Bills pursued Jason Taylor? PFT mentions us as a landing spot for Vick...

[Devin]

Keep An Eye On Buffalo As A Mike Vick Destination (http://www.profootballtalk.com/2009/05/19/keep-an-eye-on-buffalo-as-a-mike-vick-destination/)

Posted by Mike Florio on May 19, 2009, 11:34 p.m. EDT
John Clayton of ESPN.com recently listed four potential landing spots for Falcons quarterback Mike <NOBR id=itxt_nobr_0_0 style="FONT-WEIGHT: normal; FONT-SIZE: 100%">Vickhttp://images.intellitxt.com/ast/adTypes/mag-glass_10x10.gif</NOBR> (http://www.profootballtalk.com/2009/05/19/keep-an-eye-on-buffalo-as-a-mike-vick-destination/#), if he’s reinstated for the 2009 season.
Clayton’s unconfirmed quartet (http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/columns/story?columnist=clayton_john&id=4175491) consists of the Rams, 49ers, Patriots, and Seahawks. (John apparently forgets that Jim Mora’s dad, Jim Mora, once called Vick a “coach killer.” So we’d scratch the Seahawks from the list.)
But here’s the real team to watch, in our view.
The Buffalo <NOBR id=itxt_nobr_3_0 style="FONT-WEIGHT: normal; FONT-SIZE: 100%">Billshttp://images.intellitxt.com/ast/adTypes/mag-glass_10x10.gif</NOBR> (http://www.profootballtalk.com/2009/05/19/keep-an-eye-on-buffalo-as-a-mike-vick-destination/#).
The Bills want to win. Now. Whether it’s because owner Ralph Wilson is feeling a Leon Hess-style sense of urgency or whether coach Dick Jauron feels a Rich Kotite-style sense of urgency or a combination of both, the Bills are going all in.

They offered receiver Terrell <NOBR id=itxt_nobr_5_0 style="FONT-WEIGHT: normal; FONT-SIZE: 100%">Owenshttp://images.intellitxt.com/ast/adTypes/mag-glass_10x10.gif</NOBR> (http://www.profootballtalk.com/2009/05/19/keep-an-eye-on-buffalo-as-a-mike-vick-destination/#) $6.5 million guaranteed at a time when no one else was willing to pay him $6.50.

And a league source tells us that the Bills made a very aggressive play for defensive end Jason <NOBR id=itxt_nobr_6_0 style="FONT-WEIGHT: normal; FONT-SIZE: 100%">Taylorhttp://images.intellitxt.com/ast/adTypes/mag-glass_10x10.gif</NOBR> (http://www.profootballtalk.com/2009/05/19/keep-an-eye-on-buffalo-as-a-mike-vick-destination/#) immediately after Taylor was cut in March by the Redskins. In fact, the Bills were the very first team to pursue Taylor.
As to the potential backlash from signing Vick, consider the fans’ reaction to the arrival of T.O.

He’s already gotten the key to the freaking city.

So if any team can sell this transaction to their fans, it’s the Bills.

The other possibility, in our view, is Cincinnati. But not because the Bengals believe they could surive the local P.R. onslaught. The Bengals would potentially be interested in Vick because they don’t care about the P.R. onslaught.

http://www.profootballtalk.com/2009/05/19/keep-an-eye-on-buffalo-as-a-mike-vick-destination/

[venis2k1]

On the Taylor thing, I'm always glad to hear that this front office is exploring every option to improve this team.

As for the Vick thing, I personally would have no problem give a guy a second chance as a back up. This front offices "upgrade" at #2 QB is prolly gonna cost us the playoffs this year. Trent is injury prone, 6 straight years missing time to injury. thats no fluke. I'm not saying Vick is the answer, i just dont think Fitz is.

[B-DON]

i would absolutely love vick here, we have crap at back up qb

[jimbohastle51]

if fitz is called on for more than 1-2 games this season our season is over. the guy had chad johnson AND housh last year and was horrible. and the second half of the year cedric benson had over 4 yards a carry with housh and chad and he still couldnt get it going. he is not a good QB but a great practice guy and clipboard holder. there will be no miss spellings with his harvard butt on the sideline with a sharpie.

[jimbohastle51]

i also have to say that this was a weak free agent QB class. what was the top tier of the backups available (as pathetic as it was) were out of the bills price range. it is sad we didnt look at a trent green or ferotte wouldnt accept another backup role (the way i understand it he was either going to start for the vikes or retire). trent green is no starter but i would be comfortable with him for a game or 2. he has had his bell rung too many times to be counted on for more than a couple games.

[Mudflap1]

What good is Vick going to do in Buffalo? I don't think it makes any sense at all. He doesn't fit in with the city. But more than that, how does he fit into a K-Gun, no-huddle type offense? The guy is not a good passer, and I certainly wouldn't trust him to run a no-huddle offense.

[SeatownBillsFan21]

So let me get this right we gave TO a 1 yr deal taking a small chance and in doing that it will open the door for Vick ??

[TheMan08]

We could use Vick in Wild cat formations.

[jimbohastle51]

vick isnt coming to buffalo, florio must have had nothing to write about and like every other reporter today they are all getting on buffalo for all the T.O. hype and think we are foolish now. if we get just a wildcard game with T.O. on this team, the joke is on them.

[Michael82]

Oh God! Not Vick! I don't want that ****ing horrible excuse for a human being anywhere near Buffalo. First of all, he's a piece of **** and tortured dogs and killed them for fun, which makes me physically ill. Secondly...he's not a good QB. I don't care what anyone says. He's more of a RB than a QB and all that time off definitely won't help him.

[jimbohastle51]

Oh God! Not Vick! I don't want that ****ing horrible excuse for a human being anywhere near Buffalo. First of all, he's a piece of **** and tortured dogs and killed them for fun, which makes me physically ill. Secondly...he's not a good QB. I don't care what anyone says. He's more of a RB than a QB and all that time off definitely won't help him.

i feel your pain bro! he just wouldnt fit in buffalo. he doesnt have a lunch pal attitude, and the kid wouldnt know how to handle a blue collar city.

[Typ0]

Vick would be awesome here. He could line up at WR, RB, or DB. He would be another option at QB on the roster in a time of desparation. He could run the wildcat. I think our offense would go from potent (if TE performs) to destructive if MV was on this roster.

[Stewie]

I like Vick as a wildcat back, that's it

[X-Era]

vick isnt coming to buffalo, florio must have had nothing to write about and like every other reporter today they are all getting on buffalo for all the T.O. hype and think we are foolish now. if we get just a wildcard game with T.O. on this team, the joke is on them.

No way it happens... of course I said that with TO too. But, I really really cant see this one (hopefully the use of two reallys means I'm serious this time).

Do we really want a guy who's been away from football for years to come back and first start to play again for us? Especially when he wasn't that great a thrower to start with (accuracy wise and as far as decision making goes)?

[jamze132]

Vick would definitely bring more press to Buffalo. Not that TO doesn't bring enough, but imagine if two the biggest superstars to play in the NFL were on our team. Could it help the Bills stay in Buffalo?

[Mr. Miyagi]

Florio is just offering his own opinion, not from any source by any means. Any fool could make speculations like that. Just because we gave a proven receiver with no criminal record a one year deal does not mean we're ready to become the Dallas Cowboys and signing everyone that has a minimum of one felony charge.

Vick would never happen in B-lo.

[Jan Reimers]

Oh God! Not Vick! I don't want that ****ing horrible excuse for a human being anywhere near Buffalo. First of all, he's a piece of **** and tortured dogs and killed them for fun, which makes me physically ill. Secondly...he's not a good QB. I don't care what anyone says. He's more of a RB than a QB and all that time off definitely won't help him.
Great post, Mikey. I would actually end my 50 years of being a rabid fan if he came to Buffalo.

[OpIv37]

I call BS on this ENTIRE article.

First, Taylor is old, expensive and doesn't fit the system. When was the last time the Bills went after anyone who was ONE of those things, let alone all three? I'm not trying to bash the FO (at least not right now), but for better or worse, it's simply not how they operate.

Second, Vick's basically a faster JP Losman. He's more physically gifted than Losman, but just as slow in the head when it comes to making decisions with the ball and reading D's. Why ditch Losman just to pick up Vick? Someone pointed out that he'd be good in the wildcat, which is true, but the wildcat is a trick play, not a base offense. I think the Bills ran 3 wildcat plays ALL of last year. Even the Dolphins- the team that innovated the Wildcat- only used it a handful of times each game.

And finally, the Bills have gotten a lot of bad press lately for off-the-field incidents- Whitner, Lynch, Simpson, McIntyre, Hargrove- the LAST thing this FO wants to do is get a player who actually got jail time and has the most publicized off-the-field record since Pacman Jones.

This is just speculation by some website whose sources are probably suspect at best. There are at least three posters on this board whose sources I'd trust more than that site.

[Mahdi]

What good is Vick going to do in Buffalo? I don't think it makes any sense at all. He doesn't fit in with the city. But more than that, how does he fit into a K-Gun, no-huddle type offense? The guy is not a good passer, and I certainly wouldn't trust him to run a no-huddle offense.
How bout on the days where throwing the football isn't even a possibility as we have seen several times over the last 2 years with Trent. How valuable would Vick be then?

[elltrain22]

Oh God! Not Vick! I don't want that ****ing horrible excuse for a human being anywhere near Buffalo. First of all, he's a piece of **** and tortured dogs and killed them for fun, which makes me physically ill. Secondly...he's not a good QB. I don't care what anyone says. He's more of a RB than a QB and all that time off definitely won't help him.

I agree w/ everything you just said Mikey!! I really hate to say this, but if the Bills signed Vick, I wouldn't watch football that season or any season he wears a Bills uniform. Michael Vick, IMO, should be in jail for the rest of his life for what he did.

[Jan Reimers]

How bout on the days where throwing the football isn't even a possibility as we have seen several times over the last 2 years with Trent. How valuable would Vick be then?
If the weather is so bad that throwing is impossible, the defense will just sit and wait for Vick to run. His "great" running ability is due in large part to defenses having to play the pass as well as the run. That's why I think Vick would not be such a great RB, either, because the element of surprise would be gone.

[Mahdi]

I agree w/ everything you just said Mikey!! I really hate to say this, but if the Bills signed Vick, I wouldn't watch football that season or any season he wears a Bills uniform. Michael Vick, IMO, should be in jail for the rest of his life for what he did.
Pretty easy to sit around judging people from the internet isn't it.

How do you know what Vick's childhood was like... maybe as a little kid growing up he was exposed to dog fighting at an early age and it desensitized him to something we see as despicable. Doing these things later on becomes easy.

Does that make it right? No. But it definitely explains how we as outsiders can view something as being very cruel while to someone like Vick its normal.

I was reading an article today on the "ANNUAL SEAL HUNT" here in good ol, non-violent Canada.

They pretty much go out with Bats with picks at the ends and kill thousands of baby seals for FUN.

These are the cutest animals ever. I can barely believe a human can bring himself to kill one of these things, but to these hunters, bashing them in the head is second nature. Why? because this is what they were brought up seeing and believing is okay.


All that being said, I believe someone like Vick can look back on his actions and realize the brutality of them and be remorseful.


What I won't do is pass judgment on how long he should be punished for his actions and whether or not he is deserving an eternity of hell for them, as many believe.

[Mahdi]

If the weather is so bad that throwing is impossible, the defense will just sit and wait for Vick to run. His "great" running ability is due in large part to defenses having to play the pass as well as the run. That's why I think Vick would not be such a great RB, either, because the element of surprise would be gone.
I'm pretty sure defenses were aware the WildCat was coming but still couldn't stop it.

And from that formation you can try high probability throws when they commit to hard to the run with Vick since he has a rocket arm.

[OpIv37]

We've already had the debate about Vick's crime/personality flaws.

This is about whether he could help this football team. And the point is that he simply isn't cerebral enough to play QB in the NFL. Taking a year off- most of which was spent in a 10 by 10 cell- certainly isn't going to help.

The guy's going to be an expensive distraction who brings athleticism but no real football skill.

Pass.

[Jan Reimers]

I'm sitting here with one of my greyhounds, with his head on my lap. I don't care what Vick's early life was like. To willfully torture and kill dogs is inexcusable.

[Mahdi]

We've already had the debate about Vick's crime/personality flaws.

This is about whether he could help this football team. And the point is that he simply isn't cerebral enough to play QB in the NFL. Taking a year off- most of which was spent in a 10 by 10 cell- certainly isn't going to help.

The guy's going to be an expensive distraction who brings athleticism but no real football skill.

Pass.
Again I said nothing about him coming in and running the no huddle.

Im talking about using him as a WildCat QB. Giving him 1 or 2 series to throw defenses off and if needed, in games where we have trouble throwing, we can use him to run a separate style of offense suited to his skills.

The Falcons had 2 plays they used to torture defenses. Sweep right with Dunn and fake sweep right with Dunn QB Roll out Left.

That is useful in November and December.

[Mahdi]

I'm sitting here with one of my greyhounds, with his head on my lap. I don't care what Vick's early life was like. To willfully torture and kill dogs is inexcusable.
Great for you. I have 2 cats and 2 chihuahuas.

Doesn't mean I completely disregard human frailty.

[OpIv37]

Pretty easy to sit around judging people from the internet isn't it.

How do you know what Vick's childhood was like... maybe as a little kid growing up he was exposed to dog fighting at an early age and it desensitized him to something we see as despicable. Doing these things later on becomes easy.

Does that make it right? No. But it definitely explains how we as outsiders can view something as being very cruel while to someone like Vick its normal.

I was reading an article today on the "ANNUAL SEAL HUNT" here in good ol, non-violent Canada.

They pretty much go out with Bats with picks at the ends and kill thousands of baby seals for FUN.

These are the cutest animals ever. I can barely believe a human can bring himself to kill one of these things, but to these hunters, bashing them in the head is second nature. Why? because this is what they were brought up seeing and believing is okay.


All that being said, I believe someone like Vick can look back on his actions and realize the brutality of them and be remorseful.


What I won't do is pass judgment on how long he should be punished for his actions and whether or not he is deserving an eternity of hell for them, as many believe.

There are people who were brought up by racist parents- does that make it acceptable for them to be racist too? There are people who were brought up watching their dad beat up their mom- does that make it acceptable for those men to beat up their spouses, or for those women to accept being beaten up by their husbands?

Some things are acceptable and some things are not. A person being desensitized to something that is unacceptable does NOT make it acceptable. People are responsible for their own actions, period.

[ddaryl]

There are people who were brought up by racist parents- does that make it acceptable for them to be racist too? There are people who were brought up watching their dad beat up their mom- does that make it acceptable for those men to beat up their spouses, or for those women to accept being beaten up by their husbands?

Some things are acceptable and some things are not. A person being desensitized to something that is unacceptable does NOT make it acceptable. People are responsible for their own actions, period.

not acceptable, but explainable.. We are creatures of our enviroment and how we are brought up.

[Mahdi]

There are people who were brought up by racist parents- does that make it acceptable for them to be racist too? There are people who were brought up watching their dad beat up their mom- does that make it acceptable for those men to beat up their spouses, or for those women to accept being beaten up by their husbands?

Some things are acceptable and some things are not. A person being desensitized to something that is unacceptable does NOT make it acceptable. People are responsible for their own actions, period.
Where did I use the word acceptable?

I said its understandable how their behavior evolves into unacceptable by our standards.

If your parents from birth teach you that a certain race are evil you WILL believe that. It will be ingrained in you especially if others in your community preach the same message.

Doesn't make it right, just explains it.

[Jan Reimers]

I'm pretty sure defenses were aware the WildCat was coming but still couldn't stop it.

And from that formation you can try high probability throws when they commit to hard to the run with Vick since he has a rocket arm.
I don't believe Vick has ever run the Wild cat, and I don't know how much bad weather he has played in, so I can't say how effective he might be.But to hire a mentally slow QB with an inaccurate arm to run a few trick plays a game and to try to play in bad weather seems to be the kind of move that most wouldn't make.

[Mahdi]

I don't believe Vick has ever run the Wild cat, and I don't know how much bad weather he has played in, so I can't say how effective he might be.But to hire a mentally slow QB with an inaccurate arm to run a few trick plays a game and to try to play in bad weather seems to be the kind of move that most wouldn't make.
Vick destroyed Green Bay on the Frozen Tundra in January.

Like I said. They dont have to be trick plays. The Falcons offense was based on mis-direction run plays with Vick and Dunn.

There is a world of possibilities with Vick, Lynch and Jackson.

[Jan Reimers]

Great for you. I have 2 cats and 2 chihuahuas.

Doesn't mean I completely disregard human frailty.
I don't completely disregard human frailty, but I don't condone abject cruelty, either. What Vick did is not as bad as murder, child molestation, or other dispicable crimes against humans. But his actions were still heinous.

It's fine if he is reinstated. My opinion, however, is that I don't want him on my team, either from a character or a football standpoint.

[madness]

Agent says Vick to focus on family

The agent for Michael Vick (http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/players/profile?playerId=2549) said Tuesday that the quarterback "will place football on the back burner" during his immediate home confinement and that there are no meetings scheduled with NFL commissioner Roger Goodell to discuss reinstatement for the 2009 season. "Michael's looking forward to reacquainting himself with his family, his fiancée, Kiafa, his children and his mom," Joel Segal, Vick's agent, said. "When he gets home, that's his priority, along with reinserting himself into society and being a positive influence in his community. This is going to be a special time for him, just being around family."
<!-- INLINE NFL.com Video (BEGIN) -->
(http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-preseason/09000d5d801e3e3b/NFLTA-Michael-Vick-timeline&campaign=ec0009)

<!-- INLINE NFL.com Video (END) --> Segal said Vick has not formally hired a trainer but added, "At the appropriate time, he will hire one. Football will happen. But right now, it's not his priority. It's one day at a time."
Segal confirmed he has had talks with the league office during Vick's incarceration, but that it was more "about keeping open the line of communication. There's nothing set with the commissioner and, as I said, Michael's focus right now is on family."
Vick, who is serving an indefinite suspension imposed by Goodell, clearly wants an opportunity to play this season, Segal confirmed.
"It's just not appropriate for that to be the first priority in his life and he has told me that himself," Segal said. "However, he's paid his debt to society and like every American who has made mistakes, even criminal mistakes, he deserves a second chance. He realizes the severity of his mistakes."
At the NFL owners meetings Tuesday in Fort Lauderdale, Fla., Goodell said he will not make any decision on Vick until his full sentence runs its course.
Goodell has said that he wants Vick to demonstrate remorse for his actions in order to be reinstated. Asked what Vick must do to demonstrate remorse, he said: "I think that's going to be up to Michael. Michael is going to have to demonstrate to the public and the fans ... what he's learned [during his imprisonment].

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=4179874

[billsfanone]

If Vick came in, we can rename wildcat to maddog or something.

[Jan Reimers]

Vick destroyed Green Bay on the Frozen Tundra in January.

Like I said. They dont have to be trick plays. The Falcons offense was based on mis-direction run plays with Vick and Dunn.

There is a world of possibilities with Vick, Lynch and Jackson.
Mahdi, I have always respected your posts, and continue to do so. But pointing out one good game on the Frozen Tundra (were there a howling wind and blinding snow, or just cold weather?) reminds me of trading for Rob Johnson after one good game in Jacksonville. I just don't think Vick is a good NFL QB, and you know what I think of his character.

[justasportsfan]

Again I said nothing about him coming in and running the no huddle.

Im talking about using him as a WildCat QB. Giving him 1 or 2 series to throw defenses off and if needed, in games where we have trouble throwing, we can use him to run a separate style of offense suited to his skills.

The Falcons had 2 plays they used to torture defenses. Sweep right with Dunn and fake sweep right with Dunn QB Roll out Left.

That is useful in November and December.

Who's gonna design the wildcat? Turk?

No thanks to Vick.

AS fot JT, we pursued him because the jills need a new choreographer.

[justasportsfan]

If Vick came in, we can rename wildcat to maddog or something.


Our fight song would go from the Shout song to "who let the dogs out"

[Historian]

There are at least three posters on this board whose sources I'd trust more than that site.


...and who might they be?

:snicker:

[trapezeus]

regardless of character, anyone who has a hobby and stops for 2 years, knows it's a big learning curve to get back up to that ability again. And that's a Hobby, imagine how much you multiply that by when you are talking about the NFL.

2 years in prison, just weightlifting, not doing NFL style drills, Vick has a lot to catch up to. I just don't think he's goign to be a good fit for anyone.

If you sign him, you are signing him knowing that this year is a wash. And then he's 31 next year. he's had a couple injuries, i just don't think it's worth the risk for an GM to take. There has to be a player or two coming out of college next year that makes you feel comfortable.

[TacklingDummy]

I'm sitting here with one of my greyhounds, with his head on my lap. I don't care what Vick's early life was like. To willfully torture and kill dogs is inexcusable.

So is chaining a dog up in the backyard and paying no attention to it. How many dog owners do that?

Plus we are talking about Pitbulls.

[justasportsfan]

So is chaining a dog up in the backyard and paying no attention to it. How many dog owners do that?

Plus we are talking about Pitbulls.


huh? Huge difference between making them fight and chaining them up.

So what if they are pittbulls? They are not meant for fighting.

[TacklingDummy]

huh? Huge difference between making them fight and chaining them up.

Chaining dogs up and leaving them in the back yard is another form of torture, imo.

Both are bad dog owners. I can walk around my city and find many dogs chained up in the backyard. Maybe those owners should be arrested for torture too.


So what if they are pittbulls? They are not meant for fighting.
Pitbulls have always been looked down on for many years. Many places want to ban the breed altogether because of their aggressive nature. I don't blame any city for banning that breed. Whenever I see a Pitbull I walk the other way.

[Jan Reimers]

So is chaining a dog up in the backyard and paying no attention to it. How many dog owners do that?

Plus we are talking about Pitbulls.
I love the rationalizations on this board, and the attempted moral equivalencies. Vick abused, tortured and murdered dogs. He threw family dogs in with trained fighting dogs to be maimed and killed. While I hate it when dogs are chained and neglected, what Vick did is at least a thousand times worse.

And pit bulls are just slightly more aggressive than other dogs. If trained and raised properly, they make great family dogs. They have to be trained with brute force, abuse and other means to be turned into killers.

Please don't try to sugar coat Vick's inhuman behavior.

[SABURZFAN]

i feel total disgust towards what he did to those dogs. however, he has paid, and is currently paying, his debt to society.as for his reinstatement in the NFL, he should be punished for lying to them. why should he be rewarded a contract? to hurt more animals and run another gambling ring? the NFL needs to make an example out of somebody that they're not going to tolerate the thug-like attitudes that some professional ballplayers carry these days.

[TacklingDummy]

I love the rationalizations on this board, and the attempted moral equivalencies. Vick abused, tortured and murdered dogs. He threw family dogs in with trained fighting dogs to be maimed and killed. While I hate it when dogs are chained and neglected, what Vick did is at least a thousand times worse.

And pit bulls are just slightly more aggressive than other dogs. If trained and raised properly, they make great family dogs. They have to be trained with brute force, abuse and other means to be turned into killers.

Please don't try to sugar coat Vick's inhuman behavior.


There is no denying what Vick did was wrong. Just like there is no denying what millions of other dog owners do is wrong.

Have you ever seen what the do to greyhounds after their racing careers?

For ever good dog owner there is 10 bad dog owners. The chance the Pitbull is trained properly is slim.

[justasportsfan]

Chaining dogs up and leaving them in the back yard is another form of torture, imo.

Both are bad dog owners. I can walk around my city and find many dogs chained up in the backyard. Maybe those owners should be arrested for torture too. .


apples and oranges.



Pitbulls have always been looked down on for many years. Many places want to ban the breed altogether because of their aggressive nature. I don't blame any city for banning that breed. Whenever I see a Pitbull I walk the other way.


Plus we are talking about Pitbulls..

I get it. You have a bad understanding of what pittbulls are all about. They are no different from any other breed other than when they attack ,it's gets bad. BUt every breed attacks too so might as well get rid of all of them.

[justasportsfan]

I love the rationalizations on this board, and the attempted moral equivalencies. Vick abused, tortured and murdered dogs. He threw family dogs in with trained fighting dogs to be maimed and killed. While I hate it when dogs are chained and neglected, what Vick did is at least a thousand times worse.

And pit bulls are just slightly more aggressive than other dogs. If trained and raised properly, they make great family dogs. They have to be trained with brute force, abuse and other means to be turned into killers.

Please don't try to sugar coat Vick's inhuman behavior.


Pittbulls are very loyal. We can train chihuahua to be killers too.

[TacklingDummy]

to hurt more animals and run another gambling ring? the NFL needs to make an example out of somebody that they're not going to tolerate the thug-like attitudes that some professional ballplayers carry these days.

Ray Lewis was involved in a double murder and he still plays football.

Who's worse, someone who was involved in dog fighting or someone who was involved in murder?

[TacklingDummy]

apples and oranges.


leaving a dog in a car when its 90 degrees out is not torture?

leaving a dog tied up in the backyard with no water when its 90 degrees out is not torture?

apples and apples

[SABURZFAN]

And pit bulls are just slightly more aggressive than other dogs. If trained and raised properly, they make great family dogs. They have to be trained with brute force, abuse and other means to be turned into killers.


EXACTLY!!!! there's no such thing as a bad dog. it's a bad owner.

[TacklingDummy]

EXACTLY!!!! there's no such thing as a bad dog. it's a bad owner.

Sad to say there is millions of them out there.

Michael Vick wasn't the worst dog owner out there. He's just the most famous.

[SABURZFAN]

Ray Lewis was involved in a double murder and he still plays football.

Who's worse, someone who was involved in dog fighting or someone who was involved in murder?


i don't know all of the facts about it. therefore, i can't comment on him. did he do jail time? i don't remember.

they're both equally worse because death was involved in both case.

[TacklingDummy]

i don't know all of the facts about it. therefore, i can't comment on him. did he do jail time? i don't remember.No jail time. he got out of it somehow.


they're both equally worse because death was involved in both case.So you value human life and canine life the same?

You must also be anti-abortion?

[SABURZFAN]

Sad to say there is millions of them out there.

Michael Vick was wasn't the worst dog owner out there. He's just the most famous.


i know and he's no different than any other. they're all scum.

[Jan Reimers]

There is no denying what Vick did was wrong. Just like there is no denying what millions of other dog owners do is wrong.

Have you ever seen what the do to greyhounds after their racing careers?

For ever good dog owner there is 10 bad dog owners. The chance the Pitbull is trained properly is slim.
1) Most dog owners don't intentionally train their dogs to maim and kill each other. Most dog owners don't torture and abuse their dogs, throw family dogs in with fighting dogs, or do any of the horrendous things that Vick did. Are you actually equating the average dog owner to Michael Vick? Absurd.

2)Yes, I'm aware of everything that greyhounds go through. That's why my wife and I have been adopting them for almost twenty years. And thanks to many, many people involved in hundreds of greyhound rescue operations, most of them are now being adopted to good homes after their racing careers. There are still abuses, but does that exonerate Michael Vick?

3) Pit bulls can be raised by good owners to be good dogs. They are not inherently bad. People like Mike Vick simply give them a bad name. You are sorely misinformed about pit bulls.

[justasportsfan]

leaving a dog in a car when its 90 degrees out is not torture?sheez.

Thats negligence.Vick forced dogs to kill each other. He planned it. Premeditated. 1st degree.


leaving a dog tied up in the backyard with no water when its 90 degrees out is not torture?

apples and apples



Oh so now, it's 90 degrees. Now it's no water. Whats next ? He forces them to kill other dogs?

[SABURZFAN]

So you value human life and canine life the same?

You must also be anti-abortion?


:yawn:


there you go. jumping to conclusions.... :shakeno:

[TacklingDummy]

1) Most dog owners don't intentionally train their dogs to maim and kill each other. Most dog owners don't torture and abuse their dogs, throw family dogs in with fighting dogs, or do any of the horrendous things that Vick did. Are you actually equating the average dog owner to Michael Vick? Absurd. I disagree. I believe the majority of dog owners torture their dogs. Just not to the extent as Michael Vick did.


2)Yes, I'm aware of everything that greyhounds go through. That's why my wife and I have been adopting them for almost twenty years. And thanks to many, many people involved in hundreds of greyhound rescue operations, most of them are now being adopted to good homes after their racing careers. There are still abuses, but does that exonerate Michael Vick? :up:

I never said Vick should be exonerated. He payed his punishment that the court decided was proper.

3
) Pit bulls can be raised by good owners to be good dogs. They are not inherently bad. People like Mike Vick simply give them a bad name. You are sorely misinformed about pit bulls. The problem is there are more bad dog owners than there are good ones.

[TacklingDummy]

:yawn:


there you go. jumping to conclusions.... :shakeno:

Didn't jump to any conclusions. If you noticed at the end of each of my sentences there was a "?". That's a question mark. I see you avoided the questions though.

[TacklingDummy]

sheez.

Thats negligence. You call it negligence. I call it torture.

[justasportsfan]

You call it negligence. I call it torture.


Mkay!

[SABURZFAN]

Didn't jump to any conclusions. If you noticed at the end of each of my sentences there was a "?". That's a question mark.


since you really want to know...


i'll hold a canines life higher than most people. most people annoy me while most dogs don't.

if it aint mine, i don't care.

[Mahdi]

Mahdi, I have always respected your posts, and continue to do so. But pointing out one good game on the Frozen Tundra (were there a howling wind and blinding snow, or just cold weather?) reminds me of trading for Rob Johnson after one good game in Jacksonville. I just don't think Vick is a good NFL QB, and you know what I think of his character.
Well I guess we just differ on what Vick brings to the table as a football player.

I think he would add a whole other dimension to the offense. Watch some Falcons highlights or something you dont have to be a great QB to do what he did in ATL. He did it because he is a phenomenal athlete.

When you fake a hand-off to a good running back the defense has to respect that fake. If not its a big run for the RB, if they bite on the fake Vick has maybe 1 or 2 defenders to beat rolling to the opposite side. That is a very useful weapon to have in your offense. Particularly for a run first team like Buffalo.

[TacklingDummy]

if it aint mine, i don't care.


the dogs not yours, why should you care?

[Jan Reimers]

You call it negligence. I call it torture.
What Vick did was premeditated murder. There is a world of difference between the atrocities that Vick committed and the bad behavior that some neglectful dog owners exhibit. I agree with you that chaining a dog in the hot sun with no water is a terrible thing.

But Vick's intentional, heinous actions cannot be excused because others are less than responsible dog owners.

[TacklingDummy]

But Vick's intentional, heinous actions cannot be excused because others are less than responsible dog owners.No one is excusing his actions. What Vick did was wrong.

Does he not deserve another chance though? Maybe with a clause in his contract that X amount of money should be donated to the Human Society and other canine stuff. Maybe he can help save more lives than he took.

[SABURZFAN]

the dogs not yours, why should you care?


i don't.

[Mahdi]

regardless of character, anyone who has a hobby and stops for 2 years, knows it's a big learning curve to get back up to that ability again. And that's a Hobby, imagine how much you multiply that by when you are talking about the NFL.

2 years in prison, just weightlifting, not doing NFL style drills, Vick has a lot to catch up to. I just don't think he's goign to be a good fit for anyone.

If you sign him, you are signing him knowing that this year is a wash. And then he's 31 next year. he's had a couple injuries, i just don't think it's worth the risk for an GM to take. There has to be a player or two coming out of college next year that makes you feel comfortable.
A wash? how? ....

Any team that brings in Vick will do so based on the idea that he will be a running QB, not to come in and run the west coast offense or the no huddle.

Vick can have instant impact on any team's offense simply by stepping on the field and handing the ball off to a RB because the threat of him holding it and running the other way is what makes him who he is.

[Jan Reimers]

No one is excusing his actions. What Vick did was wrong.

Does he not deserve another chance though? Maybe with a clause in his contract that X amount of money should be donated to the Human Society and other canine stuff. Maybe he can help save more lives than he took.
I think he should be reinstated, and it would be great to have him working with and/or supporting the Humane Society or SPCA.

I'm just such a dog lover, however, that I would never accept him as a Bill. As I have said, God can forgive him, but I can't.

[billogic99]

I call BS on this ENTIRE article.

First, Taylor is old, expensive and doesn't fit the system. When was the last time the Bills went after anyone who was ONE of those things, let alone all three? I'm not trying to bash the FO (at least not right now), but for better or worse, it's simply not how they operate.

Whens the last time?.....Umm, this year with TO!

[Mahdi]

since you really want to know...


i'll hold a canines life higher than most people. most people annoy me while most dogs don't.

if it aint mine, i don't care.
Thats Dumb.

[SABURZFAN]

I think he should be reinstated,

after he serves some kind of suspension for lying to the league. i feel he hasn't repaid his debt to the NFL yet.

[SABURZFAN]

Thats Dumb.


that's life.

[justasportsfan]

A wash? how? ....

Any team that brings in Vick will do so based on the idea that he will be a running QB, not to come in and run the west coast offense or the no huddle.

Vick can have instant impact on any team's offense simply by stepping on the field and handing the ball off to a RB because the threat of him holding it and running the other way is what makes him who he is.
He's been out of football for 2 years. He wasn't even that good to begin with and I don't think he's going to come in and easily become an impact player. He's not superman. Don't forget what division we belong to. He's not going to easily outsmart the coaches in this division.

[Jan Reimers]

after he serves some kind of suspension for lying to the league. i feel he hasn't repaid his debt to the NFL yet.
Yeah, I should have said that. And Goodell seems to be in no hurry to reinstate him, and has said he wants to see some genuine remorse. But I really don't know how you can be sure that a guy is truly sorry.

[TacklingDummy]

But I really don't know how you can be sure that a guy is truly sorry.Like most people who got caught doing something wrong, he's sorry he got caught.

[Italian Stallion]

Bottom line for me...I'm a Bills fan and I want to see them win, end of story. If Vick can do that I'm all for it. The 90's Cowboys that whopped our asses in the Super Bowl wern't the most upstanding citizens either, but guess what they won...alot.

As for those of you that de-value their own lives by even trying to equate murder, rape and molestation and the like to "just as bad" as dog fighting...I feel very sorry for you. Sorry that your life must be so sad and lonely that you need the blind reinforcement of the idea of love (considering dogs are incapable of speech or anything humans are) from an inferior animal to comfort you more than human interaction and love.

Again, what Vick did was wrong, but he's more than paid his debt to society. It's the HUMAN murderers, rapists and molestors that deserve punishment far beyond what many of you still feel Vick deserves.

I truly hope he signs with the Bills....and we win. ALOT.

And Jan Remiers and all the others like him will jump off a bridge and renounce their Bills fanhood before they get to see any of it.....but make sure, after all, that you take your pooch with you...and see if he responds with the love and satisfaction you seek (although you'll end up looking more like Tom Hanks in Cast Away talking to a volleyball...because after all, when's the last time your dog told you...anything?????)

But I guess you probally have to go now...after all the huma..errr the dog **** in your backyard and you best go clean it up before he does it in the house.....nice relationship huh? Man....color me jealous.

[Jan Reimers]

And Jan Remiers and all the others like him will jump off a bridge and renounce their Bills fanhood before they get to see any of it.....but make sure, after all, that you take your pooch with you...and see if he responds with the love and satisfaction you seek (although you'll end up looking more like Tom Hanks in Cast Away talking to a volleyball...because after all, when's the last time your dog told you...anything?????)

My dog told me you're an idiot.

[Italian Stallion]

My dog told me you're an idiot.


Hahaha nice comeback old man...honestly, I walked into that one.

Anyway, that's how I feel about it, so sue me

[Mahdi]

He's been out of football for 2 years. He wasn't even that good to begin with and I don't think he's going to come in and easily become an impact player. He's not superman. Don't forget what division we belong to. He's not going to easily outsmart the coaches in this division.
Pretty sure the lowly Dolphins beat the genius Bill Belichick with the WildCat.

[THATHURMANATOR]

Sign Vick if he can help the team win. He served his time.

[Jan Reimers]

Hahaha nice comeback old man...honestly, I walked into that one.

Anyway, that's how I feel about it, so sue me
Just a difference of opinion. No harm, no foul.

[Jan Reimers]

Just a difference of opinion. No harm, no foul.
My dog also said - because he's a dog - he likes you, anyway. Then he licked his butt and went back to sleep.

[SABURZFAN]

Sign Vick if he can help the team win. He served his time.


he served his time to society. he still needs to be punished by the NFL for lying to them.

[SABURZFAN]

My dog also said - because he's a dog - he likes you, anyway. Then he licked his butt and went back to sleep.


Italion Stallion doesn't want to be shown up so he's licking his butt too.

[Jan Reimers]

Pretty sure the lowly Dolphins beat the genius Bill Belichick with the WildCat.
They certainly did, but as it becomes more widely used, defensive coaches will game plan for it, and it will become less successful.

[BillsWin]

I can't do it... no... I wont... no.... nope.... cant.... no Vick.... oh wait, Mike Florio wrote this?

ok. we're good! :up:

[Mahdi]

They certainly did, but as it becomes more widely used, defensive coaches will game plan for it, and it will become less successful.
Yes. But here is the thing.

Coaches have not been successful for the most part stopping a RB taking the the snap in the wildcat.

Its going to be even harder to stop a QB like Vick out of the Wildcat since at any moment he can throw it.

What do you do with your safety? Keep him back in case of pass or bring him down to stop the run?

[Italian Stallion]

Italion Stallion doesn't want to be shown up so he's licking his butt too.

Make sure to let that dogs tounge lick your face now like ya always do....UGH

I'll take a fat drunk broad at a bar anyday over an ass flavored sloppy kiss from a dog, thank you

[THATHURMANATOR]

he served his time to society. he still needs to be punished by the NFL for lying to them.
Doesn't matter to me.

[OpIv37]

Yes. But here is the thing.

Coaches have not been successful for the most part stopping a RB taking the the snap in the wildcat.

Its going to be even harder to stop a QB like Vick out of the Wildcat since at any moment he can throw it.

What do you do with your safety? Keep him back in case of pass or bring him down to stop the run?

so what are we gonna do? Use the Wildcat as a base offense?

The Wildcat is a change of pace play. It's used 5 times a game, 10 tops. Is that worth having Vick on the roster? I certainly don't think so.

[OpIv37]

Sign Vick if he can help the team win. He served his time.

But he can't. That's why this discussion is so meaningless.

[Mr. Pink]

Michael Vick is a better QB than this franchise has had since Jim Kelly retired.

If you think otherwise, you're just blinded with the hatred you have from his actions.

I've seen the love some have for Flutie on here, and Vick is a better QB than Flutie ever was.

Those are facts.

We'd have a playmaker and difference maker at the position. A guy who can take the team on his back on Sunday and be the difference between a L and a W. If you don't believe that, go watch some of what he did in Atlanta.

Or just remember back to the last time he played here against us.

[OpIv37]

Michael Vick is a better QB than this franchise has had since Jim Kelly retired.

If you think otherwise, you're just blinded with the hatred you have from his actions.

I've seen the love some have for Flutie on here, and Vick is a better QB than Flutie ever was.

Those are facts.

We'd have a playmaker and difference maker at the position. A guy who can take the team on his back on Sunday and be the difference between a L and a W. If you don't believe that, go watch some of what he did in Atlanta.

Or just remember back to the last time he played here against us.

He's not a difference maker- he's a playmaker but he makes as many mistakes as he does big plays.

He's better than any QB we've had since Kelly? Really? He's better than Todd Collins, Rob Johnson, Doug Flutie, Drew Bledsoe, Billy Joe Hobert, Alex Van Pelt and JP Losman? So what? There's a lot of room between "better than those guys" and "good enough to help the team."

You act like none of us were critical of Vick before his conviction, when in fact many of us were. My opinion of him was exactly the same before these charges came up. He's fun to watch, as long as he's not QBing your team because you're always afraid he'll do something stupid.

[TacklingDummy]

he served his time to society. he still needs to be punished by the NFL for lying to them.Some would say he didn't serve enough time.

[TacklingDummy]

Michael Vick is a better QB than this franchise has had since Jim Kelly retired.

What was Atlanta's record when Vick started?

[TacklingDummy]

38-28-1

[ddaryl]

I'd rather go 0-16 for the rest of my life as a Bills fan then to even consider Vick being on this team.

I'm too much of a dog lover and just find it beyond comprehension on how a person can willingly chain up dogs beat them until they turn mean enough and then fight them to the death for pleasure and profit.

yes there are other athletes I find equally screwed up... but Vick does not deserve another chance, and if he gets one I guarentee it will bring nothing but pain to the franchise that does. He will be attacked everywhere he goes and it will destroy any team he is a aprt of.

[Mahdi]

so what are we gonna do? Use the Wildcat as a base offense?

The Wildcat is a change of pace play. It's used 5 times a game, 10 tops. Is that worth having Vick on the roster? I certainly don't think so.
Cmon Man,


This is my 10th post on this issue and I have clearly stated in all of them that it would be a supplement to our base offense.

We could use it to mix things up and when bad whether keeps Trent from throwing the ball.

How many games have we lost because Trent can't throw in bad weather? at least 4. Is that worth having a player like Vick. Yes.

[SABURZFAN]

Some would say he didn't serve enough time.


it doesn't matter what people think. he did what the legal system assigned him and nobody can argue that.

[SABURZFAN]

Doesn't matter to me.


that's because he didn't lie to you.

[TheMan08]

so what are we gonna do? Use the Wildcat as a base offense?

The Wildcat is a change of pace play. It's used 5 times a game, 10 tops. Is that worth having Vick on the roster? I certainly don't think so.

If those ten plays lead to points. YES. Pts are at a premium with this team. Vick is a gamechanger with his legs. Sop in that Wild cat those 5-10 plays can be huge.

[kid mickey]

Mike Vick deserves a break. Don't think it will be in Buffalo, but the possibilities would be cool. I mean you run some plays where he could do different things like line up as a WR or HB and mix him at QB and some crazy things could happen. I am not talking about him as a starter, but as a role player and that would make the Bills offense extremely dangerous. I wouldn't mind seeing him in a Bills uniform. It would never happen though.

[DrGraves]

Championship!

[justasportsfan]

Pretty sure the lowly Dolphins beat the genius Bill Belichick with the WildCat.
are you forgetting who OUR coaches are?

[Mike13]

Lets see a QB who cant throw and a WR who constantly wants the ball, sounds like a match made in heaven.

[Mahdi]

are you forgetting who OUR coaches are?
no

[Typ0]

If MV understands that the culture he was a part of created his attitudes about dog fighting and those attitudes aren't socially accepted in the US then why give the guy grief over it? I say give people a break and a chance to express they have learned from their mistakes. If they can't do that then throw them to the dogs.