Is Trent really a dink and dunk QB? [Archive] - BillsZone.com

View Full Version : Is Trent really a dink and dunk QB?

The Spaz

03-17-2009, 02:50 PM

I was trying to find the QB averages per attempt and came across this article. I still haven't seen a full list so if anyone can post it that would be great. In the newest Lee Evans interview at BB.com it was said Trent has either a 7.24 yard or 7.34 yard average. Here is the article:

When Paying Attention in the Offseason Pays Off: QB Yards Per Attempt Average

The average fantasy football owner believes the offseason means they can finally take time off—but let the Bruno Boys tell you, the offseason is perhaps more important towards your chances for fantasy gold than your in-season management.

And, it's not just paying attention to the major moves that make headlines. Nope, it's digging deep and paying attention to the little things that really pay off big.

With that being the case, the Bruno Boys are here to show you when paying attention in the offseason pays off!

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/128124-when-paying-attention-in-the-off-season-pays-off-qb-yards-per-attempt-average

DrGraves

03-17-2009, 02:57 PM

Remember MNF against the Browns... all he did was take the snap and immediately throw to the RB coming out of the flat... he was terrified to even look down field at any of the WRs.

OpIv37

03-17-2009, 02:58 PM

well, it's a dink and dunk system. The coaches need to show more faith in him, and he needs to give them reason to have faith.

The Spaz

03-17-2009, 02:59 PM

Remember MNF against the Browns... all he did was take the snap and immediately throw to the RB coming out of the flat... he was terrified to even look down field at any of the WRs.

No question he did I'm just saying on average it doesn't really say that it is. H edoes do it I'm just saying it may not be as often as most make it out to be or think.

The Spaz

03-17-2009, 02:59 PM

Nice try.

Edwards has 7.2 yards per COMPLETION, not yards per ATTEMPT. They're two different things

http://www.buffalobills.com/team/roster/Trent-Edwards/26db3ddb-7753-4604-ac7f-eb78856a889a

What do you mean nice try? That's not what the article says.

OpIv37

03-17-2009, 03:00 PM

What do you mean nice try? That's not what the article says.

I fixed it.

I was looking at the stats and I read it wrong. My bad.

justasportsfan

03-17-2009, 03:12 PM

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/players/splits?playerId=10536

Check out his throws to behind the LOS to 1-10 yards out. I'm a little too busy to compare to other dink and dunk qb's.

mayotm

03-17-2009, 03:14 PM

Remember MNF against the Browns... all he did was take the snap and immediately throw to the RB coming out of the flat... he was terrified to even look down field at any of the WRs.That's fair. Lets judge his entire career based on his worst game.

theanswer74

03-17-2009, 03:17 PM

Remember MNF against the Browns... all he did was take the snap and immediately throw to the RB coming out of the flat... he was terrified to even look down field at any of the WRs.
Immediately is not true, he held the ball forever looking downfield.

How can someone say something so false.

The Spaz

03-17-2009, 03:22 PM

Here is another article I found.

http://www.buffalorumblings.com/2009/1/30/737276/2008-buffalo-bills-yards-p

TacklingDummy

03-17-2009, 03:23 PM

Sorry but I don't have much faith in Trent to get the ball to TO or Evans down field.

jamze132

03-17-2009, 03:25 PM

Let's not forget, our O-line is a human swinging door. It's not like he has enough time, most of the time to throw the ball downfield.

OpIv37

03-17-2009, 03:28 PM

Let's not forget, our O-line is a human swinging door. It's not like he has enough time, most of the time to throw the ball downfield.

That's partially true. There were times when our OL was bad. But there were just as many times when Trent or JP held the ball too long. He needs to go through his reads quicker and make a decision.

Jan Reimers

03-17-2009, 03:32 PM

Trent appears to be more comfortable with the short stuff. Maybe that will change with TO lining up opposite Evans.

madness

03-17-2009, 03:43 PM

Here is another article I found.

http://www.buffalorumblings.com/2009/1/30/737276/2008-buffalo-bills-yards-p

Conclusions
What does this tell us? Well it tells me that as much as we might get on Schonert's case, he was much better at what he did than Steve Fairchild was. (I'm not surprised. Are you?) Not that that's saying much. Fairchild's teams never got close to that YPA number we achieved last year. The plays Turk called and the offense's execution made the passing numbers significantly better all across the board. In addition to the big jump in yards per attempt, we threw for 366 more passing yards, 2 more scores, and Trent's passer rating was 15 points higher. We also threw for 26 more first downs in 2008 than we did in 2007. (Just for you power rushing guys like me, we also rushed for more yards in 2008, twice as many rushing TDs, higher yards per rushing attempt, and more rushing first downs, too.)

Progression and consistency, the two things you want to see from a young player, first time OC, offense, defense, team, etc...

The progression is obvious when you look at our offense and defense the past couple years and I expect to see more of it this year. Now if this team can finally be consistent, we'd win a whole lot more ball games.

madness

03-17-2009, 03:49 PM

I like this guys case for Air Yards as a stat...

Air Yards 2008 (http://www.advancednflstats.com/2009/01/air-yards-2008.html)
Trying to measure individual performance in football is nearly impossible. Perhaps kickers are the only players whose performance we can isolate from the rest of his team. The position in a distant second might be the quarterback. But measuring QB performance with statistics is still very problematic. Consider this tale of two QBs.

One quarterback led his team to a 12-4 regular season record after starting slow at 3-3. He won the Associated Press's MVP award. Another quarterback was replaced due to ineffectiveness early in the season by an aging journeyman best known for headbutting a stadium wall. Which one would you want on your team? You wouldn't be able to tell from their official stats.

Although one didn't play the entire season, both passers had nearly identical "per attempt stats." The first QB threw for 7.2 yards per attempt and the second QB threw for 7.1. They both had a 95 NFL passer rating. Actually, Tavaris Jackson's was 95.4 and Peyton Manning's was 95. But then again, I might be able to approach a 95 rating if I were throwing dump-offs to Adrian Peterson.

If football were a brand new invention, and we had to decide how to credit the various amounts of yards gained to various players, how would we do it? If I said, "There's this kind of play called a pass, in which a thrower passes the ball to a another player who then runs with it as far as he can. I say we credit all the yards run by the receiver to the thrower." You'd say I was nuts.

I'd say, "Well, it takes a special kind of talent for a passer to get a lot of yardage after the catch (YAC). I won't be able to prove it, in fact, I won't have any evidence for that statement at all, but I still think our primary measure of a passer should include all those yards." I'd be laughed at.

....

Here is how the 2008 regular season Air Yard stats break out. Click on the table headers to sort.

<TABLE class=sortable style="BORDER-RIGHT: 1px solid; BORDER-TOP: 1px solid; BORDER-LEFT: 1px solid; WIDTH: 400px; BORDER-BOTTOM: 1px solid; BORDER-COLLAPSE: collapse" align=center border=1><THEAD><TR style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: rgb(170,213,255)"><TD class=headhover style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">Rank</TD><TD class=headhover style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">Name</TD><TD class=headhover style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">Team</TD><TD class=headhover style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">Yds</TD><TD class=headhover style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">YAC</TD><TD class=headhover style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">YAC%</TD><TD class=headhover style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">AY/Att</TD></TR></THEAD><COLGROUP><COL id=colorcol style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: rgb(255,255,224)"><COL><COL><COL><COL><COL><COL id=colorcol style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: rgb(255,255,224)"><TBODY></TBODY><TBODY><TR class=myClass><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">1</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">Delhomme</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">http://static.nfl.com/static/site/img/teams/CAR/CAR_logo-20x20.gif</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">3288</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">1269</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">39</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">4.9</TD></TR><TR class=myClass><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">2</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">Ryan</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">http://static.nfl.com/static/site/img/teams/ATL/ATL_logo-20x20.gif</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">3440</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">1404</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">41</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">4.7</TD></TR><TR class=myClass><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">3</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">Rivers</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">http://static.nfl.com/static/site/img/teams/SD/SD_logo-20x20.gif</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">4009</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">1840</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">46</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">4.5</TD></TR><TR class=myClass><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">4</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">Rodgers</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">http://static.nfl.com/static/site/img/teams/GB/GB_logo-20x20.gif</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">4038</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">1652</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">41</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">4.5</TD></TR><TR class=myClass><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">5</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">Pennington</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">http://static.nfl.com/static/site/img/teams/MIA/MIA_logo-20x20.gif</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">3653</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">1546</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">42</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">4.4</TD></TR><TR class=myClass><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">6</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">Rosenfels</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">http://static.nfl.com/static/site/img/teams/HOU/HOU_logo-20x20.gif</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">1431</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">664</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">46</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">4.4</TD></TR><TR class=myClass><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">7</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">Cutler</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">http://static.nfl.com/static/site/img/teams/DEN/DEN_logo-20x20.gif</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">4526</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">1881</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">42</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">4.3</TD></TR><TR class=myClass><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">8</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">Manning P</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">http://static.nfl.com/static/site/img/teams/IND/IND_logo-20x20.gif</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">4002</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">1627</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">41</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">4.3</TD></TR><TR class=myClass><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">9</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">Manning E</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">http://static.nfl.com/static/site/img/teams/NYG/NYG_logo-20x20.gif</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">3238</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">1220</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">38</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">4.2</TD></TR><TR class=myClass><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">10</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">Brees</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">http://static.nfl.com/static/site/img/teams/NO/NO_logo-20x20.gif</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">5069</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">2398</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">47</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">4.2</TD></TR><TR class=myClass><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">11</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">Romo</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">http://static.nfl.com/static/site/img/teams/DAL/DAL_logo-20x20.gif</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">3448</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">1578</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">46</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">4.2</TD></TR><TR class=myClass><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">12</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">Schaub</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">http://static.nfl.com/static/site/img/teams/HOU/HOU_logo-20x20.gif</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">3043</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">1470</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">48</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">4.1</TD></TR><TR class=myClass><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">13</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">Roethlisberger</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">http://static.nfl.com/static/site/img/teams/PIT/PIT_logo-20x20.gif</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">3301</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">1368</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">41</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">4.1</TD></TR><TR class=myClass><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">14</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">Warner</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">http://static.nfl.com/static/site/img/teams/ARI/ARI_logo-20x20.gif</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">4583</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">2173</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">47</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">4.0</TD></TR><TR class=myClass><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">15</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">Hill</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">http://static.nfl.com/static/site/img/teams/SF/SF_logo-20x20.gif</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">2046</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">895</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">44</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">4.0</TD></TR><TR class=myClass><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">16</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">Garrard</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">http://static.nfl.com/static/site/img/teams/JAC/JAC_logo-20x20.gif</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">3620</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">1494</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">41</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">4.0</TD></TR><TR class=myClass><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">17</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">Garcia</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">http://static.nfl.com/static/site/img/teams/TB/TB_logo-20x20.gif</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">2712</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">1248</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">46</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">3.9</TD></TR><TR class=myClass><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">18</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">Edwards</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">http://static.nfl.com/static/site/img/teams/BUF/BUF_logo-20x20.gif</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">2699</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">1266</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">47</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">3.8</TD></TR><TR class=myClass><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">19</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">Orlovsky</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">http://static.nfl.com/static/site/img/teams/DET/DET_logo-20x20.gif</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">1616</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">652</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">40</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">3.8</TD></TR><TR class=myClass><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">20</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">Frerotte</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">http://static.nfl.com/static/site/img/teams/MIN/MIN_logo-20x20.gif</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">2157</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">1023</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">47</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">3.8</TD></TR><TR class=myClass><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">21</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">Jackson</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">http://static.nfl.com/static/site/img/teams/MIN/MIN_logo-20x20.gif</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">1056</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">502</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">48</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">3.7</TD></TR><TR class=myClass><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">22</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">McNabb</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">http://static.nfl.com/static/site/img/teams/PHI/PHI_logo-20x20.gif</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">3916</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">1805</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">46</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">3.7</TD></TR><TR class=myClass><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">23</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">Hasselbeck</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">http://static.nfl.com/static/site/img/teams/SEA/SEA_logo-20x20.gif</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">1216</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">451</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">37</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">3.7</TD></TR><TR class=myClass><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">24</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">O'Sullivan</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">http://static.nfl.com/static/site/img/teams/SF/SF_logo-20x20.gif</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">1678</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">887</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">53</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">3.6</TD></TR><TR class=myClass><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">25</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">Flacco</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">http://static.nfl.com/static/site/img/teams/BAL/BAL_logo-20x20.gif</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">2971</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">1433</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">48</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">3.6</TD></TR><TR class=myClass><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">26</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">Thigpen</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">http://static.nfl.com/static/site/img/teams/KC/KC_logo-20x20.gif</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">2608</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">1101</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">42</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">3.6</TD></TR><TR class=myClass><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">27</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">Russell</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">http://static.nfl.com/static/site/img/teams/OAK/OAK_logo-20x20.gif</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">2423</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">1143</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">47</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">3.5</TD></TR><TR class=myClass><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">28</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">Collins</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">http://static.nfl.com/static/site/img/teams/TEN/TEN_logo-20x20.gif</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">2676</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">1292</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">48</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">3.3</TD></TR><TR class=myClass><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">29</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">Orton</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">http://static.nfl.com/static/site/img/teams/CHI/CHI_logo-20x20.gif</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">2972</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">1450</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">49</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">3.3</TD></TR><TR class=myClass><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">30</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">Favre</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">http://static.nfl.com/static/site/img/teams/NYJ/NYJ_logo-20x20.gif</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">3472</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">1779</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">51</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">3.2</TD></TR><TR class=myClass><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">31</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">Quinn</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">http://static.nfl.com/static/site/img/teams/CLE/CLE_logo-20x20.gif</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">518</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">230</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">44</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">3.2</TD></TR><TR class=myClass><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">32</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">Wallace</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">http://static.nfl.com/static/site/img/teams/SEA/SEA_logo-20x20.gif</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">1532</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">755</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">49</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">3.2</TD></TR><TR class=myClass><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">33</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">Griese</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">http://static.nfl.com/static/site/img/teams/TB/TB_logo-20x20.gif</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">1073</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">488</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">45</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">3.2</TD></TR><TR class=myClass><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">34</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">Anderson</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">http://static.nfl.com/static/site/img/teams/CLE/CLE_logo-20x20.gif</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">1615</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">724</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">45</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">3.1</TD></TR><TR class=myClass><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">35</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">Bulger</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">http://static.nfl.com/static/site/img/teams/STL/STL_logo-20x20.gif</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">2720</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">1336</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">49</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">3.1</TD></TR><TR class=myClass><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">36</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">Campbell</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">http://static.nfl.com/static/site/img/teams/WAS/WAS_logo-20x20.gif</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">3245</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">1686</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">52</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">3.1</TD></TR><TR class=myClass><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">37</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">Cassel</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">http://static.nfl.com/static/site/img/teams/NE/NE_logo-20x20.gif</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">3693</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">2116</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">57</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">3.1</TD></TR><TR class=myClass><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">38</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">Palmer</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">http://static.nfl.com/static/site/img/teams/CIN/CIN_logo-20x20.gif</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">731</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">358</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">49</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">2.9</TD></TR><TR class=myClass><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">39</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">Fitzpatrick</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">http://static.nfl.com/static/site/img/teams/CIN/CIN_logo-20x20.gif</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">1905</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">848</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">45</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">2.8</TD></TR><TR class=myClass><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">40</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">Losman</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">http://static.nfl.com/static/site/img/teams/BUF/BUF_logo-20x20.gif</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">584</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">294</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">50</TD><TD style="PADDING-RIGHT: 3px; PADDING-LEFT: 3px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 3px; PADDING-TOP: 3px; TEXT-ALIGN: center">2.8</TD></TR></TBODY>

justasportsfan

03-17-2009, 03:51 PM

Buffalo QBs threw 118 vertical (11 yds or more) passes in 2008, which was the second-lowest total in the league.

http://www.billszone.com/fanzone/showthread.php?t=171982

Philagape

03-17-2009, 03:56 PM

Trent went through a three-game stretch where his confidence was visibly shaken and he was hesitant to open up. That stretch is NOT indicative of what he's capable of doing and has done for a majority of his career so far.
I remember when he first started as a rookie, I thought, Wow, that's what a medium pass looks like. His strength is the intermediate, 10-20 yard strikes. For years the Bills haven't had the horses to be dangerous at anything more than that. All JP did was short stuff and bombs, most of which didn't work.
It's been a dink-and-dunk offense, and the proof of that was when JP took over late last year. He couldn't/wouldn't throw long either. Against the Jets he averaged 6.1 yards ... per COMPLETION. :ill:
We'll find out this year with TO who was responsible.

justasportsfan

03-17-2009, 03:58 PM

Philagape

03-17-2009, 04:02 PM

Although one didn't play the entire season, both passers had nearly identical "per attempt stats." The first QB threw for 7.2 yards per attempt and the second QB threw for 7.1. They both had a 95 NFL passer rating. Actually, Tavaris Jackson's was 95.4 and Peyton Manning's was 95. But then again, I might be able to approach a 95 rating if I were throwing dump-offs to Adrian Peterson.

Wow thank you for another example of why conventional passing stats are garbage

MPN

03-17-2009, 04:15 PM

Is Trent a dink and dunk passer? Based on what he has shown so far, no...I do not belive he is. He has shown the ability to throw a wicked accurate intermediate pass. He has also shown the ability to put nice touch on the deep pass, rare as it has been.

Yes his confidence seemed to be lacking for a stretch at the end of the season and we couldn't get the ball downfield. I am however, willing to wait and see what Trent can manage now that Lee isn't doubled everytime he tries to go downfield. Until I see what happens with TO in the offense as a 2nd legit weapon, I am going to chalk up last years dink and dunk to the system.

jmb1099

03-17-2009, 05:01 PM

His confidence level was visibly different after the concussion. That being said, to say he is a dink and dunk kind of guy isn't accurate. There are quite a few examples of him tossing a beautiful long ball. He doesn't have the cannon Jeff George Jr has and probably never will. I wish he had a canon like that, but what he does have isn't as bad as some on this board like to make it out to be.
Furthermore, who other than Evans was capable of spreading the field? Royal? Reed? This will be the first time in a long time we have even had more than one deep threat in what nearly 10 years?
If we fix the line, and that is looking more and more like a big if, and Owens shows up to play, the deep ball will be a legitimate threat.

TigerJ

03-17-2009, 05:18 PM

Edwards clearly likes to make decisions quickly, and that translates to a lot of underneath passes. He does however have a decent arm, and I think he has at least the potential to make passes downfield a reasonable percentage of the time as he gains experience, assuming the offensive line gives him reason to be confident.

acehole

03-17-2009, 06:03 PM

Well there is a difference between can and will.

He has good not great arm stregth.

He likes the short throws for a few reasons..

1. Durability.
It takes time for intermediate or long route to develop...that causes breakdowns in pass blocking and he siply does not want to get hit. I know some of your ears cry to hear that he has a hisory of getting hurt and when I brough that up when he was drafted I was called a licker. We see now that that is a real concern. Knowbody knows it more then him.

2. Confidence.
You do what you are comfortable doing. The short pass has been his game always...just like you cant make a strong arm guy into a dink and duck guy you cant make a dink and dunk guy into a strong arm guy...a pocket passer into a scrambler and so forth....We have a history of drafting guys who have a good skill set in one area and try to make then into somthing they are not. This time they got trent because they like his skill set for this system. I understand we cant rely on longer passes in the winter months because they are not easy to do in Buffalo weather that time of year. So we are built for running the ball and the short pass. I understand it but I dont agree 100% as it is easier to defend this type of system. Trent is not comfortable with his long ball accuracy because he is not that good at it and he is affaid to make a mistake as he is not that kind of qb. Even though Turk has Longer ball plays in the play book if you notice most of the time only one player goes long one goes medium and on goes 3 feet. Trent has a propensity to hit the guy going 3 feet...even though open guys waive thier hands that they are open.

In conclusion with time and experience he will hopfully start to hit those medium and longer routes...he will have to to survive in the end as defenses will bring the safties up to stop the run and tee off on him...and that will take away 80% of the offense. I believe that is what happend to him after the winning streak and what I call the Trent slide of 2008. Part of the failure of Trent and the 2008 offence is not all Trents fault. When Lee Evans is your only real threat...defenses double that guy and bring a safty up to help with marshaw...and you have stopped the vaulted "None Redzone" offense of the 2008 Buffalo Bills. With the additon of TO and a guy like Sheffer , petigrew or Owen Daniels...deffenses have to do a better job of accounting for those playmakers. Even Josh Reed/parish should have better production as a result.
Parish against a # 3 or 4 corner would be sick thought.

Is Trent Really a dink and dunk QB?

He still is as we speak...but if he can trust his receivers more...and we get more of them that will change (in theory).

This is why we now appear to have a vanilla Deffense.

We really dont...but when you play from behind
most of the time you cant bring the house or call
certain defenses.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/players/splits?playerId=10536

Check out his throws to behind the LOS to 1-10 yards out. I'm a little too busy to compare to other dink and dunk qb's.

bflobarry

03-17-2009, 07:54 PM

Remember MNF against the Browns... all he did was take the snap and immediately throw to the RB coming out of the flat... he was terrified to even look down field at any of the WRs.
Why would you immediately default to the guys worst game? Why not his best game? He's was a SOPHOMORE last year. NY was ready to run off Eli after his third year. Trent will be better than good. Let him grow into it.

justasportsfan

03-17-2009, 10:09 PM

"Buffalo QBs threw 118 vertical (11 yds or more) passes in 2008, which was the second-lowest total in the league."

well madness?

Captain gameboy

03-18-2009, 03:44 AM

mybills

03-18-2009, 06:42 AM

Yes, he can throw it long.
Yes, that's not too often.
Yes, he needs a line that will give him the confidence to throw it long.
Yes, the coaches don't always call for bombs.
Yes, I think they will this year because of Lee/TO.
Yes, I think Trent will be able to handle it if they do, and if he has the line.
No, I don't think he'll have the line, and I expect to see him get sacked often.

Mahdi

03-18-2009, 07:31 AM

Kenny

03-18-2009, 07:34 AM

I love how NFL folks and fans are so fickle.

I distinctly remember during last season when ESPN analyst Mark Schlereth said that Trent Edwards may throw the best long ball in the NFL, and Turk discussing Trent's unique ability to drop it down a chimney.

Prior to Arizona of course.

You mean prior to playing any good teams right?

I know Trent was money in the 4th quarter early in the season, but looking back, and I know hindsight is 20/20, but other than those comebacks late in the game (which I know is definately a positive), I dont think he really performed well at all. Seattle and Oakland were terrible games for Trent until the last quarter, and the St Louis game was saved by Greer.

And then after the concussion we got to see the Trent to Lynch/Jackson show.

Mahdi

03-18-2009, 07:37 AM

Philagape

03-18-2009, 07:46 AM

Attempts and completions for passes over 11 yards: Edwards vs Cutler

Trent Edwards

Pass Att. 11-20 84 130

Pass Att. 21-30 61 90

Pass Att. 31+ 15 21

Jay Cutler

Pass Att. 11-20 106 160

Pass Att. 21-30 87 147

Pass Att. 31+ 88 149

Those aren't yards, those are numbers of attempts. ... first 10 attempts of the game, second 10 attempts, etc.

The yards are listed under "by pass play"

The Spaz

03-18-2009, 07:46 AM

Attempts and completions for passes over 11 yards: Edwards vs Cutler

Trent Edwards

Pass Att. 11-20 84 130

Pass Att. 21-30 61 90

Pass Att. 31+ 15 21

Jay Cutler

Pass Att. 11-20 106 160

Pass Att. 21-30 87 147

Pass Att. 31+ 88 149

You do know that Cutler threw the ball 616 times compared to Edwards 374 right?

Mahdi

03-18-2009, 07:48 AM

Those aren't yards, those are numbers of attempts. ... first 10 attempts of the game, second 10 attempts, etc.

The yards are listed under "by pass play"
Im not saying it has to do with yards. Its how many times each QB attempts a throw over the indicated distance.

Wait ok I get it,,,, thanks.

Philagape

03-18-2009, 07:50 AM

Im not saying it has to do with yards. Its how many times each QB attempts a throw over the indicated distance.

But those are not distances. Those are numbers of attempts during a game.

Philagape

03-18-2009, 07:58 AM

This is what you're looking for:

Edwards
Pass thrown: Behind line 52 67
Pass thrown: 1-10 yards 134 202
Pass thrown: 11-20 yards 46 77
Pass thrown: 21-30 yards 9 19
Pass thrown: 31-40 yards 3 8
Pass thrown: 41+ yards 1 1

Cutler
Pass thrown: Behind line 77 95
Pass thrown: 1-10 yards 198 285
Pass thrown: 11-20 yards 82 156
Pass thrown: 21-30 yards 23 53
Pass thrown: 31-40 yards 2 19
Pass thrown: 41+ yards 2 8

Captain gameboy

03-18-2009, 08:00 AM

You mean prior to playing any good teams right?

That really doesn't have anything to do with his ability to throw.

He either can or he can't.

Just like a pitcher, his throwing ability is not impacted by who he plays, though the results would be different.

Mahdi

03-18-2009, 08:03 AM

Trent Edwards:

Pass thrown:

11-20 46-77

21-30 9-19

31-40 3-8

41+ 1-1

I realize Trent threw less than Cutler so we can look at %. Trent attempted throws over 11 yards 28% of the time.

Jay Cutler

11-20 82-156

21-30 23-53

31-40 2-19

41+ 2-8

Cutler attempted throws over 11 yards 38% of the time.

Philagape

03-18-2009, 08:25 AM

JP Losman attempted throws over 11 yards 18% of the time. (19 out of 104)

That's not to compare him to anyone, but he's a more daring, strong-armed QB, and he threw short a lot more than Trent did in this offense. That suggests the offense was a big reason for it.

Billiever86

03-18-2009, 08:59 AM

He doesnt throw the ball down the field enough...what other than a dink an dunk QB fits that profile?

trent has that number....because of YAC

Billiever86

03-18-2009, 09:04 AM

You do know that Cutler threw the ball 616 times compared to Edwards 374 right?

did you know if jay cutler threw 313 times...thats half of his throws..less than trents 374..cutler would still have more than triple the amount of 31+ yard throw attempts than edwards.....

my god that says something

malvado78

03-18-2009, 09:13 AM

How about we look at complete percentage in each range. Updates in Blue

Trent Edwards:

Pass thrown:

11-20 46-77 60%
21-30 9-19 47%
31-40 3-8 38%
41+ 1-1 100%
Total Percent 56%

I realize Trent threw less than Cutler so we can look at %. Trent attempted throws over 11 yards 28% of the time.

Jay Cutler

11-20 82-156 53%
21-30 23-53 43%
31-40 2-19 11%
41+ 2-8 25%
Total Percent 46%

Cutler attempted throws over 11 yards 38% of the time.

So while Cutler throws more long balls. Edwards is significantly more accurate. Is this not an indication of a "better" long ball thrower?

Mahdi

03-18-2009, 09:18 AM

How about we look at complete percentage in each range. Updates in Blue

So while Cutler throws more long balls. Edwards is significantly more accurate. Is this not an indication of a "better" long ball thrower?
When you have the guts and the trust in your arm to try them more often your comp.% will go down.

Edwards doesn't throw anything better than Cutler, not short and certainly not long.

psubills62

03-18-2009, 09:35 AM

Lynch and Jackson had some good YAC that brought Trent's YPA up.

And no other QB has players that do that either?

The Spaz

03-18-2009, 09:51 AM

did you know if jay cutler threw 313 times...thats half of his throws..less than trents 374..cutler would still have more than triple the amount of 31+ yard throw attempts than edwards.....

my god that says something

What does that have to do with calling pass plays in general? Calling the plays is on the coordinator.

Mahdi

03-18-2009, 10:08 AM

And no other QB has players that do that either?
Edwards threw to his RBs/FBs 24% of the time. That is one of the highest percentages in the league.

HHURRICANE

03-18-2009, 10:10 AM

Edwards threw to his RBs/FBs 24% of the time. That is one of the highest percentages in the league.

Who was he going to throw to when Reed went down? A triple teamed Evans? Just curious?

jmb1099

03-18-2009, 10:19 AM

So does having only one legitimate deep threat have an effect on the numbers? Does the system?

jmb1099

03-18-2009, 10:20 AM

Who was he going to throw to when Reed went down? A triple teamed Evans? Just curious?
Exactly

Mahdi

03-18-2009, 10:21 AM

Who was he going to throw to when Reed went down? A triple teamed Evans? Just curious?
Point taken. Im just kinda throwing out numbers here. I know that Edwards had limitations on who he could throw to.

For me, the thing about Edwards is I HATE his throwing motion and how he doesn't throw with any authority.

HHURRICANE

03-18-2009, 10:47 AM

Point taken. Im just kinda throwing out numbers here. I know that Edwards had limitations on who he could throw to.

For me, the thing about Edwards is I HATE his throwing motion and how he doesn't throw with any authority.

Not to pick on you today but technically his throwing is excellent. He gets rid of the ball fast and has plenty of arm strength.

If he should be criticized, and he has admitted this himself, it's for not having enough confidence throwing down field.

However, with what we've had on the field I am willing to give him a pass. Owens should be a huge help to him.

The good news is that this is his make or break year.

Personally, I think he's going to be great but it's all in his hands this year.

jamze132

03-18-2009, 03:56 PM

That's partially true. There were times when our OL was bad. But there were just as many times when Trent or JP held the ball too long. He needs to go through his reads quicker and make a decision.
Let's not forget how hard it is to throw the ball to either a guy who is double covered (Evans), a guy who can't run a route (Parrish), or a guy who can't catch a cold (Royal).

Even if the QB has time, he spends it all trying to find an open receiver. It's no wonder he was hesitant last year and waiting for a guy to become clearly open instead of anticipating the route like he should. If Trent anticipates a route from Roscoe, you might as well keep your helmet on when you walk to the sideline because your team is about to receive the kickoff.

acehole

03-18-2009, 06:59 PM

Funny all the excuses we were not suppose to use.....being used by the people who said we couldnt use them.

jmb1099

03-18-2009, 08:32 PM

Funny all the excuses we were not suppose to use.....being used by the people who said we couldnt use them.
If JP was as good as we all hoped he was he would have been starting somewhere else by now.

acehole

03-18-2009, 09:10 PM

If JP was as good as we all hoped he was he would have been starting somewhere else by now.

Forget JP.

If Trent only had this and only had that.
I thought a qb was supose to be judged on his abilty and record.
and nothing maters...and excuses excuses....

The stats and 7-9 says it all.

Trent is our starting qb and for now it looks like I was right in my assesment of him from the start.

"A promising young qb who has yet to prove a thing"

I was also right in stating..
"A qb need to have certain things to make it including multiple weapons and a running game and protection.

Having said that I think Trent might put it together this year...if he cant with a TO and L Evans opposite...I think it would be time to pull the plugs...Bill Walsh endorsement or not.

jmb1099

03-18-2009, 10:05 PM

Forget JP.

If Trent only had this and only had that.
I thought a qb was supose to be judged on his abilty and record.
and nothing maters...and excuses excuses....

The stats and 7-9 says it all.

Trent is our starting qb and for now it looks like I was right in my assesment of him from the start.

"A promising young qb who has yet to prove a thing"

I was also right in stating..
"A qb need to have certain things to make it including multiple weapons and a running game and protection.

Having said that I think Trent might put it together this year...if he cant with a TO and L Evans opposite...I think it would be time to pull the plugs...Bill Walsh endorsement or not.
I agree that this is the year he either puts up or shuts up. If we can't make something happen with the weapons we have now then its time to move on. Your previous post alluded to the Losman wars here on the board and I get what you're saying. As of right now I agree, Edwards has a lot to prove and like you I think he might pull it together this year as well. Here's to hoping he does for all our sakes.

Wally The Barber

03-19-2009, 02:20 AM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_RMMG9hod6s&feature=related

feldspar

03-19-2009, 02:28 AM

Trent isn't really a dink and dunk QB, he just plays one on TV.

Seriously, Trent can make all the throws. That's not an issue.

LifetimeBillsFan

03-19-2009, 05:33 AM

Just a couple of points to consider:

1.) In talking about the Cutler-McDaniels situation in Denver, Herm Edwards made a point that there are two different kinds/styles of QB in the NFL and that, depending on what kind of team the HC prefers to have and what kind of defense the team has, one kind/style of QB may be a fit for that team and the other kind/style will not.

If the team is built to have a good defense and solid special teams the HC may prefer to have a QB who will take care of the ball, not turn it over, move the chains and be a good game manager, especially if the team has a good defense. (He cited Rex Ryan as this kind of HC, but I think that a lot of DCs who become HCs fall into this category, including Dick Jauron who has repeatedly talked about the need for the QB to limit mistakes and turnovers).

The other type of team is built to have a high-scoring offense and a prolific passing game. HCs whose teams are built along these lines, Edwards said, may prefer to have a QB, like Cutler, who is more of a swashbuckling type that will take chances with the ball and throw it all over the lot, not being concerned about turning the ball over occasionally. (Mike Shanahan would fall into this category, as would some of the OCs who have become HCs. Edwards said that, if they could get an offensive line to protect a guy like Cutler, the Lions are a team that could be built like this.)

I think that, in evaluating Trent Edwards, we have to take into account the type of team that has been built around him and what kind of QB he has been asked to be with the Bills. As I mentioned in parentheses above, Jauron is a defensive coach whose whole approach to the game has been to play good defense and special teams, get turnovers while limiting mistakes and turnovers on offense, and make enough plays to win games close.

Fans may not find this to be a very entertaining approach to the game, especially when they see some teams moving the ball all over the lot on offense, but there are a lot of coaches in the NFL, including B.Parcells, Cowher, etc., who are convinced that this is the best way to win games and that defense, not offense, ultimately wins championships.

2.) Before you condemn Trent Edwards for being a "dink-and-dunk" QB who checks down too often or Turk Schonert for being too conservative in his play-calling, go back and listen to Schonert's interview on BB.com. When asked about why Edwards didn't throw downfield more often, Schonert says that it wasn't that they didn't call the plays or that Trent didn't want to throw downfield, it was that very often the blocking wasn't there. He said that it wasn't a matter of the plays not being called, but the execution. In the interview, he reiterates the fact that the Bills have to do a lot better job of pass blocking.

While the Bills did not give up an inordinately high number of sacks, anyone who watched their games last season had to notice that Edwards got hit a LOT, not just in the Arizona game, even though he was dumping the ball off short quite often. If long pass routes were called, even if the WR was wide open, in many instances it would have been impossible for Edwards to hold onto the ball long enough to throw the ball deep without risking a sack or turnover.

Which takes us back to the "prime directive" that Edwards is operating under in Jauron's approach to the game: don't turn the ball over. If the word has been passed from the HC to the OC to Edwards that it is better for him to checkdown and get rid of the ball when he begins to feel pressure from the pass rush rather than hold onto the ball and risk a sack or fumble, can you really blame Trent for tossing the ball short, even if, at that instant, his WR is breaking open deep down the field?

I can't blame Edwards for doing what the coach wants him to do--protecting the ball and not taking the sack. Edwards is smart enough to know that, if he doesn't do what the HC wants in that situation, he is going to be sitting on the bench in short order. So, he has got to play the style of game that the HC wants him to play, whether he can play the other style or would prefer to play the other style or not.

3.) In evaluating Trent Edwards' potential as a NFL QB I have to throw out his performance in the three games that Josh Reed missed. Not only was it obvious that Reed was Edwards' "go-to-guy" on third downs early on in the season, it was even more obvious that no one stepped up to take Reed's place in that role when he went down and missed those three games. No one.

Without Reed, opposing defenses simply took Evans completely out of the game and put pressure on Edwards. If Edwards looked like a "deer in the headlights" and kept dumping the ball off short to his RBs in those games, it was because that was the only alternative he had to getting crunched by the pass rush. Indeed, that was when Edwards got hurt again, although he "toughed it out" to win the Denver game with Reed back in the lineup.

4.) Edwards is still developing as a QB and comparing him to Cutler, who has a full season more of experience, is like comparing apples to oranges. The Bills have been bringing Edwards along slowly and haven't asked or wanted Edwards to play the same style of game as Cutler. Look at what he is being asked to do and compare him with other QBs who were asked to do the same thing at a similar stage in their careers. Compare the team that he has had around him the last two seasons to the teams that those QBs had around them their first two seasons. Then, look at what kind of progress those QBs made during those seasons and afterwards and compare it to the progress that Edwards has made.

I understand why many Bills fans say that Edwards hasn't proven anything yet and have their doubts about him. I also understand why a lot of people also consider Edwards to be an up-and-coming young QB who has the potential to be a very good NFL QB. I think both have good reason to feel as they do.

This season could tell us a lot about Trent Edwards and his potential future as a NFL QB. However, I would caution those who are going to evaluate him based on his performance this season to keep two things in mind: 1.) do not expect him to throw the ball all over the lot, even with TO, and put up huge numbers this season--that is not the way that Jauron approaches the game: he wants his offense to put up points, but only if his QB doesn't make a lot of mistakes and turn the ball over and that's not going to change!, and 2.) Edwards isn't going to have a good season, stop dumping the ball off short, or put up decent numbers if he is getting hit, knocked on his butt or sacked just about every time he drops back to pass--the Bills must put a decent offensive line together to protect him this season or it will be impossible to fairly evaluate what Edwards (or any QB, for that matter) actually can do.

This last point is what really has me stymied at the moment. The Bills have players at the skilled positions that have the ability to make for a pretty good offense this season. But, they still have huge needs on their offensive line that will only become bigger if they do not find a way to satisfy Jason Peters before going into this season. And, they must fill those needs in a way that will allow them to protect Edwards better than they did last season if they are going to take advantage of the talents of the players that they have at the skilled positions.

I don't know that they can count on rookies to fill the needs that they currently have. While they know more about the abilities of their players than I do, I am not sure that the players that they presently have can adequately fill those needs and give them the improved performance that they require. And, I have no idea how they could possibly fill those need and the gaping hole that would be created were they to play a disgruntled Jason Peters again or, worse, be forced to trade him.

While there are still offensive linemen available who can help the Bills put together a solid offensive line and players that they can obtain in the draft who can make their offensive line even stronger, given the way that the Bills have dealt with Peters, especially after ostensibly cutting Dockery to save money so that they could give Peters a contract extension, I am beginning to have some serious doubts about the Bills' readiness to do what is necessary to give Edwards the kind of protection that will allow him to fully demonstrate what he is capable of as a QB this coming season.

I want to give the Bills' front office and coaching staff the benefit of the doubt, but, if they fail to put together an offensive line that can protect Edwards and open holes for the running game by Opening Day, it won't matter how good a QB Edwards is capable of being or that he has TO or that having TO should open up things for the running game. Nor will it be possible to make a fair evaluation of how good a QB Edwards is or can be (Steve Young was a bust playing behind a Tampa Bay O-line that couldn't protect him and a HOFer playing behind a San Francisco O-line that did!).

Personally, I don't think that Trent Edwards will ever become a big-time gun-slinger, but I think that he could become a very good game-manager type QB and could even put up big numbers if the Bills can put a good offensive line in front of him and surround him with some play-makers (doing that did wonders for Tom Brady!--and, before anyone goes nuts about the analogy, just remember what kind of offense the Pats ran when Brady first took over as a starter and how that offense evolved as he, the line and the playmakers all got better). Whether that will happen or not, though, is only partly up to him and perhaps will depend even more on what the Bills' front office and coaching staff does to improve the offensive line and skilled players around him.

Mahdi

03-19-2009, 07:20 AM

Not to pick on you today but technically his throwing is excellent. He gets rid of the ball fast and has plenty of arm strength.

If he should be criticized, and he has admitted this himself, it's for not having enough confidence throwing down field.

However, with what we've had on the field I am willing to give him a pass. Owens should be a huge help to him.

The good news is that this is his make or break year.

Personally, I think he's going to be great but it's all in his hands this year.
Well I dont agree.

He pushes his throws. He doesn't put his shoulder into his throws and it limits the kind of routes he can hit.

Watch Cutler or P. Manning throw and look specifically at their shoulders. Trent has a lot of work to do.

Mercy

03-19-2009, 08:00 AM

That really doesn't have anything to do with his ability to throw.
He either can or he can't.
Just like a pitcher, his throwing ability is not impacted by who he plays, though the results would be different.Of course it is. Not easy getting those throws off when you're being rushed or blitzed.

Bert102176

03-20-2009, 06:38 AM

trent is what ever the ****ty OC makes him and our coordinator is a ****ty one