Is it fair to say...

[The King]

Is it fair to say we were just out played on Sunday? Cleveland wanted it more they played with more desperation and it paid off.

Seemed like Edwards wanted the ball more than Evans or Reed did. I think considering the conditions our corners exceeded my expectations.

I dont think Andersons passes looked all that more accurate than Trents they both had a lot of miscues and the ball seemed to be sailing on both of them. A big difference was the size of Clevelands recievers and their ability to catch and hold onto the ball.

I agree with many... this team should be practicing outside a lot.... like 2-3 times a week. We have a RB from Cal a QB who has no bad weather experience the best chance we wouldve had is to be prepared. And we weren't. Hopefully we learned from this and this is not a mistake that is repeated.

[LtFinFan66]

It's fair to say but won't be agreed with. Op, you awake yet??

[casdhf]

Trent was terrible until the last drive.

[Bone]

Are D line was getting man handled all game, looked like we played scared...

[madness]

They looked like a young team that has no experience in harsh conditions.

[Mahdi]

Is it fair to say we were just out played on Sunday? Cleveland wanted it more they played with more desperation and it paid off.

Seemed like Edwards wanted the ball more than Evans or Reed did. I think considering the conditions our corners exceeded my expectations.

I dont think Andersons passes looked all that more accurate than Trents they both had a lot of miscues and the ball seemed to be sailing on both of them. A big difference was the size of Clevelands recievers and their ability to catch and hold onto the ball.

I agree with many... this team should be practicing outside a lot.... like 2-3 times a week. We have a RB from Cal a QB who has no bad weather experience the best chance we wouldve had is to be prepared. And we weren't. Hopefully we learned from this and this is not a mistake that is repeated.
Very fair to say..... they are just better than we are offensively and thats why they won the game. Defensively we are better than they are but the weather put their D on par with ours. Therefore everything depended on play-makers and they have more than we do and have a balanced offense which we dont have.

Anderson, Lewis, Braylon, Jurevicious, Winslow>>>>> Edwards, Lynch, Evans, Reed, Royal.

Its that simple IMO.

[ghz in pittsburgh]

Donte Witner said after the game - "We'll remember this game for a long time." That probably speaked for the whole team, all those wide eyed 1st & 2nd year players that this Bills team are filled with, and probably for players like Shoebel who never experienced a playoff.

On a team with very few warriors who have gone through it all before, Sunday's game and result is often a necessity. If Jauron and Co. handle it right, that was a great a team maturing experience. I really look forward to a 9-7 finish this year so the players will look back at this game all off-season to understand what it takes to be a playoff team.

[justasportsfan]

It's fair to say we got owned by a better team. Our O got owned by the worst D in the league but our D did what they did majority of the season .

Goes to show you which coordinator has his head on straight.

[DraftBoy]

We were outplayed, out classed, and got beat by a team with more heart.

[User Manuel]

We looked like a young team on a big stage that needs one more playmaker on each side of the ball.

Trent played like rookie playing a road game in terrible weather.

The defense played fine, but needed a takeaway (I think they tipped 4 balls and dropped a couple of ints., those plays are made by championship type teams).

Offensively, Lee Evans didnt bring the A-game and Marshawn was good, but not superior. Lewis played like a good veteran Superbowl winning RB and the WR and TEs made enough plays to win.

The Bills have nothing to be ashamed of. Cleveland was just a bit better.

[Billzz]

We looked like a team playing in a blizzard with 40mph wind for the first time. Go figure.

[Mahdi]

We were outplayed, out classed, and got beat by a team with more heart.
More heart?? common... thats not fair... the Bills have been out-manned, out -numbered and come up short with talent all year but I have never seen more heart from a team than the Bills. They shouldnt even be .500.

[Kerr]

It's fair to say we got both outplayed and outcoached.

[OpIv37]

We looked like a young team on a big stage that needs one more playmaker on each side of the ball.

Trent played like rookie playing a road game in terrible weather.

The defense played fine, but needed a takeaway (I think they tipped 4 balls and dropped a couple of ints., those plays are made by championship type teams).

Offensively, Lee Evans didnt bring the A-game and Marshawn was good, but not superior. Lewis played like a good veteran Superbowl winning RB and the WR and TEs made enough plays to win.

The Bills have nothing to be ashamed of. Cleveland was just a bit better.

we got SHUT OUT in the most important game in 3 years but we have nothing to be ashamed of? You have to be kidding me.

[Mahdi]

we got SHUT OUT in the most important game in 3 years but we have nothing to be ashamed of? You have to be kidding me.
Actually we dont have anything to be ashamed of,,,, this team has over-achieved all year. There are simply too many question marks on this team to expect more than we have gotten. Look at teams like Arizona, Atlanta, Detroit, Chicago, Washington who are doing less with more.

[OpIv37]

More heart?? common... thats not fair... the Bills have been out-manned, out -numbered and come up short with talent all year but I have never seen more heart from a team than the Bills. They shouldnt even be .500.

If they have so much heart, why did they choke against Denver? Why did they choke against Dallas? Why did they fail to even show up against Pitt, Jax and NE twice? Why did they get SHUT OUT in the most meaningful game in 4 years?

Teams with heart respond to these situations. Our team buckled.

[OpIv37]

Actually we dont have anything to be ashamed of,,,, this team has over-achieved all year. There are simply too many question marks on this team to expect more than we have gotten. Look at teams like Arizona, Atlanta, Detroit, Chicago, Washington who are doing less with more.

And this is exactly why I say some of you have accepted mediocrity.

We're 7-7 and you call it overachieving. The goal is to make the the playoffs and we came up at least 1 game short, maybe 2 or 3 games short depending on the outcome. We didn't beat any winning teams, we don't have a winning record (yet- that could still change) and we're not in the playoffs.

The only way that's "overachieving" is if you're holding this team to a lower standard. If not making the playoffs is still "overachieving", where would actually MAKING the playoffs fall? It's not even on the charts, and that's just sad.

[Billzz]

If they have so much heart, why did they choke against Denver? Why did they choke against Dallas? Why did they fail to even show up against Pitt, Jax and NE twice? Why did they get SHUT OUT in the most meaningful game in 4 years?

Teams with heart respond to these situations. Our team buckled.

That is a really weak argument.

How about you go to the locker room after the Browns game and tell these guys "YOU HAVE NO HEART, HOW THE HELL CAN YOU LET THEM WIN THE MOST MEANINGFUL GAME IN 4 YEARS?!!!!!!!!"

I would love to see the conclusion to that. Your post is piss poor at best and really creates alot of anomosity towards and from you. Questioning wether or not they have heart this year? Just dumb. This team has played beyond it's abilities which has clearly been stated by analyst, reporters and the media in general, not to include numerous fans. Sorry you are too blind by your own frustration for the team to see that and enjoy it.

[OpIv37]

That is a really weak argument.

How about you go to the locker room after the Browns game and tell these guys "YOU HAVE NO HEART, HOW THE HELL CAN YOU LET THEM WIN THE MOST MEANINGFUL GAME IN 4 YEARS?!!!!!!!!"

I would love to see the conclusion to that. Your post is piss poor at best and really creates alot of anomosity towards and from you. Questioning wether or not they have heart this year? Just dumb. This team has played beyond it's abilities which has clearly been stated by analyst, reporters and the media in general, not to include numerous fans. Sorry you are too blind by your own frustration for the team to see that and enjoy it.

This team choked at the most meaningful points of the season- multiple times. They never came up big when it counted the most. What's dumb is NOT questioning their heart under those circumstances.

[Billzz]

This team choked at the most meaningful points of the season- multiple times. They never came up big when it counted the most. What's dumb is NOT questioning their heart under those circumstances.

Like I said, go into the locker room after a loss and question their HEART. Get a job as a reporter and stand infront of these people and ask them why they lost. Lack of heart, you just choke or get outplayed? They give 110% every game of the year I have seen this year. For you to sit back at a keyboard and make assumptions about the heart of this team is a slap in the face.

[OpIv37]

Like I said, go into the locker room after a loss and question their HEART. Get a job as a reporter and stand infront of these people and ask them why they lost. Lack of heart, you just choke or get outplayed? They give 110% every game of the year I have seen this year. For you to sit back at a keyboard and make assumptions about the heart of this team is a slap in the face.

sorry- missing tackles left and right, errant passes, dropped balls- that's not giving 110%. I'm not making assumptions- the results speak for themselves. Where was the 110% when we got crushed by NE twice, or Jax or Pitt? It's ridiculous for you to sit there and say we gave 110% when we lost 56-10 or get shut out.

[Billzz]

sorry- missing tackles left and right, errant passes, dropped balls- that's not giving 110%. I'm not making assumptions- the results speak for themselves. Where was the 110% when we got crushed by NE twice, or Jax or Pitt? It's ridiculous for you to sit there and say we gave 110% when we lost 56-10 or get shut out.

That is directly related to the talent of the other team and for you to not recognize that and simply direct the blame straight back on the players for not having heart is wrong.

We where out played by better teams in all 4 of those circumstances and I doubt many will disagree. That has nothing to do with the players heart or lack of desire to win games. Again, slapping the face of the players behind your keyboard.

[Mahdi]

And this is exactly why I say some of you have accepted mediocrity.

We're 7-7 and you call it overachieving. The goal is to make the the playoffs and we came up at least 1 game short, maybe 2 or 3 games short depending on the outcome. We didn't beat any winning teams, we don't have a winning record (yet- that could still change) and we're not in the playoffs.

The only way that's "overachieving" is if you're holding this team to a lower standard. If not making the playoffs is still "overachieving", where would actually MAKING the playoffs fall? It's not even on the charts, and that's just sad.
I have accepted mediocrity you're right! And for the very obvious reason, that WE ARE mediocre. We lack weapons with which to be great or even good. I accept the Bills for what they are and commend them on doing more than theyre mediocre talent level indicates they should. When they have the talent and still dont perform then I'll agree with everything yer saying.

[Meathead]

http://yukomj23.hp.infoseek.co.jp/images/CannedSweetCorn.jpg

[OpIv37]

That is directly related to the talent of the other team and for you to not recognize that and simply direct the blame straight back on the players for not having heart is wrong.

We where out played by better teams in all 4 of those circumstances and I doubt many will disagree. That has nothing to do with the players heart or lack of desire to win games. Again, slapping the face of the players behind your keyboard.

NE is better than us. They are NOT 56-10 better than us. Jacksonville is better than us. That's no excuse for letting them COMPLETELY run away with the game.

With the results they've gotten (or more accurately, haven't gotten), they deserve to be slapped in the face.

[OpIv37]

I have accepted mediocrity you're right! And for the very obvious reason, that WE ARE mediocre. We lack weapons with which to be great or even good. I accept the Bills for what they are and commend them on doing more than theyre mediocre talent level indicates they should. When they have the talent and still dont perform then I'll agree with everything yer saying.

They shouldn't be commended for doing more than their mediocre talent level suggests they should. They should be ridiculed for having a mediocre talent level.

The Bills' FO has it easy. They set it up so it looks like we're going to suck, then everyone is impressed by mediocrity. It takes the pressure off of them to actually get results.

[madness]

Unsubscribing this thread in 5...

[Mahdi]

They shouldn't be commended for doing more than their mediocre talent level suggests they should. They should be ridiculed for having a mediocre talent level.

The Bills' FO has it easy. They set it up so it looks like we're going to suck, then everyone is impressed by mediocrity. It takes the pressure off of them to actually get results.
Thats a pretty ridiculous statement. So the FO is deliberately keeping talent off the team in order to take off the pressure of winning and that way any wins we do get are a bonus??? Yeahhhh right,,,,

OR

They are rebuilding the team piece by piece and avoiding spending too much so we dont get into cap trouble and are un-able to maintain the corps of the team for the future.

The FO knows exactly what they are doing... and its working.... They are fully aware of what the team needs are and they are addressing them the right way instead of throwing away the future by spending big money on FAs. This team is on its way up and once we have all the pieces in place and they work together this will be a good team and a fun team to watch.

Edwards, Lynch, McCargo, Whitner, McGee, Evans(maybe), Poz, Ko is a great start and 1 more draft like that and a modest FA period and this team will look much better. But expecting big things from this group as they are right now is not realistic.

[OpIv37]

Thats a pretty ridiculous statement. So the FO is deliberately keeping talent off the team in order to take off the pressure of winning and that way any wins we do get are a bonus??? Yeahhhh right,,,,

OR

They are rebuilding the team piece by piece and avoiding spending too much so we dont get into cap trouble and are un-able to maintain the corps of the team for the future.

The FO knows exactly what they are doing... and its working.... They are fully aware of what the team needs are and they are addressing them the right way instead of throwing away the future by spending big money on FAs. This team is on its way up and once we have all the pieces in place and they work together this will be a good team and a fun team to watch.

Edwards, Lynch, McCargo, Whitner, McGee, Evans(maybe), Poz, Ko is a great start and 1 more draft like that and a modest FA period and this team will look much better. But expecting big things from this group as they are right now is not realistic.

I don't think they did it deliberately- that takes way too much planning and borders on a conspiracy theory. But after years of incompetence and bad decisions, it's the situation they're in and it definitely takes some of the pressure off. Your last sentence is the most telling: this team has fallen so far that no one expects results. And people like you are satisfied by mediocrity. That's just sad.

It's working based on what? The huge contracts we gave to Schobel and Kelsay to do nothing? The 7-7 record and inability to beat good teams? Being 7 games behind out division leader?

The flaw in the strategy is that it's taking WAY too long to get all the pieces in place. By the time we fill all the holes we currently have, new holes will open up and we will be chasing our tails.

The way to win is to build through the draft and augment through FA. Our drafts have been decent- not spectacular, but possibly good enough to win. Our FA's have been useless- this FO doesn't get involved with FA's, and when they do, we end up with Davis (cut), Reyes (cut), Bowen (cut), Fowler, Tripplett, Royal, Gaines, A-Train, etc- a bunch of role players who often can't even play their role.

We did well under the conditions. So what? What does that mean exactly? Where does that put us in the long run? 29 of the other 32 NFL teams have made the playoffs since the last time we've been there. In the grand scheme of things, we still didn't get any results. That's why I'm not impressed. Frankly I'm surpised you and so many other people fell for the "set the bar so low that mediocrity seems impressive" ruse.

[Billzz]

I got a new signature, you should read it.

[OpIv37]

I got a new signature, you should read it.

wow, resorting to insults. If we were in 3rd grade on the school bus, that might get a laugh.

[Billzz]

wow, resorting to insults. If we were in 3rd grade on the school bus, that might get a laugh.

Pretty sure I didn't specify YOU to read it.

[OpIv37]

Pretty sure I didn't specify YOU to read it.

Pretty sure that I never said or implied that you were talking about me. It's an immature insult regardless of who you were targeting.

[The King]

this is what intended when I started this thread.

[yordad]

I think the biggest difference was Anderson's arm strength. He had less balls get away from him. His balls cut threw the wind more accurately. Either that or is was Trent's glove.

Trent has done very little to this point to show me he can succeed throwing the ball with authority in the swirling Ralph winds. Or, downfield at all for that matter.

I am concerned to say the least.

[OpIv37]

I think the biggest difference was Anderson's arm strength. He had less balls get away from him. His balls cut threw the wind more accurately. Either that or is was Trent's glove.

Trent has done very little to this point to show me he can succeed throwing the ball with authority in the swirling Ralph winds. Or, downfield at all for that matter.

I am concerned to say the least.

but Trent can't be held accountable for his play! He's just a rookie! It was windy and snowy! Anderson had a lower completion percentage! Cleveland's receivers are taller! Even the god amongst men, Tom Brady, had a bad day in the wind! Insert other generic excuse for faiure here!

[mybills]

Our O got owned by the worst D in the league
I disagree. Our O did it to themselves. They were completely out of sync.

[yordad]

but Trent can't be held accountable for his play! He's just a rookie! It was windy and snowy! Anderson had a lower completion percentage! Cleveland's receivers are taller! Even the god amongst men, Tom Brady, had a bad day in the wind! Insert other generic excuse for faiure here!Yeah, I did go out of my way to make an excuse just now. But, I believe they should be held accountable. But, how do you do that? Cut Gaines?

Here comes a bunch of opinions.

I think they could have tried harder. I think they could have tackled better. I think they should have tried to catch the ball better. I think our offensive coach should have been drawing game plans instead of recruiting students. I think Fairchild should be dismissed right now.

I think we should have an interim OC. AVP or Turk. Let's see how they game plan and call plays before we target an outsider with no personal or terminology familiarity.

I think JP would have done much better throwing in those winds. In fact, when it comes right down to it, I want to hire Martz away from the Lions, throw Trent back on the bench, and draft a WR, TE, and real FB.

And, I think we need to somehow get a better center. He have no push from the middle whatsoever.

And, I KNOW I just got banned from another Bills site for voicing my opinion, so I was very hesitant to do it again.

How was that?

[OpIv37]

Yeah, I did go out of my way to make an excuse just now. But, I believe they should be held accountable. But, how do you do that? Cut Gaines?

Here comes a bunch of opinions.

I think they could have tried harder. I think they could have tackled better. I think they should have tried to catch the ball better. I think our offensive coach should have been drawing game plans instead of recruiting students. I think Fairchild should be dismissed right now.

I think we should have an interim OC. AVP or Turk. Let's see how they game plan and call plays before we target an outsider with no personal or terminology familiarity.

I think JP would have done much better throwing in those winds. In fact, when it comes right down to it, I want to hire Martz away from the Lions, throw Trent back on the bench, and draft a WR, TE, and real FB.

And, I think we need to somehow get a better center. He have no push from the middle whatsoever.

And, I KNOW I just got banned from another Bills site for voicing my opinion, so I was very hesitant to do it again.

How was that?

I was being sarcastic. That's what a lot of people around here have been saying about Trent. Honestly, I think he had an awful game. Long term- he might be the QB of the future and he might not- he's shown some good signs but there are also some reasons for concerns.

As far as JP, he does have a stronger arm than Trent but he hasn't exactly been accurate even when the conditions were good. So who knows?

I thought Fairchild should be gone even before he took the other job, and now it's clear that he should be gone.

And we definitely need a C, WR, TE and a FB/H-back in the off-season, either via draft or FA. Sorry, but when Robert Royal lines up in the backfield, NO ONE on the D believes the ball is actually going to him.

[Mahdi]

I don't think they did it deliberately- that takes way too much planning and borders on a conspiracy theory. But after years of incompetence and bad decisions, it's the situation they're in and it definitely takes some of the pressure off. Your last sentence is the most telling: this team has fallen so far that no one expects results. And people like you are satisfied by mediocrity. That's just sad.

It's working based on what? The huge contracts we gave to Schobel and Kelsay to do nothing? The 7-7 record and inability to beat good teams? Being 7 games behind out division leader?

The flaw in the strategy is that it's taking WAY too long to get all the pieces in place. By the time we fill all the holes we currently have, new holes will open up and we will be chasing our tails.

The way to win is to build through the draft and augment through FA. Our drafts have been decent- not spectacular, but possibly good enough to win. Our FA's have been useless- this FO doesn't get involved with FA's, and when they do, we end up with Davis (cut), Reyes (cut), Bowen (cut), Fowler, Tripplett, Royal, Gaines, A-Train, etc- a bunch of role players who often can't even play their role.

We did well under the conditions. So what? What does that mean exactly? Where does that put us in the long run? 29 of the other 32 NFL teams have made the playoffs since the last time we've been there. In the grand scheme of things, we still didn't get any results. That's why I'm not impressed. Frankly I'm surpised you and so many other people fell for the "set the bar so low that mediocrity seems impressive" ruse.
The way to win and win consistently is to follow the Colts model of personnel management and thats what we are doing... Im happy with mediocrity because for now thats all we have but its getting better year by year and thats what matters. Yer talking about years and years of losing but the fact is this has been a 2 year process so far and I like where the team has been heading since Levy and Co. took over. The key to the FA era is to develop a system, develop a core of players that fit that system and keep that core of players long-term. You also have to realize that we needed to cut our losses first before we could start heading in a better direction which of course will impact our ability to win immediately but will pay-off down the road.

Honestly having a great team that wins all the time is fun and all but I find this fun as well. Watching this team grow and struggle and continue to improve is interesting IMO and is part of being a fan of a franchise. Piece by piece our team is getting better and when they become a great team and dominate other teams it will be even more fun. So lets just all enjoy the ride because its only getting better.

[Billzz]

The way to win and win consistently is to follow the Colts model of personnel management and thats what we are doing... Im happy with mediocrity because for now thats all we have but its getting better year by year and thats what matters. Yer talking about years and years of losing but the fact is this has been a 2 year process so far and I like where the team has been heading since Levy and Co. took over. The key to the FA era is to develop a system, develop a core of players that fit that system and keep that core of players long-term. You also have to realize that we needed to cut our losses first before we could start heading in a better direction which of course will impact our ability to win immediately but will pay-off down the road.

Honestly having a great team that wins all the time is fun and all but I find this fun as well. Watching this team grow and struggle and continue to improve is interesting IMO and is part of being a fan of a franchise. Piece by piece our team is getting better and when they become a great team and dominate other teams it will be even more fun. So lets just all enjoy the ride because its only getting better.

:bf1:

[OpIv37]

The way to win and win consistently is to follow the Colts model of personnel management and thats what we are doing... Im happy with mediocrity because for now thats all we have but its getting better year by year and thats what matters. Yer talking about years and years of losing but the fact is this has been a 2 year process so far and I like where the team has been heading since Levy and Co. took over. The key to the FA era is to develop a system, develop a core of players that fit that system and keep that core of players long-term. You also have to realize that we needed to cut our losses first before we could start heading in a better direction which of course will impact our ability to win immediately but will pay-off down the road.

Honestly having a great team that wins all the time is fun and all but I find this fun as well. Watching this team grow and struggle and continue to improve is interesting IMO and is part of being a fan of a franchise. Piece by piece our team is getting better and when they become a great team and dominate other teams it will be even more fun. So lets just all enjoy the ride because its only getting better.

watching the team grow and struggle and start to get it right was fun- in 2002. But we've been in an 8 year down cycle. I know, I know- we can't blame Marv and Jauron- they've only been here two years, the team is improving, whatever.

The problem is that we've been here before. From 2001-2002, we went from bad to mediocre, to go right back to bad in 2003. From 2003-2004, we went from bad to mediocre, only to go right back to bad in 2005. Now, here we are back at mediocre. When are we going to take the next step? I'm tired of watching this phase of the development cycle- I want to see the next phase.

[justasportsfan]

watching the team grow and struggle and start to get it right was fun- in 2002. But we've been in an 8 year down cycle. I know, I know- we can't blame Marv and Jauron- they've only been here two years, the team is improving, whatever.

The problem is that we've been here before. From 2001-2002, we went from bad to mediocre, to go right back to bad in 2003. From 2003-2004, we went from bad to mediocre, only to go right back to bad in 2005. Now, here we are back at mediocre. When are we going to take the next step? I'm tired of watching this phase of the development cycle- I want to see the next phase.


based on how TD left this team, we had no choice but to rebuild. During rebuilding stages more often than not, you go through mediocrity to get to you goal. We're going through that. Majority of teams take 2-3 years of rebuilding. We're right on schedule so far.

[Billzz]

watching the team grow and struggle and start to get it right was fun- in 2002. But we've been in an 8 year down cycle. I know, I know- we can't blame Marv and Jauron- they've only been here two years, the team is improving, whatever.

The problem is that we've been here before. From 2001-2002, we went from bad to mediocre, to go right back to bad in 2003. From 2003-2004, we went from bad to mediocre, only to go right back to bad in 2005. Now, here we are back at mediocre. When are we going to take the next step? I'm tired of watching this phase of the development cycle- I want to see the next phase.

As fans we all feel the same pain but, what's in the past is in the past. That is why people in football need to have short memories, otherwise it consumes you and because a major focal point in their careers if they cannot let go. Pretty much applies to life in general.

[OpIv37]

based on how TD left this team, we had no choice but to rebuild. During rebuilding stages more often than not, you go through mediocrity to get to you goal. We're going through that. Majority of teams take 2-3 years of rebuilding. We're right on schedule so far.

well Mahdi's point was that he likes watching the growth and development aspect of the team- my point is that we've been watching it for so long that it's not fun anymore. It's just repetitive and frustrating.

[justasportsfan]

well Mahdi's point was that he likes watching the growth and development aspect of the team- my point is that we've been watching it for so long that it's not fun anymore. It's just repetitive and frustrating.
these are the cards we are dealt with as bills fans. Nothing we can do with the TD era. So far, I'm not happy nor pissed off with the Marv and Dick era.

I expect playoffs next year , nothing less. Trent won't even be an excuse.

[Meathead]

I think the biggest difference was Anderson's arm strength. He had less balls get away from him. His balls cut threw the wind more accurately. Either that or is was Trent's glove.

Trent has done very little to this point to show me he can succeed throwing the ball with authority in the swirling Ralph winds

I am concerned to say the least.
been there made that point got called a dont know football :loser:

dont care cuz i ... err we are right. crystal clear that trents ball travelled even more poorly than andersons and that gave clev the oppty to crowd the los

'but anderson struggled too and his balls were off target wah wah'

yes but look at how the ball travelled and notice he completed several twenty yarders compared to edwards zero before the last part of the fourth

'but edwards completed more passes and had a higher completion percentage wah wah wah'

moot point. his ypc was two thirds that of edwards. look at where the clev lbs and dbs were standing vs the bills. theres only one reason for that

'oh you dont know what youre talking about edwards awesome it wasnt his fault wah'

yeah ok

coulda used you here two days ago dad

[yordad]

been there made that point got called a dont know football :loser:

dont care cuz i ... err we are right. crystal clear that trents ball travelled even more poorly than andersons and that gave clev the oppty to crowd the los

'but anderson struggled too and his balls were off target wah wah'

yes but look at how the ball travelled and notice he completed several twenty yarders compared to edwards zero before the last part of the fourth

'but edwards completed more passes and had a higher completion percentage wah wah wah'

moot point. his ypc was two thirds that of edwards. look at where the clev lbs and dbs were standing vs the bills. theres only one reason for that

'oh you dont know what youre talking about edwards awesome it wasnt his fault wah'

yeah ok

coulda used you here two days ago dadMeathead,

I'll tell you something about me. I am all about the math. If you have a big enough sample, math will win out every time. Every single time. Trust me. I am a semi-pro poker player. In the long run math and odds win, given a big enough sample. It is a fact.

That said, I'm not sold on Trent. He was promoted based on a small sample. And, even that small sample wasn't favorable, in my opinion.

I haven't seen him complete a pass that traveled more than 45 yards from the line of scrimmage yet. I haven't seen him throw into the swirling winds with promise.

Poised means very little to me. Skill and results mean most. Promise and ability means some.

Now, there is no denying that Trent fits into the current offensive philosophy better then Losman. But, with a new coordinator, that philosophy can change.

I want a offensive coordinator that can create on offense tailor made to his best players strengths. Not a guy that creates an offense, and then fits players to it.

Now, that isn't to say the coaching staff couldn't have seen something I haven't. I'm not claiming TE can't succeed. And, I'm not claiming he has a weak arm. I'm just claiming I haven't seen proof to the contrary myself.

But, I somehow noticed Greer and Jackson before the coaching staff, so I don't have complete faith.

I am sick of rebuilding.

PS: I have heard approximately 8:24min of Ron Paul. He is very compelling. There are two sides to everything, and I've only seen one so far, but I love what I've seen. Wow, do I love what I've seen. That is a awesome video.