2007 buffalo bills season break down pertaining to QB play

[djjimkelly]

Now this isn’t going to be a simple analysis of opinion or of simple wins and losses. I am going to attempt to break down the bills season through pure numbers it will relate to wins and losses by us and of our opponents.

This analysis will break down each QB and Defense did in certain circumstances. And then correlate them to each other. This will not take into account any injuries.

This analysis will be purely performance based on yardage and turnovers.

Any game both appeared in will not be considered I will be nice to both qbs in not calling game vs the pats as either their responsibility even though I would deem it as a trent start he did not practice as the starter not fair for analysis. The second jets game also was basically won by JP in the 4th quarter I will give no one credit for this game.

One other thing must be added OUR O regardless of qb has not given up points because of an interception or fumble

ALL FG’s considered product of the O

JP’s starts 6 of them

TOTAL O = 271 per game or 1626 in 6 games

TOTAL D = 397.3 per game or 2384 in 6 games

GIVEAWAYS 8total 6 picks 2 fumbles or 1.33 per game

TAKEAWAYS 4 total or 0.66 per game

TOTAL points 87 points 7 scored on a punt return D scored 0

TOTAL allowed 144

AVERAGE D THAT HE FACE 14.6 ranked

AVERAGE O OUR D FACED 11.5 ranked

Record 2-4

Opponents record 45-39 .536 3 playoff teams faced


Trent’s starts 6 of them

TOTAL O = 292.1 per game or 1753 in 6 games

TOTAL D = 319..3 per game or 1916 in 6 games

GIVEAWAYS 3 picks 2 fumbles or 0.83 per game

TAKEAWAYS 16 total or 2.66 per game

TOTAL points 115 D scored 28 special teams 0

TOTAL ALLOWED 94

AVERAGE D THAT HE FACE 17 ranked

AVERAGE O OUR D FACED 17.6 ranked

Record 4-2

Opponents record 36-48 .428 2 playoff teams faced


So all in all this analysis should show one thing both qbs basically have same result !

They lose to playoff caliber teams and beat the bottom feeders of the league.

Trent has played a much easier schedule then JP did. And JP is this coaching staffs whipping boy for their complete lack of coaching skill.

My cursing of trent has been to be simple as an offset to the constant JP bashing that went on here for last couple years. it makes it easier as i am not high on his overall potential

The truth is currently there isn’t much a difference between the 2. their strengths and weaknesses are different as can be.

JP played better in 2006 then trent has at ANY POINT THIS SEASON

JP’s short game is not as bad most would like to believe

Trents deep ball isn’t as bad as most would like to believe.

Which one do I think has the upside JP

I think trent is a backup type im pretty positive I wont be wrong a Kyle Orton type nothing wrong with that on our bench

Why have I been cursing coaches all year and calling for a new qb to be drafted because I want the bills to be elite to mean something I do know this staff seems to not want JP as I believe they didn’t draft him so why bother this is todays NFL
you go down with the girl you like not what the other GM liked

GO BILLS

[YardRat]

Wow.

I knew the team played better with Trent under center, but I didn't realize it was that much of a disparity.

[HHURRICANE]

Good post. Obviously Trent is the better QB. Hopefully we'll get him a big #2 in the off-season.

[djjimkelly]

Wow.

I knew the team played better with Trent under center, but I didn't realize it was that much of a disparity.


do u mean the defense take a look at the avg ranked O our D played in games trent started in comparison to JP's starts

take a serious look at takeaways QB doesnt effect that stat. D has been on in trents starts but i think that has alot to do with quality of opponent played

both qbs IMO have been good not giving ball away

[djjimkelly]

Good post. Obviously Trent is the better QB. Hopefully we'll get him a big #2 in the off-season.


not trying to fight how is trent the much better qb when our D played better in his games.

and

JP played against much more difficult defenses

they are basically the same IMO

20 yards per game as an O difference is nothing

the 90 extra our D gave up in JP starts is alarming but that goes to how solid the teams he played agst where

[Billzz]

Wow Trent really shows how a NFL caliber QB looks in your stats. Thanks for the quality stat info DJm it has been great reading!

[djjimkelly]

nobody interested in facts once again

go figure

[MikeInRoch]

So all in all this analysis should show one thing both qbs basically have same result !

And this is why people bash JP. If a ROOKIE can come in and do the same job as you, then you are a failure as a third year QB.

[Crisis]

Great posts.

The stats really show that Trent was a much better option than JP.

Good research.

[djjimkelly]

Great posts.

The stats really show that Trent was a much better option than JP.

Good research.


so trent made the D take the ball away better.

trent made marshawn and jackson both break 100 yards vs the dolphins.

i think these stats actually show JP played much better competition then wasnt allowed to play vs the weaker teams.

i think what these stats show the most is the our coaching staff cant beat a decent team regardless of QB

dont be surprised when its JP and trent in camp battling to be the qb in 2008

[BillsNick]

:blah:

[djjimkelly]

our D played like **** with JP in game agst superior opponents

our D actually took ball away agst the weaker teams.

the O scores less with trent but read them your way lol

[Crisis]

:bf1:

You're right.

Trent is just that damn good. Your stats prove it.

GO BILLS!!

[Devin]

Wow the team seems to really rally around Trent!

[Mr. Pink]

Good job on the analysis...too bad you can't figure out what it means. Or you can't figure out that with better offensive play, you in turn get better defensive play.

Hence, it's obvious the team plays better under Trent than it does under Loseman.

Hold the ball longer you get more yards and keep the ball away from the other teams offense. When the other team has the ball less they get less yards. Also the defense isn't as tired so they can make more plays. Hence why the turnovers are up.

When you fully understand the game of football someday, you'll see the stats you've posted is exactly why JP is done as an NFL QB and that moving forward with Trent was the right move for the bettermint of the franchise.

[Ingtar33]

dude.

look at jp's stats last year, and this year. they're basically identical... in the amount of negative plays per drop-back.

ints/sacks/fumbles

he gives a neg play once every 7.95 times he drops back. that's insane.

trent gives one once every 14.2 dropbacks. thats payton manning territory (1 neg play in 13.65 dropbacks in 2007 for payton manning).

you know basically their stats this year were pretty close to identical... and both were pretty much mediocre. but i think 2 points in the end are all that matter...

1) negative plays per dropback
2) a 4th year player played as well, or worse then a rookie.


*stat breakdown

JP Losman 2007 -
175 attempts (2 fumbles + 6 ints + 14 sacks = 22 neg plays) = 1 neg play per 7.95 dropbacks

Trent Edwards 2007 -
213 attempts (1 fumbles + 5 ints + 9 sacks = 15 neg plays) = 1 neg play per 14.2 dropbacks

Payton Manning 2007 -
464 attempts (0 Fumbles + 14 ints + 20 sacks = 34 neg plays) = 1 neg play per 13.65 dropbacks


JP Losman 2006 -
429 attempts (6 fumbles + 14 ints + 47 sacks = 67 neg plays) = 1 neg play per 6.40 dropbacks

[Ebenezer]

I'm going with Ing on this one.

[jamze132]

Good post. Obviously Trent is the better QB. Hopefully we'll get him a big #2 in the off-season.
And a TE.

[jamze132]

I don't know how anyone can say that JP has more upside or is better than Trent. The rookie played better for the most part than the veteran. I'm sticking with the rook. And I don't remember too many glowing endorsements of JP from Bills Walsh.

[Mr. Pink]

I don't know how anyone can say that JP has more upside or is better than Trent. The rookie played better for the most part than the veteran. I'm sticking with the rook. And I don't remember too many glowing endorsements of JP from Bills Walsh.

I won't diss Edwards because for the most part I like what I see out of him, but Bill Walsh gave a glowing endorsement for Jim Druckenmiller too. That one didn't work out so well.

[djjimkelly]

once again lol i find it funny how people seem to think defense took ball away from opponents better with trent in game.

its cooincidence


if u want to believe trent edwards made the dolphins turn ball over 7 times in orchard park or trent edwards made romo throw 5 picks all power too you.

i wont live in dream world.

id say theres about 10 super trent homers on the board that skew the way the board looks and what is even funnier a bunch of newbies posting pro trent too.

i think its the same people making multiple names to pimp trent

[LtBillsFan66]

So all in all this analysis should show one thing both qbs basically have same result !

GO BILLS

Great analysis! So clearly what you're saying is a rookie QB is playing the same if not better than a 4th year vet.

[jamze132]

I won't diss Edwards because for the most part I like what I see out of him, but Bill Walsh gave a glowing endorsement for Jim Druckenmiller too. That one didn't work out so well.
But JP never got one at all...

lol

[Billzz]

I keep getting Negged on this thread this is funny. Obviously people just do not see sarcasm on the internet and this running joke of a thread.

I keep reading the posts and cracking up though so it is a great thread IMO. Djjim just doesn't seem the humor in it though, too bad.

[hydro]

once again lol i find it funny how people seem to think defense took ball away from opponents better with trent in game.

its cooincidence


if u want to believe trent edwards made the dolphins turn ball over 7 times in orchard park or trent edwards made romo throw 5 picks all power too you.

i wont live in dream world.

id say theres about 10 super trent homers on the board that skew the way the board looks and what is even funnier a bunch of newbies posting pro trent too.

i think its the same people making multiple names to pimp trent

And for you to say that the better QB play had nothing to do with how well the defense played is just asinine. I will refrain from trying to talk some sense into you as it will only be a waste of bandwidth.

[trapezeus]

Where is the stat on the number of 3 and outs each QB went and the TOP battle? I wonder if those things help the defense play better?

A rookie who would have been given a pass vs the patriots, played much better than a guy who was playing for his career. JP performs ok in that game (not win, but just ok) and he remains a viable starter throughout the league. that game and the Jags game makes him nothing more than a journey man.

[Billzz]

Where is the stat on the number of 3 and outs each QB went and the TOP battle? I wonder if those things help the defense play better?

A rookie who would have been given a pass vs the patriots, played much better than a guy who was playing for his career. JP performs ok in that game (not win, but just ok) and he remains a viable starter throughout the league. that game and the Jags game makes him nothing more than a journey man.

Good points, but the fact still remains this is a useless stat driven thread that equates to nothing but somone trying to prove a point in his favor and failed, miserable failure.

[djjimkelly]

Where is the stat on the number of 3 and outs each QB went and the TOP battle? I wonder if those things help the defense play better?

A rookie who would have been given a pass vs the patriots, played much better than a guy who was playing for his career. JP performs ok in that game (not win, but just ok) and he remains a viable starter throughout the league. that game and the Jags game makes him nothing more than a journey man.


ill bring that stat out dont be so sure trent dont have more of them he started 3 and 5 times vs the browns last week

altough i think alot of the bills 3 and outs this season have to do with run for -2 run for 1 then pass in 3rd and 11 regardless of qb.

[mchurchfie]

Great analysis! So clearly what you're saying is a rookie QB is playing the same if not better than a 4th year vet.
:bf1:

[mchurchfie]

id say theres about 10 super trent homers on the board that skew the way the board looks and what is even funnier a bunch of newbies posting pro trent too.

i think its the same people making multiple names to pimp trent
They're just trying to offset the Trent haters.;)

[EDS]

Anyone have the time of possession stats for TE vs. JP?

[hydro]

I was bored so I ran through NFL.com for TOP for each of the 12 games in question (Excluding second jets game and first NE game)

JP Losman:
Broncos- 26.48
Steelers- 24.33
Bengals- 35.42
Dolphins- 23.01
Pats- 25.06
Jags- 30.45

For a grand total of ~166
Average TOP: 27.4


Trent Edwards:
Jets- 32.16
Cowboys- 32.31
Ravens- 31.26
Redskins- 27.04
Dolphins- 30.30
Browns- 28.13

For a grand total of ~182
Average TOP: 30.2

[justasportsfan]

And for you to say that the better QB play had nothing to do with how well the defense played is just asinine. I will refrain from trying to talk some sense into you as it will only be a waste of bandwidth.


Yeah, our D got ran over for 150+ yards against the browns. I guess that was Trents fault then or is that the snows?

[justasportsfan]

I was bored so I ran through NFL.com for TOP for each of the 12 games in question (Excluding second jets game and first NE game)

JP Losman:
Broncos- 26.48
Steelers- 24.33
Bengals- 35.42
Dolphins- 23.01
Pats- 25.06
Jags- 30.45

For a grand total of ~166
Average TOP: 27.4


Trent Edwards:
Jets- 32.16
Cowboys- 32.31
Ravens- 31.26
Redskins- 27.04
Dolphins- 30.30
Browns- 28.13

For a grand total of ~182
Average TOP: 30.2that TOP means nothing.

JP barely took time of the clock when he scored 10 points in a little over 1 qtr. against the jets. How did that affect the D? It didn't we still won. Your data does not prove anything.

[hydro]

Yeah, our D got ran over for 150+ yards against the browns. I guess that was Trents fault then or is that the snows?

You do a really good job of twisting things for your own agenda, ill give you that.

But no i don't blame every single yard on from the opposing offense on our QB, but to think that an offense controlling the TOP and not giving up turnovers doesn't help the defense is just pure ignorance.

[hydro]

that TOP means nothing.

JP barely took time of the clock when he scored 10 points in a little over 1 qtr. against the jets. How did that affect the D? It didn't we still won. Your data does not prove anything.

Calm down sportsfan, don't get in a tizzy about this post as it was only a simple request from EDS. I didn't include any hate mongering about your boy JP, just stated what he wanted.

[Billzz]

You do a really good job of twisting things for your own agenda, ill give you that.

But no i don't blame every single yard on from the opposing offense on our QB, but to think that an offense controlling the TOP and not giving up turnovers doesn't help the defense is just pure ignorance.

Well that is the problem with posting pure stats, they are easily changed to benefit your opinion. That is not a knock on Justa just what stats in general have a tendency to do.

That being said, it makes it really hard for the other team to score when you have ball which is something we all can agree with, no doubt. TOP is an underated item and something I always preach when coaching youth football.

[EDS]

that TOP means nothing.

JP barely took time of the clock when he scored 10 points in a little over 1 qtr. against the jets. How did that affect the D? It didn't we still won. Your data does not prove anything.


Relax dude. I asked the question. You obviously read something into it for some reason.

[justasportsfan]

You do a really good job of twisting things for your own agenda, ill give you that..you did just that. Look in the mirror.
Denver played us at the best possible time. When our OL was horrible. Pitts? No. 1 D in the league. You cannot compare one game from the other. Different team , different players.

You want to compare games, go with the one where they both played. Jets game. 10 points 1qtr vs. 3 pts. 3 qtrs.

You can't grab a bunch of different games and then compare TOP and then expect accurate data. Thats assanine.


but to think that an offense controlling the TOP and not giving up turnovers doesn't help the defense is just pure ignorance.
I never said denied that. The problem is you grabbing a list of games that helps your argumen and then leave out the other facts. That's the wysian way.




When Trent is in there the gameplan is different. You cannot expect to come up with an accurate data. Trent is made to play conservatively when he is th4e qb. It isn't the same case with JP.

[justasportsfan]

Calm down sportsfan, don't get in a tizzy about this post as it was only a simple request from EDS. I didn't include any hate mongering about your boy JP, just stated what he wanted.
I am calmed down. My posts weren't in caps or full of !!!!!! were they? ;)

[justasportsfan]

Relax dude. I asked the question. You obviously read something into it for some reason.
I am relaxed EDS, just replying to his post. Didn't mean for it to sound pissy.

[yordad]

I find this very interesting. They are pretty close. But, what I find interesting is that everyone reads it and says "Wow TE is sooo much better then JP."

That has me scratching my head. They seemed to have done pretty similar. Most seem to argue "Yeah, they are similar, so you give the edge to the rookie". I would argue, "Yeah, they seem similar, so you give the edge to the one that has had the offense tailored to his faults".

I mean, we are losing our offensive coach. Hopefully we bring in someone who can design a game plan to the players strengths. That way we can start our strongest players. As opposed to designing a game play and starting the players that fit it, strongest or not.

[trapezeus]

that TOP means nothing.

JP barely took time of the clock when he scored 10 points in a little over 1 qtr. against the jets. How did that affect the D? It didn't we still won. Your data does not prove anything.

exactly, jp is hit or miss. it's either one hailmary that connects and you got points, or its 3 incompletions and a rattled JP who won't be able to adjust to anything.

JP isn't a bright football player and it can be argued that coaches messed him up. Trent is in the same pathetic system, but seems to be able to work within what he's given.

[justasportsfan]

exactly, jp is hit or miss. it's either one hailmary that connects and you got points, or its 3 incompletions and a rattled JP who won't be able to adjust to anything.

JP isn't a bright football player and it can be argued that coaches messed him up. Trent is in the same pathetic system, but seems to be able to work within what he's given.


Considering who's calling the shots from the sidelines, I'll have to wait and see when JP plays for another team. In my mind it wasn't the players. It was Fairchild. From JP to Evans to Nuefeld. Every player was put in a sitaution to fail. NO wonder why they called him out more than one ocassion. Even Whitner , a MArv high character player.

In time we shall see.

[HHURRICANE]

exactly, jp is hit or miss. it's either one hailmary that connects and you got points, or its 3 incompletions and a rattled JP who won't be able to adjust to anything.

JP isn't a bright football player and it can be argued that coaches messed him up. Trent is in the same pathetic system, but seems to be able to work within what he's given.

Very good post. A player like JP has limited options. Mark Rypen comes to mind but he essentially played on a team that had strength at every single position on both sides of the ball.

Unless JP is going to the 1992 Redskins there are very few teams he can help including this one.

Trent is a rookie, has played intelligently, and runs the offense with alot of confidence. Jason Peters and Dockery were chest bumping him in Maimi after his TD throw. The teams responds better and it shows.

Hopefully with some better options and coaching things will be even better.

[justasportsfan]

Very good post. A player like JP has limited options..

Under Fairchild, every player has limited options. Fairchild is like a disability.

[Philagape]

Very good post. A player like JP has limited options. Mark Rypen comes to mind but he essentially played on a team that had strength at every single position on both sides of the ball.

Unless JP is going to the 1992 Redskins there are very few teams he can help including this one.

Trent is a rookie, has played intelligently, and runs the offense with alot of confidence. Jason Peters and Dockery were chest bumping him in Maimi after his TD throw. The teams responds better and it shows.

Hopefully with some better options and coaching things will be even better.

Like I've said before, JP is a high-maintenance QB. His strengths are so limited that it would take a very narrowly tailored offense to bring out the best in him. Such an offense would be limiting and unfair to anyone else on it and easy to figure out by defenses. Basically, any offense that makes JP throw the ball will get in trouble sooner or later.
We're better off now because Trent is more versatile. He can throw short, medium and long, stay in the pocket or run, and makes better use of the whole field. He has more mental command of the same offense as a rookie than JP, who's had two years in it. Like you said, he could use better play-calling and better weapons, but he can do more with them.

[streetkings01]

So all in all this analysis should show one thing both qbs basically have same result !

The truth is currently there isn’t much a difference between the 2. their strengths and weaknesses are different as can be.

Which one do I think has the upside JP

So if 1 QB has less experience and is younger than the older QB and they are equal in production, why would the older one have more upside? It took the older QB 4 years to get to where is now in his development, but it took the rookie only 7 games to match it! You made JP look worse than he already is with this thread IMO

[helmetguy]

After reading three pages of this ****, I wonder if the original poster was as dilligent in defending Bledsoe? JP ain't nothin' more than Bledsoe with faster feet.

[trapezeus]

Under Fairchild, every player has limited options. Fairchild is like a disability.

I'll agree to that statement. however, what i am saying is that JP needs an OC to show his who his second and third receivers are. He needs coaching to tell him when the pocket will collapse, when to go to option B and C.

Trent doesn't really need that coaching. He sees the field and makes decisions on his own. he's just hampered by the fact that the plays are very limited and that only having 2 or 3 run formations drags the run game down.

Switching OC's next year will be a challenge, but i think of the two Trent can adjust better and quicker.

I like trent, but i think they'll need a veteran to challenge for the starting job and to push him faster.

[djjimkelly]

So if 1 QB has less experience and is younger than the older QB and they are equal in production, why would the older one have more upside? It took the older QB 4 years to get to where is now in his development, but it took the rookie only 7 games to match it! You made JP look worse than he already is with this thread IMO



like i said go look at the numbers and the look at quality of the defenses JP faced then look at quality of defense trent faced

JP's completion % is better more big plays and so on.

had our D avged the same takeaways in JP's starts as they did in trents starts the numbers wouldnt be close

[djjimkelly]

I'll agree to that statement. however, what i am saying is that JP needs an OC to show his who his second and third receivers are. He needs coaching to tell him when the pocket will collapse, when to go to option B and C.

Trent doesn't really need that coaching. He sees the field and makes decisions on his own. he's just hampered by the fact that the plays are very limited and that only having 2 or 3 run formations drags the run game down.

Switching OC's next year will be a challenge, but i think of the two Trent can adjust better and quicker.

I like trent, but i think they'll need a veteran to challenge for the starting job and to push him faster.


ill disagree with this analysis lots of qbs start to struggle once D coordinators have film of what a qb likes to do. if you listen to serious radio pat kirwan preaches once teams have about 5 game films to watch on a qb thats when they start specific gameplanning.

its no cooicidence trents completion % has gone downhill over the last couple starts. and anyone who uses the weather last week as an excuse go look how balls werent close. and i truly mean not even close. yes the receivers dropped about 3-4 balls its still doesnt bring him close to 50%

[trapezeus]

i don't understand why the JP supporters always want to make a big deal about long bomb plays. even when JP is on, he doesn't hit more than 2 of those a game. A QB who actually keeps the chains moving is much better in the long term.

Trent's % has not gone way downhill because of defenses game planning him any different. he's been a bit inaccurate. however, he makes the plays when they are needed. When plays are needed from JP, he's hiding underneath his bed.

[djjimkelly]

After reading three pages of this ****, I wonder if the original poster was as dilligent in defending Bledsoe? JP ain't nothin' more than Bledsoe with faster feet.


actually the orignal poster was not a bledsoe fan from day 1 becuz of the fact he had zero mobility. and our o line was not set up for him to succeed.

now 2003 bledsoe behind todays O LIne i might be a fan of that

[djjimkelly]

exactly, jp is hit or miss. it's either one hailmary that connects and you got points, or its 3 incompletions and a rattled JP who won't be able to adjust to anything.

JP isn't a bright football player and it can be argued that coaches messed him up. Trent is in the same pathetic system, but seems to be able to work within what he's given.


yet JP's completion % is higher

[djjimkelly]

And for you to say that the better QB play had nothing to do with how well the defense played is just asinine. I will refrain from trying to talk some sense into you as it will only be a waste of bandwidth.


please enlighten me!

you are saying in the patriots game 2 in buffalo. if trent was the qb our D wouldnt have allowed the pats to score on every drive.

and game vs the jags please enlighten me how if trent was starting we wouldnt have had 12 men on the field on the very first drive of the game and then not alllowed taylor to break a 50+ yard run.

and then somehow we have magically taken the ball away.

please i am so asinine that i dont get this concept please explain why trent starting the game vs the pats or the jags game would have made our D not allow a score on every drive vs the pats or made coaches have 11 on field for that punt.

[djjimkelly]

You do a really good job of twisting things for your own agenda, ill give you that.

But no i don't blame every single yard on from the opposing offense on our QB, but to think that an offense controlling the TOP and not giving up turnovers doesn't help the defense is just pure ignorance.


neither qb truly gave ball away this season and we dont fumble as a team maybe that is one thing i can give jauron credit for the non fumbling.

[hydro]

please enlighten me!

you are saying in the patriots game 2 in buffalo. if trent was the qb our D wouldnt have allowed the pats to score on every drive.

and game vs the jags please enlighten me how if trent was starting we wouldnt have had 12 men on the field on the very first drive of the game and then not alllowed taylor to break a 50+ yard run.

and then somehow we have magically taken the ball away.

please i am so asinine that i dont get this concept please explain why trent starting the game vs the pats or the jags game would have made our D not allow a score on every drive vs the pats or made coaches have 11 on field for that punt.

I was talking in generalities, not specific events. I know the defense isn't soley based one the production of the QB, but if the QB does what he is supposed like controlling the TOP and not giving up the ball, that will no doubt help the defense with not being on the field as much.

As for the Pats game, we were just totally outmatched by better players. Peyton Manning couldn't have won us that game, so using that game to justify your point doesn't work.

Obviously QB play would have no effect on the first series of the game. Where did I say that was true? NOWHERE! You just assume that because I think the QB play effects the effectivness of the defense. I'll agree that it doesn't make a huge difference, for instance in games like the second Pats massacre, but in close games it could make a world of difference.

[justasportsfan]

I'll agree to that statement. however, what i am saying is that JP needs an OC to show his who his second and third receivers are. He needs coaching to tell him when the pocket will collapse, when to go to option B and C.

.
He needs a coach who can show him how to use his mobility. Not one that forces him to stay in the pocket. JP is in a lot of ways like Drew Bledsoe. They look for the big plays . When its taken away, he could either dink it (not their strength) or take off with it ALA Flutie. NOtice when it's a busted play, JP makes throws on the run and they usually hit their targets.


Problem is our brainless OC forces him to stay in the pocket no matter what. Fairchild loves to babysitt his qb's instead of letting them just play the game. If he stayed here, Trent would've busted too.

[hydro]

He needs a coach who can show him how to use his mobility. Not one that forces him to stay in the pocket. JP is in a lot of ways like Drew Bledsoe. They look for the big plays . When its taken away, he could either dink it (not their strength) or take off with it ALA Flutie. NOtice when it's a busted play, JP makes throws on the run and they usually hit their targets.


Problem is our brainless OC forces him to stay in the pocket no matter what. Fairchild loves to babysitt his qb's instead of letting them just play the game. If he stayed here, Trent would've busted too.

You are pretty good at convincing us that we shouldn't have automatically assumed JP was sulking and not conversing with the QB that took his position, yet you seem to know so much about the internal workings of Fairchilds mind. Are you telepathic?

[justasportsfan]

i don't understand why the JP supporters always want to make a big deal about long bomb plays. even when JP is on, he doesn't hit more than 2 of those a game. A QB who actually keeps the chains moving is much better in the long term..JP could've been Flutie with an arm.



Trent's % has not gone way downhill because of defenses game planning him any different. he's been a bit inaccurate. however, he makes the plays when they are needed. When plays are needed from JP, he's hiding underneath his bed.

He's been nothing more than a younger Holcomb with an arm with ton of POTENTIAL to be AS GOOD or better than KH.

[justasportsfan]

You are pretty good at convincing us that we shouldn't have automatically assumed JP was sulking and not conversing with the QB that took his position, yet you seem to know so much about the internal workings of Fairchilds mind. Are you telepathic?
Even PAt Moran said that no one talks to JP. THen he changed his mind last year. Now you guys are back to it.


Guess what , after Trent threw a TD to Evans in the fins game, Evans was seated beside Trent but they weren't talking. You telepathic fans can make assumptions all you want about that.



Are you telepathic?
no I see the results on the field. Are you blind?

[hydro]

no I see the results on the field. Are you blind?
No i just don't always like to assume, like you have told us on the JP sulking dilemma.


Fairchild loves to babysitt his qb's instead of letting them just play the game.
There is a lot of assumption in this sentence. How do you know everything they do is a direct result of Fairchild telling them? Could it be that you assume JP wants to run but fairchild "doesn't let him"? What is he yelling at him through the speaker in his helmet?

[justasportsfan]

No i just don't always like to assume, like you have told us on the JP sulking dilemma.?
what did I say about the JP sulking dilemna. Please refresh my mind.



There is a lot of assumption in this sentence. How do you know everything they do is a direct result of Fairchild telling them? Could it be that you assume JP wants to run but fairchild "doesn't let him"? What is he yelling at him through the speaker in his helmet?


Everyone that's ever been at camp knows that even when JP is sacked (not touched of course) , Fairchild makes him finish out the plays.

Unlike Moolarkey era where JP's is allowed to take off and avoid the sack. It's common knowledge to those who are regular camp visiotrs.

In 2005 he rushed for 194 yds in 9 games. Last year he rushed for less in 16 games. There's proof he's made to stay in the pocket. While I would've wanted him to stay in there, he should've been allowed to at least take off instead of taking sack after sack with a crappy Ol since he's been here.

[hydro]

what did I say about the JP sulking dilemna. Please refresh my mind.

Through out this whole thread you assume JP didn't sulk because no one said he did.

http://www.billszone.com/fanzone/showthread.php?t=140898

But you assume Fairchild tells his QBs not to use there legs yet there hasn't been any word of this that I have heard of.

[trapezeus]

Edwards with the potential to be Holcomb? Seriously? I think that's lame, Justa. he is already ahead of holcomb by beating out JP. He has longer range, and is more athletic when he scrambles. statements like that make you lose some of the leverage you have as the intelligent JP supporter on this board.

[justasportsfan]

Through out this whole thread you assume JP didn't sulk because no one said he did.

http://www.billszone.com/fanzone/showthread.php?t=140898

But you assume Fairchild tells his QBs not to use there legs yet there hasn't been any word of this that I have heard of. And you heard words spoken from the TV when you think you saw JP sulking? NO. But you can make assumptions based on that?

At least I have stats to show that I might be right. Pardon me if I don't trust your telepathy.


Everyone that's ever been at camp knows that even when JP is sacked (not touched of course) , Fairchild makes him finish out the plays.

Unlike Moolarkey era where JP's is allowed to take off and avoid the sack. It's common knowledge to those who are regular camp visiotrs.

In 2005 he rushed for 194 yds in 9 games. Last year he rushed for less in 16 games. There's proof he's made to stay in the pocket. While I would've wanted him to stay in there, he should've been allowed to at least take off instead of taking sack after sack with a crappy Ol since he's been here..



Guess what , after Trent threw a TD to Evans in the fins game, Evans was seated beside Trent but they weren't talking. .
I could've made assumptions that Trent and Evans don't like each other based on what I saw in TV plus what Evans has said publicly during the qb contorvery but I won't. Because unlike you guys, I don't have telepathy.

[Billzz]

Justa JP could of never been Flutie with an arm unless you are just refering to physical ability. Flutie was a gamer and winner with a Atype personality. He was a proven field general that put teams on his back and just won in desperate situations.

JP on the other hand I really thnk hasn't had enough winning to know the feeling or a well to draw from during down times. Even his college career was based on running for his life and making things happen. He may be a fantastic type to make something good out of something bad against college talent, but at the NFL level he took way too many sacks or got picked off doing the same thing.