if we win and defer

[patmoran2006]

I hope someone smacks jauron in the head.

The last three times we've defered, the opposition has taken the opening kickoff and scored.

[mchurchfie]

I'll bet my next three unborn children on it that if we win the toss Knucklehead will defer.

[Philagape]

Winners want the ball!

[Dr. Lecter]

I hope someone smacks jauron in the head.

The last three times we've defered, the opposition has taken the opening kickoff and scored.

Wrong.

Miami punted on their opening drive.

Link. (http://www.nfl.com/gamecenter/playbyplay?game_id=29729&displayPage=tab_play_by_play&season=2008&week=REG14&override=true)

Of all the things he does wrong, defering (which is not even wrong, imo) is way, way, way down on the list. It is a stupid media created controversy.

[RockStar36]

Deferring is a very smart move. I hope my team does it every single game.

[patmoran2006]

Either sully is lying then, or I mistated the quote. From Bflo News. Maybe its not the last three games, but three straight times regardless.
--------------------------

Sully: I'm told there's a stat that says team that score on the opening drive of the second half win a large percentage of the team. What about teams that score on the opening drive of the game? I agree that it's a case of Jauron falling into line with NFL coaches who tend to copy each other. He shows very little flexibility in his thinking. Opponents scored three times in a row to start the game when he deferred. You'd think he would change up. And people want to believe he's some kind of intellect. Give me a break

[yordad]

I'll bet my next three unborn children on it that if we win the toss Knucklehead will defer.What do you receive if you win that bet? EEwwww.

[Dr. Lecter]

Either sully is lying then, or I mistated the quote. From Bflo News. Maybe its not the last three games, but three straight times regardless.
--------------------------

Sully: I'm told there's a stat that says team that score on the opening drive of the second half win a large percentage of the team. What about teams that score on the opening drive of the game? I agree that it's a case of Jauron falling into line with NFL coaches who tend to copy each other. He shows very little flexibility in his thinking. Opponents scored three times in a row to start the game when he deferred. You'd think he would change up. And people want to believe he's some kind of intellect. Give me a break

Perhaps. But the problem is not in defering, it is in the defense stopping the team The Bills get the ball to start the 2nd half.

The Buffalo media sucks. They are focusing on a non-issue when there are real issues to discuss. Sullivan is an idiot (see his column today *****ing about Miller).

I would rather see him question the use of Hardy. Or non-use of Lynch. Or why Edwards has regressed. Or why the offense doe snot use more roll-outs. And so forth.

Not this stupid **** about deferring.

[yordad]

OK, it's clear. Edwards has regressed because we are defering. I knew there was a good reason!

[patmoran2006]

Perhaps. But the problem is not in defering, it is in the defense stopping the team The Bills get the ball to start the 2nd half.

The Buffalo media sucks. They are focusing on a non-issue when there are real issues to discuss. Sullivan is an idiot (see his column today *****ing about Miller).

I would rather see him question the use of Hardy. Or non-use of Lynch. Or why Edwards has regressed. Or why the offense doe snot use more roll-outs. And so forth.

Not this stupid **** about deferring.
You dont need Sully for that.. I can do it for him.

*** We dont use Hardy or use him the "wrong way" because frankly, he's just not that good. With his size and athleticism, if he had the football ability to match it he would've been long gone in week 2. People say Eric Moulds took three years to get it. Well, Perry TUttle NEVER got it.


*** Our non-use of LYnch is due to Turk, and his growing reputation of being too cute for his own good.. He tries to outsmart himself too much.

** Edwards has regressed in part because we didnt have a running game for 10 weeks. in part because of a bad game plan, in part because he's still young, in part becuase our WR's aren't as good as people think, in part because we have no TE who's consistent, and in part because its like a virus, and the whole team is regrestting.


*** As for lack of roll outs. See Lynch theory.

[DraftBoy]

How about I smack you upside the head for starting a stupid thread about something that has little to no consequence on the outcome of the game??

[Dr. Lecter]

I can't wait for Monday.

I can see this happening on Sunday - the Bills win the toss and receive. The game is tied at halftime or the Bills are up by 3 or 4. The Jets take the opening drive fo the 2nd half and score, picking up momentum and winning the game.

Thread titles will include "Idiot Jauron does not defer"

[Griz78]

Actually, for home games, I'd want to start on Defense, crowd is amped up and ready to go. After halftime, you're still getting beer, taking a leak or dumpin.

[bflobarry]

Yea, if we defer, we do get the second half kickoff. But if you're already losing by then, it's an uphill climb. If you score first, statistically, you win more often. Hence, unless you have a terrific defense, you should want the ball to GET THE LEAD!....

[Typ0]

2nd half is more important. Deferring is the right choice.

[patmoran2006]

I can't wait for Monday.

I can see this happening on Sunday - the Bills win the toss and receive. The game is tied at halftime or the Bills are up by 3 or 4. The Jets take the opening drive fo the 2nd half and score, picking up momentum and winning the game.

Thread titles will include "Idiot Jauron does not defer"
You really think we're going to be tied or up at the half?
I'm thinking if the Jets get to more than 4 points the game is over.

[Novacane]

I like deferring. Just have the defense prepared to stop them.

[yordad]

Yea, if we defer, we do get the second half kickoff. But if you're already losing by then, it's an uphill climb. If you score first, statistically, you win more often. Hence, unless you have a terrific defense, you should want the ball to GET THE LEAD!....What is the statistic for scoring last?

[RockStar36]

Deferring is also great if your offense gets the ball with around 3 minutes in the half, takes the ball down for a score right before the half, and then gets the ball right back afterwards. Then again, with the Bills, that most likely won't happen.

[Night Train]

It's all part of the master plan ! How To Tank A Season

[HHURRICANE]

I hope someone smacks jauron in the head.

The last three times we've defered, the opposition has taken the opening kickoff and scored.

I made almost an identical thread last week so be prepared to take crap over it.

Winners want the ball that's why they don't defer in overtime.

[Typ0]

I made almost an identical thread last week so be prepared to take crap over it.

Winners want the ball that's why they don't defer in overtime.

no, you don't defer in overtime for the same reason you defer in the first half. OT is more important than the second half so you take the ball...just like you take the ball in the second half. You want to set yourself up for an extra possession on the period. In all your "logic" your math skills aren't that good.

[HHURRICANE]

no, you don't defer in overtime for the same reason you defer in the first half. OT is more important than the second half so you take the ball...just like you take the ball in the second half. You want to set yourself up for an extra possession on the period. In all your "logic" your math skills aren't that good.

Math and logic don't necceraily apply to subject. Yes, there is some logic to deferring but in the Bills case in hasn't worked and it has set the wrong tone for the game.

It was like when the 2 point conversion came into the league. Everybody had their little tables on when to use it but in the end people figured out that putting the points on the board made more sense.

[Dr. Lecter]

I made almost an identical thread last week so be prepared to take crap over it.

Winners want the ball that's why they don't defer in overtime.

There is no option to defer in OT.

Apparently you don't understand the choices when a team wins a toss.

If a team win a toss at the start of the game, they have three options:

1. Receive the opening kick-off.
2. Choose a goal to defend.
3. Defer the option to the 2nd half.

The team that loses the coin toss, gets to choose between options 1 and 2 and the start of the 2nd half, unless the winner selects choice 1 in which case the toss winner chooses between options 2 and 3.

In OT, there are only options 2 and 3.

Deferring is not the same as declining to receive and defending a goal. It is quite different.

[Typ0]

Math and logic don't necceraily apply to subject. Yes, there is some logic to deferring but in the Bills case in hasn't worked and it has set the wrong tone for the game.

It was like when the 2 point conversion came into the league. Everybody had their little tables on when to use it but in the end people figured out that putting the points on the board made more sense.


you seemed to be trying to use logic in your arguement that people take the ball in OT so they should take the ball at the beginning of the game. I was just pointing out that your logic had a tragic flaw and actually supported the arguement to defer in the first half.

I understand the arguement about taking the ball and the tone of the game too...the problem is taking the ball isn't going to change the team failing to perform. The coaches have to do what they feel is right in the long run and work towards winning championship. They aren't going to sit there and analyze what to do when the team stinks. That's where a lot of people seem to get lost on analyzing the coaching performance IMO.

[madness]

Either sully is lying then, or I mistated the quote. From Bflo News. Maybe its not the last three games, but three straight times regardless.
--------------------------

Sully: I'm told there's a stat that says team that score on the opening drive of the second half win a large percentage of the team. What about teams that score on the opening drive of the game? I agree that it's a case of Jauron falling into line with NFL coaches who tend to copy each other. He shows very little flexibility in his thinking. Opponents scored three times in a row to start the game when he deferred. You'd think he would change up. And people want to believe he's some kind of intellect. Give me a break

Simple. Sully is lying. As Lecter pointed out, Miami punted on their first series.
1st Quarter expand [+] (javascript:void(0);) collapse [-] (javascript:void(0);) <!--START of continues content if there is more play in the quarter--><!--END of continues content if there is more play in the quarter--><!--START of Drive in the the specific quarter--><TABLE class=borderCollapse><TBODY><TR class=MIAcolors><TD class=playText colSpan=2>Miami Dolphins at 15:00 </TD></TR><!--START of play content in the quarter--><TR class=rowAlt><TD class=downTextfull colSpan=2>Bills won toss and deferred choice to second half. 9-R.Lindell kicks 61 yards from BUF 30 to MIA 9. 17-B.London to MIA 26 for 17 yards (13-St.Johnson). </TD></TR><TR><TD class=downInfo>1-10-MIA 26 </TD><TD class=downText>(14:55) 10-C.Pennington pass short left to 80-A.Fasano to MIA 35 for 9 yards (59-K.Mitchell, 51-P.Posluszny). Flat pass, caught at MIA 28. </TD></TR><TR class=rowAlt><TD class=downInfo>2-1-MIA 35 </TD><TD class=downText>(14:14) 23-R.Brown left guard to MIA 44 for 9 yards (28-L.McKelvin). </TD></TR><TR><TD class=downInfo>1-10-MIA 44 </TD><TD class=downText>(13:38) 10-C.Pennington pass short left to 23-R.Brown to MIA 47 for 3 yards (56-K.Ellison; 99-M.Stroud) [95-K.Williams]. Screen pass, thrown under pressure, caught at MIA 45. </TD></TR><TR class=rowAlt><TD class=downInfo>2-7-MIA 47 </TD><TD class=downText>(12:52) 34-R.Williams up the middle to BUF 49 for 4 yards (92-R.Denney, 56-K.Ellison). </TD></TR><TR><TD class=downInfo>3-3-BUF 49 </TD><TD class=downText>(12:10) 10-C.Pennington pass incomplete short right to 19-T.Ginn. Overthrown, receiver at BUF 39, crossing to middle. </TD></TR><TR class=rowAlt><TD class=downInfo>4-3-BUF 49 </TD><TD class=downText>(12:05) 2-B.Fields punts 44 yards to BUF 5, Center-92-J.Denney, out of bounds. </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>


In college, teams defer to the second half a staggering 97% of the time.

There are many reasons coaches have found but here are just a few.

If the weather is bad early in the game and is expected to clear
Most teams want to set the tone early with a good defensive stop
the offense has a great look at what the defense is doing and can form a plan of attack to start the second half.
when at home, fans are slow to get back to their seats after the half, an advantage for the offense, a disadvantage for the defense.

[Coach Sal]

We deferred at Kansas City and won.
Cleveland deferred against us and won.

Deferring or not deferring doesn't win or lose games.

[RockStar36]

Deferring is smart. Anyone who uses the logic that 'winners want the ball first' are incorrect. You want the ball when it is more important. It's more important to get the ball in the 2nd half when you've made adjustment and already seen that team play for 30 minutes. Plus if you can stop their offense on the first drive it's huge in the momentum department, assuming your team takes advantage of it.

[Typ0]

We deferred at Kansas City and won.
Cleveland deferred against us and won.

Deferring or not deferring doesn't win or lose games.


right. It's kind of like being white in chess...when the chess game starts white has an advantage but any move can easily sway that advantage. But logically you would want to start with that advantage.

[Coach Sal]

When I'm actually coaching in a real game, our staff usually defers when we win the toss. We want our defense on the field first to set the tone.

Sometimes, we do want the ball first because we think we can get a big play early -- or we've noticed the other team starts a little flat.

It's really all about feel of your team/situation.

But, no matter what, it just comes down to executing. I've personally never heard a coach actually say, "we shouldn't have deferred" if we get scored on.

We're just thinking about what adjustments to make on the next series.

[RockStar36]

When I'm actually coaching in a real game, our staff usually defers when we win the toss. We want our defense on the field first to set the tone.

Sometimes, we do want the ball first because we think we can get a big play early -- or we've noticed the other team starts a little flat.

But, no matter what, it just comes down to executing. I've personally never heard a coach actually say, "we shouldn't have deferred" if we get scored on.

We're just thinking about what adjustments to make on the next series.

THANK YOU!!!

[yordad]

right. It's kind of like being white in chess...when the chess game starts white has an advantage but any move can easily sway that advantage. But logically you would want to start with that advantage.Not really. There is no halftime in chess where you have a 50% chance you will get 2 consecutive moves.

[madness]

Not really. There is no halftime in chess where you have a 50% chance you will get 2 consecutive moves.

In check is close though. :D

[Typ0]

he totally twisted around the point I was trying to make because he has a fetish with shooting me down.

[yordad]

he totally twisted around the point I was trying to make because he has a fetish with shooting me down.Me? I have agreed with you at least once before... I assume. If you feel I am targeting your post, you are wrong. If I usually disagree with your post, I haven't even noticed, and it is because we disagree, nothing more.

I don't think it is that much like Chess. Especially not in the way you mention, for the reason I mention.

[Typ0]

Me? I have agreed with you at least once before... I assume. If you feel I am targeting your post, you are wrong. If I usually disagree with your post, I haven't even noticed, and it is because we disagree, nothing more.


calm down...you might have agreed with me once. That's hillarious the way you stated it though. I have no problem with you I was busting your balls...but you did twist around what I was saying here. I was making the analogy of having the slight advantage at the beginning in a chess game and how a slight change in the beginning game takes away that advantage....I know the middle game doesn't play out anything like a football game.

[yordad]

calm down...you might have agreed with me once. That's hillarious the way you stated it though. I have no problem with you I was busting your balls...but you did twist around what I was saying here. I was making the analogy of having the slight advantage at the beginning in a chess game and how a slight change in the beginning game takes away that advantage....I know the middle game doesn't play out anything like a football game.Well, saying someone has a fetish, and then telling them to calm down is rude. Plus I can sense your sarcasm. NTM, I am calm. It's just a message board. I am over it. I just didn't want you to think I had some kinda grudge against you.

:cheers:

[Typ0]

Well, saying someone has a fetish, and then telling them to calm down is rude. Plus I can sense your sarcasm. NTM, I am calm. It's just a message board. I am over it. I just didn't want you to think I had some kinda grudge against you.

:cheers:


no, I know you're just one of those JP people and that's why we have been at opposition in arguements. I know you'll come around ...

:cheers: