Stuff About Cleveland That Scares Me

[patmoran2006]

First let me say this week is such an unexpected yet pleasant surprise. My buddy FunTimes on here is a big Cleveland fan, and for the past few years we've been going back and forth about what team is worse. I don't think either of us expected this, but what do ya know. It's week 15 and the Bills and Browns are playing in a game with HUGE playoff implications. While I'm obviously pulling like crazy for Buffalo to win this game, if the Browns should win I hope they make the playoffs and pull a few miracles. Im a fan of that team too, in ways they're a lot like us.

Anyway. As anxious as I am about this game; there are some things/matchups about facing the Browns that scare the living **** out of me. Since this is Cleveland week and he's our "Browns guy" I think FunTimesYaY should contribute a few things about the Browns as well.

* I can't believe I'm saying this, but I fear George Wilson is going to be missed big time. He's more athletic than Jim Leonhard and although he may not be a "steady" in coverage; he has a knack for making a big play (2 defensive TDs) and he's a much more physical hitter. It's not even exclusively that Leonard is forced to start; it's that it changes the nickel package. I would ASSUME that this puts Ashton Youboty onto the field as the 5th DB. The only other option seems to be Scott. SCott seems to pass rush good, but I fear his coverage abilities against these great Browns WRs.

* Specifically, I fear the hell out Kellen Winslow. The guy is finally emerging as one of the elite TEs in football. Who's going to cover him? I would think Whitner.

* We all know what Braylon Edwards can do, but Joe J is a hell of a 2nd WR and I see him getting a lot of balls on third down. This is a very tough matchup for our secondary.

* That OL is the strength of the team, and many are saying Joe Thomas is the best rookie OT to come in the league in well over a decade. Somehow, someway Aaron Schobel HAS to play like the franchise DE we paid him to be and make some big plays over him.

* Defensively, we gotta contain that beast Wimbley.

* Lastly, the way our kick coverage has been lately, I'm petrified of Joshua Cribbs. I wouldn't do much kicking to him that's for sure.

In NO WAY am I saying we can't or won't be Cleveland. I'm just saying this is going to be a very tough and exciting game. I hope our young guys do a lot of growing up this game.

I think personally the key to beating Cleveland is the running game. I know the Edwards fanatics and fans of huge plays don't want to hear that; but we can't go drive for drive with the Browns offensively. We need to control the ball with Lynch/Jackson (who I think the Browns will have a tough time stopping) take advantage as they line up more guys in the box by looking for Evans/Reed, and create at least 2 turnovers defensively.

Yards mean nothing this game. The Browns WILL move the ball. We really need that "bend but dont break" defense to do exactly that. I think we can win a 24-20 type of game. I don't think we can win a 38-35 type of game against this team.

[YardRat]

Jurevicious is a bigger threat to me than Edwards or Winslow, and Cribbs scares the **** out of me also.

The weather is going to be key, and I see a lot more FG's than TD's being scored.

[Mitchy moo]

The Browns will see the ball a handful of times & the Bills will punt 2 times, plan on the Bills rolling them.

[The Answer]

The Browns will see the ball a handful of times & the Bills will punt 2 times, plan on the Bills rolling them.

We held this team to 26 total yards in 2004 in a 37-7 route and have won 3 straight against them.

~The Answer

[Mitchy moo]

We held this team to 26 total yards in 2004 in a 37-7 route and have won 3 straight against them.

~The Answer

Nothings changed except their schedule, which improved drastically on the easy side.

[The last buffalo fan]

Quote:
<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=3 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD class=alt2 style="BORDER-RIGHT: 1px inset; BORDER-TOP: 1px inset; BORDER-LEFT: 1px inset; BORDER-BOTTOM: 1px inset">Originally Posted by The Answer
We held this team to 26 total yards in 2004 in a 37-7 route and have won 3 straight against them.

~The Answer
</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>


Nothings changed except their schedule, which improved drastically on the easy side.

Oh no mis amigos, this year the brownies aren't the same 2004 team that we kicked and dragged ass before. They might be the same D or even a worst D, but they are a hell of an O and more. There is no way that we can keep this brown team on 7 points only. I want to beat them and I'm sure that we can do it, but let's face it, they are going to make some REAL damage on us. But WTF!!!??? :gobills:

[Mitchy moo]

Quote:
<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=3 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD class=alt2 style="BORDER-RIGHT: 1px inset; BORDER-TOP: 1px inset; BORDER-LEFT: 1px inset; BORDER-BOTTOM: 1px inset">Originally Posted by The Answer
We held this team to 26 total yards in 2004 in a 37-7 route and have won 3 straight against them.

~The Answer


</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>



Oh no mis amigos, this year the brownies aren't the same 2004 team that we kicked and dragged ass before. They might be the same D or even a worst D, but they are a hell of an O and more. There is no way that we can keep this brown team on 7 points only. I want to beat them and I'm sure that we can do it, but let's face it, they are going to make some REAL damage on us. But WTF!!!??? :gobills:

They are terrible on D & we just torched a better defense than them.

[The Answer]

Quote:
<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=3 width="100%" border=0><TBODY><TR><TD class=alt2 style="BORDER-RIGHT: 1px inset; BORDER-TOP: 1px inset; BORDER-LEFT: 1px inset; BORDER-BOTTOM: 1px inset">Originally Posted by The Answer
We held this team to 26 total yards in 2004 in a 37-7 route and have won 3 straight against them.

~The Answer

</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>



Oh no mis amigos, this year the brownies aren't the same 2004 team that we kicked and dragged ass before. They might be the same D or even a worst D, but they are a hell of an O and more. There is no way that we can keep this brown team on 7 points only. I want to beat them and I'm sure that we can do it, but let's face it, they are going to make some REAL damage on us. But WTF!!!??? :gobills:

We are going to be able to T off and blitz like crazy in the 2nd half when we are up by 14 points or more - so expect Anderson to turn the ball over a lot.

~The Answer

[BillsOverDolphins]

We held this team to 26 total yards in 2004 in a 37-7 route and have won 3 straight against them.

~The Answer
that stat means jack **** right now

[BillsOverDolphins]

Nothings changed except their schedule
and their QB, WR's, TE, RB, and Offensive line...yeah, besides all that they're pretty much the same


sigh...

[OpIv37]

Nothings changed except their schedule, which improved drastically on the easy side.

yeah, they didn't get a QB who could actually play, a pair of big receivers, , the best OL in the last draft, a star TE who finally got healthy, or a decent coach. They're EXACTLY the same as the teams we beat :rolleyes:

Come on, Skoob. Every time you talk like this, we lose. Cleveland has some flaws but they're a solid team and they've improved significantly since we beat them last. Both teams are completely different so what happened before is not a good basis for comparison.

[Mr. Pink]

Look who's heading the brigade saying the Browns suck. Skoob and the answer. That should tell you enough right there about the validity of their statements.

[Johnny Bugmenot]

This is going to be an offensive battle, no question about it.

The defense is going to have to come up strong, especially in the red zone. The last thing we need is to force Trent Edwards into desperation football. He plays his best when he can take his time and be meticulous. He can't do that down by 14.

[Mitchy moo]

Look who's heading the brigade saying the Browns suck. Skoob and the answer. That should tell you enough right there about the validity of their statements.

We led the brigade about Trent as well, SBZfan as too. Many of you tore us a new one & called it heresy, now you call it genius.

We'll take credit @ 4:00 pm This sunday again, Browns get rolled.

P.S. I'm cashing my + 6 wins ticket early next year. Many of you called me crazy then.

[Mr. Pink]

We led the brigade about Trent as well, SBZfan as well. Many of you tore us a new one & called it heresy, now you call it genius.

We'll take credit @ 4:00 pm This sunday again, Browns get rolled.

P.S. I'm cashing my + 6 wins ticket as well early next year. Many of you called me crazy then as well.

At least bring up valid points to back your argument then.

Why will Buffalo roll Cleveland? I want to know your extensive knowledge of why Buffalo will route Cleveland. Are we talking a 28-10 type game? Are we talking 42-20? How will Buffalo either A. hold Cleveland to a low score or B. score 42? Why will DA turn the ball over a bunch? He has 14 INTs in 12 games. How are the short corners going to cover 6'3" Edwards and 6'5" JJ? Who's going to contain KII? Chris Cooley ate this defense alive, Cooley couldn't carry KII's jock.

The sad part is I like Bills football, but outlandish and downright wrong points come across as stupid. Such as saying the Browns are the same team in 04 as now minus schedule.

Even though, there's a new coach, new coordinators, new QB, new RB, new WRs, new TE, entirely different o-line...different defensive scheme on top of the fact Orpheus Roye and Andra Davis are the only same starters on D. But the Kicker is the same!

[Mitchy moo]

At least bring up valid points to back your argument then.

Why will Buffalo roll Cleveland? I want to know your extensive knowledge of why Buffalo will route Cleveland. Are we talking a 28-10 type game? Are we talking 42-20? How will Buffalo either A. hold Cleveland to a low score or B. score 42?


Fair, I'll breakdown how I think the game will fly and why I am calling a Bills win.

Time of possession in this game is going to be the key for the Bills. Keeping a great Browns offense off the field stiffles their ability to score. During a few of your losses (pittsburgh) as example, your TOP was a total of 21:43 / 23:44 minutes for each of the games. The final rushing yards for both of those games averaged out to ~43 yards total. Your inability to rush basically forced your hand to go into a pass only offense, which if successful obviously can get you points but if neutralized (as it was against Pittsburgh) gets your D on the field faster. The Bills will attempt to stop the run and play their usual zone against the pass, standing ready for either. I am not claiming we are Pittsburgh but as of late we have done a great job against the rush. Miami got 65 yards rushing on us, the skins got 80 yards (on 30 attempts), so all in all a focused effort.

Trent also now has 2 different people in which to give the rock too with 2 different styles. When Defenses see one guy they can't tackle and another guy they can't catch running the ball, they have to take 2 different paths to get to them. Cleveland's D is not capable of handling our huge O-line and will get little pressure on Edwards, so plan on him having all day. If Cleveland loads the box, then Trent will have the time to look for mid-range passes, if they play zone he can go for longer passes and if Clev. plays back we will average 8 YPC. It's a no win situation for Clev. and will allow us to get ahead early.

Clev. will abandon the run after the first quarter & be down by 10. They will switch to the pass which will allow Buffalo to pressure DA to make decisions quicker than normal, knowing that if DA is given too much time there will be issues. DA will throw a few in waiting Bills players arms and fumble at least once trying to be a hero. That allows Buffalo's drill and fill Offense to come back on the field and gove Clev.'s D less time to rest. The Bills will end up with ~39 Minutes of possession, more than enough to roll up a big win.

[LABillsFan]

Fair, I'll breakdown how I think the game will fly and why I am calling a Bills win.

Time of possession in this game is going to be the key for the Bills. Keeping a great Browns offense off the field stiffles their ability to score. During a few of your losses (pittsburgh) as example, your TOP was a total of 21:43 / 23:44 minutes for each of the games. The final rushing yards for both of those games averaged out to ~43 yards total. Your inability to rush basically forced your hand to go into a pass only offense, which if successful obviously can get you points but if neutralized (as it was against Pittsburgh) gets your D on the field faster. The Bills will attempt to stop the run and play their usual zone against the pass, standing ready for either. I am not claiming we are Pittsburgh but as of late we have done a great job against the rush. Miami got 65 yards rushing on us, the skins got 80 yards (on 30 attempts), so all in all a focused effort.

Trent also now has 2 different people in which to give the rock too with 2 different styles. When Defenses see one guy they can't tackle and another guy they can't catch running the ball, they have to take 2 different paths to get to them. Cleveland's D is not capable of handling our huge O-line and will get little pressure on Edwards, so plan on him having all day. If Cleveland loads the box, then Trent will have the time to look for mid-range passes, if they play zone he can go for longer passes and if Clev. plays back we will average 8 YPC. It's a no win situation for Clev. and will allow us to get ahead early.

Clev. will abandon the run after the first quarter & be down by 10. They will switch to the pass which will allow Buffalo to pressure DA to make decisions quicker than normal, knowing that if DA is given too much time there will be issues. DA will throw a few in waiting Bills players arms and fumble at least once trying to be a hero. That allows Buffalo drill and fill Offense to come back on the field and Clev. D less time to rest. The Bills will end up with ~39 Minutes of possession, more than enough to roll up a big win.

:popcorn:

[Crisis]

true, whenever skooby reaches for stuff all week about how the bills will win we always end up losing.

[Mr. Pink]

Skoobs, I'll give you some credit for actually using an intelligent and thought out manner for why you think the way you do. Even if I think you're wrong.

Cleveland on the year has played to the level of it's competition. Be it against a good team or a bad team. No 1 team has dominated the Browns all season with DA starting. Charlie Frye butchered the first week of the year.

While they won't be beat big, they won't win big either.

Buffalo may be able to move the ball all game long, this is true, but so will Cleveland. You think you'll force DA into numerous INTs? Buffalo doesn't have physical big corners. There's no way Edwards nor JJ get jammed at the line. Then you cite this blitzing scheme that will get to DA. We don't apply that great of pressure on bad offensive lines, Cleveland's allowed 16 sacks all year. 5 of which were Charlie Frye vs Pittsburgh in week 1. They're tied for second least in the league behind...New England. And that's not even touching on what KII will likely do, based on what other star tight ends have done so far this year.

Like I've said before the matchups don't favor Buffalo much, except in their running game. Cleveland allows anyone to rush well against them, except Seattle. Lynch will get his hundred yards, no doubt about it.

Just because teams march down the field against Cleveland doesn't mean TDs all the time. Look at last week vs the Jets. 1 offensive TD 4 FGs one interception in the endzone. Cleveland has intercepted a pass in the past 8 games.

We've seen what happens when Buffalo gets a big lead on someone, they ease off the gas. Cleveland's offense is not a team you want to ease off against if you have them on the ropes. Let them hang around and they'll be back in the game. BTW Cleveland is also good at letting team's hang around.

39 minutes is a little far fetched for how much TOP you think the Bills will get. I believe they only average about 30 seconds more per game than Cleveland on the year.

Your best example of what the Bills are going to do is what they did vs Miami or what Pittsburgh did to Cleveland. I assure you Cleveland is not like Miami nor is Pittsburgh like Buffalo. DA isn't gonna throw a ball 3 feet over his head for someone to catch and run in. Samkon Gado proved how weak the secondary is in tackling and Lewis is a bigger back with more talent. A 5'9" corner covering either a 6'3" or 6'5" WR is a huge disadvantage especially when Chudzinski's system is based around throwing the ball high to receivers. Which is the right approach when you have tall guys at WR.

Expect numbers likes this....
Lewis 22 carries 90 yards 1 TD
JJ 5 catches for 60
Edwards 7 catches for 85
KII 12 catches for 140
DA 20 of 38 for 315 3 TDs 1 INT

Cleveland will keep pounding Jamal even if you're stopping him. As the game goes and Jamal's carries get higher, the higher his YPC gets. After 20 carries Jamal averages 5.0 ypc. Their offense is set up for playaction and keeping defenses honest. DA will throw a bunch of intermediate passes to lull you to sleep then bam, long ball to Braylon.

And a score of around 34-27 Cleveland.

Can the Bills win? yes. They need DA to make more unforced errors than normal. Most of DAs picks are DA having mental lapses. The backs pick up the blitzes well and DA gets the ball out in a hurry. They need to limit Jamal to about 15 carries so he doesn't get going. And they need Braylon to have the dropsies. This is likely a game that won't be decided til the middle of the 4th quarter if not later.

[LABillsFan]

:popcorn:

[camelcowboy]

The bills need to make this a ugly game if they want to win it. Control the clock capitalize on the redzone chances. Long drives that end with TD's not field goals. The defense needs to produce pressure cause a couple turn overs and most importantly tackle. If this team wifs on tackles against bigger players like edwards, lewis and Anderson then we are in big trouble. Both teams are so simular its almost scary Cleveland is a team i have wanted to watch all year. I have a lot of respect for them and if they beat us i'll root for them in the playoffs, but this game is winable for the bills its going to be a real good game and sunday can't come soon enought.

[Mitchy moo]

Skoobs, I'll give you some credit for actually using an intelligent and thought out manner for why you think the way you do. Even if I think you're wrong.

Cleveland on the year has played to the level of it's competition. Be it against a good team or a bad team. No 1 team has dominated the Browns all season with DA starting. Charlie Frye butchered the first week of the year.

While they won't be beat big, they won't win big either.

Buffalo may be able to move the ball all game long, this is true, but so will Cleveland. You think you'll force DA into numerous INTs? Buffalo doesn't have physical big corners. There's no way Edwards nor JJ get jammed at the line. Then you cite this blitzing scheme that will get to DA. We don't apply that great of pressure on bad offensive lines, Cleveland's allowed 16 sacks all year. 5 of which were Charlie Frye vs Pittsburgh in week 1. They're tied for second least in the league behind...New England. And that's not even touching on what KII will likely do, based on what other star tight ends have done so far this year.

Like I've said before the matchups don't favor Buffalo much, except in their running game. Cleveland allows anyone to rush well against them, except Seattle. Lynch will get his hundred yards, no doubt about it.

Just because teams march down the field against Cleveland doesn't mean TDs all the time. Look at last week vs the Jets. 1 offensive TD 4 FGs one interception in the endzone. Cleveland has intercepted a pass in the past 8 games.

We've seen what happens when Buffalo gets a big lead on someone, they ease off the gas. Cleveland's offense is not a team you want to ease off against if you have them on the ropes. Let them hang around and they'll be back in the game. BTW Cleveland is also good at letting team's hang around.

39 minutes is a little far fetched for how much TOP you think the Bills will get. I believe they only average about 30 seconds more per game than Cleveland on the year.

Your best example of what the Bills are going to do is what they did vs Miami or what Pittsburgh did to Cleveland. I assure you Cleveland is not like Miami nor is Pittsburgh like Buffalo. DA isn't gonna throw a ball 3 feet over his head for someone to catch and run in. Samkon Gado proved how weak the secondary is in tackling and Lewis is a bigger back with more talent. A 5'9" corner covering either a 6'3" or 6'5" WR is a huge disadvantage especially when Chudzinski's system is based around throwing the ball high to receivers. Which is the right approach when you have tall guys at WR.

Expect numbers likes this....
Lewis 22 carries 90 yards 1 TD
JJ 5 catches for 60
Edwards 7 catches for 85
KII 12 catches for 140
DA 20 of 38 for 315 3 TDs 1 INT

Cleveland will keep pounding Jamal even if you're stopping him. As the game goes and Jamal's carries get higher, the higher his YPC gets. After 20 carries Jamal averages 5.0 ypc. Their offense is set up for playaction and keeping defenses honest. DA will throw a bunch of intermediate passes to lull you to sleep then bam, long ball to Braylon.

And a score of around 34-27 Cleveland.

Can the Bills win? yes. They need DA to make more unforced errors than normal. Most of DAs picks are DA having mental lapses. The backs pick up the blitzes well and DA gets the ball out in a hurry. They need to limit Jamal to about 15 carries so he doesn't get going. And they need Braylon to have the dropsies. This is likely a game that won't be decided til the middle of the 4th quarter if not later.

You have been playing teams that play at a Jets type level for most of the year and padding your O-stats. Give us the raiders, arizona, rams and houston, the Ravens / Cinci twice and see how our stats look with Edwards in there and 2 solid backs. I think our record would look drastically different at that point. We get to play the NFC west next year like you did this year and the rest of the AFC East is a mess (besides NE), so the Bills are staring at ~8 wins just to start next season. Sprinkle in a few other turd teams and some solid teams and we are looking at 11 + wins already.

My whole point is you have beaten little and can't pull away score wise from even the worst teams. I consider the Browns a touch better than Miami with a better offense. The Bills have literally just started improving and Trent's statement about learning more while he sat for 3 games and watch JP lose seems to be true. Trent realized he doesn't want to lose and he is 5-1 as a starter, 2-0 in away games. Your favored at home and the pressure will be on the home team. When you get way behind, plan on the fans letting you know how they feel.

[Mitchy moo]

You have been playing teams that play at a Jets type level for most of the year and padding your O-stats. Give us the raiders, arizona, rams and houston, the Ravens / Cinci twice and see how our stats look with Edwards in there and 2 solid backs. I think our record would look drastically different at that point. We get to play the NFC west next year like you did this year and the rest of the AFC East is a mess (besides NE), so the Bills are staring at ~8 wins just to start next season. Sprinkle in a few other turd teams and some solid teams and we are looking at 11 + wins already.

My whole point is you have beaten little and can't pull away score wise from even the worst teams. I consider the Browns a touch better than Miami with a better offense. The Bills have literally just started improving and Trent's statement about learning more while he sat for 3 games and watch JP lose seems to be true. Trent realized he doesn't want to lose and he is 5-1 as a starter, 2-0 in away games. Your favored at home and the pressure will be on the home team. When you get way behind, plan on the fans letting you know how they feel.

This should be close to our schedule next season:

HOME

Patriots
Jets
Dolphins
Browns
Chargers
Raiders
Seahawks
49ers

ROAD

Patriots
Jets
Dolphins
Jaguars
Broncos
Chiefs
Rams
Cardinals

Can you see any good shots at some wins next year?? I see at least 11 on there.

[jamze132]

Its definetly going to be an interesting and physical game. I just hope that the Browns lay an egg at home, much like we have a habit of doing when a big game is on the line.

[shelby]

i want to know who FTY is rooting for this week.
:club:

:gobills:

[Ebenezer]

Stuff About Cleveland That Scares Me


ever been there?? it's all scary

[LifetimeBillsFan]

Good post, Pat.

I agree with pretty much everything that you said and would add J.Lewis to that list of things about Cleveland that scares me. Like camelcowboy pointed out, the Bills had better tackle well in this game: if Lewis gets on a roll early, he's the kind of RB who can stay on a roll and control the game for the Browns, making their other offensive weapons even more dangerous.

Youboty is going to have to really step up in this game. Against K.WinslowII, the Bills cannot afford to use Whitner as their nickle CB or leave Leonard in coverage on him. Whitner will have to stay at SS and cover K.WinslowII. That means that Youboty is going to have to play and, as the Bills biggest CB, he is going to have to show that he can hold his own against one of the Browns' big receivers. It may be a "baptism by fire", but, considering where he was drafted and the potential that has been there, it is time for Youboty to make this step and show that he is ready to contribute something to the team (and, if you will, justify the confidence that the team showed in him by drafting him where they did). I think that how Youboty plays will be a big key for the Bills on defense.

In the days before the shot-clock in basketball there was an adage in some basketball coaching circles that went as follows: "They can't score if they don't have the ball."

I agree with Pat and those who have said that that will have to be the approach that the Bills take to this game. They are going to have to run the ball well and T.Edwards is going to have to keep the chains moving and keep the Cleveland offense on the sidelines--where they won't be able to put points up on the board--for as long as possible. T.Edwards is going to have to be sharp--he can't afford to have a bad day if the Bills are going to have a chance to win this one. Even though it was only against the Dolphins, hopefully, he will be able to build on his performance last week against Miami. If he can, the Bills will have a shot to win the game because it will open up things for their running game and neutralize the potent Cleveland offense.

The weather could be a huge factor in this game. It is likely to be cold, but that won't really hurt either team that much. Neither will snow. But, if it is windy, it could help the Bills. Nothing impacts the passing game, especially the deep passing game, like wind. IMHO Cleveland's offense will be hurt more than Buffalo's offense if wind takes away the deep passing game or restricts it for half of the game.

With everything that is at stake, I expect this to be a tough, close game--I think the Bills will try to make it as "ugly" a game as possible. It is always, always, tough to win on the road in the NFL (there's a reason why Vegas betting lines consider the home field advantage to be worth 3+ points in the "high priced spread"). IMHO the Bills will have to play the best game that any of these young Bills players have ever played (the best a Bills team has played since they beat the Pats 31-0 a few years ago) to win this game. But, the thing is that this team is so young, so inexperienced, and has shown such heart and improvement that they have a chance to do exactly that.

If the Bills can pull this off and come away with a win against Cleveland, IMHO they will deserve all the credit in the world even if they don't make it to the playoffs. They have overcome so much adversity and worked so hard just to get this opportunity that I really think that they will be ready to play on Sunday. The question is whether, with all their youth, inexperience and all the losses that they have suffered this season, they will know how to take advantage of this opportunity that they have created for themselves. That, as much as anything, is going to make this a very interesting game for me.

[jmb1099]

If Buffalo's running game last week wasn't a fluke than we win by three. Both teams will look to run the ball because both D's are suspect against the run. That being said, and I know I'm a bit biased, Buffalo has the better backs and maybe the better oline. Lynch for two td's, edwards tosses another one, lindell hits a long field goal and Buffalo wins in the closing seconds.

[LifetimeBillsFan]

....Lynch for two td's, edwards tosses another one, lindell hits a long field goal and Buffalo wins in the closing seconds.

You must have read Jauron's script for the game.

I don't think he'd want it to turn out any other way!

[TigerJ]

I don't follow the Browns that closely, so I'll take your word for it Pat. I agree that this weekend the running game is going to be crucial, esspecially in view of the weather. Depending on how bad the weather is, in might be smart for the Bills to back off the somewhat more open passing game they had Edwards use versus Miami, and have him used more of a controlled underneath passing game instead. Edwards does a pretty good job with that.

[Jan Reimers]

I think our D is every bit as suspect as the Browns, but their Offense is much more advanced than ours.

To me, a Bills win would be a fairly large upset.

[HHURRICANE]

For those who think the Bills are just going to line up and pound the ball with Lynch and Jackson (maybe Jauron included) are going to be in for a huge disppointment.

The Browns are better on D than you are thinking and the offense is absolutely going to score on us.

If the Bills don't come in with a creative gameplan on both sides of the ball than it's going to be a major league disppointment.

[colin]

right now look at what the teams are doing, forget the stats.

number one the bills have a qb that gives them enough confidence to not quit. hang dog beat in the first quarter jp is gone, so the bills will play for 60 minutes and not suck the bag early.

anyhow, the bills have been running and run blocking very well. we've been protecting the football, protecting the passer, rushing the passer, and stopping the run very well.

clevland is a great passing team, but so is cinci. we stomped cincy and will have our plays against the browns. right now in the cold we are running and punching people in the face and stopping the run on the other side.

that along w steady qb play (DA makes many more mistakes than TE) is what will win for us on the road.

[DraftBoy]

I could see this game getting ugly if that Cleveland offense gets rolling, their D may be bad, but their O blows ours out of the water.

[Brown to the Bone]

We are going to be able to T off and blitz like crazy in the 2nd half when we are up by 14 points or more - so expect Anderson to turn the ball over a lot.

~The Answer


Guy you do realize that when teams have blitzed the Browns they have paid dearly. I as a Browns fan hope like hell that the Bills do exactly what your saying and the Browns will rip them a new one for sure. Do you actually follow football, because this sort of post doesn't lead me to believe you do. You had better take a look at what has caused the Browns to have problems before throwing out the very thing that will get the Bills beat.

Posted this on this board in another thread Pitt Blitzed like crazy in the 1st half of the last game we played against them, and believe me they are one of the best at it, and the Browns took them apart. It was only after they stopped blitzing and dropped everyone into coverage that they began to have success handling the Browns offense. You should read the 1st thread in this post. The strength of the Browns offense is the O Line, blitz if you like but God knows as do I the Bills will pay dearly if they do.

In fact if you like watch what happensd when the Bills try to blitz, which I am sure they will do, or at least try to do. No BS the Browns have one of the best if not the best O lines in all of the NFL, if not for a sub par defense they would be close if not actaully unbeatin this season thats how good the Browns O truly is. The only way that the Bills beat the Browns is "IF" they can keep up with the pace of scoring the Browns will do. Take a look at what the Browns have done to nearly every single team they have faced this year including the Ravens and the Steelers, whom I might mention have the number 1 and number 2 defenses in the NFL and you tell me how your going to do better with your defense then those 2 teams did? This is Not fantasy football, get real, please...

Brown to the Bone

[trapezeus]

the only chance for the bills to win:

1. score early to lower the crowd's momentum
2. Long methodic drives
3. Win the turnover battle.

If we can't do these things, we won't stop the browns Offense. I don't know if the bills can bring it against the browns receivers and OL, however, if we can get some turnovers...it will negate the lack of pass rush and inability to run with receivers for 60 minutes. That's how we shut down dallas for the majority of the game.

[madness]

Stuff about Cleveland that scares me:

Their soft schedule creating so much hype that people think we can't beat them.

[Brown to the Bone]

Fair, I'll breakdown how I think the game will fly and why I am calling a Bills win.

Time of possession in this game is going to be the key for the Bills. Keeping a great Browns offense off the field stiffles their ability to score. During a few of your losses (pittsburgh) as example, your TOP was a total of 21:43 / 23:44 minutes for each of the games. The final rushing yards for both of those games averaged out to ~43 yards total. Your inability to rush basically forced your hand to go into a pass only offense, which if successful obviously can get you points but if neutralized (as it was against Pittsburgh) gets your D on the field faster. The Bills will attempt to stop the run and play their usual zone against the pass, standing ready for either. I am not claiming we are Pittsburgh but as of late we have done a great job against the rush. Miami got 65 yards rushing on us, the skins got 80 yards (on 30 attempts), so all in all a focused effort.

Trent also now has 2 different people in which to give the rock too with 2 different styles. When Defenses see one guy they can't tackle and another guy they can't catch running the ball, they have to take 2 different paths to get to them. Cleveland's D is not capable of handling our huge O-line and will get little pressure on Edwards, so plan on him having all day. If Cleveland loads the box, then Trent will have the time to look for mid-range passes, if they play zone he can go for longer passes and if Clev. plays back we will average 8 YPC. It's a no win situation for Clev. and will allow us to get ahead early.

Clev. will abandon the run after the first quarter & be down by 10. They will switch to the pass which will allow Buffalo to pressure DA to make decisions quicker than normal, knowing that if DA is given too much time there will be issues. DA will throw a few in waiting Bills players arms and fumble at least once trying to be a hero. That allows Buffalo's drill and fill Offense to come back on the field and gove Clev.'s D less time to rest. The Bills will end up with ~39 Minutes of possession, more than enough to roll up a big win.


TOP, means nothing trust me here.. The Browns offense is very very efficient when they have the ball. In fact watch for what I am about to tell you. When the Browns offense gets the 1st 1st down of a drive they almost always score. They are extremely effiecent in the red zone, and like it or not they have scored far more TD's then FG, and they have run the ball effectively against better defenses then your own, namely the Ravens and the Steelers just to name 2. By the way they have done so twice against the Ravens. If you are of the opion that we are a team that lives by the run you would be sadly mistaken. We run only to keep defenses somewhat honest and not for any other reason. Your problem is that your caught up in some fantasy football world honestly. The Browns will score points and trust me when I say this 17 points( the Bills best road scoring total of the season) won't do.

The Browns offense does start slowly, and there will be if they play as they have all season a chance for the Bills to perhaps get an early lead but if the Bills try to sit on a lead and lose their aggressiveness they will watch as the Browns go by them on the score board as the game unfolds.

The Browns have only scored less then 27 points in one home game this season. That was the opener against the Steelers. A game in which they were soundly beatin and 2 days later they traded the starter for that game Charlie Frye. Since taking over as the Browns starter DA has not lost at home #1 and #2 they haven't scored less then 27 points in ANY of those contests. That includes games against the Ravens #2 defense and Seattle top 10 defense. So how far off the mark are you with your post?? Quite a bit I would say based on all the known FACTS. The Bills had better bring their A game, and they had better open up their offense because the Browns are going to score points, the question is can the Bills keep pace???

[Johnny Bugmenot]

Stuff about Cleveland that scares me:

Their soft schedule creating so much hype that people think we can't beat them.

I think there's a bit of a case of "the pot calling the kettle black" here. The Bills haven't exactly put up their wins against teams like the Colts and Packers, here.

[Dude]

You have been playing teams that play at a Jets type level for most of the year and padding your O-stats. Give us the raiders, arizona, rams and houston, the Ravens / Cinci twice and see how our stats look with Edwards in there and 2 solid backs. I think our record would look drastically different at that point. We get to play the NFC west next year like you did this year and the rest of the AFC East is a mess (besides NE), so the Bills are staring at ~8 wins just to start next season. Sprinkle in a few other turd teams and some solid teams and we are looking at 11 + wins already.

My whole point is you have beaten little and can't pull away score wise from even the worst teams. I consider the Browns a touch better than Miami with a better offense. The Bills have literally just started improving and Trent's statement about learning more while he sat for 3 games and watch JP lose seems to be true. Trent realized he doesn't want to lose and he is 5-1 as a starter, 2-0 in away games. Your favored at home and the pressure will be on the home team. When you get way behind, plan on the fans letting you know how they feel.First, the Browns have only played the Bengals once. Second, if you think they are only a touch better than Miami, then you are high on something. Third, the Bills and Browns have pretty much beaten the same teams this year. But, the Browns beat Seattle, which already clinched their division.

With the exception of Arizona and Oakland, I'd say they've won the games they should win. They are a good team.

[madness]

I think there's a bit of a case of "the pot calling the kettle black" here. The Bills haven't exactly put up their wins against teams like the Colts and Packers, here.

Not really, everybody that plays the Bills considers it a very winnable game. Well their fans and our own, anyway.

[Mitchy moo]

Stuff about Cleveland that scares me:

Their soft schedule creating so much hype that people think we can't beat them.

Madness is the most sane here. Cinci has a way better D and just as good a offense and we are playing much better than we we're when we beat them.

Cleveland has the easiest schedule I have seen in a long time and will fall apart against us now, no chance for them.

[Mitchy moo]

TOP, means nothing trust me here.. The Browns offense is very very efficient when they have the ball. In fact watch for what I am about to tell you. When the Browns offense gets the 1st 1st down of a drive they almost always score. They are extremely effiecent in the red zone, and like it or not they have scored far more TD's then FG, and they have run the ball effectively against better defenses then your own, namely the Ravens and the Steelers just to name 2. By the way they have done so twice against the Ravens. If you are of the opion that we are a team that lives by the run you would be sadly mistaken. We run only to keep defenses somewhat honest and not for any other reason. Your problem is that your caught up in some fantasy football world honestly. The Browns will score points and trust me when I say this 17 points( the Bills best road scoring total of the season) won't do.

The Browns offense does start slowly, and there will be if they play as they have all season a chance for the Bills to perhaps get an early lead but if the Bills try to sit on a lead and lose their aggressiveness they will watch as the Browns go by them on the score board as the game unfolds.

The Browns have only scored less then 27 points in one home game this season. That was the opener against the Steelers. A game in which they were soundly beatin and 2 days later they traded the starter for that game Charlie Frye. Since taking over as the Browns starter DA has not lost at home #1 and #2 they haven't scored less then 27 points in ANY of those contests. That includes games against the Ravens #2 defense and Seattle top 10 defense. So how far off the mark are you with your post?? Quite a bit I would say based on all the known FACTS. The Bills had better bring their A game, and they had better open up their offense because the Browns are going to score points, the question is can the Bills keep pace???

I had to stop at the bold statement above. Do you consider 40 / 46 total running yards effectively running the ball?? Buddy get your stories straight and try again later.

Complete Week 1 Scouts Buzz (http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/scoutsbuzz?weekNumber=1&seasonYear=2007&seasonType=2)

<TABLE class=tablehead cellSpacing=1 cellPadding=3><TBODY><TR class=gamehead><TD colSpan=3>Team Stat Comparison</TD></TR><TR class=oddrow align=middle><TD align=left></TD><TD>http://assets.espn.go.com/i/teamlogos/nfl/sml/trans/pit.gif</TD><TD>http://assets.espn.go.com/i/teamlogos/nfl/sml/trans/cle.gif</TD></TR><TR class=oddrow align=middle><TD class=bi align=left>1st Downs</TD><TD>17</TD><TD>13</TD></TR><TR class=evenrow align=middle><TD class=bi align=left>Total Yards</TD><TD>365</TD><TD>221</TD></TR><TR class=oddrow align=middle><TD class=bi align=left>Passing</TD><TD>159</TD><TD>175</TD></TR><TR class=evenrow align=middle><TD class=bi align=left>Rushing</TD><TD>206</TD><TD>46</TD></TR><TR class=oddrow align=middle><TD class=bi align=left>Penalties</TD><TD>6-45</TD><TD>6-51</TD></TR><TR class=evenrow align=middle><TD class=bi align=left>3rd Down Conversions</TD><TD>7-17</TD><TD>6-14</TD></TR><TR class=oddrow align=middle><TD class=bi align=left>4th Down Conversions</TD><TD>1-2</TD><TD>0-0</TD></TR><TR class=evenrow align=middle><TD class=bi align=left>Turnovers</TD><TD>1</TD><TD>5</TD></TR><TR class=oddrow align=middle><TD class=bi align=left>Possession</TD><TD>36:16</TD><TD>23:44</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

Complete Week 10 Scouts Buzz (http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/scoutsbuzz?weekNumber=10&seasonYear=2007&seasonType=2)
Also See

Chadiha: Steelers show they can be good rebounders (http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/columns/story?columnist=chadiha_jeffri&id=3105544)<TABLE class=tablehead cellSpacing=1 cellPadding=3><TBODY><TR class=gamehead><TD colSpan=3>Team Stat Comparison</TD></TR><TR class=oddrow align=middle><TD align=left></TD><TD>http://assets.espn.go.com/i/teamlogos/nfl/sml/trans/cle.gif</TD><TD>http://assets.espn.go.com/i/teamlogos/nfl/sml/trans/pit.gif</TD></TR><TR class=oddrow align=middle><TD class=bi align=left>1st Downs</TD><TD>13</TD><TD>22</TD></TR><TR class=evenrow align=middle><TD class=bi align=left>Total Yards</TD><TD>163</TD><TD>401</TD></TR><TR class=oddrow align=middle><TD class=bi align=left>Passing</TD><TD>123</TD><TD>242</TD></TR><TR class=evenrow align=middle><TD class=bi align=left>Rushing</TD><TD>40</TD><TD>159</TD></TR><TR class=oddrow align=middle><TD class=bi align=left>Penalties</TD><TD>7-40</TD><TD>5-30</TD></TR><TR class=evenrow align=middle><TD class=bi align=left>3rd Down Conversions</TD><TD>5-12</TD><TD>8-16</TD></TR><TR class=oddrow align=middle><TD class=bi align=left>4th Down Conversions</TD><TD>0-0</TD><TD>0-0</TD></TR><TR class=evenrow align=middle><TD class=bi align=left>Turnovers</TD><TD>1</TD><TD>1</TD></TR><TR class=oddrow align=middle><TD class=bi align=left>Possession</TD><TD>21:43</TD><TD>38:17</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

[Dude]

Cinci has a way better D and just as good a offenseSeriously? Have you seen the Bengals lately?

Cleveland has the easiest schedule I have seen in a long time and will fall apart against us now, no chance for them.Skoob, think about what you're posting here.

Cleveland to date:
vs PITTSBURGH STEELERS L 34-7
vs CINCINNATI BENGALS W 45-51
@ Oakland Raiders L 24-26
vs BALTIMORE RAVENS W 13-27
@ New England Patriots L 17-34
vs MIAMI DOLPHINS W 31-41
@ St. Louis Rams W 27-20
vs SEATTLE SEAHAWKS W 30-33
@ Pittsburgh Steelers L 28-31
@ Baltimore Ravens W 33-30
vs HOUSTON TEXANS W 17-27
@ Arizona Cardinals L 21-27
@ New York Jets W 24-18

Buffalo to date:
DENVER BRONCOS L 14-15
@ Pittsburgh Steelers L 3-26
@ New England Patriots L 7-38
NEW YORK JETS W 17-14
DALLAS COWBOYS L 24-25
BALTIMORE RAVENS W 19-14
@ New York Jets W 13-3
CINCINNATI BENGALS W 33-21
@ Miami Dolphins W 13-10
NEW ENGLAND PATRIOTS L 10-56
@ Jacksonville Jaguars L 14-36
@ Washington Redskins W 17-16
MIAMI DOLPHINS W 38-17

I bolded the common opponents. If you think the Browns have an easy schedule, then the Bills are not far behind. You seem to think the Bills will walk all over the Browns. I admire your optimism, but be a little more realistic when formulating your opinion.

[Mitchy moo]

Seriously? Have you seen the Bengals lately?
Skoob, think about what you're posting here.

Cleveland to date:
vs PITTSBURGH STEELERS L 34-7
vs CINCINNATI BENGALS W 45-51
@ Oakland Raiders L 24-26
vs BALTIMORE RAVENS W 13-27
@ New England Patriots L 17-34
vs MIAMI DOLPHINS W 31-41
@ St. Louis Rams W 27-20
vs SEATTLE SEAHAWKS W 30-33
@ Pittsburgh Steelers L 28-31
@ Baltimore Ravens W 33-30
vs HOUSTON TEXANS W 17-27
@ Arizona Cardinals L 21-27
@ New York Jets W 24-18

Buffalo to date:
DENVER BRONCOS L 14-15
@ Pittsburgh Steelers L 3-26
@ New England Patriots L 7-38
NEW YORK JETS W 17-14
DALLAS COWBOYS L 24-25
BALTIMORE RAVENS W 19-14
@ New York Jets W 13-3
CINCINNATI BENGALS W 33-21
@ Miami Dolphins W 13-10
NEW ENGLAND PATRIOTS L 10-56
@ Jacksonville Jaguars L 14-36
@ Washington Redskins W 17-16
MIAMI DOLPHINS W 38-17

I bolded the common opponents. If you think the Browns have an easy schedule, then the Bills are not far behind. You seem to think the Bills will walk all over the Browns. I admire your optimism, but be a little more realistic when formulating your opinion.

The Bills had to play Dallas who is the best in the NFC, Denver (who was a playoff team last season) and Jax instead of the 4 teams I enlarged under the Browns schedule. Think the Bills might win of few of the games against those non-common opponents the Browns had play?? I would say we win at least 3 of the 4. Give Cleveland NE an extra time & the 4 who we had to play, then tell me what their record is then. They would get killed by Dallas and lose to Jax, and forget about them beating NE no doubt.

[Dude]

OK, Skoob. Whatever gets you through the day.

[Mitchy moo]

OK, Skoob. Whatever gets you through the day.

Either way both our teams have problems at certain positions and whatever team exposes them better, wins. I just think Clevelands D is incapable of handling us running and Trent passing. That type of ball control will give us the advantage and force Clev. into errors on both sides of the ball, henceforth my prediction.

[patmoran2006]

We led the brigade about Trent as well, SBZfan as too. Many of you tore us a new one & called it heresy, now you call it genius.

We'll take credit @ 4:00 pm This sunday again, Browns get rolled.

P.S. I'm cashing my + 6 wins ticket early next year. Many of you called me crazy then.
WHO LED THE BRIGADE ABOUT TRENT?????????????????????
Come again son.

http://www.billszone.com/fanzone/showthread.php?t=133655&highlight=Edwards
Before Season Starts- I like Edwards more than Losman (Dated September 7, 2007)<!-- Start Post Thank You Hack --><!-- End Post Thank You Hack -->

<HR style="COLOR: #f3f3ff" SIZE=1><!-- / icon and title --><!-- message -->I wanted to get this out BEFORE WEEK ONE... You can say what you want about me, but I don't want to be accused later on this season of falling off/joining another bandwagon.

And despite what most of you are thinking, this is NOT an indictment on Losman either. For all the "Neggie Nancy" posting I've done over the past 12 months, I've almost always defended Losman.

And I'll also admit something else. I did NOT LIKE the drafting of Trent Edwards, in fact I was very vocal following the draft AGAINST it. I said at the time and I remember clearly. "I have nothing against Edwards, I like him but I think it was a STUPID pick given all the Bills other holes".

However.. I been watching this kid at practice, and in the preseason. I been talking and listening to some respectable football people.. And Im now convinced that Trent Edwards is going to have that "it" factor; which is something Losman doesn't nor do I think will ever have.

Sometimes with a great QB, and piss on the "numbers", there is a presence about him. Edwards is going to have that.. He sure as hell has the arm.. He has unbelievable poise. He just appears to me as someone who is going to lead this team to a new level in the future (but sooner than you think)

It couldnt be ANYMORE OBVIOUS and if you disagree you are straight up BLIND- that Levy is FAR from sold on Losman. you dont go drafting FIRST DAY quarterbacks unless your current QB is either:
1- OLD
2- Undecided on for the future by staff/management.

As someone who is the farthest thing as a homer on this board; I'll take it a step further. I think Trent Edwards is going to end up being the BEST QB of this entire draft class; and that includes Russell and Quinn.

For those who say in the pre-season he played against guys who are now working at walmart, I say these things.
1- Blow me
2- he also PLAYED WITH guys who work at walmart.

It's not about the numbers. He has "something" to him that Losman doesnt. I can't put my finger on it in literative terms exactly what it is, but trust me it's there. He reminds me A LOT Of Drew Brees.

and I am NOT trying to be controversial either. I dont need to try to be that. I am not intentionally stirring the pot and trying to create another Johnson vs Flutie. Im just offering my honest opinion.

I think Edwards is the better QB, I think Levy knows that and I think Jauron does too-- and I think that by 2008 at the lastest-- when we line up next year in week one it's going to be Edwards who is the starter-- and I think he's going to rip **** up.

Personally, I LOVE JP LOSMAN. What a great community guy and i dont know that I've ever seen another QB who WANTS to be great more than him. But I think he has been and will continue to be a very erratic QB who looks great oen series and lost the next; and I think it's only a matter of time before Jauron decides that he wants rock-solid consistency with his quarterback, adn Edwards will give him that.

So in future weeks as I predict this team is going to suck, I want it to be known now that I'm not anti-losman, I am very pro-Edwards as this team's QB.

Sadly, I think this is going to be a moot point sooner than you think because I think that sorry fat **** of a RT is going to get Losman hurt. I think Walker is a joke, and I dont want to get into any further because the thread isnt about him. It's about Edwards.

So dont hate on me in future weeks for being down with the Trent Edwards era.. Unlike "Answer" or "Dummy" I'm not lobbying for him to start some **** on here. I'm lobbying for him because I think he's the best rookie in his class after seeing him in person and on TV play;and I think he's going to be the guy to take this team back to the playoffs.. I mean it too

Bash away for now.. but I'll tuck this thread away and we'll revisit it in due time.
<!-- / message --><!-- sig -->

[Brown to the Bone]

Dude you do realize that I said the Browns run the ball effectively and ONLY to keep the D honest. They aren't as I said a running team. Now onto what the Bills did against Pitt 64 yards yeah they really ripped Pitt a new one there...

That said you are quick to point out how you think that the Browns had a soft schedule. They in fact were indeed luckey to have gottin the schedule they did draw. heading into the season the Browns where in fact forecast to have the 4th tuffest schedule in the NFL, they were inded luckey that some of the teams that where thought to be good turned out to be bad. from your own diveision the Jets and Miami where thought to be better heading in, and as luck would have it they weren't. You don't get to make up your schedule you only get to play it.

Now as for the Bills getting a few more wins based on the teams we played vs who you played that is pure hog wash. Look guy, the Browns have been very very consistant on their offense this season 27.7 points per game, and they have not scored less then 27 in any home game started by DA. That is a fact, not opinion. Also it is a fact that the Browns have not LOST one game at home with DA as a starter. Another FACT the Bills have not beatin 1 team with a winning record this season. Another FACT they have not scored more then 17 points in ANY road game this season, those are facts, not opinion. And while the Browns have average 27.7 points per game, the Bills average 17.1, those are facts. The most points the Bills have scored in any game this season is 38, and for the Browns it's 51. Now you can dream, and you can have all the fantasies you want, about the Bills, and what you hope they can do to the Browns, but in all honesty if you think the Bills stack up well or match up well to the Browns well dude get yourself to rehab. Nothing I have seen in the way of stats tells me that the Bills have much of a chance against the Browns. Honestly you can't look at these numbers and think otherwise.

At the end of the day you get to make your fantasy how you want it to be, after all it's your fantasy, but I just don't hold out much hope for the Bills beating the Browns come Sunday. Like they say on any given Sunday, but I can't see one thing that would lead me to believe that the Bills will do much more then show up. And like it or not the FACTS back me up...

[The Answer]

i want to know who FTY is rooting for this week.
:club:

:gobills:

He's a Browns troll showing his true colors.

~The Answer

[billsburgh]

I just hope you're man enough to come back sunday night if/when the bills beat the browns. all these FACTS you point out dont mean ****. that's why they play the game. just because the Bills are averaging 17 points and the browns are averaging 27 doesnt mean that's what going to happen this week.

[Bulldog]

Dude you do realize that I said the Browns run the ball effectively and ONLY to keep the D honest. They aren't as I said a running team. Now onto what the Bills did against Pitt 64 yards yeah they really ripped Pitt a new one there...

That said you are quick to point out how you think that the Browns had a soft schedule. They in fact were indeed luckey to have gottin the schedule they did draw. heading into the season the Browns where in fact forecast to have the 4th tuffest schedule in the NFL, they were inded luckey that some of the teams that where thought to be good turned out to be bad. from your own diveision the Jets and Miami where thought to be better heading in, and as luck would have it they weren't. You don't get to make up your schedule you only get to play it.

Now as for the Bills getting a few more wins based on the teams we played vs who you played that is pure hog wash. Look guy, the Browns have been very very consistant on their offense this season 27.7 points per game, and they have not scored less then 27 in any home game started by DA. That is a fact, not opinion. Also it is a fact that the Browns have not LOST one game at home with DA as a starter. Another FACT the Bills have not beatin 1 team with a winning record this season. Another FACT they have not scored more then 17 points in ANY road game this season, those are facts, not opinion. And while the Browns have average 27.7 points per game, the Bills average 17.1, those are facts. The most points the Bills have scored in any game this season is 38, and for the Browns it's 51. Now you can dream, and you can have all the fantasies you want, about the Bills, and what you hope they can do to the Browns, but in all honesty if you think the Bills stack up well or match up well to the Browns well dude get yourself to rehab. Nothing I have seen in the way of stats tells me that the Bills have much of a chance against the Browns. Honestly you can't look at these numbers and think otherwise.

At the end of the day you get to make your fantasy how you want it to be, after all it's your fantasy, but I just don't hold out much hope for the Bills beating the Browns come Sunday. Like they say on any given Sunday, but I can't see one thing that would lead me to believe that the Bills will do much more then show up. And like it or not the FACTS back me up...

Dude, get off your high horse. We're talking about the Browns, not the freakin Patriots. To act as though Buffalo has no chance is plain ignorant on your part. Yes Cleveland has a nice offense, and yes they are having a nice season. But the defense is ranked last in the entire league, that's fact, not opinion. If Buffalo can run the ball effectively, and by all accounts they should be able to, Buffalo can shorten the game and keep the Browns offense at bay. That should be the game plan. I'm not saying that Buffalo will win this game, but to dismiss them before they even take the field is crazy. And I for one don't think it would be that great of an upset if Buffalo does win. Call me crazy!

[Dude]

Dude you do realize that I said the Browns run the ball effectively and ONLY to keep the D honest.....Do you mean 'Dude' in the philisophical sense, or are you directing your post at me?

[Mitchy moo]

Dude you do realize that I said the Browns run the ball effectively and ONLY to keep the D honest. They aren't as I said a running team. Now onto what the Bills did against Pitt 64 yards yeah they really ripped Pitt a new one there...

That said you are quick to point out how you think that the Browns had a soft schedule. They in fact were indeed luckey to have gottin the schedule they did draw. heading into the season the Browns where in fact forecast to have the 4th tuffest schedule in the NFL, they were inded luckey that some of the teams that where thought to be good turned out to be bad. from your own diveision the Jets and Miami where thought to be better heading in, and as luck would have it they weren't. You don't get to make up your schedule you only get to play it.

Now as for the Bills getting a few more wins based on the teams we played vs who you played that is pure hog wash. Look guy, the Browns have been very very consistant on their offense this season 27.7 points per game, and they have not scored less then 27 in any home game started by DA. That is a fact, not opinion. Also it is a fact that the Browns have not LOST one game at home with DA as a starter. Another FACT the Bills have not beatin 1 team with a winning record this season. Another FACT they have not scored more then 17 points in ANY road game this season, those are facts, not opinion. And while the Browns have average 27.7 points per game, the Bills average 17.1, those are facts. The most points the Bills have scored in any game this season is 38, and for the Browns it's 51. Now you can dream, and you can have all the fantasies you want, about the Bills, and what you hope they can do to the Browns, but in all honesty if you think the Bills stack up well or match up well to the Browns well dude get yourself to rehab. Nothing I have seen in the way of stats tells me that the Bills have much of a chance against the Browns. Honestly you can't look at these numbers and think otherwise.

At the end of the day you get to make your fantasy how you want it to be, after all it's your fantasy, but I just don't hold out much hope for the Bills beating the Browns come Sunday. Like they say on any given Sunday, but I can't see one thing that would lead me to believe that the Bills will do much more then show up. And like it or not the FACTS back me up...

You not wrong with what you just posted, you just have to realize that Trent is 5-1 as a starter in his rookie year and we missed ML for 2 of the last losses we just had, so weighing both of those factors in = a better offense for us than the year would suggest so far. You had DA in since the first few games, we invited a different teammate to start with alot less success. We also now have Fred Jackson in the mix at RB that we didn't have before and after he rushed for 115 yards last week and ML rushed for 107, I would say we have a decent combo. You can try to convince me that your teams that is dead last in points allowed and in all defensive stats combined is going to show up and be way better than Miami, it's just not going to work.

[madness]

Do you mean 'Dude' in the philisophical sense, or are you directing your post at me?

That's just madness.

[Mitchy moo]

Fair, I'll breakdown how I think the game will fly and why I am calling a Bills win.

Time of possession in this game is going to be the key for the Bills. Keeping a great Browns offense off the field stiffles their ability to score. During a few of your losses (pittsburgh) as example, your TOP was a total of 21:43 / 23:44 minutes for each of the games. The final rushing yards for both of those games averaged out to ~43 yards total. Your inability to rush basically forced your hand to go into a pass only offense, which if successful obviously can get you points but if neutralized (as it was against Pittsburgh) gets your D on the field faster. The Bills will attempt to stop the run and play their usual zone against the pass, standing ready for either. I am not claiming we are Pittsburgh but as of late we have done a great job against the rush. Miami got 65 yards rushing on us, the skins got 80 yards (on 30 attempts), so all in all a focused effort.

Trent also now has 2 different people in which to give the rock too with 2 different styles. When Defenses see one guy they can't tackle and another guy they can't catch running the ball, they have to take 2 different paths to get to them. Cleveland's D is not capable of handling our huge O-line and will get little pressure on Edwards, so plan on him having all day. If Cleveland loads the box, then Trent will have the time to look for mid-range passes, if they play zone he can go for longer passes and if Clev. plays back we will average 8 YPC. It's a no win situation for Clev. and will allow us to get ahead early.

Clev. will abandon the run after the first quarter & be down by 10. They will switch to the pass which will allow Buffalo to pressure DA to make decisions quicker than normal, knowing that if DA is given too much time there will be issues. DA will throw a few in waiting Bills players arms and fumble at least once trying to be a hero. That allows Buffalo's drill and fill Offense to come back on the field and gove Clev.'s D less time to rest. The Bills will end up with ~39 Minutes of possession, more than enough to roll up a big win.

Read my post from last night and read what Adam wrote below, I think we are thinking alike (He is the only guy at Fox experts to pick the Bills):


Edwards is coming off of his best and most explosive game of the season. Evans can burn the Browns deep. Jason Peters is playing at a Pro Bowl level at tackle and deserves to go across the water to Hawaii. Lynch and Jackson should run well behind Jim McNally's offensive line. Everyone moves the ball on Cleveland. Cleveland's offense is simply explosive. But Buffalo does boast a star end in Aaron Schobel, a lock-down corner in Terrence McGee and a budding star at safety in Donte Whitner (yes, I was one of those who killed Jauron and company for taking the former Ohio State star with the ninth overall pick in 2006).

http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/story/7559356

[The last buffalo fan]

Read my post from last night and read what Adam wrote below, I think we are thinking alike (He is the only guy at Fox experts to pick the Bills):


Edwards is coming off of his best and most explosive game of the season. Evans can burn the Browns deep. Jason Peters is playing at a Pro Bowl level at tackle and deserves to go across the water to Hawaii. Lynch and Jackson should run well behind Jim McNally's offensive line. Everyone moves the ball on Cleveland. Cleveland's offense is simply explosive. But Buffalo does boast a star end in Aaron Schobel, a lock-down corner in Terrence McGee and a budding star at safety in Donte Whitner (yes, I was one of those who killed Jauron and company for taking the former Ohio State star with the ninth overall pick in 2006).

http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/story/7559356

8th pick.

[EDS]

The biggest problem for the Bills against the Browns is that the Bills have gotten destroyed by good tight ends the past few seasons. Winslow could kill the Bills in their soft zone.

Seriously, he catches the ball about 7 yards off the line of scrimmage and then bowls over the Bills tiny DBs for three more yards. No linebacker can cover him.

Basically, the Bills D needs to come up big because the Cleveland offensive is more advanced then the Bills.

[Philagape]

Jurevicius and Winslow are just the type of targets that can give our defense fits. They're not the kind of offense that a bend-but-don't-break defense wants to play; the Browns are fourth in the league in red zone offense. They have a great line, they can put together long drives, and Lewis can pound a tired D in the second half.
This feels like one of those close games in which the Browns get the ball with like four minutes left and our offense doesn't see the field again and they win with a FG.

[Preacher]

From my viewpoint... This is a game that can go either way.

1. Browns and defense. Simply put, the Browns do not have the ability to stop the run, nor do they have the ability to lock down on the pass. As a result, a team that has talent on either the ground or through the air, and is just ok doing the other part, can and usually will beat the Browns. Every team they lost to have been 2 dimensional... some just barely. Every team they beat have been one dimensional. The key is, the defense can focus on one or the other, but not both the run and the pass.

2. Browns on offense. Browns have become a strong offensive team. The problem is, they don't always have the ability to go for the kill. They should have beat my Steelers, but couldn't go for the kill. Part of that is the defense. Part of that is the inability to control the clock in a dominant ground game.

3. Bills defense and offense. Spotty, there have been games that the defense has looked like they belong to a SB team. I take you back to the Dallas game for instance. then, there are times that they look like they barely belong to any team. The offense is kinda the same.

What this results in is a game that will be decided by which team can put together more parts of the game then the other one. Some teams don't have to worry about putting together the whole game. Both the Browns and Bills do.

I think this game will end up being fascinating. If I were giving odds, I would have to say the Browns and 3 points. However, it could easily be a Bills game.

In order for the Bills to win this game. they are going to have to be able to run the ball, pass effectively. Not well, just effectively. The Bills defense has to be able to shut down the pass.

Those are the keys I think... to beating the Browns.

[Mitchy moo]

From my viewpoint... This is a game that can go either way.

1. Browns and defense. Simply put, the Browns do not have the ability to stop the run, nor do they have the ability to lock down on the pass. As a result, a team that has talent on either the ground or through the air, and is just ok doing the other part, can and usually will beat the Browns. Every team they lost to have been 2 dimensional... some just barely. Every team they beat have been one dimensional. The key is, the defense can focus on one or the other, but not both the run and the pass.

2. Browns on offense. Browns have become a strong offensive team. The problem is, they don't always have the ability to go for the kill. They should have beat my Steelers, but couldn't go for the kill. Part of that is the defense. Part of that is the inability to control the clock in a dominant ground game.

3. Bills defense and offense. Spotty, there have been games that the defense has looked like they belong to a SB team. I take you back to the Dallas game for instance. then, there are times that they look like they barely belong to any team. The offense is kinda the same.

What this results in is a game that will be decided by which team can put together more parts of the game then the other one. Some teams don't have to worry about putting together the whole game. Both the Browns and Bills do.

I think this game will end up being fascinating. If I were giving odds, I would have to say the Browns and 3 points. However, it could easily be a Bills game.

In order for the Bills to win this game. they are going to have to be able to run the ball, pass effectively. Not well, just effectively. The Bills defense has to be able to shut down the pass.

Those are the keys I think... to beating the Browns.

Amen.

[The Answer]

From my viewpoint... This is a game that can go either way.

1. Browns and defense. Simply put, the Browns do not have the ability to stop the run, nor do they have the ability to lock down on the pass. As a result, a team that has talent on either the ground or through the air, and is just ok doing the other part, can and usually will beat the Browns. Every team they lost to have been 2 dimensional... some just barely. Every team they beat have been one dimensional. The key is, the defense can focus on one or the other, but not both the run and the pass.

2. Browns on offense. Browns have become a strong offensive team. The problem is, they don't always have the ability to go for the kill. They should have beat my Steelers, but couldn't go for the kill. Part of that is the defense. Part of that is the inability to control the clock in a dominant ground game.

3. Bills defense and offense. Spotty, there have been games that the defense has looked like they belong to a SB team. I take you back to the Dallas game for instance. then, there are times that they look like they barely belong to any team. The offense is kinda the same.

What this results in is a game that will be decided by which team can put together more parts of the game then the other one. Some teams don't have to worry about putting together the whole game. Both the Browns and Bills do.

I think this game will end up being fascinating. If I were giving odds, I would have to say the Browns and 3 points. However, it could easily be a Bills game.

In order for the Bills to win this game. they are going to have to be able to run the ball, pass effectively. Not well, just effectively. The Bills defense has to be able to shut down the pass.

Those are the keys I think... to beating the Browns.

This is actually a very good assement coming from a rival who has seen both teams this year (the browns twice).

The Browns aren't the Pats - and they aren't the Jags, Steelers, Chargers or Colts for that matter either. We don't have to play lights out in all 3 phases to win this game, but on the flipside if the Browns do play lights out in all 3 phases agaisnt us it will be pose serious problems in their house.

Also even though we lost against the Cowboys, they are a far more explosive offense than the Browns, and their core gameplan is errily similar to Cleveland - dominate the middle with the TE's (Witten > Winslow) and make big plays down the field with a dominant receiver (TO > Edwards). Anderson is having a solid season, but he's no Tony Romo either.

Trent don't have to have a huge passing game - but I just don't see how the Browns are going to be able to shut down Lynch and Action Jackson, even if they stop one of them I like our chances to win easily. The real key will be utilizing the screen passing game in this one. I think either Action or Beast can take one to the house in this game.

~The Answer

[FatalShot]

Let's sum it all up quickly: Cleveland's offense should scare us! Come on Bills pass coverage can you come through for me?

[Mitchy moo]

This is actually a very good assement coming from a rival who has seen both teams this year (the browns twice).

The Browns aren't the Pats - and they aren't the Jags, Steelers, Chargers or Colts for that matter either. We don't have to play lights out in all 3 phases to win this game, but on the flipside if the Browns do play lights out in all 3 phases agaisnt us it will be pose serious problems in their house.

Also even though we lost against the Cowboys, they are a far more explosive offense than the Browns, and their core gameplan is errily similar to Cleveland - dominate the middle with the TE's (Witten > Winslow) and make big plays down the field with a dominant receiver (TO > Edwards). Anderson is having a solid season, but he's no Tony Romo either.

Trent don't have to have a huge passing game - but I just don't see how the Browns are going to be able to shut down Lynch and Action Jackson, even if they stop one of them I like our chances to win easily. The real key will be utilizing the screen passing game in this one. I think either Action or Beast can take one to the house in this game.

~The Answer

They cannot shut both down, that's the main reason we win this game. Trent makes them pay for trying to load the box.

[YardRat]

Buffalo is going to have to play their best all-around game of the year this Sunday to win, IMO...If they don't, they'll lose, plain and simple. This team is still awfully young (and banged up) to expect them to play at a high level consistently week to week, regardless of the opponent.

The running game needs to pick up where they left off last week.

TE is going to have to have another error-free, or close to it, game passing the ball.

The defense is going to have to shut done Lewis, attempt to tighten up some of the holes against the pass, and make a couple of big plays. Third down conversions are going to be huge.

Finally, the special teams is going to have to pick it up to another level, and they haven't been doing that for several games now. McGee or Parrish need to take one to the house, and I'd say the odds are even that Cribbs returns one on us.

I'm hoping for a win, but unless Cleveland uncharacteristically implodes I don't see the Bills winning big. We might be able to squeek one out, but we're certainly not going to go in there and give them a Bye-Bye Bud Carson-type whupping.

Conversely, I wouldn't be surprised if Cleveland eked one out over us, or even blew us out a la the Jacksonville game a few weeks ago.

[Brown to the Bone]

No sir sorry I don't think the Bills will do much better then anybody else has over the past month. Yes to start the season the Browns defense was gashed pretty good. I could run down a laundry list of reasons why, but I don't think you would want to hear it, in a nut shell though it was youth.

Here are the numbers over the past 4 games.

Ravens 128 Yards
Houston 77 Yards
Zona 123 Yards
Jets 119 Yards

Average 111.75 yards per game over the past month. Now I watch every single Browns game, as I am sure most of you do Bills games. I can tell you and the numbers back me up here. Yes early on in the season the Browns were ripped on the ground, no question there, that is no longer the case. The run defense has improved almost unbelievably in the past month, plus.

Even in the Pitt game where the Browns gave up 161 total yards, 49 0f those yards came as a result of Ben running for his life. And take it from me WP had one run of 30 yards, and that was it, most of his runs where 1,2,3 yards. So yes it would appear the Browns run defense is not so good but if you take the time to get past the numbers you would realize quickly that they have improved to the point now where they are average at worst.

Now you can point at the Fins game and tell the world about how great a running game you have and how your going to light up the Browns becuase their run defense sucks if you like. But the honest truth is the Browns defense played awful to start the season but in recent weeks they have shown real improvement. The stats were so bad to start the year they overshadow how the defense is actually playing at this time. Take it for what its worth, I am certain you will..

[Mitchy moo]

No sir sorry I don't think the Bills will do much better then anybody else has over the past month. Yes to start the season the Browns defense was gashed pretty good. I could run down a laundry list of reasons why, but I don't think you would want to hear it, in a nut shell though it was youth.

Here are the numbers over the past 4 games.

Ravens 128 Yards
Houston 77 Yards
Zona 123 Yards
Jets 119 Yards

Average 111.75 yards per game over the past month. Now I watch every single Browns game, as I am sure most of you do Bills games. I can tell you and the numbers back me up here. Yes early on in the season the Browns were ripped on the ground, no question there, that is no longer the case. The run defense has improved almost unbelievably in the past month, plus.

Even in the Pitt game where the Browns gave up 161 total yards, 49 0f those yards came as a result of Ben running for his life. And take it from me WP had one run of 30 yards, and that was it, most of his runs where 1,2,3 yards. So yes it would appear the Browns run defense is not so good but if you take the time to get past the numbers you would realize quickly that they have improved to the point now where they are average at worst.

Now you can point at the Fins game and tell the world about how great a running game you have and how your going to light up the Browns becuase their run defense sucks if you like. But the honest truth is the Browns defense played awful to start the season but in recent weeks they have shown real improvement. The stats were so bad to start the year they overshadow how the defense is actually playing at this time. Take it for what its worth, I am certain you will..

You are using teams with a .500 or less record to compare to the Bills?? By the way, we beat every team we played on that list this season and you lost to some of them so bad example.

[mybills]

My buddy FunTimes on here is a big Cleveland fan

Maybe you can answer this...
He's been asked a few times who he'll be rooting for, since he likes both teams. I kept my eye on those threads waiting for his response, but unless it was answered much later, I didn't see it. So, who's his #1 team of the two?

[Mitchy moo]

Sorting the Bills
Coming off a season-high 38 points against Miami, there’s no reason to believe this won’t be another good week for Bills as fantasy options.
The Cleveland Browns have yielded an NFL-worst 5,066 yards, or 389.7 per game, and a league-high 356 points, which is 27.4 per contest. They rank third-worst in passing defense (259.2 yards per game) and fifth-worst in rushing defense (130.5).
The Browns have allowed nine individuals to rush for 100 or more yards, four passers to crack the 300- yard mark and six receivers to go over 100 yards. Only once in 13 games has Cleveland failed to allow its opponent to have a player accomplish at least one of those feats — in Week 12, a 27-17 home win over the Houston Texans.

http://www.buffalonews.com/sports/story/228703.html

[Brown to the Bone]

Actually we lost to 1 of them and they still only put up 123 yards running. Again I could tell you why the Browns lost to Zona, but you wouldn't listen anyway, so why bother. Let me say this though it had nothing to do with their lack of ability to stop the run...

[Mr. Pink]

Maybe you can answer this...
He's been asked a few times who he'll be rooting for, since he likes both teams. I kept my eye on those threads waiting for his response, but unless it was answered much later, I didn't see it. So, who's his #1 team of the two?

I've honestly answered this at least 15 times throughout posting here. I root for the Bills every week and pull for them to win unless they play the Browns. I do watch both team's games every week as well. I probably know both team's rosters and schemes about equally too.

[Brown to the Bone]

Heres somemore stats for your viewing pleasure Skooby

Browns and Bills last 4 games total net yards allowed.

Browns total 1371 average = 342.75 yards per game net.

Bills total 1492 average = 373 yards per game net.

Points allowed per game last 4 games

Browns 30, 17, 27, 18 total points allowed =92 average points per game 23

Bills 56, 36, 16, 17 total points allowed=125 average points per game 31.25

If you throw out the NE score 56 WOW, the average is still 23. While I would agree NE is top of the heep in terms of their offense the Browns aren't far behind, and by the way I noticed they laid that one on ya at home....

[mybills]

So you're #1 is Browns and your #2 is Bills? And you're considered a Browns fan.

I root for the Bills every week and pull for them to win unless they play the Browns. I do watch both team's games every week as well.
I watch as many Giants games as I can, because I've always liked them too.

BUT...

I rooted for Buffalo in the S.B. and will root for them again next week.
Buffalo #1 Giants #2. I don't wear Giants gear, only Bills gear. :up:

:gobills:

[don137]

This game can go either way. Both teams are playing pretty good football. Both teams have had a pretty soft schedule. This is not going to be a blow out and will be very close. It will come down to a handful of play that determine the outcome. Anyone saying their team will definitely win and are the superior team suffer from a case of homeritus.

[Mr. Pink]

So you're #1 is Browns and your #2 is Bills? And you're considered a Browns fan.

I watch as many Giants games as I can, because I've always liked them too.

BUT...

I rooted for Buffalo in the S.B. and will root for them again next week.
Buffalo #1 Giants #2. I don't wear Giants gear, only Bills gear. :up:

:gobills:

More like 1a and 1b

Back in 04 I rooted for Buffalo to beat Cleveland, because Cleveland was garbage and not going anywhere. Buffalo had the chance at making the playoffs.

[Dude]

mybills has a bigger Bills internet penis than you, FTY.

[Mitchy moo]

Heres somemore stats for your viewing pleasure Skooby

Browns and Bills last 4 games total net yards allowed.

Browns total 1371 average = 342.75 yards per game net.

Bills total 1492 average = 373 yards per game net.

Points allowed per game last 4 games

Browns 30, 17, 27, 18 total points allowed =92 average points per game 23

Bills 56, 36, 16, 17 total points allowed=125 average points per game 31.25

If you throw out the NE score 56 WOW, the average is still 23. While I would agree NE is top of the heep in terms of their offense the Browns aren't far behind, and by the way I noticed they laid that one on ya at home....

You want to take credit for beating the Jets?? We did that twice. You played the NFC west, the worst division and Miami as well as the Jets.

[Brown to the Bone]

NFL Preview - Buffalo (7-6) at Cleveland (8-5)

Posted on Thu, Dec. 13, 2007

Digg (http://digg.com/submit?phase=2&url=http://www.miamiherald.com/858/story/343859.html) del.icio.us (http://del.icio.us/post) AIM (aim:goim?Message=http://www.miamiherald.com/858/story/343859.html) print (http://www.miamiherald.com/858/v-print/story/343859.html) email (http://www.miamiherald.com/858/v-emailform/story/343859.html)

By Michael Rushton, Sports Network

<!-- begin /production/story/credit_line_format.comp -->The Sports Network

<!-- end /production/story/credit_line_format.comp -->Two teams with hopes of a playoff spot will collide this Sunday in Cleveland, where the Buffalo Bills will battle the Browns.
That is not a typo.
Few expected these two clubs to be in the wild card hunt this late in the season, but that is in fact the case. The surprise of the league, Cleveland, is 8-5 and has the inside track, as it currently is in possession of the final postseason spot.
Jacksonville, which is 9-4, is the other team currently holding a wild card spot.
In fact, the Browns can clinch a playoff spot with a victory this Sunday coupled with losses by both Tennessee and Denver. And the club is just one game back of Pittsburgh (9-4) for first place in the AFC North. Cleveland has lost both of its games against the Steelers this season, however.
The Browns, who haven't been in the postseason since 2002, have won three of four since losing to Pittsburgh in Week 10, including a 24-18 victory over the New York Jets at the Meadowlands this past weekend.

Sports Network Predicted Outcome: Browns 31, Bills 17
<!-- story_mapbox.comp --><!-- /story_mapbox.comp -->
http://www.miamiherald.com/858/story/343859.html

Please refrain from posting full articles as it is a copy write violation, thank you ~DB

[Bulldog]

NFL Preview - Buffalo (7-6) at Cleveland (8-5)

Posted on Thu, Dec. 13, 2007

Digg (http://digg.com/submit?phase=2&url=http://www.miamiherald.com/858/story/343859.html) del.icio.us (http://del.icio.us/post) AIM (aim:goim?Message=http://www.miamiherald.com/858/story/343859.html) print (http://www.miamiherald.com/858/v-print/story/343859.html) email (http://www.miamiherald.com/858/v-emailform/story/343859.html)

By Michael Rushton, Sports Network

<!-- begin /production/story/credit_line_format.comp -->The Sports Network

<!-- end /production/story/credit_line_format.comp -->Two teams with hopes of a playoff spot will collide this Sunday in Cleveland, where the Buffalo Bills will battle the Browns.
That is not a typo.
Few expected these two clubs to be in the wild card hunt this late in the season, but that is in fact the case. The surprise of the league, Cleveland, is 8-5 and has the inside track, as it currently is in possession of the final postseason spot.
Jacksonville, which is 9-4, is the other team currently holding a wild card spot.
In fact, the Browns can clinch a playoff spot with a victory this Sunday coupled with losses by both Tennessee and Denver. And the club is just one game back of Pittsburgh (9-4) for first place in the AFC North. Cleveland has lost both of its games against the Steelers this season, however.
The Browns, who haven't been in the postseason since 2002, have won three of four since losing to Pittsburgh in Week 10, including a 24-18 victory over the New York Jets at the Meadowlands this past weekend.


Better watch out for that all important Sports Network prediction.

[mybills]

mybills has a bigger Bills internet penis than you, FTY.
:rofl: :hi5:

[The Answer]

Heres somemore stats for your viewing pleasure Skooby

Browns and Bills last 4 games total net yards allowed.

Browns total 1371 average = 342.75 yards per game net.

Bills total 1492 average = 373 yards per game net.

Points allowed per game last 4 games

Browns 30, 17, 27, 18 total points allowed =92 average points per game 23

Bills 56, 36, 16, 17 total points allowed=125 average points per game 31.25

If you throw out the NE score 56 WOW, the average is still 23. While I would agree NE is top of the heep in terms of their offense the Browns aren't far behind, and by the way I noticed they laid that one on ya at home....

We are a different team offensively with Trent Edwards at QB - plus Lynch should be 100% this week, and there's another secret weapon called Fred 'Action' Jackson that has burst onto the scene the last few weeks.

Also defensively the stats are misleading since we have to play the Pats twice. We've also played offenses that are far more potent than yours including the cowboys, jags, broncos, etc. You are going to be in for a surprise if you think you can move the ball at will against us every series.

~The Answer

[Brown to the Bone]

We are a different team offensively with Trent Edwards at QB - plus Lynch should be 100% this week, and there's another secret weapon called Fred 'Action' Jackson that has burst onto the scene the last few weeks.

Also defensively the stats are misleading since we have to play the Pats twice. We've also played offenses that are far more potent than yours including the cowboys, jags, broncos, etc. You are going to be in for a surprise if you think you can move the ball at will against us every series.

~The Answer


No team scores every single time they get the ball, never said that !!!
but you site 2 teams that aren't close to the Browns #5 scoring offense the Jags at #10 average 23.5 per game, and the Broncos average 21.1 neither team is close to the Browns when it comes to scoring points. I will grant you that playing NE twice and haveing your arse handed to you scews the numbers, but honestly the Browns are at #5 its not close to what NE has done, but God almighty man they aren't as far off from NE as you might think, and trust me this team can put up lots of points very quickley, I know I have seen it, as have many of the teams the Browns have played this season. In the last game the Browns played against the Steelers in Pitts, they scored 21 points in the 1st half and laid an egg in the second half but that was against the #1 defense in the NFL. Granted I know for a fact that the Bills defense is way better then the Steelers defense and they will shut the Browns down no problem, yeah right !!! :sorry:

[Brown to the Bone]

Yeah I am going to write an E mail to Savage and tell him to try to work a trade for TE with is 5 TD's and 5 Ints for DA with his 25 TD's and his 14 int's... Guy their just isn't a comparison on the offensive side of the ball. Granted TE looks like a good young player, but DA is a young player as well, this is his 1st season being a full time starter as well as it is for TE, now I ask you who would you rather have???

[Mr. Pink]

We are a different team offensively with Trent Edwards at QB - plus Lynch should be 100% this week, and there's another secret weapon called Fred 'Action' Jackson that has burst onto the scene the last few weeks.

Also defensively the stats are misleading since we have to play the Pats twice. We've also played offenses that are far more potent than yours including the cowboys, jags, broncos, etc. You are going to be in for a surprise if you think you can move the ball at will against us every series.

~The Answer
Cleveland has played in terms of team defense....

Pittsburgh - twice Number 1
New England - Number 4
Baltimore - twice Number 5
Seattle - number 12
St Louis - number 18
Houston - number 19

Cleveland moved the ball at will against all of these teams.

Now team offense...

New England - Number 1
Cincy - number 7
Seattle - number 11
Houston - number 12
Pittsburgh - number 14
Arizona - number 15

And the Jags are ranked below the Browns in team offense answer...sorry. Denver averages a yard and a half more a game. So it looks like you're more potent comment is off a little. Also the Browns have scored 65 more points on the year than Denver and 55 more than Jacksonville.

I always have so much fun disproving what you say. Because, frankly, you make it so easy! :rofl:

[Brown to the Bone]

Here is something else to put in your pipe and smoke..

J Lewis RB Cleveland Browns
921 Yards on 218 carries YPC 4.2

M Lynch RB Buffalo Bills
858 yards on 219 carries YPC 3.9


You guys are right when you say that you have the better running game and the numbers prove it. Oh by the way Lewis missed 2 games too. and really 3 because he went out with a foot injury after the 1st play he ran with the ball..

No question though I can see that the BILLS clearly have a big big advantage in the running game...:sorry:

[madness]

J Lewis RB Cleveland Browns
4.0 MPPT

M Lynch RB Buffalo Bills
0.0 MPPT

*Months per Prison Term

[Brown to the Bone]

LMFAO Nice post....

[The Answer]

Cleveland has played in terms of team defense....

Pittsburgh - twice Number 1
New England - Number 4
Baltimore - twice Number 5
Seattle - number 12
St Louis - number 18
Houston - number 19

Cleveland moved the ball at will against all of these teams.

Now team offense...

New England - Number 1
Cincy - number 7
Seattle - number 11
Houston - number 12
Pittsburgh - number 14
Arizona - number 15

And the Jags are ranked below the Browns in team offense answer...sorry. Denver averages a yard and a half more a game. So it looks like you're more potent comment is off a little. Also the Browns have scored 65 more points on the year than Denver and 55 more than Jacksonville.

I always have so much fun disproving what you say. Because, frankly, you make it so easy! :rofl:

I knew you were a Browns troll showing your true colors - just have fun defending Edwards, Lynch, Evans and Jackson and talk to me about who has the better QB/RB after this game too.

Crennel is no Belichik. And Brady Quinn will be starting next year for your team anyway.

~The Answer

[The Answer]

Here is something else to put in your pipe and smoke..

J Lewis RB Cleveland Browns
921 Yards on 218 carries YPC 4.2

M Lynch RB Buffalo Bills
858 yards on 219 carries YPC 3.9


You guys are right when you say that you have the better running game and the numbers prove it. Oh by the way Lewis missed 2 games too. and really 3 because he went out with a foot injury after the 1st play he ran with the ball..

No question though I can see that the BILLS clearly have a big big advantage in the running game...:sorry:

Two words: Fred Jackson - the wild card that is going to rape your defense both running and receiving the football on sunday.

~The Answer

[The Answer]

Yeah I am going to write an E mail to Savage and tell him to try to work a trade for TE with is 5 TD's and 5 Ints for DA with his 25 TD's and his 14 int's... Guy their just isn't a comparison on the offensive side of the ball. Granted TE looks like a good young player, but DA is a young player as well, this is his 1st season being a full time starter as well as it is for TE, now I ask you who would you rather have???

Trent Edwards >>>>>>> Anderson

Rember this now, after sunday, next year when he's benched for Quinn and 5 years from now when Anderson has been relegated to a career back up or out of the league.

~The Answer

[DraftBoy]

Brown to the Bone-

Please refrain from posting full articles here as it is a copy write violation, I edited your previous post with the full text. A paragraph and a link will do just fine, thank you and enjoy the BZ.

DB

[Brown to the Bone]

And Edwards and the Bills are no DA and the Cleveland Browns when it comes to putting up points, get real. I understand about being a fan but truthfully there isn't even one single area on the offense that the Bills even come close to the Browns in. The defense is a differant story to be sure but offensively few are better then the Browns, and if their D gets themselfs off the field look out because that 27.7 average will be going up.... AGAIN:sorry:

[Brown to the Bone]

Brown to the Bone-

Please refrain from posting full articles here as it is a copy write violation, I edited your previous post with the full text. A paragraph and a link will do just fine, thank you and enjoy the BZ.

DB

I have never been told this before, and I guess every other board I have ever visited is about to be hit with a law suit if what your saying is true, because I see articles posted on message boards all the time, I guess the people that write these articles must not like people from Buffalo because they are the only ones being suit that I know about.. Sorry:sorry: I won't do it again, but please....

[THATHURMANATOR]

BTTB do you feel the Bills have a chance this weekend?

[THATHURMANATOR]

I have never been told this before, and I guess every other board I have ever visited is about to be hit with a law suit if what your saying is true, because I see articles posted on message boards all the time, I guess the people that write these articles must not like people from Buffalo because they are the only ones being suit that I know about.. Sorry:sorry: I won't do it again, but please....
No need to be a jerk about it man, and yes all those other boards could be sued. Probably wouldn't happen but why risk it?

[DraftBoy]

I have never been told this before, and I guess every other board I have ever visited is about to be hit with a law suit if what your saying is true, because I see articles posted on message boards all the time, I guess the people that write these articles must not like people from Buffalo because they are the only ones being suit that I know about.. Sorry:sorry: I won't do it again, but please....


No need to be dick, you are a guest here and have already showed a propensity to try and stir the pot. Stick to your stats and we'll get along fine. I dont care about what other boards do or dont do, only about what this one does. Its been taken care of now, so no harm no foul, I appreciate your willingness to cooperate. And like I said before enjoy the BZ.

[Brown to the Bone]

Sure anything is possible. Yeah they have a chance thats why they play the game, and thats what makes it so much fun to watch. Hell if I knew the outcome, I wouldn't bother watching.

The Browns have their weaknesses to be sure they do, but they are a team that is beginning to put it all together. Their defense was pretty bad to start the year and they still have issues, but they honest to God have begun to play some pretty good ball over the last month. And the offense is well lets put it this way the offense is about to set new team records for points in a season, DA will own the TD team record as well as the yardage record. The Browns O line has given up the least number of sacks of any team in the NFL 15 and 6 of those came in the 1st game. It's hard not to like this group they truly are special.

But do the Bills have a chance yes they do. Their chance is this they need not try to rush DA, truthfully the O line in Cleveland is well awesome. They pick up the blitz as well as any team in the NFL, and DA kills teams when they blitz. In the Pitt game the Steelers Blitzed like they always do in the 1st half and DA killed them. Then in the second half they never blitzed not once and DA had a hard time adjusting to the LB ers dropping into coverage and although it was there for the taking he couldn't throw a short dump off pass to save his life. What the Steelers did was they took away BE and K2 by double and triple teaming them and gave DA the underneath stuff, he didn't adjust well. That said he has shown marked improvement in this area, and now is operating pretty good when teams drop back and double and triple up. Beware the playaction...

The way the Bills beat the Browns though is to get DA to do it for them, easier said then done, but he has his moments and the Bills will need to take every advantage should they get the chance, otherwise I see the Browns winning this one easy. I see the Bilis winning this one is if DA turns the ball over more then 2 times, its happened this season but not at home... Good luck, with that.. Honestly Good luck

[Mr. Pink]

I knew you were a Browns troll showing your true colors - just have fun defending Edwards, Lynch, Evans and Jackson and talk to me about who has the better QB/RB after this game too.

Crennel is no Belichik. And Brady Quinn will be starting next year for your team anyway.

~The Answer

Yes I'm a troll now because I'm proving your idiotic points completely false, you caught me! :rofl:

I've already said the Browns D is porous and the Bills will score, much the same the Browns O will score on the porous Bills D. It's going to be a high scoring close game.

Better QB as of today - Derek Anderson without question...three years from now? Who knows.

Better RB as of today - Jamal Lewis, three years from now...Marshawn Lynch.

This game is being played Sunday not next year or 3 years from now. Games in the present aren't predicated on future potential.

And I know how good Fred Jackson is, I've watched him just like you...but you haven't seen, mostly because you probably haven't watched Browns football, how good Harrison and Wright can be.

[DraftBoy]

Posistional Breakdown:
QB-Browns
RB-Push
TE-Browns
WR-Browns
OL-Bills
DL-Bills
LB-Browns
CB-Push
S-Browns
K-Bills
P-Bills

Thats how I see it atleast

[Mr. Pink]

Posistional Breakdown:
QB-Browns
RB-Push
TE-Browns
WR-Browns
OL-Bills
DL-Bills
LB-Browns
CB-Push
S-Browns
K-Bills
P-Bills

Thats how I see it atleast

I'll agree with that except OL

[DraftBoy]

I'll agree with that except OL


I still got issues with the right side of your line but with a healthy Bentley itd be a push.

[Brown to the Bone]

Posistional Breakdown:
QB-Browns
RB-Push
TE-Browns
WR-Browns
OL-Bills
DL-Bills
LB-Browns
CB-Push
S-Browns
K-Bills
P-Bills

Thats how I see it atleast

QB -Browns
RB- maybe a push slight edge to Browns based on YPC average..
TE- Browns
WR- Browns
OL- BROWNS big TIME 15 sacks for the entire season 6 in 1st game NFL BEST
DL- BILLS Ours sucks, but has played much better lately..
LB- Depends Wimbley great, Jackson great, Davis nope, Maguinest Old, Peek OK. I would call it a push.

DB's Browns hands down
S- Browns

Special teams a wash, Cribbs is a monster, and the Bills are known for their great special teams, but do not sell the Browns short they are very solid on special teams..

[madness]

I'd call the OL and QB a push only because of how the two positions for the Bills have played since TE took back over. I think both QB's have benefited due to some outstanding o-line play.

[DraftBoy]

QB -Browns
RB- maybe a push slight edge to Browns based on YPC average..
TE- Browns
WR- Browns
OL- BROWNS big TIME 15 sacks for the entire season 6 in 1st game NFL BEST
DL- BILLS Ours sucks, but has played much better lately..
LB- Depends Wimbley great, Jackson great, Davis nope, Maguinest Old, Peek OK. I would call it a push.

DB's Browns hands down
S- Browns

Special teams a wash, Cribbs is a monster, and the Bills are known for their great special teams, but do not sell the Browns short they are very solid on special teams..

Im aware of what the stats say, Ill still take Buffalo's line, better run blocking and we've had very good protection the last few weeks.

[DraftBoy]

I'd call the OL and QB a push only because of how the two positions for the Bills have played since TE took back over. I think both QB's have benefited due to some outstanding o-line play.


No way in hell you can be serious about the QB? Edwards has played well half a season, DA has played well the entire season, you have to give it to Cleveland just based on consistent production.

[Mr. Pink]

No way in hell you can be serious about the QB? Edwards has played well half a season, DA has played well the entire season, you have to give it to Cleveland just based on consistent production.

I gotta say that's the first time I've seen DA and consistent in the same sentence.

[DraftBoy]

I gotta say that's the first time I've seen DA and consistent in the same sentence.

Oh he still makes stupid ass mistakes, but his play as of late has atleast shown to me that I dont have to worry that he'll blow the game from week to week.

[Brown to the Bone]

Im aware of what the stats say, Ill still take Buffalo's line, better run blocking and we've had very good protection the last few weeks.

The stats say otherwise Browns 15 to Bills 23 sacks and the YPC says Browns line is better. Sorry you'll see, the Browns are one of the best up front, if not the best. You have to admit a team that has only given up 15 sacks in 13 games and that has played Pitt 2 times as well as Balt. and NE once is pretty good. I will tell you this 2 5 of those sacks came as a result of CF holding the ball to long in the 1st game against the Steelers, since CF was replaced in the 2nd quarter of the opener the Browns have given up only 10 sacks. No The Browns O line is better and the Stats say so. The Bills O Line may be playing better now, I wouldn't Know that part but over the course of the season and as of this date the Browns are better on the line, and are better in every respect. I know this the reason the Bills have had the success they have had this year is a direct result of the play of the O line, but still the Browns O line is better..:sorry:

[Slim]

The stats say otherwise Browns 15 to Bills 23 sacks and the YPC says Browns line is better. Sorry you'll see, the Browns are one of the best up front, if not the best. You have to admit a team that has only given up 15 sacks in 13 games and that has played Pitt 2 times as well as Balt. and NE once is pretty good. I will tell you this 2 5 of those sacks came as a result of CF holding the ball to long in the 1st game against the Steelers, since CF was replaced in the 2nd quarter of the opener the Browns have given up only 10 sacks. No The Browns O line is better and the Stats say so. The Bills O Line may be playing better now, I wouldn't Know that part but over the course of the season and as of this date the Browns are better on the line, and are better in every respect. I know this the reason the Bills have had the success they have had this year is a direct result of the play of the O line, but still the Browns O line is better..:sorry:

This is a lame arguement anyways but.. If you can account some of the sacks to CF, then we can account quite a few sacks to JP holding onto the ball to long also.

[DraftBoy]

The stats say otherwise Browns 15 to Bills 23 sacks and the YPC says Browns line is better. Sorry you'll see, the Browns are one of the best up front, if not the best. You have to admit a team that has only given up 15 sacks in 13 games and that has played Pitt 2 times as well as Balt. and NE once is pretty good. I will tell you this 2 5 of those sacks came as a result of CF holding the ball to long in the 1st game against the Steelers, since CF was replaced in the 2nd quarter of the opener the Browns have given up only 10 sacks. No The Browns O line is better and the Stats say so. The Bills O Line may be playing better now, I wouldn't Know that part but over the course of the season and as of this date the Browns are better on the line, and are better in every respect. I know this the reason the Bills have had the success they have had this year is a direct result of the play of the O line, but still the Browns O line is better..:sorry:

Like I said before Im aware of the stats and what they say, if we didnt play the Pats twice our stats would be almost identical to yours. We gave up 6 sacks to the best D anybody has seen since 2000.

[Brown to the Bone]

Oh he still makes stupid ass mistakes, but his play as of late has atleast shown to me that I dont have to worry that he'll blow the game from week to week.

You must have missed the Zona game when he threw 2 picks and fumbled the ball. DA is hot and cold. He usaully starts cold and warms up as the game goes on, by the time the 2nd quarter rolls around he is usually in his comfort zone then look the hell out, but I agree consistant na not quite... But yeah he is getting there...

[DraftBoy]

You must have missed the Zona game when he threw 2 picks and fumbled the ball. DA is hot and cold. He usaully starts cold and warms up as the game goes on, by the time the 2nd quarter rolls around he is usually in his comfort zone then look the hell out, but I agree consistant na not quite... But yeah he is getting there...


Fair enough

[Brown to the Bone]

Like I said before Im aware of the stats and what they say, if we didnt play the Pats twice our stats would be almost identical to yours. We gave up 6 sacks to the best D anybody has seen since 2000.


:sorry: Pitt has the #1 D along with the Ravens at what #5 and NE at #4 now I don't know who you gave up 6 sacks too, and I don't really care we played NE once and we played Pitt and Balt 2 times each.. Sorry that don't tell me that the Bills O line is better... Unless the team you gave the sacks up to is a unknown team then who is it that you played that is better then the teams we have played? I want to agree with you but I can't !! Help me !!!

[DraftBoy]

:sorry: Pitt has the #1 D along with the Ravens at what #5 and NE at #4 now I don't know who you gave up 6 sacks too, and I don't really care we played NE once and we played Pitt and Balt 2 times each.. Sorry that don't tell me that the Bills O line is better... Unless the team you gave the sacks up to is a unknown team then who is it that you played that is better then the teams we have played? I want to agree with you but I can't !! Help me !!!

And you never will bc like alot of other posters here you cant get your eyes off of rankings and stats so you have to rely on those to tell you the story, instead of being a talent evaluator. Ive seen the Bills line grow over the course of the last few weeks and Ive watched the Browns pretty much every week also. I have issued with the right side of your line, getting Bentley back next year will do wonders. Im still giving the edge to the Bills.

[madness]

No way in hell you can be serious about the QB? Edwards has played well half a season, DA has played well the entire season, you have to give it to Cleveland just based on consistent production.

Like I said, I'm basing solely the last few games. That's more realistic then comparing what a team does now to the beginning of the season. A defense can get some players back and be playing some good ball the past three games but "according to the stats" they're only a 26th ranked defense or something to that effect. Stats mean crap unless you're looking at the big picture.

Consistent production falls into that same category. Factor in JP, TE's injury, our line play in the beginning of the season, etc. and it all balances out. We're comparing this weekend DA vs. weekend TE, not season DA vs. season TE.

[DraftBoy]

Like I said, I'm basing solely the last few games. That's more realistic then comparing what a team does now to the beginning of the season. A defense can get some players back and be playing some good ball the past three games but "according to the stats" they're only a 26th ranked defense or something to that effect. Stats mean crap unless you're looking at the big picture.

Consistent production falls into that same category. Factor in JP, TE's injury, our line play in the beginning of the season, etc. and it all balances out. We're comparing this weekend DA vs. weekend TE, not season DA vs. season TE.


Ill still take DA, one good game by TE doesnt sell him fro me, esp with our lack of weapons in the passing game.

[madness]

Ill still take DA, one good game by TE doesnt sell him fro me, esp with our lack of weapons in the passing game.

I saw two good games... Well, I'll take DA too if you're factoring in passing weapons as well. ;)

[patmoran2006]

QB -Browns
RB- maybe a push slight edge to Browns based on YPC average..
TE- Browns
WR- Browns
OL- BROWNS big TIME 15 sacks for the entire season 6 in 1st game NFL BEST
DL- BILLS Ours sucks, but has played much better lately..
LB- Depends Wimbley great, Jackson great, Davis nope, Maguinest Old, Peek OK. I would call it a push.

DB's Browns hands down
S- Browns

Special teams a wash, Cribbs is a monster, and the Bills are known for their great special teams, but do not sell the Browns short they are very solid on special teams..
I'll give ya the OL, but your out of your mind if you say Lewis is an edge over Lynch/Jackson

[THATHURMANATOR]

Sure anything is possible. Yeah they have a chance thats why they play the game, and thats what makes it so much fun to watch. Hell if I knew the outcome, I wouldn't bother watching.

The Browns have their weaknesses to be sure they do, but they are a team that is beginning to put it all together. Their defense was pretty bad to start the year and they still have issues, but they honest to God have begun to play some pretty good ball over the last month. And the offense is well lets put it this way the offense is about to set new team records for points in a season, DA will own the TD team record as well as the yardage record. The Browns O line has given up the least number of sacks of any team in the NFL 15 and 6 of those came in the 1st game. It's hard not to like this group they truly are special.

But do the Bills have a chance yes they do. Their chance is this they need not try to rush DA, truthfully the O line in Cleveland is well awesome. They pick up the blitz as well as any team in the NFL, and DA kills teams when they blitz. In the Pitt game the Steelers Blitzed like they always do in the 1st half and DA killed them. Then in the second half they never blitzed not once and DA had a hard time adjusting to the LB ers dropping into coverage and although it was there for the taking he couldn't throw a short dump off pass to save his life. What the Steelers did was they took away BE and K2 by double and triple teaming them and gave DA the underneath stuff, he didn't adjust well. That said he has shown marked improvement in this area, and now is operating pretty good when teams drop back and double and triple up. Beware the playaction...

The way the Bills beat the Browns though is to get DA to do it for them, easier said then done, but he has his moments and the Bills will need to take every advantage should they get the chance, otherwise I see the Browns winning this one easy. I see the Bilis winning this one is if DA turns the ball over more then 2 times, its happened this season but not at home... Good luck, with that.. Honestly Good luck
Very fair assesment. I agree with pretty much everything here, although I think the two teams might be closer than you give the Bills credit, adding the blizzard it may slow down the Browns O a bit. That being said I predict a Browns victory.

[THATHURMANATOR]

I'll give ya the OL, but your out of your mind if you say Lewis is an edge over Lynch/Jackson
Yeah I don't agree with that either. Equal at least.

[Brown to the Bone]

I'll give ya the OL, but your out of your mind if you say Lewis is an edge over Lynch/Jackson

Sorry you can look... On less carries Lewis has more yardage and a better YPC average over the course of the season. I realize that Lynch is a pass catching threat, and Lewis for the 1st time in his career is being used in this manner as well in fact he has 2 catches (I think) for TD's this season and actually has a pretty good set of hands. But I understand that you THINK that lynch is better, and truthfully I am not sure what the numbers show for him and Lewis in the passing game, but in the running game Lewis is the better back based on the numbers. If Lynch is truly a better Running Back then the numbers should show it, or at least I would think so anyway. Unless you have something other then your opinion to back that up with I think, and the numbers say I am correct, and you only think Lynch is better. Reality says otherwise.

[Crisis]

the numbers dont mean anything.

stats are for nerds on message boards to argue with.

lynch is a better back than lewis

[Brown to the Bone]

Guy thats like sticking out your tongue and saying it aint so, please besides sticking out your tongue you have nothing to back it up with. Saying that Lynch is the better back doesn't make it so. And sticking out your tongue doesn't make it so either. Sorry nothing says that Lynch is better, NOTHING....:sorry:

[Brown to the Bone]

the numbers dont mean anything.

stats are for nerds on message boards to argue with.

lynch is a better back than lewis

Here you go lets compare:

Jamal Lewis
921 yards on 218 carries 4.2 yards per attempt with 9 TD's
Recieving stats
23 for 194 Yards 8.4 Yards per catch with 2 TD's

Marshawn Lynch
858 yards on 219 carries 3.9 yards per attempt with 6 TD's
Recieving stats
15 Rec. for 120 Yards 8.0 Yards per catch with 0 TD's

Now Stats are for nerds, yup sure are, and homerism is for people that don't know squat about football. The facts are the facts, I have tried to show you that your preception that ML is better then JL is wrong, and I have offered the one thing to you that proves that I am right and you are wrong. Your opinion to the side what do you have that would lead me to believe that you are right and I am wrong. If you can offer up one piece of tangable evidence that ML is better I will agree with you. Until then it is as clear as day JL is better.... And I proved it in the only way you can prove it, by the numbers.


:sorry:

[patmoran2006]

Here you go lets compare:

Jamal Lewis
921 yards on 218 carries 4.2 yards per attempt with 9 TD's
Recieving stats
23 for 194 Yards 8.4 Yards per catch with 2 TD's

Marshawn Lynch
858 yards on 219 carries 3.9 yards per attempt with 6 TD's
Recieving stats
15 Rec. for 120 Yards 8.0 Yards per catch with 0 TD's

Now Stats are for nerds, yup sure are, and homerism is for people that don't know squat about football. The facts are the facts, I have tried to show you that your preception that ML is better then JL is wrong, and I have offered the one thing to you that proves that I am right and you are wrong. Your opinion to the side what do you have that would lead me to believe that you are right and I am wrong. If you can offer up one piece of tangable evidence that ML is better I will agree with you. Until then it is as clear as day JL is better.... And I proved it in the only way you can prove it, by the numbers.


:sorry:
It's easy to have good numbers when you play on a team that defensive coordinators **** themselves over the passing game.

Look at Edge's stats with Indy compared to Arizona. C'mon now.

Lewis, while admittedly has had a very good comeback season, also gets the huge benefit of playing on an offense that features a great QB, one of the best WR tandems in football and an elite TE.

Marshawn Lynch meanwhile, has played an offense that spent most of the season on the pitiful side; where D.C.'s could pretty much bring 8 guys in the box consistently. It's not like JP Losman or at times Trent Edwards was going to beat teams with the passing game.

If Lynch played behind the Browns offense he'd probably lead the AFC in rushing. Actually, if he didnt miss 3 games he may have been doing that anyway.

[Mitchy moo]

Lets also add in the fact the ML is a rookie and learning and Lewis has been there. There is alot more to come from ML!

[HAMMER]

Who cares, let them strap em on and go, then we'll see. You guys act like you're 12.