Throwing Hardy under the Bus!!!

[kernowboy]

Just read some more information about the James Hardy alleged incident.

There does seem to be a lot of 2+2 = 27.

It seems the situation that because Hardy has a permit to carry a small handgun and was in a fight with his old man, therefore he must have pulled a gun on him.

Hardy has not been charged with anything.

His father has said there was an argument not altercation and that Hardy did not pull a gun on him.

Only a female witness said he pulled a handgun. She called the police and maybe chose to big it up recognising Hardy as a star. Boring stories do not make money for witnesses to sell. As he has a legal license to carry a gun, might have meant he had the gun on it, but doesn't mean he pulled the gun out on his old man. But the witness could easily have implied he did, so not to feel that she has wasted police time.

I have only heard that this witness said a gun was pulled. No other source seems to have confirmed this.

Maybe fans should put their toys back into the pram?

[Night Train]

I'm going to my daughters dance recital Saturday, right after I load and pack my Glock.

[YardRat]

I'm going to my daughters dance recital Saturday, right after I load and pack my Glock.

Make sure you keep the safety on until you actually reach the destination.

[Luisito23]

Hardy's still aight with me....It's just another case of someone trying to be famous that all.

[Mitchy moo]

This may end up being a cheap lesson for Hardy about how even little things can blow up into big things when you're a pro athlete.

Just for the record, getting a gun permit in FL is as easy as getting a drivers license. You basically ask for it and get it, nothing difficult. Many people also carry guns down here for protection and / or personal security. As for packing one for a family BBQ, well that's a another story.

[Confused]

slow news week.

[TheGhostofJimKelly]

slow news week.

very slow.

[acehole]

Please.

She did not sell this story...it seems like you are trying to sell this one.

IT is what it is. No more no less.



Just read some more information about the James Hardy alleged incident.

There does seem to be a lot of 2+2 = 27.

It seems the situation that because Hardy has a permit to carry a small handgun and was in a fight with his old man, therefore he must have pulled a gun on him.

Hardy has not been charged with anything.

His father has said there was an argument not altercation and that Hardy did not pull a gun on him.

Only a female witness said he pulled a handgun. She called the police and maybe chose to big it up recognising Hardy as a star. Boring stories do not make money for witnesses to sell. As he has a legal license to carry a gun, might have meant he had the gun on it, but doesn't mean he pulled the gun out on his old man. But the witness could easily have implied he did, so not to feel that she has wasted police time.

I have only heard that this witness said a gun was pulled. No other source seems to have confirmed this.

Maybe fans should put their toys back into the pram?

[dasaybz]

I just hope that this isn't the beginning of many altercations with this guy. He's already beat up his girlfriend and pulled a gun on his dad before he's taken one snap in this league.

Not a very good start.

[mayotm]

Please.

She did not sell this story...it seems like you are trying to sell this one.

IT is what it is. No more no less.Unless you were there, you don't know what happened.

[EDS]

Just read some more information about the James Hardy alleged incident.

There does seem to be a lot of 2+2 = 27.

It seems the situation that because Hardy has a permit to carry a small handgun and was in a fight with his old man, therefore he must have pulled a gun on him.

Hardy has not been charged with anything.

His father has said there was an argument not altercation and that Hardy did not pull a gun on him.

Only a female witness said he pulled a handgun. She called the police and maybe chose to big it up recognising Hardy as a star. Boring stories do not make money for witnesses to sell. As he has a legal license to carry a gun, might have meant he had the gun on it, but doesn't mean he pulled the gun out on his old man. But the witness could easily have implied he did, so not to feel that she has wasted police time.

I have only heard that this witness said a gun was pulled. No other source seems to have confirmed this.

Maybe fans should put their toys back into the pram?


This may all be true, but you also have to consider the fact that the father is probably looking for a pay day and knows that reporting that his son pulled a gun on him may decrease his sons future earnings. So now, potentially, the dad has a bargining chip with the son to get more money out of him - because he didn't report him and if the son doesn't give him the money he wants then he will start talking.

Obviously the above is just conjecture, and I hope we never have to hear about Hardy and his gun collection again.

[LifetimeBillsFan]

Here's another way to look at it:

Hardy may be an athlete, but his father spent 10 years in jail. A lot of guys who spend that much time in jail aren't exactly nice guys or push-overs...I mean we may not be talking about your typical suburban father here.

The kid gets into an serious argument with his father--and who knows what got said at that point--and maybe he felt threatened to the extent that he felt that he needed to pull the pistol out to let the father know that he wasn't going to be bullied, etc.

You never know. And, we don't have enough information about what went down to really be able to draw any conclusions about that.

Now, on the other hand, why the kid was walking around and went to the house with a gun in his pocket is a different story.

Not the brightest thing to do--even if he has a license and is allowed to carry a licensed gun in that state--considering how many pro athletes have recently been arrested for just carrying a gun or having a gun in their car.

It sounds to me like Hardy is a young man who needs to get away from some of his family and learn some things about being a professional athlete pretty quickly. And, probably, grow up (in a certain sense) as well. I just hope that happens soon. Before he ends up getting into the kind of trouble that he can't walk away from and/or that impacts his football career.

[justasportsfan]

It was a cell phone not a gun. Ax Vicks brother.

[Goobylal]

Here's another way to look at it:

Hardy may be an athlete, but his father spent 10 years in jail. A lot of guys who spend that much time in jail aren't exactly nice guys or push-overs...I mean we may not be talking about your typical suburban father here.

The kid gets into an serious argument with his father--and who knows what got said at that point--and maybe he felt threatened to the extent that he felt that he needed to pull the pistol out to let the father know that he wasn't going to be bullied, etc.
I think that's exactly what happened. I doubt Hardy just pulled out a gun and started waving it at his father for no reason whatsoever. Just like he didn't "beat up" (which was probably him pushing her against a hard wall) his girlfriend without being provoked, which while it's still wrong, it's like throwing punches at her for no reason.


You never know. And, we don't have enough information about what went down to really be able to draw any conclusions about that.

Now, on the other hand, why the kid was walking around and went to the house with a gun in his pocket is a different story.

Not the brightest thing to do--even if he has a license and is allowed to carry a licensed gun in that state--considering how many pro athletes have recently been arrested for just carrying a gun or having a gun in their car.
I'd bet the area he was visiting wasn't exactly the 'burbs.


It sounds to me like Hardy is a young man who needs to get away from some of his family and learn some things about being a professional athlete pretty quickly. And, probably, grow up (in a certain sense) as well. I just hope that happens soon. Before he ends up getting into the kind of trouble that he can't walk away from and/or that impacts his football career.
I agree. I hope that Skooby is right and that this is a cheap lesson for young James and that he learns from it.

[!Papacrunk!]

so not to get on some other tangent here, but for those (me) that are too lazy to google, what was the end result of the '06 incident where Hardy hurt his girlfriend and also infant?

[acehole]

Unless you were there, you don't know what happened.

You werent either...so dont assume sombody is selling a story becuase it is made up.

We know what we know....and that is what we should be discussing.

It is bad just admit it....and move on.

[acehole]

Geezee.

HE PULLED A GUN ON HIS DAD.



Here's another way to look at it:

Hardy may be an athlete, but his father spent 10 years in jail. A lot of guys who spend that much time in jail aren't exactly nice guys or push-overs...I mean we may not be talking about your typical suburban father here.

The kid gets into an serious argument with his father--and who knows what got said at that point--and maybe he felt threatened to the extent that he felt that he needed to pull the pistol out to let the father know that he wasn't going to be bullied, etc.

You never know. And, we don't have enough information about what went down to really be able to draw any conclusions about that.

Now, on the other hand, why the kid was walking around and went to the house with a gun in his pocket is a different story.

Not the brightest thing to do--even if he has a license and is allowed to carry a licensed gun in that state--considering how many pro athletes have recently been arrested for just carrying a gun or having a gun in their car.

It sounds to me like Hardy is a young man who needs to get away from some of his family and learn some things about being a professional athlete pretty quickly. And, probably, grow up (in a certain sense) as well. I just hope that happens soon. Before he ends up getting into the kind of trouble that he can't walk away from and/or that impacts his football career.

[TedMock]

Geezee.

HE PULLED A GUN ON HIS DAD.

How do you know?

[Mahdi]

I just hope that this isn't the beginning of many altercations with this guy. He's already beat up his girlfriend and pulled a gun on his dad before he's taken one snap in this league.

Not a very good start.
Were you the witness who saw him pull the gun?

[dasaybz]

Were you the witness who saw him pull the gun?
He's off to a rough start.

Don't you hope that he doesn't fall down the wrong path and ruin his life like so many others?

I want him to succeed and become a great football player and a great member of society.

[DraftBoy]

You gotta love the spin here, if this was Ted Ginn Jr being accused we would all be railing on him and have no doubt that he did it saying "things like what reason would the witness have to lie?" yet because he's James Hardy of the Buffalo Bills we'll take the word of his father an Ex-Con as to whether or not Hardy pulled a gun...yea that makes a lot of sense...


And another thing pulling a gun to show you wont be bullied is a cop out excuse for pulling a gun. I know LTBF wasn't trying to excuse the action but if that ever turned out to be the reason he pulled it on him, he loses just as much if not more respect in my eyes. Pulling a gun on somebody, when your life isnt in danger, doesnt make you any more of a man. It makes you less of one.

[acehole]

You gotta love the spin here, if this was Ted Ginn Jr being accused we would all be railing on him and have no doubt that he did it saying "things like what reason would the witness have to lie?" yet because he's James Hardy of the Buffalo Bills we'll take the word of his father an Ex-Con as to whether or not Hardy pulled a gun...yea that makes a lot of sense...


And another thing pulling a gun to show you wont be bullied is a cop out excuse for pulling a gun. I know LTBF wasn't trying to excuse the action but if that ever turned out to be the reason he pulled it on him, he loses just as much if not more respect in my eyes. Pulling a gun on somebody, when your life isnt in danger, doesnt make you any more of a man. It makes you less of one.

Yea and add the fact that it is his papa...and some are just brushing this aside.

Where have you gone Marv.

[Saratoga Slim]

This may end up being a cheap lesson for Hardy about how even little things can blow up into big things when you're a pro athlete.



Yeah Skoob, that's what I'm hoping too.

Every dog gets one bite. Every pro athlete gets one not-so-favorable media story. There's a big difference between what you can get away with in college and what you can get away with in the pros--maybe this'll be a lesson learned.

We'll soon see.

[Mahdi]

He's off to a rough start.

Don't you hope that he doesn't fall down the wrong path and ruin his life like so many others?

I want him to succeed and become a great football player and a great member of society.
He had an argument with his father. I wouldnt call that a rough start, he is just a marked man now that he is who he is. If something more substantial ever comes out I will agree that he has had a rough start.

[feelthepain]

His father has said there was an argument not altercation and that Hardy did not pull a gun on him.


You mean the guy with all the MONEY didn't pull a hand gun on his less then wealthy father? OHHHH OK!

[justasportsfan]

You gotta love the spin here,.
spinsare coming from both sides .

[yordad]

Bottonline facts:

1) there was an altercation
2) no charges were filed

moving on now

[superbills]

Yea and add the fact that it is his papa...and some are just brushing this aside.

Where have you gone Marv.

And what do you propose "Marv" should do in this situation. The only real facts that we have are that he had an argument with his father. Anything else is conjecture and hearsay. So...

Do you fine and/or suspend the player based on an alleged report for which we have no formal complaint.

or

Do you have a talk with the player internally and explain how life is different in the NFL and that every situation is magnified. In short, treat every situation with kid gloves.

I would think the latter, but why should we assume that this hasn't been done already or will be the next time Hardy is in contact with the Bills? Unless you think that Marv would have chosen option A which would be an over-reaction based on the information we have of what occurred.

[Romes]

spinsare coming from both sides .

Is that spanish? We might need LTBF to translate...





:jk:

I agree. Yordad summed up all the facts.

[acehole]

You mean the guy with all the MONEY didn't pull a hand gun on his less then wealthy father? OHHHH OK!

hahah I know...Papa dont want to upset or put his meal ticket in any danger.

Some people will believe anything...that is what makes us the American people.

I feel your pain.

[Romes]

...and some people will assume everything.

[acehole]

God you people are thick.

Marv does not draft him period.

Oh and yea I would like to hear that convo...

(In the voice of John Cleese)
Umm yea....pionting a gun at papa is ok in school but we might want to "Put the fire arm away" in the NFL. Sorry if we did not cover that in the "Welcome to the Buffalo Bills packet we gave you. You know in a way it is our fault. If it were in there I am sure you would have know. So lets just say it was a communication error on our part and move on shall we?

We dont do anything here but take it in the keaster.

Hope he doent mess up and make his contract reflect that.
End of story.

People please stop with the spin.



And what do you propose "Marv" should do in this situation. The only real facts that we have are that he had an argument with his father. Anything else is conjecture and hearsay. So...


On that not we kind of poo poo drug dealling and dog fighting thing too FYI while we are on the subject.

Do you fine and/or suspend the player based on an alleged report for which we have no formal complaint.

or

Do you have a talk with the player internally and explain how life is different in the NFL and that every situation is magnified. In short, treat every situation with kid gloves.

I would think the latter, but why should we assume that this hasn't been done already or will be the next time Hardy is in contact with the Bills? Unless you think that Marv would have chosen option A which would be an over-reaction based on the information we have of what occurred.

[acehole]

...and some people will assume everything.

Yea lets all assume he is a boyscout because of this.

That is much more rational.

Are these all the same people that ignore all the stats?

[acehole]

Bottonline facts:

1) there was an altercation
2) no charges were filed

moving on now

Ok.

Nothing to see here glad that is over.

Hardy statements reasonable.

Lets hope for the best.

[Romes]

Yea lets all assume he is a boyscout because of this.

That is much more rational.

Are these all the same people that ignore all the stats?

a) Who is assuming he is a boyscout?

b) The stats on this situation are:

2 people involved
1 not involved saw a gun
0 charges filed


A rough start to an NFL career for Hardy for sure but lets not jump to conclusions

[acehole]

a) Who is assuming he is a boyscout?

b) The stats on this situation are:

2 people involved
1 not involved saw a gun
0 charges filed


A rough start to an NFL career for Hardy for sure but lets not jump to conclusions

Ok draw 0 conclusions from this.

Got it!

[feelthepain]

Bottonline facts:

1) there was an altercation
2) no charges were filed

moving on now

In other words, you're taking a page from the NFL's book of sweeping problems under the carpet in the hopes they go away.

[Yasgur's Farm]

I suggest the following edition...

Convicted felon dad pays a visit to his son.

Dad leaves.

Son finds his piece missing.

Son goes to his dad's place... pissed that he took his gun.

He yells at his dad.

Dad hands him the glock.

Son puts the gun in his pocket

Son leaves.

The end.

[justasportsfan]

I suggest the following edition...

Convicted felon dad pays a visit to his son.

Dad leaves.

Son finds his piece missing.

Son goes to his dad's place... pissed that he took his gun.

He yells at his dad.

Dad hands him the glock.

Son puts the gun in his pocket

Son leaves.

The end.
MYwealthy friend who has a legit inside source in OBD said they were playing video games. Duck hunt. witness walks by and sees James pointing the video game gun controller at the tv set while Dad was inserting the disc.

[mayotm]

You werent either...so dont assume sombody is selling a story becuase it is made up.

We know what we know....and that is what we should be discussing.

It is bad just admit it....and move on.You're right, I wasn't. The difference is that I'm intelligent enough to not pass judgement without having the facts.

[acehole]

You're right, I wasn't. The difference is that I'm intelligent enough to not pass judgement without having the facts.


I see I am dumb because I did not buy the lawer writen statement.

I am dumb because the lady was selling her story with the gun to the highest bidder.

This is the first mention of him doing anything bad ever.

This story means nothing either way...sorry I was not wise enough to see it your way.

Thank you for enlightning me.

Please let me return the favor.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occam's_Razor

[justasportsfan]

I see I am dumb because I did not buy the lawer writen statement.

I am dumb because the lady was selling her story with the gun to the highest bidder.

This is the first mention of him doing anything bad ever.

This story means nothing either way...sorry I was not wise enough to see it your way.

Thank you for enlightning me.

Please let me return the favor.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occam's_Razor

Be nice ACE. HArdy will be catching bullets from JP for years to come. :D

[acehole]

Be nice ACE. HArdy will be catching bullets from JP for years to come. :D


Yea. Did you ever see Monty python the series?

"I would like an argument......"

My main piont is really the effort to brush this aside so quick.

As much as I like the pick...he is not worth dragging this team down.

Things are never as bad as they seem....but they are never as good either.....

On your post...

We should start betting zonebucks on the Trent JP thing.

[Goobylal]

You gotta love the spin here, if this was Ted Ginn Jr being accused we would all be railing on him and have no doubt that he did it saying "things like what reason would the witness have to lie?" yet because he's James Hardy of the Buffalo Bills we'll take the word of his father an Ex-Con as to whether or not Hardy pulled a gun...yea that makes a lot of sense...


And another thing pulling a gun to show you wont be bullied is a cop out excuse for pulling a gun. I know LTBF wasn't trying to excuse the action but if that ever turned out to be the reason he pulled it on him, he loses just as much if not more respect in my eyes. Pulling a gun on somebody, when your life isnt in danger, doesnt make you any more of a man. It makes you less of one.
If Ted Ginn Jr. had a deadbeat absentee father who just came back into his life after 2 decades away and who had a FAR more violent history than his son, and Ginn Jr. pulled a gun on him, I'd take Ted Ginn Jr.'s side. It's not like he pulled a gun on a priest (although...). And Hardy's father is one in name only. Outside of being a sperm donor, he's little more than any other ex-con. And unfortunately for him, he's probably lost any chance at getting anything from his son.

And how far does anyone think this would have gone had his dad been dumb and pressed charges against him? Not very. Most likely the cops suggested to the dad and "witless" to shut it and let it go. Goodness knows there are better things for the legal system than to be protecting violent criminals.

[justasportsfan]

My main piont is really the effort to brush this aside so quick

As much as I like the pick...he is not worth dragging this team down.

Things are never as bad as they seem....but they are never as good either....... I agree but one shouldn't come to a conclusion either regardless which side you're on. No one here has the facts. No one knows who was at fault. Both parties shouldbe given the benefit of a doubt. While the son has had issues, the dad was an ex con.




On your post...

We should start betting zonebucks on the Trent JP thing. MY money is on JP starting at some point if he isn't traded.

[feelthepain]

I suggest the following edition...

Convicted felon dad pays a visit to his son.

Dad leaves.

Son finds his piece missing.

Son goes to his dad's place... pissed that he took his gun.

He yells at his dad.

Dad hands him the glock.

Son puts the gun in his pocket

Son leaves.

The end.
Son and Dad get drunk,

Son and Dad talk "Life" Son then cops an attitude cause Dad was never there and when he was he was an ***hole to him, Dad doesn't like where the conversation is going.

Dad and son get nose to nose screaming, Son steps back and pulls gun from waistband and points it at Dad and tells him to shut the hell up before I end your life old man.

Neighbor walks up to see what the screamings all about and Son puts gun away......Tru Dat!!!

[mayotm]

I see I am dumb because I did not buy the lawer writen statement.

I am dumb because the lady was selling her story with the gun to the highest bidder.

This is the first mention of him doing anything bad ever.

This story means nothing either way...sorry I was not wise enough to see it your way.

Thank you for enlightning me.

Please let me return the favor.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occam's_RazorThat's mighty big of you. At least you admit that you're dumb. That's half the battle.

[justasportsfan]

Son and Dad get drunk,

Son and Dad talk "Life" Son then cops an attitude cause Dad 's was never there and when he was he was an ***hole to him.

Dad and son get nose to nose screaming, Son steps back and pulls gun from waistband and points it at Dad and tells him to shut the hell up before I end your life old man.

Neighbor walks up to see what the screamings all about and Son puts gun away......Tru Dat!!!
Don't tell us this is your life story. Your mom doesn't even know which bum was your dad after she was passed out and raped on the street from doing too many drugs.

[feelthepain]

Don't tell us this is your life story. Your mom doesn't even know which bum was your dad after she was passed out and raped on the street from doing too many drugs.

Ahhh princess, everyone knows you have two Dads and everything in your house is pink and fluffy, what would you know about abything but a cat fight anyways???

[Yasgur's Farm]

LMFAO... You 2 fight like an old divorced couple.

HEY... Wait a minute! It's all making sense now!!!

Sorry justa... I had to thank him. It was too good not to.

[ParanoidAndroid]

I think we need to hear more before he's off the hook. Something isn't right whether charges were filed or not. He needs to explain himself. Right now, it seems everyone is eager to sweep it under the rug. If there is nothing to sweep under the rug, then he should let us know. All he has said is that it has been blown out of porportion. He never denied taking out the weapon. Why?

[Goobylal]

I think we need to hear more before he's off the hook. Something isn't right whether charges were filed or not. He needs to explain himself. Right now, it seems everyone is eager to sweep it under the rug. If there is nothing to sweep under the rug, then he should let us know. All he has said is that it has been blown out of porportion. He never denied taking out the weapon. Why?
What more are you looking for? What more do you think there is to the story?

And he never admitted he pulled out a gun either. His "the whole thing was overblown" was basically a denial that anything really happened.

[LifetimeBillsFan]

Lest anyone misunderstand: I wasn't excusing his behavior, just pointing out that there may have been extenuating circumstances that we do not know about.

Either way, though, it was a very stupid thing to do. Very stupid.

And, no, it is not a good sign.

IMHO, Hardy is going to have to straighten up and smarten up quickly if he wants to have much of a NFL career.

From the Bills' perspective, they are going to have to protect themselves in the wording of Hardy's contract just in case he hasn't learned from all of this and, as has been suggested, it would probably be wise to see if they can get one of his teammates to keep an eye on him and give him some guidance on how to stay out of trouble down the road.

But, no, I don't excuse the behavior. But, at the same time, when the father is an ex-con who isn't necessarily a nice guy, I also don't think that the fact that it was his father makes the behavior any worse (which it might if the father had a different personal history).

[Ultra Chimp 1]

I think people who butt their heads into another man's father son relationship is a scumbag.

[feelthepain]

Lest anyone misunderstand: I wasn't excusing his behavior, just pointing out that there may have been extenuating circumstances that we do not know about.


Do you really want to be forced to think this way about a guy Bill fans have already convinced themselves is the next Andre Reed before the guy even takes a snap?

[LifetimeBillsFan]

Do you really want to be forced to think this way about a guy Bill fans have already convinced themselves is the next Andre Reed before the guy even takes a snap?

Nobody's holding a gun to my head or forcing me to do anything. I just call 'em as I see 'em.

The guy has a world of potential and could be a real factor for the Bills for years. But, he has to adjust his thinking and how he approaches things in his life if he is going to have a chance to fulfill that potential.

That applies to a lot of the young men who come into the NFL, but particularly to a kid who is coming from the kind of background that he Hardy is coming from. Being in the NFL is like being in a totally different world and he is going to have to realize that and adjust to it quickly so that he can focus on doing what he needs to do as a player in order to become the kind of player that he has the potential to become.

That's just the way it is. The road to stardom in the NFL has been littered with the wasted careers of a lot of guys with tremendous potential who didn't get it and there are guys in the Hall of Fame who came from as bad or worse circumstances who did. It's going to be up to Hardy to decide where his career will end up and he has to start dealing with that ASAP.

And, it doesn't matter if we are talking about a Bill, a Dolphin, or a young man who has just been drafted by any one of the other teams in the NFL--I'd say the same thing.

(PS: If you've ever noticed, I don't talk "smack" about other teams or put down their players--because I was taught that people in glass houses shouldn't throw stones. And, I will be critical of a Bills player if I think he warrants the criticism. No force or even hesitation involved.)

[feelthepain]

Nobody's holding a gun to my head or forcing me to do anything. I just call 'em as I see 'em.

The guy has a world of potential and could be a real factor for the Bills for years. But, he has to adjust his thinking and how he approaches things in his life if he is going to have a chance to fulfill that potential.


Come now, there's a reason why there wasn't a WR taken in the 1st round for the first time since the inception of the draft. This years group of WR was hardly a deep group. Infact there wasn't even a franchise WR to be had. I think as usual Bill fans are putting the cart before the horse. Is there ever a time when a Bill fan doesn't think a player they sign isn't going to be a superstar?? Seriously?? Just let the guy play football and actually be a star before you anoint him.

[Romes]

Come now, there's a reason why there wasn't a WR taken in the 1st round for the first time since the inception of the draft. This years group of WR was hardly a deep group. Infact there wasn't even a franchise WR to be had. I think as usual Bill fans are putting the cart before the horse. Is there ever a time when a Bill fan doesn't think a player they sign isn't going to be a superstar?? Seriously?? Just let the guy play football and actually be a star before you anoint him.

I think you need to re-read the section you quoted.

What parts of the words "potential", "could" and "chance" indicate that LBF is anointing Hardy as a superstar?

[DraftBoy]

If Ted Ginn Jr. had a deadbeat absentee father who just came back into his life after 2 decades away and who had a FAR more violent history than his son, and Ginn Jr. pulled a gun on him, I'd take Ted Ginn Jr.'s side. It's not like he pulled a gun on a priest (although...). And Hardy's father is one in name only. Outside of being a sperm donor, he's little more than any other ex-con. And unfortunately for him, he's probably lost any chance at getting anything from his son.

And how far does anyone think this would have gone had his dad been dumb and pressed charges against him? Not very. Most likely the cops suggested to the dad and "witless" to shut it and let it go. Goodness knows there are better things for the legal system than to be protecting violent criminals.


Ahh its the father's fault simply because he's an ex-con I get it now. Can't blame Hardy because he's a Bill but since his father is an Ex-Con then we automatically blame him. Ive seen many people say he's not a nice guy or a bad man. Yes he is an ex-con but I dont see how that automatically makes him a bad guy. Some criminals do actually reform. So before we go blaming everybody but Hardy for what happened lets wait for all the facts to come out, if they ever do.

[feelthepain]

I think you need to re-read the section you quoted.

What parts of the words "potential", "could" and "chance" indicate that LBF is anointing Hardy as a superstar?

When you emphasize the word "potential" it's more then just "potential", every draft pick has potential, only Bill players ALWAYS seem to have "WORLDS of potential". Big difference in potential and "WORLDS of potential", obviously. Maybe you should re-read the post and this time take off the bias glasses.

[Romes]

When you emphasize the word "potential" it's more then just "potential", every draft pick has potential, only Bill players ALWAYS seem to have "WORLDS of potential". Big difference in potential and "WORLDS of potential", obviously. Maybe you should re-read the post and this time take off the bias glasses.

my response wasn't talking about the difference between potential and worlds of potential but between being the anointed one and just having potential. Even saying someone has worlds of potential is a lot less than anointing someone.

[feelthepain]

my response wasn't talking about the difference between potential and worlds of potential but between being the anointed one and just having potential. Even saying someone has worlds of potential is a lot less than anointing someone.
Then why not just say "potential" if there's no difference? Obviously it wasn't intended as just "potential" or that's how it would have been written. You act as if Bill fans haven't been talking up Hardy like he was the best WR taken in the draft the last 10 years.

[justasportsfan]

Then why not just say "potential" if there's no difference? Obviously it wasn't intended as just "potential" or that's how it would have been written. You act as if Bill fans haven't been talking up Hardy like he was the best WR taken in the draft the last 10 years.


look whos talking they guy who talked up Bennie Anderson, Mularkey, Feeley, Saban, Culpecker and now Beck. You also talked up your entire fins the last few years that got it's arse handed not only by the bills but the entire NFL . :roflmao: The dumbest part is that you still think the fins were better than the bills that last couple of years inspite of their record and no one on FH agreed with you :coocoo:

[Goobylal]

Ahh its the father's fault simply because he's an ex-con I get it now. Can't blame Hardy because he's a Bill but since his father is an Ex-Con then we automatically blame him. Ive seen many people say he's not a nice guy or a bad man. Yes he is an ex-con but I dont see how that automatically makes him a bad guy. Some criminals do actually reform. So before we go blaming everybody but Hardy for what happened lets wait for all the facts to come out, if they ever do.
Okay, let's follow this logic. Hardy's father is a violent criminal who possibly reformed. Hardy himself had an incident where he pushed his girlfriend. but like his father, it's reasonable to assume he has reformed. So who would you guess in this situation, without knowing all of the facts, is more to blame? The 21-year old kid who made a mistake or the guy who served 9 years of hard time for drug-dealing, armed robbery, and forgery, in separate incidents?

I don't know, do you see Hardy as the type to whip out a gun for no apparent reason? Think about WHY he had the gun at the party in the first place (a gun which he didn't use, even though as a thug hothead like some claim, he very well could have).

From my vantage point, you never wanted the Bills to draft Hardy and are taking the father's side to justify your pre-draft position. That's understandable, but if you're going to use an excuse for one ("dad might have reformed"), you must use it for the other, while comparing histories.

Or don't. It doesn't matter one way or another since we can't control what Hardy will do with himself. Obviously this isn't a good thing no matter WHO was at fault, and hopefully Hardy will see the error of his way while pops will get the hint.

[feelthepain]

look whos talking they guy who talked up Bennie Anderson, Mularkey, Feeley, Saban, Culpecker and now Beck. You also talked up your entire fins the last few years that got it's arse handed not only by the bills but the entire NFL . :roflmao: The dumbest part is that you still think the fins were better than the bills that last couple of years inspite of their record and no one on FH agreed with you :coocoo:

Princess, you really need to stay away from this sport, it's not your strenght. Don't you have some curtains to mend??

[ParanoidAndroid]

What more are you looking for? What more do you think there is to the story?

And he never admitted he pulled out a gun either. His "the whole thing was overblown" was basically a denial that anything really happened.

If it is overblown to the point of being false from begining to end, let him explain what really happened. Right now, his statement is definitely up for interpretation.

[LifetimeBillsFan]

Come now, there's a reason why there wasn't a WR taken in the 1st round for the first time since the inception of the draft. This years group of WR was hardly a deep group. Infact there wasn't even a franchise WR to be had. I think as usual Bill fans are putting the cart before the horse. Is there ever a time when a Bill fan doesn't think a player they sign isn't going to be a superstar?? Seriously?? Just let the guy play football and actually be a star before you anoint him.

Obviously you have not paid much attention to my posts over the years.


When you emphasize the word "potential" it's more then just "potential", every draft pick has potential, only Bill players ALWAYS seem to have "WORLDS of potential". Big difference in potential and "WORLDS of potential", obviously. Maybe you should re-read the post and this time take off the bias glasses.


Then why not just say "potential" if there's no difference? Obviously it wasn't intended as just "potential" or that's how it would have been written. You act as if Bill fans haven't been talking up Hardy like he was the best WR taken in the draft the last 10 years.

6'6', with 4.5 speed and good hands equals "worlds of potential" in my book.

But, if you paid more attention to actually reading my posts instead of trying to spam this messageboard by attacking every Bills fan that you can, you would have noticed that I have previously posted that I do not believe that Hardy will be ready to take over a spot in the starting lineup until at least mid-season--and considering the competition that he will have for that spot, that is hardly building him up as an instant savior.

Indeed, if you were to go back further, you would note that I stated that I thought that, for all of his size, speed and potential, Hardy is still raw and will take time to get his footwork down in order to become a star. Moreover, I stated that I thought that M.Kelly and L.Sweed were more polished than Hardy and have similar star potential.

I believed before the draft that Thomas, Hardy, Kelly and Sweed all have a "world of talent" and the ability to develop into a star WR in the NFL and I still do. And that inspite of the injury issues that Kelly and Sweed have and will have to overcome.

Moreover, if you had been paying attention, I have been touting Glenn Dorsey as having the abilility to be a MONSTER in the NFL--a potential HOFer if he stays healthy and develops properly--for two years now. The fact that he is not now a Bill has not changed that. I'm just glad that the Bills won't have to face him twice a year.

While, as my previous assessments will bear out, I have never seen him being in the same class as Joe Thomas (who I also touted for two years as a potential great), I think your boy, Jake Long, has a "world of potential", too. But, like Hardy, I think he is going to work on his technique to realize that potential and it may take some time for him to do that. That's not my opinion because he plays for Miami now, but has been my opinion since watching him play against Ohio State two years ago and having that opinion confirmed by watching him play last season.

There are a lot of players that I see who come into the NFL with a "world of potential" every year (another one is Joe Flacco). And, I'm not afraid to say that or acknowledge that another team may have gotten itself a good player. Of course, if you paid attention a little bit to what a person has posted, what that person's record as a poster is, before you before you blindly lump us Bills fans all together and indiscriminately attack him along with everyone else, you would know that.

But, because you do not do that, that is why your posts lack the validity or merit that they could have if you would just stick to offer a more objective analysis or viewpoint.


Princess, you really need to stay away from this sport, it's not your strenght. Don't you have some curtains to mend??

This is why it is useless to even respond to your posts--which I, for one, will not do again in the future--let alone try to engage in a sensible discussion of football with you.

It's not a case of anyone going "Boo Hoo!" about anything you have said, it is simply that you can't engage in an exchange of ideas without being disrespectful and that the manner in which you do that obviously indicates the existence of issues that are better dealt with in therapy than in any discussion that could possibly take place on a messageboard devoted to professional football.

And, as a result, it is sad for me to say, from here on out, unless you change your approach, you can say whatever you want about that, me, the Bills or whatever because, coming from you, it will simply be a case of "mind over matter" and I won't mind....

[hydro]

LTBF is the man!! :clap:

[Goobylal]

Don't look now FTP, but Will Allen is next up to be crucified. Good thing he sucks, making your condemnation of him easier:


Dolphins | W. Allen being investigated by police
Sat, 17 May 2008 11:42:20 -0700

Craig Barnes, of the South Florida Sun-Sentinel, reports Miami Dolphins CB Will D. Allen is part of an investigation by Davie (Fla.) Police involving a dispute over money. No charged have been filed and no arrests made, according to Lt. William Coyne. A report on WPLG-Channel 10 alleged Allen borrowed money to pay gambling debts. When repayment was demanded, the person claimed Allen pulled a gun. Police would not confirm the report.

[feelthepain]

Obviously you have not paid much attention to my posts over the years.

Obviously I have! Bill fans constantly claim they're a better tema then they are. If you look at both the Dolphins and Bills over the last two years and look at every stat....not just wins!!!! Most unbias people would say the two teams are about the same at this point, but Bill fans are anything but unbias. There is zero reason to believe the Bills will have a better season the the Dolphins, ZERO! I could care less how many wins the Bills had last year, it wasn't an improvement over the previous year. Infact much of what the Bills did last year was not an improvement over the previous year. Last year at this time Bill fans were preaching improvements for the up coming season. There were none, I don't want to hear about injuries either, many teams had injuries, why is that an excuse for the Bills and no one else? It's not.


6'6', with 4.5 speed and good hands equals "worlds of potential" in my book.

But, if you paid more attention to actually reading my posts instead of trying to spam this messageboard by attacking every Bills fan that you can, you would have noticed that I have previously posted that I do not believe that Hardy will be ready to take over a spot in the starting lineup until at least mid-season--and considering the competition that he will have for that spot, that is hardly building him up as an instant savior.

Indeed, if you were to go back further, you would note that I stated that I thought that, for all of his size, speed and potential, Hardy is still raw and will take time to get his footwork down in order to become a star. Moreover, I stated that I thought that M.Kelly and L.Sweed were more polished than Hardy and have similar star potential.

I believed before the draft that Thomas, Hardy, Kelly and Sweed all have a "world of talent" and the ability to develop into a star WR in the NFL and I still do. And that inspite of the injury issues that Kelly and Sweed have and will have to overcome.

Moreover, if you had been paying attention, I have been touting Glenn Dorsey as having the abilility to be a MONSTER in the NFL--a potential HOFer if he stays healthy and develops properly--for two years now. The fact that he is not now a Bill has not changed that. I'm just glad that the Bills won't have to face him twice a year.

While, as my previous assessments will bear out, I have never seen him being in the same class as Joe Thomas (who I also touted for two years as a potential great), I think your boy, Jake Long, has a "world of potential", too. But, like Hardy, I think he is going to work on his technique to realize that potential and it may take some time for him to do that. That's not my opinion because he plays for Miami now, but has been my opinion since watching him play against Ohio State two years ago and having that opinion confirmed by watching him play last season.

There are a lot of players that I see who come into the NFL with a "world of potential" every year (another one is Joe Flacco). And, I'm not afraid to say that or acknowledge that another team may have gotten itself a good player. Of course, if you paid attention a little bit to what a person has posted, what that person's record as a poster is, before you before you blindly lump us Bills fans all together and indiscriminately attack him along with everyone else, you would know that.

But, because you do not do that, that is why your posts lack the validity or merit that they could have if you would just stick to offer a more objective analysis or viewpoint.
What about Jake Long or Chad Henne? I don't see their names in yet another selective post. I think saying Hardy has "worlds of talent" is just another way for a Bill fan to put the cart before the horse. It's potential at this point and nothing more. You have no idea what type of pro Hardy will be. He sure wasn't a model citizen at IU and he's been a Bill what 3 weeks and already had an altercation?? The more you emphasise the word potential, the less risk you should take from the porspect.

You also take a position that was so weak in the 08 draft that for the first time ever a WR wasn't selected in the first round. Obviously this class of wide outs was hardly blowing people away, or at least one of them would have snuck into the first round. Weren't the Bills the first team to select a WO? About midway through the second?

Is this to say that Hardy won't be very successful? No of course not. However, Bill fans ALWAYS think their players are superstars before they prove otherwise. Let the guy's prove they are superstars before you give them the title. Just because you're tall and fast doesn't mean success. Look at Santana Moss or Steve Smith size and speed is not how you grade a WR at this level. The only way you can know what a player will be is when they either succeed or fail. There is no full proof formula.

Miami drafted Jake Long #1 overall, one of probably the two most important positions on any team. He was the very best Olineman in this draft, he had a fantastic college career, he was a model citizen. Had fantastic grades, played at one of the most competitive schools in the contry. On a team that's produced their share of terrific pro football players. Yet even with all that on his side, at this point he has no more potential then anyone else cause he's yet to play a down in the NFL and what he did in college doesn't mean he'll do the same as a pro. It why you don't see me here talking about how great he will be, cause there's simply no way to know that.

Do you think everyone thought Jerry Rice or TO or Doug Williams out of little tiny college's had "Worlds of Talent"? Or how about 6th round pick Tom Brady out of big ol' Michigan, do you think all the teams that didn't draft him thought he had "Worlds of talent"? Obviously not, or they all would have been drafted much higher. The point is if you want to, you can lable every player drafted as having"Worlds of talent", to me it's nothing more then yet another Bill fan looking at what they signed and grading them as high as possible so they give themselves a false sense of their team, which in turn leads to this over estimation of the season ahead. EVERY STINKIN YEAR!!!!!!!!

As if that's the end of the BS it's not, Bill fans then look at their young QB who had a losing record and had more int's then TD's and somehow see a player who's undeniably their starter. The year before JP had better stats and he was the undeniable starter to start 07, how'd that turn out again?? It's the same with every player in a Bills uniform. They're great...no matter what! Fans of other teams players suck...no potential, not allowed to have a weak season and come back and have a good one, nope, one and done. But when they're a Bill it's 10 years of chances and it's always the next year when the "greatness" will be unleashed!! Obviously I do read your bias stuff.


This is why it is useless to even respond to your posts--which I, for one, will not do again in the future--let alone try to engage in a sensible discussion of football with you.

You're so right, my response to Justacrybaby was so unprovocked!!!!!

[justasportsfan]

Princess, you really need to stay away from this sport, it's not your strenght. Don't you have some curtains to mend??
:rofl: This coming from you who admitted the fins were a better team than the bills the last couple of years. I take back calling you a ******. A tard is smater than you will ever be.

You're insecurities are evident based on you're constant attempt to downplay every move the bills made here on bz. You'll always be my B!tch. It's lie that every offseason. YOu TALK like the fins are always better and when we wipe your arse all over the field when season starts, you disappear :snicker: You run away from bets. You're :limp:

No one in fh agreed with you. Get a clue.