[gr8slayer]

It's been 7 years- how much time does it take?

It didn't take the Jets time. It didn't take the Saints time. Every year, some team goes from a top 10 draft pick to the playoffs, meanwhile we improve by a game or two only to regress again the following season.
The Jets happened to have the talent in place, they had a great roster of players and got a bit lucky in some of their games.

The Saints had a great off-season and drafted all the right players.

Who's to say we are going to regress this year?

[gr8slayer]

7 years???????

Marv has been in charge for 7 years????
Where have you been?

[OpIv37]

7 years???????

Marv has been in charge for 7 years????

:rolleyes:

I don't know about you, but I was a fan of the team since long before Marv became GM. Therefore, those years still count. It's well past time for this team to be winning again.

[DaBillzAhDaShiznit]

:rolleyes:

I don't know about you, but I was a fan of the team since long before Marv became GM. Therefore, those years still count. It's well past time for this team to be winning again.


ABSOLUTELY! I am tired of the organization's excuses and the fans excuses.
Marv has a plan....Donahoe had a plan.....the next guy down the line will have a plan....I have a plan; LET'S WIN for God's sake!

I won't be buying tickets this year to see another rebuilding year.

[Dr. Lecter]

:rolleyes:

I don't know about you, but I was a fan of the team since long before Marv became GM. Therefore, those years still count. It's well past time for this team to be winning again.

But they don't count when *****ing about Marv's moves.

The point is he is starting from scratch, which is what happens when new guys come in.

Remember that when half of the panic ridden, over reaction machins want a total regime change this year if the team does not have a perfect season.

[TedMock]

I've foolishly allowed myself to read through this thread and I have a few things that I'd like to mention because I'm confused.

1. I don't think anybody is rooting against Spikes. Why would they and where does this come from? He's in the NFC East now. Good luck TKO. Wish you well.

2. Spikes was not a full time starter last season even after the injury, so we really didn't lose a "starting" linebacker. Again, where does this come from? Because he was on the field on first down? Ok. I guess 2nd, 3rd, and 4th don't count?

3. If Marv new (I'm sure he did) about the contract issue with Walker and anybody here thinks that conversations haven't taken place then you seriously need to get on medication and come back to earth.

4. For anybody downplaying McCargo's talent - you really need to look at the rush defense before and after he went down. He struggled in his first game and played very well plugging holes the next 3 before going down. He won't hit the stat sheet, but a DT plugging running lanes shouldn't. Go back and watch the games or look at the opposing team's rush / game before and after he went down.

5. A contractual holdout on ANY team EVERY year is pretty standard practice. It's not a big deal right now and it may never be a big deal...and I'm not a 12-year old girl who's going to cry about something that is trivial at the moment. But, hey, that's just me. Carry on.

[Romes]

I've foolishly allowed myself to read through this thread and I have a few things that I'd like to mention because I'm confused.

1. I don't think anybody is rooting against Spikes. Why would they and where does this come from? He's in the NFC East now. Good luck TKO. Wish you well.

2. Spikes was not a full time starter last season even after the injury, so we really didn't lose a "starting" linebacker. Again, where does this come from? Because he was on the field on first down? Ok. I guess 2nd, 3rd, and 4th don't coun't?

3. If Marv new (I'm sure he did) about the contract issue with Walker and anybody here thinks that conversations haven't taken place then you seriously need to get on medication and come back to earth.

4. For anybody downplaying McCargo's talent - you really need to look at the rush defense before and after he went down. He struggled in his first game and played very well plugging holes the next 3 before going down. He won't hit the stat sheet, but a DT plugging running lanes shouldn't. Go back and watch the games or look at the opposing team's rush / game before and after he went down.

5. A contractual holdout on ANY team EVERY year is pretty standard practice. It's not a big deal right now and it may never be a big deal...and I'm not a 12-year old girl who's going to cry about something that is trivial at the moment. But, hey, that's just me. Carry on.

:bf1:

Sense and rationality to the rescue!

[Mr. Pink]

I've foolishly allowed myself to read through this thread and I have a few things that I'd like to mention because I'm confused.

5. A contractual holdout on ANY team EVERY year is pretty standard practice. It's not a big deal right now and it may never be a big deal...and I'm not a 12-year old girl who's going to cry about something that is trivial at the moment. But, hey, that's just me. Carry on.

Complete Agreement on this.

It's only May 11th not Aug 11th.

If Walker is still holding out then, then we have something to worry about. There's still time to get it done, get him in here and acclimated to our defensive philosophy and schemes.

[jdbillsfan]

Your right. I'd ***** anyway.. .Because I never would've traded away Takeo Spikes, even AFTER drafting POZ.

If Spikes worked out, Ellison is great depth. If he doesnt, Ellison starts and Spikes' saves cap room. Id feel good about our LB's with Spikes/Crowell and POZ there, and Ellison. Walker doesnt do anything for me in terms of making the DL better. Just pretend Tripplett is there every play, it's the same thing.

Forget the money, Walker isnt worth trading Takeo Spikes for, period.

Spikes was on the verge of being cut. It seems like after players don't want to be somewhere and there is some doubt from the franchise about that players abilities, that many teams don't trade for those players, they wait until they get cut.

I think Marv and co were happy to get something for Spikes. This isn't the first time a player gets cut that people around the league and even the local fan base doesn't understand, but it happens a lot.

After Fletcher didn't get re-signed, the writing was on the wall. The team wants to go in a different direction. The player didn't want to be there. It's not that hard to understand.

Spikes may still be good, but it's not going to be here. Its time to get over it.

Why did Keyshawn get cut? Cowart not resigned? Arrington cut? The list goes on.

[Jan Reimers]

I've foolishly allowed myself to read through this thread and I have a few things that I'd like to mention because I'm confused.

1. I don't think anybody is rooting against Spikes. Why would they and where does this come from? He's in the NFC East now. Good luck TKO. Wish you well.

2. Spikes was not a full time starter last season even after the injury, so we really didn't lose a "starting" linebacker. Again, where does this come from? Because he was on the field on first down? Ok. I guess 2nd, 3rd, and 4th don't count?

3. If Marv new (I'm sure he did) about the contract issue with Walker and anybody here thinks that conversations haven't taken place then you seriously need to get on medication and come back to earth.

4. For anybody downplaying McCargo's talent - you really need to look at the rush defense before and after he went down. He struggled in his first game and played very well plugging holes the next 3 before going down. He won't hit the stat sheet, but a DT plugging running lanes shouldn't. Go back and watch the games or look at the opposing team's rush / game before and after he went down.

5. A contractual holdout on ANY team EVERY year is pretty standard practice. It's not a big deal right now and it may never be a big deal...and I'm not a 12-year old girl who's going to cry about something that is trivial at the moment. But, hey, that's just me. Carry on.
Great post. Thank you.

[Michael82]

I've foolishly allowed myself to read through this thread and I have a few things that I'd like to mention because I'm confused.

1. I don't think anybody is rooting against Spikes. Why would they and where does this come from? He's in the NFC East now. Good luck TKO. Wish you well.

2. Spikes was not a full time starter last season even after the injury, so we really didn't lose a "starting" linebacker. Again, where does this come from? Because he was on the field on first down? Ok. I guess 2nd, 3rd, and 4th don't count?

3. If Marv new (I'm sure he did) about the contract issue with Walker and anybody here thinks that conversations haven't taken place then you seriously need to get on medication and come back to earth.

4. For anybody downplaying McCargo's talent - you really need to look at the rush defense before and after he went down. He struggled in his first game and played very well plugging holes the next 3 before going down. He won't hit the stat sheet, but a DT plugging running lanes shouldn't. Go back and watch the games or look at the opposing team's rush / game before and after he went down.

5. A contractual holdout on ANY team EVERY year is pretty standard practice. It's not a big deal right now and it may never be a big deal...and I'm not a 12-year old girl who's going to cry about something that is trivial at the moment. But, hey, that's just me. Carry on.
Excellent post! :bf1:

[raphael120]

i just hope our rookies last year "get it" this year and explode, and not implode...

the name of the game is keep building, not rebuild. were building the foundation...this isnt a "rebuilding" year, it's an "improvement" year.

[ShadowHawk7]

Oh geez, I thought we got screwed in the Spikes trade as it was, but this is even worse. Hopefully things will improve among our front 7.

[DaBillzAhDaShiznit]

i jut hope our rookies last year "get it" this year and explode, and not implode...

the name of the game is keep building, not rebuild. were building the foundation...this isnt a "rebuilding" year, it's an "improvement" year.

How is changing 60% of the offensive line, reworking your running back stable, and replacing three seasoned defensive veterans with young, inexperienced players not rebuilding?