Vanek

[patmoran2006]

Vanek is doing BACKFLIPS right now.

Going into his third year.. 43 goals last year.. Led the NHL in plus/minus.

We let our "old" guys go so we can lock up our star young guys.. I hope someone offers him a MONSTER contract so we can find out if thats truly Regier's philosophy or if we're just flat-out that ****in cheap.

I talked to someone from WGR, and they said dont be surprised if a team like Montreal or New Jersey offers him well in excess of $7 million per year in an offer sheet. Four draft picks, only 2 of which are first rounders-- are not a big price to pay for a guy that talented who hasnt even hit his prime yet.

[don137]

What scares me is someone offering he a huge contract upfront like the Rangers did to Gomez and the Flyers did to Briere. Both players will make 10MM this year. While the cap hit will be lower for those guys since they take the average of the contract and spread it across the length of the contract. If a high revenue team wants Vanek they can offer him a long contract for seven years and maybe 45MM with 9-10MM in the first year which would put Buffalo in the red and will cause them to not come close to reaching the cap.

[THATHURMANATOR]

Vanek is doing BACKFLIPS right now.

Going into his third year.. 43 goals last year.. Led the NHL in plus/minus.

We let our "old" guys go so we can lock up our star young guys.. I hope someone offers him a MONSTER contract so we can find out if thats truly Regier's philosophy or if we're just flat-out that ****in cheap.

I talked to someone from WGR, and they said dont be surprised if a team like Montreal or New Jersey offers him well in excess of $7 million per year in an offer sheet. Four draft picks, only 2 of which are first rounders-- are not a big price to pay for a guy that talented who hasnt even hit his prime yet.Pretty sure it is 4 first rounders if it is a deal of 5 mil or more per.

[carybillsfan]

Nobody will offer anything for him because he'll file for arbitration get a one year deal for $7M, and next year we won't renegoiate, and we all know the Rangers will give him a 10 year $100M deal.

[patmoran2006]

Nobody will offer anything for him because he'll file for arbitration get a one year deal for $7M, and next year we won't renegoiate, and we all know the Rangers will give him a 10 year $100M deal.
Why would a team want to wait until next year? They dont have to. A team can give him $10-11 million up front right now.

And yes, Vanek will go to arbitration and play out a one year deal-- IF the Sabres dont offer him at least $6-7 million per year (and im going to go on a limb and say we wont)

[patmoran2006]

Pretty sure it is 4 first rounders if it is a deal of 5 mil or more per.
Nope.. Two first rounders, a second and a third. I think the magic number is $5.38 or somethign real close to that.

it USED to be four first rounders, but not anymore.

[THATHURMANATOR]

Nope.. Two first rounders, a second and a third. I think the magic number is $5.38 or somethign real close to that.

it USED to be four first rounders, but not anymore.
Can this be clarified somewhere? I am not saying you are wrong just that I have heard differently.

[carybillsfan]

Why would a team want to wait until next year? They dont have to. A team can give him $10-11 million up front right now.

And yes, Vanek will go to arbitration and play out a one year deal-- IF the Sabres dont offer him at least $6-7 million per year (and im going to go on a limb and say we wont)

That's not a real high limb your on.

[patmoran2006]

Can this be clarified somewhere? I am not saying you are wrong just that I have heard differently.
Actually, you are right on this one. The amount does matter.

here is a link with a table, found it on a Minnesota Wild board.
http://boards.wild.com/index.php?showtopic=13387&pid=314786&st=0&#entry314786

If a team offers Vanek between 4-5 million per season- then its four picks (but only two first rounders)

To offer more than $5 million means four first rounders.. Good call


However though.. STILL dont be shocked if a team offers him $6-7 million.. Would you rather have four first round possibilities, or a guy who's just entering year three who has already scored 43 goals and led the league in +/-.

The four first rounders MAY detract a team-- but I still wouldnt be shocked to see a huge offer made.

[mchurchfie]

Regier will screw this one up somehow also, I wouldn't get my hopes up. I have ZERO confidence in Sabres managment anymore.:cynic:

[patmoran2006]

Is there a position in hockey where you can be in charge of trades and player evaluations and have NOT A THING TO DO WITH CONTRACTS?

Im not sure I ever heard a Sabre say something good about him when it came to dealing with him.

[THATHURMANATOR]

Actually, you are right on this one. The amount does matter.

here is a link with a table, found it on a Minnesota Wild board.
http://boards.wild.com/index.php?showtopic=13387&pid=314786&st=0&#entry314786

If a team offers Vanek between 4-5 million per season- then its four picks (but only two first rounders)

To offer more than $5 million means four first rounders.. Good call


However though.. STILL dont be shocked if a team offers him $6-7 million.. Would you rather have four first round possibilities, or a guy who's just entering year three who has already scored 43 goals and led the league in +/-.

The four first rounders MAY detract a team-- but I still wouldnt be shocked to see a huge offer made.
I just cant see a team giving up 4 firsts for Vanek. If they are in the 4 mil range I can't see the Sabres not matching

[mchurchfie]

I can't see the Sabres not matching
I absolutely can.

[THATHURMANATOR]

I absolutely can.
You don't think they would match a 4 year 16 mil contract?

[Historian]

Regier will screw this one up somehow also, I wouldn't get my hopes up. I have ZERO confidence in Sabres managment anymore.:cynic:

Yea...they'll let him walk too.

[mchurchfie]

You don't think they would match a 4 year 16 mil contract?
If someone comes after Vanek its going to be a much higher contract than that Thurm. These people aren't stupid, they know that Sabres managmnet will blink after a certain figure. Hell, they might even blink on 16 mill tight as they are.

[Philagape]

Darcy is the undisputed world champion of blinking

[patmoran2006]

A team that signs Vanek wont worry about Buffalo matching, they know we wont.

They'll consider is Vanek worth four first rounders-- and if its a team that is routinely good and will draft later in the round- the answer will be yes.

I wouldnt be the least bit surprised to see New Jersey offer Vanek a deal in the $7 million per range.

The Islanders lost Smyth and Blake and bought out Yashin they got a pile of money too.

[THATHURMANATOR]

If someone comes after Vanek its going to be a much higher contract than that Thurm. These people aren't stupid, they know that Sabres managmnet will blink after a certain figure. Hell, they might even blink on 16 mill tight as they are.
Right and at that point they give up 4 first round picks. I can't see a team wanting to give that up.

[patmoran2006]

Plus mind you.

The offer goes by AVERAGE SALARY.

A team can offer Vanek 7 years for $34.75 million-- and pay him $10 mill per year for each of the first two years. It would only cost them two first rounders.

If that happens, bye bye Vanek.

[patmoran2006]

Right and at that point they give up 4 first round picks. I can't see a team wanting to give that up.
can you see a team offering him $4.99 million per year over 8 years ala Briere and highly FRONT LOADING the money so Buffalo won't match it ?

[THATHURMANATOR]

can you see a team offering him $4.99 million per year over 8 years ala Briere and highly FRONT LOADING the money so Buffalo won't match it ?
No

[patmoran2006]

Care to elaborate how you don't see that happening since it seems to be the trend this free agency period.

IF a team wants Vanek, you DONT think the first few years of that deal are going to be $9-10 million, maybe even more?

[ddaryl]

Nobody will offer anything for him because he'll file for arbitration get a one year deal for $7M, and next year we won't renegoiate, and we all know the Rangers will give him a 10 year $100M deal.


The rangers will be running out of cap room real soon. Spending big in FA with a salary cap is a double edged sword. Expect many of these teams to be in purge mode in a few years.

[carybillsfan]

The rangers will be running out of cap room real soon. Spending big in FA with a salary cap is a double edged sword. Expect many of these teams to be in purge mode in a few years.

Not at the rate the salary cap is rising $39M -> $44M ~13% increase, $44M->$50.3M 14.3%. If the cap continues these double digit increases every year the cap will be over $60M in 2 years, there would be no need to purge as long as the players are performing.

[BillsSabresB.C.T. Fan]

Nobody will offer anything for him because he'll file for arbitration get a one year deal for $7M, and next year we won't renegoiate, and we all know the Rangers will give him a 10 year $100M deal.

He can't go to arbitration! he's not eligable

[carybillsfan]

He can't go to arbitration! he's not eligable

Yes he is, he's a RFA who has been tendered and not signed. By the terms of the new 2005 CBA: He has the right to take the Sabres to arbitration to settle a salary dispute. At the end of the year following arbitration a RFA becomes an UFA.

Remember Briere last season?

[carybillsfan]

He can't go to arbitration! he's not eligable

In case you don't believe here is the link to Article 12 of the CBA:
http://www.nhl.com/cba/2005-CBA.pdf

A player is eligible to elect salary arbitration if the player meets the qualifications set forth in the following chart and in Section 12.1(b) below:
First Contract Signing Age Minimum Level of Professional
Experience Required to be
Eligible for Salary Arbitration
18-20 4 years professional experience
21 3 years professional experience
22-23 2 years professional experience -Vanek falls in here
24 1 years professional experience

[Philagape]

From Sabres blogger:

I spoke briefly with Stephen Bartlett, the agent for Thomas Vanek.

He told me that there have been no "substantial" discussions regarding Vanek's contract, however, he understands that the Sabres have been busy/preoccupied with UFA business of late. He expects that the pace will pick up soon.

"We have plenty of time between now and the beginning of the season", he told me.

http://www.hockeybuzz.com/blog.php?post_id=8402

I'd put the over/under on making an offer to Vanek the night before training camp begins.

[Ebenezer]

if Vanek doesn't get an offer from another team then the players might rightfully scream collusion...

that being said, it won't be money that will cause the Sabres to lose Vanek...if some GM were smart they would be talking 8 or 10 year deal...no way DR matches that. He only offered DB and CD 5 year deals to save face. This team, til they prove otherwise, has no intention of signing a player for more than 4 years.

[carybillsfan]

if Vanek doesn't get an offer from another team then the players might rightfully scream collusion...

that being said, it won't be money that will cause the Sabres to lose Vanek...if some GM were smart they would be talking 8 or 10 year deal...no way DR matches that. He only offered DB and CD 5 year deals to save face. This team, til they prove otherwise, has no intention of signing a player for more than 4 years.

Darcy said in the PC that 2 years ago 3yr/$3M deal was the norm. Way to go Sabres always living in the past.