A Statistical FYI [Archive] - BillsZone.com

Wys Guy

01-01-2008, 03:59 PM

I didn't even know this myself until I did the research earlier today for my season ending piece, but the Bills scored fewer offensive TDs and fewer Red Zone TDs than any other team in the league.

That obviously includes the Niners, Panthers, Jets, and Dolphins.

How anyone thinks that is anything but something suggesting that all kinds of people should already be fired given the money/resources spent on the offense this offseason is beyond me.

Nighthawk

01-01-2008, 04:02 PM

Ebenezer

01-01-2008, 04:04 PM

7-9
7-9

the only stats that count.

Nighthawk

01-01-2008, 04:09 PM

7-9
7-9

the only stats that count.

Eb, is this in defense or against this regime?

Historian

01-01-2008, 04:12 PM

7-9
7-9

the only stats that count.

Try this one on for size:

355-390-8 (.471)

This isn't even a .500 ball club.

Sad....very sad.

Nighthawk

01-01-2008, 04:14 PM

Try this one on for size:

355-390-8 (.471)

This isn't even a .500 ball club.

Sad....very sad.

Ralphy is happy to be mediocre and that sucks for us Bills fans. I mean, if this team would at least show an interest in being a serious Super Bowl contender, then I would be OK with it. However, this organization doesn't even try.

Bling

01-01-2008, 04:29 PM

Ultimately, 7-9 seasons is what this team should expect. There is no talent on this team. Edwards is definitely the better QB between Edwards and Losman, but he needs to obviously take it to another level next year. Where's the 2nd WR? Even Evans was a bit shady this year. For all the money spent on the O-line, how much of an improvement was there?

Ebenezer

01-01-2008, 04:36 PM

Eb, is this in defense or against this regime?
no...it means that Wys can post stats from here until doomsday...I want a winner...People used to quote stats all the time during the Kelly-era. Yippee!!! That didn't bring home a SB...I don't care if they have -50 yards offense every game and win 4-3 on two safeties...win...bottom line...win.

YardRat

01-01-2008, 04:38 PM

Is anybody actually surprised at the lack of red zone production or offensive production in general? It has been an issue right from the Denver game on.

Mahdi

01-01-2008, 04:51 PM

Nighthawk

01-01-2008, 04:54 PM

Is anybody actually surprised at the lack of red zone production or offensive production in general? It has been an issue right from the Denver game on.

You need only to look at Dickey's history as a HC in the NFL. Every team he's had has been towards the bottom in the league in offense. It's all related to the guy coaching this team...pitiful.

Goobylal

01-01-2008, 05:53 PM

It had little to do with the O-line and more to do with opposing DC's figuring-out Fairchild's schemes, no #2 WR, and a rookie QB.

Bone

01-01-2008, 05:53 PM

Well then I feel bad for the teams we beat this year... but I agree with Eb

SpillerThrills

01-01-2008, 06:01 PM

It had little to do with the O-line and more to do with opposing DC's figuring-out Fairchild's schemes, no #2 WR, and a rookie QB.

we had a #2 reciever... his name is Lee Evans. what we were missing however is a #1 reciever.... and it's not hard to figure out Fairchild's schemes...

1st down: run up the middle
2nd down: run up the middle
3rd down: short pass over the middle
4th down: punt

pretty easy to figure out.....

Goobylal

01-01-2008, 07:02 PM

we had a #2 reciever... his name is Lee Evans. what we were missing however is a #1 reciever....
This is debatable. His number last year with a disappointing Peerless Price (his last productive year as a #2 WR) were #1-like. And I guess I shouldn't have said #2 WR, I should have said "another WR to take the pressure off Lee." I'd rather have another guy who could BE a #1 WR if needed.

and it's not hard to figure out Fairchild's schemes...
1st down: run up the middle
2nd down: run up the middle
3rd down: short pass over the middle
4th down: punt

pretty easy to figure out.....
Yep. I'm convinced that every opposing (good) DC that saw the Bills on their schedule and were able to figure-out Fairchild's schemes over the off-season. I recall hearing several times afterwards how opposing players knew what the Bills were going to run based on the formation, and even Rich Gannon could tell, while calling the games.

justasportsfan

01-01-2008, 07:14 PM

7-9 is a reflection of how our D stepped up agianst the odds to carry the entire team.

mybills

01-02-2008, 06:21 AM

There is no talent on this team.
Liar!

Jan Reimers

01-02-2008, 10:20 AM

It had little to do with the O-line and more to do with opposing DC's figuring-out Fairchild's schemes, no #2 WR, and a rookie QB.
And while Royal and Gaines had a few TDs, our lack of an athletic, pass catching TE also contributed.

SpillerThrills

01-02-2008, 10:48 AM

For all the money spent on the O-line, how much of an improvement was there?

I don't know where to find the stats, but I bet if you look at the stats on sacks and nock downs between this year and last year you'll probably see an improvement..... I mean Trent went I think it was 4 games without being sacked at one point this year!

justasportsfan

01-02-2008, 11:05 AM

we really didn't need stats to know that. Lindell is our biggest weapon on offense. Everyone else just takes up space.

raphael120

01-02-2008, 11:12 AM

Call us the Buffalo Field Goals.

Goobylal

01-02-2008, 04:47 PM

And while Royal and Gaines had a few TDs, our lack of an athletic, pass catching TE also contributed.
Definitely! How did I forget to add that?!

Goobylal

01-02-2008, 04:51 PM

For all the money spent on the O-line, how much of an improvement was there?
Lots. Sacks went WAY down, and Lynch, as a rookie, averaged 0.2 YPC more than Willis did last year. And the O-line didn't even get to play together during training camp and pre-season because Butler was still nursing injuries, which also limited his ability to add strength.

Wys Guy

01-02-2008, 06:06 PM

no...it means that Wys can post stats from here until doomsday...I want a winner...People used to quote stats all the time during the Kelly-era. Yippee!!! That didn't bring home a SB...I don't care if they have -50 yards offense every game and win 4-3 on two safeties...win...bottom line...win.

I hate to be the one to break it to ya there Eb, but if you can't score, then it follows logically that you can't win too many games unless your defense is so utterly good that it doesn't matter.

But you apparently missed the greater point here, which I'm sure can be validated by briefly perusing the preseason threads here, that namely far bigger and more impressive things were expected from an offense with one of the biggest OLs in the game and one that just dropped 75M on a pair of OL-men not to mention a 1st round draft pick on a RB and another day-one pick on a QB that replaced one that performed better last season.

So again, answer Nighthawk's question as to whether that was pro/anti the team.

We all want a winner. Are we closer or further away from producing that winner now?

Seems to me if logic has much of a say, that given that our O has slipped in spite of all the so-called improvements, that we're certainly not getting any closer. I fully realize that logic is a redheaded step child here usually, but that does not validate ignoring it.

Also, who do you personally blame for getting less from an offense that had more this year in terms of talent? Clearly that has to fall on someone. You can't blame the schedule b/c in hindsight it was right around average and in fact easier than last season's.

So where do you lay the blame and how does that impact "winning" for the future.

Honestly y'all, these lame statements about "all that matters is winning" or "the only stat that matters is wins" are really, really lame.

If that's all that one has to add, why bother even joining a discussion.

Wys Guy

01-02-2008, 06:07 PM

Is anybody actually surprised at the lack of red zone production or offensive production in general? It has been an issue right from the Denver game on.

I'll chime in here, but I'm quite astonished that we were dead last in both easily and coming from me that's saying quite a bit.

Wys Guy

01-02-2008, 06:10 PM

Im sorry can you please tell us about all these investments that went into the offense? Last I checked we had one of the worst offenses personnel wise in the league.

Sure, Dockery, Walker, both considered upgrades by everyone along with Lynch who was also all but unanimously considered an upgrade over McGahee even as a rookie. Throw in Jackson's contributions.

You absolutely cannot be serious here.

No one said we were good, and I certainly figured we'd be among the bottom 20% of the league's offenses easily overall, but dead last in scoring and in scoring from the red zone too?!

If you don't think that this team improved itself offensively on paper and even in terms of raw talent regardless of by how much, then you're delusional.

Wys Guy

01-02-2008, 06:17 PM

It had little to do with the O-line and more to do with opposing DC's figuring-out Fairchild's schemes, no #2 WR, and a rookie QB.

Look, even if you tell opponents that you're running to the left behind Peters and Dockery they ought to be able to clear enough of a path to net Lynch more than the 3.6 ypc that he yielded behind them this season, which by the way was less than the 4.1 that McGahee netted last season behind Peters and Gandy.

In case it escaped you, Fairchild was the OC last year too.

And FWIW I told you he'd suck hind teat and that there was absolutely nothing in his dossier at the time of his hiring that even remotely suggested that he A, knew WTH he was even doing, or B, would be successful.

Wys Guy

01-02-2008, 06:23 PM

I don't know where to find the stats, but I bet if you look at the stats on sacks and nock downs between this year and last year you'll probably see an improvement..... I mean Trent went I think it was 4 games without being sacked at one point this year!

He also had only 269 attempts, less than half of what Brady had and less than half of what the top 5 passers had. He also had an offense entirely predicated on 3 and 5 step drops and getting rid of the ball quickly.

I'd have gladly swapped another 10 or 20 sacks for some actual production. Giving him, the team, props for lack of sacks in this case is like saying that the good news for an Indy Car race driver is that his car was not damaged in the race in spite of the fact that he never left the pit.

Wys Guy

01-02-2008, 06:26 PM

7-9 is a reflection of how our D stepped up agianst the odds to carry the entire team.

That and a soft schedule.

we really didn't need stats to know that. Lindell is our biggest weapon on offense. Everyone else just takes up space.

I'd argue that Moorman is our biggest weapon. He is the only one that consistently produces first downs on offensive plays when he's in there.

:snicker:

Seriously though, I'd really argue that he's our primary offensive weapon, or at least the one that's most responsible for our overall scoring generally speaking via netting us favorable field position either directly or indirectly.

Wys Guy

01-02-2008, 06:26 PM

Call us the Buffalo Field Goals.

Call us the Buffalo Chips.

Wys Guy

01-02-2008, 06:29 PM

Lots. Sacks went WAY down, and Lynch, as a rookie, averaged 0.2 YPC more than Willis did last year. And the O-line didn't even get to play together during training camp and pre-season because Butler was still nursing injuries, which also limited his ability to add strength.

Similar long run, number of TDs, etc.

Very little difference from an overall performance perspective.

.2 YPC is insignificant.

Goobylal

01-02-2008, 07:28 PM

Look, even if you tell opponents that you're running to the left behind Peters and Dockery they ought to be able to clear enough of a path to net Lynch more than the 3.6 ypc that he yielded behind them this season, which by the way was less than the 4.1 that McGahee netted last season behind Peters and Gandy.

In case it escaped you, Fairchild was the OC last year too.
So if an entire defense knows that the play is going to the offense's left, Peters and Dockery should be able to block the 5 or so players that will be standing in their way? Not quite.

As for Fairchild being the OC last year, I said that opposing DC's probably figured-out his schemes over the off-season. And the lack of even Price's production from last year hurt them a lot.

And FWIW I told you he'd suck hind teat and that there was absolutely nothing in his dossier at the time of his hiring that even remotely suggested that he A, knew WTH he was even doing, or B, would be successful.
Yeah, and you predicted the Bills would win fewer than 5 games. "A blind nut..."