Support the "Ralph is cheap" argument please

[cocamide]

Over and over again, we have to hear about how cheap Ralph is. I'm not saying that this is false, but where is the data to support this claim? Does the following link not tell the whole story? According to it, we're in the middle of the pack when it comes to total payroll for 2008. If you look at the 2007 numbers, we're right near the top. Am I missing something?

http://content.usatoday.com/sports/football/nfl/salaries/totalpayroll.aspx?year=2008

[Nighthawk]

Over and over again, we have to hear about how cheap Ralph is. I'm not saying that this is false, but where is the data to support this claim? Does the following link not tell the whole story? According to it, we're in the middle of the pack when it comes to total payroll for 2008. If you look at the 2007 numbers, we're right near the top. Am I missing something?

http://content.usatoday.com/sports/football/nfl/salaries/totalpayroll.aspx?year=2008

Cash to cap is totally different then spending more money then the top teams in the league. It makes it look like they spend a bunch of money, but they don't. Somebody had a thread about this awhile back and there was a news article about it...I wish I could find it. It pretty much backed up the fact that Ralphy is one of the cheaper owners.

[Pinkerton Security]

I mean, we do always seem to have a ton of cap room. I dont really pay attention to salaries though, so i cant talk very much to this fact.

[yordad]

We are in the middle. That may count money that other clubs spread out over the length of the contract. It also may count dead cap space, afterall, if any money was due Walker or Dockery (from their signing bonuses), it counts this year.

We are probably a projected 50 million under next years cap.

Also, because players did not hit escalates in their contracts last yea, the Bills had an extra 20ish million allowed to them this year. Not only did Ralph just keep it, he didn't even spend up to what would have been allowed without it.

[cocamide]

Cash to cap is totally different then spending more money then the top teams in the league. It makes it look like they spend a bunch of money, but they don't. Somebody had a thread about this awhile back and there was a news article about it...I wish I could find it. It pretty much backed up the fact that Ralphy is one of the cheaper owners.

I was thinking it could be a cash-to-the-cap reason. I'd be curious to see the article to see how cash to the cap makes it look like we pay more than we do.

[Mudflap1]

Ralph isn't that cheap on players. He'll splurge now and then and bring some guys in, or keep guys that we have.

However, Ralph has been cheap with GMs and coaches. He lucked out that Bill Polian was a young guy that got promoted internally and turned out to be the best GM in the NFL. Marv Levy was a journeyman coach who caught fire with the guys Polian brought in. The only other front office guy Ralph really spent money on was Tom Donahoe. Other than that... Russ Brandon, Marv Levy (GM), Gregg Williams, Mike Mularkey, Dick Jauron? Come on. All third tier choices. The only reason he brought in Tom Donahoe was because he let John Butler go, along with A.J. Smith. Smart move. Let's piss off Butler, Smith, and of course Bill Polian and get rid of all of them. The team hasn't been the same since.

[ddaryl]

He definitley goes for th cheap option on GM's and HC's

players have been a mixed bag. this year I was upset that we didn't bring in a top notch C or LB in the free agency, However hargartner is playing real well... but a all pro LB would have been appreciated even though there were slim pickens in FA

[Philagape]

Cash to cap is totally different then spending more money then the top teams in the league. It makes it look like they spend a bunch of money, but they don't. Somebody had a thread about this awhile back and there was a news article about it...I wish I could find it. It pretty much backed up the fact that Ralphy is one of the cheaper owners.

Was it this one? NE39 nailed it:

http://www.billszone.com/fanzone/showthread.php?p=2904608&highlight=Ralph#post2904608

[cocamide]

Was it this one? NE39 nailed it:

http://www.billszone.com/fanzone/showthread.php?p=2904608&highlight=Ralph#post2904608

Good find, thank you.

[yordad]

Basically, other clubs want to win so bad they will count some of the signed contracts toward future years, allowing them to spend more now, whereas the Bills don't like to. I don't understand why either, especially if they are projecting no cap limit here shortly.

The Bills, of course, don't even spend up to their self imposed cash to cap, so they are perpetually less then average.

[yordad]

One method seems to keep you in a constant state of average talent, whereas one method seems to give you years of an abundance, followed but a couple rebuilding years of repair.

Unless of course you are as successful as the Patriots, then successful proven vets take paycuts to come play for you. :(

[Stewie]

unless you guys are reading stuff in other articles, I don't see how this has anything to do with cash to cap, which is accounting principles for cash flow management

this chart shows totoal payroll over the last 2 seaons. and if accurate, we're in the top third of spending over that timespan

so basically the OP was right...people need to stfu about ralph

[yordad]

unless you guys are reading stuff in other articles, I don't see how this has anything to do with cash to cap, which is accounting principles for cash flow management

this chart shows totoal payroll over the last 2 seaons. and if accurate, we're in the top third of spending over that timespan

so basically the OP was right...people need to stfu about ralphJust because you don't grasp it, doesn't mean we should stfu.

[Stewie]

Just because you don't grasp it, doesn't mean we should stfu.
I don't grasp what exactly?

so far, I havent seen anyone tell me how an accounting princinple used by one of ralph wilson corporations has anything to do with the bills total payroll expenditure in 2007 or 2008, 2009.

care to try?

[yordad]

I don't grasp what exactly?

so far, I havent seen anyone tell me how an accounting princinple used by one of ralph wilson corporations has anything to do with the bills total payroll expenditure in 2007 or 2008, 2009.

care to try?I don't think I have enough time to fill you in.

I'll give you the short version.... The Bills are way under their cap, and they don't keep that money for next year. They are projected to be somewhere in the 50 million under range for next year. Get it?

[Pinkerton Security]

Just because you don't grasp it, doesn't mean we should stfu.

without looking at any other factors, look at this: how much money do we spend every year, compared to other teams? if we are in the bottom of the league, then yes ralph is cheap. However, if what im reading in other posts is correct, we are generally around the middle of the league in spending.

You can spin it in many ways, but the fact of the matter is that ralph spends an average amount of money and spend more than half the league every year.

[Stewie]

I don't think I have enough time to fill you in.

I'll give you the short version.... The Bills are way under their cap, and they don't keep that money for next year. They are projected to be somewhere in the 50 million under range for next year. Get it?

no. nothing you said has anything to do with coherence, logic, the OP, or anything I said. I declare your post a loser and I also declare my responses the biggest waste of forty six seconds of my tuesday. Thank you for nothing, and may God have mercy on Ralph.

[Pinkerton Security]

I don't think I have enough time to fill you in.

I'll give you the short version.... The Bills are way under their cap, and they don't keep that money for next year. They are projected to be somewhere in the 50 million under range for next year. Get it?

So your only set of data is this year? Good hypothesis.

[Stewie]

So your only set of data is this year? Good hypothesis.
no, this years data are not in. his sets of data are from his crystal ball. which I'm sure is freaking awesome.

[Dr. Lecter]

I don't think I have enough time to fill you in.

I'll give you the short version.... The Bills are way under their cap, and they don't keep that money for next year. They are projected to be somewhere in the 50 million under range for next year. Get it?

Since you are wrong on two points in this post, you should be nicer to Paul

1. The Bills are not "way under the cap", espcially since teh McGee extension (depending on how much was rolled into this year.). At the start of the season they were about 15 milioninder the cap. That is fairly standard, as practice squad players count against the cap and so do injury replacement players.

2, How they projected to be under next year's cap when, at the current time, next year is uncapped?

[bigbub2352]

very easy
he doesnt pay for front office and coaching staff, and because of this and his bad direction form the underqualified staff pays players who dont deserve it
Schobel
Kelsay
Reed
Denney
to name a few

[alohabillsfan]

Daniel Snyder isn't cheap and whats he got in return?

[Dr. Lecter]

very easy
he doesnt pay for front office and coaching staff, and because of this and his bad direction form the underqualified staff pays players who dont deserve it
Schobel
Kelsay
Reed
Denney
to name a few

I think most (many) agree he has been cheap on coaches and the FO. But not players. Spending poorly is different than cheap.

Although I am not sure what your problem is with Reed. His pay and production are not really out of line. He is a #3 WR and is paid like a #3 WR.

[yordad]

Since you are wrong on two points in this post, you should be nicer to Paul

1. The Bills are not "way under the cap", espcially since teh McGee extension (depending on how much was rolled into this year.). At the start of the season they were about 15 milioninder the cap. That is fairly standard, as practice squad players count against the cap and so do injury replacement players.

2, How they projected to be under next year's cap when, at the current time, next year is uncapped?I'm not the one telling mass amounts of people to stfu.

1. I am not a capologist, and we do not have exact figures. I would like to see where you got yours. Also, if true, which I doubt without a solid link (no offense) much of that is probably dead with the cutting of Dockery and Walker. Spent, but a non planed expenditure. "Accidentally" spent. What happened to the extra money the Bills were allowed this year due to unfullfilled bonuses?

2. You are right, I worded that wrong. Right now we are probably 50 million less then the next lowest spender for next year.

It the Bills are in fact using cash to cap and counting all/any of McGee's signing bonus toward the cap this year, just look what we have for next year salaries.

The numbers in the article yall refer to are not taking into account bonus money owed in future year by other teams. Money the Bills do not owe because they do not operate in that manor. But basically, I don;'t know what they took into account for that article.

I just know Philly pays 10 million a year for a single lineman and the Bills pay less than 6 million for the entire starting o-line!!! And it isn't like we saved that money and spent it on our QB! Or Our DTs. Our our LBs. Or our CBs. Our our cheap safeties. Just look at what Bills make.

We have Schobel, who isn't really that expensive in todays DE market, Lee and Owens. That's it.

[bigbub2352]

I think most (many) agree he has been cheap on coaches and the FO. But not players. Spending poorly is different than cheap.

Although I am not sure what your problem is with Reed. His pay and production are not really out of line. He is a #3 WR and is paid like a #3 WR.
my problem with Reed is he doesnt score and i think for the last 6-7yrs we could have done a hell of alot better than him when he was the number 2, and still have a better player than him at least athletically in steve johnson riding the pine
i have never been a fan of reed and will continue not to be until he makes a play of relevance and justifys why he has been here so long. all he has done is contributed a few 1st downs here and there
i would have rather spend the money they used to sign him to get a different WR with size and maybe some redzone capability
i feel the reason Ralph did overpay for some of the vets is due to his cheapness with pro player personel and manegement its like a trickle down effect
hence no playoffs for close to 10yrs
and horrible Free Agents and subpar drafting

[BuffaloRanger]

Look at Ralph historically. His "cheap" reputation has been well earned over the last 40 years. He was hated in the 70s and 80s by Bills fans. The only coach he ever hired with a playoff win to his credit was Chuck Knox. 17 playoff seasons in 49 years. Should that be blamed on his cheapness or incompetence?

Let's look at recent history. The Bills were 7-9 the last 3 seasons with zero playoff appearances this decade. He refuses to spend money on a decent coach with more then 1 winning season to his credit. He signed TO for 6.5 mil, but saved far more by trading Peters and cutting Dockery and langston. Net gain?!

He didn't deserve the HOF based only on what he did with the AFL. His secret loans to keep the pats and raiders going were self serving in that they protected his investment in the Bills. If those teams had folded the AFL could have disbanded.

Finally, I will never understand why a man in his 90s doesn't just go for it and bring in the best fre agents possible. Yes it doesn't guarentee winning, but it greatly improves your odds. Does he think he can take the money with him? On his death bed I wonder if he'll regret not winning a Super Bowl? He could have done something about it over the last 10 years.

[Dr. Lecter]

I'm not the one telling mass amounts of people to stfu.

1. I am not a capologist, and we do not have exact figures. I would like to see where you got yours. Also, if true, which I doubt without a solid link (no offense) much of that is probably dead with the cutting of Dockery and Walker. Spent, but a non planed expenditure. "Accidentally" spent. What happened to the extra money the Bills were allowed this year due to unfullfilled bonuses?

2. You are right, I worded that wrong. Right now we are probably 50 million less then the next lowest spender for next year.

It the Bills are in fact using cash to cap and counting all/any of McGee's signing bonus toward the cap this year, just look what we have for next year salaries.

The numbers in the article yall refer to are not taking into account bonus money owed in future year by other teams. Money the Bills do not owe because they do not operate in that manor. But basically, I don;'t know what they took into account for that article.

I just know Philly pays 10 million a year for a single lineman and the Bills pay less than 6 million for the entire starting o-line!!! And it isn't like we saved that money and spent it on our QB! Or Our DTs. Our our LBs. Or our CBs. Our our cheap safeties. Just look at what Bills make.

We have Schobel, who isn't really that expensive in todays DE market, Lee and Owens. That's it.

The number was out of the Buffalo News.

As for #2, are you basing that on anything but baseless speculation?

And while you compare the Eagles spending 10 million on Peters, you conveniently leave out that the Evans and Owens are both making more than the Eagles entire recieving crew is probably making.

As for DTs you are wrong - Marcus Stroud signed an extension in the offseason and Williams signed one last year. They also signed McGee at CB just last week. Schobel is still a high cost, as is Kelsay. At LB Mitchell is not cheap.

Don't let sentiment over-ride facts.

[trapezeus]

The number 1 reason that Ralph is cheap is:

1. Keeping Jauron after last years meltdown. other than Al Davis, i cna' think of another owner who would let a 5-1 team end with only 2 more wins and none against an above .500 team or against a divisional opponent. He should have eaten that $9MM over 3 years. That is one Toronto game for him.

And should we elect to not call him cheap, it makes him stubborn.

And his stubbornness has cost us more than his supposed cheapness. The proof is looking at what Bill Polian has done since he left. He built an expansion team into a winner in less than two years and now has built the colts to be a perennial top 5 team for over 10 years. Even more annoying is that you watch last night, and he replaced a stud of marvin harrison with a new stud Reggie Wayne. He has a great line...he gets good people.

The chargers while in turmoil with AJ Smith's personality, typically have the talent year in year out.

We are left with marginal talent and a couple possible studs and no solid coaching to bring them along. And he's let that go on for 10 years. That's embarassing for him and his inability to say, "i got it wrong and i need to fix it."

[Dr. Lecter]

my problem with Reed is he doesnt score and i think for the last 6-7yrs we could have done a hell of alot better than him when he was the number 2, and still have a better player than him at least athletically in steve johnson riding the pine
i have never been a fan of reed and will continue not to be until he makes a play of relevance and justifys why he has been here so long. all he has done is contributed a few 1st downs here and there
i would have rather spend the money they used to sign him to get a different WR with size and maybe some redzone capability
i feel the reason Ralph did overpay for some of the vets is due to his cheapness with pro player personel and manegement its like a trickle down effect
hence no playoffs for close to 10yrs
and horrible Free Agents and subpar drafting

I agree he is not a fit as a #2, but dismissing his ability to make first downs is not wise. A guy that can make the 6 yard catch on 3rd and 4 is valuable. He is not a big play guy, for sure.

And Steve Johnson might be a better athlete, but he is not a better football player. Reed runs better routes, has better hands and is the better blocker.

Johnson is likley to be #3 next year, but for now Reed fills a role.

[yordad]

The number was out of the Buffalo News.

As for #2, are you basing that on anything but baseless speculation?

And while you compare the Eagles spending 10 million on Peters, you conveniently leave out that the Evans and Owens are both making more than the Eagles entire recieving crew is probably making.

As for DTs you are wrong - Marcus Stroud signed an extension in the offseason and Williams signed one last year. They also signed McGee at CB just last week. Schobel is still a high cost, as is Kelsay. At LB Mitchell is not cheap.

Don't let sentiment over-ride facts.Just because i don't have all day to dig up facts doesn't mean my admitted specualtion is baseless.

Maybe I should have just pointed out Jauron's pay compared to that of the league average for head coaches.

Oh, and I did mention our WRs.

[bigbub2352]

I agree he is not a fit as a #2, but dismissing his ability to make first downs is not wise. A guy that can make the 6 yard catch on 3rd and 4 is valuable. He is not a big play guy, for sure.

And Steve Johnson might be a better athlete, but he is not a better football player. Reed runs better routes, has better hands and is the better blocker.

Johnson is likley to be #3 next year, but for now Reed fills a role.
i still cant stand him LOL

[yordad]

So your only set of data is this year? Good hypothesis.Do you think I need to stare at, memorize, and report 50 years of Bills history to make a casual observation? Do you think I have assess to all the relevant info? Not to mention, apparently I would have to ask every single poster a number of qualifying questions, including "How long does one have to be cheap for, in order for one to be considered cheap?"

If you want to explain the article yall keep referring to, I would have to ask its writer about 20 different questions.

[Pinkerton Security]

Do you think I need to stare at, memorize, and report 50 years of Bills history to make a casual observation? Do you think I have assess to all the relevant info? Not to mention, apparently I would have to ask every single poster a number of qualifying questions, including "How long does one have to be cheap for, in order for one to be considered cheap?"

If you want to explain the article yall keep referring to, I would have to ask its writer about 20 different questions.

uh no you can simply look at the numbers on our rankings in league spend, provided to us conveniently somewhere in this thread already:

http://www.billszone.com/fanzone/showthread.php?p=2904608&highlight=Ralph#post2904608

If you dont have enough time to read it:

2004: 19th
2005: 17th
2006: 30th
2007: 4th
2008: 16th

So basically, we are usually around the middle of the league in spending. Could we spend more? Yup. Could we spend less? Certainly. My point was that saying "holy crap we have a ton of cap room this year LOLZ ralph is cheap!!1!" doesnt exactly paint the whole picture.

[BuffaloRanger]

Only the Lions, Bills, and Texans have failed to make the playoffs this decade. The Lions problem was Matt Millen. The Texans are an expansion team that didn't play their first game until 2002.

So you make the point that Ralph isn't cheap. If that's not the excuse for failure, I guess he must really be the WORST OWNER IN THE NFL!

Heck maybe good coaches and GMs are worth the money afterall Ralphie! HAHA

[Mr. Pink]

Ralph has poor talent evaluators in place who pay money out to the wrong players.

Sign extensions for the wrong players.

And let guys who should be core guys walk.

That about sums up why this team has been mediocre for a while now.

[PromoTheRobot]

Cash to cap is totally different then spending more money then the top teams in the league. It makes it look like they spend a bunch of money, but they don't. Somebody had a thread about this awhile back and there was a news article about it...I wish I could find it. It pretty much backed up the fact that Ralphy is one of the cheaper owners.

Please explain how if there is a cap one team can spend more than another in the long run? If you overspend this season it has to come back in a later season. Cash-to-cap means you aren't mortgaging your future, not spending less. But don't let reality spoil your little fantasy world.

PTR

[Pinkerton Security]

Only the Lions, Bills, and Texans have failed to make the playoffs this decade. The Lions problem was Matt Millen. The Texans are an expansion team that didn't play their first game until 2002.

So you make the point that Ralph isn't cheap. If that's not the excuse for failure, I guess he must really be the WORST OWNER IN THE NFL!

Heck maybe good coaches and GMs are worth the money afterall Ralphie! HAHA

i think its more that our coaches have sucked than ralphie sucking, though then i guess you could say he sucks for hiring such bad coaches..

[yordad]

uh no you can simply look at the numbers on our rankings in league spend, provided to us conveniently somewhere in this thread already:

http://www.billszone.com/fanzone/showthread.php?p=2904608&highlight=Ralph#post2904608

If you dont have enough time to read it:

2004: 19th
2005: 17th
2006: 30th
2007: 4th
2008: 16th

So basically, we are usually around the middle of the league in spending. Could we spend more? Yup. Could we spend less? Certainly. My point was that saying "holy crap we have a ton of cap room this year LOLZ ralph is cheap!!1!" doesnt exactly paint the whole picture.
So they average 17th. Do you think that is a coincidence they just miss the playoffs every year?

Can you please explain how they arrived at these figures?

And, if Ralph is cutting all the players owed bonuses, can you calculate approximately how much money Ralph has counted toward next year? Compared to other teams, he is probably on the books for an average of 40 million less then everyone else next year.

Yes, I am pulling this number out of air, but just look at who is owed a big bonus?

[OpIv37]

Over and over again, we have to hear about how cheap Ralph is. I'm not saying that this is false, but where is the data to support this claim? Does the following link not tell the whole story? According to it, we're in the middle of the pack when it comes to total payroll for 2008. If you look at the 2007 numbers, we're right near the top. Am I missing something?

http://content.usatoday.com/sports/football/nfl/salaries/totalpayroll.aspx?year=2008

Dick Jauron: tied for the lowest paid coach in the NFL.

When it comes to players, Ralph isn't necessarily cheap- he just puts his money in the wrong places (ie, resigning Kelsay and Schobel, not resigning Winfield and P. Williams). When it comes to coaches, Ralph is absolutely cheap. I don't ever see Ralph shelling out for a top level coach like Cowher or Shanahan.

[Nighthawk]

Please explain how if there is a cap one team can spend more than another in the long run? If you overspend this season it has to come back in a later season. Cash-to-cap means you aren't mortgaging your future, not spending less. But don't let reality spoil your little fantasy world.

PTR

Wow, PTR, you're possibly the biggest tool on this board. If an owner only spends cash to cap, it stops him from spending more on players because he doesn't have the luxury of spreading out the bonus money. Spreading out the bonus money creates more room to spend more money on players in that year. Yes, they have to be careful how you do it, but it does allow teams to "go over" the cap. So, are you keeping up or is it too hard of a concept for you??? No, spending gobs of money on every FA doesn't guarantee anything, but keeping some good players and paying them the money, is not always a bad thing. Now go back to your room and make some happy music with yourself!

[SABURZFAN]

Wow, PTR, you're possibly the biggest tool on this board.


the biggest tool on this board is yordad. his posts in this thread alone has proven it.

[SABURZFAN]

:yawn:


:z:

[SABURZFAN]

shut up, stupid. :rolleyes:

[SABURZFAN]

dummy up, ya dummy. :rolleyes:

[SABURZFAN]

:yawn:


:z:

[cocamide]

Dick Jauron: tied for the lowest paid coach in the NFL.

When it comes to players, Ralph isn't necessarily cheap- he just puts his money in the wrong places (ie, resigning Kelsay and Schobel, not resigning Winfield and P. Williams). When it comes to coaches, Ralph is absolutely cheap. I don't ever see Ralph shelling out for a top level coach like Cowher or Shanahan.

I agree that he is cheap when it comes to his staff. I guess I was just looking at the players salaries. I'd love nothing more than for him to go out and get Cowher.

[SABURZFAN]

I agree that he is cheap when it comes to his staff. I guess I was just looking at the players salaries. I'd love nothing more than for him to go out and get Cowher.


me too but it'll never happen. the Old Fart only hires "yes" men. Cowher is not one of them.

[SABURZFAN]

do us a favor and stop breathing. :rolleyes:

[SABURZFAN]

:yawn:


:z:

[SABURZFAN]

:yawn:


:z:

[yordad]

:shutit: I can't even see your post SABs, but I'm positive it is gay.

By the way SABS, I hope you know that icon is for yawning, not giving head.

Why are you trying to ruin a good conversation with your infatuation with me? Again.

[Dr. Lecter]

Just stop it Sab.

It is getting old.

[SABURZFAN]

Just stop it Sab.

It is getting old.


whatever....... :rolleyes:

[chernobylwraiths]

Dick Jauron: tied for the lowest paid coach in the NFL.

When it comes to players, Ralph isn't necessarily cheap- he just puts his money in the wrong places (ie, resigning Kelsay and Schobel, not resigning Winfield and P. Williams). When it comes to coaches, Ralph is absolutely cheap. I don't ever see Ralph shelling out for a top level coach like Cowher or Shanahan.

And it is not Ralph picking the players to pay, it is the front office.

I agree that traditionally Ralph has not paid coaches or front office very highly (though I'm sure Levy probably got whatever he wanted and while Butler was here he wouldn't even talk to Ralph about how much he wanted). But I bet if Ralph did hire Shanahan and we didn't win right away, many on here would say he made the wrong decision again. (I really don't want Shanahan myself)

[chernobylwraiths]

whatever....... :rolleyes:

Come on man, just ignore him. If he IS ignoring you, he isn't seeing the posts, so why bother?

[Dr. Lecter]

I think, with his new contract, tha Jauron is around $3 million per and is in the middle of the pack for coaches.

[yordad]

According to this link, Jauron is 30th. link (http://coacheshotseat.com/SalariesNFLCoaches.htm)

[Jan Reimers]

According to this link, Jauron is 30th. link (http://coacheshotseat.com/SalariesNFLCoaches.htm)
That list is old.There are at least 10 coaches on it that are no longer head coaches in the NFL.

[Stewie]

who cares? jauron's job is to prepare the players so that they play as a team and their assignments are instinctual.

it's the players job to win championships. ask michael jordan.

this whole thing is rEdiculous, anyway. 3 million dollars? really? to coach a football team? all nfl coaches are overpaid by millions of dollars. yes, there are coaches out there better than dick jauron. not all of them are available when we have the opening, or want to come to buffalo. thats fine.

our team has showed a lot of promise. they're 1-1. they've scored at least 24 points on offense in two consecutive games. our defense is young and hungry. we are loaded with weapons at the skill positions on offense. and we're wasting time calling ralph cheap.

wtf people. stfu about ralph and enjoy the bills.

[yordad]

our team has showed a lot of promise. they're 1-1. they've scored at least 24 points on offense in two consecutive games. our defense is young and hungry. we are loaded with weapons at the skill positions on offense. and we're wasting time calling ralph cheap.

wtf people. stfu about ralph and enjoy the bills. Aren't you the same guy who wrote this?
no. nothing you said has anything to do with coherence, logic, the OP, or anything I said. I declare your post a loser and I also declare my responses the biggest waste of forty six seconds of my tuesday. Thank you for nothing, and may God have mercy on Ralph.

What does promise, records, and scores have to do with Ralph being cheap?

You are wasting your time. You are on a message board. Did you think something productive was going to come from it? Gez, if you want people to stfu, just don't click the link.

[trapezeus]

Cash to cap is fine. In fact after getting laughed at initially by owners as being cheap, 15 other owners jumped on board with it. So he's kind of a pioneer.

But i don't believe the cash to cap really covers GM's and coaching salaries.

The Pats, the steelers and the titans have shown us that you don't need an allstar team to win. you need players who want to play and you need a coach who can lose a player in one position and plug in another lesser player to succeed.

We don't have that with Jauron. We don't have that with Brandon. We continously get the wrong talent and the good ones we get we don't use properly.

Look at the colts with polian. If the bills had a stud like harrison for 10 years, the second he left, we wouldn't trust the guy who was brought in to replace him. But polian gets reggie wayne and dallas clark prior to it beinga problem. He did it with moulds and reed. His teams consistently have talent.

Ralph's method hasn't worked. and he still hasn't picked up on that. again perhaps its not cheapness that makes him do it, but you have to question the intelligence of a man who keeps trying to jam a square peg into a round hole.

[Stewie]

Aren't you the same guy who wrote this?

What does promise, records, and scores have to do with Ralph being cheap?

You are wasting your time. You are on a message board. Did you think something productive was going to come from it? Gez, if you want people to stfu, just don't click the link.

nothing. ralph is not cheap. your warrant is wrong, you are wrong, your post is wrong.

:gobills: