Maybe TE isnt a quick fix need

[Mitchell55]

What I mean is after how well Fine showed himself as a reciever and blocker, why not give him the starting position this year and next year when Gresham comes out pick him if Fine does bad.

[Oaf]

I agree.
How do the Bills staff really feel about Kelsay and Ellison potentially starting for another year? I feel that if they use their 11th picks with no trades, they must actually be comfortable with one of those starting. I mean, suddenly we’re in the 2nd round and we don’t have an answer for our pass rush, a starting OLB, and a LG.


Without trading down, can we really afford a luxury like Pettigrew?? Let’s assume Peters is a wash, which is really the best case scenario. Either we keep him, or the pick we get for him is a rookie LT.


I would much rather deal with Fine who may turn out to be a player himself, or even Chambers at LG (he’s proven himself at the T’s, why not give it a shot?), then known substandard players in Kelsay and Ellison.

[Oaf]

Oh, 800 times thanked!

[seanbillsfan]

What I mean is after how well Fine showed himself as a reciever and blocker, why not give him the starting position this year and next year when Gresham comes out pick him if Fine does bad.
I actually agree with you somewhat. I dont believe that TE is a huge need now that we have Owens, we can concentrate on our D and our rediclous o-line in the draft. I dont think Fine is the long term answer but we could run alot 3 and 4 reciever sets this year

[Mitchell55]

Adding onto this.

Just get

1st- Maybin/Ayers
2nd- Unger C
3rd- Sen Derrick DT
4th- Hunt DE
5th- Follet LB
6th- Spillman S
7th- Possibly Bear TE

Than we are good

[Mitchell55]

Oh, 800 times thanked!


Now 801

[SquishDaFish]

Wow FINALLY a good thread from you. :clap:

[venis2k1]

The way i see it, we have 4 MAJOR holes on our team that need to be adressed before we go into NE.

OLB
DE
TE
LG

Fortunatly LB offers alot of value still in free agency. After the Draft we will have a choice of signing a starting Vet LB. Im thinkin Cato June.

a guy like Maybin would be a good value for us in the first, at a need postion. this makes sense.

The second round is where it gets interesting...we will have to chose between a lot of good receiving TEs, but that hole at LG is too huge to ignore.

I think a guy like Duke Robinson could come in and start early.

In the Third id like to go back to the O-line, maybe a Andy Levitre or an Eric Wood, we are thin on our o-line, this gives us quality depth AND quality competion in camp.

We simply have too many holes to fill, giving fine a chance might be our best option in terms of value.

[Mitchell55]

The way i see it, we have 4 MAJOR holes on our team that need to be adressed before we go into NE.

OLB
DE
TE
LG

Fortunatly LB offers alot of value still in free agency. After the Draft we will have a choice of signing a starting Vet LB. Im thinkin Cato June.

a guy like Maybin would be a good value for us in the first, at a need postion. this makes sense.

The second round is where it gets interesting...we will have to chose between a lot of good receiving TEs, but that hole at LG is too huge to ignore.

I think a guy like Duke Robinson could come in and start early.

In the Third id like to go back to the O-line, maybe a Andy Levitre or an Eric Wood, we are thin on our o-line, this gives us quality depth AND quality competion in camp.

We simply have too many holes to fill, giving fine a chance might be our best option in terms of value.


Still I like Unger better.

[BILLSROCK1212]

don't you have hw to do??

[venis2k1]

Still I like Unger better.

better than whom??

[Oaf]

Again, if you ask me, I'd rather give Chambers a shot at LG than go with another season of Ellison. I think our needs go
1./1a. DE/OLB
3. G
4. TE
5. DT
6. FB
7. S

[venis2k1]

I agree about ellison, but come may 1st there will be 2-3 experianced Vet LBs that can come in here and succeed. We have already brought 2 in for visits. The same cant be said for G or DE. Thats why i see it in the bills best intrest to target those positions in the draft.

[venis2k1]

As for Max Unger...I think Sal said it well:

"The problem…is his strength. It is not what you would expect from someone of his size, and may not be NFL caliber at this time. At the Senior Bowl, he was driven back several times by DT’s, even those not named Raji. His 22 reps in the bench press at the Combine reinforce this concern. At times, he has problems coming out too high and loses leverage, and often will let a DT get inside his body. This may not be as much of a hand placement problem as it is a lack of upper body strength. "

I think we are in need of a bit more of a "Mauler" inside our line, someone that can move Wilfork and Jenkins.

http://salsports.com/2009C.htm

[Mitchell55]

better than whom??


Over Duke

[Mitchell55]

^ Robinson

[The Jokeman]

What I mean is after how well Fine showed himself as a reciever and blocker, why not give him the starting position this year and next year when Gresham comes out pick him if Fine does bad.
Because the Bills have a small window before a new phase of rebuilding. As arguably if the Bills fail to make the playoffs in 2010 we could see a new HC in 2010 who may not be as enamored with Trent Edwards as the current regime is. Toss in Owens is only here for a year and Schobel and Stoud are about to hit 30 and McGee and Lynch might not be around here much longer. As a result think we need to go for broke now. While I don't think Pettigrew is the answer at TE I do think it be wiser to try and trade for a proven guy like Scheffler who we be a far bigger impact then almost any rookie we bring in. As let's be honest not many rookies make big impacts as rookies and with our recent track record in the draft odds of that happening is very little.

[Mitchell55]

Because the Bills have a small window before a new phase of rebuilding. As arguably if the Bills fail to make the playoffs in 2010 we could see a new HC in 2010 who may not be as enamored with Trent Edwards as the current regime is. Toss in Owens is only here for a year and Schobel and Stoud are about to hit 30 and McGee and Lynch might not be around here much longer. As a result think we need to go for broke now. While I don't think Pettigrew is the answer at TE I do think it be wiser to try and trade for a proven guy like Scheffler who we be a far bigger impact then almost any rookie we bring in. As let's be honest not many rookies make big impacts as rookies and with our recent track record in the draft odds of that happening is very little.


30 is when DL are in there prime. Owens will likely be gone but then we have 2 young WRs to take his place. Lynch will be here for another 4-5 years. McGee will probably be resigned if not, thats just 1 more need on what hopefully will be a small list next year.

[topher180]

A lot of good points, but I'm sorry I think a proven TE should be a priority. Not more than LG, but this team has went way to long without a factor at that position. TO or no TO, a solid TE takes pressure off the QB and provides another dimension to the passing game, especially in the middle of the field.

How exactly has Fine proven himself? He and Shouman are serviceable, but I have to think neither would start on many other teams.

If not now, when?

[Oaf]

I agree about ellison, but come may 1st there will be 2-3 experianced Vet LBs that can come in here and succeed.

Maybe true, but you look at the rookie playermakers the last two years and a sizable portion of that are LBs, and that's what we need. A golden front 7 gets us playoffs even without a bonafide Gonzales at TE or <insert elite guard here, I can't even think of one> at LG.



We have already brought 2 in for visits. The same cant be said for G or DE.

Agreed on DE but why don't you think the same can be said for G?



A lot of good points, but I'm sorry I think a proven TE should be a priority. Not more than LG, but this team has went way to long without a factor at that position. TO or no TO, a solid TE takes pressure off the QB and provides another dimension to the passing game, especially in the middle of the field.

How exactly has Fine proven himself? He and Shouman are serviceable, but I have to think neither would start on many other teams.

If not now, when?

I fully agree with you that a proven TE is a need. But because of a terrible signing in Dockery, the Peters situation, the Kelsay signing, and the inability to upgrade on the substandard Ellison has FORCED those positions that didn't have to be, but are now, needs. We created our holes and now we will likely need to fill them first and be only okay or worse at TE for another year.

Who knows, next year, we may have the luxury of drafting or even trading up for Gresham.

[yordad]

I see TE slipping considerably on the needs list. TO adds another 1.5 weapons, the O-line is in Shambles (with a capital "S"), there is no pass rush, Ellison sucks.

But, I don't see how most say Fine is a good blocker. I honestly didn't see that last year. Actually, I seen him straight whiff too many times. I know he was a rookie, but how is that a good reason to call him a good blocker?

[User Manuel]

What I mean is after how well Fine showed himself as a reciever and blocker, why not give him the starting position this year and next year when Gresham comes out pick him if Fine does bad.

A voice of reason, how rare around here. I agree with you.

[bflobarry]

I agree.
How do the Bills staff really feel about Kelsay and Ellison potentially starting for another year? I feel that if they use their 11th picks with no trades, they must actually be comfortable with one of those starting. I mean, suddenly we’re in the 2nd round and we don’t have an answer for our pass rush, a starting OLB, and a LG.


Without trading down, can we really afford a luxury like Pettigrew?? Let’s assume Peters is a wash, which is really the best case scenario. Either we keep him, or the pick we get for him is a rookie LT.


I would much rather deal with Fine who may turn out to be a player himself, or even Chambers at LG (he’s proven himself at the T’s, why not give it a shot?), then known substandard players in Kelsay and Ellison.
Totally agree: Fine seems servicable at TE, and even Chambers at LG might be OK. But Kelsay starting is the biggest weakness on the team and must be addressed, followed by LOLB. Another year of zero pass rush from the left side w/b fatal, IMO.

[kgun12]

I agree that TE can wait. Fantasy Football has made the TE position more important than it really is. Here's why I say that. The 2 best TE's in the game over the last 5-10 years (T. Gonzalas and A. Gates) have gotten to how many SB's? ZERO. We have WAY TO MANY WHOLES to draft a TE on the first or early second day.

[Saratoga Slim]

I agree.
How do the Bills staff really feel about Kelsay and Ellison potentially starting for another year? I feel that if they use their 11th picks with no trades, they must actually be comfortable with one of those starting. I mean, suddenly we’re in the 2nd round and we don’t have an answer for our pass rush, a starting OLB, and a LG.


Without trading down, can we really afford a luxury like Pettigrew?? Let’s assume Peters is a wash, which is really the best case scenario. Either we keep him, or the pick we get for him is a rookie LT.


I would much rather deal with Fine who may turn out to be a player himself, or even Chambers at LG (he’s proven himself at the T’s, why not give it a shot?), then known substandard players in Kelsay and Ellison.

I'm inclined to agree. There very likely will be a decent LG prospect available in the mid rounds; assuming we resign Peters, I'd be all for letting Fine have a chance at TE, and focusing on DL & LB in the first couple rounds.