If the Bills look horrible against the Steelers is it just another pre-season game?

[HHURRICANE]

The only excuse I am giving the Bills is that it was their first pre-season game against a team that already had one under their belt.

If the Bills offense sputters and we can't stop the run against the Steelers should we use this Board's logic and call it yet another "meaningless pre-season game"?

Wasn't Jauron the one who said that we didin't do enough in pre-season last year??

[justasportsfan]

well the bills didn't look horrible. There were good and bad things that happened. If you're a cynic then all you see is the bad.

[billsburgh]

there was way too much bad and not enough good.

[OpIv37]

well the bills didn't look horrible. There were good and bad things that happened. If you're a cynic then all you see is the bad.

other than youboty and losman, what were the good things?

[don137]

Pre-season is pre-season so while I would not be upset I would start to get a tad concerned if they do not produce at all in preseason. I agree I wish Jauron got them more in game mode but its a tough call. Be in more game mode and face more injuries or take it softer and take longer to get into game mode.
I do not think any Bills fan is happy about what is going on in camp but I think the difference is some are more concerned than others.
I personally am not going to get all worked up over preseason. Its very vanilla. Lets just less mental mistakes each game of preseason, see minimal injuries and see Peters get his tail in upstate New York. September 7th will be the true test.

[BAM]

other than youboty and losman, what were the good things?

I thought our special teams did really well other than the missed FG obviously. The return game was good I'd say.

[OpIv37]

I thought our special teams did really well other than the missed FG obviously. The return game was good I'd say.

Moorman botched a punt too- he had a 38 yarder. Fitzpatrick didn't look good but he's camp fodder (I hate to say that about an Irish guy who played at ND but it's the truth). The return game looked good- the kick coverage looked solid but not dominant.

Here's the problem: we've had great S/T for 5 years now. Where has it gotten us? Good S/T is important and it absolutely helps, but it's support for the O and the D. And on Saturday, both the O and D looked like garbage.

[justasportsfan]

other than youboty and losman, what were the good things?
MCkelvin and the st.

HArdy finally had his feet wet and a taste of a TD. Jenkins looked good. Fine got his feet wet.

[BAM]

No matter what the offense does with it, it's still a positive for the team in my book! Hey even though the O couldn't score after that fumble, it at least got us 3.

[justasportsfan]

Moorman botched a punt too- he had a 38 yarder. .
Moorman is proven. No need to worry about him at this point. Use your Colts logic when they look bad in preseason "but they're proven"

[OpIv37]

No matter what the offense does with it, it's still a positive for the team in my book! Hey even though the O couldn't score after that fumble, it at least got us 3.

I don't follow your logic here. The biggest problem with the O last year was red zone production. And granted they only had one trip to the red zone, but once again they left with 3 and not 7. If they can't leave with 7, the O is no better than last year's.

[hydro]

Progress, progress, progress...

That is all I am looking for.

[BAM]

I don't follow your logic here. The biggest problem with the O last year was red zone production. And granted they only had one trip to the red zone, but once again they left with 3 and not 7. If they can't leave with 7, the O is no better than last year's.

I don't follow your question here...

You asked what other positives there were and I said ST. ?

[BAM]

Progress, progress, progress...

That is all I am looking for.

Me 2. If the O and D look anything better than last week I'll be happy!

[feelthepain]

The only excuse I am giving the Bills is that it was their first pre-season game against a team that already had one under their belt.

If the Bills offense sputters and we can't stop the run against the Steelers should we use this Board's logic and call it yet another "meaningless pre-season game"?

Wasn't Jauron the one who said that we didin't do enough in pre-season last year??

It's tough, Clinton Portis followed by Willie Parker. I think those two guy's can have their way with any defense. I wouldn't stress over it. As for your offense, the Steelers have a good D, but If I were a Bills fan and the Bill starters have another weak showing, I'd be worried.

[Stewie]

yes, it will be just another preseason game. Why? Because it's the pre-season.

[HHURRICANE]

OP made the best point here. 5 years of great special teams and it's gotten us nothing.

We have the 31st ranked offense and defense. Sorry, but I expect to see something in the pre-season that tells me that we are going to look a little better.

I have seen nothing thus far.

So if we do the same thing against the Steelers it's still okay??

[BAM]

OP made the best point here. 5 years of great special teams and it's gotten us nothing.

We have the 31st ranked offense and defense. Sorry, but I expect to see something in the pre-season that tells me that we are going to look a little better.

I have seen nothing thus far.

So if we do the same thing against the Steelers it's still okay??
Isn't Week 3 when the starters normally play the first half? Or at least most of it?

[Ickybaluky]

Yes, it is a meaningless. Unless someone important gets hurt.

[OpIv37]

I don't follow your question here...

You asked what other positives there were and I said ST. ?

it's quite simple really.

When I think of "good" in terms of a preseason game, I think of signs to suggest that players or the team as a whole have improved.

While ST being good is nice, our ST was good last year. And the year before. And the year before that, etc. It's status quo- it's not improvement.

So, I repeat the question: Our O was able to get 3 last year. So, how does getting 3 instead of getting 7 mean the offense is better? 3 wasn't enough last year and it won't be enough this year.

[BAM]

Well.........

I never said the O was better. You asked for a positive and I gave you said positive. The fumble, produced by our ST, which in turn got the team 3 points, was a positive. At least last time I checked, recovering a fumble on a kickoff in good field position which in turn gets the team 3 points was a positive!

It's quite simple really!

[raphael120]

This is what the game will probably be in a nutshell, and is what it was last year:

We get good field position from our ST, or by a turnover that our defense causes.

We score a FG after our offense sputters out, or maybe on the freak occurence we actually score a TD.

When we don't get good field position from a turnover or special teams play, we'll have our share of long 3rd down situations because of a) penalities or b) runs for losses or c) a sack or d) throwing a short dink pass that doesnt even get back to the marker

This is the MO of the Bills under Dick Jauron. This is continuing to be the MO of the Bills this season.

[OpIv37]

Well.........

I never said the O was better. You asked for a positive and I gave you said positive. The fumble, produced by our ST, which in turn got the team 3 points, was a positive. At least last time I checked, recovering a fumble on a kickoff in good field position which in turn gets the team 3 points was a positive!

It's quite simple really!

getting 3 instead of 7 is a negative, not a positive. It's quite simple, really.

Did justa PM you and tell you to engage me in an argument?

[BAM]

I'm not arguing with you! I think you simply misread my post. Or you just only want to read a part of it for some reason. Read it again.

I didn't mean for the O in any way to be a positive. They weren't. They sucked for the most part. So did the Defense.

ST fumble and a couple returns were positives from the first preseason game. That's all I meant.

If you don't think a ST fumble in scoring position is a positive, then I do believe I've completely underestimated your pessimism

[Oaf]

Progress, progress, progress...

That is all I am looking for.
Agreed. And I saw very close to nothing in terms of progress from last year. But then again, I am an armchair QB. :::

[Buckets]

:deadhorse

[Oaf]

You see a Martin Rucker, who we easily could of gotten, get 70 yards in his first game ever, then you see Fowler missing an easy cut block on a stretch play that kills a promising run, then you see Schouman give up a sack, then you see the Packers' passing attack not missing a step with Rodgers, then you look at the pedigree and depth of the Redskins WRs and then you look at our sorry corps, and well, it just frustrates you after reading all this propaganda the last 8 months.

[OpIv37]

You see a Martin Rucker, who we easily could of gotten, get 70 yards in his first game ever, then you see Fowler missing an easy cut block on a stretch play that kills a promising run, then you see Schouman give up a sack, then you see the Packers' passing attack not missing a step with Rodgers, then you look at the pedigree and depth of the Redskins WRs and then you look at our sorry corps, and well, it just frustrates you after reading all this propaganda the last 8 months.

agreed but I think it was Fine who gave up the sack, not Schouman.

[RedEyE]

I don't care if they win or lose.

I'd like to see a good solid drive from the startiing offense, regardless of how many points they put on the board.

I'd like to see the defense settle into position and correct the over pursuing they were commiting on Saturday.

Everything else will be baised to position battles and analyzing the questionable youth in order to shave down the roster at the end of the month.

The OT position is the only real concern right now as depth has recently decreased.

[OpIv37]

I don't care if they win or lose.

I'd like to see a good solid drive from the startiing offense, regardless of how many points they put on the board.

I'd like to see the defense settle into position and correct the over pursuing they were commiting on Saturday.

Everything else will be baised to position battles and analyzing the questionable youth in order to shave down the roster at the end of the month.

The OT position is the only real concern right now as depth has recently decreased.


Exactly.

I was disappointed on Saturday because I was looking for SOME sign of improvement over last season and I didn't see any. I didn't expect either the O or the D to come out and look great, but I also didn't expect the D to get completely bowled over in the run game and I didn't expect the first string O to manage only 1 first down.

All I want to see is a little bit of improvement.

[Oaf]

Exactly.

I was disappointed on Saturday because I was looking for SOME sign of improvement over last season and I didn't see any. I didn't expect either the O or the D to come out and look great, but I also didn't expect the D to get completely bowled over in the run game and I didn't expect the first string O to manage only 1 first down.

All I want to see is a little bit of improvement.
Right. And we didn't get it. So then people start bowling over this forum on how everyone else is WAYYYYYY OVER REACTING TO PRESEASON GMS BECUZ THEY MEAN NOTHINGS!!

[raphael120]

Right. And we didn't get it. So then people start bowling over this forum on how everyone else is WAYYYYYY OVER REACTING TO PRESEASON GMS BECUZ THEY MEAN NOTHINGS!!

Uh..our ****ty preseason showing last year meant a whole lot, because we had the same problems rear its ugly head all season long. So for those of you who say preseason means nothing, they sure mean something when it comes to the Bills and reoccurring issues.

[FlyingDutchman]

I have seen nothing thus far.


In the 10 plays the starting offense has played this season with no gameplanning? go figure.

[billsburgh]

In the 10 plays the starting offense has played this season with no gameplanning? go figure.
Gameplanning has nothing to do with execution of the called plays. How much gameplanning really goes into preseason games? probably very little. I tend to think that the plays that were called were the plays the coaching staff felt most comfortable calling based on what they've seen on pracitce and minicamps. So if they cant even execute those plays, how much is gameplanning going to help?

[trapezeus]

who knows. i mean, the bills are coming out of a short week. so they may not be great. but i'd like to see improvement.

Everyone seems to want to find the formula to figuring out this season. I don't think there is one out there. Some of the guys may be dogging it to ensure their healthy. Some of the coaches may be calling in plays just to see the plays as opposed to being the right call at the right time.

We really don't know the underlyings of it all. So it's hard to base anything off the preseason. Because the exact opposite could happen. Trent could be 9-9 for 110 yards, the D and OL are brilliant and the whole team kills all 4 games, but we still don't know what the other team was doing. it's totally random. Only 3 more weeks of this, then we can watch the real thing.

[FlyingDutchman]

Gameplanning has nothing to do with execution of the called plays. How much gameplanning really goes into preseason games? probably very little. I tend to think that the plays that were called were the plays the coaching staff felt most comfortable calling based on what they've seen on pracitce and minicamps. So if they cant even execute those plays, how much is gameplanning going to help?

This is gonna come out of left field, but I had a chance to speak with Jim Kelly last night at practice when he was in the corporate tent. He mentioned how stupid it is to put thought as a fan into preseason. He said there is no gameplanning whatsover. He sighted how bad the Bills were in preseason during the Super Bowl run. The Bills had the players capable of going to the super bowl those years, so you could say they didnt "execute". It is what it is, preseason, or a scrimmage. He said teams dont show any plays that they feel will be effective during the season, bc you can bet anything that teams are taping these preseason games and trying to get what they can out of them. He said he doesnt think anything of the preseason performance, and thinks they will be ready.

I understand your comment about execution, and I do agree with it. It would have been nice to see better production out of the starters in their very limited time. But the fact that people are freaking out the last few days about this is the same old bills team and blah blah blah is just girl type overracting and comical to me.

[OpIv37]

This is gonna come out of left field, but I had a chance to speak with Jim Kelly last night at practice when he was in the corporate tent. He mentioned how stupid it is to put thought as a fan into preseason. He said there is no gameplanning whatsover. He sighted how bad the Bills were in preseason during the Super Bowl run. He said teams dont show any plays that they feel will be effective during the season, bc you can bet anything that teams are taping these preseason games and trying to get what they can out of them. He said he doesnt think anything of the preseason performance, and thinks they will be ready.

I understand your comment about execution, and I do agree with it. It would have been nice to see better production out of the starters in their very limited time. But the fact that people are freaking out the last few days about this is the same old bills team and blah blah blah is just girl type overracting and comical to me.


if that's true, it's one more reason why they should do away with half the preseason. Preseason games are glorified practices- what's the point of risking injury if the players aren't even practicing the plays they're going to be using?

[justasportsfan]

Did justa PM you and tell you to engage me in an argument?

:rofl: You're paranoid OP. If I wanted you engaged in an argument, I'll do it myself. You should know this by now. People don't need me to pm them to argue with you. You do that all by yourself.

[FlyingDutchman]

if that's true, it's one more reason why they should do away with half the preseason. Preseason games are glorified practices- what's the point of risking injury if the players aren't even practicing the plays they're going to be using?

IMO, these first two games are more for player evaluation. Isnt there cuts soon? Jim also said that the coaches know 95% of the players that will make up the team, and that theres usually just a couple of surprises. Thats nothing we didnt know, but i guess thats gotta be the reason. See which players are gamers I guess.

As far as plays, maybe there is a little bit of the scheme involved just to see how defenses line up to defend, so they can take that into thought, but they definately dont want to let the cat out of the bag.

[njsue]

Preseason is for the rookies. These games allow the coaches to decide who will make the cut.

:gobills:

[gr8slayer]

I'm more concerned with "if Edwards looks horrible against the Steelers." I already know that the first excuse on the board will be "well the Steelers are a good Defense."

[DraftBoy]

Id like to see our starting O sustain a 60-70 yard drive (7-9 plays) that results in points (FG or TD). Id like to see our starting D get a three and out. Id like to see some more of Matt Baker, Xavier Omon, Felton Huggins, and Steve Johnson. I want to see our starting OL give our QB more of than 2 seconds.

[Bruce is Loose]

Roscoe looked good

[gr8slayer]

Id like to see our starting O sustain a 60-70 yard drive (7-9 plays) that results in points (FG or TD). Id like to see our starting D get a three and out. Id like to see some more of Matt Baker, Xavier Omon, Felton Huggins, and Steve Johnson. I want to see our starting OL give our QB more of than 2 seconds.
Starting OL? Our starting OL is out of service until we get back #71.

[DraftBoy]

Starting OL? Our starting OL is out of service until we get back #71.

Whoever is starting Thursday night is the starting OL that Im talking about.

[Yasgur's Farm]

Of the 1st teams...

Special teams looked outstanding.
Defense looked fine.
Offense looked horrid.

As for 2nd team...

Special teams looked outstanding.
Offense looked outstanding.
Defense looked fine.

As for 3rd and 4th teams...

Special teams looked fine.
Offense looked OK.
Defense looked horrid.

Take all the for what it's worth!

[acehole]

well the bills didn't look horrible. There were good and bad things that happened. If you're a cynic then all you see is the bad.

Indeed why cant we call a spade a spade?
If units play good call them that way. If a player
plays good and it is a loss so what...one thing is
there is no game planning...but we should be watching
execution and sycronisity....

I dont care if we win...I care if we suck.

[Bone]

Im not trying to make excuses here but that was the skins 2nd preseason game, regardless tho I think we all want to see some type of improvement from last game. I wanna see 1 good solid drive, a beastmode run and hardy get 5-6 catches and the defense to play a lil more.