Did everyone forget the Bills hired Buddy Nix?

[sauce]

I have seen alot of negativity surrounding the Bills on here recently but lets not forget Ralph hired One of the TOP personal guys in regards to talent assessment in the NFL

BUT, BUT, BUT Ralph only hires marketing guys


It was an underrated off season move that got little exposure...hopefully it shows in this draft



Since 2004, the Chargers have selected 4 starting linemen and not one was a 1st round pick: McNeil (2nd), Nick Hardwick (3rd), Shane Olivea (7th), and Jeromey Clary (6th). Considering how good the Chargers' offense has been, that is extremely impressive. When you add, Gates, Shaun Phillips (4th), Michael Turner (5th), and Sproles (4th), that is a very impressive scouting staff Nix was a part of.<!-- / message --><!-- sig -->

[Jan Reimers]

Great point, but the realists will not be dissuaded by your argument.

[OpIv37]

It may matter in 2 or 3 years. It doesn't matter now.

Buddy Nix can't make the guys we have more talented and he can't find 5 starters in one draft.

Getting excited about the Bills hiring Buddy Nix is just a cop out for the homers who don't want to face the reality of how bad the situation is for this team.

[The Spaz]

Thank god someone is on my ignore list...lol

[mayotm]

It may matter in 2 or 3 years. It doesn't matter now.

Buddy Nix can't make the guys we have more talented and he can't find 5 starters in one draft.

Getting excited about the Bills hiring Buddy Nix is just a cop out for the homers who don't want to face the reality of how bad the situation is for this team.Angry, just because some of us don't share all of your negative views doesn't mean we aren't "facing reality".

[MikeInRoch]

Op always seems to believe that there is something the front office could do to win "right now", and they are too stupid to find it. When the reality is that it just might not be possible in their current state.

[madness]

:spit:

Oh, man. That is hilarious.

[justasportsfan]

If you guys notice I hardly argue with OP anymore because like him, I'm tired. I gave this staff a benefit of a doubt. I do that with every new player and every new coach. It's was time for this staff however to prove it last year and they didn't. 3 years is average for any staff and they couldn't even do it on an average scale. Then the fins come in and make playoffs in 1 year.

All we're doing right now is scraping for anything positive to try and cloak whats proven . I too am hoping something changes but thats just it, it's nothing but hope.

Every new season brings something new. Just like every day is a possible new begining. BUt if you don't do anything different from what you did the day/week/month before, things are not likely to change.

[OpIv37]

Angry, just because some of us don't share all of your negative views doesn't mean we aren't "facing reality".

It's not my negative views.

The truth is this team needs a minimum of 4 and most likely 5 starters to be competitive. The truth is that it's difficult, if not impossible, to get that out of one draft. Yet, people still have high hopes for this team, which defies all logic and yes, it does mean they are not facing reality.

I'm angry because this team constantly loses. I'm angry because people defend this team for losing and make excuses for the players, coaches, FO personnel and owner who are responsible for those losses. I'm angry because this team cut 3 starters off the OL, didn't sign replacements for two of them, and failed to address two or three major holes that were carried over from last season, and it makes me even more angry when I have to see people come on here defending it because we hired some front office personnel guy.

This is the way this team has operated unsuccessfully for years:
"We don't need talent on the OL- we'll just hire McNally."
"We don't need top-flight CB's- we'll just run a Cover 2 as the base D"
"We don't need to replace that player- we'll just use his back-up as the starter"
And now, it's
"We don't need to replace/upgrade the players who sucked last year- we'll just let Buddy Nix find starters in the draft."

It's business as usual at OBD and, yes, that makes me angry. It should make every fan angry because business as usual is topping out at 7-9. But go ahead and make excuses. Go ahead and defend the FO. September will come, we'll be losing again, and a year from now the same people will be on this board making excuses for the FO and grasping at straws for hope for the upcoming season.

[Jan Reimers]

et tu, justa?

[justasportsfan]

et tu, justa?

I'm still hoping but not expecting anything great.

[OpIv37]

Op always seems to believe that there is something the front office could do to win "right now", and they are too stupid to find it. When the reality is that it just might not be possible in their current state.

Did it ever occur to you that the reason it's not possible to win right now is because of years and years of bad decisions by this FO? We've been rebuilding for years and we're still rebuilding. WTF?

And one more time- a lack of available options does NOT make the product on the field any better. We could argue all day about what options the FO had or didn't have, but we all saw what happened last year. Without upgrades at LG, LT, OLB, DE and better QB play, it's going to be the same **** all over again.

[OpIv37]

I'm still hoping but not expecting anything great.

Well we're all still hoping.

But there's a difference between hope and expectations. I hope the Bills go 16-0 in the regular season, breeze through the playoffs and win the SB. But as a logical person, I can't expect that to happen. When I see a team that's remarkably similar to last year and in fact has even more holes, the only reasonable expectation is results that are similar to, or perhaps worse than, last year.

[justasportsfan]

Well we're all still hoping.

But there's a difference between hope and expectations. I hope the Bills go 16-0 in the regular season, breeze through the playoffs and win the SB. But as a logical person, I can't expect that to happen. When I see a team that's remarkably similar to last year and in fact has even more holes, the only reasonable expectation is results that are similar to, or perhaps worse than, last year.
:up:

I'm still gonna try and enjoy football anyway I can. I'm keeping my expectations low this time after having seen what this coaching staff is capable or not capable of doing.

[THATHURMANATOR]

Buddy Nix can't make the guys we have more talented and he can't find 5 starters in one draft.

.
Yes he can

[justasportsfan]

Yes he can
can Buddy Nix teach the coaches to stop playing not to lose?

[mayotm]

:up:

I'm still gonna try and enjoy football anyway I can. I'm keeping my expectations low this time after having seen what this coaching staff is capable or not capable of doing.Trying to get some enjoyment from it is key. Low expectations are fine. Most of us "homers" have low expectations. But we also still have some hope. The day I don't have any hope, I'll pull a HH and stop being a fan. However, that won't ever happen. Logical or not, I head into each season with hope.

[justasportsfan]

I'll pull a HH and stop being a fan. .
thats what he says now. I'm sure HH will change his mind. He already did the minute he said he's no longer a fan.

[kernowboy]

The mindset of some 'fans' amazes me. Why not just skip the entire draft if we are going to do so badly?

There have been numerous examples of teams turning it around with one draft and we're not 2-14, we are 7-9.

Because we get rid of a greedy cancer who was a fan favourite with a minority, it is all doom and gloom.

Who's to say Schobel won't come back and have 14 sacks, a new WLB will be head and shoulders above what Ellison offers, that Fine has a breakout season, that we pick up a team cut who excels at LG, that we provide some help for Schobel, and that we pick a LT who performs from Day 1 like Marcus McNeill or Matt Light?

There is no reason to believe that 3 starters on Day1 of the draft cannot turn this team into a 10-6 or 11-5 side.

[justasportsfan]

Who's to say Schobel won't come back and have 14 sacks, a new WLB will be head and shoulders above what Ellison offers, that Fine has a breakout season, that we pick up a team cut who excels at LG, that we provide some help for Schobel, and that we pick a LT who performs from Day 1 like Marcus McNeill or Matt Light?

.
No ones saing that can't happen but again, we're just hoping that happens.

[OpIv37]

There is no reason to believe that 3 starters on Day1 of the draft cannot turn this team into a 10-6 or 11-5 side.

lmao.

There's also reason to believe that I'm going to win the lottery because I bought a ticket, but I'm not going to sign my name to the mortgage for that $3 million beachfront mansion just yet.

This team was 7-9 last year. We didn't beat a SINGLE team that finished better than .500. We were 0-6 in the division. And you're saying that we're Schobel and 3 rookies away from the playoffs? Come on- that's simply not realistic.

[justasportsfan]

Even if we draft guys who end up starters, Ellison was a starter too.

Don't forget that we're not the only ones drafting and that other teams are going to try and get better via the draft and have had better success than we have .

I hope it's true that the reason we didn't do s well in the past is because Modrak didn't have much say in in and he does now. But that remains to be seen.

[The Juice Is Loose]

To say we need 5 starters is ludicrous. Edited for TOS violation

Schobel comes back. He made 2 straight pro bowls before his injury. If he was on some other team, made 2 pro bowls, got hurt, and then we signed him you'd be all excited.

Schobel is going to get double digit sacks this year, just like almost every other year of his career.

Maybe, just maybe, our coaches see something in Demetrius Bell. I've read that he's "extremely" athletic.

You were probably complaining when they decided to start Peters at LT. "Oh he's undrafted and has never played LT, he's gonna suck!" Right.

Players come up from nowhere. It happens every year. Its happened often to Buffalo. Hargrove was great for us and he came out of nowhere. Schobel will be back and will be impressive. We don't need a SINGLE starter on defense. We were solid last year, and I don't feel we lost due to our defense once.

We have Hangartner at C. He came in the 2nd half of the year for Carolina last year. Oh, by the way, the 2nd half the year is when they were running roughshod on the entire league with the running game. It was Hangartner blocking the Giants that night when Williams and Stewart ran all over them.

A couple new starters on the line. We got TO. We got Rhodes, who's good. We'll have Fred and Lee who are not scrubs by any standard.

Derek Fine, if we don't add another tight end, showed me some good stuff last year. A rookie who had an injury most of the year. He could be just as good as Scheffler and his one good season (with a pro bowl qb)

If Trent makes as much progress from years 2 to 3 as he did years 1 to 2 we'll be in the playoffs.

STOP COMPLAINING SO MUCH! The record is 0-0, and just cuz you get high on complaining doesn't mean that ANYBODY wants to read what you have to say. Go watch your Notre Dame team, who's much worse and much more poorly coached.

Douche.

[madness]

Since when do we need 5 starters?

[OpIv37]

To say we need 5 starters is ludicrous. Edited for TOS violation

Schobel comes back. He made 2 straight pro bowls before his injury. If he was on some other team, made 2 pro bowls, got hurt, and then we signed him you'd be all excited.

Schobel is going to get double digit sacks this year, just like almost every other year of his career.

Maybe, just maybe, our coaches see something in Demetrius Bell. I've read that he's "extremely" athletic.

You were probably complaining when they decided to start Peters at LT. "Oh he's undrafted and has never played LT, he's gonna suck!" Right.

Players come up from nowhere. It happens every year. Its happened often to Buffalo. Hargrove was great for us and he came out of nowhere. Schobel will be back and will be impressive. We don't need a SINGLE starter on defense. We were solid last year, and I don't feel we lost due to our defense once.

We have Hangartner at C. He came in the 2nd half of the year for Carolina last year. Oh, by the way, the 2nd half the year is when they were running roughshod on the entire league with the running game. It was Hangartner blocking the Giants that night when Williams and Stewart ran all over them.

A couple new starters on the line. We got TO. We got Rhodes, who's good. We'll have Fred and Lee who are not scrubs by any standard.

Derek Fine, if we don't add another tight end, showed me some good stuff last year. A rookie who had an injury most of the year. He could be just as good as Scheffler and his one good season (with a pro bowl qb)

If Trent makes as much progress from years 2 to 3 as he did years 1 to 2 we'll be in the playoffs.

STOP COMPLAINING SO MUCH! The record is 0-0, and just cuz you get high on complaining doesn't mean that ANYBODY wants to read what you have to say. Go watch your Notre Dame team, who's much worse and much more poorly coached.

Douche.

Once again, displaying the weakness of your position with immature insults.

We need starters at LG, LT, DE, OLB and TE. That's 5. Maybe we could go without TE- I'll give you that one.

First, let's start with factual inaccuracies. "Just like almost every other year of his career?" Schobel's had 7 seasons in the league and had double digit sacks 3 times. That's less than 50%. You're completely overrating this guy. And I resent your assumption that I would like him if we signed him from another team. He's always racked up garbage time sacks and his production is on the decline. Doesn't matter how or why we have him- it won't make him any better or change my criticism.

Second, we don't need a single starter on D? Did you watch the games last year? Did you see how bad Keith Ellison was? Seriously, you are the ONLY person on this board who does not think we need an upgrade for Ellison.

Third, did you watch Trent last year. He got WORSE after he came back from his injury. He REGRESSED. That's the opposite of getting better. Yet, you expect him to magically get better once 2009 starts? Why? That's completely illogical.

And finally, this "0-0" crap is just ignorant. The Patriots and the Lions are both 0-0 too. Do you think they're equal? Do you think the Bills as bad as the Lions or as good as the Patriots?

I'll stop complaining when this team starts winning. You can keep making excuses and living in this dream world where Schobel and Ellison are good and Edwards is improving. I'll be down here in reality- you'll be joining me once the games start.

[THATHURMANATOR]

OP GOT SEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEERVED!

[justasportsfan]

To say we need 5 starters is ludicrous. Edited for TOS violation
Schobel comes back. He made 2 straight pro bowls before his injury. If he was on some other team, made 2 pro bowls, got hurt, and then we signed him you'd be all excited.

Schobel is going to get double digit sacks this year, just like almost every other year of his career.

Maybe, just maybe, our coaches see something in Demetrius Bell. I've read that he's "extremely" athletic.

You were probably complaining when they decided to start Peters at LT. "Oh he's undrafted and has never played LT, he's gonna suck!" Right.

Players come up from nowhere. It happens every year. Its happened often to Buffalo. Hargrove was great for us and he came out of nowhere. Schobel will be back and will be impressive. We don't need a SINGLE starter on defense. We were solid last year, and I don't feel we lost due to our defense once.

We have Hangartner at C. He came in the 2nd half of the year for Carolina last year. Oh, by the way, the 2nd half the year is when they were running roughshod on the entire league with the running game. It was Hangartner blocking the Giants that night when Williams and Stewart ran all over them.

A couple new starters on the line. We got TO. We got Rhodes, who's good. We'll have Fred and Lee who are not scrubs by any standard.

Derek Fine, if we don't add another tight end, showed me some good stuff last year. A rookie who had an injury most of the year. He could be just as good as Scheffler and his one good season (with a pro bowl qb)

If Trent makes as much progress from years 2 to 3 as he did years 1 to 2 we'll be in the playoffs.

STOP COMPLAINING SO MUCH! The record is 0-0, and just cuz you get high on complaining doesn't mean that ANYBODY wants to read what you have to say. Go watch your Notre Dame team, who's much worse and much more poorly coached.

Douche.


ICE is that you?

[OpIv37]

OP GOT SEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEERVED!

yeah, I got served, if you ignore his faulty assumptions, baseless accusations, factual inaccuracies, and unrealistic player ratings. But other than that, he got me.

[THATHURMANATOR]

yeah, I got served, if you ignore his faulty assumptions, baseless accusations, factual inaccuracies, and unrealistic player ratings. But other than that, he got me.
And got you good man.

[billsfanone]

If you guys notice I hardly argue with OP anymore because like him, I'm tired. I gave this staff a benefit of a doubt. I do that with every new player and every new coach. It's was time for this staff however to prove it last year and they didn't. 3 years is average for any staff and they couldn't even do it on an average scale. Then the fins come in and make playoffs in 1 year.

All we're doing right now is scraping for anything positive to try and cloak whats proven . I too am hoping something changes but thats just it, it's nothing but hope.

Every new season brings something new. Just like every day is a possible new begining. BUt if you don't do anything different from what you did the day/week/month before, things are not likely to change.

same here.

[PromoTheRobot]

Don't confuse Hhuricane or Opi with any good news.

PTR

[raphael120]

Op always seems to believe that there is something the front office could do to win "right now", and they are too stupid to find it. When the reality is that it just might not be possible in their current state.

7-9, 7-9, 7-9

The FO is too stupid to put it together in 3 years, let alone 1.

[The Juice Is Loose]

Once again, displaying the weakness of your position with immature insults.

We need starters at LG, LT, DE, OLB and TE. That's 5. Maybe we could go without TE- I'll give you that one.

First, let's start with factual inaccuracies. "Just like almost every other year of his career?" Schobel's had 7 seasons in the league and had double digit sacks 3 times. That's less than 50%. You're completely overrating this guy. And I resent your assumption that I would like him if we signed him from another team. He's always racked up garbage time sacks and his production is on the decline. Doesn't matter how or why we have him- it won't make him any better or change my criticism.

Second, we don't need a single starter on D? Did you watch the games last year? Did you see how bad Keith Ellison was? Seriously, you are the ONLY person on this board who does not think we need an upgrade for Ellison.

Third, did you watch Trent last year. He got WORSE after he came back from his injury. He REGRESSED. That's the opposite of getting better. Yet, you expect him to magically get better once 2009 starts? Why? That's completely illogical.

And finally, this "0-0" crap is just ignorant. The Patriots and the Lions are both 0-0 too. Do you think they're equal? Do you think the Bills as bad as the Lions or as good as the Patriots?

I'll stop complaining when this team starts winning. You can keep making excuses and living in this dream world where Schobel and Ellison are good and Edwards is improving. I'll be down here in reality- you'll be joining me once the games start.

[justasportsfan]

7-9, 7-9, 7-9

The FO is too stupid to put it together in 3 years, let alone 1.


Uh-OH. raphy's here and he has OP's back.

[The Juice Is Loose]

I wrote a big post. IDK why it didn't show up. Forget it. your not worth arguing with,.

[raphael120]

Players come up from nowhere. It happens every year. Its happened often to Buffalo. Hargrove was great for us and he came out of nowhere.

LOL

THAT'S part of your argument!?

I rest my case...

[justasportsfan]

LOL

THAT'S part of your argument!?

I rest my case...
well, he was a great cheerleader. You can't fault Hrgrove for that.

[billsfanone]

7-9, 7-9, 7-9

The FO is too stupid to put it together in 3 years, let alone 1.

Let me continue that for you.
5-11, 9-7*, 6-10, 8-8, 3-13, 8-8

*fluke destroyed by steelers 3rd stringers.

[raphael120]

Honestly, I think we improve as much as Edwards improves.

Edwards had his head up his ASS for most of the end of last season, all the flashes we saw at the beginning of the year, and even the KC game, just disappeared. He threw what, 3, INT one right after the other in the monday night game here in Buffalo...against the BROWNS!

We go as far as Edwards goes...T.O. and Lee go as far as Edwards is capable of taking him...and with the history of the Bills and their QB choices, I wouldn't hold your breath. But thats OK...cuz if Edwards ends up sucking, rest easy...we have Fitzpatrick to come in and save the day and preserve the mediocrity.

BTW...would it shock you if the Bills went totally off the wayside and drafted up to sign Sanchez?? I wonder how much faith the Bills have in Trent, especially with their new found position of trimming the fat...and the Buffalo Bills are morbidly obese.

[THATHURMANATOR]

LOL

THAT'S part of your argument!?

I rest my case...
are you sure because you are losing.

[OpIv37]

Honestly, I think we improve as much as Edwards improves.

Edwards had his head up his ASS for most of the end of last season, all the flashes we saw at the beginning of the year, and even the KC game, just disappeared. He threw what, 3, INT one right after the other in the monday night game here in Buffalo...against the BROWNS!

We go as far as Edwards goes...T.O. and Lee go as far as Edwards is capable of taking him...and with the history of the Bills and their QB choices, I wouldn't hold your breath. But thats OK...cuz if Edwards ends up sucking, rest easy...we have Fitzpatrick to come in and save the day and preserve the mediocrity.

BTW...would it shock you if the Bills went totally off the wayside and drafted up to sign Sanchez?? I wonder how much faith the Bills have in Trent, especially with their new found position of trimming the fat...and the Buffalo Bills are morbidly obese.

I agree that we go as far as Edwards goes, but I think Edwards can only go as far as the OL goes. If we don't do something about the line, Edwards will suck through no fault of his own. If we can solidify the line, then it's on Edwards himself and it could go either way.

[The Juice Is Loose]

As far as my Hargrove statement, I was referring to his first year here. We got him for nothing, and I don't care what you say, he made an impact.

Obviously, he then got in trouble and was gone, but it cost us nothing anyway. My only point is that we could end up with major contributors that aren't on the team right now.

Bryce Paup is a perfect example. I didn't even really know who he was when we signed him, but sometimes when a player changes teams, you find out that "Hey, this guy was misused and is better than we thought" (Jim Leonard)

We could say hey, Leonard did good in Baltimore, but its about CHEMISTRY!

None of us know the TRUE details about Peters. All we know is what happened. Given that one isn't bashing the other, you'd have to assume they both did what they could. Peters is gone, there is nothing that can be done.

No matter what happens this year, it could be positive. My theory is to look for potential, and hope for the best. If we suck, that's fine with me this year. It'll get us a new management and a new franchise QB. Tebow, Bradford or McCoy.

I personally have a feeling that Trent is going to improve, a lot. Him, Pozluzney and McKelvin. What if all three of them hit stride and play well?

I understand what your saying about our oline. But I personally feel if I could choose between a guy being at workouts and camp, or Peters knowing that he wouldn't be there, I'd take the other guy. I WANT THE GUY THAT WANTS TO BE HERE!

The players that can turn it on in spite of their personal feelings are few and far between. Do you really think the Rams are better off paying Steven Jackson zillions of dollars? Hell no. They could put almost any RB in there and get almost as good production. They are everywhere.

Players are everywhere. Tackles are everywhere. Look in Philly. Shawn Andrews, a pro bowl guard, is now demanding out. Sheldon Brown is now demanding out. All because they went out on a limb and gave a huge deal to Peters. What if we did that?! We could have McGee or Walker hold out.

I'm going to go ahead and have faith in my team. At least in April. Every team has question marks and weaknesses. Every team has a player that they can't wait to get rid of after the season. Its reality.

Now go ahead and throw the "have you ever seen our management succeed?" crap at me. Ya know what? No. I haven't. But you know what? I'm not going to just sit on a message board and complain about it! If its that bad, go to the zoo. Watch baseball. Watch Notre Dame get spanked week in and week out.

Bill Bellicheck was a joke in Cleveland. I laughed when New England hired him. And he wasn't in the Super Bowl right away. It took finding a 7th round qb with that certain something to get them over the top. I bet when Bledsoe went down their fans were "NOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!"

I've seen Trent have pro bowl games. If he can learn (he's smart so I think he can) he'll continue to improve. Peters was a problem on the football field last year. He gave up 4 sacks that led to turnovers. Dispute that, the videos were posted. We didn't lose that much in Peters.

We lost nothing in Dockery, Royal and Fowler. NOTHING

Those three could be replaced in rounds 3, 4 and 5. And probably be upgraded.

We lost one good player from last year. Peters. And there is a decent chance that someone could play as good, if not better, than he did in 08.

But go ahead and argue with me. I don't care. I expect the following players to have pro bowl potential season. Not saying they will, saying I think they could:

Trent (won't make it cuz of Manning, Brady...But I expect 3500 yards and 25 td's)
Owens
Evans
McGee
McKelvin
Pozlunzney
Stroud
Schobel
Walker (Hey, Peters isn't in the afc anymore so nobody will get it handed to them for nothing)
And I could see Josh Reed being Wes Welker for us. This team has improved. Stop crying.

Now I'll leave you with this. A mental image. Charlie Weis Naked and Notre Dame losing 51-0. HO HO HO merry christmas.

[OpIv37]

We lost nothing in Dockery, Royal and Fowler. NOTHING

Those three could be replaced in rounds 3, 4 and 5. And probably be upgraded.

We lost one good player from last year. Peters. And there is a decent chance that someone could play as good, if not better, than he did in 08.

But go ahead and argue with me. I don't care. I expect the following players to have pro bowl potential season. Not saying they will, saying I think they could:

Trent (won't make it cuz of Manning, Brady...But I expect 3500 yards and 25 td's)
Owens
Evans
McGee
McKelvin
Pozlunzney
Stroud
Schobel
Walker (Hey, Peters isn't in the afc anymore so nobody will get it handed to them for nothing)
And I could see Josh Reed being Wes Welker for us. This team has improved. Stop crying.

Now I'll leave you with this. A mental image. Charlie Weis Naked and Notre Dame losing 51-0. HO HO HO merry christmas.

First, I agree that we lost nothing with Fowler, Dock and Royal. But we gained NOTHING and we desperately need to improve. You're assuming that a) we draft players for those positions and b) they turn out to help immediately. That's a HUGE assumption.

As far as your Pro Bowl list, wow. No way trent puts up those kind of numbers behind a non-existent OL. It's just not going to happen. McGee is past his prime and won't make the Pro Bowl. McKelvin is improving but he isn't there yet. Stroud is probably the 3rd best DT in our division. He won't make it either.

And I guarantee that Schobel will NOT make the Pro Bowl. Quote me, put it in your sig, whatever you have to do. If I'm wrong I'll be more than willing to take the hit on it, but I won't be wrong. The guy was never that good and he's washed up.

This team did NOT improve. The only position that improved was WR with Owens, and possibly C. We don't even have our T or G yet, and you're automatically assuming improvement. You're assuming improvement from Edwards when he actually REGRESSED last year. You're completely overrating Schobel.

Seriously, let's go position by position:

DE- Same
DT- Same
LB- Same
CB- lost Greer, added Florence- Downgrade
S- Same

QB- Same
RB- Same, Lynch suspended for 3 games so arguably a slight downgrade
WR- added Owens, Upgrade
TE- Cut Royal, added no one- I'll call it a push cuz Royal Sucked
LT- Downgraded
LG- Downgraded until we find a replacement
C- I'm not convinced that this is an upgrade but I'll give it to you.
RG-Same
RT- Same

So, basically we got better at 1 and arguably 2 positions (WR and C), while downgrading 3 (LT, LG and CB). Your whole theory of improvement is based on a) the FO drafting at these positions, and b) finding rookies who are capable of starting. At this point, there is simply no logical way to conclude that this team has improved.

[The Juice Is Loose]

I don't really have a theory. I was denying that we "Need 5 Starters"

Schobel is a starter, he will start, and he'll play well.

Also, I said that I expect them to have pro bowl type years. Didn't say they'd actually make the pro bowl. I just mean, they'll play well.

If I end up wrong on Trent, that would suck. But I know this: He's our starting quarterback. I did the same with JP. Did I ever once think that JP was going to be good? Maybe 5 minutes. During the Houston game. That is it. I've seen good play out of Trent. I've seen good, complete games out of him.

I see potential, and I'm not going to write the history before it takes place. Nobody expect Tom Brady to be good, obviously. Every team in the NFL passed on him 7 times.

And I'm not saying that Edwards is Brady. I'm saying he could make the progress, and I have no reason to not believe it. I wouldn't say he regressed. I'd say we had tougher games and his weapons were limited. I'm not into excuses. But on the road in Denver, where this team historicly never wins, he won.

He's done more for me than JP ever did. And unless your saying you want to draft Sanchez or Stafford (which I don't. I'll go on record saying they both suck in the league), then downtalking Trent is a moot point, as neither through free agency or the draft this year was there a better choice.

He's a smart QB. It's our OC's 2nd year as an OC. They'll have more grasp on their teammates, strengths and weaknesses. And as I said before, TO can take a "check down" to the house at any given moment.

I don't think the schedule is that hard. And that doesn't matter cuz to be the man you gotta beat the man anyway.

What if, Brady is rusty? What if this team wins on the road week 1 at New England? If that happens, its called momentum. Its called chemistry.

The team could do it. They might not. NOBODY KNOWS.

Hate to be cliche but in the words of Chris Berman

"That's why they play the games!"

GO BILLS!

[The Juice Is Loose]

AND THE MAIN POINT IS, WE COULD EASILY GET 3 STARTERS IN THE FIRST TWO ROUNDS OF THE DRAFT THIS YEAR!!

AND WE STILL HAVE BEAST MODE FOR 13 GAMES!

Dominic Rhodes and Fred Jackson? We have the best running back committee in the league, aside from the Raiders.

Things change. Every year. Its a fact of life. The Bills are on the rise. Even ESPN who hates us says that.

Peters is already causing more grief than he is worth in Philly. Since his signing, half the peole that judge them say it was a mistake. Since his signing, 2 players have demanded trades.

What if we give Philly back their 4th and our 4th for Shawn Andrews?

If you need a cure for depression, come hang out with Lynch! He knows what's up! This team will find a guard. We have some good linemen on the team already, we still get 7 draft choices, 3 in the first 45 picks or so.

NOT THAT BAD OF SHAPE!

I could be wrong, but so could you.

THATS WHY THEY PLAY THE GAMES!!!!!!!!!!!!

[OpIv37]

AND THE MAIN POINT IS, WE COULD EASILY GET 3 STARTERS IN THE FIRST TWO ROUNDS OF THE DRAFT THIS YEAR!!

I'm not disagreeing with that. I'm disagreeing with the assertion that in 2 rounds, we can find 3 starters who can be BETTER than what we had last year in their ROOKIE season. Hell, we should be able to find 3 starters out of three picks between rounds 1 and 2, but draft picks take time to develop and to come into their own. We play NE week 1. WEEK 1. That gives any draft picks who will be starting 4 1/2 months and ZERO NFL games to get ready before we're already in a hole in our division.

[kernowboy]

I think this years class is much deeper than last year, so it is entirely possible we can get 3 starters on Day1

[The Juice Is Loose]

If we go DE at 11

Orakpo or Brown or Jackson are upgrades over Kelsay and Denney

Schobel is an upgrade over Kelsay and Denney

If we get Pettigrew at 11, its a good receiving, great blocking TE. Another weapon for Trent, and an upgrade over Royal.

I feel moving Walker to LT COULD be an upgrade over Peters (This is a what have you done for me lately league. I'm not going to judge Peters on 07 as much as I am 08.)

Chambers at RT will be a downgrade over walker, but we now have a strong blocking TE to give some help when needed.

Our running back committee has improved

Our receiving corps has improved (Why are running backs a committee but receivers a corps? I'd rather be a corps.)

If we trade for Waters or Andrews from Philly, we upgrade over Dockery.

We could get an upgrade over Ellison in the 2nd or 3rd rounds. Depending if we trade for a G or take him in the 2nd (Loadholt or someone)

[Captain gameboy]

Seriously, regarding Edwards, I think year three is the sweet spot on the learning curve.

Same coordinator and the same receivers.

The only thing I worry about is durability, and though the line looks weak now, we can get what we need in the draft and scheme to keep him from taking things head on.

[raphael120]

are you sure because you are losing.

i know you are but what am i

[raphael120]

Now go ahead and throw the "have you ever seen our management succeed?" crap at me. Ya know what? No. I haven't. But you know what? I'm not going to just sit on a message board and complain about it! If its that bad, go to the zoo. Watch baseball. Watch Notre Dame get spanked week in and week out.


Wait...so the guy who is pissed because the management hasn't succeeded has LESS reason to give their opinion than the guy who is blinding themselves to the failed history of this team?

Oh, oh, ok.

[raphael120]

AND THE MAIN POINT IS, WE COULD EASILY GET 3 STARTERS IN THE FIRST TWO ROUNDS OF THE DRAFT THIS YEAR!!

AND WE STILL HAVE BEAST MODE FOR 13 GAMES!

Dominic Rhodes and Fred Jackson? We have the best running back committee in the league, aside from the Raiders.


1. ESPN doesn't hate us, Buffalo sports is just not interesting. 3 7-9 seasons is nothing to celebrate about or report on. People have this complex but what is there to report? We have one of the most boring coaches in the league and most boring teams in the league, no fire, no fight. ESPN reports plenty when we embarrass ourselves like the Cowboys game 2 seasons ago and the "wide right" in the home MNF game against Cleveland.

2. We have the best RB committee? How about Jacksonville? Steelers? But it don't mean jack when you have a makeshift patchwork of an OL that we currently have now paving the way, or lack thereof.

3. Who is saying these rookie starters will help put us over the edge? Have you ever considered these rookies that we have to start are not going to be better than the proven vets they'll play against in the league? People automatically think because we have a fresh rookie that it's going to push us over the edge, but fail to realize that while we're plugging in inexperienced rookies everywhere, the teams we're playing have enough solid players in their starting positions they don't have to resort to chancing it on a rookie.

[The Juice Is Loose]

ok your right the bills suck i give up

[ParanoidAndroid]

Here's my take on the whole thing in case anyone really gives two s***s.

I always go into the season, as a fan, with high hopes. I get excited.

However, my expectations have been pretty low for several years now and they continue to be low.

I choose to express my hopes more than my expectations. Why do I do that? Because being practical and logical as a fan is really friggin' BORING!!!

Here's an exercise: The next time a really optimisitic post turns up, instead of explaining why there's almost no chance of hopes being fulfilled and generally sucking the enjoyment out of the posting, say, "Hmmm...I'm not sure I like our chances, but man....that would be awesome!"
Posts by Mitchell55 are exempt from that exercise.......


j/k Mitchell55 :D

[Typ0]

we could get a starter in round 8. Just pick the guy and start him and he's a starter. That doesn't mean he's a starter on a contender though.