Some food for though on the QB situation

[xXSpIkes5IXx]

JP Losman faced Denver and Pittsburgh

Denver has the #1 pass defense in the NFL
Pittsburgh has the #1 overall defense in the NFL

[STAMPY]

JP Losman faced Denver and Pittsburgh

Denver has the #1 pass defense in the NFL
Pittsburgh has the #1 overall defense in the NFL

Big Ben moved ball on Denver yesterday and Cutler moved ball on Pitt yesterday. Have a good day sir:brush:

Enough with excuses. Some times you make big plays vs good teams. You step up. Man up... JP was a 3-4 year player... but plays with less poise than our STARTER, the rookie

[STAMPY]

B. Roethlisberger QB
24-35, 290 yds
4 TDs, 2 INTs

J. Cutler QB
22-29, 248 yds
3 TDs, 2 INTs

[Inetpub]

some food for thought.

JP = 0-2
TE = 2-2 (stats will say 2-1)

I think this stat speaks more than anything considering TE is a real rookie and JP is the only 4th year rookie in the league. at this rate, he'll retire a 5th year rookie!!!

[acehole]

JP Losman faced Denver and Pittsburgh

Denver has the #1 pass defense in the NFL
Pittsburgh has the #1 overall defense in the NFL

Ya know its funny. Nobody especially the Edwards suporters wanted to aknoledge this....and now they are all mentioning the Ravens d...

11-21, 158 yards, 1 crucial int, no TD, 23% conversions on 3rd down.

JP need another chance inlight of Edwards less then stellar play.

Edwards although promising...did nothing to cement the QB position in my mind.

[STAMPY]

Ya know its funny. Nobody especially the Edwards suporters wanted to aknoledge this....and now they are all mentioning the Ravens d...

11-21, 158 yards, 1 crucial int, no TD, 23% conversions on 3rd down.

JP need another chance inlight of Edwards less then stellar play.

Edwards although promising...did nothing to cement the QB position in my mind.

B. Roethlisberger QB
24-35, 290 yds
4 TDs, 2 INTs

J. Cutler QB
22-29, 248 yds
3 TDs, 2 INTs

[TacklingDummy]

3 career starts.

27 career starts.

[STAMPY]

Another stat... Another new comer QB vs Dreaded denver Defense

D. Garrard QB
14-20, 154 yds
1 TD

Another win

[Inetpub]

0-2 record
2-2 record

only change has been QB. Plus the guy with the 2-2 record is playing with a depleted Buffalo Bills roster. Plus I dont even know why im posting in this useless post. There is no QB contraversy anymore. Anyone not willing to accept the Bills new QB, can follow loserman to his next team.

[STAMPY]

JP is technically 0-3 and Edwards is 2-1... JP started NE game :)

[Mitchy moo]

It's funny to hear excuses being made for TE being successful as a starter. I guess the 8-19 starter gives us a better chance to win in some people's mind, how I really don't know.

[STAMPY]

i liked JP and supported when he was at the helm. I was jusdt really bothered by his 3 and outs. He can't sustain drives. No poise in pocket. Doesn't look like he can lead a team on a drive more than 2 minutes

[Philagape]

JP Losman faced Denver and Pittsburgh

Denver has the #1 pass defense in the NFL
Pittsburgh has the #1 overall defense in the NFL

There was a thread on Denver's D last week. The only reason they were ranked #1 in pass D was because they had the fewest pass attempts against them in the NFL. In terms of yards per pass, Denver was 22nd. (all going into last night) They were overrated, and they are no excuse.

Pass defense is often a BS stat.

[Philagape]

And even disregarding the legitimacy of the rankings, if a QB tanks against good defenses, what good is he? If we're going to get to the playoffs, we have to beat tough opponents. Anyone who does well only against easy opponents is useless.

[Mitchy moo]

And even disregarding the legitimacy of the rankings, if a QB tanks against good defenses, what good is he? If we're going to get to the playoffs, we have to beat tough opponents. Anyone who does well only against easy opponents is useless.

People will complain about anything on here, even wins. We beat a good team for the first time in a long time, yet there is a problem?

The only problem I see is Bills fans in denial about who the better QB is and actually winning games. Jimbo didn't win every game for us and he didn't have great weeks every week but we still won.

[TacklingDummy]

i liked JP and supported when he was at the helm. I was jusdt really bothered by his 3 and outs. He can't sustain drives. No poise in pocket. Doesn't look like he can lead a team on a drive more than 2 minutes

The Bills had 191 drives last year. 109 of them were just 4 plays long.

First 8 games: 95 drives, 53 ended within 4 plays.

Last 8 games: 96 Drives, 56 ended within 4 plays.

The Bills offense actually got worse at sustaining drives in the final 8 games.

[Mitchy moo]

The Bills had 191 drives last year. 109 of them were just 4 plays long.

First 8 games: 95 drives, 53 ended within 4 plays.

Last 8 games: 96 Drives, 56 ended within 4 plays.

The Bills offense actually got worse at sustaining drives in the final 8 games.

Quit confusing them with facts.

[HHURRICANE]

You know what's absolutely amazing around here?

The fact that there is a QB contoversy with a 4 year guy who was drafted 24th overall vs. a guy that just finished his 3rd career start as a (3rd round) rookie.

Beck and Russell are still sitting on the bench because there coaches have flat out said that "they aren't ready to play yet."

You guys judge Trent like he's a veteran. I saw a post where someone said "he can't close out games." After his third start you can figure that out?

Geez.

[Philagape]

You know what's absolutely amazing around here?

The fact that there is a QB contoversy with a 4 year guy who was drafted 24th overall vs. a guy that just finished his 3rd career start as a (3rd round) rookie.

Beck and Russell are still sitting on the bench because there coaches have flat out said that "they aren't ready to play yet."

You guys judge Trent like he's a veteran. I saw a post where someone said "he can't close out games." After his third start you can figure that out?

Geez.

What's a rookie? :insane:

[OpIv37]

It's obvious that the offense's problems go well beyond QB and neither QB is going to help this offense all that much.

But, three things: Trent has 2 wins, JP has 0. Trent has looked slightly better, despite playing in only 3 games and not even having a full year in the league to JP's 3+. Trent will be cheaper going forward.

During the great JP/Bledsoe debate, we kept hearing about how JP had more "upside." Well, right now, Trent has more upside.

[justasportsfan]

Ya know its funny. Nobody especially the Edwards suporters wanted to aknoledge this....and now they are all mentioning the Ravens d...

11-21, 158 yards, 1 crucial int, no TD, 23% conversions on 3rd down.

JP need another chance inlight of Edwards less then stellar play.

Edwards although promising...did nothing to cement the QB position in my mind.

Edwards is also reaping the benefits of the OL starting to come together in the passing game. Edwards has also benefited from the D playing so much better compared to the first 3 games where they were decimated by injuries.

[Luisito23]

Just ask our defense who they would rather see start next week???.....Wonder what they'll say?.......





GO BILLS!!!!!!!!

[justasportsfan]

Just ask our defense who they would rather see start next week???.....Wonder what they'll say?.......





GO BILLS!!!!!!!!
Interesting, they keep bailing Edwards out.

[TacklingDummy]

Interesting, they keep bailing Edwards out.

Probably because they have more juice left in their tank from only being on the field for 28:34, 27:29, 27:44 compared to being on the field 33:12 and 35:27.

[HHURRICANE]

Just ask our defense who they would rather see start next week???.....Wonder what they'll say?.......



Don't confuse the topic with logic. Only emotional threads work with the JP debate.

[justasportsfan]

Probably because they have more juice left in their tank from only being on the field for 28:34, 27:29, 27:44 compared to being on the field 33:12 and 35:27.
Nice try but even the blind can see that the reason why the D has been off the field is because they've contolled the opposing teams' running game. You're not gonna convince anyone that edwards was the reason for the bills having the upper hand in TOP when you're qb is 11-21, 153 yds and almost screwed up what the D did again yesterday. Againt the jets, they shut down the run. No need to talk about Dallas either.

Although JP and the O struggled against Denvers and Pitts D, the D didn't do what they have done the last 3 games in the first 3 games. Edwards is benefiting from the D.

[Ingtar33]

You know what's absolutely amazing around here?

The fact that there is a QB contoversy with a 4 year guy who was drafted 24th overall vs. a guy that just finished his 3rd career start as a (3rd round) rookie.

Beck and Russell are still sitting on the bench because there coaches have flat out said that "they aren't ready to play yet."

You guys judge Trent like he's a veteran. I saw a post where someone said "he can't close out games." After his third start you can figure that out?

Geez.


I couldn't have summed it up better.

The one part about this debate that disappoints me the most, is the fact we're even having it. JP should be noticeably better then a rookie at this point in his career.

[justasportsfan]

I couldn't have summed it up better.

The one part about this debate that disappoints me the most, is the fact we're even having it. JP should be noticeably better then a rookie at this point in his career.
he never had the chance to prove himself due to playcalling.

[Ingtar33]

they have gotten the same playbook, and roughly the same playcalls.

it's the same OC calling the game.

[SABURZFAN]

JP Losman faced Denver and Pittsburgh

Denver has the #1 pass defense in the NFL
Pittsburgh has the #1 overall defense in the NFL



:yawn:


another Lossman thread.........


:z:

[justasportsfan]

they have gotten the same playbook, and roughly the same playcalls.

it's the same OC calling the game. the players seem to think otherwise . Same playbook, different calls.

[SABURZFAN]

3 career starts.

27 career starts.


2 wins


8 wins



do the math.

[SABURZFAN]

the players seem to think otherwise . Same playbook, different calls.


:laughter:


who cares what the players think?until somebody steps up to be a leader on this team,the players need to :stfu: and do their jobs.

[STAMPY]

Justa you are my buddy and all but??? get your lips off JP's ****... i wanna win now and in the future. Therefore TRENT IS THE MAN!!! It all comes down to 2 things, pocket presence and getting rid of it rright away. He reads the field better. JP is like a special ed kid, he has the tools but is dumb.

TRENT will lead us past Jets, Bengals, then Fish. I don't care about playoffs this yr. Trent will get the team going towards next year. He gives us best chance for most wins. I am happy at 7-9 or 8-8. From 0-3 and the schedule we had coming in to season plus fact a rookie QB, rookie RB, and new O Line did this on top of 30 injuries.

LET'S GO

[shelby]

Why do people get so upset when people don't agree with them about who our QB should be? It's very illogical, IMO.
If every poster on this board wanted TE to start, or if every poster wanted JP to start, we'd be very bored. But to get so upset over a differing opinion is rather juvenile, imo.
This is Jauron's decision. It's a moot point. It gets old watching people beat their heads against a wall day after day.
We could merge all these threads into one and nothing would be lost. The same garbage is being regurgitated over and over again by people on both sides of the debate.
:deadhorse:

[acehole]

You seroisly are going to credit edwards with those wins?
They won in spite of him not becuase of him....and you insult the Bills D deffense for not giving them their due.

Insane to have a serious debate with you guys.
One 5 yard TD this kid has...




2 wins


8 wins



do the math.

[acehole]

Geat point..however they use stats only to suit thier needs...when the JP suporters sited many reason for the slow start...they claimed we made excuses.....when we made the same comments about Edwards is was ok to use every excuse in the book......I want the best QB to play if that is Edwards great....but honesty would be great as well. They want to feel like they are like Walsh fine......I say wait before saying he is Farvesque.



Why do people get so upset when people don't agree with them about who our QB should be? It's very illogical, IMO.
If every poster on this board wanted TE to start, or if every poster wanted JP to start, we'd be very bored. But to get so upset over a differing opinion is rather juvenile, imo.
This is Jauron's decision. It's a moot point. It gets old watching people beat their heads against a wall day after day.
We could merge all these threads into one and nothing would be lost. The same garbage is being regurgitated over and over again by people on both sides of the debate.
:deadhorse:

[SABURZFAN]

You seroisly are going to credit edwards with those wins?
They won in spite of him not becuase of him....and you insult the Bills D deffense for not giving them their due.



he would be credited with the losses if they lost.

i never said that Edwards carried them to victory.i noted the wins were QB's that started the games.....and since this thread has nothing to do with defense,how do you find that they're being insulted?


try again........... :rolleyes:

[acehole]

Justa you are my buddy and all but??? get your lips off JP's ****... i wanna win now and in the future. Therefore TRENT IS THE MAN!!! It all comes down to 2 things, pocket presence and getting rid of it rright away. He reads the field better. JP is like a special ed kid, he has the tools but is dumb.

TRENT will lead us past Jets, Bengals, then Fish. I don't care about playoffs this yr. Trent will get the team going towards next year. He gives us best chance for most wins. I am happy at 7-9 or 8-8. From 0-3 and the schedule we had coming in to season plus fact a rookie QB, rookie RB, and new O Line did this on top of 30 injuries.

LET'S GO

hahhaahah

[acehole]

2 wins


8 wins



do the math.

JP Lossmen 27 TD's
T Edwards 1 TD

[SABURZFAN]

JP Lossmen 27 TD's
T Edwards 1 TD



now you look like that dog in your avatar. :rolleyes:

[Wys Guy]

You know what's absolutely amazing around here?

The fact that there is a QB contoversy with a 4 year guy who was drafted 24th overall vs. a guy that just finished his 3rd career start as a (3rd round) rookie.

Beck and Russell are still sitting on the bench because there coaches have flat out said that "they aren't ready to play yet."

You guys judge Trent like he's a veteran. I saw a post where someone said "he can't close out games." After his third start you can figure that out?

Geez.

I haven't really chimed in much on this topic specifically, but in all fairness HHuricane, the crowd that drew first blood on this was everyone that marveled over a 22-for-28 performance for 234 yards, 1 TD and 1 INT and a 98.5 rating vs. one of the worst Ds in the league if not the worst outright when other poor QBs (Green, Boller) have had even better games vs. them, and thought for some reason that it was a harbinger of the next Tom Brady and began justifying Levy and Jauron's existence in their roles here as a result.

Most people didn't know what to think as rookie/first-time starting QBs often have a decent game. And decent is all it was yet everyone looked at that 78.6% completion in a vacuum as if all he needed to do was to complete nickel passes to earn a spot in Canton.

As I've said, to date Edwards is the anti-Losman, he's a mini-Pennington thus far who has not proven a capable and accurate deep arm, the complete antithesis of Losman. In fact after Sunday he still hasn't.

Yet, everyone reacted as if Levy's team was finally coming around when the exact opposite is occurring. Schobel's all but disappeared this season, Evans will apparently be leaving at first light, Peters hasn't lived up to the hopes, and defensively we don't have a single impact player on the team if Schobel doesn't show up. There are several good ones, but none great.

Offensively this renovation couldn't possibly have been more of a letdown and flop.

Either way, fans are so desperate for even a whiff of something encouraging, this is what we're left with; drowning fans grasping at any semblance of a quarter or two of solid play or any aspect of this team that can possible be looked at in a vacuum even that suggests for even a moment that "perhaps we have something here" when the reality is, "no, we don't."

But it was the Edwards people" that drew first blood on this and put the fans of the team simply desirous of seeing good, solid play on the defensive.

Is Losman the answer? I doubt it and we've seen absolutely nothing to dates suggesting that he's even improved over last year. Could be him, but on this team it could also very well be the coaching too.

Edwards deserves the same season and a half that Losman got if in fact he gets the nod to show his stuff. Frankly, now is not too soon to find out if this team can quit any charade of "trying to still make the playoffs" now. What are the odds of that happening and them implicitly admitting that we suck and have no chance only 7 weeks into the season? Not good I'd say.

[acehole]

he would be credited with the losses if they lost.

i never said that Edwards carried them to victory.i noted the wins were QB's that started the games.....and since this thread has nothing to do with defense,how do you find that they're being insulted?


try again........... :rolleyes:
Just that you are using the record as a example of how great TE is and how bad JP is......and it is a poor argument...but that never stopped you from posting it...Credit where it is due,,...the Deffense.

[SquishDaFish]

Who gives a ****?!?! Lets root for the damn BILLS! You people are pathetic arguing over who starts. Root for whomever they put back there and root for WINS!!

[RedEyE]

More food for thought:

If the Bills maintain composure and pull of that miracle upset over Dallas, they would have won the last 3 games.

If the Bills would have just stopped the Broncos from their monster last minute drive in week 1, the Bills close out a win there as well. This team is merely two seconds away from a 4-2 season at this point.

[Wys Guy]

Who gives a ****?!?! Lets root for the damn BILLS! You people are pathetic arguing over who starts. Root for whomever they put back there and root for WINS!!


More food for thought:

If the Bills maintain composure and pull of that miracle upset over Dallas, they would have won the last 3 games.

If the Bills would have just stopped the Broncos from their monster last minute drive in week 1, the Bills close out a win there as well. This team is merely two seconds away from a 4-2 season at this point.

You guys continually miss the point. You're like fans that would rather take steroids and win than win naturally.

The point is that even despite 6 TOs by Dallas, they still kicked our a$$ RedEye. Doesn't that mean anything to you?

I mean despite 5 INTs Romo still had over 300 passing yards and wasn't sacked a single time and had all day in his pocket for the most part. Let me ask you, how many passing yards would he have had had he not thrown 5 picks? What? 500? 600? 309 passing yards is great for any QB any week. It's a pace that would result in just about 5,000 yards if he did that every week, and 32 TDs if he pitched the two he did every week, which is fantastic and top few.

Meanwhile, on the flip side, our offense didn't move the ball at all. We merely got lucky, fortunate, whatever you wish to call it on three plays that resulted in points scored directly by the D and STs.

We did not outplay Dallas or even come close. W/ our 12th man, had that game been in Dallas we could easily have lost 50-6 both teams playing the same otherwise.

Wins must mean something. Just like you all make fun of peoples' kids that just get "the family business handed to them," so too, that's how our wins seem to come each week.

[RedEyE]

You guys continually miss the point. You're like fans that would rather take steroids and win than win naturally.

The point is that even despite 6 TOs by Dallas, they still kicked our a$$ RedEye. Doesn't that mean anything to you?

I mean despite 5 INTs Romo still had over 300 passing yards and wasn't sacked a single time and had all day in his pocket for the most part. Let me ask you, how many passing yards would he have had had he not thrown 5 picks? What? 500? 600? 309 passing yards is great for any QB any week. It's a pace that would result in just about 5,000 yards if he did that every week, and 32 TDs if he pitched the two he did every week, which is fantastic and top few.

Meanwhile, on the flip side, our offense didn't move the ball at all. We merely got lucky, fortunate, whatever you wish to call it on three plays that resulted in points scored directly by the D and STs.

We did not outplay Dallas or even come close. W/ our 12th man, had that game been in Dallas we could easily have lost 50-6 both teams playing the same otherwise.

Wins must mean something. Just like you all make fun of peoples' kids that just get "the family business handed to them," so too, that's how our wins seem to come each week.

My point is that even though this team isn't playing it's best football it has been in every game this season except for two. Hell, they even gave NE a good first half. Despite the injuries, despite the poor coaching, despite the low rankings, this team has still found was of making it happen. That gives me hope not dispair.

[TacklingDummy]

JP Lossmen 27 TD's
T Edwards 1 TD

Losman 27 TDs in 32 career appearances.

Tom Brady 27 TDs in 7 games this year.

[RedEyE]

Losman 27 TDs in 32 career ppearances.

Tom Brady 27 TDs in 7 games this year.

That makes me sick.

[acehole]

More food for thought:

If the Bills maintain composure and pull of that miracle upset over Dallas, they would have won the last 3 games.

If the Bills would have just stopped the Broncos from their monster last minute drive in week 1, the Bills close out a win there as well. This team is merely two seconds away from a 4-2 season at this point.

Yes and playoffs were not a pipe dream after all....

[Oaf]

This arguement has been beaten dead. Please, lets at least wait for the decision before we start up again.

[Michael82]

This arguement has been beaten dead. Please, lets at least wait for the decision before we start up again.
even though the decision will most likely be another 1 week thing? :ill:

[Ingtar33]

the problem with this debate is we're talking past eachother.

Losman is not a good nfl quarterback right now. at best he's an average one. This means nothing about his potential future prospects, or what he might be with more starts under his belt.

Edwards is not a good NFL quarterback either. at best he's an average one. This also means nothing about what he might become.

Comparing stats between the two is sad. It's sort of like two guys in a pee-ing contests spraying on their shooes and judging who won by who has the bigger foot.

Neither is very good.

Both sides are arguing their guy has better potential.

So forgive the analogy, but it's like those same two guys standing around with the wet shoes arguing over who could have, or will shot farther next time.

From a pure coaching standpoint, if i was the Bills head coach I would start Edwards. That is only due to the fact Edwards hits his men in stride and has a quick release. JP has (thus far in his career) a better deep ball and is a better athlete.

What we have is a leadoff hitter (in JP ) who hits .198 yet will crank out 30 HR and 30 steals in a year (with a nice amount of strikouts), vs a leadoff hitter (TE) who hits .295 will give you 20HRs and 10 Steals.

In short, you don't want either of them leading off for your team. But since it's the leadoff hitters job to get on base, you have to stab yourself, and put the slow guy who gets on base in the spot over the fast guy who never is on base.

Right now im just glad the Bills seem to resemble an nfl team for a change.

[clumping platelets]

:popcorn:

[shelby]

the problem with this debate is we're talking past eachother.

Losman is not a good nfl quarterback right now. at best he's an average one. This means nothing about his potential future prospects, or what he might be with more starts under his belt.

Edwards is not a good NFL quarterback either. at best he's an average one. This also means nothing about what he might become.

Comparing stats between the two is sad. It's sort of like two guys in a pee-ing contests spraying on their shooes and judging who won by who has the bigger foot.

Neither is very good.

Both sides are arguing their guy has better potential.

So forgive the analogy, but it's like those same two guys standing around with the wet shoes arguing over who could have, or will shot farther next time.

From a pure coaching standpoint, if i was the Bills head coach I would start Edwards. That is only due to the fact Edwards hits his men in stride and has a quick release. JP has (thus far in his career) a better deep ball and is a better athlete.

What we have is a leadoff hitter (in JP ) who hits .198 yet will crank out 30 HR and 30 steals in a year (with a nice amount of strikouts), vs a leadoff hitter (TE) who hits .295 will give you 20HRs and 10 Steals.

In short, you don't want either of them leading off for your team. But since it's the leadoff hitters job to get on base, you have to stab yourself, and put the slow guy who gets on base in the spot over the fast guy who never is on base.

Right now im just glad the Bills seem to resemble an nfl team for a change.
:goodpost:

[Mitchy moo]

What we have is a leadoff hitter (in JP ) who hits .198 yet will crank out 30 HR and 30 steals in a year (with a nice amount of strikouts), vs a leadoff hitter (TE) who hits .295 will give you 20HRs and 10 Steals.

In short, you don't want either of them leading off for your team. But since it's the leadoff hitters job to get on base, you have to stab yourself, and put the slow guy who gets on base in the spot over the fast guy who never is on base.

Right now im just glad the Bills seem to resemble an nfl team for a change.

One of them has had 800 at bats and one has had 80, so who is more likely to improve??

[acehole]

Tom Brady 27 TDs in 7 games this year.
T Edwards 4 ints in 2 games.

[/quote]

Losman 27 TDs in 32 career appearances.

Tom Brady 27 TDs in 7 games this year.

[Philagape]

T Edwards 4 ints in 2 games.


in FOUR games. One per game.

[justasportsfan]

people are in love with TE's POTENTIAL.

IF TE wasn't a bills QB and someone said would you want a QB that has 1 TD 4 INT and lost 1 game and almost lost another and his only win was against a crappy jets in 3 games he's started , people here would say, no thanks.

But hey, although he doesn't score points he at least controls the clock with dinks and dunks , he's a bills qb so he's got a bright future. The only thing he's shown is that he's a younger Holcomb........ and people call me a homer. :shakeno:

[Mitchy moo]

people are in love with TE's POTENTIAL.

IF TE wasn't a bills QB and someone said would you want a QB that has 1 TD 4 INT and lost 1 game and almost lost another and his only win was against a crappy jets in 3 games he's started , people here would say, no thanks.

But hey, although he doesn't score points he at least controls the clock with dinks and dunks , he's a bills qb so he's got a bright future. The only thing he's shown is that he's a younger Holcomb........ and people call me a homer. :shakeno:

He's shown all of us that we can win with the players that we have. All JP has shown us is a 8-19 record, so I have seen enough of him.

[justasportsfan]

He's shown all of us that we can win with the players that we have. All JP has shown us is a 8-19 record, so I have seen enough of him.
he also showed us that he can throw games away during clutch. . The team is winning inspite of him.

I know that he's a rookie and I like him but I am not blind either. He's doing well for a rookie but he hasn't shown me anything special either other than being a younger Holcomb.

[acehole]

There really wasnt...if you remember JP got hurt and TE was the second string.
That is pretty much what Juron said. The controversy should start when and if they name TE the starter.


You know what's absolutely amazing around here?

The fact that there is a QB contoversy with a 4 year guy who was drafted 24th overall vs. a guy that just finished his 3rd career start as a (3rd round) rookie.

Beck and Russell are still sitting on the bench because there coaches have flat out said that "they aren't ready to play yet."

You guys judge Trent like he's a veteran. I saw a post where someone said "he can't close out games." After his third start you can figure that out?

Geez.

[acehole]

he also showed us that he can throw games away during clutch. . The team is winning inspite of him.

I know that he's a rookie and I like him but I am not blind either. He's doing well for a rookie but he hasn't shown me anything special either other than being a younger Holcomb.


It is just me and you kid....I think 2 others. Time will prove this one way or the other.

[Mahdi]

he also showed us that he can throw games away during clutch. . The team is winning inspite of him.

I know that he's a rookie and I like him but I am not blind either. He's doing well for a rookie but he hasn't shown me anything special either other than being a younger Holcomb.
To his credit he made some pretty nice deep throws to Evans and Parrish. Parrish would have had that for a TD if not for the interference.

[acehole]

To his credit he made some pretty nice deep throws to Evans and Parrish. Parrish would have had that for a TD if not for the interference.

Yea...more excuses.

Would a should a could a...

[justasportsfan]

It is just me and you kid....I think 2 others. Time will prove this one way or the other.
thing is, I'm not a Losman fan nor am I a Trent hater.

I just want to make sure the coaches have their head in the right place. I just don't want a Flutie - Johnson or a Henry - Willis situation where we let the wrong player go .

[justasportsfan]

To his credit he made some pretty nice deep throws to Evans .underthrew .


and Parrish. Parrish would have had that for a TD if not for the interference.
I didn't see where the penalty was but I'll take it. The ball was also underthrown.

[TacklingDummy]

thing is, I'm not a Losman fan nor am I a Trent hater.



:lmao: Now I can go to work in a good mood. Thanks for the laugh.

[justasportsfan]

:lmao: Now I can go to work in a good mood. Thanks for the laugh.


you can laugh it up all you want. You're the hater here.

[TacklingDummy]

you can laugh it up all you want. You're the hater here.
So me criticizig Losman with actual facts is considered "Hate" but you bashing Edwards and praising JP based on basically nothing but your opinion is not considered "hate"?

[justasportsfan]

So me criticizig Losman with actual facts is considered "Hate" but you bashing Edwards and praising JP based on basically nothing but your opinion is not considered "hate"?


na, you make twisted facts. Half truth. Wysian logic.

You wanna go back during the draft and see who defended TE? I bash TE when I've said several times that he's gonna be one hell of a qb? I even said then that I wasn't sold on JP and if in case he fails TE would be an insurance (paraphrase) . Well it look slike it's turning out that way problem is, I'm not sure yet if Jp is a bust because of the coaches.

Just like those who want Trent Edwards you only see what you want to see becuase you HATE JP while the others like TE.

It only seems like I'm bashing TE because I DON'T see his "dink and dunk" as a deep spiral that went for 100 yards and the others have already decided he's the future when in fact a lot of them were the hypocrites that wanted Holcomb gone because he did exactly what TE is doing on the field.

Just because I am not calling TE the future of this franchise yet doesn't mean I'm bashing him. Being cautious about it is not bashing.

[raphael120]

JP Losman faced Denver and Pittsburgh

Denver has the #1 pass defense in the NFL
Pittsburgh has the #1 overall defense in the NFL

I dont care. Rothlisberger has just as much experience as JP does, and 2, Cutler, who is less experienced than JP put up big numbers against the Steelers and led his team to a win.

Im tired of making excuses for JP. We should be OK with him playing like crap against tough teams? Uh, no. How are we going to the playoffs if we dont have a QB who steps up against tough opponents.

Cutler put up 3 TD's and 2INT WITHOUT Javon Walker. Whens the last time JP has put up 3 TD's against a top defense??? Never.

[Philagape]

na, you make twisted facts. Half truth. Wysian logic.

You wanna go back during the draft and see who defended TE? I bash TE when I've said several times that he's gonna be one hell of a qb? Just like those who want Trent Edwards you only see what you want to see becuase you HATE JP while the others like TE.

It seems like I'm bashing TE because I see his "dink and dunk" as is while others here here see him as the future when in fact a lot of them were the hypocrites that wanted Holcomb gone because he did exactly what TE is doing?

Just because I am not calling TE the future of this franchise yet doesn't mean I'm bashing him. Being cautious about it is not bashing.

Maybe people see it that way because you're always so concerned about what other posters say and trying to put them down. Like that post above: Pointing out what people said about Holcomb has nothing to do with the debate over who should be the QB now. I'm more confident in Trent's ability to do more than dink and dunk than I was with Holcomb. There's a reason people think that way, but all you care about is pointless witch hunting for hypocrites.
Bashing other posters with a simple analogy that isn't so simple is what makes people think you're bashing Trent. When you get personal like you always do, it makes people get personal toward you, advances no relevant points whatsoever, turns a complex debate into a black-and-white pissing match, degrades the conversation and sends this board further into the "I'm-right-you're-wrong" bashfest that is turning off and turning away members. And I'm as guilty as anyone.

[justasportsfan]

I dont care. Rothlisberger has just as much experience as JP does, and 2, Cutler, who is less experienced than JP put up big numbers against the Steelers and led his team to a win.

Im tired of making excuses for JP. We should be OK with him playing like crap against tough teams? Uh, no. How are we going to the playoffs if we dont have a QB who steps up against tough opponents.

Cutler put up 3 TD's and 2INT WITHOUT Javon Walker. Whens the last time JP has put up 3 TD's against a top defense??? Never.
SHanahan/Cowher vs. Mularkey and Fairchild. You do the math.

[MikeInRoch]

pand his only win was against a crappy jets in 3 games he's started

I guess the Baltimore game doesn't count, then.

[justasportsfan]

Maybe people see it that way because you're always so concerned about what other posters say and trying to put them down. .It's a MB. I reply to the post. I don't attack the posters.


And I'm as guilty as anyone.
we all are. Those who leave can't take the heat. They might as well read the newspaper or watch the news . This is a mb where people debate.

[justasportsfan]

I guess the Baltimore game doesn't count, then. Oops my bad.

[raphael120]

SHanahan/Cowher vs. Mularkey and Fairchild. You do the math.

So you should admit, along with everyone else on this ****ing board that who is at the helm at QB is irrevelant, and this whole QB debate is a waste of breath, because guess what...with both QB's in...we have NO TD PASSES TO A WR and we're almost HALFWAY into the season. Tha'ts not a QB problem, as I like to say, even a blind squirrle can find a nut. There is something wrong with a system when no matter what team youre playing, you can't get a TD through the air to a WR. There's something wrong with the calls, WR's, somethin. We had a hard time trying to score last year too and I have a hard time believing that our WR's are THAT BAD that no name WRs on other teams are catching the occasional TD pass and whatnot.

It's wasted breath because honestly, you put JP back in there, we aint scoring many points, as we're not scoring points with Edwards either. But at least with Edwards, we're moving the ball and he's poised. I think JP had the benefit of a good line, there were many times he had tons of time in the pocket and got sacked. But again, I dont think there's a big difference on offense no matter who is at QB. But with that point, I think you'll get Edwards at QB because at the end of the day, he's cheaper to keep.

[Philagape]

It's a MB. I reply to the post. I don't attack the posters.

But you bring them up. You make them part of the conversation. You constantly refer to others. "Hypocrite" describes a person, not a post, no matter how much you try to say it does. That poisons the debate and turns it into something else.


we all are. Those who leave can't take the heat. They might as well read the newspaper or watch the news . This is a mb where people debate.

Then expect more misconceptions about you, because you're just as responsible for them. You do more than debate. To say that some people who believe in Trent also didn't like Holcomb is not debating. It's not a point.
The MB is what we make of it.

[Mahdi]

underthrew .


I didn't see where the penalty was but I'll take it. The ball was also underthrown.
Underthrew??? If he threw it any farther it would have been picked. He put it where it had to be.


And the one to Parrish was on the money. Look at it again.

[justasportsfan]

So you should admit, along with everyone else on this ****ing board that who is at the helm at QB is irrevelant, and this whole QB debate is a waste of breath, because guess what...with both QB's in...we have NO TD PASSES TO A WR and we're almost HALFWAY into the season. Tha'ts not a QB problem, as I like to say, even a blind squirrle can find a nut. There is something wrong with a system when no matter what team youre playing, you can't get a TD through the air to a WR. There's something wrong with the calls, WR's, somethin. We had a hard time trying to score last year too and I have a hard time believing that our WR's are THAT BAD that no name WRs on other teams are catching the occasional TD pass and whatnot..I agree which is why it's stupid to compare other qb's to JP. No one so far has disagreed that Rivers, Eli and BEn would not do any better than JP if one of them was the one we drafted.



you put JP back in there, we aint scoring many points, as we're not scoring points with Edwards either. But at least with Edwards, we're moving the ball and he's poised. .I'd rather see that for myself than make assumptions. Lee and Royals seem to want to see for themselves too.





I think JP had the benefit of a good line, there were many times he had tons of time in the pocket and got sacked. But again, I dont think there's a big difference on offense no matter who is at QB. . I Disagree and so does Royals. JP has never had a decent OL.

[justasportsfan]

But you bring them up. You make them part of the conversation. You constantly refer to others. "Hypocrite" describes a person, not a post, no matter how much you try to say it does. That poisons the debate and turns it into something else. .you called me a hypocrite and I never took it personally. Am I attacking the person or are you snesitive?





Then expect more misconceptions about you, because you're just as responsible for them. You do more than debate. To say that some people who believe in Trent also didn't like Holcomb is not debating. It's not a point..that's your interpretation , not mine.





The MB is what we make of it.I agree. I can take the good along with the bad. Those who can't , they're gone.

[justasportsfan]

Underthrew??? If he threw it any farther it would have been picked. He put it where it had to be.


And the one to Parrish was on the money. Look at it again.
the one to Parrish was perfect. That's the way he should throw it to Evans. Ahed of the wr so he can run for it. Not Behind like he did Evans.

The Reed pas was underthrown. The ball wasn't placed where only Reed could've caught it.

[Philagape]

Am I attacking the person or are you snesitive?

Right there is what I'm talking about. You're turning it back on me. Addressing the person instead of the point.

The point, and I already made it, is that making debates personal takes away from the debate and takes away from any legit point you're trying to make.
You're concerned about dinking and dunking. That's a substantive viewpoint. But when you start calling people hypocrites, your substantive point gets lost and people assume you're a monolithic side-taker who's more concerned with beating others, and that's what they respond to, and they respond in kind.

I'm trying to help you out here. I don't want to lump you in with certain others on both sides of this debate, whom I don't think are necessary to name. You're smarter than that.

And like I said, I'm speaking to myself as well.

[justasportsfan]

Right there is what I'm talking about. You're turning it back on me. Addressing the person instead of the point. .. if I don't agree with you point then I'll adress it. Your reply/post is sensitive :D Better?




The point, and I already made it, is that making debates personal takes away from the debate and takes away from any legit point you're trying to make.
You're concerned about dinking and dunking. That's a substantive viewpoint..But when you start calling people hypocrites,

People call me homer or a licker. I'm not insulted. When I called them hypocrite, it was based on what they said on the message board. If I say their post was hypocritical, it the same thing.




I'm trying to help you out here. I don't want to lump you in with certain others on both sides of this debate, whom I don't think are necessary to name. You're smarter than that. .

I appreciate youe help but I don't need it. I've lasted this long since BZ was created just as I am here on BZ. :up:




You think it's personal? Guess again.

[Philagape]

You think it's personal? Guess again.

If not intentionally, that's how some people receive it. Comm 101: A communicator has to take the audience into account. Not everyone thinks the same way.

[justasportsfan]

If not intentionally, that's how some people receive it. Comm 101: A communicator has to take the audience into account. Not everyone thinks the same way.
So far, you and Op are the only ones who've complained about the way I respond :idunno:

[Philagape]

So far, you and Op are the only ones who've complained about the way I respond. :idunno:

It's the level of the debate where it's evident. You have to clarify where you stand a lot. So do I.

[SABURZFAN]

Losman 27 TDs in 32 career appearances.

Tom Brady 27 TDs in 7 games this year.



that's Mularkey's fault...........

that's Jauron's fault...........

that's Fairchild's fault...........

that's the OL's fault..........

that's Holcomb's fault..............

etc...............

[SABURZFAN]

people are in love with TE's POTENTIAL.

IF TE wasn't a bills QB and someone said would you want a QB that has 1 TD 4 INT and lost 1 game and almost lost another and his only win was against a crappy jets in 3 games he's started , people here would say, no thanks.

But hey, although he doesn't score points he at least controls the clock with dinks and dunks , he's a bills qb so he's got a bright future. The only thing he's shown is that he's a younger Holcomb........ and people call me a homer. :shakeno:


and what about the Lickers mancrushes on Lossman?????

talk about a vague description........then again,looks who's posting it. :rolleyes:

the Bills only scored on 5 of they're possessions this past Sunday. :yawn:

[acehole]

that's Mularkey's fault...........

that's Jauron's fault...........

that's Fairchild's fault...........

that's the OL's fault..........

that's Holcomb's fault..............

etc...............

OK who's fault is 1 TD and 4 INT's?

Gotcha...game point match. I am going to the Jets game I have great seats I will let you know what happens as you cant see a dam thing from your TV screens....

[SABURZFAN]

thing is, I'm not a Losman fan nor am I a Trent hater.






:roflmao:



yeah.............

[SABURZFAN]

OK who's fault is 1 TD and 4 INT's?




:z:

[SABURZFAN]

So me criticizig Losman with actual facts is considered "Hate" but you bashing Edwards and praising JP based on basically nothing but your opinion is not considered "hate"?



:roflmao:


what a joke.

[justasportsfan]

OK who's fault is 1 TD and 4 INT's?

Gotcha...game point match. I am going to the Jets game I have great seats I will let you know what happens as you cant see a dam thing from your TV screens....
don't mind saburz. Notice he couldn't answer your post so he put a smiley. He follows my posts because I'm in his head. :snicker:

[SABURZFAN]

na, you make twisted facts. Half truth. Wysian logic.



and YOU dont?????


:roflmao:

[SABURZFAN]

don't mind saburz. Notice he couldn't answer your post so he put a smiley. He follows my posts because I'm in his head. :snicker:



did somebody pull the string on the back of justas neck again?

[acehole]

don't mind saburz. Notice he couldn't answer your post so he put a smiley. He follows my posts because I'm in his head. :snicker:

I saw that ......gayest thing I have ever seen.

Hey saber fan here is one more to put a smiley face on..

On third down, he has only 11 first-down conversions in 34 passing plays.

Wow....... effeciency! Wow just like Elway!

[justasportsfan]

I saw that ......gayest thing I have ever seen.

!
:snicker:

[SABURZFAN]

I saw that ......gayest thing I have ever seen.

Hey saber fan here is one more to put a smiley face on..

On third down, he has only 11 first-down conversions in 34 passing plays.

Wow....... effeciency! Wow just like Elway!



the only thing that Elway and Edwards have in common is that they both went to Stanford.try asking me a question that i HAVEN'T answered.the last question you asked,i already answered in another thread.

[TacklingDummy]

So far, you and Op are the only ones who've complained about the way I respond :idunno:
I may disagree with your opinion but I don't have a problem with it.