Transition tag Crowell!

[yordad]

Why not? He is probably the bast available cover 2 OLB free agent.

Seriously, help me out. Why not? Leave out the rumors and what reason is there not to?

[VeggieMan14]

i still dont understand why everyone thinks he is not coming back?:idk:

[trapezeus]

you'd have to pay him the average of the top 10 LBs. i think that's the price of the transition tag. no way ralph is going to do that after "showing him a lesson" at the begining of the year.

[Owen DeBoard]

i still dont understand why everyone thinks he is not coming back?:idk:
The FO probably thinks that he is not a team player and is all about himself with how he handled his injury at the beginning of the season. They probably have a character issue with him. Who knows.

[VeggieMan14]

The FO probably thinks that he is not a team player and is all about himself with how he handled his injury at the beginning of the season. They probably have a character issue with him. Who knows.is there any real evidence that they dont want him?

[Mr. Pink]

Crow is nowhere near a top 10 LB in this league.

Terrible idea.

[Romes]

Even if we assumed that there is no animosity on either side (which is some pretty optimistic thinking)...

Crowell still has a bum knee and we can't expect him to be the same player he was before.

[MarvLevy]

get his ass outta here after what he pulled...

lets go to war with Pos, Mitchell and Ellison and draft an LB in either rd 1-3.

[OpIv37]

I could be wrong, but aren't transition tags reserved for RFA's?

Either way, I think Jackson would be a more valuable use of a transition tag than Crowell.

[Owen DeBoard]

is there any real evidence that they dont want him?
I would say the putting him on IR is but thats my opinion. I would love to have him back and he was sorely missed but I highly doubt that hes back next year.

[yordad]

Crow is nowhere near a top 10 LB in this league.

Terrible idea.I'm thinking we would have to pay top 10 to get a good cover 2 OLB either way. We might as well get our own guy, who happens to be better then any available.

Are the top 10 LBs all paid top 10 $? No. The ones who have been free agents in recent years have cashed in. Higher cap, weak available talent = people who aren't even as good cashing in.

Crowell would bring more value to us then any other team, and many teams would be willing to pay top 10 OLB $$.

So IMO, your wrong! Again!

[yordad]

I could be wrong, but aren't transition tags reserved for RFA's?

Either way, I think Jackson would be a more valuable use of a transition tag than Crowell.I believe you are wrong. Jackson is restricted so he needs no tag. Greer would be the next best option, I think.


Crowell still has a bum knee and we can't expect him to be the same player he was before.I believe the idea is he will be back 100%.

get his ass outta here after what he pulled....It's a business. I think it would be best for the Bills. Who cares what Crowell thinks.

[Griz78]

According to Chris Brown's weekly Fan Friday, he had microfracture surgery so I am guessing he will get a 1 year deal somewhere at best. If we are going to throw money somewhere I would realistically throw it at Matt Birk or Bo Scaife or Owen Daniels. DE will have to be our 1st Round Pick, maybe LB in Roudn 2 if they start to fall.

[yordad]

According to Chris Brown's weekly Fan Friday, he had microfracture surgery so I am guessing he will get a 1 year deal somewhere at best. If we are going to throw money somewhere I would realistically throw it at Matt Birk or Bo Scaife or Owen Daniels. DE will have to be our 1st Round Pick, maybe LB in Roudn 2 if they start to fall.So you want to go into the draft with gapping DE and OLB needs and have our big FA aquisition be a center?

That actually sounds horribly accurate.

A transition tag will probably give Crowell a 1 year deal. ANd, it gives us one more year without the gapping hole.

[Mr. Pink]

I'm thinking we would have to pay top 10 to get a good cover 2 OLB either way. We might as well get our own guy, who happens to be better then any available.

Are the top 10 LBs all paid top 10 $? No. The ones who have been free agents in recent years have cashed in. Higher cap, weak available talent = people who aren't even as good cashing in.

Crowell would bring more value to us then any other team, and many teams would be willing to pay top 10 OLB $$.

So IMO, your wrong! Again!

Doing this would perpetuate us into overpaying for any and everyone.

We did this already with Evans.

We did this with Dock.

We're likely to do it with Peters if he gets his way.

We did it with all three of our garbage DEs. Schobel, Kelsay, Denney.

We did it with Roscoe.

Aren't you sick of spending outlandish money on the "talent" and getting very low returns on those investments?

[yordad]

Doing this would perpetuate us into overpaying for any and everyone.

We did this already with Evans.

We did this with Dock.

We're likely to do it with Peters if he gets his way.

We did it with all three of our garbage DEs. Schobel, Kelsay, Denney.

We did it with Roscoe.

Aren't you sick of spending outlandish money on the "talent" and getting very low returns on those investments?So let me get this straight.... becasue you think Peters will get over paid, you think Crowell will under perform?

Or do you think Crowell will suck because Kelsey does?

In '07 he was one of the top OLB in the game. He should be 100%. He is the best available cover 2. He knows our system. He knows the teammates. This is a no-brainer, IMO!

The alternative is paying someone who isn't as good even more money!

[DraftBoy]

Micro-Fracture surgery is not easy to recover from, your notion that he will be back at 100% is rather outlandish given we have received no word on his rehab progress thus far.

And Dansby is the best C2 LB by far.

[Mr. Pink]

So let me get this straight.... becasue you think Peters will get over paid, you think Crowell will under perform?

Or do you think Crowell will suck because Kelsey does?

In '07 he was one of the top OLB in the game. He should be 100%. He is the best available cover 2. He knows our system. He knows the teammates. This is a no-brainer, IMO!

No, what I'm saying is that he's like the other recycled tired "talent" on this team.

Nothing special, around average and overrated by the fanbase.

To pay him top 10 money simply because there isn't someone else better is poor business procedure.

I guess we differ on how much we value his on the field production. You think he's great, I think he's average.

That's my basis, we've gone too long overspending on average. Which is why we're in the rut we've been in for the past decade.

[yordad]

Micro-Fracture surgery is not easy to recover from, your notion that he will be back at 100% is rather outlandish given we have received no word on his rehab progress thus far.

And Dansby is the best C2 LB by far.Yeah a year isn't enough time for a surgury that had a 4 month time table. No wait.... 12 months is longer then 4.

No, what I'm saying is that he's like the other recycled tired "talent" on this team.

Nothing special, around average and overrated by the fanbase.

To pay him top 10 money simply because there isn't someone else better is poor business procedure.

I guess we differ on how much we value his on the field production. You think he's great, I think he's average.

That's my basis, we've gone too long overspending on average. Which is why we're in the rut we've been in for the past decade.I would really LOVE to hear your off season plan. LOVE TO. Either you will leave us with gapping holes, or you will have us paying someone who isn't as good even more.

Production? He was top 2 in tackles for an OLB in '07. Production!!!

[DraftBoy]

Yeah a year isn't enough time for a surgury that had a 4 month time table. No wait.... 12 months is longer then 4.


The 4 month timetable was on the groin injury not the micro-fracture surgery. You are now purposely misrepresenting the facts to make your point.

[THATHURMANATOR]

I would ok with Re signing Crowell to a managable salary but not Tranisition tagging him. He is not a top 10 LB.

[Owen DeBoard]

The 4 month timetable was on the groin injury not the micro-fracture surgery. You are now purposely misrepresenting the facts to make your point.
I didnt know he had a groin injury I thought it was his knee.

[yordad]

The 4 month timetable was on the groin injury not the micro-fracture surgery. You are now purposely misrepresenting the facts to make your point.



CB: Angelo did undergo surgery and the last I heard was to be recovered by mid-January. Huh? You were saying?

[Mr. Pink]

Yeah a year isn't enough time for a surgury that had a 4 month time table. No wait.... 12 months is longer then 4.
I would really LOVE to hear your off season plan. LOVE TO. Either you will leave us with gapping holes, or you will have us paying someone who isn't as good even more.

Production? He was top 2 in tackles for an OLB in '07. Production!!!

Just because you have huge stats doesn't mean you're the man.

Look at what Fletch did here for an example.

How's this D'Qwell Jackson lead the NFL in tackles this year for the Browns. He's alright, but nothing special. Would you say D'Qwell is the top LB in the NFL?

Same with Crow. He's alright, but nothing special.

Plus he's now coming off major surgery where he may or he may not be at the level he was before.

Risk vs Reward dictates that no way you can make that move alone.

[yordad]

I would ok with Re signing Crowell to a managable salary but not Tranisition tagging him. He is not a top 10 LB.Top 10 OLB. How about top 10 COVER 2 OLB. How about the raise in players pay? Is Urlacker even making top 10?

His value to us is top 10. There aren't 10 other LBs in the entire league that can do for us what Crowell did in '07. He is a friggin' beast! How did you not miss him this year? How many friggin tackles did Ellison even make?

How else do you people plan to plug this giant hole?

I have an idea. Take the guy that fits our system best, and get him for less then what others would be willing to pay. Common sense.

[THATHURMANATOR]

Why the hard on for Crowell man. He never really blew me away when healthy.

[Mr. Pink]

I have no problem with bringing Crow back if....

We sign him to a minimal salary, say 2 million and have it based highly on incentives.

But to pay him top 10 LB money is REDICULOUS!

[THATHURMANATOR]

I have no problem with bringing Crow back if....

We sign him to a minimal salary, say 2 million and have it based highly on incentives.

But to pay him top 10 LB money is REDICULOUS!
Thom you are right on here! :hi5:

[yordad]

Just because you have huge stats doesn't mean you're the man.

Look at what Fletch did here for an example.

How's this D'Qwell Jackson lead the NFL in tackles this year for the Browns. He's alright, but nothing special. Would you say D'Qwell is the top LB in the NFL?

Same with Crow. He's alright, but nothing special.

Plus he's now coming off major surgery where he may or he may not be at the level he was before.

Risk vs Reward dictates that no way you can make that move alone.
And your suggestion? Still waiting for that? I'm sure your plan for B-lo includes finding 6 starters in the draft, right?

[DraftBoy]

I didnt know he had a groin injury I thought it was his knee.


You're correct, but it was intially a scope job not micro fracture, Im thinking of somebody else.

[Mr. Pink]

And your suggestion? Still waiting for that? I'm sure your plan for B-lo includes finding 6 starters in the draft, right?

Sign Karlos Dansby.

Draft Mauluga and move Poz outside.

Sign Mike Peterson and move Poz outside.

Sign Vilma and move Poz outside.

There's always just as good, if not better, alternatives to wasting money.

Or re-sign Crow to an incentive laden deal that's much easier on the cap especially if he hasn't fully recovered from his injury.

[yordad]

Why the hard on for Crowell man. He never really blew me away when healthy.2 words: Keith Ellison.

[DraftBoy]

Huh? You were saying?

When CB gets his PhD call me. I dont know of anybody who has come back from micro-fracture surgery in 4 months, can you name even one??

[Mr. Pink]

http://sports.yahoo.com/nfl/news?slug=ap-seahawks-jonessurgery&prov=ap&type=lgns

Walter Jones had the same surgery recently...It's a 4-6 month recovery times with a 6-9 month timetable for returning to competition.

"The generally understood recovery time for such a procedure calls for running to begin in four to six months, with a return to competition in six to nine months. "

So he had the surgery when back in september? He could be recovered in January or March, depending on the extent or his ability to heal. Which means he'll be ready to take drills, practice, etc in either March to June.

[THATHURMANATOR]

2 words: Keith Ellison.
Right he is better than Ellison, assuming he has fully healed. Read Yay's post right above this. Transition tagging a guy coming of micro fracture surgery is beyond dumb.

[Mr. Pink]

Right he is better than Ellison, assuming he has fully healed. Read Yay's post right above this. Transition tagging a guy coming of micro fracture surgery is beyond dumb.

It can take longer too than what I posted above...

KII had microfracture surgery as well...took him about a year and while he's an awesome TE in the league, I still don't think he's anywhere near the beast he was in college.

So, while you can heal in the 4-6 months and be ready to return to competition in 6-9....it doesn't mean you'll be the same player.

[THATHURMANATOR]

Yordad doesn't want to hear us man... :ill:

[Mr. Pink]

Yordad doesn't want to hear us man... :ill:


I'll keep posting more info anyways!!!

"Many well-known NFL players have undergone microfracture surgery. Not only do Tony Brackens, Courtney Brown, Stephen Davis, Terrell Davis, DeShaun Foster, Jeremy Newberry and Andre Wadsworth have the procedure in common, but they also are often remembering for knee injuries hampering or ending their careers. Former Seattle Seahawks defensive lineman Lamar King's career was entirely derailed from the surgery.

In the NBA, Chris Webber reportedly stated that a four-month recovery time is "impossible" and that it took him at least a few years to feel "like himself" again. Amare Stoudemire underwent microfracture surgery in October 2005, and after trying to return in March 2006 he began feeling stiffness in both knees before being forced to sit out until the 2006-07 season. He only played 56 games before being shut down for the year with cleanup surgery on the same knee."

http://www.kffl.com/article.php/64665/74

[yordad]

Sign Karlos Dansby.

Draft Mauluga and move Poz outside.

Sign Mike Peterson and move Poz outside.

Sign Vilma and move Poz outside.

There's always just as good, if not better, alternatives to wasting money.

Or re-sign Crow to an incentive laden deal that's much easier on the cap especially if he hasn't fully recovered from his injury.If you draft a first round LB, you don't get to draft a first round DE!

Crowell outside, based on everything I've seen so far, is much better then I project Poz would be outside. So, in signing Peterson you buy one of the most expensive available FAs one who isn't familiar with the cover 2, and don't really upgrade much, if any.

Dansby is the only other acceptable alternative IMO. So, your acceptable alternative is getting into a bidding war for an OLB that we likely won't sign. Of course this is AFTER we let Crowell get away, so we will either waste a high pic on OLB, ignoring DE, or we draft a DE and have Ellison fight it out with a later round pick.

No freakin way. If we trans tag Crowell, no head ache. No limbo. No uh-ohs. And it is only a one year deal. We have a year to focus on our other gapping holes, and grab a OLB next year.

[Ingtar33]

Dansby is a great, dirty, and stupid player.

That said i'd love to see someone with that attitude in a Bills uni.

[DraftBoy]

Dansby is a great, dirty, and stupid player.
That said i'd love to see someone with that attitude in a Bills uni.


Completely agree and I really would love him here!

[justasportsfan]

I actually wanted Rodney Harrison here for the same reason but instead the Pats brought him in . :ill:

[yordad]

Right he is better than Ellison, assuming he has fully healed. Read Yay's post right above this. Transition tagging a guy coming of micro fracture surgery is beyond dumb.I read that. January is in like 2 days. I assume your calander was suck. That means we have a couple days or 240ish until next year.