Brad Butler Signs Extension

[ZacGriffi~82]

CONTRACT EXTENSION: The Buffalo Bills today announced offensive lineman Brad Butler has signed a contract extension. In accordance with team policy, terms of the deal were not disclosed.

http://buffalobills.com/blog/index.jsp?blogger_id=1

[mysticsoto]

CONTRACT EXTENSION: The Buffalo Bills today announced offensive lineman Brad Butler has signed a contract extension. In accordance with team policy, terms of the deal were not disclosed.

http://buffalobills.com/blog/index.jsp?blogger_id=1

Very interesting...sorry to those around here who think he sucks at RG - clearly the FO doesn't think so.

But this was probably done for cheapness. Butler probably wanted assurances of being on a team and likely took less money for that security. Probably a good idea for him and perhaps for the team also.

[OpIv37]

clearly the FO doesn't think so.


The FO doesn't think Robert Royal sucks and they don't think Melvin Fowler sucks and for a year and a half they didn't think Tim Anderson sucked and for two years they didn't think Larry Tripplett sucks and they didn't think Peerless Price sucked when they brought him back and they didn't think Matt Bowen sucked when they signed him to a contract to never play a down......

See a pattern here? Just because the FO thinks something doesn't necessarily make it so.

I'm not saying Butler sucks- I honestly haven't watched him closely enough to have an opinion one way or the other. But I'm not going to assume a player is decent just because the FO signed him- they haven't earned that right.

[raphael120]

I remember the Coach Dickerson on WGR used to talk about how well butler played (out of all the people on the Oline besides Peters, he said he played mean and strong and would mention him almost everytime he was on the air), he came to play every game, and I personally think he has a lot of promise. He JUST finally saw a whole season of football last year and contributed to awesome pass protection and low sack total. If you ask me, he's a hell of a lot better than Melvin Fowler and deserves to play on this line. Fowler IS the weakest link on this line and I think Butler will get better and better as he plays.

[The Answer]

The FO doesn't think Robert Royal sucks and they don't think Melvin Fowler sucks and for a year and a half they didn't think Tim Anderson sucked and for two years they didn't think Larry Tripplett sucks and they didn't think Peerless Price sucked when they brought him back and they didn't think Matt Bowen sucked when they signed him to a contract to never play a down......

See a pattern here? Just because the FO thinks something doesn't necessarily make it so.

I'm not saying Butler sucks- I honestly haven't watched him closely enough to have an opinion one way or the other. But I'm not going to assume a player is decent just because the FO signed him- they haven't earned that right.

You definiltey make a good point.

~The Answer

[raphael120]

Now, since we're resigning oline people...let's do the same with Peters, eh?

[Tatonka]

good signing. butler played well last year and will get better.

i hope they gave him more than jason peters, just to chap his greedy ass.

[Jan Reimers]

Butler is going to very good very quickly. This is a good move by the Billls.

[Tatonka]

Now, since we're resigning oline people...let's do the same with Peters, eh?
there is no need to resign peters.. he just signed his current deal.. he is not holding out for 3 years.. that is career suicide.

let him play another year or two and prove last year was the real deal.

[justasportsfan]

The FO doesn't think Robert Royal sucks and they don't think Melvin Fowler sucks and for a year and a half they didn't think Tim Anderson sucked and for two years they didn't think Larry Tripplett sucks and they didn't think Peerless Price sucked when they brought him back and they didn't think Matt Bowen sucked when they signed him to a contract to never play a down......

See a pattern here? Just because the FO thinks something doesn't necessarily make it so..


It's not that they didn't think those guys sucked. They inherited those players and instead of just letting them go, they wanted to see what they can do under new FO . Most teams that are rebuilding go through such things. Teams make moves like Tripplett too and cut them if they don't pan out. They don't cut all the players they inherit . They do eventually get rid of players that don't pan out or are able to grasp their system. teams that are rebuilding go through hit and misses all the time.



I'm not saying Butler sucks- I honestly haven't watched him closely enough to have an opinion one way or the other. But I'm not going to assume a player is decent just because the FO signed him- they haven't earned that right.

YOu should at least give them the benefit of the doubt (seems like you do) since they were right about guys like Spikes and Walker.

[mysticsoto]

The FO doesn't think Robert Royal sucks and they don't think Melvin Fowler sucks and for a year and a half they didn't think Tim Anderson sucked and for two years they didn't think Larry Tripplett sucks and they didn't think Peerless Price sucked when they brought him back and they didn't think Matt Bowen sucked when they signed him to a contract to never play a down......

See a pattern here? Just because the FO thinks something doesn't necessarily make it so.

I'm not saying Butler sucks- I honestly haven't watched him closely enough to have an opinion one way or the other. But I'm not going to assume a player is decent just because the FO signed him- they haven't earned that right.

I think alot of those decisions above were more due to the fact that nobody better was available for some of those positions and us having so many holes that anything was an improvement at the time. For example Tripplett wasn't great, but despite that, he was still better than Tim Anderson!

On the other hand you could say that the FO didn't think McCargo sucked. The FO didn't think Marshawn Lynch sucked. They didn't think Fred Jackson sucked. The FO didn't think Poz sucked. They also didn't think DiGiorgio sucked. Etc, etc. I could go on for every bright gem with potential on the team. It works both ways.

No FO on any team is perfect!

[DraftBoy]

Smart move with his versatility he is a guy you keep around.

[justasportsfan]

Very interesting...sorry to those around here who think he sucks at RG - clearly the FO doesn't think so.

But this was probably done for cheapness. Butler probably wanted assurances of being on a team and likely took less money for that security. Probably a good idea for him and perhaps for the team also.


I think Butler has one hell of a potential and they signed him while he isn't proven yet. Just like when they signed Peters as a RT knowing they would move him to LT and be good at it.

If Buttler lives up to his potential I expect another contract renegotiation ala Peters.

[mysticsoto]

I think Butler has one hell of a potential and they signed him while he isn't proven yet. Just like when they signed Peters as a RT knowing they would move him to LT and be good at it.

If Buttler lives up to his potential I expect another contract renegotiation ala Peters.

Well, I doubt that. Butler at best would need to move to RT to try and ask for more money. At RG, that's the lowest paid position on the Oline (atleast it should be) and if he starts asking for alot, he could be replaced relatively easily). On the other hand, if as he gets older (he's a young guy) he takes over for Dockery at some point on the left side, or...takes over Walker's position at RT after he retires, then he might be worth more by then - but as of now, he does not have and won't have any bargaining power for some time to come! And by then, we could have recruited another star through the draft...

[justasportsfan]

Well, I doubt that. Butler at best would need to move to RT to try and ask for more money. At RG, that's the lowest paid position on the Oline (atleast it should be) and if he starts asking for alot, he could be replaced relatively easily). On the other hand, if as he gets older (he's a young guy) he takes over for Dockery at some point on the left side, or...takes over Walker's position at RT after he retires, then he might be worth more by then - but as of now, he does not have and won't have any bargaining power for some time to come! And by then, we could have recruited another star through the draft...
I have a feeling he wasn't extended as a proven RG or was locked up cheaply. If he becomes a probowler at RG or becomes solid like Peters , they made a steal. Just like Peters' current salary.

[casdhf]

I bet Butler can play LT :mad:

[bigbub2352]

Very good signing, this kid will be a hell of a player for us for years to come, I loved his game last year and at 6ft 7 315lbs, he is a monster to play next to Langston for the forseeable future, he has the athletic ability and size to be outstanding

Now move on to Peters and Evans and Crowell

GM is finally keeping a team together signing them young
Great Move!!

[justasportsfan]

Very good signing, this kid will be a hell of a player for us for years to come, I loved his game last year and at 6ft 7 315lbs, he is a monster to play next to Langston for the forseeable future, he has the athletic ability and size to be outstanding

Now move on to Peters and Evans and Crowell

GM is finally keeping a team together signing them young
Great Move!!
I agree. I think our right and left side will be dominant. On next years shopping list, no.1 will be a top center in FA if Fowler continues to be the weakest link.

[raphael120]

peters would be commiting career suicide by sitting out all the games left on his 3 year deal, sure...but it would be season suicide if we had Chambers as our starting LT for half the year...Peters has the Bills by the balls, not the other way around...if we had a promising young LT behind Peters, sure, but we don't...chalk that up to not really caring about the depth of our oline.

[Tatonka]

peters has never made a ton of money.. and if he sits, he will not get paid, will get heavily fined.. 14k a day adds up real fast and that is just for training camp, and then he also will not get any time credited towards his 3 years..

there is zero.. i will say again.. ZERO chance that peters sits out.. we own him for 3 years.. if he didnt want the deal he got, he should not have JUST SIGNED IT LAST YEAR.

[mayotm]

Good signing. Now get Evans and Crowell extended before the season starts. Then they can focus on Peters.

[Philagape]

Well I hope it isn't what the Giants' Chris Snee just got: Six years, $43.5 million

[FlyingDutchman]

now lets hope he doesnt get too good so he doesnt hold out for a new contract a year after signing an extension.

[RingofFire]

peters has never made a ton of money.. and if he sits, he will not get paid, will get heavily fined.. 14k a day adds up real fast and that is just for training camp, and then he also will not get any time credited towards his 3 years..

there is zero.. i will say again.. ZERO chance that peters sits out.. we own him for 3 years.. if he didnt want the deal he got, he should not have JUST SIGNED IT LAST YEAR.

I don't think it is greedy at all. I feel if you outperform your contract you have an absolute right to demand it be redone. As long as you do it professionally. As in going on TV/media and bashing the team. Just hear me out. If a player underperforms his deal. He is asked to take a paycut/rework deal or outright cut! These are not guaranteed contracts like in baseball. These guys play a high risk sport and an injury can happen at any point. So who is greedy? Owners can cut them when they stink. It ain't guaranteed. I understand, live out deal u signed, but it works both ways. Peters should be paid by Bills.

[gr8slayer]

:bf1: was our second best OL last year.

[Oaf]

Butler is going to very good very quickly. This is a good move by the Billls.
If this is true, then he'll want a new huge contract in two years anyways. So, eh. :::

Good post earlier Op.

[OpIv37]

It's not that they didn't think those guys sucked. They inherited those players and instead of just letting them go, they wanted to see what they can do under new FO . Most teams that are rebuilding go through such things. Teams make moves like Tripplett too and cut them if they don't pan out. They don't cut all the players they inherit . They do eventually get rid of players that don't pan out or are able to grasp their system. teams that are rebuilding go through hit and misses all the time.



YOu should at least give them the benefit of the doubt (seems like you do) since they were right about guys like Spikes and Walker.

Wrong. This FO signed Tripplett, Price, Fowler and Bowen. And tendered Anderson. They didn't inherit those guys.

[Night Train]

I hope he hit the bench this off-season because he did struggle in getting a push in the running game.

I'll back him, since he wears the right laundry.

[gr8slayer]

I hope he hit the bench this off-season because he did struggle in getting a push in the running game.

I'll back him, since he wears the right laundry.
Any particular game you have in mind? Run blocking is his strength....

[Mitchy moo]

Peters is by far our best player on the line, he should be paid as such in the next year or two. Not everyone is going to be paid the same or plays the same position and his side is the hardest to defend, so tell the man he plays well this season and the bank will come his way.

[Tatonka]

peters is not a priority. evans and crowell in that order are.

by that time, it will be next year and peters will have proved himself.

[acehole]

CONTRACT EXTENSION: The Buffalo Bills today announced offensive lineman Brad Butler has signed a contract extension. In accordance with team policy, terms of the deal were not disclosed.

http://buffalobills.com/blog/index.jsp?blogger_id=1


Good bye Jason Peters...good luck in Washington.

It means not gay things....

It means the Bills MO is to sign thier journeymen...Right before they let there good players go.
Are we going to argue this team makes every effort to sign thier own good players?
N CLEMENT was let go after we signed 2nd tier guys....P Williams also. Making a joke/piont that this team does NOT seem to do what it take to build a winner....and this signing is a precurser to touble.

[gr8slayer]

Good bye Jason Peters...good luck in Washington.
Where the hell did you get that from?

[hydro]

Where the hell did you get that from?

:rofl: Exactly what I am wondering...

[Marvelous]

I coulda sworn i posted in this thread 10 minutes ago.. I mentioned Jerry Ostroski? wierd!!!

-Cmon guys, lets derail Butlers new contract thread with Jason Peters & even Crowell & Evans...

---Butler looked exceptional last season, esp late...
-His pass protection looked good & his RUN BLOCKING LOOKED AWESOME too. He was owned in a couple games but that's a given when youth goes up against technique. Veterans will always out technique the biffed/strong youth,....
---Out future O-line looks super solid.
--M,an, we must be trying to build a winner. Lets build the next best thing in the AFC east... Brady & BB are almost finished with tehir dominance...

---I wanna see us draft a stud center soon. A jack of all trades type... You guys remember the way Mawae would pull on those toss plays? frakkin amazing..

[jamze132]

Good bye Jason Peters...good luck in Washington.
WTF? :limp:

[casdhf]

The outperforming your contract argument is weak. If the guy ends up being a bust, you think he'll renegotioate a pay cut in there? **** no!

[mysticsoto]

Looks like Chris Brown agrees that this was a good thing:


BUTLER EXTENSION GOOD FOR O-LINE: With Brad Butler signing an extension today four fifths of the O-line is locked up long term. Only Melvin Fowler is up after this year from the group up front. With Walker having four years left on his deal, Dockery six years and Peters three, though it will likely have to be addressed in some fashion, the line is built for the long term. That's the kind of continuity this offense will need moving forward.


Interesting that Fowler is the only one they haven't locked up long term. Are they finally looking to replace him? Will they go with a veteran FA? Draft next year? Move/promote someone within? Right now Preston is still listed as their backup and Gaddis 3rd string - though likely this hasn't been updated since last year. Are they seeing enough potential in Gaddis? McCaskill? Other? I doubt Preston is the heir apparent to the position...

I'll have to try and pay attention to who I see them giving extra time at Center in TC...

[justasportsfan]

Wrong. This FO signed Tripplett, Price, Fowler and Bowen. And tendered Anderson. They didn't inherit those guys.
I was speaking in general. I didn't state particular players as to who they inherited or not. Stating Tripplett as an example.

Point is, teams that are REBUILDING go through the phase of bringing people in and not getting it right 100% in their rebuilding season. PArcells didn't get it right when he brought in guys like Bledsoe. I don't expect Dick to get it right ,right away. Even Polian doesn't get it right 100%

Wanna bet, PArcells will cut some players he brought in this year, next year? Wanna bet he'll cut some of the players he inherited next year that he will keep this year?

[acehole]

Good bye Jason Peters...good luck in Washington.

It means not gay things....

It means the Bills MO is to sign thier journeymen...Right before they let there good players go.
Are we going to argue this team makes every effort to sign thier own good players?
N CLEMENT was let go after we signed 2nd tier guys....P Williams also. Making a joke/piont that this team does NOT seem to do what it take to build a winner....and this signing is a precurser to touble.

[OpIv37]

I was speaking in general. I didn't state particular players as to who they inherited or not. Stating Tripplett as an example.

Point is, teams that are REBUILDING go through the phase of bringing people in and not getting it right 100% in their rebuilding season. PArcells didn't get it right when he brought in guys like Bledsoe. I don't expect Dick to get it right ,right away. Even Polian doesn't get it right 100%

Wanna bet, PArcells will cut some players he brought in this year, next year? Wanna bet he'll cut some of the players he inherited next year that he will keep this year?

Fair enough.

But how do you know that Butler isn't another one of those "trial and error" rebuilding players you just mentioned?

mystic's point was that the FO expressed confidence in him- my point is that his point is irrelevant because the FO has expressed confidence in some pretty crappy players in the past. A player isn't automatically good just because the FO likes him or signs him.

[gr8slayer]

Fair enough.

But how do you know that Butler isn't another one of those "trial and error" rebuilding players you just mentioned?

mystic's point was that the FO expressed confidence in him- my point is that his point is irrelevant because the FO has expressed confidence in some pretty crappy players in the past. A player isn't automatically good just because the FO likes him or signs him.
On film Butler appears to be the real deal, sure he has some polishing to do but who on this team doesn't? We'll see how he does this year.

[RingofFire]

The outperforming your contract argument is weak. If the guy ends up being a bust, you think he'll renegotioate a pay cut in there? **** no!


If he was a bust. Say he signed a 6 year 60 Million contract. The team can cut him. In like 2nd year. It does hit the cap still i believe but the player would not receive that 60 Mill. He'd only get that first season and any signing bonus.

It works both pays. The team agreed to the deal, why not live it out and not cut him?

[gr8slayer]

If he was a bust. Say he signed a 6 year 60 Million contract. The team can cut him. In like 2nd year. It does hit the cap still i believe but the player would not receive that 60 Mill. He'd only get that first season and any signing bonus.

It works both pays. The team agreed to the deal, why not live it out and not cut him?Yup, for years it was the owners ****ing the players, now the tides have turned a bit.

[justasportsfan]

Fair enough.

But how do you know that Butler isn't another one of those "trial and error" rebuilding players you just mentioned? . I don't know if BUtler will pan out. Thats why I said he had potential and that he's unproven.


mystic's point was that the FO expressed confidence in him- my point is that his point is irrelevant because the FO has expressed confidence in some pretty crappy players in the past. A player isn't automatically good just because the FO likes him or signs him. I agree. I think it's because Mystic sees the potential in Butler like I do. He's slowly progressing like Peters did.

[gr8slayer]

I don't know if BUtler will pan out. Thats why I said he had potential and that he's unproven.
I agree. I think it's because Mystic sees the potential in Butler like I do. He's slowly progressing like Peters did.
I think he looked better this year than Peters did his first full year of starting.

[RingofFire]

The bills have the ****ing money. Pay Evans. Pay Peters. The fact fans value Angelo Crowell so much is a joke. Peters is much more important. Imagine this o line minus Peters.

I remember it in that giants game last year. We were winning that game. Moment Peters went down, we got murdered.

[mysticsoto]

Fair enough.

But how do you know that Butler isn't another one of those "trial and error" rebuilding players you just mentioned?

mystic's point was that the FO expressed confidence in him- my point is that his point is irrelevant because the FO has expressed confidence in some pretty crappy players in the past. A player isn't automatically good just because the FO likes him or signs him.

The FO has also been quick to get rid of players they didn't like also. Tripplett and Tim Anderson come right to mind - so does Pennington. So the FO has promptly dealt with those that they didn't feel were right for the team.

I believe in this case, the FO has done the right thing in signing to a longer term a player that has alot of potential and that has played reasonably well so far with hopefully an ability to get even better. They have also done well in preserving the unity and long termedness of this Oline such that they remain together for years to come. That is another positive in their favor and other than Center, we may have the same Oline (barring injuries) for the next 3 yrs or so...

[gr8slayer]

The bills have the ****ing money. Pay Evans. Pay Peters. The fact fans value Angelo Crowell so much is a joke. Peters is much more important. Imagine this o line minus Peters.

I remember it in that giants game last year. We were winning that game. Moment Peters went down, we got murdered.
The fact that we have the money to extend all three and we refuse to do it is even more of a joke.

[justasportsfan]

we refuse to do it is even more of a joke.

I haven't heard anywhere that we are refusing to.

[gr8slayer]

I haven't heard anywhere that we are refusing to.
Well have any of them been re-signed to date? No, so to this point we have refused to.

[justasportsfan]

Well have any of them been re-signed to date? No, so to this point we have refused to.

there is such a thing as negotiations and it doesn't happen overnight. Ask guys like Briggs, Urlacher, TO etc.etc.

[gr8slayer]

there is such a thing as negotiations and it doesn't happen overnight. Ask guys like Briggs, Urlacher, TO etc.etc.
Your point? We have yet to sign any of them and you and I don't know if we are even trying to do anything.

[justasportsfan]

Your point? We have yet to sign any of them and you and I don't know if we are even trying to do anything.
my point it's neither here nor there yet you are saying we are "refusing" . As a matter of fact it's been reported that we are talking to Lee's agent. That's not refusing that means negotiations are on the way. Wasn't Crowells agent in town too?

[gr8slayer]

my point it's neither here nor there yet you are saying we are "refusing" . As a matter of fact it's been reported that we are talking to Lee's agent. That's not refusing that means negotiations are on the way. Wasn't Crowells agent in town too?
I haven't heard of either.

[justasportsfan]

I haven't heard of either.
but you heard we refused

[gr8slayer]

but you heard we refused
Being that it's the Bills who are notorious for letting their own talent go and having heard nothing one can only assume. Do you have a link to back up your claim that we are trying?

[justasportsfan]

Being that it's the Bills who are notorious for letting their own talent go and having heard nothing one can only assume. Do you have a link to back up your claim that we are trying?Whats the title of this thread?

Didn't we just overpay Reed, Kelsay and Schobel ?

"We have been involved in negotiations with his agent, but per team policy, we don't discuss details," Bills spokesman Scott Berchtold said. "Our position regarding Lee has been consistent in that we want him to remain as a Buffalo Bill."

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/wire?section=nfl&id=3403878

http://buffalonews.typepad.com/billboard/2008/06/ota-day-10.html

[gr8slayer]

Lee Evans, who'll likely be limited until training camp while recovering from shoulder surgery, says the Bills have made him a contract offer. Evans is in a contract year. He provided no details and hinted talks haven't gotten to the serious stage. Evans is due $2.25 million in 2008 base pay.That's all I can find.

[justasportsfan]

did you use netscape?

[gr8slayer]

Whats the title of this thread?

Didn't we just overpay Reed, Kelsay and Schoebel ?


http://buffalonews.typepad.com/billboard/2008/06/ota-day-10.html

http://buffalonews.typepad.com/billboard/2008/06/ota-day-10.html
So we are keeping guys who could probably be replaced pretty easily (with the exception of Schobel.) None of them got anything even close to what Evans and Peters will demand (with the exception of Schobel.)

[justasportsfan]

So we are keeping guys who could probably be replaced pretty easily (with the exception of Schobel.) None of them got anything even close to what Evans and Peters will demand (with the exception of Schobel.)

the level of talent is not in question here. It's that you say we are notorious for gettting rid of our own players. I just showed you we did the opposite.

THe one who was notorious for doing that was Donahoe. He left a long time ago. So far the most significant players that we let go since Marv were Fletcher , Clements and Spikes. I don't miss any of them.

[gr8slayer]

the level of talent is not in question here. It's that you say we are notorious for gettting rid of our own players. I just showed you we did the opposite. THe one who was notorious for doing that was Donahoe. He left a long time ago.
So if we hold on to Josh Reed but don't hold on to Lee Evans it's all the same to you? Because the level of talent doesn't matter and we're 1 for 2 on holding on to guys.

Evans and Peters will probably demand more than anything this organization has ever seen. It will be a true test.

[justasportsfan]

So if we hold on to Josh Reed but don't hold on to Lee Evans it's all the same to you? Because the level of talent doesn't matter and we're 1 for 2 on holding on to guys..again , you're the one who said we let go of our own players. I just showed you otherwise.


Evans and Peters will probably demand more than anything this organization has ever seen. It will be a true test.maybe, maybe not. We also have to sign our rookies which could make negotiations with Peters and Lee longer.

[gr8slayer]

again , you're the one who said we let go of our own players. I just showed you otherwise.

maybe, maybe not. We also have to sign our rookies which could make negotiations with Peters and Lee longer.
So what happened with Clements, Winfield, Williams, etc..... Once players start asking for real money we can't handle it.

And don't give me the crap about Clements not being worth what he got, he's still twice as good as anything we have on the roster as of right now.

[justasportsfan]

So what happened with Clements, Winfield, Williams, etc..... Once players start asking for real money we can't handle it..Like I said, donahoe is long gone.

We just overpaid Kelsay and Schobel. We paid Dockery and Walker REAL serious money. Don't know what you're talking about.



And don't give me the crap about Clements not being worth what he got, he's still twice as good as anything we have on the roster as of right now.

as an individual talent yes. Does he make the unit so much better ? No.

NO way was he worth the contract the 9'ers paid him.

If you think of it, the guy in question (Peters ) just signed a contract last year no? What were you saying about the bills not keeping it's own?

[gr8slayer]

again , you're the one who said we let go of our own players. I just showed you otherwise.

maybe, maybe not. We also have to sign our rookies which could make negotiations with Peters and Lee longer.
Even after the rookies are signed we could still easily sign both of them.

[justasportsfan]

Even after the rookies are signed we could still easily sign both of them.

I agree but it takes time.

[gr8slayer]

Like I said, donahoe is long gone.

We paid Kelsay and Schobel what they were worth on the market.
So things have changed since Donahoe left..... Where? We're still a losing team, we still draft poorly, and we still aren't hanging on to our own guys. We are the farm league for the rest of the NFL

Since when are Dockery and Walker our guys? We've been one of the most active teams in FA the past two seasons, it's no secret. This is about us keeping our own elite talent, something we fail at doing often.


If you think of it, the guy in question (Peters ) just signed a contract last year no? What were you saying about the bills not keeping it's own?Peters signed his deal in '06 and the deal was hammered out by Donahoe before he left. Go back and look at our drafts over the last five years and count how many of those players are still on the team.

[justasportsfan]

So things have changed since Donahoe left..... Where? We're still a losing team, we still draft poorly, and we still aren't hanging on to our own guys. We are the farm league for the rest of the NFL.huh? What does our record have to do with refusing to sign our own players and not paying players real money?


Since when are Dockery and Walker our guys? We've been one of the most active teams in FA the past two seasons, it's no secret. This is about us keeping our own elite talent, something we fail at doing often. .
I never said Dockery and Walker were our won guys, but we sure paid them REAL money. Something you said we "can't handle"


Peters signed his deal in '06 and the deal was hammered out by Donahoe before he left. Go back and look at our drafts over the last five years and count how many of those players are still on the team.OK , so I stand corrected on the Peters part. Still doesn't mean we're refusing anything at this point tin time. Not especially Lee and Crowell.


NO, I will look back on our drafts since Marv came in. Marv and Brandon has nothing to do with the players Donahoe hired. The have a differrent approach.

Besides , who drafted the players we PAID real money for. Reed? Schobel? Kelsay? The irony.

So we actually do keep players and pay them REAL money regardless of whether TD hired them or not.

[gr8slayer]

huh? What does our record have to do with refusing to sign our own players and not paying players real money?


I never said Dockery and Walker were our won guys, but we sure paid them REAL money. Something you said we "can't handle"

OK , so I stand corrected on the Peters part. Still doesn't mean we're refusing anything at this point tin time. Not especially Lee and Crowell.


NO, I will look back on our drafts since Marv came in. Marv and Brandon has nothing to do with the players Donahoe hired. The have a differrent approach.

Besides , who drafted the players we PAID real money for. Reed? Schobel? Kelsay? The irony.

So we actually do keep players and pay them REAL money regardless of whether TD hired them or not.
You don't want to go back and check because you know I'm right. None of the guys drafted by Marv are up for new deals yet anyway. You've managed to come up with three players who we've kept; you know we draft at least 7 guys every off-season right?

I never said we have problems paying players, we've proved that we are active in FA the past two years. We have issues paying our own players.

[Captain gameboy]

Butler's OK.

He'll not likely be a pro bowl guy, but he's good enough to rely on so that you don't have to spend pro personnel or college scout's time trying to replace him.

He'll be reliable for another four years, then retire to run for political office, which is his passion.

One less variable in the equation. Good deal for a GM.

[gr8slayer]

BTW, TD was also the one who gave Crowell the extension he's currently on.

[justasportsfan]

You don't want to go back and check because you know I'm right. None of the guys drafted by Marv are up for new deals yet anyway. You've managed to come up with three players who we've kept; you know we draft at least 7 guys every off-season right?.I don't have to check. We got rin of Fletcher , Spikes and Clements who were TD hires. I acknowledged that already. It simply means if they didn't fit what Dick is trying to do, you're cut whether you were hired by TD or not.


I never said we have problems paying players, :rolleyes:


So what happened with Clements, Winfield, Williams, etc..... Once players start asking for real money we can't handle it...

Besides even if it were true , the players you mentioned were cut by Donahoe, not Marv/Brandon.


We have issues paying our own players.

Again, we just PAid Reed, Kelsay and Schobel REAL money. Not only were they our own players, they were TD hires.

[gr8slayer]

Again, we just PAid Reed, Kelsay and Schobel REAL money. Not only were they our own players, they were TD hires.
No, Schobel got real money, the other two got what they were worth on the market. Which is fine, the miscommunication is that you're talking about the current FO and I'm talking about the team history as a whole.


:rolleyes:
You should finish the quote instead of misquoting me.

[justasportsfan]

No, Schobel got real money, the other two got what they were worth on the market. Which is fine, the miscommunication is that you're talking about the current FO and I'm talking about the teams history as a whole..
lets see. The pats got rid of Bledoe. They got rid of Milloy. Sammuel. Nevermind, I know that teams do that all the time. The bills arent the only ones.

Whether we paid Kelsay what he was worth is a matter of opinion. But since you admitted we paid Aaron Real money means, you are wrong . We can handle it. :up:




You should finish the quote instead of misquoting me.

Sorry , my bad


So what happened with Clements, Winfield, Williams, etc..... Once players start asking for real money we can't handle it..

And don't give me the crap about Clements not being worth what he got, he's still twice as good as anything we have on the roster as of right now.

:rolleyes:

[justasportsfan]

BTW, TD was also the one who gave Crowell the extension he's currently on.
So what? Doesn't mean we refuse .

[gr8slayer]

So what? Doesn't mean we refuse .
Get back to me when we sign Peters, Evans, and Crowell to an extension. Until then, we haven't done crap and thus refuse to give them an extension; then they'll be distributed to teams like Dallas, Washington, and NE.

[justasportsfan]

Until then, we haven't done crap and thus refuse to give them an extension.

lol. I thought my english was bad.

[gr8slayer]

lol. I thought my english was bad.
?

[justasportsfan]

?
exactly.


:snicker:

[gr8slayer]

exactly.


:snicker:
Words too complex for you? I see nothing wrong with the English used in that post.

[justasportsfan]

Words too complex for you? I see nothing wrong with the English used in that post.
I've given you examples to prove to you that you are wrong on several of your accusations of the current management . You're trying to spin yourself out of it.

Inspite of reports implying that we are in contact with their agents to you means we REFUSE. Thats bad english. I guess the words refuse or negotiations are too complex for you, not me.


There have been no final answers from either camps and yet you've come to the conclusion that we refuse. YOu have rich friends too?

[gr8slayer]

I've given you examples to prove to you that you are wrong on several of your accusations of the current management . You're trying to spin yourself out of it.
Again, you want to talk about the current FO, I want to talk about the teams history as a whole. I've given you examples to back my claim, I've even offered to give you the names of all the players that are no longer on the team that we've drafted over the past five years.
Inspite of reports implying that we are in contact with their agents to you means we REFUSE. Thats bad english. There have been no final answers from either camps and yet you've come to the conclusion that we refuse. YOu have rich friends too?
So we are talking to Evans, but nothing serious. I'm still waiting for links for the other two. You choose to be optimistic based on the history that this FO doesn't have. I choose to be the opposite based on the teams history as a whole. By the way, that wouldn't be improper English. While we're on the topic "inspite" is two separate words; "in" & "spite." ----> "In spite"

[justasportsfan]

Again, you want to talk about the current FO, I want to talk about the teams history as a whole. I've given you countless examples to back my claim, I've even offered to give you the names of all the players that are no longer on the team that we've drafted over the past five years. Emmitt Smith played for the cards. The cowboys must not keep their players too. Teams do that all the time throught the history of the NFL . Not only the bills



So we are talking to Evans, but nothing serious. I'm still waiting for links for the other two. You choose to be optimistic based on the history that this FO doesn't have. I choose to be the opposite based on the teams history as a whole. By the way, that wouldn't be improper English.

whether it's serious or not, you and I don't know the details but it seems to me you already have come to the conclusion that we already refused . Your friend is not as rich as skoobs friend.

You didn't even know Crowells agent was in town or that there were talking with Lee and his agent yet you know that we refused?

Wil you be around to eat your crow when the time comes?

[gr8slayer]

Emmitt Smith played for the cards. The cowboys must not keep their players too. Teams do that all the time throught the history of the NFL . Not only the bills
Emmit Smith went through two contracts while with the Cowboys and was clearly at the end of his career when they let him go.


whether it's serious or not, you and I don't know the details but it seems to me you already have come to the conclusion that we already refused . Your friend is not as rich as skoobs friend.
To this point are any of them signed? No.... Based on our past history will Evans or Peters be re-signed? No.

Where are you getting this rich friend BS?
Wil you be around to eat your crow when the time comes?
Will I admit I was wrong if/when we sign Peters and Evans? Sure, will I say it makes up for all the people we've let go in the past? No.

[justasportsfan]

To this point are any of them signed? No.... Based on our past history will Evans or Peters be re-signed? No.


another example through bills ,history.

Moulds was our no.1 wr. We resigned him. More proof you're wrong. Again, Kelsay, reed, Schobel. Your'e wrong.

Just because we haven't extended them yet doesn't mean we gave them the final word and refused. if you can't understand that. Nothing I can do.


Wanna make a bet we will extend at least one of them?

[gr8slayer]

Only one? What suddenly happened to all your optimism about our FO?

[justasportsfan]

Only one? What suddenly happened to all your optimism about our FO?
okay 2. The bet ends when 2 of them leave or stay. Players: Crowell, Peters and Lee.

the bet 3 month Banning. :D

[gr8slayer]

okay 2. The bet stands until 2 of them leave or stay.
I'll take that... 5,000 ZB's.

[justasportsfan]

I'll take that... 5,000 ZB's.


I edited. Make that zb's instead :up:

[kernowboy]

Brad Butler was a very welcome surprise to the offensive line last season. After Peters he was the second best lineman.

Considering Dockery was on $7m a season average and Walker was on $5m average, their performances were ok but hardly scintilating. I'd expect far more dominance for a combined £12m. Walker also has a history of having a good season followed by an average one.

Within a couple of seasons I can quite easily Butler being moved outside to become the starting RT, haven't earnt his knocks on the interior.

[Michael82]

I love this move. They probably got him extended for a very cheap price. With a full season under his belt, I'm sure that Brad Butler will get even better this year. I look forward to seeing him pave the way for Marshawn Lynch and our RBs. He's a solid, young G and definitely not the weakest link on our OL. That title would belong to Melvin Fowler...

[RingofFire]

I love this move. They probably got him extended for a very cheap price. With a full season under his belt, I'm sure that Brad Butler will get even better this year. I look forward to seeing him pave the way for Marshawn Lynch and our RBs. He's a solid, young G and definitely not the weakest link on our OL. That title would belong to Melvin Fowler...

funny you like the move? cause i remember reading you blasting his drafting. you had posted his dirty hit from college. flip- flop. wowwwwww. shocking michael.

[gr8slayer]

funny you like the move? cause i remember reading you blasting his drafting. you had posted his dirty hit from college. flip- flop. wowwwwww. shocking michael.
I wasn't particularly thrilled with the pick but I didn't think it would hurt. BTW, we need more guys like him with a mean streak, nothing wrong with a cheap shot every now and then.

[RingofFire]

I wasn't particularly thrilled with the pick but I didn't think it would hurt. BTW, we need more guys like him with a mean streak, nothing wrong with a cheap shot every now and then.

Hell Ya. They cheer Harrison in NE for it

[Michael82]

funny you like the move? cause i remember reading you blasting his drafting. you had posted his dirty hit from college. flip- flop. wowwwwww. shocking michael.
ummm, stampy...get your facts straight and worry about your crappy ass Mets. :::

I didn't blast the move. I just talked about his cheapshot and how disgusting it was. That's it. I was one of the few who liked him last season and talked about him getting better once we finally get a new center. :::