What will it take... [Archive] - BillsZone.com

Kicker22705

08-27-2002, 06:58 PM

Originally posted by JefftheBillsfan
their secondary. i also think we could be successful blitzing off the right side with old man jason fabini playing LT. clements/winfield will own the jets WRs so lets put at least 8 men in the box if not 9 at all times.

How old is Fabini? I thought he was 27 or 28.

And Phins did you mean how the Dolphins can beat them or the Bills?

08-27-2002, 07:22 PM

I expect Martin to have 180 yards and 2 or 3 TDs on the ground.

Rebecky

08-27-2002, 07:42 PM

I think the Jets use 3 WR spread a lot -- so can winfield, clement and watson cover Chrebet, S Moss and Coles?

08-27-2002, 07:59 PM

Don't kid yourselves, the Jets will have a decent D this season barring a slew of injuries. Their CBs are Beasley and Abraham, both have tons of experience, are in their primes, and are good.

I see Martin having a heyday, and if we can't contain him, then it won't matter anyway. If we do, I imagine that it'll be at the expense of some big plays in our passing game. Look out for Santana Moss this year. They have a solid trio of WRs and when you couple that with Martin, it's a dangerous combination.

Our only hope for that game is to exploit their rushing D. Their DL is improved over last year and therefore their last year's 28th ranked rush D. It should be improved however. But their pass D was 7th and it should be about the same.

Drew's 7-9 career vs. the Jets, and 2-6 since '97. So he'll have something to shake as well. We'll need a running game no matter where it comes from. If we can keep pace, then we can win. If we only score 21 or 24 or fewer points, then we don't have a chance. You can count on Martin for 120 yards and 2 TDs at least.

STs may be the largest factor in that game. If we can get good FP throughout the game, and ensure that the Jets have crud FP, then that could easily be enough to give us the edge.

casdhf

08-27-2002, 08:05 PM

:pee:

Butch

08-27-2002, 10:14 PM

I suggest getting Alex Van Pelt as your QB, he has a better record against the Jets than that buffoon you have down there named Fiedler.

Seriously though, try not blowing a 21 or 24 point lead and I think you have a chance.

clumping platelets

08-27-2002, 10:28 PM

Score more points

BambinoSux

08-28-2002, 07:49 AM

Phins,

You shouldn't even bother playing the games against the Jets anymore. What is it 8 in a row now? That is pretty sad. I think by Week 10 the Jets will be going downhill when Vinny starts to show his age.

Patrick76777

08-28-2002, 07:55 AM

Originally posted by Wys Guy
I expect Martin to have 180 yards and 2 or 3 TDs on the ground.

180!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I'll take that bet any day of the week. If Martin gets 180 yards I'll change my sign to anything you want! Something like Wys Wing Sauce is the best. Not a chance in the world.

Patrick76777

08-28-2002, 07:56 AM

Originally posted by RedEyE
Great question!
If Martin and Testeverde are on their mark, we are going to have to control the ball and keep the Jets O off the field.

Testeverde STINKS.....Always has and always will. Don't let the preseason fool you.

Patrick76777

08-28-2002, 07:57 AM

Originally posted by Rebecky
I think the Jets use 3 WR spread a lot -- so can winfield, clement and watson cover Chrebet, S Moss and Coles?

3 VERY average Wide outs. VERY AVERAGE!

casdhf

08-28-2002, 08:02 AM

Coles could be tough. He's faster than Winfield. If we put Clements on him, that'll leave Winfield on Moss who is also faster than Winfield....As for Chrebet, I wish we had some vet corner that knew his moves

eyedog

08-28-2002, 08:05 AM

i think the bills have to come out with bledsoe throwing the ball like he did in the first preseason game. if the jets are gonna be sitting back in cover two, than j. riem. has to come up big over the middle. than go to the running game. on defense i expect the 8 men in the box with alot of blitzing. always a ricky proposition. lets hope clements and winfield have their "A" game.

Patrick76777

08-28-2002, 08:12 AM

Predicting games in impossible. A million things go into it. Maybe the Jets fumble the opening kickoff and Drew Throws a short TD to Moulds and it’s 7-0 45 seconds into the game. Then the Crowd is SO loud that the Jets go 3 and out and a short punt and decent return by C. Rogers gives us great Field position. Now the crowd is rocking and momentum is fully in our favor. Another short drive and it’s 14-0 just 4 minutes into the game.

Or maybe. We get the ball first! Drew gets sacked on the first play; Henry goes up the middle for negative 3 yards and Drew throws incomplete. Another exciting 3 and out. This goes on and on until the game ends with a 6-3 Buffalo victory.

What if we get rain, or a Blizzard?

What if C. Martin gets hurt early?

What if Big Vinnie throws his usually 3 INT’s?

What if, What if, What if?

If we could accurately prognosticate these games, we wouldn’t be hanging out on these websites.

Patrick76777

08-28-2002, 08:15 AM

Plus, we ALWAYS play the Jets tough.

Rebecky

08-28-2002, 09:00 AM

Does either Henry or Bryson have good hands (receiver)?

Patrick76777

08-28-2002, 09:01 AM

Decent hands, not great. Better then A. Smith had

Earthquake Enyart

08-28-2002, 09:09 AM

Henry can't catch.

Patrick76777

08-28-2002, 09:10 AM

Well technically he can. Just not as well as others

Phins054

08-28-2002, 10:40 AM

Sorry if I was not specific...

I meant the Bills against the Jets...I was curious to see what all of your thoughts would be for the Bills to beat the Jets. What would it take?

Personaly I see it coming down to special teams and if you can run the ball. No running game = Bills loss.

As far as Miami goes...I feel this year the streak will end. At the very least we should split.

Patrick76777

08-28-2002, 10:45 AM

Well it has to happen at some point. it can't go on forever.

Phins054

08-28-2002, 10:48 AM

Thanks Patrick...I think...

Patrick76777

08-28-2002, 10:51 AM

I don't know whom I want to win those games yet. It depends on how it will effect the Bills. But the odds are against the Jets. I'm a firm believer that (especially in today's NFL) not much separates 30 of the 32 teams (Houston and Stl are exceptions). One stupid play or one untimely turnover and a game can change drastically. So it's tough to run the table for too long.

Rebecky

08-28-2002, 01:29 PM

Forgive the overgeneralization -- I'm clearly not a football technical expert, so feel free to educate me here -- but . . . .

Bledsoe is smart -- so if Henry and Bryson can catch (or can learn), do we have the potential of a St. Louis style offense -- everyone except the OL as potential receivers! Would that be challenging for the Jets D to cover?

Another ?? I gather that our ability to rush the passer and stuff the run rests upon our CB's ability to cover the Jets WR's 1/1?? What is the plan "B" in case one of our CB's is clearly outmatched??

eyedog

08-28-2002, 02:19 PM

if one is clearly overmatched than we are ******. they would need help from the safties, thus taking away from run support, in which case c. martin will be drooling on his shoes. the good news is, i don't see either corner being overmatched.

Patrick76777

08-28-2002, 02:26 PM

Originally posted by eyedog
the good news is, i don't see either corner being overmatched.

It's not even close. I do not like their WR's. Plus Vinnie T. is TERRIBLE. He's awful. don't let a lucky preseason fool ya.

BTW the Jets went 4-0 in the preseason the year they finished 1-15

Patrick76777

08-28-2002, 02:27 PM

I hope they win all 4 games this year. They'll be so full of themselves that they'll be ripe for the picking. I think we're going to kill these guys. Do you realize How loud that stadium is going to be. I'm getting so pumped. It's going to be nuts. Get tickets if you can. I'm looking for a BIG Bills win.

eyedog

08-28-2002, 02:28 PM

vinny is not very mobile. i'm expecting 8 in the box and a lot, a very lot of blitzing on sept. 8th.

Patrick76777

08-28-2002, 02:35 PM

You’re probably right. He’s not very accurate either. Our CB’s should be able to handle their WR’s.

Phins054

08-28-2002, 06:03 PM

Originally posted by Rebecky
Forgive the overgeneralization -- I'm clearly not a football technical expert, so feel free to educate me here -- but . . . .

Bledsoe is smart -- so if Henry and Bryson can catch (or can learn), do we have the potential of a St. Louis style offense -- everyone except the OL as potential receivers! Would that be challenging for the Jets D to cover?

Another ?? I gather that our ability to rush the passer and stuff the run rests upon our CB's ability to cover the Jets WR's 1/1?? What is the plan "B" in case one of our CB's is clearly outmatched??

Great question Rebecky...Your question about the DBs 1/1 coverage shows you have technical knowledge...In regards to the offense becoming similar to the Rams...I would have to say no...The 2 biggest reasons for this are at the RB position...Marshall is an MVP candidate for what he does for the Rams, he does it all. Splits out as a WR catches blocks runs...The other problem is your offensive line...just not strong or quick enough...The Rams line is not perfect, but it far more superior than about 30 other teams...Pittsburghs O-line is the only other that is close.

Hope this helps...:phew:

Rebecky

08-28-2002, 06:19 PM

Thanks for the info -- I'm determined to become a more knowledgeable fan this year.

TigerJ

08-28-2002, 11:35 PM

The game with the Jets is interesting IMO for the way it matches strengths against weaknesses. For the Jets it's Martin vs. the Bills' run defense - Jets strength vs. Buffalo weakness. For the Bills it is a good corps of CBs vs. NY's average receivers (I'm not saying Coles, Chrebet, and Moss are chopped liver but I thin Buffalo's CBs are better). I think Buffalo's WR's are better than NY's CBs too. NY's run defense has to be considered better than Buffalo's running game thus far however. I think some of the predictions made in this thread are right on. Buffalo will stack the line to try and stop the run, daring the Jets to pass to WR's covered one on one. I think New York might cheat their defense toward the passing game, daring Buffalo to run.

I'm like Rebecky in that I'm not very knowledgable about a lot of technical stuff (I know in principle what a zone defense is, but I couldn't teach little leaguers how to play it). I think Buffalo indeed has the potential to do some of the stuff St. Louis does, though not all of it. To become truly explosive, Buffalo needs to develop a running game opponents have to respect. If Buffalo can't run vs. the Jets, Moulds and company can't be nearly as effective.

Stewie

08-28-2002, 11:47 PM

Bills keys to win game:
Run the ball as much as possible. Control the clock, use time effectively (IE: score in the redzone). Throw a lot of short/medium passes underneath, take what the defense gives. Use any one of six legitimate pass catching options to keep defense honest. Don't go complicated yet, don't need to in order to beat cover-2. Score first, make vinny beat you in second half.

Jets:
Pound CM. Use a lot of motion and new formations to fool young bills defense. Try to get Moss out on an island against anyone but Clements for a big play. Pound CM. Have Vinny be effective by complementing the running game with a smart, efficient passing game. Control clock early to <attempt> to keep the 13th man quiet.

Rebecky

08-29-2002, 12:30 AM

Doncha just HATE it when a beginner gets hold of her first playbook?

Here's my next two ideas/questions:

1) If the Bills find they can't run against the Jets, what about catching them off-guard in the 3rd quarter with . . . . .

The 4-WR style offense that, if I understand correctly, can eliminate the need for the run and have a defensive secondary spinning in circles and making mistakes. Bledsoe's smart and accurate enough for the Fun and Gun. It's a quick release offense, but if our OL is still too weak, can't the RB and/or TE position be used for blocking?

2) Q #2: Since one must always have a Plan B --

Presuming the worst, 1st half, our CB's can't cover 1/1, we need help in the secondary -- if you were DC, what Plan B might you have in the back of your mind?

northernbillfan

08-29-2002, 03:19 AM

Originally posted bu clumping platelets
Score more points
Now thats how to beat ANY team!

JefftheBillsfan

08-29-2002, 10:23 AM

i honestly think the game is going to come down to a CBs matching 1 on 1 against the WRs. We are going to force them to throw. ill take nate and antoine anyday.

The_Philster

08-29-2002, 06:17 PM

So will I, Jeff. As long as we can figure out how to get some pressure on defense, we'll top them in passing game easy.

Phins054

08-29-2002, 06:23 PM

Originally posted by Rebecky
Doncha just HATE it when a beginner gets hold of her first playbook?

Here's my next two ideas/questions:

1) If the Bills find they can't run against the Jets, what about catching them off-guard in the 3rd quarter with . . . . .

The 4-WR style offense that, if I understand correctly, can eliminate the need for the run and have a defensive secondary spinning in circles and making mistakes. Bledsoe's smart and accurate enough for the Fun and Gun. It's a quick release offense, but if our OL is still too weak, can't the RB and/or TE position be used for blocking?

2) Q #2: Since one must always have a Plan B --

Presuming the worst, 1st half, our CB's can't cover 1/1, we need help in the secondary -- if you were DC, what Plan B might you have in the back of your mind?

1. In a 4WR set you must eliminate the FB and either the TE or the RB...Most 4 wide sets eliminate the TE and either run from that formation or keep the back in for blocking...In the context of what I THINK your point is...you may want to run a no huddle offense keeping the D on the field and off balance. I find it amazing how some teams on O seem to slack all day until you need a 2 minute drill type drive...Then the QB is flinging the bal all over the place and the O scores...weird huh?!?

2. You MUST stop Curtis Martin...load 8 in the box and force VT to throw...If you can generate a strong enough pass rush and get to VT...he has shown in the past to "disappear" after getting knocked down a few times. If that is unsuccessful...I see a lot of yardage for CM.

HenryRules

08-29-2002, 09:04 PM

Phins, I disagree that we must stop Curtis Martin. While Martin is definitely the best player on that team, Vinny's success is much more indicative of how many points their offense will score. Shut him down and you shut down the Jets. Our game plan should be similar to a basketball team's - contain Curtis Martin, knowing he's going to get his yards, but don't let Vinny or anyone else get hot or on a roll.

JefftheBillsfan

08-29-2002, 11:43 PM

if we let martin beat us the jets will have the ball the whole game and still put up points...we have to take him out of the game

justasportsfan

08-30-2002, 11:11 AM

Originally posted by casdhf
Coles could be tough. He's faster than Winfield. If we put Clements on him, that'll leave Winfield on Moss who is also faster than Winfield....As for Chrebet, I wish we had some vet corner that knew his moves

Moss was awsome in college. But he hasn't been hit by Clements or Winfield yet. I say let him catch the ball for short yardage and then.......BOOOOM There it is!!!:chair:

colin

08-30-2002, 11:17 AM

If Curtis gets 150 and 1 TD, and Vinny passes for less than 2 TDs, then we should be able to force some INTS and get the ball and stuff it down their non pass defending throughts. We will crush the green homos.

HenryRules

08-30-2002, 11:46 AM

Originally posted by JefftheBillsfan
if we let martin beat us the jets will have the ball the whole game and still put up points...we have to take him out of the game

When we beat the Jets last year, Martin put up 123 yards and they scored 9 points. When they beat Carolina last year, Martin put up 159 yards and they scored 13 points. When New England beat them last year, Martin put up 106 yards and they scored 3 points. Vinny is the way the Jets score points. Take Vinny out of the game and they don't score.