It's the talent?

[yordad]

QB- More then average talent

RBs- One of the most talented duos in the league. FB sucks, but why even field one?

WR- Lee is one of the most talented. We have several niche players. Reed is solid, with good hands and is great at blocking. Parrish is cat quick. Hardy is fast for his size, and one of the tallest WRs in the league. And out of all these "number 2s", I think Johnson is the most talented of them all

Line- We have the biggest line in the league. Peters is one of the best LTs. We brought in Walker and Dock with big contracts, obviously we thought they were talented. Butler isn't all that bad. Center does suck though.

TE- Suck

So on offense we have 2.5 talentless positions: FB (.5), TE and C. How many weak positions does the average team have?

Why is our offense behind teams like San Fran, the Jags, Baltimore, the Bucs, the Texans, the Falcons, the Dolphins, the the WRless Titans? Why is our offense 23rd? IMO, seems teams get more out of there talent then we do.

Why? And, if Ralph thinks its the talent, are we to assume someone will be brought in to help the front office? Or is no one accountable?

[gr8slayer]

Re: It's the talent?

Outside of Lynch, Evans, and Peters the offensive talent is weak to say the least. Good QB play would go a long way to fixing a lot of the problems the Bills currently have on offense.

[OpIv37]

Re: It's the talent?

QB- More then average talent

RBs- One of the most talented duos in the league. FB sucks, but why even field one?

WR- Lee is one of the most talented. We have several niche players. Reed is solid, with good hands and is great at blocking. Parrish is cat quick. Hardy is fast for his size, and one of the tallest WRs in the league. And out of all these "number 2s", I think Johnson is the most talented of them all

Line- We have the biggest line in the league. Peters is one of the best LTs. We brought in Walker and Dock with big contracts, obviously we thought they were talented. Butler isn't all that bad. Center does suck though.

TE- Suck

So on offense we have 2.5 talentless positions: FB (.5), TE and C. How many weak positions does the average team have?

Why is our offense behind teams like San Fran, the Jags, Baltimore, the Bucs, the Texans, the Falcons, the Dolphins, the the WRless Titans? Why is our offense 23rd? IMO, seems teams get more out of there talent then we do.

Why? And, if Ralph thinks its the talent, are we to assume someone will be brought in to help the front office? Or is no one accountable?

QB- Disagree. Edwards may be better than average- it's too soon to tell. But so far he hasn't been average. And Losman...well, enough has already been said on that subject.

RB/FB- agreed.

WR- Evans is the real deal. I've come around on Reed and I do like him, but I still have to admit that he's limited by his lack of speed. I think he contributes to this team but I don't think he's a top #2 receiver. Parrish runs terrible routes- combine that with his lack of size and it's damn near impossible to get him the ball. Johnson and Hardy represent a ton of potential but haven't proven anything yet. As a whole, the WR's are average at best.

Line- Dock is overrated. Butler has his good moments and his bad moments. The C position just blows. Walker and Peters are fine.

TE- agreed.

I'd say our talent is BARELY average and that might even be a stretch. If Edwards, Hardy and Johnson come along, then I'd say the O as a whole has above average talent. But at the moment, the talent isn't there.

The reality: it's EVERYTHING. The FO. The coaches. The talent. And most importantly, the owner. This organization is just an utter failure.

[Owen DeBoard]

Re: It's the talent?

QB- More then average talent

RBs- One of the most talented duos in the league. FB sucks, but why even field one?

WR- Lee is one of the most talented. We have several niche players. Reed is solid, with good hands and is great at blocking. Parrish is cat quick. Hardy is fast for his size, and one of the tallest WRs in the league. And out of all these "number 2s", I think Johnson is the most talented of them all

Line- We have the biggest line in the league. Peters is one of the best LTs. We brought in Walker and Dock with big contracts, obviously we thought they were talented. Butler isn't all that bad. Center does suck though.

TE- Suck

So on offense we have 2.5 talentless positions: FB (.5), TE and C. How many weak positions does the average team have?

Why is our offense behind teams like San Fran, the Jags, Baltimore, the Bucs, the Texans, the Falcons, the Dolphins, the the WRless Titans? Why is our offense 23rd? IMO, seems teams get more out of there talent then we do.

Why? And, if Ralph thinks its the talent, are we to assume someone will be brought in to help the front office? Or is no one accountable?

[jimbohastle51]

Re: It's the talent?

we have talent, i cant even listen to media members that say that. if we had schobel or someone for that matter that had 10 sacks himself then our defense would be in the top 10. all we are really lacking on D is a pass rushing DE and keith ellisons spot could use an upgrade but the pass rushing DE would make a world of difference. as far as the Center position and the TE position our front office knew we needed to fill these spots long ago and ignored them. we had money still to spend and watched jeff faine sign with the bucs, and then we waited till week 6 to try to trade for a TE when if any trade for a TE was going to go down we should have done it on draft day with our 3rd round pick when we knew all the good TE's were gone anyways and we could have easily pryed a good TE away from a team. maybe we are one more offseason away remember this is only year 3 so technically next year is the year we should be "built"

[X-Era]

Re: It's the talent?

QB- More then average talent

RBs- One of the most talented duos in the league. FB sucks, but why even field one?

WR- Lee is one of the most talented. We have several niche players. Reed is solid, with good hands and is great at blocking. Parrish is cat quick. Hardy is fast for his size, and one of the tallest WRs in the league. And out of all these "number 2s", I think Johnson is the most talented of them all

Line- We have the biggest line in the league. Peters is one of the best LTs. We brought in Walker and Dock with big contracts, obviously we thought they were talented. Butler isn't all that bad. Center does suck though.

TE- Suck

So on offense we have 2.5 talentless positions: FB (.5), TE and C. How many weak positions does the average team have?

Why is our offense behind teams like San Fran, the Jags, Baltimore, the Bucs, the Texans, the Falcons, the Dolphins, the the WRless Titans? Why is our offense 23rd? IMO, seems teams get more out of there talent then we do.

Why? And, if Ralph thinks its the talent, are we to assume someone will be brought in to help the front office? Or is no one accountable?

Yes, its talent. Its also the coaching staff, the FO, and the owner. If you add all of that up, you get mediore overall... our record shows it.

Just like any class you take, you may fail in one area but if you make up for it in others, you can still get a passing grade or even do well. Our problem is we get a C in just about everything.

And then we are somehow surprised that we have only an average year? Thats stupid and it reflects on everyone involved.

No pun intended here... but take ownership over your team and your actions.

[X-Era]

Re: It's the talent?

QB- More then average talent

RBs- One of the most talented duos in the league. FB sucks, but why even field one?

WR- Lee is one of the most talented. We have several niche players. Reed is solid, with good hands and is great at blocking. Parrish is cat quick. Hardy is fast for his size, and one of the tallest WRs in the league. And out of all these "number 2s", I think Johnson is the most talented of them all

Line- We have the biggest line in the league. Peters is one of the best LTs. We brought in Walker and Dock with big contracts, obviously we thought they were talented. Butler isn't all that bad. Center does suck though.

TE- Suck

So on offense we have 2.5 talentless positions: FB (.5), TE and C. How many weak positions does the average team have?

Why is our offense behind teams like San Fran, the Jags, Baltimore, the Bucs, the Texans, the Falcons, the Dolphins, the the WRless Titans? Why is our offense 23rd? IMO, seems teams get more out of there talent then we do.

Why? And, if Ralph thinks its the talent, are we to assume someone will be brought in to help the front office? Or is no one accountable?

Ill respond a bit more to your specifics:

QB- average at best, certainly not top 10 or even 15, I will give it 15th in the league

RB's- good, not stellar, probably top 15 or even 10, I will give it 10th

WR's- Lee top 10, everyone else average or worse, overall I will give it 15th

OL- Peters top 5, the rest of the unit overall is about average, overall- a bit better than most, I will give it 13th

TE- bottom half of the league, I will give it 20th

Add all that up and you get:

15
10
15
13
20
___

That averages 14.6... 12 teams get into the playoffs, so the math says we shouldn't make it based just on ranking our O talent.

Do the damn math and Ralph is right, what will he do about it?

[TedMock]

Re: It's the talent?

The reality: it's EVERYTHING. The FO. The coaches. The talent. And most importantly, the owner. This organization is just an utter failure.

Bingo. Everybody is blaming one side or another. It is a combination of everything. I will say that I don't think the team lacks a ton of talent, but we do need upgrading in a few key areas. Every team in the league is talented, but most teams (even the best teams) don't have a bunch of studs running around. They play tight, disciplined, mistake-free football. So, while we could use more talent at C, OLB, etc, we could also use more discipline to stop the extremely foolish mental errors we see each week and I feel that's on the coaching staff for not properly utilizing practice. I also think that there are talented players being mis-used on this team and that drives me nuts. I hate being married to systems or styles. Good coaches adapt to the talent on the team and form an identity for their squad. We have too often forced players into roles that they are not good at and/or not comfortable with. At the end of the day, the GM and owner are as accountable as the players and coaches for our failures because they either don't recognize that there are problems, or they are too stubborn to admit to their own mistakes.

[ddaryl]

Re: It's the talent?

We have some talent, and I think Edwards is progressing along... One has to wonder how he plays if the consussion never happend. To me that very nasty hit shook him up. Compare Edwards to other QBs 1st 2 years in the league and Edwards is doing well. He has a layed a couple of turds, but 2nd year QB's will do that, as will nasty concussions that linger

Our OL is solid with C being a weak link... I don't know why it took them 3/4 of season to learn to run block though. Depth is a little worrisome

TE is weak, but IMO Fine was a good pickup... Upgrade here would be nice

WR we have Evans and Reed... a half way decent 1 & 2 we could use help here, or hopefully Hardy and Johnson step it up in the very near future.

RB is set and solid...

We seen bad play calling yet again from the coaches, we've seen missed assignments and half assed efforts from players all seaosn long. To me coaching has been a roller coaster and it is a big part of why our O and team isn't playing better and more consistent.


As for the D... We need a MAJOR !!!!!! upgrade at DE, and an upgrade at OLB... PLUS the 4-3 cover 2 just plays too soft and good teams or a hot QB picks it apart. This is mainly because we do not have a consistent pass rush from the front 4. And having DE's drop back in pass coverage is never a good idea IMO

[yordad]

Re: It's the talent?

I think some of you guys are confussing production with talent.

For example........ "If Edwards, Hardy and Johnson come along, then I'd say the O as a whole has above average talent. But at the moment, the talent isn't there."

The talent is there, but the production isn't, IMO. The question is, why? Some teams play above their talent. And although ours isn't the most talented, it has underperformed IMO. Afterall, most of us predicted playoffs prior to the season starting, right?

[billsfanone]

Re: It's the talent?

Good coaches work with the talent. Good coaches aren't lame ducks when it comes to selecting players either.

[yordad]

Re: It's the talent?

That averages 14.6... 12 teams get into the playoffs, so the math says we shouldn't make it based just on ranking our O talent.

OK, lets say our QBs and RBs and WRs only have average talent and overall the offense is about a 14.6 talent wise. Why does our offense rank 23rdish? Seems a good coach, system, and scheme could get top 12 production out of top 15 talent. We did the opposite.

[Jan Reimers]

Re: It's the talent?

We will never win without a pass rush, plain and simple. We need an OLB and a DE who can get consistent pressure on the QB.

Offensively, we need a pass catching TE and a big 2nd WR to give us ome flexibility in the red zone, and a C to help the running game.

So, we need major help at 5 positions.

[jimbohastle51]

Re: It's the talent?

We will never win without a pass rush, plain and simple. We need an OLB and a DE who can get consistent pressure on the QB.

Offensively, we need a pass catching TE and a big 2nd WR to give us ome flexibility in the red zone, and a C to help the running game.

So, we need major help at 5 positions.

agreed ms reimers, i think we just have to hope that this IS the last rebuilding offseason and we are ready to roll next season. at least it has been obvious even through our coaching staff and front office that they know those are needs that have to be filled. for examples jauron has said that he has been juggling fowler and preston and the front office tried to trade for gonzo so we know those positions have to be filled.

[mybills]

Re: It's the talent?

Jan is a man.


Year after year they get an arm QB, then they get a JP scrambler, then Trent 'the pocket' type. Above average QB's stand out right away. Neither of them did in their 2nd season. Whether we get one that comes out throwing, or starts out comfortable in the pocket, or a Michael Vick type scrambler, a great QB will be able to combine them successfully just about every game, and stand out.
Trent is average. Losman is below average. I'm still waiting for a great one!