NFL investigating spying by the patriots

[CuseJetsFan83]

http://www.nfl.com/news/story?id=09000d5d8023a2fb&template=with-video&confirm=true

NEW YORK -- The NFL is looking into claims a New England Patriots (http://www.nfl.com/teams/newenglandpatriots/profile?team=NE) employee was videotaping signals by Jets coaches on New York's sideline during the season opener.
The investigation was first reported by ESPN.com, which said that NFL security confiscated a video camera and tape from a Patriots employee during New England's 38-14 victory Sunday. The employee was accused of aiming his camera at the Jets' defensive coaches, who were sending signals out to the players, sources told the Web site.

*edit* feel free to merge with other thread....... didn't see it on the Bills board

[TigerJ]

Bill Belicheat is at it again.

[CuseJetsFan83]

Bill Belicheat is at it again.

if the cheating is in fact true, it will just justify my hatred for new england anymore, but of course if it is proved to be not true, they gave us a woodshed beating

[El Guapo]

I think Miami accused them of this same type of thing last year. I blew it off at the time, thinking they were sore losers (which they are), but maybe there are some teeth to this.

[Gunzlingr]

I saw that Greenbay threw the same guy out of the game last year for recording it.

[AndreReed83]

ESPNNews is now reporting that the NFL has determined the Patriots broke the rules, but hasn't specified beyond that.

[Mudflap1]

NFL commissioner Roger Goodell has determined that the New England Patriots violated league rules Sunday when they videotaped defensive signals by the New York Jets' coaches, league sources have told ESPN's Chris Mortensen.



NFL security officials confiscated a camera and videotape from Patriots video assistant Matt Estrella on the New England sidelines when it was suspected he was recording the Jets' defensive signals. Sources say the visual evidence confirmed the suspicion.



Goodell is considering severe sanctions, including the possibility of docking the Patriots "multiple draft picks" because it is the competitive violation in the wake of a stern warning to all teams since he became commissioner, the sources said. The Patriots have been suspected in previous incidents.



The Patriots will be allowed an opportunity to present their case by Friday, sources said, most likely via the telephone.



The league also was reviewing a possible violation into the number of radio frequencies the Patriots were using during Sunday's game, sources said. The team did not have a satisfactory explanation when asked about possible irregularities in its communication setup during the game.



Goodell is expected to have a decision no later than Friday but that is not set in stone.



The league refused comment but did confirm Monday that they were reviewing a possible violation by the Patriots.



Chris Mortensen covers the NFL for ESPN.

[The King]

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=3014677

Per ESPN




NFL commissioner Roger Goodell has determined that the New England Patriots (http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/clubhouse?team=nwe) violated league rules Sunday when they videotaped defensive signals by the New York Jets (http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/clubhouse?team=nyj)' coaches, league sources have told ESPN's Chris Mortensen.

NFL security officials confiscated a camera and videotape from Patriots video assistant Matt Estrella on the New England sidelines when it was suspected he was recording the Jets' defensive signals. Sources say the visual evidence confirmed the suspicion.

[mchurchfie]

:bf1:

[SABURZFAN]

does Goddell punish Bellycheck,Kraft,or both? :idunno:

[gil]

if they don't come down with some sort of serious punishment on the coaching staff, then this whole crackdown on players is a joke - I say they should give Belicheck 4 games.

[raphael120]

Burn his hoody!

[The King]

Remember when the Pats were hated before this..... Yikes!

[SyraBillsLican]

It is so clear that the Patriots cheat. here is the evidence. im sure they do much more than this.

the entire franchise should be banned from the nfl

[shelby]

Thank you, i needed something to laugh about.
It will be interesting to see how Goodell reacts to this.

The thing that kills me is that the Patriots are clearly the best team in the AFCE....why the :curse: do they feel the need to cheat?
:madcurse:

[AndreReed83]

Make the Patriots play without a coaching staff for 4 games!

[The King]

I say make Belicheck coach a game topless that will humiliate his fat ass.

[SABURZFAN]

fine them some high draft picks. :biggrin:

[lordofgun]

They should cut off Tom Brady's right hand. :up:

[justasportsfan]

he had an affair with someone else's wife. That would make him a repeat offender. Pacman his arse. :D

[SABURZFAN]

forfeit the 1st and 2nd Rounders for the next 3 years.where's NE39 and his cheating ass? :snicker:

[The King]

He also fraternized with the Vikes

[gil]

Draft picks would be great, but I seriously don't understand why they would give Wade Wilson 5 games for taking HGH and not suspend Belicheck who undoubtedly should be held responsible as the head coach for cheating.

aren't taking performance enhancing drugs and actually cheating by spying on the other team on par?

granted, I hate them all so my viewpoint is biased, but I'd still like to see it.

[Romes]

They should cut off Tom Brady's right hand. :up:

Or how about give us a night with his girlfriend :hump:

[Meathead]

just give it to them

[Night Train]

ESPNEWS also saying the Pats could lose multiple draft picks as a penalty.

[patmoran2006]

Make them forfeit the game.

[duhbilz]

Is there a chance the Pats have been doing this since their first SB winning season? If so, wouldn't it be poetic justice to see them stripped of their titles if theres evidence pointing to the fact? I know it will never happen, but it sure does taint them and what they've done IMO.

[MTBillsFan]

Forfeit all vicotories under that dirty bastard Bellichick

[RedEyE]

I think a good majority of teams do this in one form or another. Do all teams do it? Probably not - but the fact remains that it has ben found to be illegal and there should definitly be a punishment handed out.

IMO, the punishment should fit the crime. I think the league should do a thorough investigation to get a rough estimate on how long this was going on for and for how many games. Look at film and detemine how many games the Patriots might have lost had they NOT used this unlawful approach. Fine Kraft a specific amount per game and then ban Belichek for as many games.

[zone]

We all know they cheat, I am so glad this is happening!

[Mad Bomber]

What a bunch of bastards. It's not enough just to own the officials...

[RedEyE]

Now if only we can get someone to release the tapes of the Pats coaching staff paying off the officials.....

[RedEyE]

If they were stealing radio frequencies too I say that the league should actually ban Belichek if found specifically invloved. it's one thing to steal signals, it's another to actually tune in on an opposing teams frequency to call in the plays. Total BS!!

[Bling]

They should be stripped off their win. The Jets got ****ed. Who knows what the game would be like if the Jets signals weren't being spied on? You don't know how much cheating affects the game.

[FlyingDutchman]

does anyone else think that the game against the Jets should be forfeited? I mean, hello?? they were stealing the freaking plays! You cant really cheat any worse than that in the game of football.

[Ingtar33]

i still don't believe anything will happen to them

[Bling]

i still don't believe anything will happen to them

This is the friggin' 70s. Everyone knows about Watergate and coverups. In today's media, the NFL is forced to crack down on the pats.

[EricStratton]

Some NYC radio guy today (maybe Boomer and Carton on FAN) mentioned this morning that the radio thing could also include talking to the QB on a different frequency after the huddle has broken or even during a play.

Having the pre-snap read from would sure be nice.

[RedEyE]

Some NYC radio guy today (maybe Boomer and Carton on FAN) mentioned this morning that the radio thing could also include talking to the QB on a different frequency after the huddle has broken or even during a play.

Having the pre-snap read from would sure be nice.

I think they'll burn for this more then the taping thing. Signaling your defense what the play call is for the opposing offense is like having clarvoyency. This is total bull**** and I think that belicheck should be completley banned.

[camelcowboy]

how many superbowls did those cheating bastards win? Time to start taking banners down.

[SquishDaFish]

Suspend Belli**** for 4 games, Take away either 2 1st rd picks or 1 st and 1 2nd and Fine the hell out of the franchise.

[SquishDaFish]

Oh and cut off Bradybunches Right hand and/or the gay mans little nutsack.

[OpIv37]

I say make Belicheck coach a game topless that will humiliate his fat ass.

what? no sense punishing the rest of us for his mistake.

[YardRat]

They should at least forfeit the game, along with losing draft picks. Someone should be suspended.

[Ohio Steeler]

strip them of there super bowl titles, ban belidick for life and take away there next 10 years of draft picks

[Nighthawk]

The only thing that is severe enough to stop them is to take away their 1st rounder...PERIOD! Anything less will do nothing...

[YardRat]

if they don't come down with some sort of serious punishment on the coaching staff, then this whole crackdown on players is a joke - I say they should give Belicheck 4 games.

Great point. If they're going to put the hammer to the players, they should be willing to do the same to coaches and owners.

Dynasty, my ass.

[don137]

I say make Belicheck coach a game topless that will humiliate his fat ass.
Yea, but then that would also punish anyone watching the game. Who would be able to stomach seeing him with his shirt off other than Tom Brady?

[im4bflo]

In football, it's all about winning, I say they forfiet the game, give them a goose egg, and take their draft picks. How long have they been getting away with cheating? Could of changed everything. Sick 'em Goodell!

[Ebenezer]

Regardless the way they cheated, if they cheated during the game then they should forfeit the game...

[im4bflo]

Throw the book at them Roger! And more!
Cheating for how long?
a HUGE asterick goes next to all their achievments under Bellicheck.
NO HOF for cheater Bellicheck.

[mikemac2001]

Patriots cant be cheaters....NO no who says they didnt pay the refs also :)

today is just getting better and better

[ddaryl]

it should be a forfieted game.... Jets win

[don137]

It just makes me hate those arrogant SOBs even more.

[Typ0]

I don't know what to think of this. If they were going to risk cheating why do it against the JETS?

[RedEyE]

I don't know what to think of this. If they were going to risk cheating why do it against the JETS?

Why not? If they've been getting away with it for as long as I think they have, why stop?

And the taping thing would just be used the next time they play the Jets. But purposely tuning in on the opposing teams signals from coach to QB is just dispicable.

[im4bflo]

I don't know what to think of this. If they were going to risk cheating why do it against the JETS?

Which should lead you to believe it's been going on for quite a while, against every team.

[RedEyE]

Make Kraft and Belichick wear dog costumes and strap them to Vicks rape tables in Virginia.

[BleedinGreenNC]

I dont want them to forfeit the game, i dont want a win like that. They need to be punished, take their 1st rounders away from them. Who know's what's going to happen, but something does need to happen to them.

[Ebenezer]

I don't know what to think of this. If they were going to risk cheating why do it against the JETS?
because of Mangini?

[RedEyE]

They should force them to start Bledsoe the rest of the season.

[im4bflo]

Let Brady explain the 'tuck rule' to the goons in the 'black hole' in Oakland. :snicker2:

[RedEyE]

Let Brady explain the 'tuck rule' to the goons in the 'black hole' in Oakland. :snicker2:

Brady's idea of the "tuck rule" is a technique that he likes to use when preparing for a date.

[The Spaz]

Thank you, i needed something to laugh about.
It will be interesting to see how Goodell reacts to this.

The thing that kills me is that the Patriots are clearly the best team in the AFCE....why the :curse: do they feel the need to cheat?
:madcurse:

Ever wonder why...lol

[The Spaz]

Brady's idea of the "tuck rule" is a technique that he likes to use when preparing for a date.

It's kind of like in Scary Movie 2 when Wayans says tucked in or out...lol.

[HHURRICANE]

Give the Jets the win. That would be awesome and fair.

[Ickybaluky]

Give the Jets the win. That would be awesome and fair.

I doubt that happens. Probably will get banged a few picks, including at least one high one. That hurts.

I'd almost rather forfeit the game if they could keep the picks.

[Meathead]

Some NYC radio guy today (maybe Boomer and Carton on FAN) mentioned this morning that the radio thing could also include talking to the QB on a different frequency after the huddle has broken or even during a play.

Having the pre-snap read from would sure be nice.
holy crap!

using a videotape to analyze and steal signals is one thing. serious, yes, but that pales in comparison to tapping into the qbs helmet when theyre not supposed to

i mean if you could visually interpret signals and steal them without the video that would be legal (or at least not punishable) so its essentially using technology to help you do something you potentially could do anyway

but secretly communicating with the qb is a whole other exponential level to cheating. that would be an enormous advantage you could not possibly ever come close to duplicating any other way

the first would warrant perhaps the forfeit of first round picks for two or three years

the second would be severe enough to forfeit multiple games. and if it is determined they were doing this during key playoff games i wouldnt have a problem with literally revoking superbowl titles

as much as i would love to see the patriots hammered harshly, i sure hope the latter isnt true as it would be a devastatingly dark day for the nfl

[CuseJetsFan83]

holy crap!

using a videotape to analyze and steal signals is one thing. serious, yes, but that pales in comparison to tapping into the qbs helmet when theyre not supposed to

i mean if you could visually interpret signals and steal them without the video that would be legal (or at least not punishable) so its essentially using technology to help you do something you potentially could do anyway

but secretly communicating with the qb is a whole other exponential level to cheating. that would be an enormous advantage you could not possibly ever come close to duplicating any other way

the first would warrant perhaps the forfeit of first round picks for two or three years

the second would be severe enough to forfeit multiple games. and if it is determined they were doing this during key playoff games i wouldnt have a problem with literally revoking superbowl titles

as much as i would love to see the patriots hammered harshly, i sure hope the latter isnt true as it would be a devastatingly dark day for the nfl

the news reports i seen sunday night alluded to the same thing, but were quickly stricken as hearsay......... but then there was an article on MSNBC that was saying draft picks would must likely be the punishment, but then alluded that the NFL is also looking into the wiretapping of the headsets.

now stealing signals i wouldnt call for a forfeit, but if NE is found to be guilty of stealing headset signals..... i'd say either forfeit/suspend the coaches, and hold them to the same accountability standards that the players have, or else they will lose whatever credibility they have

[Meathead]

somebody posted this at bbi allegedly from pft no link:


WERE PATS WIRING DEFENSIVE PLAYERS, TOO?

The situation regarding the New England Patriots and the allegations/proof that they have stolen defensive signals is unofficially getting weirder.

The signal stealing flap is relevant only to defensive signals, since all offensive calls are made by radio.

But we're now aware of suspicions/rumors regarding efforts by the Pats to get a leg up as to opposing offenses. Specifically, we're told that it's believed that, during the 2006 season, the Patriots were putting microphones on defensive linemen in order to capture the offensive line calls and the quarterback audibles.

Then, the audio and the video of the game would be matched up, and the defensive players would be given the code at halftime.
not as serious as jury rigging signals to the qb but still another devestating illegal advantage to the pats that rachets up the signal stealing allegations by many factors

[Meathead]

http://i123.photobucket.com/albums/o290/davyjoneslocker07/cheatiesnj9.jpg

[Meathead]

http://img204.imageshack.us/img204/633/patsforfeit2ss1.png

[YardRat]

Check out the dude on the right, outlined by the black 'football'...

http://www.touchdown.org/pats-camera.jpg

[Meathead]

http://www.touchdown.org/poster.jpg

[CuseJetsFan83]

if that is the guy... i must say...... can you be any more obvious!?

[Bone]

i dont see the pic

[njsue]

I just knew Bellyache/Kraft were cheaters!!! Now they are screwed for many draft picks.

What a bunch of stunods!!!

[mybills]

You can't really strip them of their SB titles, but wouldn't it be funny if they had to turn in their rings? :D

The NFL could auction them off, and give the proceeds to spinal cord research or something. :up:

[DraftBoy]

I think that everyone here is losing sight of just how big a punishment of losing draft picks is to a franchise especially one like NE which has built its success through the draft. We know that just signing FA's (Redskins) wont work so for New England to be stripped of multiple picks could have bigger ramifications than a 4 game suspension which Im sure the Patriot organization would gladly take over losing picks.

[Gunzlingr]

They said on Sirius that Eric Mangina knew what to look for because he was part of it when he was there. They said he could be blacklisted for breaching the coaches' code of silence.

[mybills]

This just keeps getting better.

[Cntrygal]

I could have sworn that there were "rumors" of this a few years ago.... or am I maybe I just foresaw the future.... :insane:

[Cntrygal]

Belichick apologizes to Goodell for video flap

Belichick said he spoke with NFL commissioner Roger Goodell this week about a “videotaping procedure” during last Sunday’s game and “my interpretation of the rules.”

more... (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/20706148/)

[Cntrygal]

Steelers coach Mike Tomlin isn’t surprised a New England Patriots employee is suspected of videotaping signals by Jets coaches during Sunday’s season opener.

more... (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/20727528/)

[Gunzlingr]

I could have sworn that there were "rumors" of this a few years ago.... or am I maybe I just foresaw the future.... :insane:

I believe there were have been accusations for years, but why the league did nothing until now is beyond me. Greenbay even kicked the same camerman out last year for doing it (I guess he raised hell, and threatened security even).

[Cntrygal]

I believe there were have been accusations for years, but why the league did nothing until now is beyond me. Greenbay even kicked the same camerman out last year for doing it (I guess he raised hell, and threatened security even).

I'll have to see if I can dig up some of those old stories. :D

[njsue]

You can't really strip them of their SB titles, but wouldn't it be funny if they had to turn in their rings? :D

The NFL could auction them off, and give the proceeds to spinal cord research or something. :up:


:jig:

[dolphan117]

Turns out this isnt the first time the Pats doing this has come to light. Last year our players/coaches used game tape whith audio from the normal telivision feed instead fo the muted game tapes to prepare for the Pats and try and figure out there line call. IMO not a big deal but it sparded a storm and the league looked into it. This came out as a result.
And remember this is in 06

"There is nothing illegal about what Miami did. However, the Patriots got caught doing something early in the year they weren't supposed to be doing. They had a man on their sideline dressed in coaching attire with a video camera who was presumably videotaping the other team's signals. You can't do that. They were warned. If it happens again, they're going to be disciplined."
http://blogs.sun-sentinel.com/sports_football_dolphins/2006/12/stealing_signs_.html
Over the offeseason all 32 teams were warned on this subject so there is no shades of gray here on whether the pats thought this was legal or not.

Then comes this


A former assistant under Bill Belichick, Mangini arrived in New York last year with an insider's knowledge of the Patriots' sign-stealing surveillance tactics and he shared the dirty little secret with members of the Jets' organization, a person with knowledge of the matter informed the Daily News yesterday.
It wasn't until the fifth Mangini-Belichick showdown - last Sunday - that the Jets were able to catch the Patriots. Tipped off by Jets security, an NFL security official confiscated a video camera and tape from a Patriots employee at the Meadowlands, and the evidence is believed to be damning.
http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/football/jets/2007/09/12/2007-09-12_eric_mangini_exposes_bill_belichicks_spy.html


If the reason Mangini knew about this was because they were doing it while he was still there then we know the pats used this method to steal at least 1 SB vs Philly as 05 was the last year Mangini was with the Pats.

[Ebenezer]

Does this have the legs to become a "real" scandal? I mean suspensions, kicking guys out of the league, overturning victories, etc??? That is what happens in the NCAA...

[Michael82]

Turns out this isnt the first time the Pats doing this has come to light. Last year our players/coaches used game tape whith audio from the normal telivision feed instead fo the muted game tapes to prepare for the Pats and try and figure out there line call. IMO not a big deal but it sparded a storm and the league looked into it. This came out as a result.
And remember this is in 06

http://blogs.sun-sentinel.com/sports_football_dolphins/2006/12/stealing_signs_.html
Over the offeseason all 32 teams were warned on this subject so there is no shades of gray here on whether the pats thought this was legal or not.

Then comes this

http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/football/jets/2007/09/12/2007-09-12_eric_mangini_exposes_bill_belichicks_spy.html


If the reason Mangini knew about this was because they were doing it while he was still there then we know the pats used this method to steal at least 1 SB vs Philly as 05 was the last year Mangini was with the Pats.
Wow.....I was wondering how far back it goes. If Mangini knew about it from when he was there, it means that the Patriots have been cheating for all this time and won a Super Bowl ring and got to the playoffs with it. I hope they lose both 1st rounders, plus have to forfeit the week 1 win, plus have that slimeball Bill Belichick suspended for 2-4 games. :mad:

[Michael82]

Does this have the legs to become a "real" scandal? I mean suspensions, kicking guys out of the league, overturning victories, etc??? That is what happens in the NCAA...
and if it continues to leak more info out....we finally have a commish that won't bury this under the rug. I know that he will definitely punish the Patriots and most likely Bill Belichick. I just wonder how far he will go......

[Ebenezer]

Wow.....I was wondering how far back it goes. If Mangini knew about it from when he was there, it means that the Patriots have been cheating for all this time and won a Super Bowl ring and got to the playoffs with it. I hope they lose both 1st rounders, plus have to forfeit the week 1 win, plus have that slimeball Bill Belichick suspended for 2-4 games. :mad:
If Mangini knew about it then he is just as guilty....should there be sanctions against him??

[trapezeus]

If Mangini knew about it then he is just as guilty....should there be sanctions against him??

in some ways, mangini becomes like a state witness. Everyone knows he's guilty, but you allow it to get the bigger fish.

[mybills]

If Mangini knew about it then he is just as guilty....should there be sanctions against him??
Not sure, but I heard it means he broke some confidentiality clause with NE.

[dplus47]

I think that everyone here is losing sight of just how big a punishment of losing draft picks is to a franchise especially one like NE which has built its success through the draft. We know that just signing FA's (Redskins) wont work so for New England to be stripped of multiple picks could have bigger ramifications than a 4 game suspension which Im sure the Patriot organization would gladly take over losing picks.

in the NBA, the minnesota timberwolves had 5 first round picks taken from them for tampering with joe smith. this isn't the NBA, but it's a far worse crime than tampering, especially if it comes to light that they were illegally talking to brady and/or defensive players during plays, etc.

[Gunzlingr]

If Mangini knew about it then he is just as guilty....should there be sanctions against him??

The guys on NFL radio made it sound like Mangina knew all about it from his days as a pat.

[Gunzlingr]

Not sure, but I heard it means he broke some confidentiality clause with NE.

I heard it was more of a good ole boys code sort of thing.

[SABURZFAN]

Bellycheck would be gone had he not won the Super Bowls.i hope Goddell sticks it to Bellycheck whether it be a hefty fine,a lengthy suspension with no pay,or both.after listening to Mike & Mike in the Morning,it sounds as if ALL teams were warned not to do this.therefore,i hope he gets both and the Pats get a draft pick or two taken.

[Mitchy moo]

FOXBOROUGH, Mass. (AP) - This videotape needs no interpretation: New England Patriots (http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/team/67054) coach Bill Belichick walked out of his news conference on Wednesday when pressed repeatedly about the sideline spying scandal that landed him on NFL commissioner Roger Goodell's crowded docket.

Ten minutes before his regular availability, Belichick issued a one-paragraph statement apologizing to his team and confirming that he has spoken to Goodell about an "interpretation" of league rules that ban videotaping of the opposing sideline.

"Although it remains a league matter, I want to apologize to everyone who has been affected, most of all ownership, staff and players," Belichick said. "Following the league's decision, I will have further comment." It was not clear whether Belichick was apologizing for his actions or the distraction it has caused his team as it prepares for Sunday night's marquee game against San Diego. But if he thought — or even hoped — that the standing-room crowd of media was there to talk about the Chargers (http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/team/67068), he failed to prepare in the manner that has made him one of the most successful coaches in the history of the league.

http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/story/7216386

[Ebenezer]

I have no problem with a year long suspension....

[Mitchy moo]

I have no problem with a year long suspension....

Goddell's probable response: Cheating is not something that needs to be taken lightly but since it's Kraft's boy let's cut him some cheese, I mean slack.

[Mitchy moo]

Who in their right mind would move this?? NE39?

[shelby]

i'm sure his hand is stinging from a slap on the wrist:rolleyes:

[CuseJetsFan83]

Who in their right mind would move this?? NE39?

its not directly related to the bills, but it is NFL related, hence its here

[Ebenezer]

Skooby, please start posting non-Bills but NFL related material in the NFL zone, thanks!!

[Ickybaluky]

I have no problem with a year long suspension....

A year would be tough.

If it is for a quarter season or so a suspension wouldn't be so terrible for the team. Dante Scarnecchia would step up and probably take the lead role until BB returned.

If it were for a year, I wonder if Kraft would consider hiring Bill Parcells to fill in until Belichick returned? I've always liked the Tuna, so I'd like that. He already knows the system real well, and his son-in-law is running the front office. That would be interesting.

[CuseJetsFan83]

you know something ive been pondering for a while, but could they possibly say that this is a secondary offense ala - the patriots covering up rodney's hgh, or maybe lying on the injury reports...... as detrimental to the rules

or shall it be considered a separate league matter

[Devin]

If its already been posted ill delete this thread.




DID PATS USE RADIOS ON DEFENSE?
Now that the entire pro football community is atwitter over the allegations/proof of cheating by the New England Patriots (http://www.profootballtalk.com/rumormill.htm#), we're hearing more rumors on the NFL grapevine regarding the extent to which this stuff went on.

In addition to the rumor we heard on Wednesday that the Pats were putting microphones on defensive players in 2006 to pick up audibles and offensive line calls, we're now hearing that there has been a rumor for years that the Patriots have inserted a radio in the helmet of one or more defensive players for the purposes of direct communications with the coaching staff.

Such a tactic, if true, would be an even more significant violation of the rules, in our opinion. As several readers have pointed out, the only thing illegal about the signal-stealing issue is the use of the electronic equipment to record the images. Nothing prevents a team from using low-tech means to track signals and connect them to the defensive coverages used. It's simply harder to do it via the naked eye, especially since the video can be used later to confirm the specific signals given, if/when the team with the video is preparing to face the same opponent in the future -- or a member of that coaching staff who might use the same signals in a new city.
So the only competitive advantage is that it's a better way of doing something that already can be done.

In contrast, using radios in the helmets of defensive players gives the team access to something that folks who follow the rules simply can't use.

Keep in mind that this new twist is only a rumor, one of many that are now on the NFL grapevine as this story continues to percolate. Still, given the events of the last 48 hours, it's hard not to rule out anything at this point.

http://www.profootballtalk.com/rumormill.htm

[Ebenezer]

Who in their right mind would move this?? NE39?
I would...I told you in another one of your threads that non-Bills NFL related threads go in the NFL zone.

[CuseJetsFan83]

pretty much every source ive looked at has alluded to it, but ill believe it when i see it i guess....... if they were guilty of that, i'd have to say the only fair penalty is forfeit of the jets game, as well as suspending the coaching staff.......

if unfounded, still puts a huge ? over them

[Cntrygal]

This was already covered.......

check out the updates towards the end of the thread! (http://www.billszone.com/fanzone/showthread.php?t=133999)

[shelby]

Merged, for your convenience.
Thanks for surfing the Zone.
Buh-bye.

[mybills]

I'm going to enjoy busting Pats fans this weekend. :biggrin:

[DraftBoy]

Merged three other threads with this one, we dont need 6 threads on BB cheating folks just keep updating this one

[Beantown_Pat]

WOW, everyone is ready to bust Bill's chops. Sure he messed up but it was a one time deal. The Fins did it to us last year so lets consider it we are even.

Also, it still doesnt take away that Bill is an excellent coach. The best in the league...maybe in all of sports.

[MikeInRoch]

One time? Guess you aren't paying much attention, are you?

[Ickybaluky]

I guess it was only a matter of time:

http://www.coldhardfootballfacts.com/Images/patriots_spy_logo.jpg

[DraftBoy]

I still maintain this being blown way out of the water and is a much more common occurance then anybody is willing to admit to.

[dplus47]

I still maintain this being blown way out of the water and is a much more common occurance then anybody is willing to admit to.

i think attempting to steal signs "live" is pretty common. that's why coaches bother trying to conceal them sometimes. i wouldn't think that filming the signals is all that common, because it's pretty easy to get caught, and it goes beyond the norm when you have a high tech system in place to steal and analyze the signals. you're essentially talking about having somebody else on the payroll for this, and that, again, is easy to catch if someone's looking for it.

also, if the different radio frequency allegations are true (talking to the defense, etc.), i believe that would set this apart from what normally happens.

[Ickybaluky]

I still maintain this being blown way out of the water and is a much more common occurance then anybody is willing to admit to.

Nonsense!

I heard a rumor today that the reason we didn't find any WMD in Iraq is because Belichick hid them all.

[Dr. Lecter]

I'm going to enjoy busting Pats fans this weekend. :biggrin:

Until they bring up the past 7-10 years.

[DynaPaul]

And you guys wondered how they looked so good with so little talent? Remember when they had nobodies in the secondary and STILL won games? Remember when they had no WRs and an old defense and STILL won games? How is it that TOm Brady knows exactly where to throw the ball on a blitz as soon as it's hiked? How is that they seem to know exactly what the other team is going to do? Oh, I forgot - Belichick is a genius. The same genius who couldn't get it together in Cleveland.

Like I said, these guys aren't really stocked with talent. They win with trickery and I am completely not shocked at all about them finally getting caught. For all we know they were hacking in the opposing teams radio system and sending the plays into the defense. Jacksonville's coach did mention that their radios mysteriously malfunctioned during a game versus them.

Throw the book at them. Their championships already had an asterisk next to them and now it's only justified.

[mybills]

Until they bring up the past 7-10 years.
Around here? They're too stupid. They only mention the 4 SB losses. To which I reply, Where were you? :cheers:

[Gunzlingr]

Wow, now they are saying that during games at foxboro they disabled headsets during drives.

Wow.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2007/writers/dr_z/09/13/cheating/index.html?eref=si_topstories

[dplus47]

Wow, now they are saying that during games at foxboro they disabled headsets during drives.

Wow.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2007/writers/dr_z/09/13/cheating/index.html?eref=si_topstories
notice the quote they attribute to weis. it's from the year 2000. long, long time ago, and pre-super bowl...

[Cntrygal]

Still, the hefty fine and that No. 1 draft choice (or a second- and a third-round pick if New England misses the playoffs) was the punishment because so many media people were outraged by Belichick's arrogant action. I believe many of them struck this moral outrage rant in their articles because they can't stand Belichick. They don't like him because he doesn't give them the time of day. This was their way of getting even, because I'm not convinced stealing coaching signals can really decide who wins or loses on Sundays. Maybe it helps with a play here or there, but rival coaches are so aware of opponents stealing such vital information that most believe they have put in enough safeguards to negate such illegally obtained information being truly beneficial.



IMO - the punishment wasn't enough.... (http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/story/7223504)

[CuseJetsFan83]

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=easterbrook/070918&sportCat=nfl

something caught my eye..... wonder if this maybe caught any of yours........



Consider the Sunday night contest. New England had played San Diego just four games back, in the January 2007 postseason. Perhaps Belichick's cameraman was illegally taping the Chargers that day, and perhaps Belichick illegally used the information against the Chargers on Sunday night. The San Diego coaching staff has changed since the playoff game, so presumably its defensive calls are different. But San Diego's new defensive coordinator, Ted Cottrell, was defensive coordinator for the Bills and Jets, both AFC East teams, in the Belichick period. Perhaps Belichick has spied on Cottrell's calls before and took out the tapes of the spying rather than handing them over as Goodell demanded. Was New England cheating again Sunday night, when the Patriots advanced the ball with such ease it seemed they knew what defense San Diego would be in?


And the Patriots' cheating might have been more extensive than so far confirmed. Fox Sports reported that former NFL players believe Belichick had microphones installed in the shoulder pads of defensive linemen so the Patriots could tape other teams' offensive audibles and line calls. Needless to say, putting microphones on players violates NFL rules. Andrea Kremer of NBC reported that several teams might charge the Patriots this week with having stolen playbooks from the visitors' dressing room. The convenient "malfunction" of visiting teams' headphones at the Patriots' two fields under Belichick seems to have happened far too often to be an IT department error. The rumor mill says Belichick, Richard Nixon-style, has file cabinets of info on opposing coaches and assistant coaches – some gleaned honestly, some obtained by cheating.
It seems more than just an eerie coincidence that Belichick's unethical behavior involves illicit taping, the same offense that made Nixon's actions so sordid. The parallels to Nixon don't stop there. Caught, Belichick – like Nixon – tried to hide the true extent of the prohibited acts; Belichick – like Nixon – tried to claim his prohibited action hadn't been prohibited; Belichick – like Nixon – immediately stonewalled. It would be tempting to break the unhappy tone of this column with a Nixon joke – when the league plays Belichick's tape of the Jets' sideline, will there be an 18-and-a-half minute gap? But for all lovers of the NFL, there's just nothing to laugh about now.

[mybills]

Pats fans & team..."We don't get any respect!" :cry: :baby:

[Michael82]

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=easterbrook/070918&sportCat=nfl

something caught my eye..... wonder if this maybe caught any of yours........
Wow! That's insane! But it really does help explain why the Patriots as a team have been able to dominate so many teams. If they had an extra advantage (don't forget giving HGH to Rodney Harrison and who knows who else) for the playoffs and the Super Bowl..... It makes perfect sense! :ill: :puke:


**** THE CHEATERS!!!! :mad:

[njsue]

What comes around goes around!

[DraftBoy]

Here is an interesting thing;

Belichick's 500k fine is completely tax deductible;
http://blogs.wsj.com/law/2007/09/17/tax-profs-bill-belichick-can-deduct-his-500000-fine/

[mybills]

Here is an interesting thing;

Belichick's 500k fine is completely tax deductible;
http://blogs.wsj.com/law/2007/09/17/tax-profs-bill-belichick-can-deduct-his-500000-fine/
now THAT'S something to get :mad: about, OpIv.

[Ickybaluky]

Looks like this thing is over (http://www.boston.com/sports/football/patriots/reiss_pieces/2007/09/nfl_update.html):


Here is an update on the NFL's investigation into the Patriots videotaping procedures:

"The Patriots have fully cooperated and complied with the requirements of the commissioner�s decision," NFL spokesman Greg Aiello relayed via email.

"All tapes, documents and other records relating to this matter were turned over to the league office and destroyed, and the Patriots have certified in writing that no copies or other records exist. League policies on in-game video taping and audio communication will continue to be closely monitored and strictly enforced with all 32 teams."

Aiello was also asked about allegations that the Patriots illegally placed a microphone on a defensive player to pick up the audibles of opposing quarterbacks. A report on NBC during the Patriots-Chargers game indicated that the Jets believed the Patriots had illegally placed a microphone on a defensive player.

"We have no evidence to support that claim," Aiello said.

[Cntrygal]

Yep... I believe it.


[/sarcasm]

[mybills]

Aiello was also asked about allegations that the Patriots illegally placed a microphone on a defensive player to pick up the audibles of opposing quarterbacks. A report on NBC during the Patriots-Chargers game indicated that the Jets believed the Patriots had illegally placed a microphone on a defensive player.

"We have no evidence to support that claim," Aiello said.

Even a bank robber hides the loot.

[Cntrygal]

Here is an interesting thing;

Belichick's 500k fine is completely tax deductible;
http://blogs.wsj.com/law/2007/09/17/tax-profs-bill-belichick-can-deduct-his-500000-fine/

How ****ing pathetic - I wonder if this was taken into account when he was so "severely" punished.

:loser:

[Cntrygal]

The NFL is investigating how a copy of the infamous Patriots' spy tape of Jets signals landed in the hands of Fox television, which aired it on its NFL pregame show on Sunday, according to an ESPN report.

"We don't know how it happened and we're obviously not happy about it," Greg Aiello, the league's senior vice president of communications, told ESPN.




more... (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/20862969/)

These clowns should be more concerned with that vanilla fine. :mad: