6 Bills rookies listed in top 100 impact rookies

[Dr. Lecter]

Link. (http://www.whatifsports.com/beyondtheboxscore/default.asp?id=2009NFLDraft)

#96 - Nic Harris
#87 - Shawn Nelson
#73 - Aaron Maybin
#67 - Andy Levitre
#35 - Jarius Byrd
#27 - Eric Wood

[bigbub2352]

IM surprised Byrd is rated so hi, i really like the pick now that he is going to FS

Still absolutly luv the levitre and Wood pick
Maybin reminds me alot of J Taylor coming out of college
Harris cant do any worse than our LBer starter (ellison) and our depth has been here

[yordad]

Orakpo = 13th
Maybin = 73rd
:idunno:

[OpIv37]

our #11 draft pick is the #73 impact player? Go FO!

[Mahdi]

our #11 draft pick is the #73 impact player? Go FO!
Yeah, like that really means much.

[EricStratton]

What type of site is WhatIfSports? Is it a message board type like this one or more news/insight type of stuff?

It's blocked at work.

[Dr. Lecter]

our #11 draft pick is the #73 impact player? Go FO!

For rookie impact, not long term.

Of course, you completely ignore that the 5th round pick is in the top 100.

And you wonder why people ***** about your *****ing?

[Dr. Lecter]

What type of site is WhatIfSports? Is it a message board type like this one or more news/insight type of stuff?

It's blocked at work.

It seems to be the type of place that has random musings. Most of them are probably meaningless, but I thought this might be interesting for some people.

[OpIv37]

For rookie impact, not long term.

Of course, you completely ignore that the 5th round pick is in the top 100.

And you wonder why people ***** about your *****ing?

once again, what good does that do us NOW?

We needed a DE last year- we still need a DE THIS year. If Maybin is good long term, great- but we're still screwed for the moment. That's what frustrates me. I really don't understand why you don't get it.

And our 5th round pick being in the top 100 is nice, but he doesn't play DE, OLB or LT.

[OpIv37]

Yeah, like that really means much.

it means other people share the opinion that there were other players more likely to help us now.

But that's ok- the Bills can draft a prospect and lose 3 or 4 more starters before he's in his prime and we'll be right back in the perpetual rebuilding cycle. No one except me really seems to mind.

[OpIv37]

oops- he does play OLB, but he didn't in college. Another project.

[Dr. Lecter]

once again, what good does that do us NOW?

We needed a DE last year- we still need a DE THIS year. If Maybin is good long term, great- but we're still screwed for the moment. That's what frustrates me. I really don't understand why you don't get it.

And our 5th round pick being in the top 100 is nice, but he doesn't play DE, OLB or LT.

Actually our 5th round pick DOES play OLB. He will be moved from safety. He can't play all 3 positions though.

And I understand what you are saying. Why you don't want the greatest long term benefit is what I don't understand. If the Bills were one or two players away from winning it all I would agree. They are not. So why sacrifice 2 years down the road for a fake thrill of 9-7 this year?

[Mahdi]

it means other people share the opinion that there were other players more likely to help us now.

But that's ok- the Bills can draft a prospect and lose 3 or 4 more starters before he's in his prime and we'll be right back in the perpetual rebuilding cycle. No one except me really seems to mind.
No one thought Dwight Freeney would help right away either.

[Dr. Lecter]

oops- he does play OLB, but he didn't in college. Another project.

You corrected yourself while I was pointing out that your rant was as accurate as a TopDog rant. But at least you caught it and admitted to it, so you are not that bad.

[OpIv37]

Actually our 5th round pick DOES play OLB. He will be moved from safety. He can't play all 3 positions though.

And I understand what you are saying. Why you don't want the greatest long term benefit is what I don't understand. If the Bills were one or two players away from winning it all I would agree. They are not. So why sacrifice 2 years down the road for a fake thrill of 9-7 this year?

So, he's changing positions- ie, ANOTHER PROJECT.

It's not that I don't want long term benefit- it's that I don't trust what this team is going to do with the other positions during that time period. In 2 years we'll have our DE, but then Stroud's contract is up and we'll be clamoring for a DT to replace him, who will take two years.... etc etc etc.

[psubills62]

once again, what good does that do us NOW?

We needed a DE last year- we still need a DE THIS year. If Maybin is good long term, great- but we're still screwed for the moment. That's what frustrates me. I really don't understand why you don't get it.

And our 5th round pick being in the top 100 is nice, but he doesn't play DE, OLB or LT.

Actually, our 5th round pick will be an OLB.

And seriously...the fact that you give more credit to that website, who is ranking the impact players not even a week after they were drafted, than to the FO, is pretty sad. I know you don't like the FO, but come on...like they have any idea of who will actually make an instant impact? I'd bet they put Cliff Avril and Trevor Scott high on the list impact DE's last year too.

[Dr. Lecter]

BTW, the Bills and Lions tied for the most impact rookies at 6 a piece.

So this is actually a positive article.

[OpIv37]

Actually, our 5th round pick will be an OLB.

And seriously...the fact that you give more credit to that website, who is ranking the impact players not even a week after they were drafted, than to the FO, is pretty sad. I know you don't like the FO, but come on...like they have any idea of who will actually make an instant impact? I'd bet they put Cliff Avril and Trevor Scott high on the list impact DE's last year too.

I give ZERO credit to our FO. I've seen plenty of posters on this board come up with ideas that turned out to be much better than those of the FO. Until they win, they deserve ZERO credit and ZERO benefit of the doubt.

Don't get me wrong- I know this is just a website and I have no idea how credible they are. But it's one more source espousing the opinion that myself and many others share: Orakpo will have more of an impact than Maybin, at least in the short term. The FO has made mistakes like this in the past (Whitner and McCargo come immediately to mind). When they were blasted on the intertubes, people came to the FO's defense saying that the sources weren't credible, had no football knowledge, blah, blah, blah. Turns out the internet nerds were right and the FO was wrong.

[kid mickey]

Dude you suck.

[psubills62]

I give ZERO credit to our FO. I've seen plenty of posters on this board come up with ideas that turned out to be much better than those of the FO. Until they win, they deserve ZERO credit and ZERO benefit of the doubt.

Don't get me wrong- I know this is just a website and I have no idea how credible they are. But it's one more source espousing the opinion that myself and many others share: Orakpo will have more of an impact than Maybin, at least in the short term. The FO has made mistakes like this in the past (Whitner and McCargo come immediately to mind). When they were blasted on the intertubes, people came to the FO's defense saying that the sources weren't credible, had no football knowledge, blah, blah, blah. Turns out the internet nerds were right and the FO was wrong.

Maybe so, but it's not like other teams' FO's have nailed every single pick. Just because there's someone out there who agrees with you doesn't mean that they're automatically right. Orakpo wasn't even supposed to be on the board when we picked - doesn't that tell you something right there? You're really blasting Buffalo's FO for passing on Orakpo, when 12 other teams, many of whom actually needed a DE/OLB like Orakpo, also passed on him?

[OpIv37]

Maybe so, but it's not like other teams' FO's have nailed every single pick. Just because there's someone out there who agrees with you doesn't mean that they're automatically right. Orakpo wasn't even supposed to be on the board when we picked - doesn't that tell you something right there? You're really blasting Buffalo's FO for passing on Orakpo, when 12 other teams, many of whom actually needed a DE/OLB like Orakpo, also passed on him?

I'm blasting the FO based on the fact that they've screwed up so many times in the past and it appears that they did so again. It isn't just me and this magazine that think so, either. You can't automatically say 12 other teams passed on him because other teams had other needs, and there were some better players on the board too. That's oversimplifying the situation to defend the Bills' FO when they don't deserve it.

[OpIv37]

Dude you suck.

intelligent, thoughtful response.

[BillsWin]

our #11 draft pick is the #73 impact player? Go FO!

they mean nothing. These rankings really mean nothing at all. for all we know 75 of the 100 wont even do anything really special with their rookie years or careers at all. The fact of the matter is that in rounds 1-5, the Bills picked up players that will contribute and make offense, defense and special teams better for the Bills. That is all that really matters isnt it?

[OpIv37]

they mean nothing. These rankings really mean nothing at all. for all we know 75 of the 100 wont even do anything really special with their rookie years or careers at all. The fact of the matter is that in rounds 1-5, the Bills picked up players that will contribute and make offense, defense and special teams better for the Bills. That is all that really matters isnt it?

Nope, what matters is using the off-season to fill positions of need. All the Bills did was try to fill a ton of holes with rookies who will need time to develop. That may pay off in the future- assuming we made the right picks and we don't lose other players or develop new holes in the meantime- but it does absolutely nothing for us for 2009.

[psubills62]

I'm blasting the FO based on the fact that they've screwed up so many times in the past and it appears that they did so again. It isn't just me and this magazine that think so, either. You can't automatically say 12 other teams passed on him because other teams had other needs, and there were some better players on the board too. That's oversimplifying the situation to defend the Bills' FO when they don't deserve it.

You really think KC was smart to pass on Orakpo (who had a ton of sacks in college) for Tyson Jackson, who had about 3 sacks in college? My point is, if Orakpo was that good, and since he was at a position of need (especially for a team like Denver - who's going to play OLB for them?) for most teams, then why did they pass on him? There were other GOOD players out there, but according to most people, Orakpo was rated higher than several of them.

I just see no reason to assume Maybin will automatically fail to meet any sort of expectations this year. Even Copeland Bryan got a sack last year...you don't think Maybin will do ANYTHING for us?

[OpIv37]

You really think KC was smart to pass on Orakpo (who had a ton of sacks in college) for Tyson Jackson, who had about 3 sacks in college? My point is, if Orakpo was that good, and since he was at a position of need (especially for a team like Denver - who's going to play OLB for them?) for most teams, then why did they pass on him? There were other GOOD players out there, but according to most people, Orakpo was rated higher than several of them.

I just see no reason to assume Maybin will automatically fail to meet any sort of expectations this year. Even Copeland Bryan got a sack last year...you don't think Maybin will do ANYTHING for us?

I'd agree that KC made a mistake.

The reason? He's still undersized and he struggled against the run in college, and it's certainly no easier in the NFL. I'm not saying he won't do anything. I'm saying the Bills need a SIGNIFICANT improvement in their pass rush to be successful and I see no reason to believe that Maybin can provide that THIS year. Will he get a handful of sacks by playing in obvious pass rushing situations? Probably. Will he alone bring this pass rush out of the funk they've been in for the last two seasons? I highly doubt it.

[psubills62]

Nope, what matters is using the off-season to fill positions of need. All the Bills did was try to fill a ton of holes with rookies who will need time to develop. That may pay off in the future- assuming we made the right picks and we don't lose other players or develop new holes in the meantime- but it does absolutely nothing for us for 2009.

A lot of teams used the draft to fill needs for 2009, as well as the future. The Eagles (Maclin, McCoy), the Panthers (Everette Brown), the Giants (Hakeem Nicks), etc. I'd bet you would consider those teams to be fairly successful. Those teams are depending on those guys to contribute in 2009. So why is it so horrible when the Bills do it?

Let me guess...because they're terrible at drafting.

If that's going to be your answer, I don't see any point to this conversation. Whenever it's obvious that the Bills aren't doing anything different from any other team, then it's still bad because Buffalo sucks at drafting.

Just FYI, if you look at drafting history for most teams the past four years, you'll most likely see that Buffalo has a relatively high percentage of draftees that are either on the team or starters.

[Dr. Lecter]

To be fair Op, Washington picked Orakpo.

Their drafts have not been much better (if better at all) than the Bills recent drafts.

[psubills62]

I'd agree that KC made a mistake.

The reason? He's still undersized and he struggled against the run in college, and it's certainly no easier in the NFL. I'm not saying he won't do anything. I'm saying the Bills need a SIGNIFICANT improvement in their pass rush to be successful and I see no reason to believe that Maybin can provide that THIS year. Will he get a handful of sacks by playing in obvious pass rushing situations? Probably. Will he alone bring this pass rush out of the funk they've been in for the last two seasons? I highly doubt it.

Maybe I'm missing something. You're saying that we need an upgrade to our pass rush. But then you're main complaint of Maybin is that he's weak against the run. Does that not seem weird to you?

You want a pass rush, and Maybin brings a pass rush. If he plays mainly on passing downs and spends his first season learning to gain leverage against the run, then he can contribute in 2009 against the pass, and contribute in 2010 against both the pass and the run.

And as far as "bring[ing] this pass rush out of the funk they've been in for the last two seasons," I agree that Maybin probably won't do that. But I also don't see Orakpo doing it. Just because Orakpo may hold up better against the run doesn't solve our pass rush woes.

[OpIv37]

Maybe I'm missing something. You're saying that we need an upgrade to our pass rush. But then you're main complaint of Maybin is that he's weak against the run. Does that not seem weird to you?

You want a pass rush, and Maybin brings a pass rush. If he plays mainly on passing downs and spends his first season learning to gain leverage against the run, then he can contribute in 2009 against the pass, and contribute in 2010 against both the pass and the run.

And as far as "bring[ing] this pass rush out of the funk they've been in for the last two seasons," I agree that Maybin probably won't do that. But I also don't see Orakpo doing it. Just because Orakpo may hold up better against the run doesn't solve our pass rush woes.

Way to quote half of what I said. He's UNDERSIZED and weak against the run. Being undersized will hurt him in the passing game as well. And we can't sacrifice run D for pass D- opposing DC's will pick up on that in no time.

I think Orakpo is in better physical condition and more ready to help in both aspects of the game right now, at least moreso than Maybin. Hopefully I'm wrong, but if we don't get a better pass rush, then 2009 is going to look an awful lot like 2008.

[psubills62]

Way to quote half of what I said. He's UNDERSIZED and weak against the run. Being undersized will hurt him in the passing game as well. And we can't sacrifice run D for pass D- opposing DC's will pick up on that in no time.

I think Orakpo is in better physical condition and more ready to help in both aspects of the game right now, at least moreso than Maybin. Hopefully I'm wrong, but if we don't get a better pass rush, then 2009 is going to look an awful lot like 2008.

At this moment, he's not all that undersized. His athleticism and long arms can be used to counteract his current lack of size. I'd like to play the "wait and see" game to see how our new DL coach can help Maybin.

Maybe Orakpo is in better physical condition. But that doesn't mean he'll perform better. Like I said, I'm going to give Maybin the benefit of the doubt for now. Just because he was selected by Buffalo's FO doesn't mean he's terrible.

[OpIv37]

Just because he was selected by Buffalo's FO doesn't mean he's terrible.

no, but it certainly doesn't help his case.

[Dr. Lecter]

no, but it certainly doesn't help his case.

And being selected by Washington means what exactly?

[Don't Panic]

Maybin as Taylor... that's the best comparison I've heard yet.

[yordad]

Maybe so, but it's not like other teams' FO's have nailed every single pick. Just because there's someone out there who agrees with you doesn't mean that they're automatically right. Orakpo wasn't even supposed to be on the board when we picked - doesn't that tell you something right there? You're really blasting Buffalo's FO for passing on Orakpo, when 12 other teams, many of whom actually needed a DE/OLB like Orakpo, also passed on him?Of the teams that passed, the Bills were the only ones who run a 4-3 and picked a DE.
You really think KC was smart to pass on Orakpo (who had a ton of sacks in college) for Tyson Jackson, who had about 3 sacks in college? My point is, if Orakpo was that good, and since he was at a position of need (especially for a team like Denver - who's going to play OLB for them?) for most teams, then why did they pass on him? There were other GOOD players out there, but according to most people, Orakpo was rated higher than several of them.

I just see no reason to assume Maybin will automatically fail to meet any sort of expectations this year. Even Copeland Bryan got a sack last year...you don't think Maybin will do ANYTHING for us?KC runs a 3-4.

[Jan Reimers]

It is absolutely unbelievable to have our FO excoriated based on someone's arbitrary opinion of first year impact, before any of these players have ever played a down in the NFL. To get all bent out of shape over meaningless predictions is beyond ridiculous.

I know I'm just a stupid optimist, but I think I'll wait to see how these guys actually play before comdemning or annointing any of our picks, or the FO that picked them.

[Dr. Lecter]

Jan's been drinking again. :(

[billsfanone]

let the kids step on the field first.

[psubills62]

Of the teams that passed, the Bills were the only ones who run a 4-3 and picked a DE.KC runs a 3-4.

I'm not sure what your point is. Orakpo was projected more as a 3-4 OLB than a 4-3 DE. Since that's mainly where a 3-4 system's pass rush comes from, it's a little odd that KC (what, 10 sacks in 2008, and don't have many players that fit a 3-4), Denver (also has very few players that fit a 3-4), and Green Bay (ditto) all passed on him.

[OpIv37]

To be fair Op, Washington picked Orakpo.

Their drafts have not been much better (if better at all) than the Bills recent drafts.

Well, to be fair, Washington only gets like 3 draft picks a year because Snyder trades the rest away.

[ServoBillieves]

Orakpo = 13th
Maybin = 73rd
:idunno:

I know, because we've seen them all play at the NFL level so far, I can't believe we made such a big mistake in drafting Maybin. Damn, what a bust.

[SABURZFAN]

For rookie impact, not long term.

Of course, you completely ignore that the 5th round pick is in the top 100.

And you wonder why people ***** about your *****ing?


i can see why he's *****ing. the #11 pick, you would think, should pay immediate dividends. a #11 pick shouldn't be ranked #73 for rookie impact unless that team is stacked at that position. if anybody thinks the Bills are stacked at DE, they're a big idiot for believing it.

[kid mickey]

Right now I bet that if Orakpo and Maybin are starting opening day, Maybin will be better than Orakpo. There is just something about him that I don't like. He just seems like a guy who won't be a good end. I think they both play LE and I think the guy who has a better impact now and a better career is Maybin. Not biased, but come on people. You think that Orakpo is the better rusher? No way. Tape doesn't say so. I don't care if Maybin only did it for a year he is less of a bust factor than Orakpo.