A Dolfan's Mock 4 the Bills

[BehindEnemyLines]

What up Bill's fans?

I have signed up to draft as the Bills for a 7 round mock we are doing on a Fin site(earth shattering info I know). Anyway. I didn't want to misrepresent so I starting looking at your roster, draft picks etc. in order to get a general idea, and this is what I came up with.

I feel the Bills are young, talented and perfectly positioned in the 2008 draft to fill team needs w/o spending much time, if any, chasing free agents.

RD1(11) - Leodis McKelvin CB Troy
RD2(10) - Limas Sweed WR Texas
RD3(08) - Geno Hayes OLB Florida State
RD3(09) - Brad Cottam TE Tennessee
RD4(15) - Owen Schmitt FB West Virginia
RD5(10) - Kirk Barton T/G Ohio State
RD5(14) - Tommy Blake DE TCU
RD6(13) - Marcus Harrison DT Arkansas
RD7(12) - Doug Legursky C Marshall

What do you think???

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[mysticsoto]

What up Bill's fans?

I have signed up to draft as the Bills for a 7 round mock we are doing on a Fin site(earth shattering info I know). Anyway. I didn't want to misrepresent so I starting looking at your roster, draft picks etc. in order to get a general idea, and this is what I came up with.

I feel the Bills are young, talented and perfectly positioned in the 2008 draft to fill team needs w/o spending much time, if any, chasing free agents.

RD1(11) - Leodis McKelvin CB Troy
RD2(10) - Limas Sweed WR Texas
RD3(08) - Geno Hayes OLB Florida State
RD3(09) - Brad Cottam TE Tennessee
RD4(15) - Owen Schmitt FB West Virginia
RD5(10) - Kirk Barton T/G Ohio State
RD5(14) - Tommy Blake DE TCU
RD6(13) - Marcus Harrison DT Arkansas
RD7(12) - Doug Legursky C Marshall

What do you think???

<!-- / message --> And I just now saw The Scouting Zone. Mods I apologize, plz move or delete and i'll re-post it thanks.

Your 1st pick is awful. The Bills are unlikely to take a CB in rd 1 considering our CBs did okay, that we'll get a few back from injuries and that the cover 2 defense doesn't emphasize the need for elite CBs. But on top of all that, I feel you've chosen like the 3rd-4th best CB or so (yes, I know these things can be up for debate). A top LB might have been the best selection if there is no top DT/DE left by #11 to take.

The rest of your draft looks okay, however...

[Devin]

What up Bill's fans?

I have signed up to draft as the Bills for a 7 round mock we are doing on a Fin site(earth shattering info I know). Anyway. I didn't want to misrepresent so I starting looking at your roster, draft picks etc. in order to get a general idea, and this is what I came up with.

I feel the Bills are young, talented and perfectly positioned in the 2008 draft to fill team needs w/o spending much time, if any, chasing free agents.

RD1(11) - Leodis McKelvin CB Troy
RD2(10) - Limas Sweed WR Texas
RD3(08) - Geno Hayes OLB Florida State
RD3(09) - Brad Cottam TE Tennessee
RD4(15) - Owen Schmitt FB West Virginia
RD5(10) - Kirk Barton T/G Ohio State
RD5(14) - Tommy Blake DE TCU
RD6(13) - Marcus Harrison DT Arkansas
RD7(12) - Doug Legursky C Marshall

What do you think???

And I just now saw The Scouting Zone. Mods I apologize, plz move or delete and i'll re-post it thanks.<!-- / message -->

Apart your 1st pick (which is god awful) I actually dig that draft. Sweed in the 2nd wont happen i dont think but if it did id be thrilled.

I love the Schmitt pick as well as the Blake pick (assuming hes sorted out his issues). Legursky in the 7th would be awesome as well.

Trade that first pick in for a DT/LB and youd be cooking. Not bad man.

[BehindEnemyLines]

Your 1st pick is awful. The Bills are unlikely to take a CB in rd 1 considering our CBs did okay, that we'll get a few back from injuries and that the cover 2 defense doesn't emphasize the need for elite CBs. But on top of all that, I feel you've chosen like the 3rd-4th best CB or so (yes, I know these things can be up for debate). A top LB might have been the best selection if there is no top DT/DE left by #11 to take.

The rest of your draft looks okay, however...

I didn't realize the Bills were strictly a cover 2 team. Knowing that I would go with either Talib or Jenkins w/ that pick. IMO it definitely represents the best value at 11. Rivers, Connors shouldn't go until late 1 and I don't think there is much of a drop off b/w them and guys line Vince Hall and Geno Hayes. As you said, there probably won't be a DT/DE left. Just to defend my first pick, I believe when it's all said and done(combine,prodays,etc..)
All 4 CB's(McKelvin,DRC,Talib,Jenkins) will go high.

[Confused]

pretty much everything but the schmitt pick in the 4th round sux. McKelvin?! If we took a cb in the 1st, it would be DRC. Highsmith in the 3rd followed by Martellus Bennett. Sweed is gone by the 5th pick in the 2nd if he makes it out of the 1st.
Who the ***** is doug legurski?

[Nighthawk]

I do not want the Bills picking a CB that high, but most of you have to get off the guy's back for picking McKelvin. McKelvin might be or will be the top CB in the draft, so him going there is not out of the realm of possibility. That being said, I still don't like that for the Bills. I want a big DT or River/Connors.

[Confused]

conner is not a top 15 pick. nor is Rivers. If Malcolm Kelly runs a sub 4.45 40, he is. If Sedric Ellis is there, he is. otherwise we trade down and grab a third and either Sweed/Hardy, or Fred Davis/DRC. BOOYAA

[mysticsoto]

I didn't realize the Bills were strictly a cover 2 team. Knowing that I would go with either Talib or Jenkins w/ that pick. IMO it definitely represents the best value at 11. Rivers, Connors shouldn't go until late 1 and I don't think there is much of a drop off b/w them and guys line Vince Hall and Geno Hayes. As you said, there probably won't be a DT/DE left. Just to defend my first pick, I believe when it's all said and done(combine,prodays,etc..)
All 4 CB's(McKelvin,DRC,Talib,Jenkins) will go high.

No, the best value would be Rivers or Connors. They are beasts and would help solidify our front 7 which is pretty shaky due to the front 4 not always being able to penetrate. At the very least, it would help stop or slow down the run with top notch LBs there - which is what we desperately need. A CB in the 1st rd would be a waste. The 1st CBs that go are usually the ones that can play great in man to man (teams want shutdown corners). We don't need that. The CBs will be playing strictly coverage/zones only in our system. Ideally, we want a CB with speed, height and good hands (for interceptions). We don't need them to have the ability to stay man to man with a WR, etc. I think Tracy Porter or Patrick Lee are well suited for cover 2 and can likely be had in the 2nd/3rd rds. There are several others that qualify also.

If Ellis is gone and you can't trade up to get him, Gholston is another possibility given that we lost Hargrove on a drug test suspension. Again, the cover 2 lives and dies by the up front pass rush and currently we are not getting it enough consistently. All priority has to be given to drafting a front 4 Dlinemen if available and worth it. If not, LBs are next since they help support the front 4. Following that could be a WR if one warrants being taken that high. As of now, I don't feel any warrant it, but the combine could prove me wrong. Malcolm Kelly is probably at the top of my list. He's a tall WR with speed. He's not polished however, which is why taking him at #11 is a bit of a reach. However, if he shows sub 4.5 speed, he may be worth it anyway. But he likely won't contribute as much as we might need him to in his 1st year...which is why I advocate we grab a WR in FA also...

[Mahdi]

I do not want the Bills picking a CB that high, but most of you have to get off the guy's back for picking McKelvin. McKelvin might be or will be the top CB in the draft, so him going there is not out of the realm of possibility. That being said, I still don't like that for the Bills. I want a big DT or River/Connors.
At this point Aqib Talib is the best CB in the draft. I would say that DRC is 2nd, Antoine Cason is 3rd and Mike Jenkins is 4th.

[BehindEnemyLines]

pretty much everything but the schmitt pick in the 4th round sux. McKelvin?! If we took a cb in the 1st, it would be DRC. Highsmith in the 3rd followed by Martellus Bennett. Sweed is gone by the 5th pick in the 2nd if he makes it out of the 1st.
Who the ***** is doug legurski?

Thanks for the well thought out feedback. I guess all of my picks do suck if you think Highsmith and Bennett stick until the third . Good luck with that! Due to Sweed's injuries, he could very well last that long. Much more likely than your two suggestions for the third.

[BehindEnemyLines]

No, the best value would be Rivers or Connors. They are beasts and would help solidify our front 7 which is pretty shaky due to the front 4 not always being able to penetrate. At the very least, it would help stop or slow down the run with top notch LBs there - which is what we desperately need. A CB in the 1st rd would be a waste. The 1st CBs that go are usually the ones that can play great in man to man (teams want shutdown corners). We don't need that. The CBs will be playing strictly coverage/zones only in our system. Ideally, we want a CB with speed, height and good hands (for interceptions). We don't need them to have the ability to stay man to man with a WR, etc. I think Tracy Porter or Patrick Lee are well suited for cover 2 and can likely be had in the 2nd/3rd rds. There are several others that qualify also.

If Ellis is gone and you can't trade up to get him, Gholston is another possibility given that we lost Hargrove on a drug test suspension. Again, the cover 2 lives and dies by the up front pass rush and currently we are not getting it enough consistently. All priority has to be given to drafting a front 4 Dlinemen if available and worth it. If not, LBs are next since they help support the front 4. Following that could be a WR if one warrants being taken that high. As of now, I don't feel any warrant it, but the combine could prove me wrong. Malcolm Kelly is probably at the top of my list. He's a tall WR with speed. He's not polished however, which is why taking him at #11 is a bit of a reach. However, if he shows sub 4.5 speed, he may be worth it anyway. But he likely won't contribute as much as we might need him to in his 1st year...which is why I advocate we grab a WR in FA also...

I understand what the cover 2 does and what players are needed to run it. I didn't realize the Bills were strictly cover 2. That being said, I would probably (as stated earlier) draft either Talib or Jenkins with that pick. Connors and Rivers value IMO, and many others I've read, lies in the late first. The reason you give for selecting a linebacker: "they help support the front 4" and "At the very least it would help stop or slow down the run with top-notch linebackers there". My question to you. Did you watch the Colts play at all this year. Marlin Jackson and Kelvin Hayden finished 3rd and 4th in tackles, with 88 and 83 respectively. If you did indeed watch the Colts than you know that those tackles were not being made ten yards down the field, but rather at or around the line of scrimmage. Both impacted their run defense in a huge way. If thats what your looking for, than Jenkins would be my first choice. He is extremely physical against the run as far as CBs are concerned and could easily play either S or CB in the NFL. Talib, although strictly a cover 2 corner due to foot speed, would provide you with more of a play maker in the passing game.

LB's in a cover 2 are somewhat easier to find, as they don't meet the general size requirement of non cover 2 teams. Long before I started fooling around with this draft, I discussed(another forum) how well Geno Hayes would fit into the cover 2. IMHO a better fit and better value than either Rivers or Connors.

Tracy Porter is definitely not a cover 2 corner. The knock on him during Senior Bowl week, and before, has been that he is not very physical and is generally poor against the run. McKelvin would be a much better fit for the cover 2 in that respect. And definitely not a bad pick at 11.

At your 2nd pick, their should be a group of WR's that include Sweed, Doucet, Caldwell, Manningham and Devin Thomas. If at least one not named Manningham makes it to your selection(likely) it would be a better pick than reaching for Kelly at 11.

http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/players.php?genpos=WR&draftyear=2008&sortorder=tsxpos&order=ASC


Gholston and Ellis won't be there. As a Dolphin's fan I would prefer the Bills spend their first on a LB or reach for a WR. JMO.

[Roscoe'sChicken69]

Sweed Is A First Round Pick.

[Yasgur's Farm]

1) Ellis is currently top 5.
2) Rivers is currently top 10.
3) Sweed has slipped to late 1st, early 2nd.

http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/top64.php?draftyear=2008 (http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/top64.php?draftyear=2008)

I flip/flop dailey... But today I'm going with...
1) WR Malcolm Kelly
2) DE Phillip Merling
3a) TE Martin Rucker
3b) DT Red Bryant
4) CB Charles Godfrey
5a) DE Chris Harrington
5b) C Jamey Richards
6) ILB Ben Moffitt
7a) OG Shannpn Tevage
7b) OT Breno Giacomini

[DraftBoy]

1) Ellis is currently top 5.
2) Rivers is currently top 10.
3) Sweed has slipped to late 1st, early 2nd.

Rivers isnt top 10

[TigerJ]

Your 1st pick is awful. The Bills are unlikely to take a CB in rd 1 considering our CBs did okay, that we'll get a few back from injuries and that the cover 2 defense doesn't emphasize the need for elite CBs. But on top of all that, I feel you've chosen like the 3rd-4th best CB or so (yes, I know these things can be up for debate). A top LB might have been the best selection if there is no top DT/DE left by #11 to take.

The rest of your draft looks okay, however...

I agree on the first pick, but it's surprising how many draft pundits outside Buffalo think Buffalo needs a CB more than anything else. I think the Bills could use another good CB, but the need at least two or three other positions more. I saw a mock yesterday where Buffalo takes safety Kenny Phillips in round one. In the comments the mocker stated that Phillips would take the starting position away from Jim Leonhard. DUH!!!!!!! I guess he noticed Leonhard started the last couple games and just assumed Leonard is the Bills' full time starter at free safety. He doesn't seem to comprehend that Ko Simpson will be coming back from injury, and George Wilson would have started the rest of the way had he not been injured. If Buffalo adds no one at FS next season, Leonhard will be no better than third string.

[Yasgur's Farm]

Rivers isnt top 10I dunno bout that... 1st 4 site I look at...
9th http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/top64.php?draftyear=2008
10th http://qisports.com/nfldraft.html
12th http://www.nfldraftcountdown.com/sub/rankings.html
9th http://walterfootball.com/draft2008.php

[BehindEnemyLines]

I agree on the first pick, but it's surprising how many draft pundits outside Buffalo think Buffalo needs a CB more than anything else. I think the Bills could use another good CB, but the need at least two or three other positions more. I saw a mock yesterday where Buffalo takes safety Kenny Phillips in round one. In the comments the mocker stated that Phillips would take the starting position away from Jim Leonhard. DUH!!!!!!! I guess he noticed Leonhard started the last couple games and just assumed Leonard is the Bills' full time starter at free safety. He doesn't seem to comprehend that Ko Simpson will be coming back from injury, and George Wilson would have started the rest of the way had he not been injured. If Buffalo adds no one at FS next season, Leonhard will be no better than third string.

I don't think that the Bills need a CB, I'm just of the mindset that u take the BPA. At #11 I think corner is just that. And a solid CB certainly wouldn't hurt.

[Yasgur's Farm]

You're playing both BZ.com and BB.com... I smell a Bills fan wearing a blow hole!!

http://boards.buffalobills.com/showthread.php?t=39020 (http://boards.buffalobills.com/showthread.php?t=39020)

[LifetimeBillsFan]

Put me down as someone who would not be shocked if the Bills were to draft a CB on the first day, especially if they were to trade down and pick up another 2nd or 3rd, but I doubt that it would be McKelvin or Jenkins.

While it is true that McGee and Greer did a good job at CB last season and that they will be getting Webster and K.Thomas back, along with Youboty, I think P.Fewell realized something as the season progressed: if you stay in a Cover 2 constantly against certain teams that the Bills play, it is going to be a very long day because you are going to get picked apart. The Bills have to be able to go to man-to-man in certain situations, but, when they do, McGee, Greer and Webster are simply too short to be effective. They need at least one bigger CB who can go man-to-man in those situations: K.Thomas can't do that and Youboty hasn't shown that he has developed enough to be able to do it either. Ideally, I think the Bills would hope that Youboty takes a big step up this coming season, but I'm not sure that they can afford to wait to find out if he will--and they're obviously not happy with his progress thus far.

The reason they won't go with Jenkins is simple: he's too small. He's basically the same size as McGee and Greer and they are not bad against the run, so you wouldn't pick up much by drafting him.

The problem with McKelvin is that, while it is truly impressive the way that he gets his hands on the ball, he just doesn't catch it. Generating turnovers is a big key to the success of a Tampa 2 defense and, while a shutdown corner isn't necessary, having CBs who can turn the ball over to the offense with INTs is. Bills DC P.Fewell, who was the Bears' DB coach before coming to Buffalo knows how much having a ball-hawking CB, like C.Tillman or R.Barber, can make a T-2 defense more effective. Now, maybe McKelvin can learn to go for the turnover and catch the ball better, but being a true ball-hawk is something that almost comes naturally rather than being something that's learned. And, if the Bills are going to spend a high draft pick on a bigger CB who can play man-to-man, I think that they would want to get a guy who is more of a natural ball-hawk if they had a choice.

And, if they were to go for a CB high in the draft, they do have at least one very good choice in D.Rogers-Cromartie. I don't know what kind of stats he put up, but the kid from Auburn also looked like he has a nose for the ball. Aqib Talib, from Kansas, is a ball-hawk, but he is not going to give you much in terms of man-to-man skills because of his lack of foot-speed, which, as I understand it, is also a problem for A.Cason.

If the Bills don't go for a CB early on in the draft, they could still go for one a bit later on. There's one CB that a lot of people are overlooking who could be an interesting pick up later: the kid Williams (Trae, I believe his first name is) from South Florida who played opposite Jenkins. He needs some work, but he played pretty well in college and he isn't a "smurf".

The Bills have a number of needs, but, depending on what they do in free agency, I could see them drafting a CB in one of the first three rounds. I would hope that, if they do use their first pick on a CB, they would do so after a tradedown, however, because I think that, with DRC being as raw as he still is, he probably won't go in the top half of the first round. (At least, if the Bills really want him, I hope not!)

[mysticsoto]

I understand what the cover 2 does and what players are needed to run it. I didn't realize the Bills were strictly cover 2. That being said, I would probably (as stated earlier) draft either Talib or Jenkins with that pick. Connors and Rivers value IMO, and many others I've read, lies in the late first. The reason you give for selecting a linebacker: "they help support the front 4" and "At the very least it would help stop or slow down the run with top-notch linebackers there". My question to you. Did you watch the Colts play at all this year. Marlin Jackson and Kelvin Hayden finished 3rd and 4th in tackles, with 88 and 83 respectively. If you did indeed watch the Colts than you know that those tackles were not being made ten yards down the field, but rather at or around the line of scrimmage. Both impacted their run defense in a huge way. If thats what your looking for, than Jenkins would be my first choice. He is extremely physical against the run as far as CBs are concerned and could easily play either S or CB in the NFL. Talib, although strictly a cover 2 corner due to foot speed, would provide you with more of a play maker in the passing game.

LB's in a cover 2 are somewhat easier to find, as they don't meet the general size requirement of non cover 2 teams. Long before I started fooling around with this draft, I discussed(another forum) how well Geno Hayes would fit into the cover 2. IMHO a better fit and better value than either Rivers or Connors.

Tracy Porter is definitely not a cover 2 corner. The knock on him during Senior Bowl week, and before, has been that he is not very physical and is generally poor against the run. McKelvin would be a much better fit for the cover 2 in that respect. And definitely not a bad pick at 11.

At your 2nd pick, their should be a group of WR's that include Sweed, Doucet, Caldwell, Manningham and Devin Thomas. If at least one not named Manningham makes it to your selection(likely) it would be a better pick than reaching for Kelly at 11.

http://www.nfldraftscout.com/ratings/players.php?genpos=WR&draftyear=2008&sortorder=tsxpos&order=ASC


Gholston and Ellis won't be there. As a Dolphin's fan I would prefer the Bills spend their first on a LB or reach for a WR. JMO.

I disagree with Rivers and Connors. I have them rated as mid 1st rd picks - not late 1st rd picks. The Colts secondary may not necessarily reflect what we will do here - despite it being the same basic defensive style. The whole theory is to get the front 4 causing the pass rush and have the secondary capitalize with interceptions or just cause turnovers in general. If the front 4 is ineffective, then you have to bring LBs and/or defensive backs up to help stop the run - which appears to be what you are advocating. We did so last year. But the result was that the passing game opened up more for opponents. Trying to fix our cover 2 problems by getting better CBs first, is putting a band-aid on the problem rather than actually fixing it. You may get slightly better play at times, but you will still suffer from the same overall injury that you have been suffering from until you actually cure it...

[mysticsoto]

I should probably mention that if we trade down, I'd be less upset with grabbing a CB, although if we did draft down, I'd much prefer grabbing the WR Kelly instead. As I said before, I feel that are good CBs that can be had in the 2nd/3rd rd that will be great cover 2.

[TigerJ]

It's possible the Bills could draft a CB in the first round, Lifetime and Behind. It's interesting to note however, that more than any other position, draft pundits can settle on who is the best CB available. For a while Antoine Cason was the consensus top guy. Then it was Malcolm Jenkins (who decided to stay in school) then Mike Jenkins, but then some say it's Aqib Talib or Reggie Smith or Tracy Porter or Terrell Thomas. Iv'e seen every one of those guys listed as the first CB taken and every one of them projected as a Bills first round pick at one point or another. Now McKelvey is the hot name since Mike Mayock got on his bandwagon (even though Mayock says he doesn't have very good ball skills). It's a little tough to argue BPA when pundits are having a tough time agreeing on who the best CB is and sticking with it.

[DraftBoy]

RD1(11) - Leodis McKelvin CB Troy
RD2(10) - Limas Sweed WR Texas
RD3(08) - Geno Hayes OLB Florida State
RD3(09) - Brad Cottam TE Tennessee
RD4(15) - Owen Schmitt FB West Virginia
RD5(10) - Kirk Barton T/G Ohio State
RD5(14) - Tommy Blake DE TCU
RD6(13) - Marcus Harrison DT Arkansas
RD7(12) - Doug Legursky C Marshall

What do you think???

<!-- / message -->

1. McKelvin-Pass, as many have already stated the guy can bat the ball away but what about creating the turnovers and making them happen? Id prefer a guy like Talib, DRC, Jenkins, Porter, Wheatley, Williams, or a number of others.

2. Sweed-Not a bad pick but I still am very unsure about his wrist and if he cant do a pro day he'll drop like a rock. The wrist was supposed to be fine by now, I dont know what the delay is.

3a. Hayes-May be a little early for Hayes here but by no way is it a bad pick. Hayes can make plays sideline to sideline and has the speed to play the outside. I thought he had some character issues though but Im not sure.

3b.Cottam-May be a little high for him here, Id prefer him in rd 5 if he's still avail, I think that Rucker could still be here at this point and is a much better pick, than a very raw TE.

4. Schmitt-I dont see any logic to this pick, we signed a blocking FB in Barnes and a guy we could get in Rd 7 or as a UDFA in Micheal Cox from GT is just as good a blocker. I dont see our offense really needing a FB who can really carry the ball.

5a. Barton-Good Value Pick here, I really like it, may look to see if Eric Young from Tennessee is still avail but Barton is a good pick.

5b. Blake-I love Blake and I think he could be a steal but I think he'll be avail later, his stock is at rock bottom.

6. Harrison-I dont see him going this low but it is possible he is at 310 right now, so alot will depend on how he looks at the combine, not a bad pick for Rd 6 though

7. Legursky-Not a bad pick, nothing spectacular...I got nothing else really to say

[BehindEnemyLines]

I disagree with Rivers and Connors. I have them rated as mid 1st rd picks - not late 1st rd picks. The Colts secondary may not necessarily reflect what we will do here - despite it being the same basic defensive style. The whole theory is to get the front 4 causing the pass rush and have the secondary capitalize with interceptions or just cause turnovers in general. If the front 4 is ineffective, then you have to bring LBs and/or defensive backs up to help stop the run - which appears to be what you are advocating. We did so last year. But the result was that the passing game opened up more for opponents. Trying to fix our cover 2 problems by getting better CBs first, is putting a band-aid on the problem rather than actually fixing it. You may get slightly better play at times, but you will still suffer from the same overall injury that you have been suffering from until you actually cure it...

We can agree to disagree about how valuable R and C are.

I don't see anyone falling to #11 that is going to help you with your pass rush.

I'm not suggesting this. Simply, CB will be the BPA when you select and that they can impact your run D.

I don't think you go into the draft expecting to "cure" all that ails you with your first pick. You simply pick the BPA.

[BehindEnemyLines]

Put me down as someone who would not be shocked if the Bills were to draft a CB on the first day, especially if they were to trade down and pick up another 2nd or 3rd, but I doubt that it would be McKelvin or Jenkins.

While it is true that McGee and Greer did a good job at CB last season and that they will be getting Webster and K.Thomas back, along with Youboty, I think P.Fewell realized something as the season progressed: if you stay in a Cover 2 constantly against certain teams that the Bills play, it is going to be a very long day because you are going to get picked apart. The Bills have to be able to go to man-to-man in certain situations, but, when they do, McGee, Greer and Webster are simply too short to be effective. They need at least one bigger CB who can go man-to-man in those situations: K.Thomas can't do that and Youboty hasn't shown that he has developed enough to be able to do it either. Ideally, I think the Bills would hope that Youboty takes a big step up this coming season, but I'm not sure that they can afford to wait to find out if he will--and they're obviously not happy with his progress thus far.

The reason they won't go with Jenkins is simple: he's too small. He's basically the same size as McGee and Greer and they are not bad against the run, so you wouldn't pick up much by drafting him.

The problem with McKelvin is that, while it is truly impressive the way that he gets his hands on the ball, he just doesn't catch it. Generating turnovers is a big key to the success of a Tampa 2 defense and, while a shutdown corner isn't necessary, having CBs who can turn the ball over to the offense with INTs is. Bills DC P.Fewell, who was the Bears' DB coach before coming to Buffalo knows how much having a ball-hawking CB, like C.Tillman or R.Barber, can make a T-2 defense more effective. Now, maybe McKelvin can learn to go for the turnover and catch the ball better, but being a true ball-hawk is something that almost comes naturally rather than being something that's learned. And, if the Bills are going to spend a high draft pick on a bigger CB who can play man-to-man, I think that they would want to get a guy who is more of a natural ball-hawk if they had a choice.

And, if they were to go for a CB high in the draft, they do have at least one very good choice in D.Rogers-Cromartie. I don't know what kind of stats he put up, but the kid from Auburn also looked like he has a nose for the ball. Aqib Talib, from Kansas, is a ball-hawk, but he is not going to give you much in terms of man-to-man skills because of his lack of foot-speed, which, as I understand it, is also a problem for A.Cason.

If the Bills don't go for a CB early on in the draft, they could still go for one a bit later on. There's one CB that a lot of people are overlooking who could be an interesting pick up later: the kid Williams (Trae, I believe his first name is) from South Florida who played opposite Jenkins. He needs some work, but he played pretty well in college and he isn't a "smurf".

The Bills have a number of needs, but, depending on what they do in free agency, I could see them drafting a CB in one of the first three rounds. I would hope that, if they do use their first pick on a CB, they would do so after a tradedown, however, because I think that, with DRC being as raw as he still is, he probably won't go in the top half of the first round. (At least, if the Bills really want him, I hope not!)

Greer is 5-11 180. McGee is 5-9 198. Jenkins is 6' 200. Whether it be height(McGee) or bulk(Greer) I don't see Jenkins as being "basically the same size".

Agreed. Jenkins is pretty good at getting his hands on the ball.

As stated earlier, I'm picking for the Bills in a mock on another forum(posted this for feedback and probably getting a lil too involved) and I know DRC is going to the Pats. So I'm forced to choose b/w what's left. Although I still think CB represents the best value.

[DraftBoy]

Update us as the picks come in and we'll provide you with realistic options, most of the guys in here are excellent sources for draft info and are probably better then the pundits on TV.

[BehindEnemyLines]

1. McKelvin-Pass, as many have already stated the guy can bat the ball away but what about creating the turnovers and making them happen? Id prefer a guy like Talib, DRC, Jenkins, Porter, Wheatley, Williams, or a number of others.

2. Sweed-Not a bad pick but I still am very unsure about his wrist and if he cant do a pro day he'll drop like a rock. The wrist was supposed to be fine by now, I dont know what the delay is.

3a. Hayes-May be a little early for Hayes here but by no way is it a bad pick. Hayes can make plays sideline to sideline and has the speed to play the outside. I thought he had some character issues though but Im not sure.

3b.Cottam-May be a little high for him here, Id prefer him in rd 5 if he's still avail, I think that Rucker could still be here at this point and is a much better pick, than a very raw TE.

4. Schmitt-I dont see any logic to this pick, we signed a blocking FB in Barnes and a guy we could get in Rd 7 or as a UDFA in Micheal Cox from GT is just as good a blocker. I dont see our offense really needing a FB who can really carry the ball.

5a. Barton-Good Value Pick here, I really like it, may look to see if Eric Young from Tennessee is still avail but Barton is a good pick.

5b. Blake-I love Blake and I think he could be a steal but I think he'll be avail later, his stock is at rock bottom.

6. Harrison-I dint see him going this low but it is possible he is at 310 right now, so alot will depend on how he looks at the combine, not a bad pick for Rd 6 though

7. Legursky-Not a bad pick, nothing spectacular...I got nothing else really to say

Find it hard to believe that anyone would prefer "Wheatley, Williams or a number of others" to McKelvin, but to each his own.

If teams are basing that much on a pro day instead of tape than they are making a mistake. If their doc's don't clear him or think that he'll be ready for TC that's one thing.

I(for the Fins) would also prefer him in rd 5.

Don't know if Rucker will be here, but that fact that he hasn't had to play in-line concerns me. From that standpoint, you could almost say that he is very raw.

Wouldn't count on Barnes. Been there, done that. Schmitt is a much better FB than Cox. Cox is a hell of a blocker(watched him take apart the Canes) but a bit of a one trick pony. Having a FB with good hands and RAC ability, IMO would really help out a young QB. Also, I stole this pick from another Bill's forum.

[BehindEnemyLines]

Update us as the picks come in and we'll provide you with realistic options, most of the guys in here are excellent sources for draft info and are probably better then the pundits on TV.

Appreciate it. Thnx.

[DraftBoy]

Find it hard to believe that anyone would prefer "Wheatley, Williams or a number of others" to McKelvin, but to each his own.

If teams are basing that much on a pro day instead of tape than they are making a mistake. If their doc's don't clear him or think that he'll be ready for TC that's one thing.

I(for the Fins) would also prefer him in rd 5.

Don't know if Rucker will be here, but that fact that he hasn't had to play in-line concerns me. From that standpoint, you could almost say that he is very raw.

Wouldn't count on Barnes. Been there, done that. Schmitt is a much better FB than Cox. Cox is a hell of a blocker(watched him take apart the Canes) but a bit of a one trick pony. Having a FB with good hands and RAC ability, IMO would really help out a young QB. Also, I stole this pick from another Bill's forum.

I wasnt saying that Id take Wheatley or Williams at #11 but I would late in the draft as both kids can make plays. Wheatley had 5 picks this year and while he is only 5'9 he can fly and jump. Trae Williams picked off 6 last year.

I dont think teams will judge Sweed solely on his pro day but if his wrist still isnt healed thats going to really hurt him.

Who would you prefer in the 5th?

[mysticsoto]

Greer is 5-11 180. McGee is 5-9 198. Jenkins is 6' 200. Whether it be height(McGee) or bulk(Greer) I don't see Jenkins as being "basically the same size".

Agreed. Jenkins is pretty good at getting his hands on the ball.

As stated earlier, I'm picking for the Bills in a mock on another forum(posted this for feedback and probably getting a lil too involved) and I know DRC is going to the Pats. So I'm forced to choose b/w what's left. Although I still think CB represents the best value.

You feel DRC is going at #7 to the Pats? I'm not sure I can agree with that. I like DRC, but that's awfully high to take him in - he has great potential, but he's still a bit raw.

For what it's worth, I'd probably rather Jenkins over McKelvin - but still...neither at #11. You may be right (in your other post) that there's no one that will help with our pass rush by #11. In which case, if we don't grab a viable #2 WR in FA, I would advocate we go that way with our 1st pick. Of course, a slight trade down would be preferred...

[BehindEnemyLines]

You feel DRC is going at #7 to the Pats? I'm not sure I can agree with that. I like DRC, but that's awfully high to take him in - he has great potential, but he's still a bit raw.

For what it's worth, I'd probably rather Jenkins over McKelvin - but still...neither at #11. You may be right (in your other post) that there's no one that will help with our pass rush by #11. In which case, if we don't grab a viable #2 WR in FA, I would advocate we go that way with our 1st pick. Of course, a slight trade down would be preferred...

I was told by the "GM" of the Pats that DRC wouldn't get past him. In my next post, you'll see that he lied.

[DraftBoy]

He's talking about in his GM Mock, Mystic not in real life

[mysticsoto]

He's talking about in his GM Mock, Mystic not in real life

Got it. Thanks...

[BehindEnemyLines]

First off, thanks for the feedback! Much appreciated!

DraftBoy suggested that I keep you all updated and allow for feedback. Good idea. I think. So, I'll update the mock as it's happening and if you want to, jump in and tell me who to pick. Obviously, it's just a game, but I consider myself a draft geek. Actually a huge draft geek. So I enjoy it. Let me also say that you all know the Bills, and your opinion on what they should/will do greatly exceeds my own, but I argue b/c it allows me to learn about your team. And for a huge draft/football geek, that's what passes as fun. With that being said, (just like in real life) the GM(that's me) gets last call. Feel free to crucify me(just like you would in real life) for doing something stupid(guaranteed). I also think it will be interesting to hear your take on the picks other Dolfans are making for teams around the league. I'll continue to update throughout(if anyone actually cares), but let me warn you that this draft is the definition of slow.

Drum roll plz:

Round 1

With the 1st pick the Miami Dolphins select CHRIS LONG, DE, VIRGINA
With the 2nd pick the St Louis Rams select GLENN DORSEY, DT, LSU
With the 3rd pick the Kansas City Chiefs select JAKE LONG, OT, MICHIGAN
With the 4th pick the Atlanta Falcons select MATT RYAN, QB, BOSTON COLLEGE
With the 5th pick the Oakland Raiders select SEDRICK ELLIS, DT, USC
With the 6th pick the New York Jets select DARREN MCFADDEN, RB, ARKANSAS
With the 7th pick the New England Patriots select VERNON GHOLSTON, DE/OLB, OSU

The Pats GM lied to me and did not take DRC, so he's an option at 11.

[DraftBoy]

no shocks so far, I think the Jets got a gift in McFadden and NE made a mistake taking Gholston.

[BehindEnemyLines]

I wasnt saying that Id take Wheatley or Williams at #11 but I would late in the draft as both kids can make plays. Wheatley had 5 picks this year and while he is only 5'9 he can fly and jump. Trae Williams picked off 6 last year.

I dont think teams will judge Sweed solely on his pro day but if his wrist still isnt healed thats going to really hurt him.

Who would you prefer in the 5th?

Gotcha!

I would prefer Cottam being available in the 5th for the Fins(although we don't have a five). Just meant later than 3rd. I think the combine gets him into the third however.

[BehindEnemyLines]

no shocks so far, I think the Jets got a gift in McFadden and NE made a mistake taking Gholston.

I'm not that high on McFadden. I think he's a lil bit overrated, JMO. Agree w/ you on Gholston.

And with that the Ravens have selected Brian Brohm. Maybe a bit of a reach, but not a bad pick.

[mysticsoto]

Round 1

With the 1st pick the Miami Dolphins select CHRIS LONG, DE, VIRGINA
With the 2nd pick the St Louis Rams select GLENN DORSEY, DT, LSU
With the 3rd pick the Kansas City Chiefs select JAKE LONG, OT, MICHIGAN
With the 4th pick the Atlanta Falcons select MATT RYAN, QB, BOSTON COLLEGE
With the 5th pick the Oakland Raiders select SEDRICK ELLIS, DT, USC
With the 6th pick the New York Jets select DARREN MCFADDEN, RB, ARKANSAS
With the 7th pick the New England Patriots select VERNON GHOLSTON, DE/OLB, OSU

The Pats GM lied to me and did not take DRC, so he's an option at 11.


So far so good, from my POV. I could see all these picks so far...

[BehindEnemyLines]

Round 1 (updated)

With the 1st pick the Miami Dolphins select CHRIS LONG, DE, VIRGINA
With the 2nd pick the St Louis Rams select GLENN DORSEY, DT, LSU
With the 3rd pick the Kansas City Chiefs select JAKE LONG, OT, MICHIGAN
With the 4th pick the Atlanta Falcons select MATT RYAN, QB, BOSTON COLLEGE
With the 5th pick the Oakland Raiders select SEDRICK ELLIS, DT, USC
With the 6th pick the New York Jets select DARREN MCFADDEN, RB, ARKANSAS
With the 7th pick the New England Patriots select VERNON GHOLSTON, DE, OHIO ST
With the 8th pick the Baltimore Ravens select BRIAN BROHM, QB, LOUISVILLE
With the 9th pick the Cincinnati Bengals select Ryan Clady, OT, BOISE STATE

Saints are up Bills on deck! Who do you want??? Starting to feel the pressure and think OLB:bandwagon . Help!

[LifetimeBillsFan]

Can you trade down?

If so, I'd do it and pick up a 2nd or 3rd in return.

If not, I'd go with Malcolm Kelly, WR, Oklahoma. (I know I'll get an argument on that from the guys who want Rivers or Connor, but I think OLBs for the T-2 defense can be picked up later. CB as well.)

[DraftBoy]

Id go Rivers if you cant trade down if you can, Id look to move down maybe into the 20 range where players like Kentwan Balmer, Malcolm Kelly, Pat Sims, DRC all become options.

[Yasgur's Farm]

Malcolm Kelly gets my vote... But Keith Rivers would not dissapoint me.

I agree with DraftBoy... Moving down is the best option.

[BehindEnemyLines]

Malcolm Kelly gets my vote... But Keith Rivers would not dissapoint me.

I agree with DraftBoy... Moving down is the best option.

No trades unfortunately. Probably could have been talked into Rivers, but my pick came up fast and I went with my gut. For the record, I jst had my knee scoped and I think the meds are screwing with my decision making.

With the 1st pick the Miami Dolphins select CHRIS LONG, DE, VIRGINA
With the 2nd pick the St Louis Rams select GLENN DORSEY, DT, LSU
With the 3rd pick the Kansas City Chiefs select JAKE LONG, OT, MICHIGAN
With the 4th pick the Atlanta Falcons select MATT RYAN, QB, BOSTON COLLEGE
With the 5th pick the Oakland Raiders select SEDRICK ELLIS, DT, USC
With the 6th pick the New York Jets select DARREN MCFADDEN, RB, ARKANSAS
With the 7th pick the New England Patriots select VERNON GHOLSTON, DE, OHIO ST
With the 8th pick the Baltimore Ravens select BRIAN BROHM, QB, LOUISVILLE
With the 9th pick the Cincinnati Bengals select RYAN CLADY, OT, BOISE ST
With the 10th pick the New Orleans Saints select KENNY PHILLIPS, S, MIAMI
With the 11th pick the Buffalo Bills select AQIB TALIB, CB, KANSAS
With the 12th pick the Denver Broncos select KEITH RIVERS, LB, USC
With the 13th pick the Carolina Panthers select RASHARD MENDENHALL, RB, ILLINOIS
With the 14th pick the Chicago Bears select JEFF OTAH, OT, PITTSBURGH

The Broncos rushed their card to the podium, anxious to nab Rivers. I still like my pick. Not sure about the Bengals. And, although I think he's the best back in the draft, would have gone a different direction if I were the Panthers. Like Otah to the Bears.

[DraftBoy]

Talib isnt horrible by any means, Otah isnt bad at this point although I think I have Mendenhall as the 4th or 5th best back. Jones and Stewart are ahead of him.

[BehindEnemyLines]

Wish I would have asked this b4, but what do you all think of Calais Campbell or Derrick Harvey at #11? I'm a Cane fan and follow the Gators closely. Thought both of them were disappointing this season, but CC has some unique tools. He could be awesome on your D.

[DraftBoy]

Id pass at 11

[Yasgur's Farm]

Campbell would have been a reach... But I would have been thrilled with the pick... He's gonna be a beast.

Ideally I'd have us trade down for Kelly... Then trade back in for Campbell.

Who knows... Maybe Dallas will give us #22 and #28 for our #11... Point values are close 1440 to 1250... Maybe we'll have to throw in or #73 too.

[BehindEnemyLines]

Campbell would have been a reach... But I would have been thrilled with the pick... He's gonna be a beast.

Ideally I'd have us trade down for Kelly... Then trade back in for Campbell.

Who knows... Maybe Dallas will give us #22 and #28 for our #11... Point values are close 1440 to 1250... Maybe we'll have to throw in or #73 too.

I think Campbell is tough to evaluate. He always looks very slow twitch to me, but then I continually read(local papers) about his phenomenal times and strength, work ethic, etc... His size/length(6-8 282) makes it difficult to tell how sudden he actually is. It also makes it very difficult for O-linemen to get to his chest. If his shuttle, 10, 20, 40 times are good, I would really consider him in this spot.

[Yasgur's Farm]

As you can see from my siggy mock... DE Phillip Merling would be a nice addition too @ #41. I'm not ruling out DT Pat Sims at that slot either.