last year's offense: major problem discovered

[trapezeus]

“I expect to put some things on his shoulders,” Schonert said of Edwards. “We’re going to have an audible system. If he sees something that’s a disadvantage to us, I want him to make it an advantageous situation by checking to the right thing. We didn’t have that last year for the quarterback.”


um? they didn't have an audible system for the last two years? are you kidding me? to me that's like not having a running game. Oh wait.

Anyways, adding the ability to call audibles should go a long way to getting us out of the ruts of the league.

[Mr. Pink]

“I expect to put some things on his shoulders,” Schonert said of Edwards. “We’re going to have an audible system. If he sees something that’s a disadvantage to us, I want him to make it an advantageous situation by checking to the right thing. We didn’t have that last year for the quarterback.”


um? they didn't have an audible system for the last two years? are you kidding me? to me that's like not having a running game. Oh wait.

Anyways, adding the ability to call audibles should go a long way to getting us out of the ruts of the league.

That should tell you what they thought of JP Losman.

And when they changed QBs midyear, it was likely too late to implement a new system and make changes.

[HHURRICANE]

That should tell you what they thought of JP Losman.

And when they changed QBs midyear, it was likely too late to implement a new system and make changes.

People will argue this point but I agree that the offensive staff had zero confidence in JP's ability to read the offense.

[Elminster]

That should tell you what they thought of JP Losman.

And when they changed QBs midyear, it was likely too late to implement a new system and make changes.
I don't care what you think of your QB. If you really are committed to developing him and helping him succeed, you at least let him call basic play-changes. It is simply inexcusable that we have been unable to change our plays, even when it was painfully obvious that the defense was ready for us.

[trapezeus]

it also makes you wonder what the hell Trent's "we're running" hand signals were all about. if you can't change plays in the offense, Trent was probably signally, "it's ok everyone, at least i'm not getting run over in this play."

God, i really hate rooting for the bills sometimes. I hope turk is the second coming of levy/marchibroda and stuns us with this "diverse" and effective attack that can keep our d off the field and point on the board.

Can you imagine if turk was just a disgruntled employee below fairchild and wanted to do things different by fairchild was too much of an ass? And turk is ready to make thigns happen? Am i dreaming too much?

[Dr. Lecter]

We all knew they had limited or no audibles. The bad part was that JP alluded to it himself at times and wanted to change a play but could not.

Whether or not they thoguthhe could handle it is irrelevant. You have to at least give him a limited set of audibles. Hell, it ain't going to make it worse. Especially since JP was his best letting it fly and being creative.

[mybills]

I don't care what you think of your QB. If you really are committed to developing him and helping him succeed, you at least let him call basic play-changes. It is simply inexcusable that we have been unable to change our plays, even when it was painfully obvious that the defense was ready for us.
:10: :bf1:

[TacklingDummy]

Just another excuse for lack of execution.

[Oldbillsfan]

If they can't move the ball anyway, why not let them audible? What the hell is the difference? Could they have a worse offense? Stupid.

[Mitchy moo]

That should tell you what they thought of JP Losman.



Their lack of faith translated into a losing record.

[Mitchy moo]

“I expect to put some things on his shoulders,” Schonert said of Edwards. “We’re going to have an audible system. If he sees something that’s a disadvantage to us, I want him to make it an advantageous situation by checking to the right thing. We didn’t have that last year for the quarterback.”


um? they didn't have an audible system for the last two years? are you kidding me? to me that's like not having a running game. Oh wait.

Anyways, adding the ability to call audibles should go a long way to getting us out of the ruts of the league.

If you see 9 in the box and can do nothing about it, you are going to have problems. How many times did we all say to ourselves please don't run into the middle this year after seeing the box stacked? Too many.

[Spiderweb]

Just another excuse for lack of execution.

??????

Execution matters obviously, but despite how well a play is run, when the defense is set to specifically stop the play about to be run, chances of success drop considerably, especially in the run game. As for the pass game, 2 man routes make things far easier on a secondary. Superior talent can overcome a lot as well, but I don't believe the Bills would be considered to have an abundance of talent at this point.

No excuses, just the way it is.

[jmb1099]

Very interesting...
So the players weren't permitted to adapt? This goes way beyond just Losman. This explains and confirms an awful lot.

[cocamide]

Thank you, Colorado, for picking up our trash.

[YardRat]

This year is going to be fun. I can feel it.

[Philagape]

This team has been playing Atari 2600 football in a Madden league.

[TigerJ]

I don't care what you think of your QB. If you really are committed to developing him and helping him succeed, you at least let him call basic play-changes. It is simply inexcusable that we have been unable to change our plays, even when it was painfully obvious that the defense was ready for us.

I absolutely agree. The players play the game. It's not fair to them to handicap them by not having a QB authorized to audible. I think we're getting an unusual look at the flaws of Steve Fairchild and what he was doing as OC. I also think that the fact Schonert has the go ahead to tell the public all this stuff is an indication of how disgusted Jauron was with the job Fairchild did. I think Fairchild did Jauron a favor by leaving and saving Jauron the bother of firing him.

[LifetimeBillsFan]

it also makes you wonder what the hell Trent's "we're running" hand signals were all about. if you can't change plays in the offense, Trent was probably signally, "it's ok everyone, at least i'm not getting run over in this play." ....

In the Pittsburgh-Indy game a couple of years ago the announcers explained that the hand-signals that you see P.Manning, T.Brady and a lot of QBs use relate to the blocking schemes, identifying where the middle of the defense is, so that the offense can adjust their blocking (for example: is the MLB over or to the left or right of the center; has the SS stepped up into the box so that, in effect, there are 4 LBs and the middle of the defensive alignment has moved; etc.).

If you are going to have the QB doing this on certain plays--say on running plays--though, it is important for him to disguise the fact that he is doing it by using fake or dummy calls on plays when this is not called for. P.Manning has taken this to almost an art form: as anyone who has seen him play, he jesticulates around and makes like he is calling an audible on every play. This makes it difficult for opposing defenses to know whether he is calling a blocking scheme, calling an audible or just putting on a show with a dummy call. His teammates have been quoted as saying that P.Manning is very creative when coming up with meaningless, dummy calls that sound like real play calls but that actually have nothing to do with anything.

I was shocked to find out that the Bills have not even had a basic audible system in place for the last 2 seasons--we had one when I was in high school almost 40 years ago! It explains a lot. Particularly about the problems that the team had on 3rd downs and in the red zone. It's all well and good to line up and effectively say to the opposition, "We're going to do what we're going to do and you can't stop us!", but you have to be really, really good and have players capable of executing to perfection on every play to do that. In nearly 50 years of watching football, I've only seen 2 teams that could do that consistently: the Green Bay Packers under V.Lombardi and the Miami Dolphins of the '70s under D.Shula (this year's Pats may be the third, although we're only talking about one year at this point).

I think that just installing an audible package--even if it is somewhat limited and simple--will, by itself, make the Bills offense better and more productive in 2008. I think that it will be important, though, for the Bills to also have their QBs learn how to disguise their audibles and blocking scheme calls with dummy calls the way that other teams do--Edwards doesn't have to start doing it the way that you see P.Manning and T.Brady doing it, but they really should give him some means of disguising the real calls that they want him to make.

[jamze132]

I wonder what Jauron thought about not having audibles?

[YardRat]

I wonder what Jauron thought about not having audibles?

He probably didn't know about it either until Turk's presser.

[Turf]

Why does Jauron get a pass on all this, no audibles. He's the head freakin coach. Instead they wait all year, let the OC go, and say oh yeah, now we're allowing audibles. What the hell does Jauron actually do? This is ridiculous. How can he make in game adjustments if he can't make in season adjustments? What a joke.

[mybills]

Why does Jauron get a pass on all this, no audibles. He's the head freakin coach. Instead they wait all year, let the OC go, and say oh yeah, now we're allowing audibles. What the hell does Jauron actually do? This is ridiculous. How can he make in game adjustments if he can't make in season adjustments? What a joke.
The only thing I can think of is that he's defense minded. :idunno:

[Dr. Lecter]

Why does Jauron get a pass on all this, no audibles. He's the head freakin coach. Instead they wait all year, let the OC go, and say oh yeah, now we're allowing audibles. What the hell does Jauron actually do? This is ridiculous. How can he make in game adjustments if he can't make in season adjustments? What a joke.

I definetly think this was a mistake by Jauron. Nobody said the guy is perfect.

[G. Host]

http://www.detnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080118/SPORTS0101/801180332/1126

Under Martz, the quarterback was not allowed to call audibles.

"You don't have to be a genius to figure these things out," Colletto said. "I want to make sure that we run a real balanced style of football. Make the defense have to play both run and pass.

"You don't have to be real fancy. You just have to be a good executing team."

Colletto did not criticize Martz, who has been hired by the 49ers.


Fairchild learned from Martz who many wanted to be OC here. Did they know at the time that Martz's system did not allow audibles?

[Wys Guy]

“I expect to put some things on his shoulders,” Schonert said of Edwards. “We’re going to have an audible system. If he sees something that’s a disadvantage to us, I want him to make it an advantageous situation by checking to the right thing. We didn’t have that last year for the quarterback.”


um? they didn't have an audible system for the last two years? are you kidding me? to me that's like not having a running game. Oh wait.

Anyways, adding the ability to call audibles should go a long way to getting us out of the ruts of the league.

What a great idea!

These guys are brilliant. I wonder when the rest of the league will catch on though.

If I announce that if we put wheels on an object, we can roll it much easier, will I be haled as some sort of great thinker?

Here anyway!

;)

[THATHURMANATOR]

What a great idea!

These guys are brilliant. I wonder when the rest of the league will catch on though.

If I announce that if we put wheels on an object, we can roll it much easier, will I be haled as some sort of great thinker?

Here anyway!

;)
Wys it is agreed that these are basic things but are you saying they shouldnt do them to improve the offense and just leave it as it was last year? What is your point?

[Wys Guy]

Wys it is agreed that these are basic things but are you saying they shouldnt do them to improve the offense and just leave it as it was last year? What is your point?

Are you serious Thurm?

Assuming so, and at the risk of making a fool of myself, aren't these things that fall into the "automatic" category for anyone that knows anything about football?

I mean is, was, there another team in the league, if this is even true, that simply had no provision for an audible of any type, whether prompted by the QB or someone else telling the QB?

I know that I was vocal in my insistence that to put Lynch out there w/o a bona fide FB was flat out dumb. In hindsight, it was. Yet, they let both FBs go.

I mean talking about things at this level isn't what makes championship caliber teams. Can you see Belichick debating over whether or not to put audibles in there? Or whether or not he should use a traditional FB at times? Or even insisting that there's never any need for one?

You guys sit here and "clap and cheer" for everything that the organization does in terms of decision making digging up kudos where none exist, and in spite of the sheer and utter and complete ignorance of the fundamentals of sound football, and then criticize the same things after they 'correct" what really should never have been implemented to begin with.

I'm at a loss here.

And here we go again! Schonert steps in, announces the most basic changes, and certainly nothing that in and of itself will make a championship caliber team or even close, and some people here actually view these things as relevant.

Everything, and I do mean everything, that has come to pass at OBD to date this offseason thus far, is trivial, meaningless, and inconsequential in terms of the progress of this team. Everything.

By week 10 next year you and others will be talking about Jauron's firing thereby inherently talking about another coaching staff and and a whole new era of rebuilding. I'm not even going to go on about whether or not Wilson will do something smart then as we know what the answer to that is.

This team is a spoof. I'm going to watch other teams next season. This one ain't worth watching, literally. Watching this team is the equivalent to watching infomercials late night.

We will know more when Wilson dies. But for now there isn't a viable scenario that keeps this team in Buffalo then given the mass exodus of males 18-35 from the region.

[THATHURMANATOR]

Are you serious Thurm?

Assuming so, and at the risk of making a fool of myself, aren't these things that fall into the "automatic" category for anyone that knows anything about football?

I mean is, was, there another team in the league, if this is even true, that simply had no provision for an audible of any type, whether prompted by the QB or someone else telling the QB?

I know that I was vocal in my insistence that to put Lynch out there w/o a bona fide FB was flat out dumb. In hindsight, it was. Yet, they let both FBs go.

I mean talking about things at this level isn't what makes championship caliber teams. Can you see Belichick debating over whether or not to put audibles in there? Or whether or not he should use a traditional FB at times? Or even insisting that there's never any need for one?

You guys sit here and "clap and cheer" for everything that the organization does in terms of decision making digging up kudos where none exist, and in spite of the sheer and utter and complete ignorance of the fundamentals of sound football, and then criticize the same things after they 'correct" what really should never have been implemented to begin with.

I'm at a loss here.

And here we go again! Schonert steps in, announces the most basic changes, and certainly nothing that in and of itself will make a championship caliber team or even close, and some people here actually view these things as relevant.

Everything, and I do mean everything, that has come to pass at OBD to date this offseason thus far, is trivial, meaningless, and inconsequential in terms of the progress of this team. Everything.

By week 10 next year you and others will be talking about Jauron's firing thereby inherently talking about another coaching staff and and a whole new era of rebuilding. I'm not even going to go on about whether or not Wilson will do something smart then as we know what the answer to that is.

This team is a spoof. I'm going to watch other teams next season. This one ain't worth watching, literally. Watching this team is the equivalent to watching infomercials late night.

We will know more when Wilson dies. But for now there isn't a viable scenario that keeps this team in Buffalo then given the mass exodus of males 18-35 from the region.
Calm down man.
Wasnt saying this will magically transform the offense into a juggernaut.
Have fun watching other teams. I am not fickle and will always stand by my team.

[mybills]

This team is a spoof. I'm going to watch other teams next season. This one ain't worth watching, literally.


You gonna stopped making wing sauce, too?

[MikeInRoch]

I think you have the title of this thread reversed...

major problem discovered: last year's offense

[Spiderweb]

People will argue this point but I agree that the offensive staff had zero confidence in JP's ability to read the offense.

Maybe, but I would tend to believe they simply didn't trust anyone, period. More like micro-managing and being a control freak if you ask me. Look, Fairchild was a jerk before and Martz pulled the play calling from him in STL. Fairchild's only history is bad history.

What was even worse was that Jauron failed to walk up to Fairchild in game 2 and simply give him a Buddy Ryan belt in the chops (and then canned him right there). As bad as it was, what in the world was Jauron thinking all season long? Jauron needs to shoulder a large part of the fault with our offense. He allowed Fairchild to continue drawing air.