WTF, Jauron, you moron!

[lordofgun]

How do you not challenge that fumble?

What a ******.

[MarshawnIsDaMan]

We may have to put it on the guys upstairs. They have the TV's up there to look at it and tell Jauron.

[JD]

I honestly do NOT put that on Jauron, did you see that ****ing ref telling him it was incomplete for sure? He even signaled his hands to show incomplete.

They are throwing this game for Taylor. May god rest his soul but WHAT THE **** seriously? This is football. I'm sorry the guy lost his life tragically but life goes on.

[BidsJr]

How do you not challenge that fumble?

What a ******.
I'm not sure that is even reviewable if there was an inadvertant whistle.

Jauron was obviously ready to throw the flag, maybe the ref said it wasn't challengable.

[jamze132]

I don't know, I CAN'T SEE THE GAME!

[djjimkelly]

How do you not challenge that fumble?

What a ******.


still think we dont need a new staff?

[Wys Guy]

WTF, Jauron, you moron!

How do you not challenge that fumble?

What a ******.

Didn't you get the memo, Jauron was Coach of the Week. That means he's incredible and the team is coming along.

I disappointed at all of the negativity on the boards today. I mean it's so easy to see that the Ivy League Dynamic Duo has a plan and that we'll be in the playoffs next season.

Now this. This is no way to support your team people!

[Don't Panic]

I'm pretty sure the ref told him he couldn't challenge that play. I don't know why though... there's nothing to say you can't review that play. There was no whistle. Hell, they reversed initial judgment. He should have thrown the flag and at least forced the head umpire to explain it.

[John Doe]

Didn't you get the memo, Jauron was Coach of the Week. That means he's incredible and the team is coming along.

I disappointed at all of the negativity on the boards today. I mean it's so easy to see that the Ivy League Dynamic Duo has a plan and that we'll be in the playoffs next season.

Now this. This is no way to support your team people!

Please join the rest of the Bills fans in the victory celebration.

[Mr. Pink]

Please join the rest of the Bills fans in the victory celebration.

I don't think he's capable. He has no idea what anything but biased negativity is.

[Crisis]

wys lives for the "i told you so"

[YardRat]

The radio guys seemed to think it was obviously an incompletion based on the replays they were watching.

[zone]

wys lives for the "i told you so"

Take away that win today and the Bills lost.

[Dr. Lecter]

http://buffalobills.com/blog/index.jsp?post_id=2504

WHY NO CHALLENGE ON ELLISON FORCED FUMBLE: Early in Sunday's game Keith Ellison appeared to strip Chris Cooley of the ball after making an intermediate reception, which he recovered. The officials initially ruled it a catch and fumble and signaled that Buffalo had possession. But after conferring on the field together the officials overturned their initial call and ruled it incomplete. Replay clearly showed that Cooley had made the catch and got three steps down before the fumble.
So I asked Dick Jauron why he did not challenge the ruling. Here's his answer.

“If you challenge it you cannot get the ball because they already ruled it an incompletion," said Jauron. "What would happen if we challenge that play, I believe they could rule it a completion and they could get the ball at that point. So there were certainly a lot of reasons for us not to challenge. You don’t want to challenge that one. Clearly the back judge thought he saw him bobble it. It was initially ruled a completion and a fumble, and then they overruled it on the field and called it an incompletion. If they had ruled it a completion, but not a fumble then we could have challenged it and got the ball.”

So because the final ruling on the field was an incompletion, challenging for a fumble is not an option because the only change to a play ruled incomplete is a completed pass and that would not have benefited the Bills in any way.

Awwww.......

Looks like Jauron was right and others were wrong.

[jdbillsfan]

Take away that win today and the Bills lost.

That's funny.

[Jeff1220]

http://buffalobills.com/blog/index.jsp?post_id=2504

WHY NO CHALLENGE ON ELLISON FORCED FUMBLE: Early in Sunday's game Keith Ellison appeared to strip Chris Cooley of the ball after making an intermediate reception, which he recovered. The officials initially ruled it a catch and fumble and signaled that Buffalo had possession. But after conferring on the field together the officials overturned their initial call and ruled it incomplete. Replay clearly showed that Cooley had made the catch and got three steps down before the fumble.
So I asked Dick Jauron why he did not challenge the ruling. Here's his answer.

“If you challenge it you cannot get the ball because they already ruled it an incompletion," said Jauron. "What would happen if we challenge that play, I believe they could rule it a completion and they could get the ball at that point. So there were certainly a lot of reasons for us not to challenge. You don’t want to challenge that one. Clearly the back judge thought he saw him bobble it. It was initially ruled a completion and a fumble, and then they overruled it on the field and called it an incompletion. If they had ruled it a completion, but not a fumble then we could have challenged it and got the ball.”

So because the final ruling on the field was an incompletion, challenging for a fumble is not an option because the only change to a play ruled incomplete is a completed pass and that would not have benefited the Bills in any way.

Awwww.......

Looks like Jauron was right and others were wrong.

To me, this sounds like Jauron might have actually had a full grasp of the situation and played it correctly. His decisions aren't always the best, but he has been solid for the most part this year.

[Voltron]

wys lives for the "i told you so"
yes but he has been right 70% of the time on the big ones.

Drew
Malarkey
Williams
Donahoe
McGahee

I am not a fan of the negativity but at the same point Mark is always a straight shooter.

[colin]

zone, that was friggin hillarious.

the constant crap stream of our scheme being wrong, the coaches sucked, etc etc is silly.

i agree that our O is (clearly) bad and a change might have to happen there, but to be 500 with a shot at the play offs with a rook qb after jp has stunk like old cheese, our star rook rb hurt, our #2 wr gone, and soooooo many injuries on D is pretty good overall.

[Mr. Miyagi]

I don't think he's capable. He has no idea what anything but biased negativity is.
Has anyone ever seen Wys and Op at the same time?

[Voltron]

Has anyone ever seen Wys and Op at the same time?
:wave:

[OpIv37]

http://buffalobills.com/blog/index.jsp?post_id=2504

WHY NO CHALLENGE ON ELLISON FORCED FUMBLE: Early in Sunday's game Keith Ellison appeared to strip Chris Cooley of the ball after making an intermediate reception, which he recovered. The officials initially ruled it a catch and fumble and signaled that Buffalo had possession. But after conferring on the field together the officials overturned their initial call and ruled it incomplete. Replay clearly showed that Cooley had made the catch and got three steps down before the fumble.
So I asked Dick Jauron why he did not challenge the ruling. Here's his answer.

“If you challenge it you cannot get the ball because they already ruled it an incompletion," said Jauron. "What would happen if we challenge that play, I believe they could rule it a completion and they could get the ball at that point. So there were certainly a lot of reasons for us not to challenge. You don’t want to challenge that one. Clearly the back judge thought he saw him bobble it. It was initially ruled a completion and a fumble, and then they overruled it on the field and called it an incompletion. If they had ruled it a completion, but not a fumble then we could have challenged it and got the ball.”

So because the final ruling on the field was an incompletion, challenging for a fumble is not an option because the only change to a play ruled incomplete is a completed pass and that would not have benefited the Bills in any way.

Awwww.......

Looks like Jauron was right and others were wrong.

This is EXACTLY the problem with instant replay- it still doesn't allow for challenges on certain controversial plays.

BTW, I don't blame people for thinking Jauron screwed it up. He's messed up enough timeouts and challenges in his day that he hasn't earned the benefit of the doubt.

[LtBillsFan66]

Is it reviewable? Doesn't the whistle blow if initially ruled incomplete?

[Mr. Miyagi]

:wave:
Oh god you mean there are TWO of them? :ill:

[Mahdi]

still think we dont need a new staff?
Man we have won 6 games with the worst offense in the NFL and a Defense full of nobodies. Someone is making good decisions somewhere on that staff.

[Dr. Lecter]

This is EXACTLY the problem with instant replay- it still doesn't allow for challenges on certain controversial plays.

BTW, I don't blame people for thinking Jauron screwed it up. He's messed up enough timeouts and challenges in his day that he hasn't earned the benefit of the doubt.

He has been spot on his challenges this year, although I doubt you would acknowledge that.

[OpIv37]

Man we have won 6 games with the worst offense in the NFL and a Defense full of nobodies. Someone is making good decisions somewhere on that staff.

wait- in the offseason, when I was complaining about losing Spikes, Fletcher and Clements, everyone was lecturing me about how we don't need big names for the D to be good and just because someone isn't a highly recruited first day draft pick doesn't mean we can't win with them.

But now, someone on the coaching staff deserves credit for winning with a bunch of nobodies? So which is it? Do we need big names to win or not?

Also, it's the coaching staff's own decision to have a D full of nobodies because there certainly were some big names we could have signed or kept and they chose not to.
The coaching staff doesn't deserve credit for making the best of a bad situation when the bad situation was their own choice.

[OpIv37]

He has been spot on his challenges this year, although I doubt you would acknowledge that.

and he was awful with them last year- so at best he's 50/50. And he's still been bad with timeouts, clock management, and other in-game decisions.

So, his decisions still should be questioned until all the facts are out.

[hydro]

He has been spot on his challenges this year, although I doubt you would acknowledge that.

I definitely remember hearing that he his above the league average for overturned calls.

[Mahdi]

wait- in the offseason, when I was complaining about losing Spikes, Fletcher and Clements, everyone was lecturing me about how we don't need big names for the D to be good and just because someone isn't a highly recruited first day draft pick doesn't mean we can't win with them.

But now, someone on the coaching staff deserves credit for winning with a bunch of nobodies? So which is it? Do we need big names to win or not?

Also, it's the coaching staff's own decision to have a D full of nobodies because there certainly were some big names we could have signed or kept and they chose not to.
The coaching staff doesn't deserve credit for making the best of a bad situation when the bad situation was their own choice.
Are you forgetting that we have injuries to key players on defense? We have a converted WR playing FS in a cover 2 defense! Im pretty sure our D looks nothing like it was supposed to and yet they are still at .500. And once again we have THE worst offense in the NFL bar none.

[OpIv37]

Are you forgetting that we have injuries to key players on defense? We have a converted WR playing FS in a cover 2 defense! Im pretty sure our D looks nothing like it was supposed to and yet they are still at .500. And once again we have THE worst offense in the NFL bar none.

who's still injured on D? Poz, Simpson and Kelsay. Kelsay has sucked all year- Wilson has been a nice surprise at S and I'll have to give the coaches some credit for that. We definitely miss Poz in the middle and it shows on the field.

We could be 8-4 competing for the 5th playoff seed, but because of our coaches, we're 6-6 and a long shot for the last playoff seed.

Also, don't forget that our coaching staff is a big reason why we have the worst offense in the entire NFL. Fairchild's conservative, predictable playcalling makes life easy for the opposing defenses. The guy is just terrible. He never figured out how to use Losman's speed and he can't get Parrish the ball without some kind of gimmick. We have no quick slants (which are a staple of every successful NFL offense), we have no play action passes, we never run fades, we set up screens with no blockers, etc.

[Mahdi]

who's still injured on D? Poz, Simpson and Kelsay. Kelsay has sucked all year- Wilson has been a nice surprise at S and I'll have to give the coaches some credit for that. We definitely miss Poz in the middle and it shows on the field.

We could be 8-4 competing for the 5th playoff seed, but because of our coaches, we're 6-6 and a long shot for the last playoff seed.

Also, don't forget that our coaching staff is a big reason why we have the worst offense in the entire NFL. Fairchild's conservative, predictable playcalling makes life easy for the opposing defenses. The guy is just terrible. He never figured out how to use Losman's speed and he can't get Parrish the ball without some kind of gimmick. We have no quick slants (which are a staple of every successful NFL offense), we have no play action passes, we never run fades, we set up screens with no blockers, etc.
Our offense is the worst in the league because we rotate #3 WRs as starters, we have no TE worth anything and we have a brand new OL that is struggling to free up our best player. Not to mention major inconsistencies at the most important position on offense. Give me the best OC in the NFL and he would do no better and its not logical to think otherwise. You can only run certain plays with what we have. Oh and BTW we only run gimmick plays to Roscoe because he is a gimmick player. You can throw him a few short passes a game and maybe one bomb and hope for the best but thats about it. Again name me ONE OC in the NFL that has the same talent level we have on offense but still puts a great offensive product on the field. If you can then you have proven me wrong.

[OpIv37]

Our offense is the worst in the league because we rotate #3 WRs as starters, we have no TE worth anything and we have a brand new OL that is struggling to free up our best player. Not to mention major inconsistencies at the most important position on offense. Give me the best OC in the NFL and he would do no better and its not logical to think otherwise. You can only run certain plays with what we have. Oh and BTW we only run gimmick plays to Roscoe because he is a gimmick player. You can throw him a few short passes a game and maybe one bomb and hope for the best but thats about it. Again name me ONE OC in the NFL that has the same talent level we have on offense but still puts a great offensive product on the field. If you can then you have proven me wrong.

this is complete BS. I know our personnel limits what we can do to some extent, but the OC's job is to make the best of the talent on hand and he doesn't do that at all. The classic example is bootlegs or runs with JP- he never utilizes the guy's speed. And don't tell me that Josh Reed can't run a slant- I've seen him do it like twice in 4 years- so it is possible.

And even if all of that is true- how do you explain the fact that we run the same garbage plays over and over again despite the fact that they don't work? Even if we're limited by the players' lack of talent, there is no justification for the complete lack of logic in not at least trying something different.

[TigerJ]

http://buffalobills.com/blog/index.jsp?post_id=2504

WHY NO CHALLENGE ON ELLISON FORCED FUMBLE: Early in Sunday's game Keith Ellison appeared to strip Chris Cooley of the ball after making an intermediate reception, which he recovered. The officials initially ruled it a catch and fumble and signaled that Buffalo had possession. But after conferring on the field together the officials overturned their initial call and ruled it incomplete. Replay clearly showed that Cooley had made the catch and got three steps down before the fumble.
So I asked Dick Jauron why he did not challenge the ruling. Here's his answer.

“If you challenge it you cannot get the ball because they already ruled it an incompletion," said Jauron. "What would happen if we challenge that play, I believe they could rule it a completion and they could get the ball at that point. So there were certainly a lot of reasons for us not to challenge. You don’t want to challenge that one. Clearly the back judge thought he saw him bobble it. It was initially ruled a completion and a fumble, and then they overruled it on the field and called it an incompletion. If they had ruled it a completion, but not a fumble then we could have challenged it and got the ball.”

So because the final ruling on the field was an incompletion, challenging for a fumble is not an option because the only change to a play ruled incomplete is a completed pass and that would not have benefited the Bills in any way.

Awwww.......

Looks like Jauron was right and others were wrong.Thanks, Dr. Lecter. I read that, and I'm still not sure I understand it. I'd like to hear a league official give his take on the rule. I might be inclined to rant at that point about how the rules are screwed up, but I doubt I'm going to get that chance.

[The Spaz]

yes but he has been right 70% of the time on the big ones.

Drew
Malarkey
Williams
Donahoe
McGahee

I am not a fan of the negativity but at the same point Mark is always a straight shooter.

His posts are still douche.

[Ed]

Isn't Jauron 5-5 or close to that on challenges so far this year? He's probably been the best coach this season on correctly challenging calls. He's clearly improved significantly in that area, so last year really isn't that relevant.

[Mahdi]

this is complete BS. I know our personnel limits what we can do to some extent, but the OC's job is to make the best of the talent on hand and he doesn't do that at all. The classic example is bootlegs or runs with JP- he never utilizes the guy's speed. And don't tell me that Josh Reed can't run a slant- I've seen him do it like twice in 4 years- so it is possible.

And even if all of that is true- how do you explain the fact that we run the same garbage plays over and over again despite the fact that they don't work? Even if we're limited by the players' lack of talent, there is no justification for the complete lack of logic in not at least trying something different.
Its a GMs job to provide an OC with enough talent to work with. Its an OC job to use that talent to develop a game plan. You cant just creat magic because your job is OC. And Reed has run slants but he gets punished something fierce when he does. You typically dont use small guys to run slants over the middle especially when you dont have a TE that can create lanes for your small guys. Again you havent named me one OC that has accomplished what you expect out of Fairchild.

[OpIv37]

Isn't Jauron 5-5 or close to that on challenges so far this year? He's probably been the best coach this season on correctly challenging calls. He's clearly improved significantly in that area, so last year really isn't that relevant.

sure it is. He's had one good year and one bad year- that's not really enough to draw any meaningful conclusions. He's 50-50 at best so how do you know he won't screw up the next one?

[OpIv37]

Its a GMs job to provide an OC with enough talent to work with. Its an OC job to use that talent to develop a game plan. You cant just creat magic because your job is OC. And Reed has run slants but he gets punished something fierce when he does. You typically dont use small guys to run slants over the middle especially when you dont have a TE that can create lanes for your small guys. Again you havent named me one OC that has accomplished what you expect out of Fairchild.

Really? You mean no other OC gets their skill players the ball? No other OC stops running plays that don't work? No other OC finds ways to maximize talent?


Reed is 5'10" 215. He's short for a receiver but built- thats the same size as most NFL RB's and you're going to tell me he's too small to take a hit? Give me a break.

[Mahdi]

Really? You mean no other OC gets their skill players the ball? No other OC stops running plays that don't work? No other OC finds ways to maximize talent?


Reed is 5'10" 215. He's short for a receiver but built- thats the same size as most NFL RB's and you're going to tell me he's too small to take a hit? Give me a break.
You keep saying the same thing,,,, all im asking for is for you to name me just 1 OC who has produced with the same amount of talent we have combined with the inconsistency at QB. Nothing more.

Yes Reed is built like a RB however Wrs have to pay attention to a ball and catch it first before worrying about the hit. RBs already have the ball and are looking for where the contact is coming from.

[OpIv37]

You keep saying the same thing,,,, all im asking for is for you to name me just 1 OC who has produced with the same amount of talent we have combined with the inconsistency at QB. Nothing more.

Yes Reed is built like a RB however Wrs have to pay attention to a ball and catch it first before worrying about the hit. RBs already have the ball and are looking for where the contact is coming from.

I don't have the information that you want because I don't follow any teams as closely as I follow the Bills and I can't even tell you which ones are comparable to us in terms of talent.

But to start, Vince Young throws for like 80 yards a game but Tennessee still managed 8 wins. They use his athleticism as well as his QB skills.

Your excuse for Reed could be applied to any NFL receiver. It's no different for anyone else but that doesn't stop them from running slants.

And you still haven't given me an answer about continuing the same conservative style and same plays that aren't working, and you won't because there's simply no justification for it. There are plays where the players don't execute and there are plays that are awful play calls for the situation- and we've had more than our fair share of both.

But hey, let's just keep making excuses for mediocrity and wondering why we never win anything.

[Mahdi]

I don't have the information that you want because I don't follow any teams as closely as I follow the Bills and I can't even tell you which ones are comparable to us in terms of talent.

But to start, Vince Young throws for like 80 yards a game but Tennessee still managed 8 wins. They use his athleticism as well as his QB skills.

Your excuse for Reed could be applied to any NFL receiver. It's no different for anyone else but that doesn't stop them from running slants.

And you still haven't given me an answer about continuing the same conservative style and same plays that aren't working, and you won't because there's simply no justification for it. There are plays where the players don't execute and there are plays that are awful play calls for the situation- and we've had more than our fair share of both.

But hey, let's just keep making excuses for mediocrity and wondering why we never win anything.
You speak as if you are in the huddle, know which routes are being called, and which blocking scheme is being used. You dont! all you see is the result of the play. We have a conservative offense because we have conservative players. Why is that so hard to understand? We lack the basics of any successful offense in the NFL. We have 2 Qbs with who are still not there yet and are still learning. Yer expectations are not realistic at all.

And the reason you dont know of any other offense who have been successful with comparable talent is because it doesnt exist and never has. Just in case you dont know.....

--- we have no TE

--- no true #2 WR, Reed is solid for a #3. In fact I think he would be great if we had a really good #2.

--- our running game averages less than 4 ypc.

--- we have no consistency at QB.

If im a DC against the Bills its a very easy offense to stop and thats whats been happening all year.

Roll the coverage to Evans side, play man on Reed because he's not a threat deep, keep everyone else near the LOS to stop the run and any swing passes to RBs. You can also pretty much let Royal run free because even if he does manage to catch it he wont get far.

[OpIv37]

You speak as if you are in the huddle, know which routes are being called, and which blocking scheme is being used. You dont! all you see is the result of the play. We have a conservative offense because we have conservative players. Why is that so hard to understand? We lack the basics of any successful offense in the NFL. We have 2 Qbs with who are still not there yet and are still learning. Yer expectations are not realistic at all.

And the reason you dont know of any other offense who have been successful with comparable talent is because it doesnt exist and never has. Just in case you dont know.....

--- we have no TE

--- no true #2 WR, Reed is solid for a #3. In fact I think he would be great if we had a really good #2.

--- our running game averages less than 4 ypc.

--- we have no consistency at QB.

If im a DC against the Bills its a very easy offense to stop and thats whats been happening all year.

Roll the coverage to Evans side, play man on Reed because he's not a threat deep, keep everyone else near the LOS to stop the run and any swing passes to RBs. You can also pretty much let Royal run free because even if he does manage to catch it he wont get far.


and the results of the plays are bad, yet we keep running the same plays. Why is it that Losman's speed was never used? Why is it that Fred Jackson and A Train were part of the passing game but Lynch, when healthy, was not? Why is it that all of our players are situational so the players on the field always tip our hand? That comes back to coaching- they're not teaching the players to, say, pass and block. We keep WR's and RB's for their blocking ability rather than teaching guys who can catch and run how to block. It's an asinine strategy that goes right back to the coaches.

[Mahdi]

and the results of the plays are bad, yet we keep running the same plays. Why is it that Losman's speed was never used? Why is it that Fred Jackson and A Train were part of the passing game but Lynch, when healthy, was not? Why is it that all of our players are situational so the players on the field always tip our hand? That comes back to coaching- they're not teaching the players to, say, pass and block. We keep WR's and RB's for their blocking ability rather than teaching guys who can catch and run how to block. It's an asinine strategy that goes right back to the coaches.
The answers to all your questions is simple. If you think about it a little you would see that.

Lynch doesnt get many receptions because teams are aware of his ability to catch so they keep everyone at the LOS to prevent it. Teams cant do that to LT because if you key in too much on the swing passes to LT, Gates will burn you. We dont have that option unless you expect Fairchild to unleash Royal down the middle of the field with is uncanny receiving ability. PERSONNEL is affecting every decision and every play call. Fairchild isnt ******ed, he obviously knows what the strengths of our players are. But you need more than what we have in order to use those strengths.

Reed is great underneath but we have no #2 to give him some freedom to roam the middle. Same with Parrish.

Lynch is a great receiver but we have no TE to keep defenses honest. Evans is a great deep threat but has no one on the other side to keep defenses from rolling their coverage over to him on almost every play.

Its that simple.

[YardRat]

We definitely miss Poz in the middle and it shows on the field.

Are you serious? You might want to re-visit how the defense played, especially against the run, while Poz was on the field as opposed to DiG being in there.

Poz wasn't ready to play MLB at this level, and it shows.