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jamze132
10-26-2009, 12:22 PM
So they have roughly half and NFL season under their belts. What do you guys think about how they have played thus far and what do you think about their futures in the NFL?

Nighthawk
10-26-2009, 12:26 PM
I truly think Wood is going to be a stud...he just needs more experience. Levitre has played OK and I think he'll be good also. It's the tackle spots that are hurting this team.

TheBrownBear
10-26-2009, 12:45 PM
I like them. I think they'll be, at worst, solid NFL starters. Like Nighthawk said, Wood has Pro Bowl potential down the line. I have a feeling this line will start to look better and better now that we've ditched the no-huddle. The penalties are what was killing this unit - the no-huddle was just too much to process with all of the inexperience that was on the field.

BuffaloBlitz83
10-26-2009, 12:46 PM
Bell Stinks.

Ingtar33
10-26-2009, 12:56 PM
Wood has been one of the best players on the line (I'd say he has been the best... which is sad when you consider he's a rookie)... Levitre has been the 3rd best player on the line. Not great. Not horrible. He's been blown up a few times by DTs, and taken dumb penalties, but so has Hangartner, there isn't much difference right now between the two.

the tackles have been horrible.

bigbub2352
10-26-2009, 12:56 PM
Levitre needs to get bigger, but shows everything you want to see in a starting caliber Guard and as for Wood we hit a gold mine with him he is going to be excellent for us,
the interior is doing there jobs the tackles are awful

ddaryl
10-26-2009, 01:03 PM
Levitre looked horrible yesterday on that Safety.... but all of our rookies need a full year in a strength and conditioning program ...

Meredith also got bull rushed yesterday and Bell will probably make a solid backup

Hangartner hasn't impressed me much.. WE still need a stud C.. Maybe Wood will be moved there next year, and we can move Butler back to RG and keep Meredith at RT

the OL still needs some upgrades and should remain a priority for the Bills this offseason as well as LB

THATHURMANATOR
10-26-2009, 01:06 PM
We get NO push off the ball. As many have eluded a year in the weight room can help. I do want the position addressed early in the draft though. After QB.

Ingtar33
10-26-2009, 01:12 PM
Levitre looked horrible yesterday on that Safety.... but all of our rookies need a full year in a strength and conditioning program ...


he wasn't the only one who got blown up on that safety. Derrick Fine was at the BOTTOM of the pile in the endzone. His guy is who forced Jackson to cut inside into Levitre's man ending the play.

I don't know why Fine is on the field anymore. They say its because he's a good blocker... but that safety wasn't the only time he was 5 yards in the backfield getting blown up in run blocking.

PECKERWOOD
10-26-2009, 02:10 PM
Our interior is set, DON'T CAN one of our tackles and move one of these guys outside. Our interior is fine, leave it alone FO.

BuffaloBlitz83
10-26-2009, 02:17 PM
it is simple

Sign an Elite LT
Draft QB in 1st Rd

or

Draft Best LT avail Rd 1
Draft QB in Rd 2 or Move up in 20's to grab QB

casdhf
10-26-2009, 02:19 PM
How often to elite LTs switch teams?

Ed
10-26-2009, 02:22 PM
Wood has been one of the best players on the line (I'd say he has been the best... which is sad when you consider he's a rookie)... Levitre has been the 3rd best player on the line. Not great. Not horrible. He's been blown up a few times by DTs, and taken dumb penalties, but so has Hangartner, there isn't much difference right now between the two.

the tackles have been horrible.
So what do you think of Bell's future at LT? He seemed to make a lot of progress this past offseason and still has some potential, but do you see him being the answer for us at either OT postion in the future?

Ingtar33
10-26-2009, 02:37 PM
So what do you think of Bell's future at LT? He seemed to make a lot of progress this past offseason and still has some potential, but do you see him being the answer for us at either OT postion in the future?


I don't know. I thought he needed at east one more year on the bench before seeing the field... however, this year has prevented him from getting it.

He hasn't been terrible in run blocking... but pass blocking he's been a turnstile. I think Meredith has been an upgrade over Butler, great find there... So RT has improved greatly the last two weeks.

I think Bell could be good, but i don't think we can afford to wait for him.

PECKERWOOD
10-26-2009, 02:41 PM
Meredith is a kid I wanted us to draft, but better than Butler?? Not sure about that comment.

TigerJ
10-26-2009, 03:04 PM
he wasn't the only one who got blown up on that safety. Derrick Fine was at the BOTTOM of the pile in the endzone. His guy is who forced Jackson to cut inside into Levitre's man ending the play.

I don't know why Fine is on the field anymore. They say its because he's a good blocker... but that safety wasn't the only time he was 5 yards in the backfield getting blown up in run blocking.

The Bills were down to Fine and Stupar at TE yesterday. Not much to choose from.

Ebenezer
10-26-2009, 03:07 PM
The Bills were down to Fine and Stupar at TE yesterday. Not much to choose from.
Ryan Denney may be better than those two.

BillsWin
10-26-2009, 03:20 PM
solid interior line play from the rookies. center play has been lightyears ahead of last season. tackles have been a weakness. Wood looks like he'll be a pro bowler by next season, Levitre is a few steps behind but will be a good player for us.

patmoran2006
10-26-2009, 03:22 PM
I like them both, for rookies.

and I think Levitre has played the best of anybody on the OL so far this year-- by a ton, and that includes wood

psubills62
10-26-2009, 03:25 PM
This situation reminds me a lot of the Colts last year. They drafted three centers in 2008: Mike Pollak, Steve Justice, and Jamey Richard. They intended to move two of them (Justice and Pollak, I think) to guards to shore up the interior.

Due to injuries, etc., their line was a mess last year. They allowed a ton of sacks, even with Manning back there.

This year, the line hasn't been great, but they've done a good job protecting Manning (I think they've allowed 0 sacks in the past 4-5 games or so). Even though the tackles are still somewhat in flux, they've settled down and gotten the job done.

I can easily see our interior doing that next year. Not sure about the tackles, but I think if we draft an LT early in 2010, we could have a very good OL.

doomsdayvirus
10-26-2009, 03:33 PM
wood has been solid. he'll probably want a big contract next year, so we'll ship him out and replace him with someone ****ty.

BillsWin
10-26-2009, 03:33 PM
I like them both, for rookies.

and I think Levitre has played the best of anybody on the OL so far this year-- by a ton, and that includes wood


If you're judging by how well they've played based on what was expected of them, by far Levitre is the best. But Wood has been dominate at times. Most notably against Wilfork in week one and Jenkins before he went down with an injury. We might finally have an interior who can cope with the 3-4 NT's in our division.

Run blocking isn't where it should be, but I fully expect it to get better as the year goes on.

ServoBillieves
10-26-2009, 04:04 PM
Wood is the best player on the line. Levitre needs to get better on getting low and listening to the play call. Meredith has opened my eyes. Great hip flex, very strong at getting the end to over pursue. Still made rookie mistakes, but hey, he's a rookie.

Bell needs to get his ****ing head screwed on and open his damn ears... Hangy? For a center, I usually don't pay attention to the middle of the line.

If we run Marshawn and Corey between Wood and Hangartner, good things can happen.

In the future? Wood will be studly. Levitre has potential but needs to get his head in the game. We need a stud LT, cause it looks like we have a good one on the right.

YardRat
10-26-2009, 04:13 PM
Both rookie guards are looking like a solid foundation for the future. I expect Woods to move over to center at some point, though.

jamze132
10-27-2009, 06:45 AM
I am hoping that Wood can man the C position next season.

DraftBoy
10-27-2009, 07:50 AM
I want us to take an OT next year but Im not convinced it should be a top tier guy imo.

I like a lot of the smaller school prospects like Vladimir Ducasse, John Anderson, Ramone Harewood amongst a few others.

ParanoidAndroid
10-27-2009, 09:02 AM
If you're judging by how well they've played based on what was expected of them, by far Levitre is the best. But Wood has been dominate at times. Most notably against Wilfork in week one and Jenkins before he went down with an injury. We might finally have an interior who can cope with the 3-4 NT's in our division.

Run blocking isn't where it should be, but I fully expect it to get better as the year goes on.

I've seen Levitre pancake a few guys this season. His feet are better than Wood's. What Wood has over him right now is power. Once he locks on, he's a beast.

Those

ParanoidAndroid
10-27-2009, 09:04 AM
If you're judging by how well they've played based on what was expected of them, by far Levitre is the best. But Wood has been dominate at times. Most notably against Wilfork in week one and Jenkins before he went down with an injury. We might finally have an interior who can cope with the 3-4 NT's in our division.

Run blocking isn't where it should be, but I fully expect it to get better as the year goes on.

I've seen Levitre pancake a few guys this season. His feet are better than Wood's. What Wood has over him right now is power. Once he locks on, he's a beast.

If this offense is going to go anywhere, those guys need to be here and in the same positions, season in and season out. Continuity....

Griff
10-27-2009, 09:05 AM
I truly think Wood is going to be a stud...he just needs more experience. Levitre has played OK and I think he'll be good also. It's the tackle spots that are hurting this team.

dead on but the new guy at RT seems to be doing okay.

LifetimeBillsFan
10-27-2009, 09:33 AM
I disagree with a number of things that have been said, although I do agree that the future looks good. Here's my take:

1.) None of the Bills' young offensive linemen, with the possible exception of Wood, is really ready to be starting in the NFL at this point and they wouldn't be starting on a team with a good offensive line (ie the Giants or the Jets).

2.) Wood has shown the ability to become an exceptional OG in the future at times, but is making his share of rookie mistakes. If he were playing on a better, more experienced offensive line, his mistakes wouldn't be as glaring and he would be improving faster, but he is coming along nicely. He doesn't get pushed back a lot, but is getting a lot of push many times in the run game, either. He is going to get better as the season progresses and will benefit from being in the offseason workout program. He could be good to very good next season.

3.) I completely disagree with Pat: IMHO Levitre has been the worst of the young offensive linemen given the fact that he got to work with the first team in OTAs and the preseason and neither of the OTs got nearly that amount of reps before being thrown into the fire. Levitre absolutely MUST get stronger this offseason. Opposing defenses are moving their biggest DT to play head-up on Levitre (including 3-4 defenses) to take advantage of the fact that he isn't strong enough to be playing at this point and they have been consistently blowing him up. He can't get any push on them in the run game at all and Hangartner has been having to help him out consistently in pass-blocking, which has been throwing off teh assignments of the other O-linemen and making things very difficult for Hangartner. But, Levitre has also shown that he is a real "battler"--he doesn't give up even when he is getting bowled back into the QB. Like Wood, he is making his share of rookie mistakes--he was making more than his share early on--but has really improved on that the last two games. He has shown signs that he can become a really solid player--maybe not with Pro Bowl potential like Wood, but a quality starter--once he gets strong enough to deal with the bigger NFL caliber DTs. He should be much better next season.

4.) Hangartner has really had his hands full trying to do his job and help out Wood and especially Levitre. It's hard to judge just how good he is--it would be nice to be able to see him able to just concentrate on doing his job without being so busy helping out the two rookies--but he definitely appears to be an improvement over both Fowler and Preston. By next season I think that the trio of Hangartner, Levitre and Wood could be quite solid and perhaps even become very good--especially since they are getting used to working together as a unit this season. The problems that they have now are things that should be by and large fixed by next season.

5.) Demetrius Bell is going through a trial by fire and, like Wood and Levitre, should end up being better for it. Bell shouldn't be starting and wouldn't be starting on most NFL teams at this point--he's still a bit too raw. But, the talent is there and he gives a full-out effort on every play, even when he gets beat. That tells me that he will get better--because he is contantly trying. Bell basically has two problems/weaknesses at this point: a.) he still needs to get stronger--he's noticeably stronger than he was last year, but not strong enough yet, but he has the frame to get bigger and I expect that he will; and b.) he needs to continue working on his footwork--when he gets his hands on his opponent, he does well, but he has problems with speed-rushers who are able to take advantage of the weaknesses in his footwork and get him off-balance. Bell has the potential to be really good, but should still be on the bench learning from an experienced starter that he would just spell occasionally. Playing next to Levitre, who is having his own struggles that opposing defenses are trying to take advantage of does not help. I expect Bell to continue to struggle the rest of the season, but he will get better as he gains experience.

6.) I do not think that the Bills need to use their # 1 draft pick on a LT to replace Bell. While I think that they need to add to their O-line depth in the draft, I think Bell will be far enough along in his development by next year that they can wait until later in the draft to pick up an OT--perhaps one who can challenge for the RT job.

7.) Meridith has been a pleasant surprise. He has some potential as a RT, but needs a lot of work. Like the others, he needs to get stronger in the offseason. He can't get any push because he isn't strong enough and a RT is supposed to be your road-grader. He really isn't ready to be playing in the NFL right now, but I kind of think that I would prefer to leave him in the lineup and let his get experience instead of replacing him with Scott when Scott comes back.

8.) Scott didn't look that bad during the preseason, but was awful before he got hurt. For a guy who has the experience that he has, he only looked marginally better than Meridith to me--and IMHO Meridith has more long-term potential. I see Scott as a back-up at best.

9.) I was shocked at how poorly Chambers played. He was awful. I couldn't believe that I was watching the same guy who played so decently for the Bills when Peters was out. I wonder what's going on with him.

You can't expect an offensive line that is starting essentially 4 rookies--three of whom should not be getting much playing time at all at this point--to be very good. Teams that start two rookies during a season usually have problems (see Green Bay and the Pats a couple of years ago) that limit their offense. So, I expect this offensive line to continue to struggle throughout this season. But, I also expect that they will get better with experience as the season goes on. I think that this unit has the potential to be anywhere from decent to pretty good next season, once the individual players get stronger during the offseason and as they get more time working together as a group. But it's going to be rough this year--and that's going to make it very difficult for the Bills to do much on offense in a lot of their remaining games.

DesertFox24
10-27-2009, 10:48 AM
I disagree with a number of things that have been said, although I do agree that the future looks good. Here's my take:

1.) None of the Bills' young offensive linemen, with the possible exception of Wood, is really ready to be starting in the NFL at this point and they wouldn't be starting on a team with a good offensive line (ie the Giants or the Jets).

2.) Wood has shown the ability to become an exceptional OG in the future at times, but is making his share of rookie mistakes. If he were playing on a better, more experienced offensive line, his mistakes wouldn't be as glaring and he would be improving faster, but he is coming along nicely. He doesn't get pushed back a lot, but is getting a lot of push many times in the run game, either. He is going to get better as the season progresses and will benefit from being in the offseason workout program. He could be good to very good next season.

3.) I completely disagree with Pat: IMHO Levitre has been the worst of the young offensive linemen given the fact that he got to work with the first team in OTAs and the preseason and neither of the OTs got nearly that amount of reps before being thrown into the fire. Levitre absolutely MUST get stronger this offseason. Opposing defenses are moving their biggest DT to play head-up on Levitre (including 3-4 defenses) to take advantage of the fact that he isn't strong enough to be playing at this point and they have been consistently blowing him up. He can't get any push on them in the run game at all and Hangartner has been having to help him out consistently in pass-blocking, which has been throwing off teh assignments of the other O-linemen and making things very difficult for Hangartner. But, Levitre has also shown that he is a real "battler"--he doesn't give up even when he is getting bowled back into the QB. Like Wood, he is making his share of rookie mistakes--he was making more than his share early on--but has really improved on that the last two games. He has shown signs that he can become a really solid player--maybe not with Pro Bowl potential like Wood, but a quality starter--once he gets strong enough to deal with the bigger NFL caliber DTs. He should be much better next season.

4.) Hangartner has really had his hands full trying to do his job and help out Wood and especially Levitre. It's hard to judge just how good he is--it would be nice to be able to see him able to just concentrate on doing his job without being so busy helping out the two rookies--but he definitely appears to be an improvement over both Fowler and Preston. By next season I think that the trio of Hangartner, Levitre and Wood could be quite solid and perhaps even become very good--especially since they are getting used to working together as a unit this season. The problems that they have now are things that should be by and large fixed by next season.

5.) Demetrius Bell is going through a trial by fire and, like Wood and Levitre, should end up being better for it. Bell shouldn't be starting and wouldn't be starting on most NFL teams at this point--he's still a bit too raw. But, the talent is there and he gives a full-out effort on every play, even when he gets beat. That tells me that he will get better--because he is contantly trying. Bell basically has two problems/weaknesses at this point: a.) he still needs to get stronger--he's noticeably stronger than he was last year, but not strong enough yet, but he has the frame to get bigger and I expect that he will; and b.) he needs to continue working on his footwork--when he gets his hands on his opponent, he does well, but he has problems with speed-rushers who are able to take advantage of the weaknesses in his footwork and get him off-balance. Bell has the potential to be really good, but should still be on the bench learning from an experienced starter that he would just spell occasionally. Playing next to Levitre, who is having his own struggles that opposing defenses are trying to take advantage of does not help. I expect Bell to continue to struggle the rest of the season, but he will get better as he gains experience.

6.) I do not think that the Bills need to use their # 1 draft pick on a LT to replace Bell. While I think that they need to add to their O-line depth in the draft, I think Bell will be far enough along in his development by next year that they can wait until later in the draft to pick up an OT--perhaps one who can challenge for the RT job.

7.) Meridith has been a pleasant surprise. He has some potential as a RT, but needs a lot of work. Like the others, he needs to get stronger in the offseason. He can't get any push because he isn't strong enough and a RT is supposed to be your road-grader. He really isn't ready to be playing in the NFL right now, but I kind of think that I would prefer to leave him in the lineup and let his get experience instead of replacing him with Scott when Scott comes back.

8.) Scott didn't look that bad during the preseason, but was awful before he got hurt. For a guy who has the experience that he has, he only looked marginally better than Meridith to me--and IMHO Meridith has more long-term potential. I see Scott as a back-up at best.

9.) I was shocked at how poorly Chambers played. He was awful. I couldn't believe that I was watching the same guy who played so decently for the Bills when Peters was out. I wonder what's going on with him.

You can't expect an offensive line that is starting essentially 4 rookies--three of whom should not be getting much playing time at all at this point--to be very good. Teams that start two rookies during a season usually have problems (see Green Bay and the Pats a couple of years ago) that limit their offense. So, I expect this offensive line to continue to struggle throughout this season. But, I also expect that they will get better with experience as the season goes on. I think that this unit has the potential to be anywhere from decent to pretty good next season, once the individual players get stronger during the offseason and as they get more time working together as a group. But it's going to be rough this year--and that's going to make it very difficult for the Bills to do much on offense in a lot of their remaining games.

Excellent post could not agree with you anymore.

I agree that drafting a tackle early this year would not be the best bet, but we do need to draft another tackle and guard for depth purposes and for competition in the future.

DraftBoy
10-27-2009, 10:55 AM
Personally Ive been the most impressed with Meredith given the kid came off the Packers PS and has essentially been our best OT.

Typ0
10-27-2009, 11:08 AM
You really brought out the things that are showing what I said just before the season started...namely that the organization had already given up on this season in hopes of breeding talent quickly to be much more competitive next year. I just hope they realize they are going to need qualified QB talent to get anything done.


I disagree with a number of things that have been said, although I do agree that the future looks good. Here's my take:

1.) None of the Bills' young offensive linemen, with the possible exception of Wood, is really ready to be starting in the NFL at this point and they wouldn't be starting on a team with a good offensive line (ie the Giants or the Jets).

2.) Wood has shown the ability to become an exceptional OG in the future at times, but is making his share of rookie mistakes. If he were playing on a better, more experienced offensive line, his mistakes wouldn't be as glaring and he would be improving faster, but he is coming along nicely. He doesn't get pushed back a lot, but is getting a lot of push many times in the run game, either. He is going to get better as the season progresses and will benefit from being in the offseason workout program. He could be good to very good next season.

3.) I completely disagree with Pat: IMHO Levitre has been the worst of the young offensive linemen given the fact that he got to work with the first team in OTAs and the preseason and neither of the OTs got nearly that amount of reps before being thrown into the fire. Levitre absolutely MUST get stronger this offseason. Opposing defenses are moving their biggest DT to play head-up on Levitre (including 3-4 defenses) to take advantage of the fact that he isn't strong enough to be playing at this point and they have been consistently blowing him up. He can't get any push on them in the run game at all and Hangartner has been having to help him out consistently in pass-blocking, which has been throwing off teh assignments of the other O-linemen and making things very difficult for Hangartner. But, Levitre has also shown that he is a real "battler"--he doesn't give up even when he is getting bowled back into the QB. Like Wood, he is making his share of rookie mistakes--he was making more than his share early on--but has really improved on that the last two games. He has shown signs that he can become a really solid player--maybe not with Pro Bowl potential like Wood, but a quality starter--once he gets strong enough to deal with the bigger NFL caliber DTs. He should be much better next season.

4.) Hangartner has really had his hands full trying to do his job and help out Wood and especially Levitre. It's hard to judge just how good he is--it would be nice to be able to see him able to just concentrate on doing his job without being so busy helping out the two rookies--but he definitely appears to be an improvement over both Fowler and Preston. By next season I think that the trio of Hangartner, Levitre and Wood could be quite solid and perhaps even become very good--especially since they are getting used to working together as a unit this season. The problems that they have now are things that should be by and large fixed by next season.

5.) Demetrius Bell is going through a trial by fire and, like Wood and Levitre, should end up being better for it. Bell shouldn't be starting and wouldn't be starting on most NFL teams at this point--he's still a bit too raw. But, the talent is there and he gives a full-out effort on every play, even when he gets beat. That tells me that he will get better--because he is contantly trying. Bell basically has two problems/weaknesses at this point: a.) he still needs to get stronger--he's noticeably stronger than he was last year, but not strong enough yet, but he has the frame to get bigger and I expect that he will; and b.) he needs to continue working on his footwork--when he gets his hands on his opponent, he does well, but he has problems with speed-rushers who are able to take advantage of the weaknesses in his footwork and get him off-balance. Bell has the potential to be really good, but should still be on the bench learning from an experienced starter that he would just spell occasionally. Playing next to Levitre, who is having his own struggles that opposing defenses are trying to take advantage of does not help. I expect Bell to continue to struggle the rest of the season, but he will get better as he gains experience.

6.) I do not think that the Bills need to use their # 1 draft pick on a LT to replace Bell. While I think that they need to add to their O-line depth in the draft, I think Bell will be far enough along in his development by next year that they can wait until later in the draft to pick up an OT--perhaps one who can challenge for the RT job.

7.) Meridith has been a pleasant surprise. He has some potential as a RT, but needs a lot of work. Like the others, he needs to get stronger in the offseason. He can't get any push because he isn't strong enough and a RT is supposed to be your road-grader. He really isn't ready to be playing in the NFL right now, but I kind of think that I would prefer to leave him in the lineup and let his get experience instead of replacing him with Scott when Scott comes back.

8.) Scott didn't look that bad during the preseason, but was awful before he got hurt. For a guy who has the experience that he has, he only looked marginally better than Meridith to me--and IMHO Meridith has more long-term potential. I see Scott as a back-up at best.

9.) I was shocked at how poorly Chambers played. He was awful. I couldn't believe that I was watching the same guy who played so decently for the Bills when Peters was out. I wonder what's going on with him.

You can't expect an offensive line that is starting essentially 4 rookies--three of whom should not be getting much playing time at all at this point--to be very good. Teams that start two rookies during a season usually have problems (see Green Bay and the Pats a couple of years ago) that limit their offense. So, I expect this offensive line to continue to struggle throughout this season. But, I also expect that they will get better with experience as the season goes on. I think that this unit has the potential to be anywhere from decent to pretty good next season, once the individual players get stronger during the offseason and as they get more time working together as a group. But it's going to be rough this year--and that's going to make it very difficult for the Bills to do much on offense in a lot of their remaining games.

Jan Reimers
10-27-2009, 11:16 AM
I think Butler goes back to RT next year, when healthy. He was doing well before he was injured, and will prove to be better than Scott or Meredith. I see no reason to draft an RT.

Ground Chuck
10-27-2009, 10:46 PM
People forget how bad we were up the middle last year. The A gap rush killed us all year. At least we can handle that now.

I wonder why they haven't tried Levitre at LT and let McKinney play LG. Levitre played tackle his whole senior year. At this point, a large garbage can would be better than Bell.

feldspar
10-28-2009, 02:50 AM
Generally speaking, I think that the o-line has been the biggest liability to the offense all year. Without question. That's not to say that they don't have potential, but developing 4 guys on the line at the same time is a recipe for disaster.

I know Butler got hurt early, but now we have three rookies starting on the line, one of whom was undrafted. Then we have Bell, a second-year player picked in the seventh round that has never started prior to this year. Hangartner is nothing to write home about.

4 completely inexperienced players and a nobody. That's our line. Remember when we tried Chambers and Scott starting at the Tackle positions? That was a disaster and just about killed us.

People shouldn't complain about our QB so much, no matter which one. I think it might take another 5 turnovers by the defense this week to win the game against the Texans. Our defense gives up huge amounts of yardage anyway.

This line is the main reason why the Bills averaged 1.9 yards per carry rushing this week. Potential? Whatever. They are NOT getting the job done right now.

Did you guys know that the Bills had 32 yards total offense in the first half this week? One first down in six drives. Pathetic.

Nighthawk
10-28-2009, 12:22 PM
I like them both, for rookies.

and I think Levitre has played the best of anybody on the OL so far this year-- by a ton, and that includes wood

I disagree...IMO, Woods has shown why so many NFL experts were high on him. Levitre has been OK, but at times has struggled with the transition inside. Don't get me wrong, I think they'll both be very good, I just think Wood has been better.

LooneyBin
10-28-2009, 08:23 PM
They get my approval.

Raptor
10-29-2009, 08:15 AM
Levitre has clearly been the better of the two, he only has 1 sack by my acct and yea he has 2 false start penalties but those can be expected by a rookie. He's great in space and really fights every play

Wood has given up 3 sacks and had two holding penalties. The holding penalties are drive killers and he he has been good in run blocking his pass blocking needs some work

But its clear right now Levitre is a stud and Wood is on his way

LifetimeBillsFan
10-29-2009, 09:59 AM
I don't know what all the people who are so high on Levitre are seeing.

Ron from NM has a good article in BuffaloRumblings that is posted on the BZ front page where he describes what every offensive lineman did in the game and grades them. Levitre does not grade out well. Additionally, in the comments section after the article he explains his grading system and points out that, of the 8 drive killing errors by Bills' offensive linemen in the game, Levitre committed 5 of them. That is more in keeping with what I have been seeing of Levitre.

There is should be no doubt that the offensive line is what is killing the Bills' offense this season (TO also referenced this in his latest presser). Tom Brady and Jim Brown would have difficulties playing well behind this offensive line.

But, that is to be expected when you have such a young, inexperienced offensive line. Rookies and inexperienced players make mistakes. That's a fact. And, as Ron from NM's article highlights, each of the Bills' offensive linemen made his share of bad mistakes in that game. That has been the case in previous games and will continue to be the case as each one of these guys tries to gain the experience needed to become a quality offensive lineman in the NFL. The fact these players are all pretty much playing in a unit with other young, inexperienced guys is going to magnify and, to a certain extent, increase the number and magnitude of their mistakes because they don't have experienced guys to lean on to guide them and cover up for them when they get beat or make a mistake. In effect, they have all been thrown into the deep end of the pool and told to sink or swim--and eventually, given their talent, they will end up learning how to swim, even if they end up swallowing a fair amount of water along the way. The problem is that, while they are thrashing around and getting water in their nose, mouth and lungs, the Bills' QBs, RBs, WRs and offense as a whole are going to suffer--a lot.

The only way that I can justify what the Bills have done with the offensive line this season is to look back at what a couple of other NFL teams, the Pats, Packers and Indy, have done recently. All three of those teams--for various reasons--have played seasons recently when they started two rookies on their offensive line for most, if not all, of the season. While their offenses suffered somewhat during those seasons, in all three cases those teams ended up having much better offensive lines and offenses the next season and two of them, NE and Indy, made the playoffs that year. Knowing how poorly the interior of their offensive line performed last season, it would not be illogical for the Bills to reason that, while they would suffer a bit of a setback initially, they would ultimately be no worse off by the end of this season and better next season if they could do the same thing that those other teams did--which ultimately led to them drafting Wood and Levitre to start at OG this season.

Despite what some fans seem to think, the decision to trade Peters was a no-brainer for the Bills. They had no choice in the matter. After what he did last season, they could not count on him to live up to his contract nor could they trust him not to begin griping or holdout again once some other LT surpassed him in pay. Worse yet, even if they paid him, doing so, after the way that he acted, would send a message to their other players that they could follow suit if they were unhappy with their contracts--which could lead to even more problems in the future. No team wants to get rid of a talent like Peters--and the Bills made it clear that they didn't want to either--but no player is irreplaceable or can be allowed to disrupt a team in the way that Peters threatened to do so. So, they had to get rid of him, even though I'm sure that they would have prefered to try to reach some kind of agreement with him.

While I am sure that the Bills drafted Demetrius Bell as a potential future replacement for Peters--Bell is simply too similar to Peters not to draw that conclusion--should a replacement be needed, I don't think that they anticipated that they would need to have Bell replace Peters so quickly. After the way that Langston Walker and Chambers played in Peters' absence, I think that they really believed that, with Butler at RT, they could get through this season--or at least to the bye week at mid-season--with those two manning the LT position. But, for whatever reason, Chambers' play has utterly deteriorated and there was a problem with Walker.

We do not know and may never know what happened with Walker and the Bills behind closed doors that led the team to release him. There have been stories that Walker didn't like the "no huddle" and was unwilling to get himself into sufficient shape to play at a high tempo. That may be the case, but, personally, I think that there may be more to it than that. After a promising start to his career, Walker objected when Oakland moved him to a different position and his play with the Raiders deteriorated considerably as they moved him from position to position. When he signed with the Bills, Walker indicated that one of the reasons that he left Oakland and wanted to join the Bills was that he was upset with being moved around so much in Oakland. I don't know if the Bills gave Walker any assurances that they would not ask him to change positions if he signed with them, but it was obvious in the interviews that he gave during the offseason that Walker wasn't too happy about being switched to LT by the Bills. While issues related to playing in a "no huddle" attack may have been "the straw that broke the camel's back" with Walker and precipitated his release, I would not be surprised if the Bills' plan to move Walker to LT was what was responsible for his poor attitude and play during the preseason and the underlying reason why the Bills decided to cut ties with him at what would otherwise be such an inopportune time for them.

I think the Bills realized in the preseason that their decision to rebuild the interior of their offensive line was going to result in a step back for their offense. I think that they hoped that the addition of TO would help to compensate for that. But, I think that once they had to cut ties with Walker they knew that it was going to be pretty rough for their offense with such a young offensive line--Dick Jauron may not be the best HC in the NFL, but he is not a stupid man and he has been around the NFL long enough to know how difficult it can be for a team that is starting so many young offensive linemen (he wouldn't--and, in his position, couldn't--say that publicly: he has a team to coach and a whole season to get his team through regardless). The injury to Brad Butler simply made things worse and a lot rougher.

If Dick Jauron gets this team to .500 or even to another 7-9 season, there's a pretty good chance that he will survive as their head coach--because of the offensive line, especially if the offensive line play improves as the season progresses. I know that Bills' fans don't want to hear that, but it would be quite an achievement for any head coach to get that many wins with such a young and inexperienced offensive line holding its offense back like an anchor. It would be hard for Ralph Wilson to discount that and he has been around football long enough that I don't think that he will. Indeed, I wouldn't be surprised if the extreme youth of the Bills offensive line has not been the subject of some discussions with him already and the coaches and front office are proceeding with putting them through this "baptism of fire" with his direct knowledge and even blessing.