Don't forget we had 17 injuries last season

[xXSpIkes5IXx]

Ive read threads saying we havent done enough to improve our team this offseason, and that we will have a 7-9 record again this coming season.

I just don't see it, we have a more favorable schedule, we get players like Ko and Poz back on defense plus the aquisitions Stroud, Johnson, Mitchell, and now James..you have to agree that the defense cant be worse, even after releasing Tripplett, who did absolutely nothing in his two years here.

On offense, you have to hope that Trent will be better, and the offense will perform with continuity at the QB position. Plus you add in the effect of a probable first round wide reciever, not to mention utilizing Fred Jackson for a whole season instead of the last 5 games.

Another overlooked factor is that last season our special teams suffered because guys who came into the season as special teamers like Digiorgio were taken off the unit because they were needed on defense.

I just don't see how this team is not better off... can someone explain this?

[venis2k1]

On offense, you have to hope that Trent will be better, and the offense will perform with continuity at the QB position. .


I think thats the problem most people have. Not too many key injurys to the offense last year. Price. Peters for one game. Lynch for 3.

we stunk on offense last year and have done nothing to improve.

To say Lets hope edwards gets better, and a rookie can play doesnt make me want to go out and get season tickets.

[xXSpIkes5IXx]

Can we really be WORSE on offense?

My point is that the team is better off next season, i didnt say we are going to turn into the colts

[PECKERWOOD]

Get used to it man. I made a similar thread and got ZERO replies. Everybody wants to live in their own fantasy land. We should go out and sign every FA available because we don't have any home grown talent on our roster worth a damn. :crazy:

I agree with ya! :cheers:

I'm happy with Stroud and Mitchell as our big signings.. Let's get more depth and let's build through the draft, we are in a great position to do so.

[DrGraves]

Good post... I agree with you that we are overlooking the injuries... and the D will DEFINITELY be better... and i think you're right about trent showing more improvement and the situation with jackson... but even with jackson for 16 games, and with trent playing more solidly... i still dont think the bills are a team that can consistently get into the endzone 3 times a game (or even twice really). We need to do something more to get us there, then I will believe.

[acehole]

None are forgeting this except those who blame the QB.

Ive read threads saying we havent done enough to improve our team this offseason, and that we will have a 7-9 record again this coming season.

I just don't see it, we have a more favorable schedule, we get players like Ko and Poz back on defense plus the aquisitions Stroud, Johnson, Mitchell, and now James..you have to agree that the defense cant be worse, even after releasing Tripplett, who did absolutely nothing in his two years here.

On offense, you have to hope that Trent will be better, and the offense will perform with continuity at the QB position. Plus you add in the effect of a probable first round wide reciever, not to mention utilizing Fred Jackson for a whole season instead of the last 5 games.

Another overlooked factor is that last season our special teams suffered because guys who came into the season as special teamers like Digiorgio were taken off the unit because they were needed on defense.

I just don't see how this team is not better off... can someone explain this?

[pintonick96]

I think thats the problem most people have. Not too many key injurys to the offense last year. Price. Peters for one game. Lynch for 3.

we stunk on offense last year and have done nothing to improve.

To say Lets hope edwards gets better, and a rookie can play doesnt make me want to go out and get season tickets.
Not getting season tickets? Go root for someone else then. Ive had seasons since 92 and have been through the ups and downs and I still love this team and will continue to have seasons until I die. You wanna be a band wagon fan? Go root for NE. I want real fans at the games with me.

[Goobylal]

I think thats the problem most people have. Not too many key injurys to the offense last year. Price. Peters for one game. Lynch for 3.

we stunk on offense last year and have done nothing to improve.

To say Lets hope edwards gets better, and a rookie can play doesnt make me want to go out and get season tickets.
Going from a rookie QB to a non-rookie QB is a huge upgrade. As for the O-line, Brad Butler barely worked-out or played in the off-season/pre-season, and should be much better this year, while Dockery and Walker will have had a full year in the system. At WR, the Bills will be adding one in the draft as well as a TE. And Lynch won't be a rookie anymore either. I also think that Schonert will be an improvement over Fairchild.

And with an improved defense, as they say, "the best offense is a good defense."

[HHURRICANE]

Ive read threads saying we havent done enough to improve our team this offseason, and that we will have a 7-9 record again this coming season.

I just don't see it, we have a more favorable schedule, we get players like Ko and Poz back on defense plus the aquisitions Stroud, Johnson, Mitchell, and now James..you have to agree that the defense cant be worse, even after releasing Tripplett, who did absolutely nothing in his two years here.

On offense, you have to hope that Trent will be better, and the offense will perform with continuity at the QB position. Plus you add in the effect of a probable first round wide reciever, not to mention utilizing Fred Jackson for a whole season instead of the last 5 games.

Another overlooked factor is that last season our special teams suffered because guys who came into the season as special teamers like Digiorgio were taken off the unit because they were needed on defense.

I just don't see how this team is not better off... can someone explain this?

You make some good points, especially regarding Jackson.

However, our WR's and TE's couldn't get open and alot of it had to do with Reed and Price being slow, Pariish getting man-handled at the line, and having no threats at TE or the #5 position. Shutting down Evans became super easy and left us with no other options.

So we are not improved if we can't get at least 2 high caliber WRs. I could easily see another 7-9 season without this not getting address. Time to put our egos away and trade for Ocho.

[feelthepain]

Ive read threads saying we havent done enough to improve our team this offseason, and that we will have a 7-9 record again this coming season.

I just don't see it, we have a more favorable schedule, we get players like Ko and Poz back on defense plus the aquisitions Stroud, Johnson, Mitchell, and now James..you have to agree that the defense cant be worse, even after releasing Tripplett, who did absolutely nothing in his two years here.

On offense, you have to hope that Trent will be better, and the offense will perform with continuity at the QB position. Plus you add in the effect of a probable first round wide reciever, not to mention utilizing Fred Jackson for a whole season instead of the last 5 games.

Another overlooked factor is that last season our special teams suffered because guys who came into the season as special teamers like Digiorgio were taken off the unit because they were needed on defense.

I just don't see how this team is not better off... can someone explain this?
Tripplett- In the last two years has: 68 Tackles/3.5 sacks/10 passes defended/1 int.

Stroud- In the last two years has: 42 tackles/5.5 sacks/3 passes defended/ 0 int's

You claim "Tripplett has done absolutley nothing in his 2 seasons with the Bills", what do you have to say about Stroud? I think Bill fans continue to believe Stroud is what he was three years ago. You can't count on him being that player till he rebounds and proves to still be that player. If anything he's a big question mark, not a big upgrade.

[Goobylal]

Tripplett- In the last two years has: 68 Tackles/3.5 sacks/10 passes defended/1 int.

Stroud- In the last two years has: 42 tackles/5.5 sacks/3 passes defended/ 0 int's

You claim "Tripplett has done absolutley nothing in his 2 seasons with the Bills", what do you have to say about Stroud? I think Bill fans continue to believe Stroud is what he was three years ago. You can't count on him being that player till he rebounds and proves to still be that player. If anything he's a big question mark, not a big upgrade.
The difference is that Tripplett played in and started 32 games the past 2 years, and Stroud played in and started 20 games the past 2 years. Multiply Stroud's stats by 1.6 and then see what you get.

[feelthepain]

The difference is that Tripplett played in and started 32 games the past 2 years, and Stroud played in and started 20 games the past 2 years. Multiply Stroud's stats by 1.6 and then see what you get.

So Stroud missing time due to injury and drug suspension and not helping the Jags doesn't really matter or count, casuse Bill fans will just make up numbers to make his signing seem terriffic? But Tripplett actually playing and helping the Bills doesn't mean squat, because he's not "Stroud"? Got it!!

[Goobylal]

So Stroud missing time due to injury and drug suspension and not helping the Jags doesn't really matter or count, casuse Bill fans will just make up numbers to make his signing seem terriffic? But Tripplett actually playing and helping the Bills doesn't mean squat, because he's not "Stroud"? Got it!!
Not exactly. You gave numbers over the past 2 seasons, without regards to number of games played. That's like me saying that Lynch outrushed Ronnie Brown this past season, thus he's clearly a better RB.

As for the injury and drug concerns, I'm not worried about him failing another test. But injury is a concern, and it's always a concern for any player. But when healthy, there's no comparison between Stroud and Tripplett.

[YardRat]

We should be at a point where we can do more than exclaim 'Whoopee! We got a new OC and a few players that aren't rookies anymore! Can't wait for the draft!' regarding the offense.

But...it is what it is. :gobills:

[Goobylal]

We should be at a point where we can do more than exclaim 'Whoopee! We got a new OC and a few players that aren't rookies anymore! Can't wait for the draft!' regarding the offense.

But...it is what it is. :gobills:
Exactly. It is what it is. Free agency wasn't great for WR's and TE's.

[feelthepain]

Not exactly. You gave numbers over the past 2 seasons, without regards to number of games played. That's like me saying that Lynch outrushed Ronnie Brown this past season, thus he's clearly a better RB.

I never said Triplett was better then Stroud because he played and Stroud didn't. I said Tripplet played and Stroud didn't so how can Bill fans say Tripplett did basically nothing and Stroud is an upgrade? Strouds injuries are serious and his drug use is even more seriuous. Stroud hasn't had a "good" year since 04 that's 4 years ago. It's not like he's coming off a probowl or even one season removed from probowl status.


As for the injury and drug concerns, I'm not worried about him failing another test. But injury is a concern, and it's always a concern for any player. But when healthy, there's no comparison between Stroud and Tripplett

You're using "if's" and "but's" as if they're fact. You can't call Stroud an upgrade till he proves he is. As I stated before, Stroud is more of a question mark then an upgrade. But Bill fans such as yourself refuse to be realistic about it.

[OpIv37]

Ive read threads saying we havent done enough to improve our team this offseason, and that we will have a 7-9 record again this coming season.

I just don't see it, we have a more favorable schedule, we get players like Ko and Poz back on defense plus the aquisitions Stroud, Johnson, Mitchell, and now James..you have to agree that the defense cant be worse, even after releasing Tripplett, who did absolutely nothing in his two years here.

On offense, you have to hope that Trent will be better, and the offense will perform with continuity at the QB position. Plus you add in the effect of a probable first round wide reciever, not to mention utilizing Fred Jackson for a whole season instead of the last 5 games.

Another overlooked factor is that last season our special teams suffered because guys who came into the season as special teamers like Digiorgio were taken off the unit because they were needed on defense.

I just don't see how this team is not better off... can someone explain this?

NO improvements to the 30th ranked offense- it's as simple as that. We had no injuries on offense except Everett who isn't coming back. It doesn't matter how good the D is if the O can't score or keep them off the field- bend but don't break always breaks.

Oh, and ST lost several players (Hargrove and Aiken come immediately to mind), plus a lot of those guys were still playing ST while they were playing D.

I liked the start of FA with the improvements to the D, but right now the only hope for the offense is Edwards improving. And if you've been following this team for the last decade, you should know why that's a problem.

[Kenny]

NO improvements to the 30th ranked offense- it's as simple as that. We had no injuries on offense except Everett who isn't coming back. It doesn't matter how good the D is if the O can't score or keep them off the field- bend but don't break always breaks.

Oh, and ST lost several players (Hargrove and Aiken come immediately to mind), plus a lot of those guys were still playing ST while they were playing D.

I liked the start of FA with the improvements to the D, but right now the only hope for the offense is Edwards improving. And if you've been following this team for the last decade, you should know why that's a problem.

While I agree we have problems on O, I think it'll be better.
TE has some games under his belt, and hopefully will play better. Plus, the OL should be better now that they've had more time to gel.

IMO, -we really dont know what we have on offense. Though it looked pathetic last season (mostly due to QB play), I think the majority of us felt pretty good heading into the 2007 season, -espeically with the hot finish to the 2006 season (JP and Evans looked to be emerging superstars, -which obviously didnt transpire).

I dont know... maybe I have my rose colored glasses on.

[Goobylal]

I never said Triplett was better then Stroud because he played and Stroud didn't. I said Tripplet played and Stroud didn't so how can Bill fans say Tripplett did basically nothing and Stroud is an upgrade? Strouds injuries are serious and his drug use is even more seriuous. Stroud hasn't had a "good" year since 04 that's 4 years ago. It's not like he's coming off a probowl or even one season removed from probowl status.
Ummmm, Stroud made the Pro Bowl from 2003-2005. Check out his stats from those seasons. Then he started having ankle problems and missed 5 and 7 games the past 2 years respectively, which obviously affected his play. As I said, if he's healthy, he's a force, and his health is what is a real concern. Tripplett has never been much of anything, healthy or not.

You're using "if's" and "but's" as if they're fact. You can't call Stroud an upgrade till he proves he is. As I stated before, Stroud is more of a question mark then an upgrade. But Bill fans such as yourself refuse to be realistic about it.
Please, you're one of the LAST people to be talking about being realistic. If Stroud were say, Ricky Williams, I'd be worried that he's a risk to fail another drug test. I'd also say that I'd be just as worried about Ronnie Brown being as injury-prone as you believe Stroud is.

[OpIv37]

While I agree we have problems on O, I think it'll be better.
TE has some games under his belt, and hopefully will play better. Plus, the OL should be better now that they've had more time to gel.

IMO, -we really dont know what we have on offense. Though it looked pathetic last season (mostly due to QB play), I think the majority of us felt pretty good heading into the 2007 season, -espeically with the hot finish to the 2006 season (JP and Evans looked to be emerging superstars, -which obviously didnt transpire).

I dont know... maybe I have my rose colored glasses on.

it all depends on Edwards and that's what concerns me- we've been here before. It was the same situation with Losman, RJ and Todd Collins, and we all know how those turned out.

[Goobylal]

NO improvements to the 30th ranked offense- it's as simple as that. We had no injuries on offense except Everett who isn't coming back. It doesn't matter how good the D is if the O can't score or keep them off the field- bend but don't break always breaks.
IMHO, what hurt the Bills was Price's decline from 2006 to 2007. While he was nothing great in 2006, he was closer to a #2 WR than anything the Bills had this past season. And that's what they need to find. Can they do it in the draft? Perhaps post-June 1st cuts?

Oh, and ST lost several players (Hargrove and Aiken come immediately to mind), plus a lot of those guys were still playing ST while they were playing D.
Spencer Johnson plays ST's, so he replaces Hargrove. And with Mitchell being a started, JD and/or Ellison become a full-time ST'ers

I liked the start of FA with the improvements to the D, but right now the only hope for the offense is Edwards improving. And if you've been following this team for the last decade, you should know why that's a problem.
Actually I look for Edwards and Lynch to improve, the O-line to continue to improve/gel, and the Bills to address WR and TE in the draft and/or post-June 1st cuts. I also think Schonert will be an improvement over Fairchild, and that the running game will be more emphasized in any case.

[feelthepain]

Ummmm, Stroud made the Pro Bowl from 2003-2005. Check out his stats from those seasons. Then he started having ankle problems and missed 5 and 7 games the past 2 years respectively, which obviously affected his play. As I said, if he's healthy, he's a force, and his health is what is a real concern. Tripplett has never been much of anything, healthy or not.

I didn't say Stroud didn't make the probowl since 2004, I said he hasn't had a good season since 04...go look at his stats. You obviously want to live off his play on a team that was deep and strong on Defense, especially Dline. The Bills don't have that coupled with his injuries and drug use I will once again say Stroud is a question mark, not an upgrade.


Please, you're one of the LAST people to be talking about being realistic. If Stroud were say, Ricky Williams, I'd be worried that he's a risk to fail another drug test. I'd also say that I'd be just as worried about Ronnie Brown being as injury-prone as you believe Stroud is.

I'm very realistic, I give my team credit when it's due and I say nothing at all if I feel there's nothing to say. It's why so far this off season I've not been talking about the Fins and what I think they are and should be. Because I have no idea at this point. You NEVER look at things with an unbias eye. Everything the Bills do is an improvement in your opinion. This Stroud thing, is a perfect example.

[xXSpIkes5IXx]

You NEVER look at things with an unbias eye. Everything the Bills do is an improvement in your opinion. This Stroud thing, is a perfect example.

I will admit i am a bills fan and am therefore bias. However, anytime a team aquires a 3 time probowl defensive tackle when its run defense has struggled, its only natural to get excited.

Bottom line, for a 3rd and a 5th the reward is much higher than the risk. You make it seem like you KNOW Stroud is going to be a failure. Which is far from a certainty. Plus your sig is of John Beck, and what a great pick he has turned out to be so far.... How many TD's did he lead you guys to? 1, in about 6 starts?

[dannyek71]

Other than POZ, and Ko, how many guys that actually really made much of a difference got hurt last year? Maybe we'd have won an extra game or two without those other injuries. And if we had absolutly no injuries, I think we'd have won 9 games last year at most.

[Goobylal]

I didn't say Stroud didn't make the probowl since 2004, I said he hasn't had a good season since 04...go look at his stats. You obviously want to live off his play on a team that was deep and strong on Defense, especially Dline. The Bills don't have that coupled with his injuries and drug use I will once again say Stroud is a question mark, not an upgrade.
On what are you basing that he didn't have a good season in 2005? His stats? What DT or DT's played better that season in the AFC? Ted Washington used to make the Pro Bowl without high sack or tackle stats.

I'm very realistic, I give my team credit when it's due and I say nothing at all if I feel there's nothing to say. It's why so far this off season I've not been talking about the Fins and what I think they are and should be. Because I have no idea at this point. You NEVER look at things with an unbias eye. Everything the Bills do is an improvement in your opinion. This Stroud thing, is a perfect example.
Please. I still recall your bluster about the Dols acquiring Culpepper 2 years ago, as if it were just yesterday. At that time, you had NO problem thinking that he was the greatest addition in NFL history.

[ddaryl]

I agree with most... our glass is half full. It is NOT half empty

[Philagape]

it all depends on Edwards and that's what concerns me- we've been here before. It was the same situation with Losman, RJ and Todd Collins, and we all know how those turned out.

Past performances should never be used to evaluate a current player. It doesn't get more irrelevant.

[feelthepain]

I will admit i am a bills fan and am therefore bias. However, anytime a team aquires a 3 time probowl defensive tackle when its run defense has struggled, its only natural to get excited.

Bottom line, for a 3rd and a 5th the reward is much higher than the risk. You make it seem like you KNOW Stroud is going to be a failure. Which is far from a certainty. Plus your sig is of John Beck, and what a great pick he has turned out to be so far.... How many TD's did he lead you guys to? 1, in about 6 starts?


Really? So me calling Stroud a question mark, is where you conclude I think he will be a failure?

I see Stroud as a question mark because of what he's done in recent years. I think thats fair. I'm not saying he's a poor pickup, I'm not saying he's never been a good player. So why you make the statement "I make it seem like he is going to be a failure" is beyond me.

Bill fans automatically pencil him in as a success, because that's what they want to happen. I on the other hand, give a much more honest and realistic opinion. I give the only real opinion you can give a guy that's recent history warrants it.

[justasportsfan]

However, our WR's and TE's couldn't get open and alot of it had to do with Reed and Price being slow, Pariish getting man-handled at the line, and having no threats at TE or the #5 position. Shutting down Evans became super easy and left us with no other options.

wrong. the reason we have any answers for Evans getting doubled and the rest couldn't get open was Fairchild.

he's the idiot who would dump what they practiced all week on gameday?

[blackonyx89]

Ive read threads saying we havent done enough to improve our team this offseason, and that we will have a 7-9 record again this coming season.

I just don't see it, we have a more favorable schedule, we get players like Ko and Poz back on defense plus the aquisitions Stroud, Johnson, Mitchell, and now James..you have to agree that the defense cant be worse, even after releasing Tripplett, who did absolutely nothing in his two years here.

On offense, you have to hope that Trent will be better, and the offense will perform with continuity at the QB position. Plus you add in the effect of a probable first round wide reciever, not to mention utilizing Fred Jackson for a whole season instead of the last 5 games.

Another overlooked factor is that last season our special teams suffered because guys who came into the season as special teamers like Digiorgio were taken off the unit because they were needed on defense.

I just don't see how this team is not better off... can someone explain this?


Despite the massive injuries,the Bills played hard and made some games competitive. They should be able to fight for a wildcard game this season,barring a major outbreak of injuries, of course.

:respect:

[feelthepain]

On what are you basing that he didn't have a good season in 2005? His stats? What DT or DT's played better that season in the AFC? Ted Washington used to make the Pro Bowl without high sack or tackle stats.

Good grief are you serious? Strouds numbers in 05 were no wheres near PB numbers...not even close. Stroud was given a free pass in the 05 probowl, if infact he played in the 05 probowl. The Jags were top 6 in total defense in 05, they were top 3 in sacks of which Stroud contributed just one sack all year. You really need to stop lying to yourself and look at what Stroud has actually done. He's getting the credit of a teams success not individual success.


Please. I still recall your bluster about the Dols acquiring Culpepper 2 years ago, as if it were just yesterday. At that time, you had NO problem thinking that he was the greatest addition in NFL history.

I know you refuse to see anything other then Bills greatness, but Daunte at the time Miami signed him had put up numbers that many of the top QB's in the league throught history couldn't even touch. He put up those numbers with and without the help of Randy Moss and he wasn't 3 years removed from his success. At the time Miami signed Daunte he only had one half of a season he struggled in his career and that was the season before we signed him when he sustained hi knee injury. So please don't compare Daunte and what he's done in the NFL to Stroud....they're not even close.

[Goobylal]

Good grief are you serious? Strouds numbers in 05 were no wheres near PB numbers...not even close. Stroud was given a free pass in the 05 probowl, if infact he played in the 05 probowl. The Jags were top 6 in total defense in 05, they were top 3 in sacks of which Stroud contributed just one sack all year. You really need to stop lying to yourself and look at what Stroud has actually done. He's getting the credit of a teams success not individual success.
So because Stroud had 1 sack in 2005, he was a bum and his Pro Bowl days were over in 2004? Okay, I guess we'll see.

I know you refuse to see anything other then Bills greatness, but Daunte at the time Miami signed him had put up numbers that many of the top QB's in the league throught history couldn't even touch. He put up those numbers with and without the help of Randy Moss and he wasn't 3 years removed from his success. At the time Miami signed Daunte he only had one half of a season he struggled in his career and that was the season before we signed him when he sustained hi knee injury. So please don't compare Daunte and what he's done in the NFL to Stroud....they're not even close.
See, it's stuff like this and "the Bills haven't beaten the Dols because they were better, only because they were lucky" excuse that make us shake our heads. FYI, Culpepper owes his career to Moss. Without Moss, he was and is a bum. Even with Moss he was a sack and turnover machine. I mean, it's no surprise that Brady gets Moss and breaks the TD record, is it?

[yordad]

So Stroud missing time due to injury and drug suspension and not helping the Jags doesn't really matter or count, casuse Bill fans will just make up numbers to make his signing seem terriffic? But Tripplett actually playing and helping the Bills doesn't mean squat, because he's not "Stroud"? Got it!!Your right. Stroud was a non-factor in the games he was injured. So it completely makes sense that you would comnpare his 20 game production to that of someone else's 32 game production. In doing so, it is plain to see that if you stretched his 20 game production into 32 games he was less then average.

Duh. Sweet logic.

[justasportsfan]

I know you refuse to see anything other then Bills greatness, but Daunte at the time Miami signed him had put up numbers that many of the top QB's in the league throught history couldn't even touch. He put up those numbers with and without the help of Randy Moss and he wasn't 3 years removed from his success. At the time Miami signed Daunte he only had one half of a season he struggled in his career and that was the season before we signed him when he sustained hi knee injury. So please don't compare Daunte and what he's done in the NFL to Stroud....they're not even close.


Dear Daunte,

Love,
FTP.

[feelthepain]

Dear Daunte,

Love,
FTP.


Dear WORLD,

I'm clueless,
sincerely,

Justa.

[feelthepain]

Your right. Stroud was a non-factor in the games he was injured. So it completely makes sense that you would comnpare his 20 game production to that of someone else's 32 game production. In doing so, it is plain to see that if you stretched his 20 game production into 32 games he was less then average.

Duh. Sweet logic.


So your opinion is, to only give him credit for things that make "Bill fans" believe he will be a stud in Buffalo and ignore his injuries, missed games and drug suspension because it would force you to look at the addition as a question mark rather then a guaranteed upgrade. Got it.

I'm looking at his success and issues and calling him a question mark. Bill fans are only looking at his success because you sure don't see any threads addressing Stroud's issues, basically treating them as minor and unimportant. Hardly.

[Goobylal]

Again, if Stroud is healthy, he'll be an upgrade for the Bills, period. If he can regain his 2002-2005 form, he'll be a MAJOR upgrade for the Bills.

[Luisito23]

NO improvements to the 30th ranked offense.



Fairchild is gone!....HUGE improve!.....