For the Whitner haters...There are 3 kinds of safties in the NFL...

[sauce]

"People are out here calling Whitner a bust because he doesn't pick the ball off much, however there are 3 types of safeties in the NFL.

Safties who are great vs the pass and have a very finesse game like Byrd

There are guys who are great vs the run and have a very physical game like Whitner and Scott.

Then their are guys who play both very well. There are plenty of examples around the NFL, just not on our team.

Here is what Wikipedia said about Safeties: "Safeties are the last line of defense, and are thus expected to be sure tacklers. In fact, many safeties rank among the hardest hitters in football history."

We have Byrd who is a ball hawk...added bonus. Donte NEVER EVER was considered to be a ball hawk in college...he only had 3 INT's. Find me an article or scouting report that uses the words "Ball Hawk" to describe Whitner and I'll eat crow.

Donte Whitner fits the bill of a safety to the tee: Hard, sure tackler...allow minimal extra yardage. He is also a fiery leader (which some fans don't like strangely)

D-Whit was, in my opinion, off to a fantastic start prior to injury and although he struggled with angles this year he has been very steady and well respected among the NFL.

So don't FREAK when Whitner doesn't have 3+ picks a year, because those of us that know what his job is and understand it really like his play. I know I do...Whitner and Byrd, I love our safety tandom. "

[Philagape]

There are guys who are great vs the run and have a very physical game like Whitner and Scott.

Since when? Whitner doesn't do anything great.

[Prov401]

There is nothing you can do to convince Whitner haters otherwise. I personally think he is a top 10 saftey, at about 10. People here are just angry he doesn't live up to his 8th overall pick potential. I agree he was highly reached for, but blame Marv Levy for that, not Dont Whitner.

[Pinkerton Security]

suace, why do you quote yourself? or is this pasted from elsewhere?

[Crisis]

I'd rather have Scott starting than Whitner.

[zone]

Byrd can hit as well as ball hawk.

[THATHURMANATOR]

Yeah Byrd was delivering some decent tackles out there.

I don't have Whitner and still have hope he will be a decent player for us. Key word "decent" which sucks because at 8th overall he should be great.

[Mr. Pink]

You're right.

There is three types of safeties in this league.

Great, Average, Terrible

Where does Whitner fall in this? Somewhere between average and terrible.

[BuffaloBlitz83]

Landry on Washington and Adrian Wilson on Zona are examples of a hard hitters that are never ball hawks. They are very good safeties.

Ed Reed on Baltimore is just the greatest safety! He does it all. Hit hard, cover, Pick off passes to the house.

[OpIv37]

"People are out here calling Whitner a bust because he doesn't pick the ball off much, however there are 3 types of safeties in the NFL.

Safties who are great vs the pass and have a very finesse game like Byrd

There are guys who are great vs the run and have a very physical game like Whitner and Scott.

Then their are guys who play both very well. There are plenty of examples around the NFL, just not on our team.

Here is what Wikipedia said about Safeties: "Safeties are the last line of defense, and are thus expected to be sure tacklers. In fact, many safeties rank among the hardest hitters in football history."

We have Byrd who is a ball hawk...added bonus. Donte NEVER EVER was considered to be a ball hawk in college...he only had 3 INT's. Find me an article or scouting report that uses the words "Ball Hawk" to describe Whitner and I'll eat crow.

Donte Whitner fits the bill of a safety to the tee: Hard, sure tackler...allow minimal extra yardage. He is also a fiery leader (which some fans don't like strangely)

D-Whit was, in my opinion, off to a fantastic start prior to injury and although he struggled with angles this year he has been very steady and well respected among the NFL.

So don't FREAK when Whitner doesn't have 3+ picks a year, because those of us that know what his job is and understand it really like his play. I know I do...Whitner and Byrd, I love our safety tandom. "

Explain the 3 bad angles in the Giants game in 07 or letting McJackass run right by him for a huge touchdown or getting jacked twice by RB's in jacksonville in last year's opener or getting injured trying to make a hit against an RB late last season. They guy is not a solid tackler. He helps some in the run game, but he was also on the field for both of those huge runs against the Jets, so even his run defense is overrated.

People say he's a leader- how? Cuz he let McKelvin stay over at his house? So what? Do you have any idea how many people I've let couch-surf at my place for weeks while they were trying to get settled in this area? That's not leadership- that's just what friends do.

Cuz he embarrassed himself by making a stupid prediction? How is that leadership? Because he tackled a guy 8 yards in the endzone instead of BEFORE he scored? How is that leadership?

People always use the "leadership" line to defend Whitner but never have any examples or evidence of him actually BEING a leader.

I never understand you Whitner apologists. He's average at best- just deal with it and stop defending mediocrity.

[OpIv37]

Landry on Washington and Adrian Wilson on Zona are examples of a hard hitters that are never ball hawks. They are very good safeties.

Ed Reed on Baltimore is just the greatest safety! He does it all. Hit hard, cover, Pick off passes to the house.

I live in DC and Landry takes a fair amount of heat for not being a ball hawk and getting beat deep too often.

[djjimkelly]

"People are out here calling Whitner a bust because he doesn't pick the ball off much, however there are 3 types of safeties in the NFL.

Safties who are great vs the pass and have a very finesse game like Byrd

There are guys who are great vs the run and have a very physical game like Whitner and Scott.

Then their are guys who play both very well. There are plenty of examples around the NFL, just not on our team.

Here is what Wikipedia said about Safeties: "Safeties are the last line of defense, and are thus expected to be sure tacklers. In fact, many safeties rank among the hardest hitters in football history."

We have Byrd who is a ball hawk...added bonus. Donte NEVER EVER was considered to be a ball hawk in college...he only had 3 INT's. Find me an article or scouting report that uses the words "Ball Hawk" to describe Whitner and I'll eat crow.

Donte Whitner fits the bill of a safety to the tee: Hard, sure tackler...allow minimal extra yardage. He is also a fiery leader (which some fans don't like strangely)

D-Whit was, in my opinion, off to a fantastic start prior to injury and although he struggled with angles this year he has been very steady and well respected among the NFL.

So don't FREAK when Whitner doesn't have 3+ picks a year, because those of us that know what his job is and understand it really like his play. I know I do...Whitner and Byrd, I love our safety tandom. "


byrd FS whitner SS argument over

[OpIv37]

There is nothing you can do to convince Whitner haters otherwise. I personally think he is a top 10 saftey, at about 10. People here are just angry he doesn't live up to his 8th overall pick potential. I agree he was highly reached for, but blame Marv Levy for that, not Dont Whitner.

how is he a top safety?
INTs? No
Passes defensed? No
Big hits? No
Tackles? Some, but not enough to make him a top safety
Run defense? Decent, but overrated by you apologists. He makes as many mistakes as he does plays.

But, you people insist on defending mediocrity. Nothing I can do about it.

[Crisis]

Scott back at SS, Whitner to 4th corner.

[Prov401]

how is he a top safety?
INTs? No
Passes defensed? No
Big hits? No
Tackles? Some, but not enough to make him a top safety
Run defense? Decent, but overrated by you apologists. He makes as many mistakes as he does plays.

But, you people insist on defending mediocrity. Nothing I can do about it.

Firstly, calm down.

Secondly, nobody here is right. This is a discussion forum, opinions count.

Thirdly, it is quite obvious you hate Donte Whitner. You always have at least 10 posts in a Whitner thread belittling everybody's opinion's about the guy.

Fourthly, at the begining of this season, Donte Whitner was rated number 9, count it, 9, one more time 9th among safties in the NFL, here is the link.

http://blogs.buffalobills.com/2009/05/28/whitner-ranked-as-nfls-9th-best-safety/

So dude, seriously, just make one huge thread on how much you can't stomach Donte Whitner, because it is quite obvious. Yes, we all know this, you don't like him. Ok, that's fine, I respect your opinion, but it's sickening to here you repeat yourself over, and over again. Honestly, I respect alot of your postings, but this Whitner thing is like kicking a dead horse. I agree, there is a thread about Whitner once a week, and that alone is getting sickening. I even made one labeled 'Defending Donte' about a month ago that got a good discussion going on.

Was Whitner reached for? Absolutley. Who's fault is/was that? Marv Levy.
Does Donte Whitner make mistakes? Yes, he's human. I don't see 30 threads about how Polamalu missed a clear tackle Sunday against the Vikings. I'm in no means trying to compare the two, I'm just saying, everybody makes mistakes.

Donte has had absolutley no pass rush what-so-ever since he has been playing in Buffalo. He is not a ball-hawk saftey. I want to see you, or anybody on this board, hell, anyone in the NFL cover professional wide recievers for more than 8 seconds and see if you can keep them covered as your D-Line creates a cute, powderpuff pocket for the QB to step up in after about 8-10 seconds of sipping a cup of tea, reading the New York Daily, and having time to have a phone conversation with his wife about dinner plans.

Whitner gets a bad rap, and its all because everybody can't get past Marv Levy,.... MARV LEVY reaching for him.

[Prov401]

Scott back at SS, Whitner to 4th corner.

I'm guessing the, can-i-bus thing is effecting your posts.

[BillsWin]

"People are out here calling Whitner a bust because he doesn't pick the ball off much, however there are 3 types of safeties in the NFL.

Safties who are great vs the pass and have a very finesse game like Byrd

There are guys who are great vs the run and have a very physical game like Whitner and Scott.

Then their are guys who play both very well. There are plenty of examples around the NFL, just not on our team.

Here is what Wikipedia said about Safeties: "Safeties are the last line of defense, and are thus expected to be sure tacklers. In fact, many safeties rank among the hardest hitters in football history."

We have Byrd who is a ball hawk...added bonus. Donte NEVER EVER was considered to be a ball hawk in college...he only had 3 INT's. Find me an article or scouting report that uses the words "Ball Hawk" to describe Whitner and I'll eat crow.

Donte Whitner fits the bill of a safety to the tee: Hard, sure tackler...allow minimal extra yardage. He is also a fiery leader (which some fans don't like strangely)

D-Whit was, in my opinion, off to a fantastic start prior to injury and although he struggled with angles this year he has been very steady and well respected among the NFL.

So don't FREAK when Whitner doesn't have 3+ picks a year, because those of us that know what his job is and understand it really like his play. I know I do...Whitner and Byrd, I love our safety tandom. "


You won't convince some people. I am not a Whitner lover, nor am I a hater. I think he was picked a little high at 8, but was really coming along this season.

He is a defensive leader, good tackler and a big hitter who is great against the run. Whitner and Byrd will be a fantastic tandem when they play together.

[Billiever86]

lol....do you actually think whitner can tackle?...

haha....hes made about two stops in his career by the line of scrimmage...terrible gap assignments...cant get penetration....MISSES TOO MANY TACKLES.....

HES 8 overall! HE LOST HIS JOB TO A nobody called bryan scott....who is a much better run support player than him....

COME ON MAN

[OpIv37]

Firstly, calm down.

Secondly, nobody here is right. This is a discussion forum, opinions count.

Thirdly, it is quite obvious you hate Donte Whitner. You always have at least 10 posts in a Whitner thread belittling everybody's opinion's about the guy.

Fourthly, at the begining of this season, Donte Whitner was rated number 9, count it, 9, one more time 9th among safties in the NFL, here is the link.

http://blogs.buffalobills.com/2009/05/28/whitner-ranked-as-nfls-9th-best-safety/

So dude, seriously, just make one huge thread on how much you can't stomach Donte Whitner, because it is quite obvious. Yes, we all know this, you don't like him. Ok, that's fine, I respect your opinion, but it's sickening to here you repeat yourself over, and over again. Honestly, I respect alot of your postings, but this Whitner thing is like kicking a dead horse. I agree, there is a thread about Whitner once a week, and that alone is getting sickening. I even made one labeled 'Defending Donte' about a month ago that got a good discussion going on.

Was Whitner reached for? Absolutley. Who's fault is/was that? Marv Levy.
Does Donte Whitner make mistakes? Yes, he's human. I don't see 30 threads about how Polamalu missed a clear tackle Sunday against the Vikings. I'm in no means trying to compare the two, I'm just saying, everybody makes mistakes.

Donte has had absolutley no pass rush what-so-ever since he has been playing in Buffalo. He is not a ball-hawk saftey. I want to see you, or anybody on this board, hell, anyone in the NFL cover professional wide recievers for more than 8 seconds and see if you can keep them covered as your D-Line creates a cute, powderpuff pocket for the QB to step up in after about 8-10 seconds of sipping a cup of tea, reading the New York Daily, and having time to have a phone conversation with his wife about dinner plans.

Whitner gets a bad rap, and its all because everybody can't get past Marv Levy,.... MARV LEVY reaching for him.

The people who make those ratings don't watch every play of every game like real Bills fans do. I've seen Whitner make plays, and I've given him credit when he has. I've also seen him make a lot of mistakes.

What drives me absolutely ape-**** is how so many people on this board just can't admit it when he screws up. Everyone has to blame the system, or the pass rush, or someone else on the D. Whitner makes mistakes- when he does, just criticize him for it and move on. Too many people on this board want to make excuses for him and I just don't understand why.

When it comes to Marv, believe me- I'm one of his harshest critics. His drafts were mediocre at best and his free agent classes were dismal failures. He ruined his legacy and I really admire him as a coach, so I wish he never came back in the GM role.

But unfortunately, what's done is done. Teams whose high round draft picks play well tend to win, teams whose high round draft picks struggle tend to struggle. So,it's not Whitner's fault that Marv reached for him, and the expectation to play up to a #8 overall draft pick may be unfair. But if Whitner doesn't live up to those expectations- fair or not- it's a good indicator that the team will struggle.

[OpIv37]

You won't convince some people. I am not a Whitner lover, nor am I a hater. I think he was picked a little high at 8, but was really coming along this season.

He is a defensive leader, good tackler and a big hitter who is great against the run. Whitner and Byrd will be a fantastic tandem when they play together.


Can someone PLEASE explain this "leader" thing to me? I keep hearing that he's a leader, but I don't see it on the field and no one ever explains what makes him a leader.

[Ickybaluky]

Landry on Washington and Adrian Wilson on Zona are examples of a hard hitters that are never ball hawks. They are very good safeties.

I'll give you Landry, a great athlete who lacks instincts. I wouldn't call him very good, just athletic.

But... Adrian Wilson? Are you kidding me? Wilson is one of the most dominating S of the last decade, it is just people don't know it because he plays in Arizona. He has 19 Ints, 48 passes defensed, 12 forced fumbles and 19 sacks in his career. He is built like a LB, hits like a truck and is all over the field. He has something like 60+ career tackles for loss. He is a great player, a 2X Pro Bowler and 2X All-Pro, despite playing on crappy teams most of his career.

I mean, seriously, that guy is great.

I'll agree Whitner isn't terrible, but he isn't really great at anything. He is a good, physical S who rarely makes game-changing plays. Top-10? No, but he is starting caliber. Until he starts making some big plays regularly, he is just another good athlete who lacks playing instincts. He makes so few plays around the ball, he probably should come off the field in passing situations. I think George Wilson would be better in those cases.

Byrd looks like a find, though. He seems to have a knack for being around the ball, which is even more impressive given he is a rookie that missed a lot of time.

[trapezeus]

Can someone PLEASE explain this "leader" thing to me? I keep hearing that he's a leader, but I don't see it on the field and no one ever explains what makes him a leader.

he tweets and facebooks the team to make them play better. you haven't noticed the amazing leadership?

I'm sure whitner has some value, but Byrd came up in run support and laid a couple big hits. one of which made williams get up gingerly. I'm sure he'll fall apart by virtue of being a bills player, but its exciting to see him do well right now.

[DrGraves]

whitner is the type of safety who sucks in run support and doesn't make plays in the pass game either.

[BertSquirtgum]

which one is whitner? i think he has very good typing skills and should consider becoming a secretary.

[malo]

Whitener is none of those three. He just occupies some space.

[Griff]

Whitner is a perfect acceptable SS, an overpaid one, but having him and Scott at SS isn't the biggest issue this team would have once he comes back.

[kelly2reed4six]

Byrd had some awesome tackles, especially considering he's a rookie. He saved a TD on a Deangelo Williams run and stopped that 4th down conversion. Byrd won that game for us, no doubt. It's not even that his interceptions were amazing picks, but rather that he KNEW to be there to make the play. Most guys wouldn't do that. Listen to his postgame interview....he explains how he made the picks.....most guys would just tell you they happened to be in the right place at the right time....I can't wait to see how this guy progresses! I hope we have a Troy Polamalu or Ed Reed in the making!

[bigbub2352]

Whitner is a horrible SS and an average FS i guess... he is not ball hawking, he is not physical, he was not worth the 8th overall pick
He is terrible in run support unless u call arm tackiling and getting hurt when u get run over good in run support
His pick this yr was thrown right at him so he i guess made the play we waited 4 yrs for.
He is also to small to match up against Big time WRs and TEs he gets beat regularly in coverage is late coming over the top and NO WR or TE fears him over the middle, he has had 2 good hits in 4 yrs one on OCHO Cinco and One on Brandon Marshall
he is not even near the same class as :
Polamalu
Reed
Sanders
Merriweather
Wilson
Weddle
Sharper
He runs his mouth on the internet and then gets hurt every game while guranteeing playoffs
He is injury prone too which has made us sign street free agents every year at the safety position
this is all bad news that u put together for someone who was reached for with the 8th overall pick and it set the organization back
Hence why we sucked under his tenure here

[The Jokeman]

As mentioned it's not so much Whitner but where we selected Whitner. I realize handsite is a great thing but the truth is looking back a better plan would have been to take DT Brodrick Bunkley at pick #8, which would mean we would had never traded up for John "BUST1B" McCargo and could have stayed at pick #42 taken a SS that's as good if not better then Whitner in Roman Harper. We'd also have pick #73 that could have used on a guy like Jason Spitz who's been a solid OG/C for the Packers.

[Philagape]

I realize handsite is a great thing but the truth is looking back a better plan would have been to take DT Brodrick Bunkley at pick #8, which would mean we would had never traded up for John "BUST1B" McCargo and could have stayed at pick #42 taken a SS that's as good if not better then Whitner in Roman Harper. We'd also have pick #73 that could have used on a guy like Jason Spitz who's been a solid OG/C for the Packers.

Or Ngata?????