On Losman vs. Edwards

[Wys Guy]

I can quite honestly say that I do not have a good handle on this situation.

JP has only had about 2 dozen starts, hardly enough to qualify as a "fair shot." Yet on the other hand, he really needed to show some improvement, as marginal as it may have been, in the short passing game this season over last. As we all know, or should, that's where a QB's bread is buttered.

A long game is a requisite component of a QB's array of options, but clearly most passes fall into the high-percentage or short-medium game if that QB will be successful.

Having said that, JP simply has not demonstrated any marked improvement in this facet of his game from last season either in the preseason or in limited action this fall, even against two very good Ds.

Edwards on the other hand is a rookie thrown into a mix of a team that can't even block well or regularly. This isn't to suggest that it does that for JP, but at least JP has last season as a notice served that he's on his own at times in that way. Edwards is just figuring that out.

Again, having said that, Edwards throws a lot more quick outlet and short passes than Losman ever did, no doubt partially by design but also partially due to his strengths. At the same time however he has proven to be a bit of an anti-Losman in that his deep arm simply isn't any more accurate than JP's and may in fact be worse. We don't really have a full compliment of data points here.

It seems that most of the team's players rally behind Losman and have intentions of winning now vice considering the future first.

So what does the team do? If we either dish or waive Losman at some point, which is imminent unless he continues to start, and he plays well elsewhere, it merely further hammers this team into the ground at the managerial levels and from the perceptions of players, fans, and media.

On the other hand if they go with Edwards and he chokes then we're in a similar boat. While not decisive on the QB situation, I also haven't seen much from Edwards unlike many indicative that he'll be anything other than what Holcomb is thanks to the astute observations by some other posters here.

As I see it however, due to Lynch's struggles, the issue is still the OL and the overall offensive strategy. That's why we're years away from doing anything regardless of how Losman or Edwards plays. Y'all, the media, and team are tinkering with this JP v. Edwards thing while the core reasons for why we suck slip by unnoticed by the same parties disallowing us to do what needs to be done in order to correct flawed philosophies and methodologies.

[YardRat]

Re: On Losman vs. Edwards

Rome wasn't built in a day, and neither was any championship team in football.

[gr8slayer]

Re: On Losman vs. Edwards

Rome wasn't built in a day, and neither was any championship team in football.

Well we've failed to build Rome in forty years, how long does it take>

[YardRat]

Re: On Losman vs. Edwards

Well we've failed to build Rome in forty years, how long does it take>

Stay tuned...You just may be fortunate enough to find out.

[Wys Guy]

Re: On Losman vs. Edwards

Stay tuned...You just may be fortunate enough to find out.

By the time that happens most of us will be in for more on Depends and Dent-u-grip than we will be for tickets to games.

[BillsOverDolphins]

Re: On Losman vs. Edwards

Stay tuned...You just may be fortunate enough to find out.

yes, but it wont have quite the same ring when the Los Angeles Bills win

[THE END OF ALL DAYS]

Re: On Losman vs. Edwards

yes, but it wont have quite the same ring when the Los Angeles Bills win

Now thats a depressing post

[Typ0]

Re: On Losman vs. Edwards

My thinking on the situation is this. The offense is not nearly as bad as you are suggesting. At least with TE we move the chains and get downfield. The coaching staff is desparate for one of these guys to emerge as a threat and turn the medicre qbing we've been getting into something that threatens a defense.

There are a lot of people who think JP is some kind of threat and he's not. All he does is throw several deep balls a game to get one that works. The rest of his game stinks. That is not a threat. On a down by down basis defenses have no reason to respect the game JP Losman is playing all they have to do is worry about a low percentage pass once and a while that could hurt them. This in turn has a huge negative effect on our defense because they end up on the field for too much of the game. And JP losman has not improved in the areas of the game he's weakest in two years. That is why the change was made.

TE, on the other hand, does not have all the tools in his toolbelt that JP does right now. But he's been adding things every week that he's played and he's been able to attack the defense and consistently move us downfield. In the last two games he's played he started throwing more downfield and also, and very importantly, started getting the ball to the tight ends. TE has shown consistent improvement and he has also demonstrated, that as a rookie, he can run the offense in a positive instead of negative fashion. So with JP the team is stagnant and with TEs the team is getting better. It really seems like a no-brainer to me.

And before all the moans and groans (I know they are coming anyway) I truly wish JP was showing more than he is. The best case scenario for us is both of these guys step up and become top ten NFL qbs and continue to compete for the job so we have two great QBs on the roster or can trade one for a great deal of value. I'm just saying these things because JP has not been showing what he should after four years. People still bring up the arguements about other qbs like favre, elway, montana...well you should not be mentioning JP in the same breath as those guys except only in hindsight. You act like if we stick with JP while he plays poor or average he'll be able to work it out is some guarantee. There are no guarantees and a lot more guys fail than turn into Brett Favre.

Finally, a nice exciting Mike Martz style offense would be fun but this offense does not promise to be that just because JP throws a nice spiral downfield. We do not have the receivers to play that style of offense and if we try we're going to get killed. We also don't have a strong pass catching running back. Get it out of your heads that our offense can turn into some kind of explosive machine because it can't. Our coaching staff is not going to build that kind of team and I don't blame them (maybe that's why you don't like them). Instead, they are going to distribute the money spent on players accross the team and try and get solid units on both sides of the ball. That's something I would like to see and I think we can be a good team with this coaching staff despite the whines and complains about the play calling.

[Wraith]

Re: On Losman vs. Edwards

JP has only had about 2 dozen starts, hardly enough to qualify as a "fair shot." Yet on the other hand, he really needed to show some improvement, as marginal as it may have been, in the short passing game this season over last. As we all know, or should, that's where a QB's bread is buttered.

A long game is a requisite component of a QB's array of options, but clearly most passes fall into the high-percentage or short-medium game if that QB will be successful.

Having said that, JP simply has not demonstrated any marked improvement in this facet of his game from last season either in the preseason or in limited action this fall, even against two very good Ds.

You really are clueless about short-passing in the NFL. I was going to ask if you had any data to support your conclusion that Losman was a bad short passer last season or this, but the answer is clearly NO so I won't bother. I know this because if you had bothered to do the research you would know that Losman completed the second highest percentage of passes thrown less than ten yards last season in the entire NFL, behind only Tony Romo, and that in limited action this year, he is even better.

[BAM]

Re: On Losman vs. Edwards

It's a tough call for sure. Each has their own positives and negatives. To me, they equal each other out. I don't really care who starts, I just want them to stick with one of them.

[The King]

Re: On Losman vs. Edwards

Football is hardly science the team with the best lines usually wins.

[DBam]

Re: On Losman vs. Edwards

The main differences I've observed between the two are the following: With Edwards we have been able to consistently keep drives alive, thus keeping the defense fresh. This in itself is my opinion on why our defense has significantly improved of late. You don't see this show up in any stats, but could be the very reason why the coaches prefer Edwards. He doesn't have a lot of 3 and outs.

In addition, when is the last time that you have seen a JP run team utilizing the TEs? By spreading out the attack and utilizing all of his weapons, he is making our offense much less predictable. Granted, he hasn’t lit up the score board yet, but he is making some very good defenses "Ravens" look ordinary .

[Patti120]

Re: On Losman vs. Edwards

I know someone mentioned this in another post but maybe if we could combine TE and JP then we'd have a pretty good quarterback. Either way, I'm rooting for whoever is behind center and I hope they light it up! It's also time for our O-line to play with some attitude and start busting open some holes for ML!

[colin]

Re: On Losman vs. Edwards

the real problem right now isn't our line, it is the skill guys.

we have 2 rook rbs who have talent but miss holes and nearly always have trouble in the blitz pick up.

we have a vet who gets benched for a rookie and a rookie qb (neither are the pivot man a good O needs), and we have 2 bad TEs, one good but very small WR, and a punt returner and one of the slowest WR's in the nfl below 6 feet. we lost price our only other vet to injury.

our line is new in terms of being together, and not consistent, that's true. they get us time enough often enough tho, and while not great have blocked some people in the run game. our team sucks against blitzes and we have no targets big enough to screen off an LB or DB on a slant.

we need at least one more solid or big time WR and a TE who can do some things to be effective.

[justasportsfan]

Re: On Losman vs. Edwards

My thinking on the situation is this. The offense is not nearly as bad as you are suggesting. At least with TE we move the chains and get downfield. T.

In Bellichicks press conference They said he wouldn't apologize for the Pats high scoring O "why else would they be in there but to score points, it's their job to score points".

OUrs is to move chains and control the clock only? Even Dick just came out and said we need to score points.

There are several ways to control the clock. Get a decent run blocking OL. We don't even have that.

This O is horrible. We are ranked at the bottom in the 2nd straight year and who should be held accountable? The qb? What about Fairchild? Seems to me no matter who the qb is, we can't score. If you noticed since the 1st jets game, TE has REGRESSED now that teams have tape on him. What happens next year? We'll bench him too?