Did some quick research on GW and the other coaches

[Pride]

These tidbits are from posts earlier in the season... Maybe it will refresh some memories about our wonderful coaching staff.

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Special teams coach..not yet
OC Gilbrides already replaced him
DC, looks like Lebeau, Grays could be out, can become a subserviant
OL coach, GONE
DL coach retired, replacement, who knows if he will stick

If the special teams coach gets axed, his 4 main coaches he hand picked will have been released. Not exactly an endorsement for his skill as a head coach.

http://www.billsfanzone.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=8142&highlight=greg+williams

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Greg Williams obviously doesn't know very much about the 46 because we don't have the players needed to effectively run it. Yet he insists on sticking with a scheme that is hurting us more than helping us.

Until we get an all world DE and have a set of safeties that can make big plays, it will not work.

http://www.billsfanzone.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=6786&highlight=greg+williams

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GREG WILLIAMS ~ F Failed again to ignite a fire under his team when it counted the most. Then showed us all how much confidence he truly has in his team when he kicked the field goal rather then going for it on a 4th and 1 situation while the Bills were down by 20 late in the 3rd quarter. Thanks Coach!

http://www.billsfanzone.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=6800&highlight=greg+williams

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This is the defense that GW wants and JG fits in because he wants to run it as well. We don't have the talent to run the defense we are trying to run. They are hoping our players will play in and get comfortable with the system so next season they will get some talent and hopefully be much improved. I don't see Grey going anywhere if GW is still here because I don't think it's fair to hold him responsible when he is clearly being put in a position he won't be successful. If GW goes so will Grey.

I am very sceptical about Williams. He does not know how to manage a game and we don't know if he will ever learn and stop making the mistakes he's making. If we can't get someone with experience as HC we should stick with Williams as he has been here for two years and trying to work up his system. I have seen a lot of good things from Williams but screwing up gametime decisions is not acceptable for a coach...especially some of the no-brainers he has screwed up. As a replacement, Dennis Green comes to mind he's available and probably wants to coach again. He had a lot of success at Minnesota until everything fell apart there and he was smart enough to get out while he could.

Gilbride does not deserve to be an OC on this team. It might look good at times but there is no way he is ever going to change. He has never solidified Henry as a running threat and that fact alone has caused the offense to look like crap the past month. If we had a proven running attack Drew would be able to play to his strenghts a lot more. Instead, teams just come against us and take Drews strengths away and we look like crap. I'm sorry but I cannot support Gilbride as OC no matter what people say about him. I have no question an inexperience OC who just knew enough not to screw things up would look like Bill Walsh with this offense. Gilbride is throwing it all out the door. The only place he will look good is on a team with mid level talent where he can take a lot of chances and help them win some games instead of losing every game. Having a highly talented offense that can perfrom as one of the best in the league his style just drags it down into mediocrity.

http://www.billsfanzone.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=6396&highlight=greg+williams

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greg williams is actually worse than wade philips was. thats hard to do but he has managed to do it.

last year was not his fault with all the cuts (td) and injuries but this year we should be 7-2. we lost to new england and new york because of stupid coaching

we should fire greg and make ted cottrell the head coach

http://www.billsfanzone.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=5451&highlight=greg+williams

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this coaching staff is the ONLY reason that we wouldn't make the playoffs.Wys' stats about the Red Zone,the last drive,etc..are about accurate if you give or take a yard or 2.i'm glad to see that i wasn't the only one bellyaching about these matters.


this coaching staff blows.

http://www.billsfanzone.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=6030&highlight=greg+williams

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[kgun12]

Ok the point issssssssss!

[TedMock]

Like I said in another post. We'll see now that he has a little experience and more talent on the team. Even if we won another game last season and made the wild card, we weren't going anywhere passed that. These posts were well deserved especially because you could almost taste how close we were to being a contender. I still say he's gotten better and that we have to wait until this season to fairly assess him. To say he doesn't know the 46 when he successfully coached it both as a positional coach and as a coordinator isn't accurate in my opinion. We definitely didn't have the talen to run it so far but it's a complicated scheme and as evidenced by the end of last season the players are starting to get it. The guys we brought in are smart vets who won't take much time to adapt as all of these 1st and 2nd year guys did.

[Pride]

The point is, GW does have a history of making bad decisions. It isnt 1 or 2 incidents. It went on all season long. We just tend to forget about all of the little stuff and simply remember 4 down on the 32, PUNT.

This was meant to jog some memories.

As you can tell, I don't care for GW. But then again I dont like JG or KG either.

[TedMock]

Yes, this is do or die for him. If we suck this year then I absolutely agree to ax him. My point was to give a fair assessment, not to say that he's been great.

[Pride]

Has anyone thought about the fact that, with all of the pure talent on our team, alot of mistakes made by GW will be covered up?

In my opinion, last year, was the telling year for GW. This year will be a cakewalk for him. He has all of the talent that any coach has ever had.

My poing is, Last year, he could not make an average team good. He made an above average team average. If you give Parcells, Mariucci, or Reid last year's squad, we make the playoffs. Not win a SB, but at least make the playoffs.

[Pride]

.

[Pride]

Ted, you back up your opinion well, I wish you would post more often!

[TedMock]

We weren't above average last year. Our offense was. The D and special teams were pretty bad most of the year. The D got better late. Any successful coach has above average talent overall. One side of the ball may be average but the other usually ends up being above. The great teams we had in the early 90's were talented as all hell. They rode pure talent to 4 straight superbowls. I'm not knocking Marv at all but he didn't really have to do much. He did call the plays inside the 10. Philly's D has been great for Reid and Mariucci has had pretty solid talent in SF. Even Parcell's had above average talent on one side of the ball or another. I'll give you Parcell's though, I don't think anybody's in his league.

[Pride]

Maybe it is just me, but I think our D was average last year. Not bad like most think. I think the scheme and the coaching is what made it suck so bad.

We had 2 outstanding CBs
1 All Pro MLB
Newman was Solid
Big Pat was Solid
and Schoebel was solid.

When you think about it, Marv didn't have much more.

He had Bruce
He had Bennett and Talley, but not the whole time
Crappy corners
and a half decent strong safety.

Our defense in the early 90's wasn't that good!

[TedMock]

I agree that the D in the early 90's was overrated but I think it was better than this one. Don't forget about Nate Odomes at corner, he was a pure lockdown guy. The Offense in the early 90's was averaging like 28 points per game. They were stacked with a bunch of probowl OL, Kelly, Reed, Thurm, Lofton, Metzalars, McKeller, Beebe..These guys all came up with big plays. Last year, we didn't have a bunch of gaping holes in the D but the few that were there were huge. I think that the "other" DT spot was huge as was WLB. The other spot was DE, Schobel is solid but the other spot was filled with inconsistancy. I do agree with you that Newman is solid but I think he was misused. Hopefully they use Posey as a pass rusher this season. Pride, I actually enjoy pointing out differences in opinion with you. It's not stressful or argumentative. Good points, good backup, respect eachother.

[Cntrygal]

Originally posted by Pride
If you give Parcells, Mariucci, or Reid last year's squad, we make the playoffs. Not win a SB, but at least make the playoffs.

Don't forget about Shelby's man... Gruden.

:D

[Pride]

Thank you for the praise.

I did forget about Odomes, but wasn't he only good for 2 of those 4 seasons?

To be honest, I dont even remember who our DT's were back then. Jeff Wright?

We played the 3-4, so if my memory serves me correctly, it looked like this. (I attempted to rank their skills 1-10, 10 being pro-bowl)

DL
B Smith (10)
Jeff Wright (5)
P Hanson (7)

LB
Bennett (8)
Talley (9)
Maddox (5)
? (?)

CB
Odomes (10)
? (?)

S
Henry Jones (9)
Mark Kelso (3)

As I look over that D, I compare it to last years D.

DL
Schoebel (6)
Pat Williams (9)
Revolving Door (4)
Ahanatu (5)

LB
Fletcher (10)
Newman (8) <- if used properly
Robinson (5)

CB
Clements (8)
Winfield (8)

S
Wire (Rookie) (5)
Preliou (spelling?) (5)

To me, 2002 Defense looks the same as the 1990-1993 D

It may just be my opinion on this. I am just worried we are wasting a year with all of this talent, if GW cannot carry them deep into the playoffs.

If we had this talent in 90-93, we go 2-2 or 3-1 (Skins completely whipped us)

[WG]

GW isn't the one who tossed 15 INTs and fumbled twice in 7 losses!

The D did just fine towards the end of the season, if they increase according to the upgrades we've made, we can count on a top 5 D this year. More than adequate no matter who coaches!

I have to question why this thread was brought up as well. Seems like everything was GW's fault last year!

Drew sucked in 8 games too, yet he's hailed as a hero.

[TedMock]

LB's we had Shane Conlan and then Ray Bentley, Leonard Smith was a great hitter and run stopper pre-Schultz. Although Smith missed the Superbowl with an injury, he was on crutches that day. Leon Seals started at DE the first superbowl which is the year before we drafted Hanson, I think. I'd give Kelso a higher grade. He wasn't a hitter but he defended well against the pass. I still say if we kept Smerlas around one more season we win that first Bowl. Jeff Wright was manhandled all game. We drafted Derrick Borroughs who was another lock down guy to play opposite Odomes. Everyone thought we'd have the next Lester Hayes/Mike Haynes type tandom. Unfortunately Borroughs broke his neck and was unable to play again. That D in the 90's had a handful of 'studs' but even more solid, consistant guys who played well every week. That's the biggest issue we had last year. Some of these guys are so inconsistant.

[justasportsfan]

Didn't the D allow an average of 10pts per game towards the end of the season and it just so happened the O dropped? We would've made the playoffs if the O didn't decline which was KG's responsibility. Then again GW is the HC so it is his responsibility as well but I wouldn't blame him completely.

I was ready to write GW off at a certain point of the season. But the sudden resurgence of the D saved his job and has therefore earned one more season to prove himself. My thoughts on him are 50/50 at this point in time.

The players seem to have very high respect for him.

[Pride]

This thread was aimed at all 3 top coaches. I am willing to give JG one more year. KG, until he shows me he wants to run, is on my ***** list.

But Williams is the one who truly scares me. I have no faith in him. Worse yet, it is hard to point to specific reasons why. I just don't have faith in him.

I brought up the thread for good conversation, which I got. But also, to try to put my own reasons in perspective.

Ted, thanks for the insight into the SB years Defenses. You are right, they were a better bunch. I had forgotten about some of them. I think it is just they were all overshadowed by our O, they seem to fade away faster.

As far as Drew. I knew going into the season he was a big play/risk taker. With that many yards he threw for, the chance for INT goes up fast. 40+ attempts per game, will yield alot of INT's. I do blame him for about 3 of the losses.

But in that, part of it still has to fall on GW. As someone said, he is the HC, and by that it means when KG begins to pass like crazy after being down by 1 TD in the 3rd Quarter, GW needs to step in and say, we need to continue doing what got us here. I just don't think he gets the entire scheme of things.

He makes some bad calls. I can remember countless times sitting in front of the TV saying, "This next play will be a 10 yard out" and low and behold, it was. Worse yet, I can remember screaming at the TV saying "What the hell are you doing???"

He may get better, but I am afraid it is directly proportional to better players, not a better coach.

[TedMock]

My theory on Drew is that he's a very good QB who's loses something at the end of the year but I could never figure out why. Last year was easy. Throw the ball 40 times a game and eventually your arm loses its zip. Throwing that many times also increases you chance of getting sacked. He does hold the ball too long at times and does force it at times but for the most part I think he's solid. I do think that the offense should be focused around Henry instead though. I would bet that doing that results in Drew throwing for fewer yards but more TD's rather than these 350-400 yard 1 TD games. I'd much rather see 17 for 25, 220 yards and 2 TD's than 31/40 360yards 1 TD 1 int.

[Pride]

I agree completely Ted