Cash to Cap may be the answer to keeping our top soon to be FA's

[jpdex12]

Anyone stop to think that before you critisize the cash to cap philosophy you should try to understand why our FO is using this method?

We are going to have some young players at crutial positions that will become FA's soon. Knowing that we will need a sizeable amount of money to dish out to keep them just maybe our FO is using this strategy to allow us $$ to sign them in the future. If OBD has the cash in the future to spend on them then we can, if we spend it now in other areas rather than keeping control of spending then we will have to let some of these players walk.

It's conserve now to spend later! None of us really have a clear understanding of how the financials of these contracts plays out so why get in a tizzy about it when there is no point? We don't have crystal balls and don't know how things will play out but there has to be reasons for OBD to adopt this new philosophy with the new regime. Marv and Ralph and Polian dished out big contracts in the early 90's to keep players that they knew were the core of this team...don't you think that they will try to do it again if need be? Did they let Jim Kelly walk? Did they let Andre Reed walk? Did they let Thurman walk? Did they let Bruce and half of the other defensive beasts walk? Nope. Yes their financial philosophy may have been different then and the cap was not as it is now but spending money is no different.

If OBD sees it necessary to keep certain players when the tim eis right, then they will. Nate was replaceable and we can find a replacement for his position rather than shell out 90 million. That is a good example of smart savings. If they feel JP is our next franchise QB, then he'll get his money from OBD otherwise Edwards will be the man if they groom him properly. If Evans keeps putting up great numbers then he will be the next Andre Reed put paid like Andre Johnson.

Have confidence in cash to cap it may just save our team in the near future.

[OpIv37]

Re: Cash to Cap may be the answer to keeping our top soon to be FA's

Cash to cap will save our team IF AND ONLY IF it is used as a temporary strategy. Eventually, we will have to shell out to keep our young guys, and if having the cap space allows us to do that, it's a good thing. But if our guys walk anyway or if we can't attract good FA's because it would put us over the self-imposed cash to cap limit, then we will never win.

I'm hoping the FO realizes we're a year or two away from being competitive, and once we reach that point, they ditch cash to cap and shell out to get the missing pieces. That strategy will build a winning franchise.

[HHURRICANE]

Re: Cash to Cap may be the answer to keeping our top soon to be FA's

Cash to cap will save our team IF AND ONLY IF it is used as a temporary strategy. Eventually, we will have to shell out to keep our young guys, and if having the cap space allows us to do that, it's a good thing. But if our guys walk anyway or if we can't attract good FA's because it would put us over the self-imposed cash to cap limit, then we will never win.

I'm hoping the FO realizes we're a year or two away from being competitive, and once we reach that point, they ditch cash to cap and shell out to get the missing pieces. That strategy will build a winning franchise.

If we beat the Titans we might have won that Superbowl.

This team is kind of like that one. I think if we get close the "cash to cap" scenario gets thrown out the window to get that Superbowl win.

[streetkings01]

Re: Cash to Cap may be the answer to keeping our top soon to be FA's

I can name 5 players right off the bat that we are going to have to pay some serious money to.....

#1 - Lee Evans: expect him to receive top 5 WR money
#2 - JP Losman: depending on this year he should receive top 10 QB money
#3 - Jason Peters: after he has a monster 2007 season, expect his agent to want to rework his deal to have him paid as a LT....not a RT
#4 - Aaron Schobel: He has been our best pass rusher since he was drafted and the fact that Kelsey and Denney were overpaid and their production doesn't come close to his....expect him to want contract in the range of top 5 DE's in the NFL
#5 - Angelo Crowell - his contract is up after the 08 season....expect him to receive a very nice contract.

With those guys right there thats around 35-40 million just in base salary...it's gonna get real crazy after this season!

[raphael120]

Re: Cash to Cap may be the answer to keeping our top soon to be FA's

Out of all those guys, I honestly see Schobel as being the odd man out. Look at all the guys we have at DE. They're trying to see who can be the guy to step it up and maybe take his place next season.

I think we'll be able to keep Peters, JP, and Evans. If the Bills are commited to winning, then they should be commited to keeping their best guys, at least most of them.

[HHURRICANE]

Re: Cash to Cap may be the answer to keeping our top soon to be FA's

I can name 5 players right off the bat that we are going to have to pay some serious money to.....

#1 - Lee Evans: expect him to receive top 5 WR money
#2 - JP Losman: depending on this year he should receive top 10 QB money
#3 - Jason Peters: after he has a monster 2007 season, expect his agent to want to rework his deal to have him paid as a LT....not a RT
#4 - Aaron Schobel: He has been our best pass rusher since he was drafted and the fact that Kelsey and Denney were overpaid and their production doesn't come close to his....expect him to want contract in the range of top 5 DE's in the NFL
#5 - Angelo Crowell - his contract is up after the 08 season....expect him to receive a very nice contract.

With those guys right there thats around 35-40 million just in base salary...it's gonna get real crazy after this season!

I agree with everything except Schobel. We'll let him walk.

[raphael120]

Re: Cash to Cap may be the answer to keeping our top soon to be FA's

You know what though.

Because we might let Schobel walk is the reason i'm kinda pissed off. We throw a boat load of money at an average at best DE in Kelsay, and we totally **** over our best performer season in and season out since he's been drafted to the Bills in Schobel. Just shows how ass backwards things are sometimes at the FO.

I honestly believe we shouldve let Kelsay walk, thrown money at Schobel and let Denney, Hagrove, and Ah You play cheaply and used that money saved and either drafted a beast of a DE next year, or pick one up in FA. It just doesn't add up.

Now if Kelsay all of a sudden matches the production of Schobel, i'll eat my words, but I just don't see that happening.

[Saratoga Slim]

Re: Cash to Cap may be the answer to keeping our top soon to be FA's

Cash to cap will save our team IF AND ONLY IF it is used as a temporary strategy. Eventually, we will have to shell out to keep our young guys, and if having the cap space allows us to do that, it's a good thing. But if our guys walk anyway or if we can't attract good FA's because it would put us over the self-imposed cash to cap limit, then we will never win.

I'm hoping the FO realizes we're a year or two away from being competitive, and once we reach that point, they ditch cash to cap and shell out to get the missing pieces. That strategy will build a winning franchise.

I think you're probably right Op. I don't think the FO has ever said that cash to cap is a permanent strategy. If we get to where we are truly missing only a few pieces, maybe it'll get tossed out the door--or at least relaxed.

[jpdex12]

Re: Cash to Cap may be the answer to keeping our top soon to be FA's

You know what though.

Because we might let Schobel walk is the reason i'm kinda pissed off. We throw a boat load of money at an average at best DE in Kelsay, and we totally **** over our best performer season in and season out since he's been drafted to the Bills in Schobel. Just shows how ass backwards things are sometimes at the FO.

I honestly believe we shouldve let Kelsay walk, thrown money at Schobel and let Denney, Hagrove, and Ah You play cheaply and used that money saved and either drafted a beast of a DE next year, or pick one up in FA. It just doesn't add up.

Now if Kelsay all of a sudden matches the production of Schobel, i'll eat my words, but I just don't see that happening.

Maybe you're right but think about this...

Everyone expects their team to pay their players and a lot of fans complain about their team if the FO decides to let a good player walk that may be getting old and will command a big paycheck. I love the whole loyalty factor with player and team but we need to remember as fans that this game that we love is a business for the players and teams. While it is nice to pay a player like London Fletcher good money because he performed admirable and loyal or like Schobel who has been a model player we have to realize that a lot of players back out on their deal and ask for a new contract so why can't a team release a player who is getting older that will command a contract that is too high for the later years of his career? We need to show compassion to both the team and the player when discussing this issue. Loyalty is not so much a special character of player and team anymore!

Talk about loyalty, where's the loyalty of the current players and NFLPA for the pioneers of the NFL? This game has more business components than it ever did, we need to realize this more as fans. We are the only ones left with high loyalty standards!

If Shobel is let go then I salute him for the great efforts he gave us and wish him well like Fletcher and trust that OBD has a suitable player to step in and fill the new position and then watch them walk when they are approaching the wrong side of 30.

If you want to see a fair arrangement for a player who is 30+ then front load the first 1-2 years of a 3 year contract and then get your monies worth out of the first two years of the 3 year deal before he gets dumped. BTW, the contract can't be too overblown, otherwise send them down the road if that's not good enough.

[patmoran2006]

Re: Cash to Cap may be the answer to keeping our top soon to be FA's

Anyone stop to think that before you critisize the cash to cap philosophy you should try to understand why our FO is using this method?

We are going to have some young players at crutial positions that will become FA's soon. Knowing that we will need a sizeable amount of money to dish out to keep them just maybe our FO is using this strategy to allow us $$ to sign them in the future. If OBD has the cash in the future to spend on them then we can, if we spend it now in other areas rather than keeping control of spending then we will have to let some of these players walk.

It's conserve now to spend later! None of us really have a clear understanding of how the financials of these contracts plays out so why get in a tizzy about it when there is no point? We don't have crystal balls and don't know how things will play out but there has to be reasons for OBD to adopt this new philosophy with the new regime. Marv and Ralph and Polian dished out big contracts in the early 90's to keep players that they knew were the core of this team...don't you think that they will try to do it again if need be? Did they let Jim Kelly walk? Did they let Andre Reed walk? Did they let Thurman walk? Did they let Bruce and half of the other defensive beasts walk? Nope. Yes their financial philosophy may have been different then and the cap was not as it is now but spending money is no different.

If OBD sees it necessary to keep certain players when the tim eis right, then they will. Nate was replaceable and we can find a replacement for his position rather than shell out 90 million. That is a good example of smart savings. If they feel JP is our next franchise QB, then he'll get his money from OBD otherwise Edwards will be the man if they groom him properly. If Evans keeps putting up great numbers then he will be the next Andre Reed put paid like Andre Johnson.

Have confidence in cash to cap it may just save our team in the near future.

your a good poster, but this not accurate and won't happen.

The Bills MUST scrap the cash to cap when it comes to extending and resigning some of our YOUNG studs.. Mathematics say they will lose players if all their bonuses/guarenteed monies is paid up front.

Cash to Cap is a good excuse to get rid of aging vets like Spikes, Vincent, Milloy, Adams, Fletcher, etc who were past or near-past their prime.

But cash to cap when it comes to the young core players is absolutely pure cheap bull**** cop-out by the worst owner in the entire NFL, period.

[Saratoga Slim]

Re: Cash to Cap may be the answer to keeping our top soon to be FA's

But cash to cap when it comes to the young core players is absolutely pure cheap bull**** cop-out by the worst owner in the entire NFL, period.

Do you mean "But IF RALPH STICKS TO THE cash to cap when it comes to the young core players, AND WE THEN LOSE THOSE CORE PLAYERS, THAT WILL BE absolutely pure cheap bull**** cop-out, AND RALPH WILL HAVE TO BE CONSIDERED the worst owner in the entire NFL, period."

If that's what you mean, I agree 100%. But I think we need to future tense it a bit as of right now, don't you? As of right now there are no facts that require the conclusion that Ralph is going to let Schobel, Losman, Evans, or Peters walk because of the cash to cap philosophy.

[SquishDaFish]

Re: Cash to Cap may be the answer to keeping our top soon to be FA's

Do you mean "But IF RALPH STICKS TO THE cash to cap when it comes to the young core players, AND WE THEN LOSE THOSE CORE PLAYERS, THAT WILL BE absolutely pure cheap bull**** cop-out, AND RALPH WILL HAVE TO BE CONSIDERED the worst owner in the entire NFL, period."

If that's what you mean, I agree 100%. But I think we need to future tense it a bit as of right now, don't you? As of right now there are no facts that require the conclusion that Ralph is going to let Schobel, Losman, Evans, or Peters walk because of the cash to cap philosophy.

Awesome posting bro.

[patmoran2006]

Re: Cash to Cap may be the answer to keeping our top soon to be FA's

Do you mean "But IF RALPH STICKS TO THE cash to cap when it comes to the young core players, AND WE THEN LOSE THOSE CORE PLAYERS, THAT WILL BE absolutely pure cheap bull**** cop-out, AND RALPH WILL HAVE TO BE CONSIDERED the worst owner in the entire NFL, period."

If that's what you mean, I agree 100%. But I think we need to future tense it a bit as of right now, don't you? As of right now there are no facts that require the conclusion that Ralph is going to let Schobel, Losman, Evans, or Peters walk because of the cash to cap philosophy.

Fair enough.. "If" Ralph sticks to cash to cap.

But would you agree that if we DO STICK to our cash to cap philosophy we'll be waving "see ya" to at least a good part of these upcoming FA's?

[Saratoga Slim]

Re: Cash to Cap may be the answer to keeping our top soon to be FA's

Fair enough.. "If" Ralph sticks to cash to cap.

But would you agree that if we DO STICK to our cash to cap philosophy we'll be waving "see ya" to at least a good part of these upcoming FA's?

I agree that we're going to have some big contracts that need to get written in the same 1-2 year span. I'm no cap whiz but you're right, it does seem like if we stick to our self-imposed cap and don't engage in creative pro-ration of bonuses, we may have some problems keeping all our rock stars.

Even if that's not the case--i.e. say we're 30M under next year's cap and extend, say, Schobel and Evans to the tune of 25M in signing bonuses applied wholly towards next year's cap, that won't leave us a whole lot to work with towards other FAs (employing the cash to cap philosophy). I guess that's what I'm more worried about - being hamstrung in the FA market bythe cash to cap theory after paying a reaonable market rate to keep our core young players. I don't really see even Ralph letting Losman, Evans, Schobel or Peters get away.

[patmoran2006]

Re: Cash to Cap may be the answer to keeping our top soon to be FA's

I don't really see even Ralph letting Losman, Evans, Schobel or Peters get away.

I sorta apologize for sounding like a cynical ass on Ralph Wilson. But If I'm being honest I'm hoping its a new Buffalo Bills owner that's not letting Losman, Evans, Schobel and Peters get away.

Trust me.. as long as its an owner committed to keeping the team in Buffalo, everyone from the front office down onto the fans will be happier.

anyone who thinks Wilson is still a competent owner in today's NFL is fooling themselves.