Im loving this spygate coverage

[Bruce is Loose]

They are showing the tapes, including the ones from the Bills games. The tapes have endzone shots of the play formation, sideline shots of the coaches and the clock and down. Teams are taped that they dont play for years - begging the question of why tape it unless its used in game.

Im not sure any of this will lead to any new allegations, but its nice to see the disbelief the commentators have, commenting on the scar on the organization, etc. This has been all sportcenter has covered, and it is great :)

[Mr. Miyagi]

Is it being shown on ESPN or something?

[RockStar36]

I'm gonna go ahead and guess that it is based on the thread starter

[Mr. Miyagi]

You saying he's making up this crap?

[Bruce is Loose]

Yes on ESPN.
The subtitle is: ESPN is pounding the pats dynasty
It bothers me that we cant see subtitles once we open a thread....


Anyway, Godell is speaking now and basically saying that there is nothing in addition to what Godell already knew and that the Pats will not be punished further. Hes still speaking.

New info:
Tape existed of a player on IR practicing - would be a team fine but its small potatoes compared to previous fine so he would not take any further action
Scalping of superbowl tickets by players

[justasportsfan]

Everything about the pats is now tainted. People should take back the Brady and Montana comparison. Both are still GREAT system qb's. One is a WCO system qb and the other is a Cheating system.

Come HOF nomination time, spygate should come into consideration. I think Andre' Reed should get in before any of the Pats players involved in spygate should. Except for Moss if he is HOF material before joining the Pats.

[Mr. Miyagi]

It's on LIVE right now!

http://www.nfl.com/videos?videoId=09000d5d80707252

[DMBcrew36]

Sounds like Goodell is basically putting a cap on Spygate so the league can move forward. He isn't going to take any further action on punishing the Patriots are Belicheat it seems.

[TacklingDummy]

Everything about the pats is now tainted. People should take back the Brady and Montana comparison. Both are still GREAT system qb's. One is a WCO system qb and the other is a Cheating system.



I don't know about that. Brady had his best year statistically this past year.

[Mr. Miyagi]

Sounds like Goodell is basically putting a cap on Spygate so the league can move forward. He isn't going to take any further action on punishing the Patriots are Belicheat it seems.
The league desperately needs this to go away, for the good of the game. They know what the Pats did, and it's a lot a lot more than they'll admit to in public. And they never will, in order to save face for everyone involved.

But I think the Pats are in serious doghouse of the league, and any favoring of the Pats by the league prior to this incident will be reversed 180 deg. I foresee the Pats losing all the close calls from this point on. No more golden child. I'm okay with this even though I really wanted public humiliation of the Pats.

[TacklingDummy]

What the Pats need is for another team to be exposed for this.

So who is the NFL going to throw under the bus to take the heat off the Pats?

[justasportsfan]

I don't know about that. Brady had his best year statistically this past year.
they already have several videos on teams over the years. Don't think much has changed in Dicks first and 2nd year. I mean, not tryint to say that we would've beaten them anyways , it's just that they already have info on plays.

[The Spaz]

The whole things that bothers me is that Goodell says it didn't affect the outcomes of games. If this is true then why did the taping continue for 6-7 years?

[gr8slayer]

I'm tired of hearing about it; if Goodell isn't going to remove rings then it's a non-issue and a waste of time.

[gil]

I know it won't go anywhere, but I'm just enjoying seeing Belichick's legacy get all nice & tarnished.

[raphael120]

The whole things that bothers me is that Goodell says it didn't affect the outcomes of games. If this is true then why did the taping continue for 6-7 years?

if it doesnt effect games then why do it in the first place...why waste precious time and effort. so stupid

[raphael120]

I'm tired of hearing about it; if Goodell isn't going to remove rings then it's a non-issue and a waste of time.

i dont care about rings, I want bellicheat banned from the NFL

[Bruce is Loose]

There was info from the rams walkthrough, even if there isnt a tape, including:
1) Marshall Faulk lined up to return a kick
2) TE rolled a certain way in a certain formation

In that game stuffing a single play may have made a difference?

[Michael82]

Interesting....Roger Goodell held a big piece of info out of his press conference.....

Sal Paolantonio is reporting on ESPN that according to Matt Walsh's attorney, Walsh stated at the meeting that he watched the Ram's walkthru and did not tape it. But he did tell the Patriots WRs coach what he saw and described certain formations from the walkthru to the Receivers coach.

[Michael82]

There was info from the rams walkthrough, even if there isnt a tape, including:
1) Marshall Faulk lined up to return a kick
2) TE rolled a certain way in a certain formation

In that game stuffing a single play may have made a difference?
That right there should REALLY piss off the Rams rams. It's makes me sick that Roger Goodell purposely kept that out of the press conference. :ill:

[ddaryl]

i dont care about rings, I want bellicheat banned from the NFL

I'd take it further and place all the personell who willingly and knowingly did this to be fined and suspended...

but I agree this alone will have the entire league ragging on the cheatriots for quite awhile... which in itself should cause strain on and in the organization.

[justasportsfan]

I'd take it further and place all the personell who willingly and knowingly did this to be fined and suspended...

but I agree this alone will have the entire league ragging on the cheatriots for quite awhile... which in itself should cause strain on and in the organization.
I wonder if the Krafts knew about this.

[Michael82]

I wonder if the Krafts knew about this.
:rofl: of course they did.


Did you happen to see Robert Kraft did Bill Belichick a new contract after he was fined all that money? :ill: :puke:

[Mr. Miyagi]

Anything the league is trying to cover up, Spector will turn it over. I'm glad he's meeting with Walsh in person.

[PECKERWOOD]

Funny how they only get penalized a 1st round pick for cheating INGAME, when players like Pacman and Henry get 1 year bans. Where is Goodell when it comes to punishing teams that are cheating? Plus, does anybody honestly think that Belichick paid that 500k from his own pocket? There is a reason why Kraft gave Belichick a contract extension with a nice bonus included.

[Bill Brasky]

cover-ups! i love america.

[PromoTheRobot]

Patriots* = O.J.!!! You may have beat the system, but we all know you're GUILTY!!

PTR

[Marvelous]

Man i don't like Spector, Sounds like a big baby to me..

[Mike13]

Goodell=:poop:

[OpIv37]

this **** pisses me off to no end.

We've only beaten the Pats once since their first SB win and we've lost to them 9 straight times. Who knows how many of those losses were due to them cheating? What about 2004 where we lost to them twice and finished 1 game out of the playoffs? It's impossible to know the full effects of what they did, and yet Goodell just gives them the proverbial slap on the wrist- "uhhh, we have to punish you for PR but we're not gonna come down hard because of all the money you've made for the league. Just try to keep your nose clean from here on out" :rolleyes:

My hatred for the Patriots grows stronger every day. I can't wait for them to crash and burn, although that's probably still a few years off.

[YardRat]

If Goodell continues to sweep this under the rug he automatically becomes the worst professional sports commissioner ever.

IMO, he's damn close already.

[Ingtar33]

If Goodell continues to sweep this under the rug he automatically becomes the worst professional sports commissioner ever.

IMO, he's damn close already.


He's handcuffed. He chose last year to cover it up, and it bit him on the butt, if he changes course now, he'll be admitting this is a crisis for the nfl.

If he admits this is a crisis... he'll not be commish for long.

The team owners want the league to always look like a winner. a commish who leads the league into a "crisis" might take away the cultural momentum the league has spent 40 years building to become America's game.

in short. to now punish the pats he'll be admitting to making a mistake. He won't do it... now it's about spin. he's going to claim this is "nothing new" old story, move on.

it's his only move.

now he has to pray some more tapes don't show up.

[Oaf]

Can we just dish out the retribution now? Like playing with 10 players on the field for the season or just forfieting it period?

[Michael82]

He's handcuffed. He chose last year to cover it up, and it bit him on the butt, if he changes course now, he'll be admitting this is a crisis for the nfl.

If he admits this is a crisis... he'll not be commish for long.

The team owners want the league to always look like a winner. a commish who leads the league into a "crisis" might take away the cultural momentum the league has spent 40 years building to become America's game.

in short. to now punish the pats he'll be admitting to making a mistake. He won't do it... now it's about spin. he's going to claim this is "nothing new" old story, move on.

it's his only move.

now he has to pray some more tapes don't show up.
Good post. I was thinking the same thing. You can tell that he knows he screwed up. He looks like a guy pissed off that this has gotten this far. He knows he should have punished the Patriots more, but it's too late for that now. What's done is done. :ill:

[LifetimeBillsFan]

Goodell and the NFL as a whole just want this to go away.

The NFL is a multi-billion dollar business and the people who are running that business are scared that the fans who support that business will withdraw some of their support if they were to admit that one of the most successful teams of the last decade, a franchise that has won multiple championships during this era, had gained a competitive advantage over its opponents during this time by engaging in activities expressly forbidden by the rules of the game. They are concerned that their whole business will be tainted by the suggestion that the competition that they sponsor and market has not been conducted on a "level field".

Because the Patriots are able to command the highest ticket prices in the league, are one of the league's most valuable and highest priced franchises, and feature one of the league's most marketable individual stars, in T.Brady (particularly at a time when the league is losing one of its most marketable stars in B.Favre), the NFL has chosen to go into denial mode: denying that what the Pats did was that big a deal or had any impact on the outcome of games.

Already, the league has got its allies in the media (such a the hosts of Mike and the Mad Dog, a nationally syndicated radio show on WFAN in NYC) to say that, since Walsh was unable to produce a tape of the Rams' pre-Super Bowl walk-through, there was nothing substantial in what Walsh had to say or turned over to Goodell. And, you can expect that you will hear more voices taking up this position on what the Pats did in coming days.

And, that may work to satisfy those casual fans who don't follow the game closely, but do watch the games or go to a game occasionally, and the league's corporate sponsors (many of whom are corporations with the same moral sensibilities as Kraft, Belichick and that Patriots' franchise). Which is all that the NFL really cares about.

Of course, those of us who follow the game more closely know better than to accept that line of BS.

We understand that, if the Pats weren't gaining a competitive advantage from doing the taping that they did, the Patriots', as an organization, would not have spent the money that they did on personnel and equipment to do that taping. We know the game well enough to know how that could work to the advantage of the Patriots, not just in the games that were being taped, but in future meetings with those teams. We understand the flow of the game well enough to appreciate how the information gleaned from those tapes could tip the balance between defeat and victory in games.

But, the NFL isn't worried about fans like us. They figure that we are so hooked on their product that, even if we know that they are feeding us a line of BS about the extent and impact of what the Pats did, we're still going to watch the games and buy the products that their advertisers sell. So we hate the Pats even more than before...so what! If anything, they figure that we're only going to root harder and be more devoted to our teams, hoping that they will revenge themselves against the Pats.

So, Goodell gave the Pats a little slap on the wrist and tells the media that it was enough punishment for what they did. We may know that it wasn't enough punishment for them gaining an advantage, even just against their AFC East rivals--all three of whom we know were taped!--which accounted for almost 1/3 of the games that they played every season. But, what are we going to do about that?

Correctly, Goodell and the rest of the folks running the NFL figure that the answer to that question is NOTHING.

And, in 6 months, when all of this blows over, the NFL can get back to business as usual with one of its most valuable franchises slightly tainted, perhaps, but with its value still intact. Whatever taint remains on the Patriots franchise will be washed away by the excitement and hype over whether Brady and Moss can break the records that they set last season and complete the undefeated season that the NY Giants prevented them from having last year.

The only hope for any further justice...the only chance that the NFL will be forced to mete out some further punishment to the Patriots...lies in Sen. Spector.

Spector is a politician...who doesn't know "jack" about football. But, he does know a little about using an issue to get himself some publicity (and, if you have followed politics over the years, you will know that Spector likes publicity!) and maybe some additional votes. I don't expect him to be interested in this issue for the sake of any kind of "justice", just his self interest.

I do not expect Spector to give a "tinker's damn" about the fact that the Pats taped the Bills or the rest of their AFC East opponents. But, there is one thing that gives me some hope that he will try to keep this issue alive and, perhaps, force Goodell to take more action to punish the Pats:

One of the tapes that Walsh turned over to Goodell was of the Pats' AFC Championship Game against the Pittsburgh Steelers.

Spector is a senator from Pennsylvania. And, I am sure that he is very much aware of how rabid Steelers fans are. I think he is also smart enough to understand that, if the Patriots' taping gave them an advantage in the second half of that Championship game against the Steelers, the fact that the Pats won and went to the Super Bowl instead of the Steelers cost people in his state money that ended up going to New England and their businesses, etc. instead.

My only hope in all of this is that Spector will realize how much money the people in the state that he represents potentially lost out on and that, as a result, he will take it upon himself to put some heat on Goodell to come up with some further punishment for the Patriots' franchise.

The last thing that the NFL wants is the US government or a US senator with influence making noises about taking a look at their books or anti-trust exemption. Sen. Spector has been around the Congress long enough to have all the contacts that he needs to create a lot of problems for the NFL, if he chooses to do so. So, if Walsh can convince him that the Pats gained a competitive advantage from their taping that might have impacted their win over the Steelers in that AFC Championship game and, as a result, Spector decides to put some heat on the NFL, Goodell might be convinced that he needs to further punish the Pats.

But, that's a long-shot. And, there is no way IMHO that, even in that instance, Goodell would do anything more to punish the Pats than he absolutely would have to do to satisfy Spector--which would likely end up being nothing more than giving the Pats another slap on the wrist.

I hate to say it, but IMHO the Patriots franchise and Belichick will never be given anywhere near the punishment for what they have done that they deserve. The NFL may keep a closer eye on the team, but those who run the league are never going to do anything that will harm the cash-cow that the New England franchise has become, let alone the league's marketablity.

As I have watched the way that Goodell has handled this whole issue, I have been constantly reminded of the scene from the movie "North Dallas Forty", where the lineman in the lockerroom screams at the assistant coach, "Every time I call it a game, you call it a business! And, when I call it a business, you call it a game!"

Well, folks, that's the game that the NFL plays: to them it is a business, but, when you the fan try to call it a business, they tell you that it is just a game. But, don't ever believe that--to the folks who run the NFL it is ALWAYS a business first...the game is just there to create a reason for you to give them your money...and it doesn't matter how much you know or love the game or understand how much of an advantage the Pats got from cheating...as long as it doesn't adversely impact the credibility of their product and, ultimately, their bottom line....

[don137]

The Patriots legacy is tarnished. No doubt about it. In today's Charlotte Observer it talked about how one wonder if the Patriots cheated against the Panthers in the Super Bowl and how the Patriots were able to move at will in the second half for unknown reasons. The fact they lost by a last second FG one wonders if they cheated and if they did it probably affected the outcome.
Goodell is between a rock and a hard place. He doesn't want to say too much because the reputation of the league is at stake.

[Michael82]

Another excellent post, LTBF! :bf1:

[Michael82]

The Patriots legacy is tarnished. No doubt about it. In today's Charlotte Observer it talked about how one wonder if the Patriots cheated against the Panthers in the Super Bowl and how the Patriots were able to move at will in the second half for unknown reasons. The fact they lost by a last second FG one wonders if they cheated and if they did it probably affected the outcome.
Goodell is between a rock and a hard place. He doesn't want to say too much because the reputation of the league is at stake.
That's the key...the kind of tapes that the Patriots were using and how secretative they were. All they had to do was bring them into the locker room for halftime and give it to the guys upstairs and they can come up with ways to counter what they have seen in the tape and with the signals. Look at most of the Patriots games, they always were better in the 2nd half, especially the last quarter...after they had time to study to tapes and read the signals. :ill:

[DynaPaul]

It's too bad the Rams tape didn't come out but the fact is still there that the Patriots cheated and we don't know about other tapes that were destroyed and not seen by the public. In light of this, they are not so great. It's easy to win when you know the calls.

The thing that gets me is what kind of deal the NFL had with Walsh. I'm sure something was suppressed there that would protect the league's integrity.

[OpIv37]

He's handcuffed. He chose last year to cover it up, and it bit him on the butt, if he changes course now, he'll be admitting this is a crisis for the nfl.

If he admits this is a crisis... he'll not be commish for long.

The team owners want the league to always look like a winner. a commish who leads the league into a "crisis" might take away the cultural momentum the league has spent 40 years building to become America's game.

in short. to now punish the pats he'll be admitting to making a mistake. He won't do it... now it's about spin. he's going to claim this is "nothing new" old story, move on.

it's his only move.

now he has to pray some more tapes don't show up.

he had an out though.

he could have said there was something new or different about the tapes and gotten himself off the hook by making it look like he didn't know about it before.

But he didn't. And now the Pats cheated their way to a dynasty and quite possibly cost us a playoff birth in 2004 due to their cheating.

[The Spaz]

I'm going to check out the patriots message boards just so I can laugh...lol