Bryant Johnson= Josh Reed

[Mad Max]

...plus a few inches. Their production is eerily similar. Look at their yards,TDs, AVG. And after 5years in the league I think it's a pretty big stretch to think that he's going to suddenly blossom (don't give me that Cris Carter BS either.....for every Cris Carter there are 20 Mike Williams).

So to me he's a big :yawn: . Guess he won't hurt if we do end up getting him, but I just don't see him being a big help (like Troupe won't help us either IMO). We gotta get our big guy in the draft regardless.

Here are both of their career stats, go see for yourself.
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/players/stats?playerId=4475

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/players/stats?playerId=3564

[Mitchy moo]

Arizona has been a doormat forever.

[Mad Max]

Arizona has been a doormat forever.

Of course that's 100% accurate scoobster, yet somehow Boldin and Larry Fitzgerald both "got theirs" didn't they.

[RockStar36]

Maybe his production is similar because he was BEHIND Boldin and Fitz. That makes a huge difference. What is Josh Reed's excuse? He was behind Peerless Price?

[tampabay25690]

...plus a few inches. Their production is eerily similar. Look at their yards,TDs, AVG. And after 5years in the league I think it's a pretty big stretch to think that he's going to suddenly blossom (don't give me that Cris Carter BS either.....for every Cris Carter there are 20 Mike Williams).

So to me he's a big :yawn: . Guess he won't hurt if we do end up getting him, but I just don't see him being a big help (like Troupe won't help us either IMO). We gotta get our big guy in the draft regardless.

Here are both of their career stats, go see for yourself.
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/players/stats?playerId=4475

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/players/stats?playerId=3564


WHY is that everone looks at STATS 1st.......

The guy si splaying behind 2 #1 WR.....In Buffalo we have 1 #1 WR in EVANS......If Johnson has a chance you know the guy wants to show that he can shine.

You have to look at what a guy can do not at STATS

[Don't Panic]

Did Josh Reed play behind two Pro Bowlers the last 4 years? When Johnson was given the opportunity, he performed. Redd has been given the same opportunity multiple times and done nothing. He is an adequate #2, and a definite upgrade over Reed.

[Mad Max]

Maybe his production is similar because he was BEHIND Boldin and Fitz. That makes a huge difference. What is Josh Reed's excuse? He was behind Peerless Price?

He was drafted (1st round) before both of those guys. So that means he was ahead of the curve experience wise (by a long shot) against both those guys, yet he still couldn't stay/get ahead of them. He ws severly outclassed by both of them, that's why he was behind them. Same reason Reed was behind Price. Do you think we'd have brought Price back if Reed performed as a #2 should?

[alohabillsfan]

I really don't think Reed and Johnson are even comparable... Look at some of the Johnson highlights and find me 1 of josh reed making a similar play!

[tampabay25690]

Well like it or not and I think most of us that knows football (LIKE IT)...

But Bryant Johnson will be announced today as the Newest Member of the Buffalo Bills. Finally on buffalobills.com they stated that Johnson will be signed today.

Im sure they are just working out a few details.....

NICE

[colin]

dude, this isn't madden.

we need size and physical play. jonson can provide some of that for us.

a screen or slant to him can go for more than 3 yards because of his physical ability. we don't have anyone like that now.

we do also need another wr (2nd round rook is what i am thinking, someone will fall) and TE. i expect an FA te and a rook as well.

every player we add is allowing more production for our O.

and i can't shake the feeling that in the first 4 rounds we are gonna grab an interior blocker who ends up falling.

[Mad Max]

...
But Bryant Johnson will be announced today as the Newest Member of the Buffalo Bills.



Great. Then I hope he catches 10 TD's. Like I said in my original post I am ambivalent about him. I hope he does well (now that he's a Bill), I just don't think he's an improvement over Reed (maybe one or two coffin corner ally-oops notwithstanding).

[Night Train]

He did have problems with drops early in his career, causing the Cards to select Larry Fitz to play across from Bouldin. The drops became more infrequent as he moved to a #3 role.

I still think the Bills draft another WR at some point, regardless of the signing. They cut Peerless and let Aiken walk. Same goes for TE, even if they sign Troupe. Seems to be short and Royal is no cinch. He bobbles the ball too much.

[tampabay25690]

He did have problems with drops early in his career, causing the Cards to select Larry Fitz to play across from Bouldin. The drops became more infrequent as he moved to a #3 role.

I still think the Bills draft another WR at some point, regardless of the signing. They cut Peerless and let Aiken walk. Same goes for TE, even if they sign Troupe. Seems to be short and Royal is no cinch. He bobbles the ball too much.

Another WR for sure, I say you keep Royal though. I would like to see him and Troupe opposite each other.

[colin]

we play 3 wide and 2 TE often enough to really need 4 wrs and 3 TEs on the team who we can put in there.

even if it is for less than a week, a couple of these guys are gonna get dinged up. reed, evans, parish, johnson, rook, we need em all.

the colts this year had a rough patch (although they also lost two tackles and the most expensive DE ever!!) starting against the pats by losing their wideouts all in one game. if they had an extra guy who could play they may well have beaten the pats.

although you need a bunch of good DL and OL, you need linebackers on D to make the tackles and WRs on O to catch the ball.
somebody has to finish the play.

[THATHURMANATOR]

Accept Johnson is 6'3" while Reed is 5'10". We needed a bigger target bottom line.

[tampabay25690]

Accept Johnson is 6'3" while Reed is 5'10". We needed a bigger target bottom line.

I AGREE with you 100%% (FOR ONCE)

[THATHURMANATOR]

I AGREE with you 100%% (FOR ONCE)
:hi5:

[Jan Reimers]

Johnson is certainly a different receiver than Reed. Whether he will become our true #2 WR remains to be seen, but we know that Reed never will be. I can't figure out why some people dump on a guy before he ever puts on a Bills' uniform.

[TacklingDummy]

Maybe his production is similar because he was BEHIND Boldin and Fitz. That makes a huge difference. What is Josh Reed's excuse? He was behind Peerless Price?

Wouldn't being on the field with both Boldin and Fitz make the coverage more loose on Johnson?

[TacklingDummy]

I really don't think Reed and Johnson are even comparable... Look at some of the Johnson highlights and find me 1 of josh reed making a similar play!

Has Johnson every ducked on a pass?

[DraftBoy]

Wouldn't being on the field with both Boldin and Fitz make the coverage more loose on Johnson?

Gotta have a QB who is both capable of finding his 3rd option and who has time to do so.

[TacklingDummy]

Gotta have a QB who is both capable of finding his 3rd option and who has time to do so.

Kurt Warner is a pretty good QB at times.

[DraftBoy]

Kurt Warner is a pretty good QB at times.

You should change "is" to "was"

[don137]

Just because they had similar stats does not mean they are similar players. There is a big difference being a #2 and a #3 WR not to mention Johnson is much taller than Reed. Its one thing to say you watch a lot of Cardinals football (I doubt anyone alive can say that) and you know a lot about him but going by what's on paper does not mean they are the same kind of player.
I admit he is a little bit of a risk because we do not know a lot about him. However, being stuck behind two pro-bowl WRs will hurt any WR.

[madness]

Bryant Johnson is going to be just as reliable on 3rd downs as Josh Reed? Sweet.

[gr8slayer]

...plus a few inches. Their production is eerily similar. Look at their yards,TDs, AVG. And after 5years in the league I think it's a pretty big stretch to think that he's going to suddenly blossom (don't give me that Cris Carter BS either.....for every Cris Carter there are 20 Mike Williams).

So to me he's a big :yawn: . Guess he won't hurt if we do end up getting him, but I just don't see him being a big help (like Troupe won't help us either IMO). We gotta get our big guy in the draft regardless.

Here are both of their career stats, go see for yourself.
http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/players/stats?playerId=4475

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/players/stats?playerId=3564
No offense but that's a pretty ignorant statement. Their styles of play are like night and day.

[gr8slayer]

You should change "is" to "was"
Better than anything we have on our roster.

[TacklingDummy]

You should change "is" to "was"

27 TDs, 3417 yards, last year, and that's with missing 2 games and only having 2 pass attempts in another.

[gr8slayer]

27 TDs, 3417 yards, last year, and that's with missing 2 games and only having 2 pass attempts in another.
And he wasn't even starting until week seven when Leinart went down for good.

[Tatonka]

Gotta have a QB who is both capable of finding his 3rd option and who has time to do so.

what about the same qb that was able to get the ball to boldin and fitz a 100 times a season consistently? that arguement is so tired, because the guys around him, and the guy behind him, urban, were able to produce.

[DraftBoy]

Better than anything we have on our roster.


Thats like saying that you're the tallest person in a room full of midgets.

[gr8slayer]

Thats like saying that you're the tallest person in a room full of midgets.
But the truth.

[Tatonka]

27 TDs, 3417 yards, last year, and that's with missing 2 games and only having 2 pass attempts in another.

wow.. those stats suck.. how can you expect a wr to do anything with that.. along with the 8 starts johnson got too.. so he really WASNT playing behind anyone for half the season.. same with last season.. 8 starts.. that is 16 starts in 2 years.. that is a full season.. yet the numbers are well below average.. few tds.. below average yardage.. no big games at all..

i just pray we didnt pay another average wr that just happens to be tall starters money.. because he may very well not be able to hold down a starting spot.

[DraftBoy]

what about the same qb that was able to get the ball to boldin and fitz a 100 times a season consistently? that arguement is so tired, because the guys around him, and the guy behind him, urban, were able to produce.

Consistently? You do know to be consistent in something you have to do it more than once, right? Only one time in their careers have Boldin and Fitzy both had over 100 catches, that was in 2005 with Warner. In 06 Bolding had 83 catches and Fitzy had 69, and last year it was Boldin with 71, and Ftizy 100. And Urban produced? 22 catches for 329 and 2 TD is producing but 46 catches for 528 yards, and 2 TD's isnt? Thats not a bias statement or anything. Im sure you'll cling to the lack of TD catches and again Ill retort it with when TD catches are the only barometer of TD's Ill give credence to that fact.

[DraftBoy]

wow.. those stats suck.. how can you expect a wr to do anything with that.. along with the 8 starts johnson got too.. so he really WASNT playing behind anyone for half the season.. same with last season.. 8 starts.. that is 16 starts in 2 years.. that is a full season.. yet the numbers are well below average.. few tds.. below average yardage.. no big games at all..

i just pray we didnt pay another average wr that just happens to be tall starters money.. because he may very well not be able to hold down a starting spot.


TD didnt mention his 19 INT's either..just saying


So now you want to talk averages...ok. Of the FA WR's avail who avg the most catches per year, and the most yards? Ill wait the information is readily available.

[Mr. Pink]

TD didnt mention his 19 INT's either..just saying


So now you want to talk averages...ok. Of the FA WR's avail who avg the most catches per year, and the most yards? Ill wait the information is readily available.

This one was easy...Randy Moss, duh!

[Tatonka]

urban has had a better game than johnson ever has.. as a 4th wr..

and the bottom line is that the starting 2 wrs in arizona have produced.. period.

when johnson has started 16 games, he has done ****.. including his 1 catch for 5 yards in his final game as a starter before free agency began... way to show everyone what your made of.

JOHNSON IS AVERAGE TO BELOW AVERAGE AND HAS NEVER SHOWN ANYTHING OTHERWISE IN HIS 39 CAREER STARTS. PERIOD.

[Tatonka]

And dont compare johnson to reed.. because reed knows how to block..

[DraftBoy]

urban has had a better game than johnson ever has.. as a 4th wr..

and the bottom line is that the starting 2 wrs in arizona have produced.. period.

when johnson has started 16 games, he has done ****.. including his 1 catch for 5 yards in his final game as a starter before free agency began... way to show everyone what your made of.


Wow Im so glad we are now basing ability off who has the better career game! Yes, my 217 yard receiving game in HS may get me to the NFL yet!

Facts are this; The guy averages more catches a year then Porter, Wilford, or Hackett, he averages more yards as a predominant third option. Has he under produced as a starter? Yes, but does that mean he's complete ****? No, he has been productive as a #3 WR so lets give him a full year as a #2 not a few games here and a few games there because of injury and see what he can do.

[Tatonka]

16 games in 2 seasons is a few games here and there?

:lol:

your right.. lets throw starters money at him and hope he can be a number 2, even though he has shown in 5 years and 39 starts that he is not a good starter.

[DraftBoy]

16 games in 2 seasons is a few games here and there?

:lol:

your right.. lets throw starters money at him and hope he can be a number 2, even though he has shown in 5 years and 39 starts that he is not a good starter.


Pulling figures from thin air again?

[RingofFire]

I really like this guy. I see it as a positive. Gives us much needed size and a chain mover. Allows reed to be in slot. Major, major improvement over Price. Stats are irrelevant. This kid will be a good number 2 option. I like it!

[RockStar36]

Wouldn't being on the field with both Boldin and Fitz make the coverage more loose on Johnson?

Sure. But as a number three you only get so many opportunities to even play let alone get the ball. And it hinges on who is throwing it to you. And that hinges on the offensive line play.

[Tatonka]

Pulling figures from thin air again?

nope, just basing them on the 5-6 million a year his agent stated he was looking for with 8 million up front... and if you want the ****ing link, go dig it up from the other post from this weekend where you tried your best to show that johnson doesnt suck as a starter, even though the facts are so abundently clear.. 39 starts.. pro bowl wrs next to him at all times to take the coverage and double teams away.. and still.. no results..

maybe he and josh reed arent that different.. except johnson just cant block as good.

[ddaryl]

<TABLE class="w655px datatablecell" cellSpacing=0 _extended="true"><TBODY _extended="true"><TR class="datatablehead ARIcolors" _extended="true"><TD colSpan=13 _extended="true">

Stats

Bryant Johnson

Receiving
</TD></TR><TR class=datatabledatahead _extended="true"><TD width=20 _extended="true">Year</TD><TD width=140 _extended="true">Team</TD><TD _extended="true">G</TD><TD _extended="true">Rec</TD><TD _extended="true">Yds</TD><TD _extended="true">Avg</TD><TD _extended="true">Yds/G</TD><TD _extended="true">Long</TD><TD _extended="true">TD</TD><TD _extended="true">20+</TD><TD _extended="true">40+</TD><TD _extended="true">1st</TD><TD _extended="true">FUM</TD></TR><TR class=ltblueback _extended="true"><TD _extended="true">2007</TD><TD _extended="true">Arizona Cardinals (http://www.nfl.com/teams/arizonacardinals/profile?team=ARI) </TD><TD _extended="true">16</TD><TD _extended="true">46</TD><TD _extended="true">528</TD><TD _extended="true">11.5</TD><TD _extended="true">33.0</TD><TD _extended="true">30</TD><TD _extended="true">2</TD><TD _extended="true">2</TD><TD _extended="true">0</TD><TD _extended="true">33</TD><TD _extended="true">0</TD><TR _extended="true"><TR class=whiteback _extended="true"><TD _extended="true">2006</TD><TD _extended="true">Arizona Cardinals (http://www.nfl.com/teams/arizonacardinals/profile?team=ARI) </TD><TD _extended="true">16</TD><TD _extended="true">40</TD><TD _extended="true">740</TD><TD _extended="true">18.5</TD><TD _extended="true">46.2</TD><TD _extended="true">58</TD><TD _extended="true">4</TD><TD _extended="true">14</TD><TD _extended="true">5</TD><TD _extended="true">30</TD><TD _extended="true">0</TD><TR _extended="true"><TR class=ltblueback _extended="true"><TD _extended="true">2005</TD><TD _extended="true">Arizona Cardinals (http://www.nfl.com/teams/arizonacardinals/profile?team=ARI) </TD><TD _extended="true">14</TD><TD _extended="true">40</TD><TD _extended="true">432</TD><TD _extended="true">10.8</TD><TD _extended="true">30.9</TD><TD _extended="true">41</TD><TD _extended="true">1</TD><TD _extended="true">3</TD><TD _extended="true">1</TD><TD _extended="true">25</TD><TD _extended="true">0</TD><TR _extended="true"><TR class=whiteback _extended="true"><TD _extended="true">2004</TD><TD _extended="true">Arizona Cardinals (http://www.nfl.com/teams/arizonacardinals/profile?team=ARI) </TD><TD _extended="true">16</TD><TD _extended="true">49</TD><TD _extended="true">537</TD><TD _extended="true">11.0</TD><TD _extended="true">33.6</TD><TD _extended="true">40</TD><TD _extended="true">1</TD><TD _extended="true">5</TD><TD _extended="true">1</TD><TD _extended="true">29</TD><TD _extended="true">1</TD><TR _extended="true"><TR class=ltblueback _extended="true"><TD _extended="true">2003</TD><TD _extended="true">Arizona Cardinals (http://www.nfl.com/teams/arizonacardinals/profile?team=ARI) </TD><TD _extended="true">15</TD><TD _extended="true">35</TD><TD _extended="true">438</TD><TD _extended="true">12.5</TD><TD _extended="true">29.2</TD><TD _extended="true">54T</TD><TD _extended="true">1</TD><TD _extended="true">4</TD><TD _extended="true">2</TD><TD _extended="true">20</TD><TD _extended="true">1</TD><TR _extended="true"><TR class=datatabledatahead _extended="true"><TD colSpan=2 _extended="true">TOTAL</TD><TD _extended="true">77</TD><TD _extended="true">210</TD><TD _extended="true">2,675</TD><TD _extended="true">12.7</TD><TD _extended="true">34.7</TD><TD _extended="true">58</TD><TD _extended="true">9</TD><TD _extended="true">28</TD><TD _extended="true">9</TD><TD _extended="true">137</TD><TD _extended="true">2</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

Josh Reed

<TABLE class="w655px datatablecell" cellSpacing=0 _extended="true"><TBODY _extended="true"><TR class="datatablehead BUFcolors" _extended="true"><TD colSpan=13 _extended="true">
Receiving
</TD></TR><TR class=datatabledatahead _extended="true"><TD width=20 _extended="true">Year</TD><TD width=140 _extended="true">Team</TD><TD _extended="true">G</TD><TD _extended="true">Rec</TD><TD _extended="true">Yds</TD><TD _extended="true">Avg</TD><TD _extended="true">Yds/G</TD><TD _extended="true">Long</TD><TD _extended="true">TD</TD><TD _extended="true">20+</TD><TD _extended="true">40+</TD><TD _extended="true">1st</TD><TD _extended="true">FUM</TD></TR><TR class=ltblueback _extended="true"><TD _extended="true">2007</TD><TD _extended="true">Buffalo Bills (http://www.nfl.com/teams/buffalobills/profile?team=BUF) </TD><TD _extended="true">15</TD><TD _extended="true">51</TD><TD _extended="true">578</TD><TD _extended="true">11.3</TD><TD _extended="true">38.5</TD><TD _extended="true">30</TD><TD _extended="true">0</TD><TD _extended="true">8</TD><TD _extended="true">0</TD><TD _extended="true">33</TD><TD _extended="true">0</TD><TR _extended="true"><TR class=whiteback _extended="true"><TD _extended="true">2006</TD><TD _extended="true">Buffalo Bills (http://www.nfl.com/teams/buffalobills/profile?team=BUF) </TD><TD _extended="true">13</TD><TD _extended="true">34</TD><TD _extended="true">410</TD><TD _extended="true">12.1</TD><TD _extended="true">31.5</TD><TD _extended="true">52</TD><TD _extended="true">2</TD><TD _extended="true">6</TD><TD _extended="true">1</TD><TD _extended="true">21</TD><TD _extended="true">0</TD><TR _extended="true"><TR class=ltblueback _extended="true"><TD _extended="true">2005</TD><TD _extended="true">Buffalo Bills (http://www.nfl.com/teams/buffalobills/profile?team=BUF) </TD><TD _extended="true">16</TD><TD _extended="true">32</TD><TD _extended="true">449</TD><TD _extended="true">14.0</TD><TD _extended="true">28.1</TD><TD _extended="true">51T</TD><TD _extended="true">2</TD><TD _extended="true">8</TD><TD _extended="true">1</TD><TD _extended="true">21</TD><TD _extended="true">0</TD><TR _extended="true"><TR class=whiteback _extended="true"><TD _extended="true">2004</TD><TD _extended="true">Buffalo Bills (http://www.nfl.com/teams/buffalobills/profile?team=BUF) </TD><TD _extended="true">12</TD><TD _extended="true">16</TD><TD _extended="true">153</TD><TD _extended="true">9.6</TD><TD _extended="true">12.8</TD><TD _extended="true">20</TD><TD _extended="true">0</TD><TD _extended="true">1</TD><TD _extended="true">0</TD><TD _extended="true">8</TD><TD _extended="true">0</TD><TR _extended="true"><TR class=ltblueback _extended="true"><TD _extended="true">2003</TD><TD _extended="true">Buffalo Bills (http://www.nfl.com/teams/buffalobills/profile?team=BUF) </TD><TD _extended="true">16</TD><TD _extended="true">58</TD><TD _extended="true">588</TD><TD _extended="true">10.1</TD><TD _extended="true">36.8</TD><TD _extended="true">26</TD><TD _extended="true">2</TD><TD _extended="true">5</TD><TD _extended="true">0</TD><TD _extended="true">33</TD><TD _extended="true">1</TD><TR _extended="true"><TR class=whiteback _extended="true"><TD _extended="true">2002</TD><TD _extended="true">Buffalo Bills (http://www.nfl.com/teams/buffalobills/profile?team=BUF) </TD><TD _extended="true">16</TD><TD _extended="true">37</TD><TD _extended="true">509</TD><TD _extended="true">13.8</TD><TD _extended="true">31.8</TD><TD _extended="true">42</TD><TD _extended="true">2</TD><TD _extended="true">7</TD><TD _extended="true">1</TD><TD _extended="true">23</TD><TD _extended="true">1</TD><TR _extended="true"><TR class=datatabledatahead _extended="true"><TD colSpan=2 _extended="true">TOTAL</TD><TD _extended="true">88</TD><TD _extended="true">228</TD><TD _extended="true">2,687</TD><TD _extended="true">11.8</TD><TD _extended="true">30.5</TD><TD _extended="true">52</TD><TD _extended="true">8</TD><TD _extended="true">35</TD><TD _extended="true">3</TD><TD _extended="true">139</TD><TD _extended="true">2</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

[DraftBoy]

nope, just basing them on the 5-6 million a year his agent stated he was looking for with 8 million up front... and if you want the ****ing link, go dig it up from the other post from this weekend where you tried your best to show that johnson doesnt suck as a starter, even though the facts are so abundently clear.. 39 starts.. pro bowl wrs next to him at all times to take the coverage and double teams away.. and still.. no results..

maybe he and josh reed arent that different.. except johnson just cant block as good.


Agents talk a lot, Im dont make it a habit to buy their bs, glad to see you do though

[Tatonka]

Sure. But as a number three you only get so many opportunities to even play let alone get the ball. And it hinges on who is throwing it to you. And that hinges on the offensive line play.

what about the 39 games in his career that he was NOT the 3rd option, but a starter, including the 8 this year and 8 last year?

[DraftBoy]

Sure. But as a number three you only get so many opportunities to even play let alone get the ball. And it hinges on who is throwing it to you. And that hinges on the offensive line play.

Dont bring logic into this argument, numbers tell it all! Also though dont count the fact that his average production is over that of Wilford, Hackett, and Porter, that doesnt count either. He doesnt score TD's, and he has had a 100 yard receiving game those are the only things that matter!!!!!

[Tatonka]

Agents talk a lot, Im dont make it a habit to buy their bs, glad to see you do though

i know what his agent said.. what else are you basing it on?

we will find out shortly though.. at that point i will say i was wrong or tell you to go shove it up your ass for being a condicending *****.

[RockStar36]

what about the 39 games in his career that he was NOT the 3rd option, but a starter, including the 8 this year and 8 last year?

I don't know. What were his stats in those particular games?

[DraftBoy]

what about the 39 games in his career that he was NOT the 3rd option, but a starter, including the 8 this year and 8 last year?


Yea because starters cant struggle ever right?

Lee Evans-2 100 yard games this past season but he also had games where he caught 2 balls for 5 yards, 1 ball for 7 yards, and 1 ball for 2 yards, but he must suck too.

[Tatonka]

Dont bring logic into this argument, numbers tell it all! Also though dont count the fact that his average production is over that of Wilford, Hackett, and Porter, that doesnt count either. He doesnt score TD's, and he has had a 100 yard receiving game those are the only things that matter!!!!!

what do you base it on then????

if you start and you dont produce, that shouldnt be an indication at all ????

5 years and 39 starts is not enough to determine anything???

are you basing what you think his production will be on a divine message from god?

[DraftBoy]

i know what his agent said.. what else are you basing it on?

we will find out shortly though.. at that point i will say i was wrong or tell you to go shove it up your ass for being a condicending *****.


Now thats not very nice, and you should know better than to completely buy what an agent tells you, he's going to want to absolute most for his client its his job. If they get Johnson for between 4 and 5 million a year I think its a solid deal for a guy who produces at his clip.

[losman420]

Of course that's 100% accurate scoobster, yet somehow Boldin and Larry Fitzgerald both "got theirs" didn't they.Its hard to get "yours' when you play behind 2 guys like that.

[DraftBoy]

what do you base it on then????

if you start and you dont produce, that shouldnt be an indication at all ????

5 years and 39 starts is not enough to determine anything???

are you basing what you think his production will be on a divine message from god?


Now your getting, god came to me (like Moses, I really should change my name to Prophet) and told Johnson would get 1700 receiving yards next year and catch 45 touchdowns. Just to note though there was no burning bush and I was pretty skeptical because of that. I mean seriously?

[Tatonka]

Yea because starters cant struggle ever right?

Lee Evans-2 100 yard games this past season but he also had games where he caught 2 balls for 5 yards, 1 ball for 7 yards, and 1 ball for 2 yards, but he must suck too.

and you think the qb play in arizona held johnson back? wait till he gets here..

if you need a break down of why lee evans was so bad this last year, from awful qb play, to some of the worst offensive playcalling, to lack of any other receiving weapons.. then clearly you didnt watch the games.. which i believe is actually fairly true, but correct me if im wrong.

[TacklingDummy]

<TABLE class="w655px datatablecell" cellSpacing=0 _extended="true"><TBODY _extended="true"><TR class="datatablehead ARIcolors" _extended="true"><TD colSpan=13 _extended="true">

Stats

Bryant Johnson

Receiving
</TD></TR><TR class=datatabledatahead _extended="true"><TD width=20 _extended="true">Year</TD><TD width=140 _extended="true">Team</TD><TD _extended="true">G</TD><TD _extended="true">Rec</TD><TD _extended="true">Yds</TD><TD _extended="true">Avg</TD><TD _extended="true">Yds/G</TD><TD _extended="true">Long</TD><TD _extended="true">TD</TD><TD _extended="true">20+</TD><TD _extended="true">40+</TD><TD _extended="true">1st</TD><TD _extended="true">FUM</TD></TR><TR class=ltblueback _extended="true"><TD _extended="true">2007</TD><TD _extended="true">Arizona Cardinals (http://www.nfl.com/teams/arizonacardinals/profile?team=ARI) </TD><TD _extended="true">16</TD><TD _extended="true">46</TD><TD _extended="true">528</TD><TD _extended="true">11.5</TD><TD _extended="true">33.0</TD><TD _extended="true">30</TD><TD _extended="true">2</TD><TD _extended="true">2</TD><TD _extended="true">0</TD><TD _extended="true">33</TD><TD _extended="true">0</TD><TR _extended="true"><TR class=whiteback _extended="true"><TD _extended="true">2006</TD><TD _extended="true">Arizona Cardinals (http://www.nfl.com/teams/arizonacardinals/profile?team=ARI) </TD><TD _extended="true">16</TD><TD _extended="true">40</TD><TD _extended="true">740</TD><TD _extended="true">18.5</TD><TD _extended="true">46.2</TD><TD _extended="true">58</TD><TD _extended="true">4</TD><TD _extended="true">14</TD><TD _extended="true">5</TD><TD _extended="true">30</TD><TD _extended="true">0</TD><TR _extended="true"><TR class=ltblueback _extended="true"><TD _extended="true">2005</TD><TD _extended="true">Arizona Cardinals (http://www.nfl.com/teams/arizonacardinals/profile?team=ARI) </TD><TD _extended="true">14</TD><TD _extended="true">40</TD><TD _extended="true">432</TD><TD _extended="true">10.8</TD><TD _extended="true">30.9</TD><TD _extended="true">41</TD><TD _extended="true">1</TD><TD _extended="true">3</TD><TD _extended="true">1</TD><TD _extended="true">25</TD><TD _extended="true">0</TD><TR _extended="true"><TR class=whiteback _extended="true"><TD _extended="true">2004</TD><TD _extended="true">Arizona Cardinals (http://www.nfl.com/teams/arizonacardinals/profile?team=ARI) </TD><TD _extended="true">16</TD><TD _extended="true">49</TD><TD _extended="true">537</TD><TD _extended="true">11.0</TD><TD _extended="true">33.6</TD><TD _extended="true">40</TD><TD _extended="true">1</TD><TD _extended="true">5</TD><TD _extended="true">1</TD><TD _extended="true">29</TD><TD _extended="true">1</TD><TR _extended="true"><TR class=ltblueback _extended="true"><TD _extended="true">2003</TD><TD _extended="true">Arizona Cardinals (http://www.nfl.com/teams/arizonacardinals/profile?team=ARI) </TD><TD _extended="true">15</TD><TD _extended="true">35</TD><TD _extended="true">438</TD><TD _extended="true">12.5</TD><TD _extended="true">29.2</TD><TD _extended="true">54T</TD><TD _extended="true">1</TD><TD _extended="true">4</TD><TD _extended="true">2</TD><TD _extended="true">20</TD><TD _extended="true">1</TD><TR _extended="true"><TR class=datatabledatahead _extended="true"><TD colSpan=2 _extended="true">TOTAL</TD><TD _extended="true">77</TD><TD _extended="true">210</TD><TD _extended="true">2,675</TD><TD _extended="true">12.7</TD><TD _extended="true">34.7</TD><TD _extended="true">58</TD><TD _extended="true">9</TD><TD _extended="true">28</TD><TD _extended="true">9</TD><TD _extended="true">137</TD><TD _extended="true">2</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

Josh Reed

<TABLE class="w655px datatablecell" cellSpacing=0 _extended="true"><TBODY _extended="true"><TR class="datatablehead BUFcolors" _extended="true"><TD colSpan=13 _extended="true">
Receiving
</TD></TR><TR class=datatabledatahead _extended="true"><TD width=20 _extended="true">Year</TD><TD width=140 _extended="true">Team</TD><TD _extended="true">G</TD><TD _extended="true">Rec</TD><TD _extended="true">Yds</TD><TD _extended="true">Avg</TD><TD _extended="true">Yds/G</TD><TD _extended="true">Long</TD><TD _extended="true">TD</TD><TD _extended="true">20+</TD><TD _extended="true">40+</TD><TD _extended="true">1st</TD><TD _extended="true">FUM</TD></TR><TR class=ltblueback _extended="true"><TD _extended="true">2007</TD><TD _extended="true">Buffalo Bills (http://www.nfl.com/teams/buffalobills/profile?team=BUF) </TD><TD _extended="true">15</TD><TD _extended="true">51</TD><TD _extended="true">578</TD><TD _extended="true">11.3</TD><TD _extended="true">38.5</TD><TD _extended="true">30</TD><TD _extended="true">0</TD><TD _extended="true">8</TD><TD _extended="true">0</TD><TD _extended="true">33</TD><TD _extended="true">0</TD><TR _extended="true"><TR class=whiteback _extended="true"><TD _extended="true">2006</TD><TD _extended="true">Buffalo Bills (http://www.nfl.com/teams/buffalobills/profile?team=BUF) </TD><TD _extended="true">13</TD><TD _extended="true">34</TD><TD _extended="true">410</TD><TD _extended="true">12.1</TD><TD _extended="true">31.5</TD><TD _extended="true">52</TD><TD _extended="true">2</TD><TD _extended="true">6</TD><TD _extended="true">1</TD><TD _extended="true">21</TD><TD _extended="true">0</TD><TR _extended="true"><TR class=ltblueback _extended="true"><TD _extended="true">2005</TD><TD _extended="true">Buffalo Bills (http://www.nfl.com/teams/buffalobills/profile?team=BUF) </TD><TD _extended="true">16</TD><TD _extended="true">32</TD><TD _extended="true">449</TD><TD _extended="true">14.0</TD><TD _extended="true">28.1</TD><TD _extended="true">51T</TD><TD _extended="true">2</TD><TD _extended="true">8</TD><TD _extended="true">1</TD><TD _extended="true">21</TD><TD _extended="true">0</TD><TR _extended="true"><TR class=whiteback _extended="true"><TD _extended="true">2004</TD><TD _extended="true">Buffalo Bills (http://www.nfl.com/teams/buffalobills/profile?team=BUF) </TD><TD _extended="true">12</TD><TD _extended="true">16</TD><TD _extended="true">153</TD><TD _extended="true">9.6</TD><TD _extended="true">12.8</TD><TD _extended="true">20</TD><TD _extended="true">0</TD><TD _extended="true">1</TD><TD _extended="true">0</TD><TD _extended="true">8</TD><TD _extended="true">0</TD><TR _extended="true"><TR class=ltblueback _extended="true"><TD _extended="true">2003</TD><TD _extended="true">Buffalo Bills (http://www.nfl.com/teams/buffalobills/profile?team=BUF) </TD><TD _extended="true">16</TD><TD _extended="true">58</TD><TD _extended="true">588</TD><TD _extended="true">10.1</TD><TD _extended="true">36.8</TD><TD _extended="true">26</TD><TD _extended="true">2</TD><TD _extended="true">5</TD><TD _extended="true">0</TD><TD _extended="true">33</TD><TD _extended="true">1</TD><TR _extended="true"><TR class=whiteback _extended="true"><TD _extended="true">2002</TD><TD _extended="true">Buffalo Bills (http://www.nfl.com/teams/buffalobills/profile?team=BUF) </TD><TD _extended="true">16</TD><TD _extended="true">37</TD><TD _extended="true">509</TD><TD _extended="true">13.8</TD><TD _extended="true">31.8</TD><TD _extended="true">42</TD><TD _extended="true">2</TD><TD _extended="true">7</TD><TD _extended="true">1</TD><TD _extended="true">23</TD><TD _extended="true">1</TD><TR _extended="true"><TR class=datatabledatahead _extended="true"><TD colSpan=2 _extended="true">TOTAL</TD><TD _extended="true">88</TD><TD _extended="true">228</TD><TD _extended="true">2,687</TD><TD _extended="true">11.8</TD><TD _extended="true">30.5</TD><TD _extended="true">52</TD><TD _extended="true">8</TD><TD _extended="true">35</TD><TD _extended="true">3</TD><TD _extended="true">139</TD><TD _extended="true">2</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

Wow, can't get much closer.

[DraftBoy]

and you think the qb play in arizona held johnson back? wait till he gets here..

if you need a break down of why lee evans was so bad this last year, from awful qb play, to some of the worst offensive playcalling, to lack of any other receiving weapons.. then clearly you didnt watch the games.. which i believe is actually fairly true, but correct me if im wrong.


Oh so now QB play, play calling become factors and stats dont tell the whole story, imagine that. Shocking!

[raphael120]

Reed started most of the season last year and matched production from a 3rd stringer....

You're crazy.

[Tatonka]

Its hard to get "yours' when you play behind 2 guys like that.

it shouldnt be when you start as much as he did.

[Tatonka]

Oh so now QB play, play calling become factors and stats dont tell the whole story, imagine that. Shocking!

please dont compare the struggles of the bills offense to that of arizona.. there is NO comparison. i guess poor johnson was just always unlucky for 5 years and 39 starts.. lee evans has one bad season, along with EVERYONE else on offense.. all the other receivers in arizona did fine, even though johnson started half those games

[DraftBoy]

it shouldnt be when you start as much as he did.
Reed started more games last year and had less TD catches and just a few more yards and receptions, with only one pro bowler ahead of him to take catches away. Happy with that production?

[TacklingDummy]

Yea because starters cant struggle ever right?

Lee Evans-2 100 yard games this past season but he also had games where he caught 2 balls for 5 yards, 1 ball for 7 yards, and 1 ball for 2 yards, but he must suck too.

At times Lee does suck. Last year Lee played like he went back in time to the year 2004/2005 and not 2006.

I remember Bills fans breaking balls on Fin fans about Chris Chambers. So far Evans career is on the same path as Chambers.

[ddaryl]

Honestly we shouldn't have to pay Bryant more then 3.5 million a year... in exchange for the a solid chance at starting for the Bills

He hasn't done anything worthy of a 5 mil per year contract, and has a lot to prove before any team would pay him that.

He does have some upside when compared to Reed IMO. Also if we sign Bryant I don't think that means we still won't bring in another WR via draft. Bryant just fits the Bills 2008 philosphy of getting bigger at every position.

[DraftBoy]

please dont compare the struggles of the bills offense to that of arizona.. there is NO comparison. i guess poor johnson was just always unlucky for 5 years and 39 starts.. lee evans has one bad season, along with EVERYONE else on offense.. all the other receivers in arizona did fine, even though johnson started half those games

Im just enjoying watching you say on one hand the intangibles dont matter but of course on the other side they do. I havent seen a flip-flop like this since the 04 campaigns.

[TacklingDummy]

please dont compare the struggles of the bills offense to that of arizona.. there is NO comparison.

The Bills would have been in the playoffs last year if their offense produced the way the Cardinals did.

[Tatonka]

Reed started more games last year and had less TD catches and just a few more yards and receptions, with only one pro bowler ahead of him to take catches away. Happy with that production?

**** no im not.. but reed makes 10 million over 4 years.. pay johnson that and you wont hear another word from me.


i never said we didnt need a better wr than reed.. im saying johnson isnt it.

[RedEyE]

This is like comparing apples to oranges.

The real stat everyone needs to consider:

Vertical:

Reed: 37 inches

Johnson: 45 inches

In today's league a strong, tall target WR is money. A small WR in the red zone is obsolete going inch for inch with corners that are either taller than or identical too in size. The Bills red zone statistics prove all of this with miserable missed opportunites due to the short stature of the receiveing squad.


And lets not forget the mutiple drop seasons Reed had as well. He almost never made it this far into his career as his inconsistancy early on almost had him cut from the team more than once. I like Reed, but in comparision to Johnson, he's 2nd best.

[Mr. Pink]

At times Lee does suck. Last year Lee played like he went back in time to the year 2004/2005 and not 2006.

I remember Bills fans breaking balls on Fin fans about Chris Chambers. So far Evans career is on the same path as Chambers.

Evans career path rivals Kevin Johnson thus far. Big numbers, bust QB, only weapon in the offense.

[DraftBoy]

This is like comparing apples to oranges.

The real stat everyone needs to consider:

Vertical:

Reed: 37 inches

Johnson: 45 inches

In today's league a strong, tall target WR is money. A small WR in the red zone is absolete going inch for inch with corners that are either taller than or identical to in size. The Bills red sone statistics prove all of this with miserable missed opportunites due to the short stature of the receiveing squad.


And lets not forget the mutiple drop seasons Reed had as well. He almost never made it this far into his career as his inconsistancy early on almost had him cut from the team more than once. I like Reed, but in comparision to Johnson, he's 2nd best.

Intangibles dont matter in this case Red havent you been paying attention, only one thing matters 39 starts, and 9 TD's thats about all that we can look at. His average production for a year, his lack of looks because of whose in front of him, his less then spectacular QB play, his size, none of that matters.

[TacklingDummy]

The real stat everyone needs to consider:

Vertical:

Reed: 37 inches

Johnson: 45 inches



Reed's is much shorter when he ducks. Right, mybills? :snicker:

[Tatonka]

Im just enjoying watching you say on one hand the intangibles dont matter but of course on the other side they do. I havent seen a flip-flop like this since the 04 campaigns.

im not flip floping on ****.. if you want to try and point to why evans struggled for one year in his career, i can see it being intangibles.. but why johnson struggled every year in his career, while no one else around him did, for 5 years and 39 starts, blaming "intangibles" is just making excuses for a guy that is asking for a lot of money.

hope im totally wrong.. but i cant find anything at all to say that i am.. no production to show.. and not enough intagibles to explain that many years of average play.

[DraftBoy]

im not flip floping on ****.. if you want to try and point to why evans struggled for one year in his career, i can see it being intangibles.. but why johnson struggled every year in his career, while no one else around him did, for 5 years and 39 starts, blaming "intangibles" is just making excuses for a guy that is asking for a lot of money.

hope im totally wrong.. but i cant find anything at all to say that i am.. no production to show.. and not enough intagibles to explain that many years of average play.

No you're absolutely flipping on this and Lee Evans struggling one year in his career? What about 05, he produced more his rookie year then that year. This guy has been a starter too not a #3 option his entire career. But yet we can blame the QB play and play calling for that. But not for Johnson of course, but your not flip flopping at all.

[Tatonka]

Intangibles dont matter in this case Red havent you been paying attention, only one thing matters 39 starts, and 9 TD's thats about all that we can look at. His average production for a year, his lack of looks because of whose in front of him, his less then spectacular QB play, his size, none of that matters.

exactly... see i knew you would get it if you stopped talking and thought about it.

:dance:

[Tatonka]

No you're absolutely flipping on this and Lee Evans struggling one year in his career? What about 05, he produced more his rookie year then that year. This guy has been a starter too not a #3 option his entire career. But yet we can blame the QB play and play calling for that. But not for Johnson of course, but your not flip flopping at all.


you idiot.. i never said one thing about lee evans and then changed my stance on it.. that is what flip floping is..

im simply saying that johnsons struggles have alot less to do with intagibles that you are so easily trying to blame than lee evans.. i have never said anything otherwise.. jackass.

:oops:

[RedEyE]

Actually, I stand corrected.

Johnson posted a 37 inch vertical at the combine as well. Those Micheal Jordan like numbers were from CALVIN Johnson.

My bad. This does change things perspectively in the Reed to Johnson debate.

[The Spaz]

Idiot and Jackass nice....

[Mr. Pink]

you idiot.. i never said one thing about lee evans and then changed my stance on it.. that is what flip floping is..

im simply saying that johnsons struggles have alot less to do with intagibles that you are so easily trying to blame than lee evans.. i have never said anything otherwise.. jackass.

:oops:

I also have never changed my status on Evans. We as fans of the team overrate the hell out of the guy. Hell, I did the same with Kevin Johnson in Cleveland. I was shocked that the Browns traded him away for next to nothing because he was able to produce in the offense.

Due to this, once we get "better" options I can foresee Lee being gone as well.
G catch Yards Avg Long TD FD fumbles
<table class="tablehead" cellpadding="3" cellspacing="1"><tbody><tr class="oddrow" align="right"><td align="left">1999</td><td align="left">CLE</td><td>16</td> <td>66</td> <td>986</td> <td>14.9</td> <td>64</td> <td>8</td> <td>39</td> <td>0</td> <td>0</td> </tr> <!--teamId2=5--> <tr class="evenrow" align="right"><td align="left">2000</td><td align="left">CLE</td><td>16</td> <td>57</td> <td>669</td> <td>11.7</td> <td>79</td> <td>0</td> <td>26</td> <td>0</td> <td>0</td> </tr> <!--teamId2=5--> <tr class="oddrow" align="right"><td align="left">2001</td><td align="left">CLE</td><td>16</td> <td>84</td> <td>1097</td> <td>13.1</td> <td>55</td> <td>9</td> <td>54</td> <td>2</td> <td>0</td> </tr> <!--teamId2=5--> <tr class="evenrow" align="right"><td align="left">2002</td><td align="left">CLE</td><td>16</td> <td>67</td> <td>703</td> <td>10.5</td> <td>30</td> <td>4</td> <td>38</td> <td>0</td> <td>0</td></tr></tbody></table>
With these numbers, I thought the world of the guy. He was great. A true number 1. A viable weapon at WR. Boy was I and many other Browns fans wrong about that one. I'm sure even DB was wrong on him, now if he admits it or not is another story entirely.

[justasportsfan]

At times Lee does suck. Last year Lee played like he went back in time to the year 2004/2005 and not 2006.

I remember Bills fans breaking balls on Fin fans about Chris Chambers. So far Evans career is on the same path as Chambers.
:rofl: Hilarious. Your hatred for JP snowballed down to those that defended him. Funny.

[Tatonka]

Actually, I stand corrected.

Johnson posted a 37 inch vertical at the combine as well. Those Micheal Jordan like numbers were from CALVIN Johnson.

My bad. This does change things perspectively in the Reed to Johnson debate.

so reed and johnson have the same vertical? please say thats not true.

[justasportsfan]

Johnsons nos. indicate he is another Josh reed. Nothing wrong with having a taller Josh Reed on the team especially in the redzone.

It upgrades the wr corps. Don't know whats wrong with that. I'd rather have him than Aiken.

[RedEyE]

so reed and johnson have the same vertical? please say thats not true.
They do, but they are still above average numbers. And really its all about how you handle yourself when you're up there.

[colin]

this isn't fantasy football or baseball, you don't just get stats on your team, you get a player.

a big physical athletic guy who can go up and get the ball or screen off db's with his body is exactly what we need. even if he only gets 40 catches if he takes heat off of lee and puts dbs and Lbs further back then it helps our team a lot.

we've had way to many short pass plays result in a tackle right away and few yards -- a big target is the best thing for making short plays into decent gains.

i'll take him.

[Mr. Pink]

My point on posting the above is that this team needs a TRUE NUMBER 1 opton.

Evans would be a nice compliment to an elite guy.

This team has plenty of ho hum slot and 4th receivers, Johnson is at best another one to add to that bunch. Granted he is better than Price at this point so it does upgrade the position, we're still a long way to go before having legitimate options/weapons at the position.

Meanwhile, if we sign Johnson and then draft another WR, we have a 5th WR we're paying 4 million dollars! Isn't that wonderful? You'd think we'd be stacked at the position when you see a 5th wide making 4 million.

[justasportsfan]

My point on posting the above is that this team needs a TRUE NUMBER 1 opton.

.
That would be awsome. That would be one hell of a LUXURY as long as the other positions have been taken care off. The last 2 SB champs didn't have 2 no. 1's.

If our running game improves and Lynch/Jackson/Wright gets involved in the passing game and a improve at the TE position , we won't need 2 no 1's.

[Mr. Pink]

That would be awsome. That would be one hell of a LUXURY as long as the other positions have been taken care off. The last 2 SB champs didn't have 2 no. 1's.

Again, we don't even have 1.

[Tatonka]

i will take him too.. just based on the potential he was drafted for and his size.. but if he is a josh reed type player, then he should get that money.

if he is not good enough to be a starter, and by all indications, the really isnt, then he shouldnt not get 5-6 million a yaer.. that money can be spent on something else to help improve the team. if he is ok with 2-3 mill a year

[justasportsfan]

Again, we don't even have 1.

Fix the qb position and we do. Lee was not the problem, the qb and playcalling was.

[TacklingDummy]

:rofl: Hilarious. Your hatred for JP snowballed down to those that defended him. Funny.

Did Lee have a crappy year last year, yes or no?

[justasportsfan]

Did Lee have a crappy year last year, yes or no?
no, the coaches and the qb's did. Who designs or calls the plays and who throws Lee the ball.... AHA!

[Mr. Pink]

Fix the qb position and we do. Lee was not the problem, the qb and playcalling was.

Plaxico produced well with Manning, who during the season was speculated as putting one foot out the door until their playoff push. Hell several posters on here at different times said JP was better than Eli.

Earlier in this thread I saw Warner getting dissed...Fitzy and Boldin both produce in AZ.

Steve Smith produced last year with David Carr and Matt Moore.

True Elite Number 1 WRs produce in this league, regardless of who is throwing them the ball. Period.

Hell Roddy White produced under a clustereph of QBs in Atlanta last year. Does that mean he'll do even more with stability at the position? Does that mean he's better than Lee?

[justasportsfan]

Plaxico produced well with Manning, who during the season was speculated as putting one foot out the door until their playoff push. Hell several posters on here at different times said JP was better than Eli.

Earlier in this thread I saw Warner getting dissed...Fitzy and Boldin both produce in AZ.

Steve Smith produced last year with David Carr and Matt Moore.

True Elite Number 1 WRs produce in this league, regardless of who is throwing them the ball. Period.

Hell Roddy White produced under a clustereph of QBs in Atlanta last year. Does that mean he'll do even more with stability at the position? Does that mean he's better than Lee?


A crappy Eli was better than our Qb situation last year. Lee Evans wouldve been fine with the giants. ANone who thinks Lee wouldn't have had awsome nos. with greenbay or Colts is smoking some whacky stuff.

A True elite WR wasn't gonna do squat here last year unless he can throw and catch to himself.

[TacklingDummy]

no, the coaches and the qb's did. Who designs or calls the plays and who throws Lee the ball.... AHA!

I get it.

So JP didn't have a bad year last year either. It's the coaches who design and call the plays and the receivers for not getting open fault. :up:

[justasportsfan]

I get it.

So JP didn't have a bad year last year either. It's the coaches who design and call the plays and the receivers for not getting open fault. :up:


I said the qb's had a bad year. Your hatred for JP is making you lose your ability to read.

The coaches design plays to get the wr's open. The coaches put their players in a position to succeed. Brady supposedly didn't have arn arm. They got the ball to Moss down deep even though the D's knew it ?

Evans didn't have Welker , Brady or a decent playcaller. Think about it.

[Tatonka]

steve smith sucked balls last year..

i guess he is really a number 2.

[Mr. Pink]

I said the qb's had a bad year. Your hatred for JP is making you lose your ability to read.

The coaches design plays to get the wr's open. The coaches put their players in a position to succeed. Brady supposedly didn't have arn arm. They got the ball to Moss down deep even though team knew it didn't they?

Evans didn't have Welker , Brady or a decent playcaller. Think about it.

Roddy White and Steve Smith didn't have Welker, Brady or a decent playcaller either.

[TacklingDummy]

The excuse can fit any arguement.

[justasportsfan]

Roddy White and Steve Smith didn't have Welker, Brady or a decent playcaller either.

they didn't have a qb carousel either did they? They also didn't have a rookie qb who's strength was dinking the ball too did they?

[Mr. Pink]

steve smith sucked balls last year..

i guess he is really a number 2.

If 87 catches for a 1000 yards and 7 TDs sucked balls...what would you consider Lee Evans season?

[justasportsfan]

The excuse can fit any arguement.
but you can't just blame Lee alone for his nos. There were several other factors that you conveninetly didn't bring up because it's common knowledge that you hate anyone who defended JP. If Lee had said anything, you'd be calling for the bills to extend.

[Mr. Pink]

they didn't have a qb carousel either did they? They also didn't have a rookie qb who's strength was dinking the ball too did they?

:rofl: are you serious?

Carolina started Delhomme, Testaverde, Carr, and Matt Moore during the year.

Atlanta started Harrington, Leftwich and Redman during the year.

[TacklingDummy]

steve smith sucked balls last year..

i guess he is really a number 2.

87 Rec, 1002 yards, 7 TDs, is sucking balls?

Hell, those numbers are just as good as Evans best year.

[gr8slayer]

87 Rec, 1002 yards, 7 TDs, is sucking balls?

Hell, those numbers are just as good as Evans best year.
I'd take it.

[justasportsfan]

:rofl: are you serious?

Carolina started Delhomme, Testaverde, Carr, and Matt Moore during the year.

Atlanta started Harrington, Leftwich and Redman during the year.
Did they have Fairchild?

[justasportsfan]

87 Rec, 1002 yards, 7 TDs, is sucking balls?

Hell, those numbers are just as good as Evans best year.
Since Lee achieved that, he is a no. 1 then. Thanks for clearing that up.

[TacklingDummy]

Did they have Fairchild?

:lmao:

If there is a straw to grasp, justa will find it.

[Mr. Pink]

Did they have Fairchild?

Atlanta just had a coach that outright quit and left on the team in the middle of the season. That's infinitely worse than Fairchild.

[TacklingDummy]

Since Lee achieved that, he is a no. 1 then.

2 years ago. I guess now he is just sucking balls.

[justasportsfan]

:lmao:

If there is a straw to grasp, justa will find it.
:snicker: You would know, you're doing the exact same thing.

[justasportsfan]

2 years ago. I guess now he is just sucking balls.
again, not painting the whole picture. He alone did this to himself. We all know your opinion is based on your hatred for JP. AS long as JP helped Lee gain no. 1 nos. it doesn't count. Lol!

[Philagape]

Johnson played five games last year in which either Fitz or Boldin didn't play, making him a true starter. (I know nfl.com says 36 career starts or something, but if a team starts the game in a 3-WR set, then technically all 3 WRs are starters.) In those games, Johnson had 21 catches for 210 yards and 2 TDs. Pro-rated over a full season, that's 67 catches, 672 yards, 6 TDs. Not bad, but the average per catch is pretty low. Better than Reed, but that's about what I'd expect from, say, Wilford if he had Evans on the other side. So if we get Johnson for Wilford money, I'd be OK with that but not excited. Johnson has to prove he can produce against more than nickelbacks in a pass-happy offense. Otherwise, he's just the next Az-Zahir Hakim.