How many sacks will the defense get this year?

[Tatonka]

this is an unbiased poll.. just wondering how many sacks you think our defense will get.. you have to pick from the options.

[Mr. Miyagi]

How many did they have last season? How many did Tampa have last season?

[Tatonka]

i think we had 31.. tampa had 43.

[WG]

Yeah, but at least Tampa could pressure the QB.

Oh, sorry, I'm getting away from the point and too abstract now... :rolleyes:


The Bills ranked 25th last year in sacks at 31. Teams below us were:

the Jets
Seattle
Cleveland
Minnesota
Cincy
Dallas
Arizona

http://www.nfl.com/stats/teamsort/NFL/DEF-PASSING/2002/regular?&sort_col_1=11&sort_col_2=11&_1:col_1=11

So T and Dozer are right! We have no issues w/ our pass rush! It's fine now! Heck, if we add 3 this season, we can beat Detroit's total for last year.

[Tatonka]

if we can add .75 sacks a game, we can match tampa's production.

[Tatonka]

carolina's sacks really got them far.

[WG]

Actually, when looking at that list, the only teams w/ any real chance of actually being in or winning the SB were in the top 8 of sacks. I'm gonna step out on another limb here and state that sacks are indicative of a pass rush in general. Call me crazy!

I'm just curious where these other 12 plus sacks are gonna come from for us to be in that range this year.

Oh, I forgot, McKenzie and Jones are each a shoe in for 3 on a 16 game season. Too bad they both can't play at once, eh. Then we'd only need another 9+.

Hey, maybe Posey will get 15!

[Tatonka]

posey will get 5

spikes will have 3

wire will get 3

pat williams will get 3

adams will get 2

schobel will get 12

kelsay will get 3

mckenzie/jones will have 5

irons will have 3

fletcher will have 2

clements/winfield will get 3

drew bledsoe will have 10

[WG]

BTW, we got 3.5 from Bannan and Edwards last year at DT. Since Adams figures to take most of their reps, and since Adams hasn't posted more than 2 over the past 5 seasons, our production in sacks from that DT position may actually decrease.

So where are our sacks gonna come from this season if we're gonna have a lot more than the 31 we had last season?

[Tatonka]

i just answered your question.

[Tatonka]

"hey baby, there aint no easy way out..

hey I will stand my ground.. and i wont back down.. "

tom and the heartbreakers.

[WG]

Originally posted by Tatonka
posey will get 5

spikes will have 3

wire will get 3

pat williams will get 3

adams will get 2

schobel will get 12

kelsay will get 3

mckenzie/jones will have 5

irons will have 3

fletcher will have 2

clements/winfield will get 3

drew bledsoe will have 10

Let's hope so T. But as you have it, Irons, Jones, and McKenzie who will all be splitting one position, will have 8? I think you'll see one of the players emerge as our leading DE and IMO he won't have 8. As well, if it happens that one doesn't emerge, that won't be good either and will put us right back where we were last year from that perspective. I'd rather have McKenzie and Jones be busts and have Irons emerge as the clearcut starter than to have no one be of starter caliber such that we have to platoon again.

Also, I think the most that you'd ever see Schobel get is a dozen. He's simply not that fast. He's good, but it's difficult for me to imagine him ever having more than 10 or so.

I'll say:

Schobel: 10
Spikes: 5
Other DE: 5
Fletcher: 5
Posey: 4
Wire: 3
Williams: 3
Winfield: 1
Adams: 1
Others: 3

Total: 40

Last year:

Schobel: 8.5
Ahanotu: 5
Fletcher: 3
Wire: 3
Newman: 3
Irons: 2.5
Edwards: 2.5
Bannan: 1
Prioleau: 1
Williams: .5

Total: 31 (ESPN-only adds to 30, but 31 total)
For

[Mr. Miyagi]

T I guess you started this thread as a joke. So I answered 5000 sacks. :rolleyes:

Honestly, I think the number of sacks will go up dramatically from last year. I wouldn't be surprised if we have close to or even over 40 sacks. Our D speed has improved a lot and our run-stuffers are in place. QBs will have less time to throw, and if they hurry them our DBs will benefit from the pass rush. So then QBs will hesitate more often, ending up on the ground more.

I hope.

[WG]

I'm predicating Fletcher's 5 on the notion that having Adams and PW in the middle will open up some holes for Fletch to get thru. I see Schobel improving but only marginally. He was good last year.

IMO the big question will be how they use the LBs.

As well, Newman got 3 sacks in 10 games and is just entering his prime. So it'll be interesting to see how well Posey does in that respect given that he'll start all 16 and not get yanked for 2/3 of the plays when he does start. I.e., I think we could have done more w/ Newman last year and hope that this wasn't a "get rid of Butler's roster" move. Newman may very well be a better player than Posey.

[justasportsfan]

Originally posted by Tatonka

drew bledsoe will have 10

You're being way too pessimistic don't you think?

[WG]

Originally posted by Mr. Miyagi
T I guess you started this thread as a joke. So I answered 5000 sacks. :rolleyes:

Honestly, I think the number of sacks will go up dramatically from last year. I wouldn't be surprised if we have close to or even over 40 sacks. Our D speed has improved a lot and our run-stuffers are in place. QBs will have less time to throw, and if they hurry them our DBs will benefit from the pass rush. So then QBs will hesitate more often, ending up on the ground more.

I hope.

I guess that's where I'm a little confused Miyagi. There was that article talking about this supposed tremendous upgrade in speed on our D, but as of now, our corners are the same, there's nothing to indicate that Wire and PP won't start, and even if they don't I don't see an enormous upgrade in speed at the position one way or another. Adams isn't a speed player. In fact, he may be slower than those whom he replaced. Schobel and PW are the same. I don't know how we measure speed at a DE position w/o a known starter and when we had a variety of players platooning the spot last year.

So the only "speed" upgrade it can be argued is w/ Spikes and Posey. So are Moulds' comments perhaps being overemphasized?

Sure Spikes is faster than Robinson and better in so many ways that it's silly. But other than that, and that even only goes so far, where is this enormous difference coming from? Newman was not slow by any standard.

[Tatonka]

i think we already had some speed on the defense though.. we just replaced the slowest spots..

with spikes for that old man

and posey for an ineffective newman who for whatever reason, was not showing the speed he did in wade philips defense. and pat williams is one of the fastest dts in the league, as far as getting off the line and through the garbage, so sam adams, while not directly being fast, will help pat williams and schobel utilize their speed more.

[LABillsFan]

I really don't know if they'll have that many more than last year. I believe the Bills will have more tackles for losses though. If the addition of Adams plugs the middle with PW, teams could be running more to the outside which means the LB's DE's and Wire could be making tackles much closer to the line if not behind it.

[WG]

Originally posted by Tatonka
i think we already had some speed on the defense though.. we just replaced the slowest spots..

with spikes for that old man

and posey for an ineffective newman who for whatever reason, was not showing the speed he did in wade philips defense. and pat williams is one of the fastest dts in the league, as far as getting off the line and through the garbage, so sam adams, while not directly being fast, will help pat williams and schobel utilize their speed more.

So I'll assume that Moulds' comments were all hype as I suspected then.

But Newman, for all the criticism, still put up 3 sacks in very, very limited action. He can't have been all that slow, nor is he. The "for whatever reason" that you mention is simple lack of playing time. I'll wager any amount of ZBs that Newman has more sacks in Houston this season than Posey does in Buffalo.

[THATHURMANATOR]

How bout 2000 zbs WYS????

[WG]

Originally posted by LABillsFan
I really don't know if they'll have that many more than last year. I believe the Bills will have more tackles for losses though. If the addition of Adams plugs the middle with PW, teams could be running more to the outside which means the LB's DE's and Wire could be making tackles much closer to the line if not behind it.

I'm not expecting too many more sacks, but I am expecting our rushing defense to go from 132.6 YPG to less than 100 YPG or thereabouts!!! In the league's top 10 for sure!

We also don't face the horrendously talented RBs that we faced last season which will help.

We only face Williams twice and the Jets RBs twice.

Last year we faced Green, Tomlinson, a healthier Holmes, Portis/Denver's RBs, along w/ Williams and the Jets RBs. Also, Smith was stronger last year especially v. our porous rush D. This year Smith won't be as good and our rush D is significantly improved.

We will also face better Ds this season. Last season we only faced two top 10 scoring Ds in three games; Miami and Oakland.

This year we face 6 of last season's top 10 Ds and Tennessee will have improved and were #11 last year. So from that perspective, we have a tougher schedule.

[WG]

Originally posted by THATHURMANATOR
How bout 2000 zbs WYS????

For real?

Sure! Shoot me a PM confirming.

;)

[Tatonka]

Originally posted by Wys Guy


1. So I'll assume that Moulds' comments were all hype as I suspected then.

2. I'll wager any amount of ZBs that Newman has more sacks in Houston this season than Posey does in Buffalo.

1st, why would you assume that?

2nd, i will bet you 20k in zone bucks.. considering that newman doesnt play for houston.. try atlanta, statwizard.