Vick gets sentenced to 23 months for dog fighting

[Mitchy moo]

Bye bye career, welcome to the jail house rock.

:lolpoint: Vick

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/columns/story?columnist=pasquarelli_len&id=3147850

[DraftBoy]

link?

[DraftBoy]

NVM its on ESPN front page

[Billz_fan]

It's live on ESPN 23 months minus his 1 month credit gets him out in Oct 2009. He then has 3 yrs probation.

[Mitchy moo]

link?

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/columns/story?columnist=pasquarelli_len&id=3147850

[Dr. Lecter]

His career is over. No NFL in 2007, 2008 or 2009. And, he might be suspended in 2010.

Good Riddance.

[mybills]

What was the max he could've gotten?

[DraftBoy]

5 years I believe

[bigbub2352]

Ignorant

[colin]

i don't like vick, and cruelty to animals is a sin, but is dog fighting really that big of a crime?

compared to hunting and farming there isn't enough difference to go after people for it. it's only cuz dogs are loved in our society.

[mybills]

hunting = quick death - humane
fighting = slow death - sick/cruel

there's the difference.

[TacklingDummy]

So he will be out before next season begins.

[DraftBoy]

hunting = quick death - humane
fighting = slow death - sick/cruel

there's the difference.

I dont know that Id equate hunting to being humane not that Im against it

[Dr. Lecter]

So he will be out before next season begins.

Huh?

His sentence started in November 2007.

If he serves 85% of his sentence (From ESPN's Roger Cussack) his sentence will be at least another 18 months. So the earliest he gets out is around June 2009.

[mybills]

I dont know that Id equate hunting to being humane not that Im against it
I'm against it, but a hunter will usually put the bullet where it counts. It's quicker, the animal doesn't suffer like those dogs had to. :(

[BlackMetalNinja]

"Watch your cornhole buddy"
http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1050/567456292_257a85505e_m.jpg

[Dr. Lecter]

There is also the fact that hunters are gathering food.

And how the fighting dogs are trained - usually using smaller pets that are stolen (i.e. small dogs, cats, puppies, etc.)

There is no comparison between hunting and dog fighting.

[mybills]

One's legal, one's not.

[DraftBoy]

There is also the fact that hunters are gathering food.

And how the fighting dogs are trained - usually using smaller pets that are stolen (i.e. small dogs, cats, puppies, etc.)

There is no comparison between hunting and dog fighting.

Thats the traditional and historical context but you know as well as I do that its become more sporty now and way more of the animal is wasted if used at all in some cases for food. But you are right there really isnt a fair comparison between these two.

[Ebenezer]

:bigwave: Vick

for the last time:
overhyped
overpaid

and now, just over.

[TacklingDummy]

Huh?

His sentence started in November 2007.

If he serves 85% of his sentence (From ESPN's Roger Cussack) his sentence will be at least another 18 months. So the earliest he gets out is around June 2009.

So what you are saying basically is that Vick will miss this season and next season?

[BlackMetalNinja]

Thats the traditional and historical context but you know as well as I do that its become more sporty now and way more of the animal is wasted if used at all in some cases for food. But you are right there really isnt a fair comparison between these two.

While this is completely off topic from the original post... you sure must know some different hunters than I do. Anybody I know that hunts is keeping the meat and either eating it themselves or giving it to others who don't hunt to eat.

What you're talking about is more along the lines of poaching... and that's illegal too.

[colin]

the dog's are his property, and he can fight them if he wants according to the constitution.

the cruelty is barbaric, but so is the ufc and i watch that regularly.

killing the animals after might have put him over the top, but dog fighting itself shouldn't be a crime.

[Ebenezer]

the dog's are his property, and he can fight them if he wants according to the constitution.

the cruelty is barbaric, but so is the ufc and i watch that regularly.

killing the animals after might have put him over the top, but dog fighting itself shouldn't be a crime.
but it is.....

[M]

the cruelty is barbaric, but so is the ufc ...

the guys in the ufc are there by choice.

[colin]

the guys in the ufc are there by choice.

dogs are property, they fight by the owners' choice

[Ed]

dogs are property, they fight by the owners' choice
Kind of like slavery. Good point...moron.

[colin]

Kind of like slavery. Good point...moron.

1. you are a little girl because you can't deal with a different view point than your own without name calling.

2. animals are property. not at all like slavery. slavery is when humans are property, and it is clearly wrong all over the world. animals are property, we eat them, we keep them as pets, we use them in useful jobs, and we wear products made of their skin.

if you can make some kind of case why animals cannot be put into fights against each other by their owner, but can be killed and eaten then please do.

[SabreEleven]

Huh?

His sentence started in November 2007.

If he serves 85% of his sentence (From ESPN's Roger Cussack) his sentence will be at least another 18 months. So the earliest he gets out is around June 2009.

So I shouldn't start him this weekend on my fantasy team?

[Ebenezer]

Ed and colin, please stop the name calling. Thanks.

[PECKERWOOD]

Man, I hate dog fighting but 23 months is a bit harsh, imo. I've seen WAAAAAAY worst crimes against humanity get let off easier than this and that includes child molestation and other forms of rape, assault and battery.

[Ebenezer]

Man, I hate dog fighting but 23 months is a bit harsh, imo. I've seen WAAAAAAY worst crimes against humanity get let off easier than this and that includes child molestation and other forms of rape, assault and battery.
that only means the penalties for those crimes are not severe enough...

[PECKERWOOD]

that only means the penalties for those crimes are not severe enough...

Yes, especially in the SP state of Vermont.

[Drev8]

1. you are a little girl because you can't deal with a different view point than your own without name calling.

2. animals are property. not at all like slavery. slavery is when humans are property, and it is clearly wrong all over the world. animals are property, we eat them, we keep them as pets, we use them in useful jobs, and we wear products made of their skin.

if you can make some kind of case why animals cannot be put into fights against each other by their owner, but can be killed and eaten then please do.

Colin - the question here is one of "rights" and "protections" as entrenched by law and general moral agreement. Although a dog is considered property, it also posseses the right and legal protection not to be treated with cruelty. This right trumps any right that the owner might have to do with his property as he pleases. In other words, a guy can rip the arms of his GI Joe's because they're toys without rights (either legal or moral), but this is not the case with an animal he owns. Dogs, as I'm sure you're aware, are sentient in that they feel pain and pleasure. Thus dogfighting is an unacceptable crime.

As for your comparison to hunting, strong animal rights advocates would suggest that hunting is as wrong as dog fighting. But in the United States hunting with a licence is permitted under certain circumstances. Thus the first difference with dogfighting is that one is legal, the other is not. There is also arguably a moral distinction that can be made between dogfighting and hunting. First, as pointed out above, hunting an animal is not a cruel way to take its life, and the suffering of the animal is much less. Not to mention the way that Vick has killing some of the dogs (electrocution, hanging, etc.) Second, hunting is only legal when done for the purpose of eating the meat, which serves the purpose of human survival. Dogfighting on the other hand, serves only to entertain the dogowners and gamblers, at the expense of great cruelty to the animals.

The bottom line is even if you maintain that hunting is just as bad, there is neither a legal nor moral excuse or justification for dogfighting. It's wrong on both accounts according to the norms of our society.

[Dr. Lecter]

So what you are saying basically is that Vick will miss this season and next season?

Yep.

At least. He still has state charges and Gooddell to deal with.

[Michael82]

Excellent news! That piece of **** got exactly what he deserved. I also think that he will still get suspended for the rest of the 2009 season when he does come out of jail. So, now we are looking at 2010 as the his first season back. He'll be over 30 then and out of the NFL for 3 years. He will never be the same and probably won't make much again either.

[BADTHINGSMAN]

Thats the traditional and historical context but you know as well as I do that its become more sporty now and way more of the animal is wasted if used at all in some cases for food. But you are right there really isnt a fair comparison between these two.

There are 2 different kinds of hunters, food hunters and trophy hunters.. I know a ton of hunters and they all hunt for the food.. I hunt for the food as well.. The crew I hunt with, we donate alot of the meat to families that dont get alot of food.. The deer hyde is taken to a professional who turn them into gloves which are also donated..

To keep on topic Vick will probably end up on a team again if he keeps in shape.. There is always a handful of teams that will take a chance..

[colin]

Colin - the question here is one of "rights" and "protections" as entrenched by law and general moral agreement. Although a dog is considered property, it also posseses the right and legal protection not to be treated with cruelty. This right trumps any right that the owner might have to do with his property as he pleases. In other words, a guy can rip the arms of his GI Joe's because they're toys without rights (either legal or moral), but this is not the case with an animal he owns. Dogs, as I'm sure you're aware, are sentient in that they feel pain and pleasure. Thus dogfighting is an unacceptable crime.

As for your comparison to hunting, strong animal rights advocates would suggest that hunting is as wrong as dog fighting. But in the United States hunting with a licence is permitted under certain circumstances. Thus the first difference with dogfighting is that one is legal, the other is not. There is also arguably a moral distinction that can be made between dogfighting and hunting. First, as pointed out above, hunting an animal is not a cruel way to take its life, and the suffering of the animal is much less. Not to mention the way that Vick has killing some of the dogs (electrocution, hanging, etc.) Second, hunting is only legal when done for the purpose of eating the meat, which serves the purpose of human survival. Dogfighting on the other hand, serves only to entertain the dogowners and gamblers, at the expense of great cruelty to the animals.

The bottom line is even if you maintain that hunting is just as bad, there is neither a legal nor moral excuse or justification for dogfighting. It's wrong on both accounts according to the norms of our society.

there is not question being asked about what the law says, obviously dog fighting is illegal.

my point is that it shouldn't be. animals that get slaughtered for food are treated in a way very very far from humane.

hunting is also done for the entertainment of the hunters (it is a sport afterall).

there is no question that how vick killed the dogs was cruel and twisted, but it is simply foolish selectivity to say that chickens and pigs are ok to treat horribly but dogs are not.

as far as the norms of society go, the law and a very vocal set of people are dead against prostitution, drug use, and gambling, but the reality is these activities are very very popular with americans from all walks of life and have been from day one.

so while most peole (myself included) find dog fighting offputting, that isn't enough to make it (or hunting, or meat eating) a crime. the law should not (although obviously it does) legislate morality.

[G. Host]

Federal charges have not been filed yet. If federal government decides to file and not run sentence concurrently then he may be in jail for a longer time.

Oh and the crime was more than just dog fighting and the one the league considers worst, illegal gambling, supposedly had a ban for life.