For those of you wanting to draft left tackle over top tier QB,

[BillsWin]

We don't have a QB on our roster worth spending high picks on tackles to protect.

Buffalo sports daily had a great article a week or two ago breaking down the incompetence of our franchise over this past decade and how we have approached the QB position since Kelly.

We have yet to try drafting a top tier prospect (NO, LOSMAN DOES NOT COUNT. He was NEVER considered a top prospect.)

We just keep trying the same old thing, and look how that is working out.

You know that old saying, "If it ain't broke, don't fix it."?

Well this **** is broke. So fix it.

[PECKERWOOD]

Who cares? Cause none of us are the shot callers, just one stupid fan's opinion over the others.

[BillsWin]

I know first hand that games are won in the trenches. But come now! We need someone to lead this team under center.

[BillsWin]

Who cares? Cause none of us are the shot callers, just one stupid fan's opinion over the others.
You callin' me stupid pecker? :mad:

[PECKERWOOD]

You callin' me stupid pecker? :mad:

Not at all, just saying that none of our opinions really matter, because even if you made the right call, the leadership of our franchise would obviously go in a different direction for the sake of being wrong.

[Oaf]

This is a stupid argument.

We don't have a Tackle on our roster worth spending high picks on a QB to throw behind!

BTW, again, I am pulling for a round one LB.

[BillsWin]

Not at all, just saying that none of our opinions really matter, because even if you made the right call, the leadership of our franchise would obviously go in a different direction for the sake of being wrong.


Boy, I have been saying that for years. :sadwalk:

[TigerJ]

It's a matter of philosophy. Those who would build a team from the lines out might tend to draft a tackle whether or not they had a QB worth protecting. They would say, "Get your line set first, then bring in the franchise QB." For me, the question is more about whether our present tackles are kids with lots of talent and upside who merely suck because they're so inexperienced, or they are always going to be scrubs because that's what they are. I don't think we have a definitive answer to that question yet, but I think the Bills will have, or should have a pretty good indication by the end of the season.

[YardRat]

You can win in this league with adequate QB play if you've got a dominant offensive line.

You can have the best QB in the league, and if he doesn't have the o-line in front of him you're going to lose.

Easy call. Draft big, early and often.

[Demon]

I'm not against NOT picking a QB in the first round, however I am still in love with Colt McCoy and think he is exactly what we need, BUT, i'm not against the idea of not picking a QB, however, not for a tackle. If we don't pick a QB, i hope it's because we fell in love with one of the DT;s (Cody or McCoy) or LB (McClain or Spikes). I don't think we'll be picking near the top so Suh will be out of question.

[Philagape]

Only certain QBs are worth protecting? Huh??

I guess the Browns should cut Joe Thomas then. I'll take him!

It's true that the Bills have been doing the same crap for years.
For example, they haven't drafted a guy who played LT in the first two rounds since 1992 (Fina)

[BuffaloBlitz83]

This is the stupidest load of **** i ever heard of. this is the mentality the FO has had for years i bet. Things need to change, we need to build a top OL.

GREEN BAY freaking sucks balls too, it isn't cause of Aaron Rogers or the defense. It is the pathetic OL that leads the nFL in most sacks. I can fuarantee it isn't a coincidence that bad OL's lead to good teams struggling

[PECKERWOOD]

Boy, I have been saying that for years. :sadwalk:

Sucks, doesn't it? You or I may hold the answer, but it doesn't matter.

[DrGraves]

I agree Billswin. Here is the way I see it. There are two scenarios:

1. we draft a linemen or whatever and the front office thinks okay maybe the line is improved and trent will magically get better and our problems will be solved

2. we draft a top tier prospect. the front office thinks to themselves, **** we are paying this guy a ton of money and we don't want to look like **** ups for drafting him. lets go sign some more good players to help him out.

[BillsWin]

Only certain QBs are worth protecting? Huh??

I guess the Browns should cut Joe Thomas then. I'll take him!

It's true that the Bills have been doing the same crap for years.
For example, they haven't drafted a guy who played LT in the first two rounds since 1992 (Fina)

It was a joke phil :drool:, but you get the point!

[PECKERWOOD]

Dude, for every drool you got I got like three more. :drool: :drool: :drool:

[BillsWin]

Dude, for every drool you got I got like three more. :drool: :drool: :drool:

Ill see your drool and raise you a :brilliant:

[Oaf]

Dude, for every drool you got I got like three more. :drool: :drool: :drool:
WTF?

[ddaryl]

I still beleive a team can win with a so-so QB and a great OL and DL, but a great QB behind a craptastic OL has little to no chance

The bottom line is... If the player at our draft position that rates the highest is a T you don't reach for a QB who might turn out to be the next J.P. Edwards on this team, you take the T....

We have huge needs at the OT DL QB and LB positions... and we shouldn't reach for any of those positions. We basically take the very best player at those 4 positions when our pick comes IMO

[jamze132]

I'm not opposed to drafting a QB in RD1 as long as they project along the lines of the big 3 in 06, not the 4th jackass we drafted.

BUT... I would RATHER have some resemblance of an O-line before I put a $40M rookie QB behind them. There is no point is spending so much money on a rookie QB who you expect to be the franchise without an O-line. I think next year all we will need for the O-line will be 2 starting Ts. If there are any studs in FA this offseason, we need to jump quick. Then we can draft our QB AND depth for the O-line... which we have failed to really do recently.

[SABURZFAN]

We don't have a QB on our roster worth spending high picks on tackles to protect.

Buffalo sports daily had a great article a week or two ago breaking down the incompetence of our franchise over this past decade and how we have approached the QB position since Kelly.

We have yet to try drafting a top tier prospect (NO, LOSMAN DOES NOT COUNT. He was NEVER considered a top prospect.)

We just keep trying the same old thing, and look how that is working out.

You know that old saying, "If it ain't broke, don't fix it."?

Well this **** is broke. So fix it.


i'd rather have the LT in place before a QB.

[yordad]

I think our line has more potential then our QBs, so for me, picking a QB is the way to go. Actually, If there is no clear stud, I really wouldn't care if they picked a QB in every single round, and played QB carousel for the entire 2010 season, just to find the answer. They can cut McIntryre, Wendling, Jenkins, Parrish, Denney, Fitz, and Hamden to make room for them.

I call for 8 QBs on the roster in '10!

[Yasgur's Farm]

I think our line has more potential then our QBs, so for me, picking a QB is the way to go. Actually, If there is no clear stud, I really wouldn't care if they picked a QB in every single round, and played QB carousel for the entire 2010 season, just to find the answer. They can cut McIntryre, Wendling, Jenkins, Parrish, Denney, Fitz, and Hamden to make room for them.

I call for 8 QBs on the roster in '10!I agree with you concerning the O-line... Bell, Levetre, Hangartner, Wood, Butler should prove to be a soilid unit for years to come... Paid for by the growing pains of '09. Late round tackles from this point forward for me.

I'm not thrilled with the QB talent that will be available to us in round 1. With the right coach, one who knows how to use the talent he has (yes the Bills have talent)... We can get by with a servicable vet (Vick, Collins, etc) while we groom somebody like LeFevour in round 2.

I can see a real solid run game being developed in '10 with what we have... A run game that would make our O playoff competitive IMO.

So, that said, I turn my attention to the D... I'm OK with our DE's (again with the '09 growing pains). A maturing Maybin and Ellis will turn into a nice bookend for us going forward.

As I said in another post, I'd be tempted to go with a 5 man line with a 4 man rotation at 2 DT positions and a 5 man rotation at 3 DE positions... 1 of the DE's (a different 1 each play) could play the roaming DE/LB hybrid.

In addition, we could add another hybrid player to the LB ranks I think I'd start rotating Harris and Scott as the 3rd LB/S in this position.

McGee, McKelvin, Florence and Corner would fill our CB duties while Whitner, Byrd and Wilson round out the lone S position.

That's my "Hybrid 5-3-3 D"... Or as I like to call it "The strap on Dick" scheme.

Back to the draft... I'm in favor of a BPA draft within a defined group of needs. I think that group of needs is (in order of priority) LB, DT, QB. I like...

DT Terrence Cody round 1 or Dan Williams round 3.
LB Brandon Spikes roud 1 or Daryl Washington round 3.
QB Dan LeFevour round 2

1 - Terrence Cody or Brandon Spikes
2 - Dan LeFevour
3 - Dan Williams or Daryl Washington

BPA for the remaining rounds is fine with me.

[DynaPaul]

I say take a top LT anyway and get a solidified line working before taking anymore skill players.

[X-Era]

I think our line has more potential then our QBs, so for me, picking a QB is the way to go. Actually, If there is no clear stud, I really wouldn't care if they picked a QB in every single round, and played QB carousel for the entire 2010 season, just to find the answer. They can cut McIntryre, Wendling, Jenkins, Parrish, Denney, Fitz, and Hamden to make room for them.

I call for 8 QBs on the roster in '10!

I agree that a QB may be at the top of the needs list. I also feel that we can get decent OT prospects in the 2nd or even 3rd round.

I wont mind a OT taken first, but my personal preference would be to get yourself a franchise QB prospect.

Now, its not totally clear to me yet (its still too early) as to whether a QB will a) be there when we pick, and b) be worthy of our 1st round pick.

Weve got a lot of process left before we will have a clear look at who is appropriate and available at our pick(s).

[djjimkelly]

This is a stupid argument.

We don't have a Tackle on our roster worth spending high picks on a QB to throw behind!

BTW, again, I am pulling for a round one LB.


there were 3 studs this year and we drafted a DE that they wont put on the field

[BillsWin]

there were 3 studs this year and we drafted a DE that they wont put on the field

This franchise is a mess.

[baalworship]

If the Bills have the choice between Matt Ryan and Jake Long they better take Matt Ryan. You never pass on a franchise QB.

[BillsWin]

If the Bills have the choice between Matt Ryan and Jake Long they better take Matt Ryan. You never pass on a franchise QB.

Some people just don't get that!

[Griff]

Here's the problem with our HC, OC and OTs, it doesn't really matter what rookie we bring in under center, or vet for that matter.

[OpIv37]

First, average qb's can look pretty damn good with the right protection. Doug Williams, Mark Rypien, Brad Johnson and Jim McMahon don't have SB rings due to their elite passing skills.

Second, if we do go QB, what makes you think this FO will pick the right one, or be able to groom the one they do pick? No one in this org has shown the ability to develop a qb.

Third, this team has glaring holes at QB, T and LB, and needs at other positions as well. Pick your poison, because any choice still leaves us with holes to fill.

[X-Era]

First, average qb's can look pretty damn good with the right protection. Doug Williams, Mark Rypien, Brad Johnson and Jim McMahon don't have SB rings due to their elite passing skills.

Second, if we do go QB, what makes you think this FO will pick the right one, or be able to groom the one they do pick? No one in this org has shown the ability to develop a qb.

Third, this team has glaring holes at QB, T and LB, and needs at other positions as well. Pick your poison, because any choice still leaves us with holes to fill.

I totally agree we have other holes, and that we can go a variety of routes.

But I'm pretty sick and tired of mediocre quarterbacking, and I want the best player we can get if were going shopping. Its just too important.

[X-Era]

Some people just don't get that!

I think they get it, but think we can be just fine with a average game-managing QB if we have a great OL. The problem is we are never good enough on D, or in other areas to have that work for us... and we have been trying for years. I'm done with that plan, I want a true franchise QB.

[OpIv37]

I totally agree we have other holes, and that we can go a variety of routes.

But I'm pretty sick and tired of mediocre quarterbacking, and I want the best player we can get if were going shopping. Its just too important.
I'm not entirely opposed to taking a qb early. I'm just saying that even if we do, it hardly means all our problems are solved. Right now, I don't even have a preference.

[X-Era]

I'm not entirely opposed to taking a qb early. I'm just saying that even if we do, it hardly means all our problems are solved. Right now, I don't even have a preference.
Nor do I.

I simply want a legit franchise QB prospect. There may be guys in the 2nd or 3rd who could be that... or should I say that have as much of a chance to be that as guys in the early 1st. I think its less likely, but there may be a few guys that have a shot.

What I want is what I always want, the best player that fills a need. We have several needs so we could go several ways.

[DraftBoy]

This team sucks at just about every position so Im for BPA. Whether that OT, QB, DE, DT, CB, SS, LB what have you.

[bflojohn]

Initially, the notion that you don't select your franchise QB because there is NO pass protection is absurd! Sit the rookie, and run out the sacrificial lamb (Edwards) until the problem is solved. Additionally, the looming 2010 offseason is shaping up to be one of the more interesting ones in Buffalo Bills history. Personally, any coach named Billick, Gruden, Shanahan or Holgren will allow for a young gun to MATURE, unlike others out there, IMO. IF they keep a QB like Trent to hold the fort, is it possible that 2010 will also be a wash? Heck yes, Rome wasn't built in a day, unless for the Bills sake, the NEW front office signs the right free agents come March. I truly believe that Ralph Wilson is going to finally put up and show the fans that he, indeed, does want to win.... we'll see?!

[PECKERWOOD]

Without a tackle protecting your QB, it doesn't matter who you got at QB.

Honestly? I see plenty of depth at QB this year, we should probably wait till round 2-3 to take a quarterback.

1.) Terrence Cody, NT/DT, Alabama (Heart n soul of Bama's #1 ranked defense)
2.) Jason Fox, OT, Miami (There's our left tackle.)
3.) Jevan Snead, QB, Ole Mississippi (Allow him to learn the ropes behind Trent)


We should do something like that, bring in a guy like David Carr as the backup QB so Jevan Snead doesn't get rushed in when Trent starts to suck. Then sign a guy like Derrick Johnson in free agency along with some depth at receiver, we'd be all set.

Maybin/Cody/Stroud/Schobel
Johnson/Poz/Mitchell

Fox/Levitre/Hangartner/Wood/Butler
/////////////Edwards/Carr/Snead///////////

I'd settle for an offseason like that.

[X-Era]

Without a tackle protecting your QB, it doesn't matter who you got at QB.

Honestly? I see plenty of depth at QB this year, we should probably wait till round 2-3 to take a quarterback.

1.) Terrence Cody, NT/DT, Alabama (Heart n soul of Bama's #1 ranked defense)
2.) Jason Fox, OT, Miami (There's our left tackle.)
3.) Jevan Snead, QB, Ole Mississippi (Allow him to learn the ropes behind Trent)


We should do something like that, bring in a guy like David Carr as the backup QB so Jevan Snead doesn't get rushed in when Trent starts to suck. Then sign a guy like Derrick Johnson in free agency along with some depth at receiver, we'd be all set.

Maybin/Cody/Stroud/Schobel
Johnson/Poz/Mitchell

Fox/Levitre/Hangartner/Wood/Butler
/////////////Edwards/Carr/Snead///////////

I'd settle for an offseason like that.

Snead? He hasnt been bad this year, hes been HORRIBLE!

I have no interest in Snead.

[SABURZFAN]

I say take a top LT anyway and get a solidified line working before taking anymore skill players.


i agree. ballgames are won in the trenches. you don't need a top notch QB to take you to the Super Bowl. Trent Dilfer and David Woodley come to mind.

[PECKERWOOD]

Snead? He hasnt been bad this year, hes been HORRIBLE!

I have no interest in Snead.
He is good value in the 3rd, if he puts it together he can be elite.

[baalworship]

Last Superbowl Champions:

2009: Pittsburgh: Big Ben,Franchise QB
2008:NY Giants: Eli Manning, Franchise QB
2007:Indianapolis Colts: Peyton Manning, Franchise QB
2006:Pittsburgh Steelers, Big Ben, Franchise QB
2005: New England Patriots, Tom Brady, Franchise QB
2004: New England Patriots, Tom Brady, Franchise QB
2003: Tamp Bay Bucs, Brad Johnson-Last QB to win Superbowl that was not a franchise QB, #1 NFL defense

Winning it all almost never happens unless you have a franchise QB. That should be the goal for the Buffalo Bills, winning a Superbowl.

[X-Era]

He is good value in the 3rd, if he puts it together he can be elite.

If by good value, you mean we could get a guy with 1st round talent in the 3rd, I would offer that there's a reason hes dropping to the 3rd, and I think he actually drops well below the 3rd considering the other QB talent that may be there.

I really have no interest. His INT totals are just alarming as hell.

[X-Era]

One thing to consider is the depth of OT and especially LT prospects this year. Im looking at lots of solid LT prospects into the 3rd round at least. Its a deep class and has many prospects that may have athleticism to play LT in the NFL.

QB is also deep, although I would agree with DB that it may not have any sure fire franchise guys. I think its going to be a draft, at the QB spot, where they really need to make here money. A few of these guys could become franchise QB's, a few could become the next Sage Rosenfels, or JP Losmans.

I feel the QB class is riskier then the OT class overall.

[SABURZFAN]

Last Superbowl Champions:

2009: Pittsburgh: Big Ben,Franchise QB
2008:NY Giants: Eli Manning, Franchise QB
2007:Indianapolis Colts: Peyton Manning, Franchise QB
2006:Pittsburgh Steelers, Big Ben, Franchise QB
2005: New England Patriots, Tom Brady, Franchise QB
2004: New England Patriots, Tom Brady, Franchise QB
2003: Tamp Bay Bucs, Brad Johnson-Last QB to win Superbowl that was not a franchise QB, #1 NFL defense

Winning it all almost never happens unless you have a franchise QB. That should be the goal for the Buffalo Bills, winning a Superbowl.


easier said than done. these kind of QB's don't grow on trees either.

[X-Era]

easier said than done. these kind of QB's don't grow on trees either.

Id agree but the trend is changing.

Add in Matt Ryan, and Joe Flacco

[Griff]

Last Superbowl Champions:

2009: Pittsburgh: Big Ben,Franchise QB
2008:NY Giants: Eli Manning, Franchise QB
2007:Indianapolis Colts: Peyton Manning, Franchise QB
2006:Pittsburgh Steelers, Big Ben, Franchise QB
2005: New England Patriots, Tom Brady, Franchise QB
2004: New England Patriots, Tom Brady, Franchise QB
2003: Tamp Bay Bucs, Brad Johnson-Last QB to win Superbowl that was not a franchise QB, #1 NFL defense

Winning it all almost never happens unless you have a franchise QB. That should be the goal for the Buffalo Bills, winning a Superbowl.

know what those teams also had? Elite OLs.

[Griff]

Id agree but the trend is changing.

Add in Matt Ryan, and Joe Flacco

neither of them play on the level of Ben.

[SABURZFAN]

Id agree but the trend is changing.

Add in Matt Ryan, and Joe Flacco


i won't do that just yet. things can change as time goes on. i remember not too long ago that some people were ready to give a contract extension to a QB who was on a 5 game winning streak, which parlayed into a decent 2006 season. fast forward to 2009 and he's no longer in the league. thank god nobody took the Lickers seriously and we no longer live in the LosmanEra. (pun intended)