Fitzy

[Forward_Lateral]

I must say, he looked horrible to start, and made some pretty crappy throws, but he did also make some good throws in crunch time. That throw to Reed on 3rd and 7 was nice, and the slant to Evans for the TD (he missed an earlier one).

I think if Fitz gets all the reps this week, he has a chance to play a lot better. I also like his mobility, as he is suprisingly fast.

He definitely has a big league arm, just not quite the accuracy yesterday. I thought he played OK, considering what he had to come into.

[TacklingDummy]

He did make some throws that Edwards would have not even attempted. Maybe getting the snaps all week knowing he's the starter will make him look better next week.

[Buckets]

I think this points out some deficiencies that Trent has, particularly how to make something out of a busted play or broken pass protection.

[casdhf]

He'll be a good backup to have for a few years.

[Night Train]

I like the fact he drilled a few slants that Edwards wouldn't even attempt. like the TD to Evans.

Still, he stared down Evans on that one bad INT and is nothing more than a decent backup on his best day. What's sad is, that's probably still better than putting Edwards back in.

Edwards 5 for 5 were shorties and I keep thinking we probably would have lost the game with him playing all 4 quarters, for whatever reason. I have zero confidence in the guy to see the WR's beyond 10 yards.

[Mahdi]

I must say, he looked horrible to start, and made some pretty crappy throws, but he did also make some good throws in crunch time. That throw to Reed on 3rd and 7 was nice, and the slant to Evans for the TD (he missed an earlier one).

I think if Fitz gets all the reps this week, he has a chance to play a lot better. I also like his mobility, as he is suprisingly fast.

He definitely has a big league arm, just not quite the accuracy yesterday. I thought he played OK, considering what he had to come into.
The thing I liked the most about what Fitz did yesterday was anticipating pressure. He felt the pocket around him and made some very good plays to get himself out of a sack and a loss of yards.

How many times do we see Trent being dragged down for a sack by defenders behind him and then just falling forward. It's practically his signature move.

Fitz has great movement in the pocket and he is also athletic enough to hurt defenses with his legs.

He also gave his WRs chances to make plays. He focused on Owens early but clearly he had a bad day so he shifted to Evans.

I like how he trusted Nelson with that back shoulder throw.

[Forward_Lateral]

That throw to Nelson was very nice. The throw to Evans that they called incomplete in OT was also nearly perfectly thrown too.

[Mahdi]

That throw to Nelson was very nice. The throw to Evans that they called incomplete in OT was also nearly perfectly thrown too.
I think the throw to Evans was perfect actually. Evans needs to come down with that cleanly.

[HHURRICANE]

You guys are grasping at straws. Fitzpatrick did nothing more than Edwards could have done.

We won the game because the Jets gave it to us.

If you think Fitzpatrick is better than Edwards have at it but you are wrong.

[ddaryl]

I agree Fitz started off like crap but he made some key plays down the stretch..

I'm looking forward to see what he has with a weeks work with the 1st string...

but I thought he slung the ball into our WR with a bit more zip and confidence then Edwards shows..

[Mahdi]

You guys are grasping at straws. Fitzpatrick did nothing more than Edwards could have done.

We won the game because the Jets gave it to us.

If you think Fitzpatrick is better than Edwards have at it but you are wrong.
Fitz got sacked 0 times. Targeted his WRs about 15 times and made plays Trent has been afraid to make all year.

He is better going off yesterday alone.

[Buckets]

You guys are grasping at straws. Fitzpatrick did nothing more than Edwards could have done.

We won the game because the Jets gave it to us.

If you think Fitzpatrick is better than Edwards have at it but you are wrong.

8 to 1 on the posts so far but you're reght and we are all wrong

[justasportsfan]

It's not how you start but how you finish.

I don't have confidence in Fitz either but all I ask is that the qb throw the ball and trust his wrs to make a play. He did that and we won.

[Forward_Lateral]

You guys are grasping at straws. Fitzpatrick did nothing more than Edwards could have done.

We won the game because the Jets gave it to us.

If you think Fitzpatrick is better than Edwards have at it but you are wrong.

I may have misread my own post, but I don't think I said Fitz was better than Trent. It's far to early to make that assumption, after 3/4 of a game.

[ChristopherWalken]

Could have been worse. Could have thrown 5 ints.

[madness]

Fitz got sacked 0 times. Targeted his WRs about 15 times and made plays Trent has been afraid to make all year.

He is better going off yesterday alone.

You're right. The changes to the OL did make the difference.

[Mahdi]

You're right. The changes to the OL did make the difference.
So did Fitz. I dont recall the OL throwing to our WRs.

[ChristopherWalken]

At this point, I may have to agree that momentum could be built using Fritz. I think Trent is a very talented QB, but he plays scared.

[Chewytie]

I feel like Fitz came out and was a little like a kid in a candy store. How often do you get to throw to one of the best WR's of all time. (albeit not necessarily this year.)

[LooneyBin]

Dream and wish all you want, but Trent is starting next week's game.

[madness]

So did Fitz. I dont recall the OL throwing to our WRs.

I don't recall the OL giving any QB that amount of time the previous 3 games.

Credit goes to this OL before it goes to Fitz. They turned around a very bad 3 game span.

[Ickybaluky]

The interception he threw in overtime wasn't a good play, so I'm not sure about "finishing strong". He was 10-for-25 and only averaged 4.6 yards per attempt. I don't know that is something to get excited about.

Fitzpatrick is a journeyman. He was before coming to Buffalo and nothing has changed. I don't even think he is a good backup.

That said, if they want to throw him in there and give Edwards a chance to get a break it may not be a bad move. The Bills aren't scoring anyway, and giving Edwards a chance to clear his head (literally) and watch from the sidelines for a game or two may give him a chance to return with a fresh start once Fitzgerald plays to form and suck out loud.

In the interim, Fitzgerald can play with his career 57.7% completions, career 5.3 Yds/Att and career 13-for-18 TD-to-Int and take the crap that Edwards has been getting all season. I mean, seriously, why did the Bills even sign the guy? This is yoru savior?

[Mahdi]

The interception he threw in overtime wasn't a good play, so I'm not sure about "finishing strong". He was 10-for-25 and only averaged 4.6 yards per attempt. I don't know that is something to get excited about.

Fitzpatrick is a journeyman. He was before coming to Buffalo and nothing has changed. I don't even think he is a good backup.

That said, if they want to throw him in there and give Edwards a chance to get a break it may not be a bad move. The Bills aren't scoring anyway, and giving Edwards a chance to clear his head (literally) and watch from the sidelines for a game or two may give him a chance to return with a fresh start once Fitzgerald plays to form and suck out loud.

In the interim, Fitzgerald can play with his career 57.7% completions, career 5.3 Yds/Att and career 13-for-18 TD-to-Int and take the crap that Edwards has been getting all season. I mean, seriously, why did the Bills even sign the guy? This is yoru savior?
The guy has like 15 career starts, he didn't get many reps in the offseason, he didn't get to throw to Evans and Owens to gain any sort of chemistry with them and he is only 26 years old.

Your evaluation of him is premature and you really have no basis with which to say whether or not he is a good or bad QB.

He can turn into Tom Brady for all you know. At this point, he is unproven and un-tested.

What I do know is that he was able to come into the game against a very good defense and do enough for us to win the game. He didn't take any sacks even when he was pressured and wasn't shy about trying to make a play.

As of now, he is the best QB on the roster.

[Lone Stranger]

I agree with your synopsis.

[Canadian'eh!]

Fitz flat out STUNK.

I don't even think he did a bad job of reading D's, even though he missed some reads and threw it right to defenders a few times.

He could have had 4 picks himself if the Jets D could catch.

But the biggest thing is he has a TERRIBLE arm. Buffalo weatehr in November and Dec will KILL him.

And even worse is his complete lack of accuracy on almost everythrow.

Seriously.... He had maybe on taget throws the whole game. YIKES.

[Ickybaluky]

The guy has like 15 career starts, he didn't get many reps in the offseason, he didn't get to throw to Evans and Owens to gain any sort of chemistry with them and he is only 26 years old.

Your evaluation of him is premature and you really have no basis with which to say whether or not he is a good or bad QB.

He can turn into Tom Brady for all you know. At this point, he is unproven and un-tested.

What I do know is that he was able to come into the game against a very good defense and do enough for us to win the game. He didn't take any sacks even when he was pressured and wasn't shy about trying to make a play.

As of now, he is the best QB on the roster.

Are you kidding? Tom Brady? I have eyes. The guy sucks.

He has thrown over 500 career passes and has been in the NFL for 5 seasons. He was throwing to some pretty good receivers when he was in St. Louis and Cincinnati, right?

If the guy is so good, why is he on his 3rd team in 5 years? Because he sucks, that's why. Because his career completion percentage is 57.7 and his career Yds/Att is 5.3 (which is brutal, BTW). Because his career effeciency rating is 66.1. Because he sucks.

After 5 seasons in the NFL and 3 teams, Fitzpatrick is what he is. At best, he is a journeyman. I really don't even see him as worth backup material, because he really doesn't have much upside. What does he do well? Nothing, he is pretty much average or worse at everything you want a QB to do.

[Canadian'eh!]

LMAO at some opfthe posts here?

Fitz has a BIG LEAGUE ARM? You sure you weren't looking at his leg? His out patterns are TERRIFYING. it takes about 4 seconds to get there.

The ball to Nelson was way off target and nearly hit the defender int he back. He had to make a great catch.

the one to Lee was just a chuck it up adn pray play. Trent has done that about 10 times, and he didn't exactly lead him. Pulled him to the sideline.

He had 2 good throws. The slant to lee, and the short dump off to Fine. Everthing else was WAY off target.

The next Tom Brady???

ROFLMFAO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[ServoBillieves]

He's JP 2.1

Big arm, not overly accurate, quick feet, but seems to have a head on his shoulders.

That being said, saying he's better than JP isn't a compliment.

[Mahdi]

LMAO at some opfthe posts here?

Fitz has a BIG LEAGUE ARM? You sure you weren't looking at his leg? His out patterns are TERRIFYING. it takes about 4 seconds to get there.

The ball to Nelson was way off target and nearly hit the defender int he back. He had to make a great catch.

the one to Lee was just a chuck it up adn pray play. Trent has done that about 10 times, and he didn't exactly lead him. Pulled him to the sideline.

He had 2 good throws. The slant to lee, and the short dump off to Fine. Everthing else was WAY off target.

The next Tom Brady???

ROFLMFAO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Yer analysis of those 2 throws just proves u have no clue what yer saying.

Chuck it up and pray? WTH are you talking about. That is a designed throw and is usually called when the other team blitzes a lot. And it was on the money.

The throw to Nelson was a back-shoulder throw and was also well executed.

Was he off target a few times, yeah, but he also doesn't get much practice time, and rarely throws to Evans and Owens if ever.

Trent had all of TC and every practice this year to produce nothing at all.

Fitz had no preparation and did more than Trent has all season. He is not an all-star but he is a guy you can win with.

[Canadian'eh!]

Yer analysis of those 2 throws just proves u have no clue what yer saying.

Chuck it up and pray? WTH are you talking about. That is a designed throw and is usually called when the other team blitzes a lot. And it was on the money.

The throw to Nelson was a back-shoulder throw and was also well executed.

Was he off target a few times, yeah, but he also doesn't get much practice time, and rarely throws to Evans and Owens if ever.

Trent had all of TC and every practice this year to produce nothing at all.

Fitz had no preparation and did more than Trent has all season. He is not an all-star but he is a guy you can win with.

You said Fitz could be the next Tom Brady.

Don't ever question MY credibility.

[Mahdi]

He's JP 2.1

Big arm, not overly accurate, quick feet, but seems to have a head on his shoulders.

That being said, saying he's better than JP isn't a compliment.
He is nothing like JP. And Fitz does not have a big arm either. He has an average, maybe above average at best arm. Which is ok because I think he makes the most of it. He does have quick feet, but JP did not have quick feet. Dont confuse JP's running ability with quick feet, JP was a mess in the pocket. Fitz moves well in the pocket.

[Canadian'eh!]

I know the book on Fitz was a strong arm, but is eriously dind't see it yesterday.

His deivery is VERY slow. His Accuracy is go awful. PLus he threw it right into the D's arms a few times.

I don't think he's very good at all.

[Mahdi]

You said Fitz could be the next Tom Brady.

Don't ever question MY credibility.
I was obviously speaking figuratively. My point is that he is an unknown due to his limited starts and experience. Pretty sure everyone but you got that.

[Ickybaluky]

Fitz had no preparation and did more than Trent has all season. He is not an all-star but he is a guy you can win with.

A guy you can win with? His career win/loss as a starter is 4-10-1. You call that limited?

[Mahdi]

I know the book on Fitz was a strong arm, but is eriously dind't see it yesterday.

His deivery is VERY slow. His Accuracy is go awful. PLus he threw it right into the D's arms a few times.

I don't think he's very good at all.
No. The book on him was not a strong arm, ever. The book on him was a smart QB, with a decent arm, who could digest any offense and give you a reliable backup.

[Mahdi]

A guy you can win with? His career win/loss as a starter is 4-10-1. You call that limited?
With St.Louis and Cincinnati? What do you expect? And yes that is limited.

In the NFL 15 starts for a QB is considered too early for evaluation.

[justasportsfan]

The interception he threw in overtime wasn't a good play, so I'm not sure about "finishing strong". He was 10-for-25 and only averaged 4.6 yards per attempt. I don't know that is something to get excited about.

Fitzpatrick is a journeyman. He was before coming to Buffalo and nothing has changed. I don't even think he is a good backup.

That said, if they want to throw him in there and give Edwards a chance to get a break it may not be a bad move. The Bills aren't scoring anyway, and giving Edwards a chance to clear his head (literally) and watch from the sidelines for a game or two may give him a chance to return with a fresh start once Fitzgerald plays to form and suck out loud.

In the interim, Fitzgerald can play with his career 57.7% completions, career 5.3 Yds/Att and career 13-for-18 TD-to-Int and take the crap that Edwards has been getting all season. I mean, seriously, why did the Bills even sign the guy? This is yoru savior?

I'd rather lose trying to throw the ball than lose holding on to the ball.

It's better to have tried and lost than to have never tried at all.

With that being said, no one is saying Fritz the answer or the savior . Not even close.


I think Trent is a smart player who lost his confidence. I still think he can be a good qb down the road with a coach who knows offense and knows how to get in the head of his qb and fix it. Such a coach is with the broncos :wail:

[Mahdi]

With St.Louis and Cincinnati? What do you expect? And yes that is limited.

In the NFL 15 starts for a QB is considered too early for evaluation.
My only argument at the end of the day is that FITZ IS BETTER THAN TRENT. Im dont think he is a savior, dont think he will go to the PB, dont think he is our QB of the future.

I think he is good enough to move the chains, use our WRs and make our offense more dynamic.

Thats it.

[Philagape]

With St.Louis and Cincinnati? What do you expect?

And this is Buffalo. I expect the same as St. Louis and Cincinnati.

[justasportsfan]

The interception he threw in overtime wasn't a good play, so I'm not sure about "finishing strong". He was 10-for-25 and only averaged 4.6 yards per attempt. I don't know that is something to get excited about.

Fitzpatrick is a journeyman. He was before coming to Buffalo and nothing has changed. I don't even think he is a good backup.

That said, if they want to throw him in there and give Edwards a chance to get a break it may not be a bad move. The Bills aren't scoring anyway, and giving Edwards a chance to clear his head (literally) and watch from the sidelines for a game or two may give him a chance to return with a fresh start once Fitzgerald plays to form and suck out loud.

In the interim, Fitzgerald can play with his career 57.7% completions, career 5.3 Yds/Att and career 13-for-18 TD-to-Int and take the crap that Edwards has been getting all season. I mean, seriously, why did the Bills even sign the guy? This is yoru savior?

I'd rather lose trying to throw the ball than lose holding on to the ball.

It's better to have ttried and lost than to have never tried at all.

With that being said, no one is saying Fritz the answer or the savior . Not even close.


I think Trent is a smart player who lost his confidence. I still think he can be a good qb down the road with a coach who knows offense and knows how to get in the head of his qb and fix it. Such a coach is with the broncos :wail:

[ServoBillieves]

http://i763.photobucket.com/albums/xx277/BuffaloComedy/Haha.jpg

[Ickybaluky]

With St.Louis and Cincinnati? What do you expect? And yes that is limited.

In the NFL 15 starts for a QB is considered too early for evaluation.

5 Years. 3 Teams. Over 500 attempts.

Name me a QB that played 5 years in the NFL who performed like he has and suddenly became good. You can't, because there aren't any. Fitzpatrick has a crappy completion percentage and worse Yds/Att. He doesn't do anything you can hang your hat on. He doesn't have the big arm. He isn't accurate and his release is average. He is average size and athleticism for the position. What does he do well?

Seriously, this guy is far from an unknown. He won't even be in the NFL in 2 years. He'll be selling insurance.

[Ickybaluky]

My only argument at the end of the day is that FITZ IS BETTER THAN TRENT. Im dont think he is a savior, dont think he will go to the PB, dont think he is our QB of the future.

I think he is good enough to move the chains, use our WRs and make our offense more dynamic.

Thats it.

Trent is much better than Fitzpatrick. Granted, I'll give you he is struggling right now, but a big reason for that is the OL he is playing with and the simple offense he is being asked to execute. He isn't even being given a shot. I'd agree to throw Fitzpatrick in there for now, or even Hamden for that matter, just to give Edwards a breather.

However, Fitzpatrick is what he is, which is a fringe NFL player. He may make the occasional play, but over time he is going to be exposed bad and he will never get better. There is not shame in that, he probably is a nice guy, but he isn't very talented.

Once he gets his head handed to him, bring Edwards back. Maybe getting a break will give him a chance to get his game together. It is worth a try, and the concussion offers a good excuse.

However, Edwards is way more talented than Fitzpatrick. You may be unhappy with the guy, but he is the only legitimate NFL QB on the roster.

[justasportsfan]

we should bring in Jeff Garcia

[TheBrownBear]

5 Years. 3 Teams. Over 500 attempts.

Name me a QB that played 5 years in the NFL who performed like he has and suddenly became good. You can't, because there aren't any. Fitzpatrick has a crappy completion percentage and worse Yds/Att. He doesn't do anything you can hang your hat on. He doesn't have the big arm. He isn't accurate and his release is average. He is average size and athleticism for the position. What does he do well?

Seriously, this guy is far from an unknown. He won't even be in the NFL in 2 years. He'll be selling insurance.
There are lots of guys like this. One off the top of my head is Rich Gannon. The guy was, at best, a journeyman who was released multiple times until he took over the Raiders starting job at age 34. Then he went to 4 straight pro-bowls and won the league MVP in 2002. QB is a position where a guy can blossom late...and sometimes all you need is to find the right situation to succeed.

Yeah, still, based on what I've seen I don't think Fitzpatrick is our future, or any team's future. But like Mahdi said, he gives us a better chance to win right now than Edwards does.

[Mahdi]

5 Years. 3 Teams. Over 500 attempts.

Name me a QB that played 5 years in the NFL who performed like he has and suddenly became good. You can't, because there aren't any. Fitzpatrick has a crappy completion percentage and worse Yds/Att. He doesn't do anything you can hang your hat on. He doesn't have the big arm. He isn't accurate and his release is average. He is average size and athleticism for the position. What does he do well?

Seriously, this guy is far from an unknown. He won't even be in the NFL in 2 years. He'll be selling insurance.
Heard of Rich Gannon? Jim Plunkett? Jake Delhomme? Kyle Orton? Brad Johnson?

I can name a lot more probably.... all were low draft picks, backup QBs on other teams that didn't really have much starting experience who have managed to be winners in this league.

[ChristopherWalken]

He's a definite journeyman, but the Bills need the lesser of two evils at this time and Fitz might be it.

[BillsWin]

Trent sucks. Fitz sucks. We are screwed until we get some real talent in here!

[Mahdi]

There are lots of guys like this. One off the top of my head is Rich Gannon. The guy was, at best, a journeyman who was released multiple times until he took over the Raiders starting job at age 34. Then he went to 4 straight pro-bowls and won the league MVP in 2002. QB is a position where a guy can blossom late...and sometimes all you need is to find the right situation to succeed.

Yeah, still, based on what I've seen I don't think Fitzpatrick is our future, or any team's future. But like Mahdi said, he gives us a better chance to win right now than Edwards does.
Lol. Gannon was the first guy who came to my head too.

[Mahdi]

Trent is much better than Fitzpatrick. Granted, I'll give you he is struggling right now, but a big reason for that is the OL he is playing with and the simple offense he is being asked to execute. He isn't even being given a shot. I'd agree to throw Fitzpatrick in there for now, or even Hamden for that matter, just to give Edwards a breather.

However, Fitzpatrick is what he is, which is a fringe NFL player. He may make the occasional play, but over time he is going to be exposed bad and he will never get better. There is not shame in that, he probably is a nice guy, but he isn't very talented.

Once he gets his head handed to him, bring Edwards back. Maybe getting a break will give him a chance to get his game together. It is worth a try, and the concussion offers a good excuse.

However, Edwards is way more talented than Fitzpatrick. You may be unhappy with the guy, but he is the only legitimate NFL QB on the roster.
How is Trent talented? Where is his talent exactly?

Weak arm, horrible delivery, and poor anticipation skills. I recently realized why his release is so quick.

He is the anti-Leftwich.... he has no wind up so the ball comes out fast.

[Ickybaluky]

Heard of Rich Gannon? Jim Plunkett? Jake Delhomme? Kyle Orton? Brad Johnson?

The difference is, all those guys were good. Compare their numbers to Fitzgerald and they are in a difference clase. If Fitzpatrick had shown any ability you might have a point, but all he has shown is he isn't any good. You actually prove my point, because all those guys were good players who had to wait for a shot. Fitzgerald is a bad player who is waiting until his career is over. He probably won't have to wait much longer.

Name me a guy who completely suck for his first 5 seasons and then suddenly became good. Do you realize how bad a career 5.3 Yds/Att is? There aren't any guy like that.

[Ickybaluky]

There are lots of guys like this. One off the top of my head is Rich Gannon. The guy was, at best, a journeyman who was released multiple times until he took over the Raiders starting job at age 34.

Rich Gannon was a pretty good player before getting to the Raiders. Look at his numbers.

[Mahdi]

The difference is, all those guys were good. Compare their numbers to Fitzgerald and they are in a difference clase. If Fitzpatrick had shown any ability you might have a point, but all he has shown is he isn't any good. You actually prove my point, because all those guys were good players who had to wait for a shot. Fitzgerald is a bad player who is waiting until his career is over. He probably won't have to wait much longer.

Name me a guy who completely suck for his first 5 seasons and then suddenly became good. Do you realize how bad a career 5.3 Yds/Att is? There aren't any guy like that.
They were all low picks (except for Plunkett)... none of them were seen as "good players" as you say and their stats were not impressive at all.

[Mahdi]

Rich Gannon was a pretty good player before getting to the Raiders. Look at his numbers.
In Gannon's first 6 seasons he threw over 1200 attempts and never broke 59% completions and the highest rating he scored in those 6 years was 81.5.

That is good?

You know what the reality is... he could be Gannon or he could be Damon Huard. You dont know, I dont know or anyone else for that matter.

Right now, Fitzpatrick is an unknown commodity. There are guys in this league who have just as much talent or less starting for NFL teams. His arm is not magnificent and its not bad either. He has an average NFL arm, can make reads and checks at the LOS and has good pocket presence. He can take off with this offense and never look back or he can fail miserably. The only argument anyone can make is that right now, he is our best option.

No one can say for a certainty that he is never going to make it and no one can say that he will be a PB in the future.

[DynaPaul]

I liked his pocket prescence, his knack for getting the ball out quick, and for taking shots downfield even if the receiver had some tight coverage. He does need a little more accuracy though. If we could mesh him with Edwards we could have a complete QB instead of 2 QB's each with their own faults.

[Ickybaluky]

How is Trent talented? Where is his talent exactly?

Weak arm, horrible delivery, and poor anticipation skills. I recently realized why his release is so quick.

He is the anti-Leftwich.... he has no wind up so the ball comes out fast.

Edwards has an above-average NFL arm. He is accurate and has a good release. He has good size and showed early poise. He is a talented guy, you can see him as an NFL QB.

The problem with Edwards is the same problem Jim Plunkett had (another Stanford guy). Edwards showed ability early in his career, but his confidence was ruined playing behind a bad OL in an offense that does very little to help a QB. The Bills just line up and play. They don't use a lot of formations. They don't use motion. They aren't a hard team to figure out.

Jim Plunkett had a similar situation in NE. He had early success, but his confidence was ruined and he was traded. After SF gave up on him, Oakland picked him up and spent a year rebuilding his confidence. It paid off big.

If the Bills run Edwards out of town I could see the same thing happening. He will get picked up by some team and they will put him in a better situation.

[THE END OF ALL DAYS]

the most poplular guy on any team is the back up QB... grass is always greener on the other side of the fence.

unless you have a superstar qb like payton or brady.

even when kelly was playing there were some who wanted Frank Reich

[ChristopherWalken]

Hamden!

[TheBrownBear]

Name me a guy who completely suck for his first 5 seasons and then suddenly became good. Do you realize how bad a career 5.3 Yds/Att is? There aren't any guy like that.

The problem is your whole argument relies on "5 seasons." You keep stating this over and over again. Problem is, Fitz has only had 15 starts over that span. It's not like he has 50+ starts under his belt to prove that he sucks. So we should really be comparing him to those other QB's we've listed over their first 15 games - not 5 seasons. Compare him again to those guys - you'll see he isn't demonstrably worse over a 15 game span.

He played on some crappy Rams teams who have sucked regardless of who has been behind center (including a former probowler Marc Bulger). And he played one season on a bad Cincy team with a 70% OchoCinco.

I think it's likely that he sucks too, but I don't think 15 games is enough to close the book on a guy - unless that guy is Ryan Leaf bad.

[Ickybaluky]

In Gannon's first 6 seasons he threw over 1200 attempts and never broke 59% completions and the highest rating he scored in those 6 years was 81.5.

That is good?

Gannon showed he could do things well. His record as a starter in those 6 years was 19-16. He threw for over 6,000 yards and threw 40 TDs, with a Yds/Att a full yard higher than Fitzpatrick's. His completion percentage and TD-to-Int were better than Fitzpatrick. He showed he was one of the more athletic QBs in the NFL, rushing for 700 yards in those years while averaging 5.0 yards per carry.

Gannon was a much better player than Fitzpatrick in every category.

[Ickybaluky]

The problem is your whole argument relies on "5 seasons." You keep stating this over and over again. Problem is, Fitz has only had 15 starts over that span. It's not like he has 50+ starts under his belt to prove that he sucks. So we should really be comparing him to those other QB's we've listed over their first 15 games - not 5 seasons. Compare him again to those guys - you'll see he isn't demonstrably worse over a 15 game span.

He played on some crappy Rams teams who have sucked regardless of who has been behind center (including a former probowler Marc Bulger). And he played one season on a bad Cincy team with a 70% OchoCinco.

I think it's likely that he sucks too, but I don't think 15 games is enough to close the book on a guy - unless that guy is Ryan Leaf bad.

First of all, those Rams teams were good on offense. Marc Bulger and Jamie Martin both put up better numbers than him on those teams. Look at the players on those teams. Stephen Jackson, Marshall Faulk, Torry Holt. With Cincy, he still had guys like Houshmanzadeh, right?

Fitzpatrick has been in the NFL for 5 seasons and hasn't demonstrated the ability to do anything well. Nothing. He doesn't throw for a lot of yards. He isn't real accurate. He just isn't that good.

The players you listed all showed promise, but didn't get an opportunity. Gannon was better in every category. Jim Plunkett was rookie of the year. Brad Johnson had great accuracy. All those guys showed something.

What does Fitzpatrick do well?

[Philagape]

The problem is your whole argument relies on "5 seasons." You keep stating this over and over again. Problem is, Fitz has only had 15 starts over that span. It's not like he has 50+ starts under his belt to prove that he sucks. So we should really be comparing him to those other QB's we've listed over their first 15 games - not 5 seasons.

The crappy teams he was on saw him every day in practice for those five years. And they let him go.

[Mahdi]

Gannon showed he could do things well. His record as a starter in those 6 years was 19-16. He threw for over 6,000 yards and threw 40 TDs, with a Yds/Att a full yard higher than Fitzpatrick's. His completion percentage and TD-to-Int were better than Fitzpatrick. He showed he was one of the more athletic QBs in the NFL, rushing for 700 yards in those years while averaging 5.0 yards per carry.

Gannon was a much better player than Fitzpatrick in every category.
Except that Fitz has only had 15 starts.

[Mahdi]

Edwards has an above-average NFL arm. He is accurate and has a good release. He has good size and showed early poise. He is a talented guy, you can see him as an NFL QB.

The problem with Edwards is the same problem Jim Plunkett had (another Stanford guy). Edwards showed ability early in his career, but his confidence was ruined playing behind a bad OL in an offense that does very little to help a QB. The Bills just line up and play. They don't use a lot of formations. They don't use motion. They aren't a hard team to figure out.

Jim Plunkett had a similar situation in NE. He had early success, but his confidence was ruined and he was traded. After SF gave up on him, Oakland picked him up and spent a year rebuilding his confidence. It paid off big.

If the Bills run Edwards out of town I could see the same thing happening. He will get picked up by some team and they will put him in a better situation.
There is no way you or anyone else can say that Trent has an above average NFL arm. Sorry but nothing he has done or shown supports that. Trent has never made an eye opening throw. His release is horrible so I dont know what film you are watching. Trent short arms all his throws and rarely puts any zip on his passes. It is not this offense that is easy to defend. It is Trent that is easy to defend because he neglects 1/3 of the field and usually 2/3 of the field since he has only gone deep maybe 5 times this year.

[TheBrownBear]

The crappy teams he was on saw him every day in practice for those five years. And they let him go.

I agree. I was just attacking his general argument. From what I've seen (hasn't been much) of Fitz, he mostly sucks.

[Ickybaluky]

There is no way you or anyone else can say that Trent has an above average NFL arm. Sorry but nothing he has done or shown supports that. Trent has never made an eye opening throw. His release is horrible so I dont know what film you are watching. Trent short arms all his throws and rarely puts any zip on his passes. It is not this offense that is easy to defend. It is Trent that is easy to defend because he neglects 1/3 of the field and usually 2/3 of the field since he has only gone deep maybe 5 times this year.

We will have to disagree. Edwards has an NFL arm. He doesn't have a cannon, but he has a plus arm. He can make all the throws. Coupled with his quick release and accuracy he can be a successful NFL QB.

QB, more than any other position, is dependent. Early in Edwards career he played pretty well. Lately, he hasn't. However, if you ask me the reason he isn't playing well is because he is in a bad situation. His confidence is shaken because of a bad scheme with a bad OL. Everyone wants to blame the QB, but IMO that will end up a mistake. I'm not sure how good Edwards may ultimately be, but I do think he is at least a starting-caliber NFL QB. I could see him being better, but he needs a chance to succeed.

However, the kid has skills. He has talent. As is well documented, Bills Walsh thought highly of him. Rich Gannon thinks highly of him. I'll defer to those guys.

[Canadian'eh!]

Wow... This thread is hilarious.... I actually hope Fitz gets in there a few more weeks. We coudl use the higher draft pick.

Mahdi has been one of the posters iv'e seen flip flop all over the place. We win a gift game so Fitz = Good.

His QB rating was 51 yesterday. he turned it over twice. He completed under 50%. He was inaccurate.

GIve me a friggin break. He's NOT better than Trent. Trent wins that game yesterday too and probably more easily.

[Mahdi]

Wow... This thread is hilarious.... I actually hope Fitz gets in there a few more weeks. We coudl use the higher draft pick.

Mahdi has been one of the posters iv'e seen flip flop all over the place. We win a gift game so Fitz = Good.

His QB rating was 51 yesterday. he turned it over twice. He completed under 50%. He was inaccurate.

GIve me a friggin break. He's NOT better than Trent. Trent wins that game yesterday too and probably more easily.
Sorry how have I flip flopped? Explain.

[mybills]

The interception he threw in overtime wasn't a good play, so I'm not sure about "finishing strong". He was 10-for-25 and only averaged 4.6 yards per attempt. I don't know that is something to get excited about.

Fitzpatrick is a journeyman. He was before coming to Buffalo and nothing has changed. I don't even think he is a good backup.

That said, if they want to throw him in there and give Edwards a chance to get a break it may not be a bad move. The Bills aren't scoring anyway, and giving Edwards a chance to clear his head (literally) and watch from the sidelines for a game or two may give him a chance to return with a fresh start once Fitzgerald plays to form and suck out loud.

In the interim, Fitzgerald can play with his career 57.7% completions, career 5.3 Yds/Att and career 13-for-18 TD-to-Int and take the crap that Edwards has been getting all season. I mean, seriously, why did the Bills even sign the guy? This is yoru savior?
:gag:

[Canadian'eh!]

Sorry how have I flip flopped? Explain.

Oops.... thinking of X-Era (for one.) Though I often agree with him.

You've been wrong consistently.

My bad.

[Mahdi]

We will have to disagree. Edwards has an NFL arm. He doesn't have a cannon, but he has a plus arm. He can make all the throws. Coupled with his quick release and accuracy he can be a successful NFL QB.

QB, more than any other position, is dependent. Early in Edwards career he played pretty well. Lately, he hasn't. However, if you ask me the reason he isn't playing well is because he is in a bad situation. His confidence is shaken because of a bad scheme with a bad OL. Everyone wants to blame the QB, but IMO that will end up a mistake. I'm not sure how good Edwards may ultimately be, but I do think he is at least a starting-caliber NFL QB. I could see him being better, but he needs a chance to succeed.

However, the kid has skills. He has talent. As is well documented, Bills Walsh thought highly of him. Rich Gannon thinks highly of him. I'll defer to those guys.
He can make all the throws? Well we have yet to see that.

[Mahdi]

Oops.... thinking of X-Era (for one.) Though I often agree with him.

You've been wrong consistently.

My bad.
How have I been wrong consistently? Show me where I have been wrong.

If you're going to make an accusation back it up or dont say anything at all.

Two, even if I made a prediction somewhere and I turned out to be wrong, I doubt I'll be the first. Im not here to be a fortune teller.

Three, on the subject of Edwards, everything that has happened so far only supports what I said about Edwards before the season started. So to this point I am more right than wrong. Only time will tell if I am 100% right on Edwards, he may one day prove me wrong. But for now, my analysis of Edwards not being a capable starter in this league is not wrong. To this point he has only proven me right.

[Canadian'eh!]

How have I been wrong consistently? Show me where I have been wrong.

If you're going to make an accusation back it up or dont say anything at all.

Two, even if I made a prediction somewhere and I turned out to be wrong, I doubt I'll be the first. Im not here to be a fortune teller.

Your'e wrong on Trent's mechanics. About his "poor" arm, and about 15 other places in the thread alone.

[Mahdi]

Your'e wrong on Trent's mechanics. About his "poor" arm, and about 15 other places in the thread alone.
You can claim all you like that Trent has good mechanics or that he has an above average arm, bottom line, he has been horrible, his throws are horrible, he can't find his WRs, his accuracy is bad, and he puts no zip on his passes. And these are facts, not opinions.

So until Edwards shows us all that he does have great mechanics or that he does have an above average NFL arm, he has only proven me right.

[feldspar]

I like the fact he drilled a few slants that Edwards wouldn't even attempt. like the TD to Evans.


Fitzy only completed TWO balls to Evans and two balls to Owens. The two receivers combined had 4 catches for 61 yards off of Fitzpatrick. Some people are excited because he threw to these two more than Trent generally does while ignoring the fact that it matters whether those balls are completions or not. He attempted 13 to these guys (I think) but only completed 4. Hell, Trent completed 3 to these guys in the limited time he saw in this game. He went long to Owens, too, on a pass that drew a penalty.

Fitz has a 5.3 yards per attempt stat for his whole career, and that is not good. He completed only 40% of his passes this week for 116 yards, and he played nearly a whole game including overtime. Those are the stats. In reality, he threw a BAD interception in overtime and really should have had a few more during the game. He missed some wide open guys, and threw some ill-advised passes. People are so desperate for the long ball that it doesn't matter to them that Fitzy didn't complete the five he tried.

"Different" is not "better" in this case IMO. He had a few nice passes, but played poorly in general. He won't fix a thing. If Trent is our best option at this point, which I believe he is, then so be it. Believe it or not, things could be worse.

Do not give credit for the win to Fitzpatrick. Six interceptions and a botched kick for the win didn't hurt. The Bills were handed this game on a silver platter, but it took them most of overtime to pull off the win.

[Mitchell55]

Fitz actually beat a 34 D

[feldspar]

Fitz actually beat a 34 D

"Fitz" didn't beat anyone this week. 6 interceptions and a botched fieldgoal beat a 34, not to mention the fact that the most important piece of that 3-4 got hurt.

[Philagape]

Saying Fitz beat the Jets is only a little less absurd than saying Derek Anderson beat the Bills

[Canadian'eh!]

You can claim all you like that Trent has good mechanics or that he has an above average arm, bottom line, he has been horrible, his throws are horrible, he can't find his WRs, his accuracy is bad, and he puts no zip on his passes. And these are facts, not opinions.

So until Edwards shows us all that he does have great mechanics or that he does have an above average NFL arm, he has only proven me right.

No.. actually those are opinions. here's a definition.


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–noun <TABLE class=luna-Ent><TBODY><TR><TD class=dnindex width=35>1.</TD><TD>a belief or judgment that rests on grounds insufficient to produce complete certainty.</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><TABLE class=luna-Ent><TBODY><TR><TD class=dnindex width=35>2.</TD><TD>a personal view, attitude, or appraisal.</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

And you are the ONLY one who claims Trent's "mechanics" are bad. Despite even some of his bigger critics with far more knowledge than you disagreeing with your lousy assessment. Same for his arm, and his accuracy.

The onyl question about trent is his decision making.

and for the roecord... despite how much belief you may have in yourself. your opinions do not equal facts.

[Canadian'eh!]

Saying Fitz beat the Jets is only a little less absurd than saying Derek Anderson beat the Bills

LOL excellent point.

[feldspar]

Here was Fitzpatrick's game in a nutshell...all the plays he had in every drive, excluding run plays:

pass incomplete short left to 83-L.Evans
pass incomplete short right to 81-T.Owens
3 and out

pass incomplete deep left to 81-T.Owens
3 and out

pass short left to 89-S.Nelson to BUF 35 for 25 yards
pass incomplete short left to 83-L.Evans
pass incomplete short left (his hand was hit)
The Bills gained one first down on this drive because of a Jets penalty on third

pass short right to 81-T.Owens pushed ob at BUF 23 for 11 yards
pass incomplete deep right to 81-T.Owens
pass incomplete deep right to 81-T.Owens
pass short left to 81-T.Owens to BUF 19 for -4 yards
The Bills get one first down, then punt from their own 19

pass short left to 86-D.Fine to BUF 27 for 5 yards
pass incomplete short right to 81-T.Owens
3 and out

pass incomplete short right to 83-L.Evans
The Bills get 2 first downs and kick a fieldgoal – ran the ball 8 times

pass incomplete short right to 83-L.Evans
pass short left intended for 83 Intercepted – brought back on penalty
pass short left to 38-C.McIntyre to NYJ 40 for 18 yards
pass incomplete short left to 23-M.Lynch
pass short right to 83-L.Evans for 37 yards, TOUCHDOWN

pass short left to 23-M.Lynch to BUF 24 for 2 yards
pass short right to 82-J.Reed to BUF 37 for 10 yards
pass incomplete short right to 38-C.McIntyre.
pass short left to 38-C.McIntyre to BUF 47 for no gain
2 first downs

pass short left to 83-L.Evans to NYJ 37 for 12 yards
End of regulation

pass incomplete deep right to 83-L.Evans
3 and out

pass short left intended for 83-L.Evans INTERCEPTED
2 play drive

pass incomplete deep left to 83-L.Evans (nice play – it was a close one)
Fieldgoal is good – Bills win

[Canadian'eh!]

Fitzy only completed TWO balls to Evans and two balls to Owens. The two receivers combined had 4 catches for 61 yards off of Fitzpatrick. Some people are excited because he threw to these two more than Trent generally does while ignoring the fact that it matters whether those balls are completions or not. He attempted 13 to these guys (I think) but only completed 4. Hell, Trent completed 3 to these guys in the limited time he saw in this game. He went long to Owens, too, on a pass that drew a penalty.

Fitz has a 5.3 yards per attempt stat for his whole career, and that is not good. He completed only 40% of his passes this week for 116 yards, and he played nearly a whole game including overtime. Those are the stats. In reality, he threw a BAD interception in overtime and really should have had a few more during the game. He missed some wide open guys, and threw some ill-advised passes. People are so desperate for the long ball that it doesn't matter to them that Fitzy didn't complete the five he tried.

"Different" is not "better" in this case IMO. He had a few nice passes, but played poorly in general. He won't fix a thing. If Trent is our best option at this point, which I believe he is, then so be it. Believe it or not, things could be worse.

Do not give credit for the win to Fitzpatrick. Six interceptions and a botched kick for the win didn't hurt. The Bills were handed this game on a silver platter, but it took them most of overtime to pull off the win.

Excellent post.

[Joe Fo Sho]

Jesus, guys. Fitz is not the next coming of Joe Montana, but the guy did just win a game. You can argue all you want about how much the Jets sucked, but the bottom line is that Fitz should be the QB credited with the W. Did he play well? Eh, not really, but he went into the game as the backup and hasn't practice with the 1st string all year. Let's see what a weeks worth of practice can do and hope for the best.

Oh, and he WAS more exciting than Trent. He is now 2nd to last on the list of exciting Buffalo QBs. JP>Fitzy>Trent... And oh what a list that is.

[Mr. Pink]

What you saw out of Fitzpatrick yesterday is what Fitzpatrick has been his entire career.

A lot of short routes with the occasional long ball throw in. That's different than Edwards?

He's also very inaccurate and telegraphs a bunch of passes. Thankfully the Jets had stone hands on defense. He coulda easily matched Sanchez's 5 INTs.

[Mahdi]

No.. actually those are opinions. here's a definition.



And you are the ONLY one who claims Trent's "mechanics" are bad. Despite even some of his bigger critics with far more knowledge than you disagreeing with your lousy assessment. Same for his arm, and his accuracy.

The onyl question about trent is his decision making.

and for the roecord... despite how much belief you may have in yourself. your opinions do not equal facts.
Actually they are facts...

Trent has been horrible this year and no one will argue that except maybe you, his passes have been off-target, and he hasn't been putting any zip on them, he has also not been throwing to his WRs.... these are FACTS.

The part about mechanics is my opinion and in my mind is the reason why he is struggling.


And just in case you need more FACTS....

Trent Edwards:

59% completions, 5 TD, 6INT, 73.0 rating...

Evans: 16 receptions, 227 yds, 2tds --- 3 of those were from Fitz and one TD

Owens: 15 receptions, 215 yds, 1TD

Reed: 12 receptions, 119 yds, 1TD

Need more facts or is this proof enough of my points?

[Ingtar33]

I must say, he looked horrible to start, and made some pretty crappy throws, but he did also make some good throws in crunch time. That throw to Reed on 3rd and 7 was nice, and the slant to Evans for the TD (he missed an earlier one).

I think if Fitz gets all the reps this week, he has a chance to play a lot better. I also like his mobility, as he is suprisingly fast.

He definitely has a big league arm, just not quite the accuracy yesterday. I thought he played OK, considering what he had to come into.


the story of "fitzy's" career. if you think this perennial backup has some heretofore unknown accuracy just waiting to be displayed magically then i've got a bridge in Brooklyn to sell you.

[HHURRICANE]

We will have to disagree. Edwards has an NFL arm. He doesn't have a cannon, but he has a plus arm. He can make all the throws. Coupled with his quick release and accuracy he can be a successful NFL QB.

QB, more than any other position, is dependent. Early in Edwards career he played pretty well. Lately, he hasn't. However, if you ask me the reason he isn't playing well is because he is in a bad situation. His confidence is shaken because of a bad scheme with a bad OL. Everyone wants to blame the QB, but IMO that will end up a mistake. I'm not sure how good Edwards may ultimately be, but I do think he is at least a starting-caliber NFL QB. I could see him being better, but he needs a chance to succeed.

However, the kid has skills. He has talent. As is well documented, Bills Walsh thought highly of him. Rich Gannon thinks highly of him. I'll defer to those guys.

As usual are smartest poster is a fan from another team.

I'm sure these are the same fans that wanted Reich over Kelly.